Guest guest Posted August 14, 2006 Report Share Posted August 14, 2006 Om Namah Shivaya! If any one has any thoughts on this, please feel free to agree or disagree. Especially people who have had been in a position of enforcing standards FOR OTHERS in public places. In public settings, in order to look out for the needs of the many, behaviorial rules must be established. This is common sense. Although it is sometimes unpleasant, these rules sometimes need to be fairly and lovingly enforced. Because our culture, and especially popular culture is highly anti authoritarian, conflicts over boundary setting are inevitable. I learned this summer that in this balancing act, Amma definitely wanted me to be aware of setting boundaries and standards not just for myself, but for OTHERS in my sphere as well. I can be too permisive, too willing to let others disrupt in the interest of being "non judgemental" and "caring". This does not mean that I should walk around like some sort of a dictator, not at all. But, it does mean that I should be responsible for being a leader, albiet a gentle and service oriented one. This is especially true for folks who look after children and teenagers. Or adults who are still teenagers emotionally. Chaos and trouble follows a lack of boundary setting like a shadow. Peace, Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 14, 2006 Report Share Posted August 14, 2006 Dear Chris: This Saturday evening during M.A. Center's Bay Area Satsang I was sitting in the second row. After Bhajans their is Arati and a Reading of Names of persons or animals/countries etc that we may pray for. The room is darkened and the explicit point is to focus on praying for our brothers and sisters suffering. Right in back of me (third row) a small child was talking loudly about this and that. From what I could determine the child did not have an urgent need or complaint (like having to go potty). The child was conversing to her father in a cute but loud manner. The room was silent. Despite this the father did not even once admonish the child to whisper. In fact he talked back and forth as if they were at a train station. My attempt at prayer and arati was distracted since I am not yet Realized. Amma has said that little children should be quiet or set away a bit so that persons can accomplish what they intend at a Temple. Amma has said that many persons during the Retreat save money all year to come and travel hundreds and thousands of miles so that they can practice a little bit. The devotees in attendance ordinary life circumstances may make it difficult to meditate and pray due to extraneous noise in their home environs. No one (including me) said a word to the little one or the father. I took it as an opportunity to constrain my vasana of confronting people. Nevertheless their is a proper time and proper place for everything Arati and Group collective prayer is not the time for loud father daughter rap sessions however cute in its outer appearance IMHO. I humbly agree with your recent posts Chrisji. Has anyone ever seen a sign posted during Amma's tour stops saying: "Ye Who Enter Here - Everything Goes" Namah Shivaya, Chitanand P.S. Thank you for doing Security in Massachusetts. You are a very fine young man. Ammachi, "ckeniley2003" <ckeniley2003 wrote: > > Om Namah Shivaya! > > If any one has any thoughts on this, please feel free to agree or > disagree. Especially people who have had been in a position of > enforcing standards FOR OTHERS in public places. > > In public settings, in order to look out for the needs of the many, > behaviorial rules must be established. This is common sense. Although > it is sometimes unpleasant, these rules sometimes need to be fairly > and lovingly enforced. > > Because our culture, and especially popular culture is highly anti > authoritarian, conflicts over boundary setting are inevitable. > > I learned this summer that in this balancing act, Amma definitely > wanted me to be aware of setting boundaries and standards not just > for myself, but for OTHERS in my sphere as well. I can be too > permisive, too willing to let others disrupt in the interest of > being "non judgemental" and "caring". This does not mean that I > should walk around like some sort of a dictator, not at all. But, it > does mean that I should be responsible for being a leader, albiet a > gentle and service oriented one. > > This is especially true for folks who look after children and > teenagers. Or adults who are still teenagers emotionally. > > Chaos and trouble follows a lack of boundary setting like a shadow. > > > Peace, > Chris > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 14, 2006 Report Share Posted August 14, 2006 Namah Shivaya, I want to respond on 2 points. #1, when interacting with devotees for seva during Amma's tour, more than once I've felt shunned, because devotees weren't crazy about being asked to do, or not do something. It hurts to feel rejected for trying to serve our Guru. But, it's not a popularity contest. So, I guess it would be better for us to stand up more often to ask devotees to do what's for the good of the group. On the other hand, when I reminded some devotees about following Amma's instructions to help us better serve during a seva, they seemed to appreciate it. Amma also gave me a nice smile shortly thereafter. We all need reminders sometimes. It would help me to grow, if others would put me in check more often. #2, is that I'm easily distracted by noises. I've also noticed children running near Amma's chair shortly after arati, or blowing out the oil lamps. Perhaps it's all of our dharmas to lovingly request that respect is shown in the temple. In the Catholic parish where I was raised, the sanctuary's environment was very quiet. During masses no gum chewing or eatting was allowed, no conversations, etc ... My parents began training me on these points, at a very young age. Until children could control themselves, a "cry room" was available. One of my earliest memories is of being that room. It would help people such as me, if a disciplined culture of quietness such as this were to grow in Amma's temple. I can start with myself. What can we do to encourage it? Thank you, Sweta leokomor <leokomor > wrote: The room is darkened and the explicit point is to focus on praying for our brothers and sisters suffering. ....... My attempt at prayer and arati was distracted since I am not yet Realized. Amma has said that little children should be quiet or set away a bit so that persons can accomplish what they intend at a Temple. ........ Has anyone ever seen a sign posted during Amma's tour stops saying: "Ye Who Enter Here - Everything Goes" ..... Ammachi, "ckeniley2003" <ckeniley2003 wrote: > > Om Namah Shivaya! > > If any one has any thoughts on this, please feel free to agree or > disagree. Especially people who have had been in a position of > enforcing standards FOR OTHERS in public places. > Get your email and more, right on the new .com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 16, 2006 Report Share Posted August 16, 2006 > Namah Shivaya, > > Chitanand > > P.S. Thank you for doing Security > in Massachusetts. You > are a very fine young man. > > > Om Namah Shivaya Chitanad, it was nice to meet you this summer..but I have to say I feel much finer around Amma! She has helped me so much this year, its hard to describe. Peace Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 16, 2006 Report Share Posted August 16, 2006 > In public settings, in order to look out for the needs of the many, > behaviorial rules must be established. This is common sense. Although > it is sometimes unpleasant, these rules sometimes need to be fairly > and lovingly enforced. Many years ago, announcements were periodically made during Amma's tour that a quiet, meditative atmosphere should be kept within the hall, suggesting that conversations/visiting be taken outside the hall. Several years ago, I noticed that announcements were no longer being made -- probably because people never had heeded them in the first place. I am able to see Amma in only one city each year, and I use this as an annual "retreat" of my own -- trying to remain in meditation and prayer as much of the time as I can. In addition to the incredible opportunity to have darshan with Amma, I also enjoy the bhajans and the wonderful Amma-energy that makes it a fantastic time to say one's mantra, silently chant the LS, etc. In recent years, the Amma event in my city has taken on more and more of a loud, circusy feeling -- like some kind of hippie happening from the 60s -- mainly because of the large numbers of people continually chatting and unsupervised children (and adults) acting out in the hall. No one seems to mind any of this at all, so I've just tried to accept it, and I've come to think that Amma approves of and actually likes this kind of atmosphere. If Amma didn't approve of peoples' behavior, surely she would do something about it (or maybe she's given up?). I truly believe that she is aware of everything that is happening in the hall. This tour, loud mothers and children were sitting below the dais directly in front of Amma, chatting loudly, squirming around, giving each other massages, and so forth as others were trying to meditate. None of the official people had anything to say about this. I typically just move from place to place in the hall, fairly frequently, when peoples' conversations or running children just get too distruptive. And I have to admit, as others have, that it is hard for me personally to tune out all this noise and activity -- for others, maybe it's not a problem. I was surprised and glad that someone else raised this topic, because I truly believed that I was the only one not hip enough to be able to meditate and focus on Amma in the midst of this craziness! Rosetta Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 16, 2006 Report Share Posted August 16, 2006 I remember the first official DC stop back in '97, the crowds were restless and talkative because of the heat (overloaded AC system) and the long lines of the old non-token days. I remember one swami saying very clearly, if not a bit irritated, that "If you want to have a conversation, then please go outside!" No one listened, and everyone just waited until the people with the water cups came around. I've noticed that since that time the events are more noisy, but I've also disliked that at least locally, the events are more likely to be held in a hotel rather than alternate hall like in the earlier days. It's a totally different atmosphere when not in hotels. tom Ammachi, "rosaroja24" <rosaroja24 wrote: > > > > In public settings, in order to look out for the needs of the many, > > behaviorial rules must be established. This is common sense. > Although > > it is sometimes unpleasant, these rules sometimes need to be fairly > > and lovingly enforced. > > Many years ago, announcements were periodically made during Amma's > tour that a quiet, meditative atmosphere should be kept within the > hall, suggesting that conversations/visiting be taken outside the hall. > > Several years ago, I noticed that announcements were no longer being > made -- probably because people never had heeded them in the first > place. > (snipped) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 17, 2006 Report Share Posted August 17, 2006 >I was surprised and glad that someone else raised this topic, because >I truly believed that I was the only one not hip enough to be able to >meditate and focus on Amma in the midst of this craziness! >Rosetta I'm thankful that I can just turn off my hearing aids and meditate among the chaotic atmosphere peacefully in Amma's presence. I"ve meditated better in her presence than at home. I don't make a big deal with how people behave and all. All that matters to me the most is that I am there with her and am able to sit very closer to her. I cherish every minute of that opportunity because who knows how long it will be before we won't be able to do that often as her popularity keeps growing year after year. Really the noise, chaos, etc. that should not matter. All that matters is being there with her. Jai Ma! Stacy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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