Guest guest Posted June 16, 2006 Report Share Posted June 16, 2006 Dear Paul, The point you brought up is very interesting and I want to *ramble* at length on it. Please ignore if my ramblings make no sense! > If anybody tells you that their Enlightened or know God, dont beleive > them; everything is a part of God and life is already enlightened. I agree and disagree. The argument that "everything is part of God and life is already enlightened" makes one think that nothing more needs to be done. I can only wish what you said was true. It is true that there is God in everything. If I think, it is god's energy that is present in my thinking process. If I am sleepy and I sleep, it is god's energy (a taamasik energy) that is present in that. If I feel compassion for a five year boy with a lukemia, it is god's energy that is present in that compassion. If I feel hungry, it is god's energy that is present in that hunger. Even in a serial killer's ruthlessness that makes him kill twenty people, it is basically a form of god's energy that is present. It is various forms of god's energy that is present in everything that exists. Thus, what you said is essentially true - everything is part of god. But there is one key point that is missing here. Let us go back to my previous "diamond analogy". In this analogy, the core of the diamond is the fomless divinity that pervades the entire universe and the faces with various attributes are various "forms" of divinity. The inner surfaces of the faces that are in touch with the core are the aakaasa tattva manifestations of various forms. The outer surfaces of the thick faces that seem opaque with various colors are the other lower manifestations of various forms. Is there no difference between one whose thoughts and actions are controlled by one of the deities representing an outermost surface of a really thick face of this diamond and one whose thoughts and actions are controlled by one of the deities representing an innermost surface of a face, that is in touch with the core? At the core, each of them is all-pervading Brahman only. But one has not fully realized it and will continue to exist in one form after the other, while the other is close to realizing it. Even though the core of the diamond in my analogy is actually not limited to any space & time and is all-pervading, the depiction of it close to the inner surfaces and away from the outer surfaces symbolizes that. What I am trying to say is this: Our will power is in tune with various energies of this universe. As we peel off layers and it becomes tuned with the will power of the root energy that is close to formlessness, we become close to self-realization. Of course, when self-realization comes, one may fully realize and appreciate the fact that even the outer forms (that had to be peeled off like layers of onion) were actually filled with Brahman only. But, such realization is not possible if you continue to be controlled by those energies. * * * What I am trying to say here is extremely difficult to express in words. Let me summarize it in totally different words. The formless reality (Brahman) that pervades *everything* in this universe is the true self (atman). It is unlimited and unblemished. However, manifested forms are limited and blemished. If one fully appreciates that one is not the form, but the formless reality pervading the form, one is self-realized. Without full appreciation of that, one is not self-realized. If there is even a small hint of self-identification with a form (e.g. a body), one has more sadhana to do. * * * I agree with your "don't believe them" part. A really enlightened person does not go around advertizing it or seeking publicity or followers. Most gurus who claim to be realized may not be so, in reality. That point, I agree on. In fact, complete self-realization does not come in one step in this Yuga. It is a long and slow process. It is possible that someone climbs Mount Kanchenjunga and thinks that it is Mount Everest. One who makes some progress in the path of self-realization can become satisfied at some stage and think that one is self-realized. Only a sadguru can save one from such a trap. Sarvam SreeKrishnaarpanamastu, Narasimha ------------------------------- Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro.home.comcast.net Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAstrologer.org Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagannath.org ------------------------------- > Dear All, > > I was taught: > > If anybody tells you that their Enlightened or know God, dont beleive > them; everything is a part of God and life is already enlightened. > > For what its worth, > > Best wishes, > Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 17, 2006 Report Share Posted June 17, 2006 dear narasimha ji your last observation on realisation is rather strong. if it is your personal opinion, it is fine but if you say it as a rule or principle, it is wrong. in vedic metaphysics, we narrate the two kinds of approaches a person has after realisation which i explain below in simple language for the benefit of all. i remember once learnt dakshinamoorthiji explained the same in a message in this group. after self realisation, the native realises the reality (truth) that god is within and it is the same god which is all pervading and all permeating and by controlling the body, mind and the soul, he aligns with the self and feel the divine bliss which can only be experienced and not explained. however, after this level, the native has two choices. one is to consign himself to a cozy comfortable ashram in himalayas or live in a reclusive seclusion in a cave and enjoy the eternal bliss ALL ALONE undisturbed or unconcerned over what is happening in the outside world. if a person suffering with extreme pain approaches him or if a person having problems of job for self, marriage for daughter etc. approaches him, he simply laughs loudly and pity him for the IGNORANCE OR MAYA JAAL in which he is living i.e. the dependance on outwardly things and craving for samsaric comforts. this realised person does not care for the suffering of the persons he is seeing in front and does not do anything even if a man is dying in front. these are the first category of realised people. the second category of realised people are those who, after realising the god within also realise that the same god exists in all sentient beings and show abundant compassion and distribute equal love to all human beings. they go in search of the suffering like jesus christ and take the pains on themselves. people like shirdi saibaba also take the sufferings of the natives and make them happy. similar are the stories of so many babas, fakirs, peers, sages and saints from this holy land. they also perform miracles to instill faith in god in the minds of the athiests, not for earning money or any self gratification. myself being a healer knows how i took on myself the sufferings, pains and evils from the suffering natives and made them happy. at times i also performed few miracles to convince the natives that god exists and that the divine grace has the power to do and undo things written in the chart. hence my humble request to you and mr. paul is not to disrespect the gurus who are serving the society at large in their self-less service. you may not be the direct beneficiary of their miraculous divine blessings but there are crores of people who got their fates changed with the blessings of these realised gurus. planets become mute in such cases. as you may be aware, sages are kept above par gods in protocol for their power to bless or curse and change what brahma has written. astrology and planets become meaningless when such sages bless a native like a boon. may this holy land where such great holy sages and saints dwell bless all the natives and protect the citizens from all problems. with best wishes pandit arjun vedic astrology, "Narasimha P.V.R. Rao" <pvr wrote: > > Dear Paul, > > The point you brought up is very interesting and I want to *ramble* at length on it. Please ignore if my ramblings make no sense! > > > If anybody tells you that their Enlightened or know God, dont beleive > > them; everything is a part of God and life is already enlightened. > > I agree and disagree. > > The argument that "everything is part of God and life is already enlightened" makes one think that nothing more needs to be done. I can only wish what you said was true. > > It is true that there is God in everything. If I think, it is god's energy that is present in my thinking process. If I am sleepy and I sleep, it is god's energy (a taamasik energy) that is present in that. If I feel compassion for a five year boy with a lukemia, it is god's energy that is present in that compassion. If I feel hungry, it is god's energy that is present in that hunger. Even in a serial killer's ruthlessness that makes him kill twenty people, it is basically a form of god's energy that is present. It is various forms of god's energy that is present in everything that exists. > > Thus, what you said is essentially true - everything is part of god. But there is one key point that is missing here. > > Let us go back to my previous "diamond analogy". In this analogy, the core of the diamond is the fomless divinity that pervades the entire universe and the faces with various attributes are various "forms" of divinity. The inner surfaces of the faces that are in touch with the core are the aakaasa tattva manifestations of various forms. The outer surfaces of the thick faces that seem opaque with various colors are the other lower manifestations of various forms. > > Is there no difference between one whose thoughts and actions are controlled by one of the deities representing an outermost surface of a really thick face of this diamond and one whose thoughts and actions are controlled by one of the deities representing an innermost surface of a face, that is in touch with the core? > > At the core, each of them is all-pervading Brahman only. But one has not fully realized it and will continue to exist in one form after the other, while the other is close to realizing it. Even though the core of the diamond in my analogy is actually not limited to any space & time and is all-pervading, the depiction of it close to the inner surfaces and away from the outer surfaces symbolizes that. > > What I am trying to say is this: Our will power is in tune with various energies of this universe. As we peel off layers and it becomes tuned with the will power of the root energy that is close to formlessness, we become close to self-realization. Of course, when self-realization comes, one may fully realize and appreciate the fact that even the outer forms (that had to be peeled off like layers of onion) were actually filled with Brahman only. But, such realization is not possible if you continue to be controlled by those energies. > > * * * > > What I am trying to say here is extremely difficult to express in words. Let me summarize it in totally different words. > > The formless reality (Brahman) that pervades *everything* in this universe is the true self (atman). It is unlimited and unblemished. However, manifested forms are limited and blemished. If one fully appreciates that one is not the form, but the formless reality pervading the form, one is self-realized. Without full appreciation of that, one is not self-realized. > > If there is even a small hint of self-identification with a form (e.g. a body), one has more sadhana to do. > > * * * > > I agree with your "don't believe them" part. > > A really enlightened person does not go around advertizing it or seeking publicity or followers. Most gurus who claim to be realized may not be so, in reality. That point, I agree on. > > In fact, complete self-realization does not come in one step in this Yuga. It is a long and slow process. It is possible that someone climbs Mount Kanchenjunga and thinks that it is Mount Everest. One who makes some progress in the path of self-realization can become satisfied at some stage and think that one is self- realized. Only a sadguru can save one from such a trap. > > Sarvam SreeKrishnaarpanamastu, > Narasimha > ------------------------------- > Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro.home.comcast.net > Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAstrologer.org > Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagannath.org > ------------------------------- > > > Dear All, > > > > I was taught: > > > > If anybody tells you that their Enlightened or know God, dont beleive > > them; everything is a part of God and life is already enlightened. > > > > For what its worth, > > > > Best wishes, > > Paul > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 17, 2006 Report Share Posted June 17, 2006 Dear Pandit Arjun ji, The 2 categories of realized people you have mentioned reminds me of "Buddha" and "Pase Budu" in Buddhism. 'Pase Budu' is a person who attains 'araht hood' [enlightenment] but cannot preach the 'marga' to anyone else. On the other hand a person who attains Buddhahood can preach Dhamma and show the path to others too. Gautama Lord Buddha was the most compassionate human being that your land could ever boast of. It is indeed nice to know that you are a healer blessed with miraculous powers. Blessings Renu vedic astrology, "panditarjun2004" <panditarjun2004 wrote: > > dear narasimha ji > > your last observation on realisation is rather strong. if it is > your personal opinion, it is fine but if you say it as a rule or > principle, it is wrong. in vedic metaphysics, we narrate the two > kinds of approaches a person has after realisation which i explain > below in simple language for the benefit of all. i remember once > learnt dakshinamoorthiji explained the same in a message in this > group. > > after self realisation, the native realises the reality (truth) that > god is within and it is the same god which is all pervading and all > permeating and by controlling the body, mind and the soul, he aligns > with the self and feel the divine bliss which can only be > experienced and not explained. however, after this level, the > native has two choices. > > one is to consign himself to a cozy comfortable ashram in himalayas > or live in a reclusive seclusion in a cave and enjoy the eternal > bliss ALL ALONE undisturbed or unconcerned over what is happening in > the outside world. if a person suffering with extreme pain > approaches him or if a person having problems of job for self, > marriage for daughter etc. approaches him, he simply laughs loudly > and pity him for the IGNORANCE OR MAYA JAAL in which he is living > i.e. the dependance on outwardly things and craving for samsaric > comforts. this realised person does not care for the suffering of > the persons he is seeing in front and does not do anything even if a > man is dying in front. these are the first category of realised > people. > > the second category of realised people are those who, after > realising the god within also realise that the same god exists in > all sentient beings and show abundant compassion and distribute > equal love to all human beings. they go in search of the suffering > like jesus christ and take the pains on themselves. people like > shirdi saibaba also take the sufferings of the natives and make them > happy. similar are the stories of so many babas, fakirs, peers, > sages and saints from this holy land. they also perform miracles to > instill faith in god in the minds of the athiests, not for earning > money or any self gratification. > > myself being a healer knows how i took on myself the sufferings, > pains and evils from the suffering natives and made them happy. at > times i also performed few miracles to convince the natives that god > exists and that the divine grace has the power to do and undo things > written in the chart. > > hence my humble request to you and mr. paul is not to disrespect the > gurus who are serving the society at large in their self-less > service. you may not be the direct beneficiary of their miraculous > divine blessings but there are crores of people who got their fates > changed with the blessings of these realised gurus. planets become > mute in such cases. as you may be aware, sages are kept above par > gods in protocol for their power to bless or curse and change what > brahma has written. astrology and planets become meaningless when > such sages bless a native like a boon. > > may this holy land where such great holy sages and saints dwell > bless all the natives and protect the citizens from all problems. > > with best wishes > pandit arjun > > vedic astrology, "Narasimha P.V.R. Rao" > <pvr@> wrote: > > > > Dear Paul, > > > > The point you brought up is very interesting and I want to > *ramble* at length on it. Please ignore if my ramblings make no > sense! > > > > > If anybody tells you that their Enlightened or know God, dont > beleive > > > them; everything is a part of God and life is already > enlightened. > > > > I agree and disagree. > > > > The argument that "everything is part of God and life is already > enlightened" makes one think that nothing more needs to be done. I > can only wish what you said was true. > > > > It is true that there is God in everything. If I think, it is > god's energy that is present in my thinking process. If I am sleepy > and I sleep, it is god's energy (a taamasik energy) that is present > in that. If I feel compassion for a five year boy with a lukemia, it > is god's energy that is present in that compassion. If I feel > hungry, it is god's energy that is present in that hunger. Even in a > serial killer's ruthlessness that makes him kill twenty people, it > is basically a form of god's energy that is present. It is various > forms of god's energy that is present in everything that exists. > > > > Thus, what you said is essentially true - everything is part of > god. But there is one key point that is missing here. > > > > Let us go back to my previous "diamond analogy". In this analogy, > the core of the diamond is the fomless divinity that pervades the > entire universe and the faces with various attributes are > various "forms" of divinity. The inner surfaces of the faces that > are in touch with the core are the aakaasa tattva manifestations of > various forms. The outer surfaces of the thick faces that seem > opaque with various colors are the other lower manifestations of > various forms. > > > > Is there no difference between one whose thoughts and actions are > controlled by one of the deities representing an outermost surface > of a really thick face of this diamond and one whose thoughts and > actions are controlled by one of the deities representing an > innermost surface of a face, that is in touch with the core? > > > > At the core, each of them is all-pervading Brahman only. But one > has not fully realized it and will continue to exist in one form > after the other, while the other is close to realizing it. Even > though the core of the diamond in my analogy is actually not limited > to any space & time and is all-pervading, the depiction of it close > to the inner surfaces and away from the outer surfaces symbolizes > that. > > > > What I am trying to say is this: Our will power is in tune with > various energies of this universe. As we peel off layers and it > becomes tuned with the will power of the root energy that is close > to formlessness, we become close to self-realization. Of course, > when self-realization comes, one may fully realize and appreciate > the fact that even the outer forms (that had to be peeled off like > layers of onion) were actually filled with Brahman only. But, such > realization is not possible if you continue to be controlled by > those energies. > > > > * * * > > > > What I am trying to say here is extremely difficult to express in > words. Let me summarize it in totally different words. > > > > The formless reality (Brahman) that pervades *everything* in this > universe is the true self (atman). It is unlimited and unblemished. > However, manifested forms are limited and blemished. If one fully > appreciates that one is not the form, but the formless reality > pervading the form, one is self-realized. Without full appreciation > of that, one is not self-realized. > > > > If there is even a small hint of self-identification with a form > (e.g. a body), one has more sadhana to do. > > > > * * * > > > > I agree with your "don't believe them" part. > > > > A really enlightened person does not go around advertizing it or > seeking publicity or followers. Most gurus who claim to be realized > may not be so, in reality. That point, I agree on. > > > > In fact, complete self-realization does not come in one step in > this Yuga. It is a long and slow process. It is possible that > someone climbs Mount Kanchenjunga and thinks that it is Mount > Everest. One who makes some progress in the path of self- realization > can become satisfied at some stage and think that one is self- > realized. Only a sadguru can save one from such a trap. > > > > Sarvam SreeKrishnaarpanamastu, > > Narasimha > > ------------------------------- > > Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro.home.comcast.net > > Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAstrologer.org > > Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagannath.org > > ------------------------------- > > > > > Dear All, > > > > > > I was taught: > > > > > > If anybody tells you that their Enlightened or know God, dont > beleive > > > them; everything is a part of God and life is already > enlightened. > > > > > > For what its worth, > > > > > > Best wishes, > > > Paul > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 dear sister renu in my mentioning the most compassionate persons like jesus christ and saibaba, i forgot to mention the buddha whose ahimsa philosophy is a way for all religions across the globe which is why it is gaining more popularity even in the west with celebrities like richard gere working for the promotion of ahimsa and buddhism. once vishnu sharma wrote in his pancha tantram "aayam nijah paroveti gananam laghu chetasam, udaara charitanaamtu vasudhaiva kutumbakam". it means that a narrow minded (unrealised) person reckons whether a person belongs to him or not (by way of relation, language etc.) whereas for a broad minded (realised) person the entire world is their family. in other words, an enlightened person RISE in love and loves the whole world whereas an unrealised person FALL in love and loves only few persons who are close to him. all religions across the world have great living gods like buddha. in the present day when all countries are painting islamic nations as terrorist countries, i remind them the greatest compassion shown by emperor salauddin (muslim) in healing the suffering king richard even when he was invading islamic nations to spread christianity. god is there in every human being and one shall respect and love the god in other humans. with best wishes and blessings pandit arjun vedic astrology, "renunw" <renunw wrote: > > Dear Pandit Arjun ji, > > The 2 categories of realized people you have mentioned reminds me > of "Buddha" and "Pase Budu" in Buddhism. 'Pase Budu' is a person who > attains 'araht hood' [enlightenment] but cannot preach the 'marga' to > anyone else. On the other hand a person who attains Buddhahood can > preach Dhamma and show the path to others too. Gautama Lord Buddha > was the most compassionate human being that your land could ever > boast of. > > It is indeed nice to know that you are a healer blessed with > miraculous powers. > > Blessings > > Renu > > vedic astrology, "panditarjun2004" > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > dear narasimha ji > > > > your last observation on realisation is rather strong. if it is > > your personal opinion, it is fine but if you say it as a rule or > > principle, it is wrong. in vedic metaphysics, we narrate the two > > kinds of approaches a person has after realisation which i explain > > below in simple language for the benefit of all. i remember once > > learnt dakshinamoorthiji explained the same in a message in this > > group. > > > > after self realisation, the native realises the reality (truth) > that > > god is within and it is the same god which is all pervading and all > > permeating and by controlling the body, mind and the soul, he > aligns > > with the self and feel the divine bliss which can only be > > experienced and not explained. however, after this level, the > > native has two choices. > > > > one is to consign himself to a cozy comfortable ashram in himalayas > > or live in a reclusive seclusion in a cave and enjoy the eternal > > bliss ALL ALONE undisturbed or unconcerned over what is happening > in > > the outside world. if a person suffering with extreme pain > > approaches him or if a person having problems of job for self, > > marriage for daughter etc. approaches him, he simply laughs loudly > > and pity him for the IGNORANCE OR MAYA JAAL in which he is living > > i.e. the dependance on outwardly things and craving for samsaric > > comforts. this realised person does not care for the suffering of > > the persons he is seeing in front and does not do anything even if > a > > man is dying in front. these are the first category of realised > > people. > > > > the second category of realised people are those who, after > > realising the god within also realise that the same god exists in > > all sentient beings and show abundant compassion and distribute > > equal love to all human beings. they go in search of the suffering > > like jesus christ and take the pains on themselves. people like > > shirdi saibaba also take the sufferings of the natives and make > them > > happy. similar are the stories of so many babas, fakirs, peers, > > sages and saints from this holy land. they also perform miracles > to > > instill faith in god in the minds of the athiests, not for earning > > money or any self gratification. > > > > myself being a healer knows how i took on myself the sufferings, > > pains and evils from the suffering natives and made them happy. at > > times i also performed few miracles to convince the natives that > god > > exists and that the divine grace has the power to do and undo > things > > written in the chart. > > > > hence my humble request to you and mr. paul is not to disrespect > the > > gurus who are serving the society at large in their self-less > > service. you may not be the direct beneficiary of their miraculous > > divine blessings but there are crores of people who got their fates > > changed with the blessings of these realised gurus. planets become > > mute in such cases. as you may be aware, sages are kept above par > > gods in protocol for their power to bless or curse and change what > > brahma has written. astrology and planets become meaningless when > > such sages bless a native like a boon. > > > > may this holy land where such great holy sages and saints dwell > > bless all the natives and protect the citizens from all problems. > > > > with best wishes > > pandit arjun > > > > vedic astrology, "Narasimha P.V.R. Rao" > > <pvr@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Paul, > > > > > > The point you brought up is very interesting and I want to > > *ramble* at length on it. Please ignore if my ramblings make no > > sense! > > > > > > > If anybody tells you that their Enlightened or know God, dont > > beleive > > > > them; everything is a part of God and life is already > > enlightened. > > > > > > I agree and disagree. > > > > > > The argument that "everything is part of God and life is already > > enlightened" makes one think that nothing more needs to be done. I > > can only wish what you said was true. > > > > > > It is true that there is God in everything. If I think, it is > > god's energy that is present in my thinking process. If I am sleepy > > and I sleep, it is god's energy (a taamasik energy) that is present > > in that. If I feel compassion for a five year boy with a lukemia, > it > > is god's energy that is present in that compassion. If I feel > > hungry, it is god's energy that is present in that hunger. Even in > a > > serial killer's ruthlessness that makes him kill twenty people, it > > is basically a form of god's energy that is present. It is various > > forms of god's energy that is present in everything that exists. > > > > > > Thus, what you said is essentially true - everything is part of > > god. But there is one key point that is missing here. > > > > > > Let us go back to my previous "diamond analogy". In this analogy, > > the core of the diamond is the fomless divinity that pervades the > > entire universe and the faces with various attributes are > > various "forms" of divinity. The inner surfaces of the faces that > > are in touch with the core are the aakaasa tattva manifestations of > > various forms. The outer surfaces of the thick faces that seem > > opaque with various colors are the other lower manifestations of > > various forms. > > > > > > Is there no difference between one whose thoughts and actions are > > controlled by one of the deities representing an outermost surface > > of a really thick face of this diamond and one whose thoughts and > > actions are controlled by one of the deities representing an > > innermost surface of a face, that is in touch with the core? > > > > > > At the core, each of them is all-pervading Brahman only. But one > > has not fully realized it and will continue to exist in one form > > after the other, while the other is close to realizing it. Even > > though the core of the diamond in my analogy is actually not > limited > > to any space & time and is all-pervading, the depiction of it close > > to the inner surfaces and away from the outer surfaces symbolizes > > that. > > > > > > What I am trying to say is this: Our will power is in tune with > > various energies of this universe. As we peel off layers and it > > becomes tuned with the will power of the root energy that is close > > to formlessness, we become close to self-realization. Of course, > > when self-realization comes, one may fully realize and appreciate > > the fact that even the outer forms (that had to be peeled off like > > layers of onion) were actually filled with Brahman only. But, such > > realization is not possible if you continue to be controlled by > > those energies. > > > > > > * * * > > > > > > What I am trying to say here is extremely difficult to express in > > words. Let me summarize it in totally different words. > > > > > > The formless reality (Brahman) that pervades *everything* in this > > universe is the true self (atman). It is unlimited and unblemished. > > However, manifested forms are limited and blemished. If one fully > > appreciates that one is not the form, but the formless reality > > pervading the form, one is self-realized. Without full appreciation > > of that, one is not self-realized. > > > > > > If there is even a small hint of self-identification with a form > > (e.g. a body), one has more sadhana to do. > > > > > > * * * > > > > > > I agree with your "don't believe them" part. > > > > > > A really enlightened person does not go around advertizing it or > > seeking publicity or followers. Most gurus who claim to be realized > > may not be so, in reality. That point, I agree on. > > > > > > In fact, complete self-realization does not come in one step in > > this Yuga. It is a long and slow process. It is possible that > > someone climbs Mount Kanchenjunga and thinks that it is Mount > > Everest. One who makes some progress in the path of self- > realization > > can become satisfied at some stage and think that one is self- > > realized. Only a sadguru can save one from such a trap. > > > > > > Sarvam SreeKrishnaarpanamastu, > > > Narasimha > > > ------------------------------ - > > > Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro.home.comcast.net > > > Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAstrologer.org > > > Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagannath.org > > > ------------------------------ - > > > > > > > Dear All, > > > > > > > > I was taught: > > > > > > > > If anybody tells you that their Enlightened or know God, dont > > beleive > > > > them; everything is a part of God and life is already > > enlightened. > > > > > > > > For what its worth, > > > > > > > > Best wishes, > > > > Paul > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Dear Pandit Arjun ji, I agree with you sir and thank you so much for replying to my posting. True, I was wondering why you forgot Lord Buddha when you mentioned compassionate people. I do respect all the religions and I do feel the name of the religion is irrelevant as long as a person is good in the 'true' sense of the word.How can anyone become a Buddhist or call him/herself a Buddhist if one doesn't follow the path of Buddhist Philosophy? It is the same with all the other religions too. It is sad that people are blind and cannot see the beauty of this world. I can see that you are a highly evolved person, sir. May you live long and let your 'gifts' be shared among the rest of the mankind! Blessings, Renu vedic astrology, "panditarjun2004" <panditarjun2004 wrote: > > dear sister renu > > in my mentioning the most compassionate persons like jesus christ > and saibaba, i forgot to mention the buddha whose ahimsa philosophy > is a way for all religions across the globe which is why it is > gaining more popularity even in the west with celebrities like > richard gere working for the promotion of ahimsa and buddhism. > > once vishnu sharma wrote in his pancha tantram "aayam nijah paroveti > gananam laghu chetasam, udaara charitanaamtu vasudhaiva > kutumbakam". it means that a narrow minded (unrealised) person > reckons whether a person belongs to him or not (by way of relation, > language etc.) whereas for a broad minded (realised) person the > entire world is their family. in other words, an enlightened person > RISE in love and loves the whole world whereas an unrealised person > FALL in love and loves only few persons who are close to him. > > all religions across the world have great living gods like buddha. > in the present day when all countries are painting islamic nations > as terrorist countries, i remind them the greatest compassion shown > by emperor salauddin (muslim) in healing the suffering king richard > even when he was invading islamic nations to spread christianity. > god is there in every human being and one shall respect and love the > god in other humans. > > with best wishes and blessings > pandit arjun > > vedic astrology, "renunw" <renunw@> wrote: > > > > Dear Pandit Arjun ji, > > > > The 2 categories of realized people you have mentioned reminds me > > of "Buddha" and "Pase Budu" in Buddhism. 'Pase Budu' is a person > who > > attains 'araht hood' [enlightenment] but cannot preach the 'marga' > to > > anyone else. On the other hand a person who attains Buddhahood can > > preach Dhamma and show the path to others too. Gautama Lord Buddha > > was the most compassionate human being that your land could ever > > boast of. > > > > It is indeed nice to know that you are a healer blessed with > > miraculous powers. > > > > Blessings > > > > Renu > > > > vedic astrology, "panditarjun2004" > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > dear narasimha ji > > > > > > your last observation on realisation is rather strong. if it is > > > your personal opinion, it is fine but if you say it as a rule or > > > principle, it is wrong. in vedic metaphysics, we narrate the > two > > > kinds of approaches a person has after realisation which i > explain > > > below in simple language for the benefit of all. i remember > once > > > learnt dakshinamoorthiji explained the same in a message in this > > > group. > > > > > > after self realisation, the native realises the reality (truth) > > that > > > god is within and it is the same god which is all pervading and > all > > > permeating and by controlling the body, mind and the soul, he > > aligns > > > with the self and feel the divine bliss which can only be > > > experienced and not explained. however, after this level, the > > > native has two choices. > > > > > > one is to consign himself to a cozy comfortable ashram in > himalayas > > > or live in a reclusive seclusion in a cave and enjoy the eternal > > > bliss ALL ALONE undisturbed or unconcerned over what is > happening > > in > > > the outside world. if a person suffering with extreme pain > > > approaches him or if a person having problems of job for self, > > > marriage for daughter etc. approaches him, he simply laughs > loudly > > > and pity him for the IGNORANCE OR MAYA JAAL in which he is > living > > > i.e. the dependance on outwardly things and craving for samsaric > > > comforts. this realised person does not care for the suffering > of > > > the persons he is seeing in front and does not do anything even > if > > a > > > man is dying in front. these are the first category of realised > > > people. > > > > > > the second category of realised people are those who, after > > > realising the god within also realise that the same god exists > in > > > all sentient beings and show abundant compassion and distribute > > > equal love to all human beings. they go in search of the > suffering > > > like jesus christ and take the pains on themselves. people like > > > shirdi saibaba also take the sufferings of the natives and make > > them > > > happy. similar are the stories of so many babas, fakirs, peers, > > > sages and saints from this holy land. they also perform > miracles > > to > > > instill faith in god in the minds of the athiests, not for > earning > > > money or any self gratification. > > > > > > myself being a healer knows how i took on myself the sufferings, > > > pains and evils from the suffering natives and made them happy. > at > > > times i also performed few miracles to convince the natives that > > god > > > exists and that the divine grace has the power to do and undo > > things > > > written in the chart. > > > > > > hence my humble request to you and mr. paul is not to disrespect > > the > > > gurus who are serving the society at large in their self-less > > > service. you may not be the direct beneficiary of their > miraculous > > > divine blessings but there are crores of people who got their > fates > > > changed with the blessings of these realised gurus. planets > become > > > mute in such cases. as you may be aware, sages are kept above > par > > > gods in protocol for their power to bless or curse and change > what > > > brahma has written. astrology and planets become meaningless > when > > > such sages bless a native like a boon. > > > > > > may this holy land where such great holy sages and saints dwell > > > bless all the natives and protect the citizens from all problems. > > > > > > with best wishes > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Narasimha P.V.R. Rao" > > > <pvr@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Paul, > > > > > > > > The point you brought up is very interesting and I want to > > > *ramble* at length on it. Please ignore if my ramblings make no > > > sense! > > > > > > > > > If anybody tells you that their Enlightened or know God, > dont > > > beleive > > > > > them; everything is a part of God and life is already > > > enlightened. > > > > > > > > I agree and disagree. > > > > > > > > The argument that "everything is part of God and life is > already > > > enlightened" makes one think that nothing more needs to be done. > I > > > can only wish what you said was true. > > > > > > > > It is true that there is God in everything. If I think, it is > > > god's energy that is present in my thinking process. If I am > sleepy > > > and I sleep, it is god's energy (a taamasik energy) that is > present > > > in that. If I feel compassion for a five year boy with a > lukemia, > > it > > > is god's energy that is present in that compassion. If I feel > > > hungry, it is god's energy that is present in that hunger. Even > in > > a > > > serial killer's ruthlessness that makes him kill twenty people, > it > > > is basically a form of god's energy that is present. It is > various > > > forms of god's energy that is present in everything that exists. > > > > > > > > Thus, what you said is essentially true - everything is part > of > > > god. But there is one key point that is missing here. > > > > > > > > Let us go back to my previous "diamond analogy". In this > analogy, > > > the core of the diamond is the fomless divinity that pervades > the > > > entire universe and the faces with various attributes are > > > various "forms" of divinity. The inner surfaces of the faces > that > > > are in touch with the core are the aakaasa tattva manifestations > of > > > various forms. The outer surfaces of the thick faces that seem > > > opaque with various colors are the other lower manifestations of > > > various forms. > > > > > > > > Is there no difference between one whose thoughts and actions > are > > > controlled by one of the deities representing an outermost > surface > > > of a really thick face of this diamond and one whose thoughts > and > > > actions are controlled by one of the deities representing an > > > innermost surface of a face, that is in touch with the core? > > > > > > > > At the core, each of them is all-pervading Brahman only. But > one > > > has not fully realized it and will continue to exist in one form > > > after the other, while the other is close to realizing it. Even > > > though the core of the diamond in my analogy is actually not > > limited > > > to any space & time and is all-pervading, the depiction of it > close > > > to the inner surfaces and away from the outer surfaces > symbolizes > > > that. > > > > > > > > What I am trying to say is this: Our will power is in tune > with > > > various energies of this universe. As we peel off layers and it > > > becomes tuned with the will power of the root energy that is > close > > > to formlessness, we become close to self-realization. Of course, > > > when self-realization comes, one may fully realize and > appreciate > > > the fact that even the outer forms (that had to be peeled off > like > > > layers of onion) were actually filled with Brahman only. But, > such > > > realization is not possible if you continue to be controlled by > > > those energies. > > > > > > > > * * * > > > > > > > > What I am trying to say here is extremely difficult to express > in > > > words. Let me summarize it in totally different words. > > > > > > > > The formless reality (Brahman) that pervades *everything* in > this > > > universe is the true self (atman). It is unlimited and > unblemished. > > > However, manifested forms are limited and blemished. If one > fully > > > appreciates that one is not the form, but the formless reality > > > pervading the form, one is self-realized. Without full > appreciation > > > of that, one is not self-realized. > > > > > > > > If there is even a small hint of self-identification with a > form > > > (e.g. a body), one has more sadhana to do. > > > > > > > > * * * > > > > > > > > I agree with your "don't believe them" part. > > > > > > > > A really enlightened person does not go around advertizing it > or > > > seeking publicity or followers. Most gurus who claim to be > realized > > > may not be so, in reality. That point, I agree on. > > > > > > > > In fact, complete self-realization does not come in one step > in > > > this Yuga. It is a long and slow process. It is possible that > > > someone climbs Mount Kanchenjunga and thinks that it is Mount > > > Everest. One who makes some progress in the path of self- > > realization > > > can become satisfied at some stage and think that one is self- > > > realized. Only a sadguru can save one from such a trap. > > > > > > > > Sarvam SreeKrishnaarpanamastu, > > > > Narasimha > > > > ----------------------------- - > - > > > > Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro.home.comcast.net > > > > Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAstrologer.org > > > > Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagannath.org > > > > ----------------------------- - > - > > > > > > > > > Dear All, > > > > > > > > > > I was taught: > > > > > > > > > > If anybody tells you that their Enlightened or know God, > dont > > > beleive > > > > > them; everything is a part of God and life is already > > > enlightened. > > > > > > > > > > For what its worth, > > > > > > > > > > Best wishes, > > > > > Paul > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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