It is all about astrology, as it applies to or supposed to apply to life!

[Guest guest]

Before doctors learn about diseases and their cures, I have been

told, they learn about the healthy body and mind and its functions

(ties in nicely with the WHO definition of health!).

 

Astrology does not exist in vacuum. It must be learned, and must

incorporate not just its math and rules but also the living and

changing reality it was created to describe. If not, you will end up

with a very dry, egg-head astrologer, kind of like the physician with

all technology but no bedside manners. If only machines could heal!

But do they? I will leave it at that. So, regardless of who is trying

to bully the agenda, all of this is astrology. If rules is all we

want, there is plenty of literature, old to new! Anytime we talk

about human experience or what a human experiences or could, we are

talking about astrology. <I was almost going to give an analogy here

but stop because it would be viewed wrongly is my fear!>.

 

I think this quest for certainty, is not intellect/reasoning based

but very instinctual. Imagine being a caveman, waking up, still

aching from last week's hunt -- miles of running to avoid the

sabretoothed tiger when all you wanted was to catch that four feet

high rabbit and bring it home to 'community home' aka Cave #666! Your

people depended on you (yes that emotion and role had surfaced

already!) and you would happily die in order to deliver expectations!

But that gaping hole in your calf where the *^%$$## sabretooth got

its canines gave you a tattoo, for some reasons hurts so much more

this morning than while you were running back to your cave, praying

to lord Flamingo (they called Fire that, back then).

 

It is in the morning, before one goes out, yet again on another life-

sustaining adventure (foraging -- to be called later on) that the

Lord of #666 wished for certainty! And he had this feeling in the pit

of his stomach that that little stone he was working on that brought

this red stuff each time he touched the stone carelessly, was the

answer. This queer sensation in the pit of his stomach (he did not

know the name of the body part but could only point to it!) which for

many generations was thought to be just 'bad meat meal' now he knew

was really Lord Flamingo telling him from inside that Lord is talking

to Lord #666. Why LORD Flamingo? The caveman did not know but we

elite moderns know! Stress causes heartburn and acidity!!

 

Then he found astrology, but not that easily! More later if moderator

permits ...

 

RR

 

RR

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

, "rishi_2000in"

<rishi_2000in> wrote:

>

> The intellect/ mental part of human beings seeks certainity indeed.

> The natural arrogance of being born in human race , the part of

life

> which has bent a large part of nature to suit its convenience, its

> will always feels that nature can be deciphered fully, if not today

> then at a future date. This very mode of communication which we use

> is a simple illustration of human innovation and change.

> Yet, nature , more often than not sends strong signals saying that

> the humans need more effort in their endeavor to understand nature.

>

> Left unsaid, is perhaps, only a conjecture, that deep within each

> human being lies an untapped reservoir of unconscious awareness

> which gives some more answers. For that, do the humans need to look

> beyond what the mind can see; to what the intellect can absorb ; to

> probe deeper within to look at what emotions can offer, to look

from

> that perspective which is there, yet not perceptible, to look at

> what the spirit offers?

> Its here that reason and logic merge with faith and belief.

> Just rambling on the philosphy of astrology in case, I digress from

> astrological context of the forum.

> regards

>

> rishi

>

>

>

> , "crystal pages" <rrgb@>

> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Prafulla,

> >

> > There is something about 'certainty' that makes the human carnate

> > soul really get all excited and engaged and bent upon justifying

> it!

> >

> > Hence we generally dwell in the past and even Doyens like Freud

> > stayed pinned into the past, partly true, mostly imagined and

> created

> > edifices of reality around that perception.

> >

> > When something has already happened or occurred, taken place --

we

> > feel we have no option and that must be the truth,

unconditionally!

> >

> > A story told to me when I was young in astrology and divination

> that

> > still shakes me to the core, I wish to share with you today.

> >

> > One of those wars fought between the west and east -- vietnam,

> korea,

> > india -- matters not at this emancipated time!

> >

> > The soldier found love in this foreign land and what is expected

> out

> > of a 21 year old man happened! He got injured badly and got

> shipped

> > back home where he lived through the hell of one terrible

> > rehabilitation, day by day -- and when he could remember her or

> those

> > times, pined for same! He was not really capable to think of

> anything

> > more, given his physical condition and even his psyche that was

> > afflicted if anyone knows how 20 some feel!

> >

> > Meanwhile, his belle with eastern values and all, bore his child

> and

> > was relegated to a life of being shunned and ridiculed for being

> one

> > of those GI brides or whatever else they were called!

> >

> > Surely it is all about karma! Who though, gets the brunt of it?

> The

> > mother who knows it all and must bear the burden of all these

> > perceived rejections, some she knows are not really there but she

> has

> > no clue.

> >

> > The GI who pines for his love but given his physical state and

> > inability to even sustain a living from day to day in this modern

> > society that remembers him once a year but pretty much <that is

it!

> >

> >

> > Or the *innocent* child? What should S/he feel? What if she is

the

> > illegitimate offspring in a puritanical rather rigid society,

> > exploited too long to even recover en masse!

> >

> > Whose karma is going to be the worst when they are born again, as

> > they better or where will astrology and its karmic foundation

> stand

> > upon?

> >

> > RR

> >

> >

> >

> >  , Prafulla Gang

<jyotish@>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Mr Kumar

> > >

> > > When started learning astrology - I used to consider yoga

> heavily

> > (as prescribed) and but with the academic progressions, I started

> > discriminting them (on respective planet's functional role as

> defined

> > in classics) in my astrological pursuance. In some form or other,

> I

> > could not identify them to give clues for consistent results;

> > ofcourse, I never d them for events. Yet, the keeping

> > astrology to simplistic form has always been my genuine efforts

> and

> > worked around the tools, which can definitely render indications

> for

> > events. May be the approach deviates from the classics, but in a

> way -

> >  linking that to current yuga read with the rationale provided by

> > classics.

> > >

> > > Having said that - for an astrology student - concept of

> overriding

> > principles are always complicated for the fact that - this leads

> to

> > inconsistent interpretations (not for past results - but for

> future

> > events).

> > >

> > > I am certainly looking forward to receive your notes on yoga.. I

> am

> > not closed in my mind set for the yogas, yet certainly look

> forward

> > to fine tune the approach for consistent interpretation tool.

> > >

> > > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > >

> > > Neither naked asceticism, matted hair, dirt, fasting, sleeping

> on

> > the ground, dust & mud, nor prolonged sitting on one's heels can

> > purify a man who is not free of doubts.

> > >

> > >

> > > >

> > > > gbp_kumar@

> > > > Sun, 28 May 2006 22:12:13 -0700 (PDT)

> > > >

> > > > Re: case study - guru / moon gaj kesari yoga

29/5

> > > >

> > > > Dear Prafulla,

> > > >    I WIL TRY TO PLACE THE PINTS HERE BELOW your lines in

> CAPS.

> > as fonts

> > > > or colors r not supported in JR

> > > >  Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> wrote:        Dear Mr Kumar

> > > >  My contention is very simple - can yoga involve the planets

> > which  are

> > > > negative for a native in general interpretation (or

classics 

> > reference)?

> > > > Can yoga contradicts the fundamental of afflictions? Can 

> yoga be

> > > > involving weak planets? Perhaps, we to many yogas

> for 

> > results,

> > > > which might exist for some other fundamental reasons.

> > > >    SURE WEAK PLANETS GIVE WEAK YOGAS no denial

> > > >    ABOVE ALL GURU inthis womens chart is in own house,

> Kendra,

> > Moola

> > > > Trikona, Hamsa Yoga etc at least tis will give her wealth on

> its

> > own

> > > > even if Moons weak aspect reduces it a bit

> > > >    a la Gajakesari Yoga.

> > > >  If with the aspect / affliction - guru is weak then its

> > results  will be

> > > > affected proportionately. In my understanding, under such 

> > combinations

> > > > yoga cease to exist.

> > > >    WEAK DASA, YOGAS  GIVE weak results.

> > > >    YOU CAN DRAW SOME CLUES FROM THE WAY LONGEVITY IS

ASSESSED

> by

> > so many

> > > > factors yogas.

> > > >    QUITE OFT EN  OUR RISHIS HAVE SAID IM IMPLIED WORS THAN

> SAID

> > > > DIRECTLYI am sure if you have gone through Uttarakalumrutha,

> Phala

> > > > deepika, Jatakaparijata all derivations from Parashari it is

> also

> > there.

> > > >    and the guidng axim that Desha, Kala parastithi is

> important

> > without

> > > > loosing the spirit of it we need to adapt the Yoga or Dasa

> > RESULTS.

> > > >    Yoga works throughout the life; Parashari does not define

> any

> > > > proportionate yoga results (commentators might have). I will

> love

> > to  see

> > > > such quote and correct myself, if any. Another logical issue

> > (Yes,  I am

> > > > aware of 5th lord mars with ketu in 8th), if yoga so existing

> with

> > > > strong guru (assuming in your theory - not afflicted), then

> can

> > not  this

> > > > override any such negative resultants. Afterall, Yoga is

> > supposed  to

> > > > give uninterrupted results. Dasa in concern was also of guru.

> > > >    I can only be suggestive in exploring the basis of yoga

> > itself, and

> > > > validate the resultants. I might also be wrong, as I am

> exploring

> > too;

> > > > and looking for consistent application of any configuration.

> > > >    I AM SURE I AM SETIGN YOU ON THE RIGHT TRACK I AM NO

> > AUTHORITY BUT

> > > > HAVE  BEEN TOLD, BY MY GURUS 2 were founder members of 

> ICAS,

> > my guiding

> > > > Guru today +(from past 21 yrs) is a 4 generation astrologer.

> > > >  BTW, no one is guru basher. How can one be; we are only

> > discussing  its

> > > > relevance in judging few of its karakatve in current yuga.

> > > >    THERE R MANY GURU BASHERS in this group Pl read threads

on

> it

> > so many

> > > > u  can find during march-May this yr Guru in 5th, Guru a

> malefic

> > etc

> > > >    THAT WHEREVER GURU IS OR ASPECTS IS RUINED, SATN IS A

> BEIFIC

> > COMPARED

> > > > TO GURU etc some wild assesments even coverign past Yogas

> where

> > NONE OF

> > > > US HAVE ANY BASIS TO ENTER OR INTERPRET.

> > > >    I replied to them sayigng what i sumed in last mail Guru

> > gives slowly

> > > > with  honor, rightfully morally but tests u all the way , but

> > > > materialistic Sukra, Rahi give u faster and by wha the world

> sees

> > how

> > > > rich u r not how u made it then Guru is a malefic., that too

> after

> > > > Capitailism, consumerism, liberalism, prermisiveness beyond

> sense

> > > > through CINEA, TV came in.

> > > >    for a value based socity Guru is a benific- u earn with

> > hnonor, may

> > > > be  poor but academically rich, well know, comands respect

> but

> > at times

> > > > no  wealth to flaunt.

> > > >    for a valueless, ethicsless, immoral, unscroupulos one it

> is a

> > > > malefic.

> > > >    I WILL EXPLAIN A NEW DIMENSION TO YOGAS IN  post, will

> scan

> > a page  of

> > > > NN KRISHA Raos works and show some useflw ays to read yogas.

> > > >    regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > >  Neither naked asceticism, matted hair, dirt, fasting,

> sleeping

> > on  the

> > > > ground, dust & mud, nor prolonged sitting on one's heels

can 

> > purify a

> > > > man who is not free of doubts.

> > > >     

> > > >    gbp_kumar@

> > > >    Sun, 28 May 2006 10:52:41 -0700 (PDT)

> > > >   

> > > >    Re: case study - guru / moon gaj kesari

yoga

> > 28/5

> > > >      Dear Prafulla,

> > > >      I am surprised that the Guru Bashers [Guru is a

maleic

> > wherever  he

> > > > is  or asppects, will be v happy to see this case in such 

> > light] did

> > > > not  jump into the fray I am not one of them

> > > >      NOW THE QUESTION WAS DOES GAJAKESARI YOGA OPERATE OR

> NOT

> > > >      AS I CAN READ IT  it is power, status, money, etc

> > > >      the other questions are not part of Gajakesari Yoga

> but

> > if u want an

> > > > answer on it

> > > >      3 misscarriage= 5th lord in 8th with malefic ketu.

> surely

> > will give

> > > > that result who is Neecha too.

> > > >      health sani+Sukra does affect health.

> > > >      I can write seperately on this if u want

> > > >      BUT ALL CLASSICS STATE THE RESULTS ARE PROPORTIONAL

TO

> > STRENGTH  OF

> > > > THE  YOGAS AND FOR YOGAS THE DASA MUST RUN AND GOCHARA and 

> > other Balas

> > > > must  support it.

> > > >      Mixing gaja kesari with poor health, no male isuses

> > defeats the

> > > > Yoga itself. it quality i ssurel reduced but not eliminated.

> > > >      Hw about Mahatma Gandhi he had Gajakesari yoga

> commended

> > respect

> > > > and  wealth  never ammased wealth though rather slod

> evvery 

> > memorablie

> > > > and made money for the freedom movement or any relief 

> programm

> > and many

> > > > MALE ISSUES for him Guru is 6th lord in Lagna  in a enemy

> sign,

> > with

> > > > shandra in Kataka-aslesha.

> > > >      we can show that there be come qualitative reductuion

> due

> > to

> > > > applying factors, as said dasas, Yogas, gochara etc.

> > > >    Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> wrote:        Dear Mr

Kumar

> > > >           I was expecting this line of   argument

> from

> > you (!!). I know,

> > > > what mean to say; but can we get  down  to few key things:

> > > >            a.  is the jupiter strong for its

> > relationship with moon?

> > > >            b.  if the (a) is true  - is jupiter 

> > poweful enough to render

> > > > strong results for - its  occupation, its  ownership,

> aspects

> > and natural

> > > > significations?  and if the results  indicated are not

> strong

> > enough -

> > > > what does it  imply? Jupiter is  afflicted by Moon. How do

> you

> > justify

> > > > poor  health, weak education, lack  of male progeny, weak

> > health of

> > > > spouse reflected in personal stress  (jupiter is karka for

> > husband  as

> > > > well).  If a yoga is so strong -  should not it manifest 

> in

> > full - It

> > > > does not !!!.

> > > >            c.  yoga is   never  meant  to be

> > partial or overridden; it is

> > > > sure  shot  indication for its results. For any yoga to

give

> > results,

> > > > planets  engaged therein - must be positively inclined for

> the 

> > native

> > > > and must  be strong as well. If jupiter is afflicted,   it

> is

> > not strong.

> > > > and  please quote me from classics, if they  support yoga

> > formation by

> > > > weak  planets. The fact remains that -  the lady gone

> through 3

> > > > abortions  (will strong jupiter let it  happen - if

> aspecting

> > 5th house

> > > > in full  with gaj kesari - and  that too in guru maha

> dasha).

> > Even with

> > > > other  factors, strong  lagnesh should have overruled, all

> its

> > > > overriding  factors; and if  it fails to meet the

overriding

> > factors -

> > > > certainly  implies that  guru is rendered weak in the

> > chart..and gaj

> > > > keasri yoga is  not  manifesting (strictly in line with

> > classics..as I

> > > > repeat -    please quote a support from parashari saying

> that

> > malefic /

> > > > weak  planets are candidate for yoga formation).

> > > >            I am putting this example,  not to 

> prove

> > or score; so please

> > > > experiment the above rationale  from research  perspective.

> and

> > under any

> > > > circumstances, I will  avoid to drag  astrological

> experience

> > sharing

> > > > into unnecessary  arguments.

> > > >            regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > >      Talk is cheap, because supply exceeds demand.

> > > >     

> > > >      gbp_kumar@

> > > >      Sun, 28 May 2006 00:36:49 -0700 (PDT)

> > > >     

> > > >      Re: case study - guru / moon gaj kesari

> > yoga 28/5

> > > >      Prafulla,

> > > >        ur own line cut ^ pasted here...has lots of luck

> and

> > fortune...

> > > >        this is part oft he Gaa kesari yog

> > > >        the other issues not par of it, NO male issue or

> > issues with

> > > > lumanaries etc.

> > > >        and as u said in earlier posts that there will be

> > several other

> > > > factors why not here?

> > > >        say even Lagna lord going to dusthana, if lagna

> > lord  itself WAK

> > > > does  ANY YOGA have a role, will hav eto modified  isn't it

> > that is  one

> > > > want  to build a multi storied buildign  on weak soil? or

> an 

> > earthquake

> > > > prone  zone?

> > > >        same here u can do it and add other safeguards if

> u

> > want to buold

> > > > in such place.

> > > >      Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> wrote:        Dear

> > Members

> > > >      I will be posting few charts and let us investigate

the

> > > > influences  of dusthana lord moon's effect on natal guru 

> > (whether  gaj

> > > > kesari yoga  is initialized).

> > > >        Case of denial of male progeny and constant

health

> > issues

> > > >        Female

> > > >        July 9, 1972

> > > >        18.45 IST

> > > >        Jodhpur - India 26N17, 73E04

> > > >        dhanu lagna - lagnesh guru in lagna; 8th lord

> moon 

> > and 9th lord

> > > > sun in  7th; saturn / venus in 6th;  ketu/mars/mercury in

> 8th;

> > rahu  in

> > > > 2nd house

> > > >        Let us not build overriding theories; but

> validate 

> > the fact that

> > > > - if  "shubha" yoga is formed with planets  owning dusthana

> > houses  or

> > > > weak  planets. In my view, there  is no partial yoga;

> feeble 

> > yoga will

> > > > produce  highly  inconsistent results and if at all it 

> can -

> > then it can

> > > > not   override the inherent weakness / bad  results of

> > dusthana lords.

> > > >        The lady, I read her chart 7/8 years back - has

> > lots  of luck

> > > > and  fortune ..but troubled life (more around  natural 

> > significations

> > > > of  jupiter).

> > > >        Please note that - this is not chart reading 

> > request; but a

> > > > sincere submission to validate the existence of yoga.

> > > >        regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > >  Prashantkumar G B

> > > >    -*- The services of this astrologer are free on

> > group

> > > > but

> > > >   off the group consultations are chargeable by chat, mail or

> > phone.

> > > >    Please  fix times for this in advance -*-

> > > >    09840051861

> > > > 

> > > >  New Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from

> your

> > PC and

> > > > save big.

> > > > 

[Guest guest]

Interesting, isn't it, sir, that when we talk of caveman, we think

from our perspective, not really knowing what conditions were then

but trying to recreate/build them up.

Instinct or reason, the fact remains that "certain" events are limited

and known. We tend to take astrology towards certainity because we

seek patterns and expect them to recur and deliver similar results.

The degree of difficulty in astrology increases because unlike

medicine which finds definite physiological, anatomical etc patterns

in healthy human beings, astrology cannot with certainity pinpoint

any single pattern.

We often say that no single yoga or combination or graha can alone

dictate the entire chart but an amalgam of various factors needs to

be weighed, analysed and understood. Fair enough.

However, most of the problems in empirical astrological research

arise because one cannot even list out those various factors which

will amalgamate in a chart holistically.

When you do not know what a healthy chart is, how do you start 

curing?

 

And,astrology is not merely applying laid down rules. That is the job

of a technician in the astrological field. Sadly, even the

technicians do not use the same set of approaches.

Couldnot it mere coincidences that many pedictions come true.

Let me, a mere student of Jyotish, seek answer and a  logical one,

not because its written in a text book to this very basic question to

start with.

 

Why is the trikona ..the Lagna, fifth and the ninth house the key to

charts?

regards

rishi

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

, "crystal pages" <rrgb>

wrote:

>

> Before doctors learn about diseases and their cures, I have been

> told, they learn about the healthy body and mind and its functions

> (ties in nicely with the WHO definition of health!).

>

> Astrology does not exist in vacuum. It must be learned, and must

> incorporate not just its math and rules but also the living and

> changing reality it was created to describe. If not, you will end

up

> with a very dry, egg-head astrologer, kind of like the physician

with

> all technology but no bedside manners. If only machines could heal!

> But do they? I will leave it at that. So, regardless of who is

trying

> to bully the agenda, all of this is astrology. If rules is all we

> want, there is plenty of literature, old to new! Anytime we talk

> about human experience or what a human experiences or could, we are

> talking about astrology. <I was almost going to give an analogy

here

> but stop because it would be viewed wrongly is my fear!>.

>

> I think this quest for certainty, is not intellect/reasoning based

> but very instinctual. Imagine being a caveman, waking up, still

> aching from last week's hunt -- miles of running to avoid the

> sabretoothed tiger when all you wanted was to catch that four feet

> high rabbit and bring it home to 'community home' aka Cave #666!

Your

> people depended on you (yes that emotion and role had surfaced

> already!) and you would happily die in order to deliver

expectations!

> But that gaping hole in your calf where the *^%$$## sabretooth got

> its canines gave you a tattoo, for some reasons hurts so much more

> this morning than while you were running back to your cave, praying

> to lord Flamingo (they called Fire that, back then).

>

> It is in the morning, before one goes out, yet again on another

life-

> sustaining adventure (foraging -- to be called later on) that the

> Lord of #666 wished for certainty! And he had this feeling in the

pit

> of his stomach that that little stone he was working on that

brought

> this red stuff each time he touched the stone carelessly, was the

> answer. This queer sensation in the pit of his stomach (he did not

> know the name of the body part but could only point to it!) which

for

> many generations was thought to be just 'bad meat meal' now he knew

> was really Lord Flamingo telling him from inside that Lord is

talking

> to Lord #666. Why LORD Flamingo? The caveman did not know but we

> elite moderns know! Stress causes heartburn and acidity!!

>

> Then he found astrology, but not that easily! More later if

moderator

> permits ...

>

> RR

>

> RR

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> , "rishi_2000in"

> <rishi_2000in@> wrote:

> >

> > The intellect/ mental part of human beings seeks certainity

indeed.

> > The natural arrogance of being born in human race , the part of

> life

> > which has bent a large part of nature to suit its convenience,

its

> > will always feels that nature can be deciphered fully, if not

today

> > then at a future date. This very mode of communication which we

use

> > is a simple illustration of human innovation and change.

> > Yet, nature , more often than not sends strong signals saying

that

> > the humans need more effort in their endeavor to understand

nature.

> >

> > Left unsaid, is perhaps, only a conjecture, that deep within each

> > human being lies an untapped reservoir of unconscious awareness

> > which gives some more answers. For that, do the humans need to

look

> > beyond what the mind can see; to what the intellect can absorb ;

to

> > probe deeper within to look at what emotions can offer, to look

> from

> > that perspective which is there, yet not perceptible, to look at

> > what the spirit offers?

> > Its here that reason and logic merge with faith and belief.

> > Just rambling on the philosphy of astrology in case, I digress

from

> > astrological context of the forum.

> > regards

> >

> > rishi

> >

> >

> >

> > , "crystal pages" <rrgb@>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Prafulla,

> > >

> > > There is something about 'certainty' that makes the human

carnate

> > > soul really get all excited and engaged and bent upon

justifying

> > it!

> > >

> > > Hence we generally dwell in the past and even Doyens like Freud

> > > stayed pinned into the past, partly true, mostly imagined and

> > created

> > > edifices of reality around that perception.

> > >

> > > When something has already happened or occurred, taken place --

> we

> > > feel we have no option and that must be the truth,

> unconditionally!

> > >

> > > A story told to me when I was young in astrology and divination

> > that

> > > still shakes me to the core, I wish to share with you today.

> > >

> > > One of those wars fought between the west and east -- vietnam,

> > korea,

> > > india -- matters not at this emancipated time!

> > >

> > > The soldier found love in this foreign land and what is

expected

> > out

> > > of a 21 year old man happened! He got injured badly and got

> > shipped

> > > back home where he lived through the hell of one terrible

> > > rehabilitation, day by day -- and when he could remember her or

> > those

> > > times, pined for same! He was not really capable to think of

> > anything

> > > more, given his physical condition and even his psyche that was

> > > afflicted if anyone knows how 20 some feel!

> > >

> > > Meanwhile, his belle with eastern values and all, bore his

child

> > and

> > > was relegated to a life of being shunned and ridiculed for

being

> > one

> > > of those GI brides or whatever else they were called!

> > >

> > > Surely it is all about karma! Who though, gets the brunt of it?

> > The

> > > mother who knows it all and must bear the burden of all these

> > > perceived rejections, some she knows are not really there but

she

> > has

> > > no clue.

> > >

> > > The GI who pines for his love but given his physical state and

> > > inability to even sustain a living from day to day in this

modern

> > > society that remembers him once a year but pretty much <that is

> it!

> > >

> > >

> > > Or the *innocent* child? What should S/he feel? What if she is

> the

> > > illegitimate offspring in a puritanical rather rigid society,

> > > exploited too long to even recover en masse!

> > >

> > > Whose karma is going to be the worst when they are born again,

as

> > > they better or where will astrology and its karmic foundation

> > stand

> > > upon?

> > >

> > > RR

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >  , Prafulla Gang

> <jyotish@>

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Mr Kumar

> > > >

> > > > When started learning astrology - I used to consider yoga

> > heavily

> > > (as prescribed) and but with the academic progressions, I

started

> > > discriminting them (on respective planet's functional role as

> > defined

> > > in classics) in my astrological pursuance. In some form or

other,

> > I

> > > could not identify them to give clues for consistent results;

> > > ofcourse, I never d them for events. Yet, the keeping

> > > astrology to simplistic form has always been my genuine efforts

> > and

> > > worked around the tools, which can definitely render

indications

> > for

> > > events. May be the approach deviates from the classics, but in

a

> > way -

> > >  linking that to current yuga read with the rationale provided

by

> > > classics.

> > > >

> > > > Having said that - for an astrology student - concept of

> > overriding

> > > principles are always complicated for the fact that - this

leads

> > to

> > > inconsistent interpretations (not for past results - but for

> > future

> > > events).

> > > >

> > > > I am certainly looking forward to receive your notes on yoga.

I

> > am

> > > not closed in my mind set for the yogas, yet certainly look

> > forward

> > > to fine tune the approach for consistent interpretation tool..

> > > >

> > > > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > >

> > > > Neither naked asceticism, matted hair, dirt, fasting,

sleeping

> > on

> > > the ground, dust & mud, nor prolonged sitting on one's heels

can

> > > purify a man who is not free of doubts.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > gbp_kumar@

> > > > > Sun, 28 May 2006 22:12:13 -0700 (PDT)

> > > > >

> > > > > Re: case study - guru / moon gaj kesari yoga

> 29/5

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Prafulla,

> > > > >    I WIL TRY TO PLACE THE PINTS HERE BELOW your lines in

> > CAPS.

> > > as fonts

> > > > > or colors r not supported in JR

> > > > >  Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> wrote:        Dear Mr Kumar

> > > > >  My contention is very simple - can yoga involve the

planets

> > > which  are

> > > > > negative for a native in general interpretation (or

> classics 

> > > reference)?

> > > > > Can yoga contradicts the fundamental of afflictions? Can 

> > yoga be

> > > > > involving weak planets? Perhaps, we to many yogas

> > for 

> > > results,

> > > > > which might exist for some other fundamental reasons.

> > > > >    SURE WEAK PLANETS GIVE WEAK YOGAS no denial

> > > > >    ABOVE ALL GURU inthis womens chart is in own house,

> > Kendra,

> > > Moola

> > > > > Trikona, Hamsa Yoga etc at least tis will give her wealth

on

> > its

> > > own

> > > > > even if Moons weak aspect reduces it a bit

> > > > >    a la Gajakesari Yoga.

> > > > >  If with the aspect / affliction - guru is weak then its

> > > results  will be

> > > > > affected proportionately. In my understanding, under such 

> > > combinations

> > > > > yoga cease to exist.

> > > > >    WEAK DASA, YOGAS  GIVE weak results.

> > > > >    YOU CAN DRAW SOME CLUES FROM THE WAY LONGEVITY IS

> ASSESSED

> > by

> > > so many

> > > > > factors yogas.

> > > > >    QUITE OFT EN  OUR RISHIS HAVE SAID IM IMPLIED WORS

THAN

> > SAID

> > > > > DIRECTLYI am sure if you have gone through

Uttarakalumrutha,

> > Phala

> > > > > deepika, Jatakaparijata all derivations from Parashari it

is

> > also

> > > there.

> > > > >    and the guidng axim that Desha, Kala parastithi is

> > important

> > > without

> > > > > loosing the spirit of it we need to adapt the Yoga or Dasa

> > > RESULTS.

> > > > >    Yoga works throughout the life; Parashari does not

define

> > any

> > > > > proportionate yoga results (commentators might have). I

will

> > love

> > > to  see

> > > > > such quote and correct myself, if any. Another logical

issue

> > > (Yes,  I am

> > > > > aware of 5th lord mars with ketu in 8th), if yoga so

existing

> > with

> > > > > strong guru (assuming in your theory - not afflicted), then

> > can

> > > not  this

> > > > > override any such negative resultants. Afterall, Yoga is

> > > supposed  to

> > > > > give uninterrupted results. Dasa in concern was also of

guru.

> > > > >    I can only be suggestive in exploring the basis of yoga

> > > itself, and

> > > > > validate the resultants. I might also be wrong, as I am

> > exploring

> > > too;

> > > > > and looking for consistent application of any configuration.

> > > > >    I AM SURE I AM SETIGN YOU ON THE RIGHT TRACK I AM NO

> > > AUTHORITY BUT

> > > > > HAVE  BEEN TOLD, BY MY GURUS 2 were founder members of 

> > ICAS,

> > > my guiding

> > > > > Guru today +(from past 21 yrs) is a 4 generation astrologer.

> > > > >  BTW, no one is guru basher. How can one be; we are only

> > > discussing  its

> > > > > relevance in judging few of its karakatve in current yuga.

> > > > >    THERE R MANY GURU BASHERS in this group Pl read threads

> on

> > it

> > > so many

> > > > > u  can find during march-May this yr Guru in 5th, Guru a

> > malefic

> > > etc

> > > > >    THAT WHEREVER GURU IS OR ASPECTS IS RUINED, SATN IS A

> > BEIFIC

> > > COMPARED

> > > > > TO GURU etc some wild assesments even coverign past Yogas

> > where

> > > NONE OF

> > > > > US HAVE ANY BASIS TO ENTER OR INTERPRET.

> > > > >    I replied to them sayigng what i sumed in last mail

Guru

> > > gives slowly

> > > > > with  honor, rightfully morally but tests u all the way ,

but

> > > > > materialistic Sukra, Rahi give u faster and by wha the

world

> > sees

> > > how

> > > > > rich u r not how u made it then Guru is a malefic., that

too

> > after

> > > > > Capitailism, consumerism, liberalism, prermisiveness beyond

> > sense

> > > > > through CINEA, TV came in.

> > > > >    for a value based socity Guru is a benific- u earn with

> > > hnonor, may

> > > > > be  poor but academically rich, well know, comands respect

> > but

> > > at times

> > > > > no  wealth to flaunt.

> > > > >    for a valueless, ethicsless, immoral, unscroupulos one

it

> > is a

> > > > > malefic.

> > > > >    I WILL EXPLAIN A NEW DIMENSION TO YOGAS IN  post, will

> > scan

> > > a page  of

> > > > > NN KRISHA Raos works and show some useflw ays to read yogas.

> > > > >    regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > > >  Neither naked asceticism, matted hair, dirt, fasting,

> > sleeping

> > > on  the

> > > > > ground, dust & mud, nor prolonged sitting on one's heels

> can 

> > > purify a

> > > > > man who is not free of doubts.

> > > > >     

> > > > >    gbp_kumar@

> > > > >    Sun, 28 May 2006 10:52:41 -0700 (PDT)

> > > > >   

> > > > >    Re: case study - guru / moon gaj kesari

> yoga

> > > 28/5

> > > > >      Dear Prafulla,

> > > > >      I am surprised that the Guru Bashers [Guru is a

> maleic

> > > wherever  he

> > > > > is  or asppects, will be v happy to see this case in

such 

> > > light] did

> > > > > not  jump into the fray I am not one of them

> > > > >      NOW THE QUESTION WAS DOES GAJAKESARI YOGA OPERATE

OR

> > NOT

> > > > >      AS I CAN READ IT  it is power, status, money, etc

> > > > >      the other questions are not part of Gajakesari Yoga

> > but

> > > if u want an

> > > > > answer on it

> > > > >      3 misscarriage= 5th lord in 8th with malefic ketu.

> > surely

> > > will give

> > > > > that result who is Neecha too.

> > > > >      health sani+Sukra does affect health.

> > > > >      I can write seperately on this if u want

> > > > >      BUT ALL CLASSICS STATE THE RESULTS ARE PROPORTIONAL

> TO

> > > STRENGTH  OF

> > > > > THE  YOGAS AND FOR YOGAS THE DASA MUST RUN AND GOCHARA

and 

> > > other Balas

> > > > > must  support it.

> > > > >      Mixing gaja kesari with poor health, no male isuses

> > > defeats the

> > > > > Yoga itself. it quality i ssurel reduced but not eliminated.

> > > > >      Hw about Mahatma Gandhi he had Gajakesari yoga

> > commended

> > > respect

> > > > > and  wealth  never ammased wealth though rather slod

> > evvery 

> > > memorablie

> > > > > and made money for the freedom movement or any relief 

> > programm

> > > and many

> > > > > MALE ISSUES for him Guru is 6th lord in Lagna  in a enemy

> > sign,

> > > with

> > > > > shandra in Kataka-aslesha.

> > > > >      we can show that there be come qualitative

reductuion

> > due

> > > to

> > > > > applying factors, as said dasas, Yogas, gochara etc.

> > > > >    Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> wrote:        Dear Mr

> Kumar

> > > > >           I was expecting this line of   argument

> > from

> > > you (!!). I know,

> > > > > what mean to say; but can we get  down  to few key things:

> > > > >            a.  is the jupiter strong for its

> > > relationship with moon?

> > > > >            b.  if the (a) is true  - is

jupiter 

> > > poweful enough to render

> > > > > strong results for - its  occupation, its  ownership,

> > aspects

> > > and natural

> > > > > significations?  and if the results  indicated are not

> > strong

> > > enough -

> > > > > what does it  imply? Jupiter is  afflicted by Moon. How

do

> > you

> > > justify

> > > > > poor  health, weak education, lack  of male progeny, weak

> > > health of

> > > > > spouse reflected in personal stress  (jupiter is karka for

> > > husband  as

> > > > > well).  If a yoga is so strong -  should not it

manifest 

> > in

> > > full - It

> > > > > does not !!!.

> > > > >            c.  yoga is   never  meant  to be

> > > partial or overridden; it is

> > > > > sure  shot  indication for its results. For any yoga to

> give

> > > results,

> > > > > planets  engaged therein - must be positively inclined for

> > the 

> > > native

> > > > > and must  be strong as well. If jupiter is afflicted,  

it

> > is

> > > not strong.

> > > > > and  please quote me from classics, if they  support yoga

> > > formation by

> > > > > weak  planets. The fact remains that -  the lady gone

> > through 3

> > > > > abortions  (will strong jupiter let it  happen - if

> > aspecting

> > > 5th house

> > > > > in full  with gaj kesari - and  that too in guru maha

> > dasha).

> > > Even with

> > > > > other  factors, strong  lagnesh should have overruled,

all

> > its

> > > > > overriding  factors; and if  it fails to meet the

> overriding

> > > factors -

> > > > > certainly  implies that  guru is rendered weak in the

> > > chart..and gaj

> > > > > keasri yoga is  not  manifesting (strictly in line with

> > > classics..as I

> > > > > repeat -    please quote a support from parashari saying

> > that

> > > malefic /

> > > > > weak  planets are candidate for yoga formation).

> > > > >            I am putting this example,  not to 

> > prove

> > > or score; so please

> > > > > experiment the above rationale  from research 

perspective.

> > and

> > > under any

> > > > > circumstances, I will  avoid to drag  astrological

> > experience

> > > sharing

> > > > > into unnecessary  arguments.

> > > > >            regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > > >      Talk is cheap, because supply exceeds demand.

> > > > >     

> > > > >      gbp_kumar@

> > > > >      Sun, 28 May 2006 00:36:49 -0700 (PDT)

> > > > >     

> > > > >      Re: case study - guru / moon gaj

kesari

> > > yoga 28/5

> > > > >      Prafulla,

> > > > >        ur own line cut ^ pasted here...has lots of

luck

> > and

> > > fortune...

> > > > >        this is part oft he Gaa kesari yog

> > > > >        the other issues not par of it, NO male issue

or

> > > issues with

> > > > > lumanaries etc.

> > > > >        and as u said in earlier posts that there will

be

> > > several other

> > > > > factors why not here?

> > > > >        say even Lagna lord going to dusthana, if lagna

> > > lord  itself WAK

> > > > > does  ANY YOGA have a role, will hav eto modified  isn't

it

> > > that is  one

> > > > > want  to build a multi storied buildign  on weak soil? or

> > an 

> > > earthquake

> > > > > prone  zone?

> > > > >        same here u can do it and add other safeguards

if

> > u

> > > want to buold

> > > > > in such place.

> > > > >      Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> wrote:        Dear

> > > Members

> > > > >      I will be posting few charts and let us investigate

> the

> > > > > influences  of dusthana lord moon's effect on natal guru 

> > > (whether  gaj

> > > > > kesari yoga  is initialized).

> > > > >        Case of denial of male progeny and constant

> health

> > > issues

> > > > >        Female

> > > > >        July 9, 1972

> > > > >        18.45 IST

> > > > >        Jodhpur - India 26N17, 73E04

> > > > >        dhanu lagna - lagnesh guru in lagna; 8th lord

> > moon 

> > > and 9th lord

> > > > > sun in  7th; saturn / venus in 6th;  ketu/mars/mercury in

> > 8th;

> > > rahu  in

> > > > > 2nd house

> > > > >        Let us not build overriding theories; but

> > validate 

> > > the fact that

> > > > > - if  "shubha" yoga is formed with planets  owning

dusthana

> > > houses  or

> > > > > weak  planets. In my view, there  is no partial yoga;

> > feeble 

> > > yoga will

> > > > > produce  highly  inconsistent results and if at all it 

> > can -

> > > then it can

> > > > > not   override the inherent weakness / bad  results of

> > > dusthana lords.

> > > > >        The lady, I read her chart 7/8 years back - has

> > > lots  of luck

> > > > > and  fortune ..but troubled life (more around  natural 

> > > significations

> > > > > of  jupiter).

> > > > >        Please note that - this is not chart reading 

> > > request; but a

> > > > > sincere submission to validate the existence of yoga.

> > > > >        regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > > >  Prashantkumar G B

> > > > >    -*- The services of this astrologer are free on

> > > group

> > > > > but

> > > > >   off the group consultations are chargeable by chat, mail

or

> > > phone.

> > > > >    Please  fix times for this in advance -*-

> > > > >    09840051861

> > > > > 

> > > > >  New Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from

> > your

> > > PC and

> > > > > save big.

> > > > > 

[Guest guest]

-Dear Rishi,

 

For most ordinary individuals like yours truly, sans self-

realization, sans intuition or any special brilliance of reasoning or

intellect, reality can only be visualized and understood via the

mind, whatever its state is. Truly, it is not an unbiased or un-

conditioned tool, but what else is there for this poor ant?

 

I am sure there was a time in the history of healing crafts when the

clarity of correlated events and certainty was not there, compared to

now, and even now it is not fully clear, completely defined and thus

remains 'less than certain'. This is not a comparison between

medicine and astrology but an analogy to which people can relate to,

hence its utilization here.

 

However, when I described my view of the caveman, it was based on the

possibility that Darwin was right! Some question that of course. But

if indeed human developed from animals, even the smallest animal has

instincts and I do not want to elaborate that too much here as I am

going to ruffle some feathers again which activity I have no use for!

 

Please think about this for a moment, though! The caveman is not some

possible or forgotten page in some unrecorded history! Caveman is

very much alive within all of us! We just are too scared to reach in

and touch base with him/her on a regular basis. We do see him in all

glory from time to time, even in the 2dimensional medium of internet,

need I remind you? Anyway, you must have read Desmond Morrises Naked

Ape and The Human zoo books. The simple fact of there being remnants

of old brain regions within our modern brains (scientifically

documented) and the well-known adage or observation of ontogeny

repeats phylogeny also come to mind in this respect. If God created hu

(man) directly, what would be the point of the unborn, unseen (until

recent foetus) to go through all those stages during which it

resembles earlier stages of evolution of animal kingdom?

 

I have written about trikons in my writings often and enough and it

has been made freely available to all who seek my views and my

understanding of this fascinating subject. I have no need to flaunt

that again and waste bandwidth on this august forum and then be

blamed and accused of being arrogant in repeated posts which

hopefully are not caused by some virus ;-)

 

RR

 

-- In , "rishi_2000in"

<rishi_2000in> wrote:

>

> Interesting, isn't it, sir, that when we talk of caveman, we think

> from our perspective, not really knowing what conditions were then

> but trying to recreate/build them up.

> Instinct or reason, the fact remains that "certain" events are

limited

> and known. We tend to take astrology towards certainity because we

> seek patterns and expect them to recur and deliver similar results.

> The degree of difficulty in astrology increases because unlike

> medicine which finds definite physiological, anatomical etc

patterns

> in healthy human beings, astrology cannot with certainity pinpoint

> any single pattern.

> We often say that no single yoga or combination or graha can alone

> dictate the entire chart but an amalgam of various factors needs to

> be weighed, analysed and understood. Fair enough.

> However, most of the problems in empirical astrological research

> arise because one cannot even list out those various factors which

> will amalgamate in a chart holistically.

> When you do not know what a healthy chart is, how do you start 

> curing?

>

> And,astrology is not merely applying laid down rules. That is the

job

> of a technician in the astrological field. Sadly, even the

> technicians do not use the same set of approaches.

> Couldnot it mere coincidences that many pedictions come true.

> Let me, a mere student of Jyotish, seek answer and a  logical one,

> not because its written in a text book to this very basic question

to

> start with.

>

> Why is the trikona ..the Lagna, fifth and the ninth house the key

to

> charts?

> regards

> rishi

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> , "crystal pages" <rrgb@>

> wrote:

> >

> > Before doctors learn about diseases and their cures, I have been

> > told, they learn about the healthy body and mind and its

functions

> > (ties in nicely with the WHO definition of health!).

> >

> > Astrology does not exist in vacuum. It must be learned, and must

> > incorporate not just its math and rules but also the living and

> > changing reality it was created to describe. If not, you will end

> up

> > with a very dry, egg-head astrologer, kind of like the physician

> with

> > all technology but no bedside manners. If only machines could

heal!

> > But do they? I will leave it at that. So, regardless of who is

> trying

> > to bully the agenda, all of this is astrology. If rules is all we

> > want, there is plenty of literature, old to new! Anytime we talk

> > about human experience or what a human experiences or could, we

are

> > talking about astrology. <I was almost going to give an analogy

> here

> > but stop because it would be viewed wrongly is my fear!>.

> >

> > I think this quest for certainty, is not intellect/reasoning

based

> > but very instinctual. Imagine being a caveman, waking up, still

> > aching from last week's hunt -- miles of running to avoid the

> > sabretoothed tiger when all you wanted was to catch that four

feet

> > high rabbit and bring it home to 'community home' aka Cave #666!

> Your

> > people depended on you (yes that emotion and role had surfaced

> > already!) and you would happily die in order to deliver

> expectations!

> > But that gaping hole in your calf where the *^%$$## sabretooth

got

> > its canines gave you a tattoo, for some reasons hurts so much

more

> > this morning than while you were running back to your cave,

praying

> > to lord Flamingo (they called Fire that, back then).

> >

> > It is in the morning, before one goes out, yet again on another

> life-

> > sustaining adventure (foraging -- to be called later on) that the

> > Lord of #666 wished for certainty! And he had this feeling in the

> pit

> > of his stomach that that little stone he was working on that

> brought

> > this red stuff each time he touched the stone carelessly, was the

> > answer. This queer sensation in the pit of his stomach (he did

not

> > know the name of the body part but could only point to it!) which

> for

> > many generations was thought to be just 'bad meat meal' now he

knew

> > was really Lord Flamingo telling him from inside that Lord is

> talking

> > to Lord #666. Why LORD Flamingo? The caveman did not know but we

> > elite moderns know! Stress causes heartburn and acidity!!

> >

> > Then he found astrology, but not that easily! More later if

> moderator

> > permits ...

> >

> > RR

> >

> > RR

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > , "rishi_2000in"

> > <rishi_2000in@> wrote:

> > >

> > > The intellect/ mental part of human beings seeks certainity

> indeed.

> > > The natural arrogance of being born in human race , the part of

> > life

> > > which has bent a large part of nature to suit its convenience,

> its

> > > will always feels that nature can be deciphered fully, if not

> today

> > > then at a future date. This very mode of communication which we

> use

> > > is a simple illustration of human innovation and change.

> > > Yet, nature , more often than not sends strong signals saying

> that

> > > the humans need more effort in their endeavor to understand

> nature.

> > >

> > > Left unsaid, is perhaps, only a conjecture, that deep within

each

> > > human being lies an untapped reservoir of unconscious awareness

> > > which gives some more answers. For that, do the humans need to

> look

> > > beyond what the mind can see; to what the intellect can

absorb ;

> to

> > > probe deeper within to look at what emotions can offer, to look

> > from

> > > that perspective which is there, yet not perceptible, to look

at

> > > what the spirit offers?

> > > Its here that reason and logic merge with faith and belief.

> > > Just rambling on the philosphy of astrology in case, I digress

> from

> > > astrological context of the forum.

> > > regards

> > >

> > > rishi

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > , "crystal pages"

<rrgb@>

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Prafulla,

> > > >

> > > > There is something about 'certainty' that makes the human

> carnate

> > > > soul really get all excited and engaged and bent upon

> justifying

> > > it!

> > > >

> > > > Hence we generally dwell in the past and even Doyens like

Freud

> > > > stayed pinned into the past, partly true, mostly imagined and

> > > created

> > > > edifices of reality around that perception.

> > > >

> > > > When something has already happened or occurred, taken place -

-

> > we

> > > > feel we have no option and that must be the truth,

> > unconditionally!

> > > >

> > > > A story told to me when I was young in astrology and

divination

> > > that

> > > > still shakes me to the core, I wish to share with you today.

> > > >

> > > > One of those wars fought between the west and east --

vietnam,

> > > korea,

> > > > india -- matters not at this emancipated time!

> > > >

> > > > The soldier found love in this foreign land and what is

> expected

> > > out

> > > > of a 21 year old man happened! He got injured badly and got

> > > shipped

> > > > back home where he lived through the hell of one terrible

> > > > rehabilitation, day by day -- and when he could remember her

or

> > > those

> > > > times, pined for same! He was not really capable to think of

> > > anything

> > > > more, given his physical condition and even his psyche that

was

> > > > afflicted if anyone knows how 20 some feel!

> > > >

> > > > Meanwhile, his belle with eastern values and all, bore his

> child

> > > and

> > > > was relegated to a life of being shunned and ridiculed for

> being

> > > one

> > > > of those GI brides or whatever else they were called!

> > > >

> > > > Surely it is all about karma! Who though, gets the brunt of

it?

> > > The

> > > > mother who knows it all and must bear the burden of all these

> > > > perceived rejections, some she knows are not really there but

> she

> > > has

> > > > no clue.

> > > >

> > > > The GI who pines for his love but given his physical state

and

> > > > inability to even sustain a living from day to day in this

> modern

> > > > society that remembers him once a year but pretty much <that

is

> > it!

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Or the *innocent* child? What should S/he feel? What if she

is

> > the

> > > > illegitimate offspring in a puritanical rather rigid society,

> > > > exploited too long to even recover en masse!

> > > >

> > > > Whose karma is going to be the worst when they are born

again,

> as

> > > > they better or where will astrology and its karmic foundation

> > > stand

> > > > upon?

> > > >

> > > > RR

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >  , Prafulla Gang

> > <jyotish@>

> > > > wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Mr Kumar

> > > > >

> > > > > When started learning astrology - I used to consider yoga

> > > heavily

> > > > (as prescribed) and but with the academic progressions, I

> started

> > > > discriminting them (on respective planet's functional role as

> > > defined

> > > > in classics) in my astrological pursuance. In some form or

> other,

> > > I

> > > > could not identify them to give clues for consistent results;

> > > > ofcourse, I never d them for events. Yet, the

keeping

> > > > astrology to simplistic form has always been my genuine

efforts

> > > and

> > > > worked around the tools, which can definitely render

> indications

> > > for

> > > > events. May be the approach deviates from the classics, but

in

> a

> > > way -

> > > >  linking that to current yuga read with the rationale

provided

> by

> > > > classics.

> > > > >

> > > > > Having said that - for an astrology student - concept of

> > > overriding

> > > > principles are always complicated for the fact that - this

> leads

> > > to

> > > > inconsistent interpretations (not for past results - but for

> > > future

> > > > events).

> > > > >

> > > > > I am certainly looking forward to receive your notes on

yoga.

> I

> > > am

> > > > not closed in my mind set for the yogas, yet certainly look

> > > forward

> > > > to fine tune the approach for consistent interpretation tool.

> > > > >

> > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > > >

> > > > > Neither naked asceticism, matted hair, dirt, fasting,

> sleeping

> > > on

> > > > the ground, dust & mud, nor prolonged sitting on one's heels

> can

> > > > purify a man who is not free of doubts.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > gbp_kumar@

> > > > > > Sun, 28 May 2006 22:12:13 -0700 (PDT)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Re: case study - guru / moon gaj kesari

yoga

> > 29/5

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Prafulla,

> > > > > >    I WIL TRY TO PLACE THE PINTS HERE BELOW your lines in

> > > CAPS.

> > > > as fonts

> > > > > > or colors r not supported in JR

> > > > > >  Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> wrote:        Dear Mr

Kumar

> > > > > >  My contention is very simple - can yoga involve the

> planets

> > > > which  are

> > > > > > negative for a native in general interpretation (or

> > classics 

> > > > reference)?

> > > > > > Can yoga contradicts the fundamental of afflictions?

Can 

> > > yoga be

> > > > > > involving weak planets? Perhaps, we to many

yogas

> > > for 

> > > > results,

> > > > > > which might exist for some other fundamental reasons.

> > > > > >    SURE WEAK PLANETS GIVE WEAK YOGAS no denial

> > > > > >    ABOVE ALL GURU inthis womens chart is in own house,

> > > Kendra,

> > > > Moola

> > > > > > Trikona, Hamsa Yoga etc at least tis will give her wealth

> on

> > > its

> > > > own

> > > > > > even if Moons weak aspect reduces it a bit

> > > > > >    a la Gajakesari Yoga.

> > > > > >  If with the aspect / affliction - guru is weak then its

> > > > results  will be

> > > > > > affected proportionately. In my understanding, under

such 

> > > > combinations

> > > > > > yoga cease to exist.

> > > > > >    WEAK DASA, YOGAS  GIVE weak results.

> > > > > >    YOU CAN DRAW SOME CLUES FROM THE WAY LONGEVITY IS

> > ASSESSED

> > > by

> > > > so many

> > > > > > factors yogas.

> > > > > >    QUITE OFT EN  OUR RISHIS HAVE SAID IM IMPLIED WORS

> THAN

> > > SAID

> > > > > > DIRECTLYI am sure if you have gone through

> Uttarakalumrutha,

> > > Phala

> > > > > > deepika, Jatakaparijata all derivations from Parashari it

> is

> > > also

> > > > there.

> > > > > >    and the guidng axim that Desha, Kala parastithi is

> > > important

> > > > without

> > > > > > loosing the spirit of it we need to adapt the Yoga or

Dasa

> > > > RESULTS.

> > > > > >    Yoga works throughout the life; Parashari does not

> define

> > > any

> > > > > > proportionate yoga results (commentators might have). I

> will

> > > love

> > > > to  see

> > > > > > such quote and correct myself, if any. Another logical

> issue

> > > > (Yes,  I am

> > > > > > aware of 5th lord mars with ketu in 8th), if yoga so

> existing

> > > with

> > > > > > strong guru (assuming in your theory - not afflicted),

then

> > > can

> > > > not  this

> > > > > > override any such negative resultants. Afterall, Yoga is

> > > > supposed  to

> > > > > > give uninterrupted results. Dasa in concern was also of

> guru.

> > > > > >    I can only be suggestive in exploring the basis of

yoga

> > > > itself, and

> > > > > > validate the resultants. I might also be wrong, as I am

> > > exploring

> > > > too;

> > > > > > and looking for consistent application of any

configuration.

> > > > > >    I AM SURE I AM SETIGN YOU ON THE RIGHT TRACK I AM NO

> > > > AUTHORITY BUT

> > > > > > HAVE  BEEN TOLD, BY MY GURUS 2 were founder members of 

> > > ICAS,

> > > > my guiding

> > > > > > Guru today +(from past 21 yrs) is a 4 generation

astrologer.

> > > > > >  BTW, no one is guru basher. How can one be; we are only

> > > > discussing  its

> > > > > > relevance in judging few of its karakatve in current yuga.

> > > > > >    THERE R MANY GURU BASHERS in this group Pl read

threads

> > on

> > > it

> > > > so many

> > > > > > u  can find during march-May this yr Guru in 5th, Guru a

> > > malefic

> > > > etc

> > > > > >    THAT WHEREVER GURU IS OR ASPECTS IS RUINED, SATN IS A

> > > BEIFIC

> > > > COMPARED

> > > > > > TO GURU etc some wild assesments even coverign past Yogas

> > > where

> > > > NONE OF

> > > > > > US HAVE ANY BASIS TO ENTER OR INTERPRET.

> > > > > >    I replied to them sayigng what i sumed in last mail

> Guru

> > > > gives slowly

> > > > > > with  honor, rightfully morally but tests u all the

way ,

> but

> > > > > > materialistic Sukra, Rahi give u faster and by wha the

> world

> > > sees

> > > > how

> > > > > > rich u r not how u made it then Guru is a malefic., that

> too

> > > after

> > > > > > Capitailism, consumerism, liberalism, prermisiveness

beyond

> > > sense

> > > > > > through CINEA, TV came in.

> > > > > >    for a value based socity Guru is a benific- u earn

with

> > > > hnonor, may

> > > > > > be  poor but academically rich, well know, comands

respect

> > > but

> > > > at times

> > > > > > no  wealth to flaunt.

> > > > > >    for a valueless, ethicsless, immoral, unscroupulos

one

> it

> > > is a

> > > > > > malefic.

> > > > > >    I WILL EXPLAIN A NEW DIMENSION TO YOGAS IN  post,

will

> > > scan

> > > > a page  of

> > > > > > NN KRISHA Raos works and show some useflw ays to read

yogas.

> > > > > >    regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > > > >  Neither naked asceticism, matted hair, dirt, fasting,

> > > sleeping

> > > > on  the

> > > > > > ground, dust & mud, nor prolonged sitting on one's heels

> > can 

> > > > purify a

> > > > > > man who is not free of doubts.

> > > > > >     

> > > > > >    gbp_kumar@

> > > > > >    Sun, 28 May 2006 10:52:41 -0700 (PDT)

> > > > > >    (AT) (DOT) .com

> > > > > >    Re: case study - guru / moon gaj kesari

> > yoga

> > > > 28/5

> > > > > >      Dear Prafulla,

> > > > > >      I am surprised that the Guru Bashers [Guru is a

> > maleic

> > > > wherever  he

> > > > > > is  or asppects, will be v happy to see this case in

> such 

> > > > light] did

> > > > > > not  jump into the fray I am not one of them

> > > > > >      NOW THE QUESTION WAS DOES GAJAKESARI YOGA OPERATE

> OR

> > > NOT

> > > > > >      AS I CAN READ IT  it is power, status, money, etc

> > > > > >      the other questions are not part of Gajakesari

Yoga

> > > but

> > > > if u want an

> > > > > > answer on it

> > > > > >      3 misscarriage= 5th lord in 8th with malefic

ketu.

> > > surely

> > > > will give

> > > > > > that result who is Neecha too.

> > > > > >      health sani+Sukra does affect health.

> > > > > >      I can write seperately on this if u want

> > > > > >      BUT ALL CLASSICS STATE THE RESULTS ARE

PROPORTIONAL

> > TO

> > > > STRENGTH  OF

> > > > > > THE  YOGAS AND FOR YOGAS THE DASA MUST RUN AND GOCHARA

> and 

> > > > other Balas

> > > > > > must  support it.

> > > > > >      Mixing gaja kesari with poor health, no male

isuses

> > > > defeats the

> > > > > > Yoga itself. it quality i ssurel reduced but not

eliminated.

> > > > > >      Hw about Mahatma Gandhi he had Gajakesari yoga

> > > commended

> > > > respect

> > > > > > and  wealth  never ammased wealth though rather slod

> > > evvery 

> > > > memorablie

> > > > > > and made money for the freedom movement or any relief 

> > > programm

> > > > and many

> > > > > > MALE ISSUES for him Guru is 6th lord in Lagna  in a

enemy

> > > sign,

> > > > with

> > > > > > shandra in Kataka-aslesha.

> > > > > >      we can show that there be come qualitative

> reductuion

> > > due

> > > > to

> > > > > > applying factors, as said dasas, Yogas, gochara etc.

> > > > > >    Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> wrote:        Dear Mr

> > Kumar

> > > > > >           I was expecting this line of  

argument

> > > from

> > > > you (!!). I know,

> > > > > > what mean to say; but can we get  down  to few key

things:

> > > > > >            a.  is the jupiter strong for its

> > > > relationship with moon?

> > > > > >            b.  if the (a) is true  - is

> jupiter 

> > > > poweful enough to render

> > > > > > strong results for - its  occupation, its  ownership,

> > > aspects

> > > > and natural

> > > > > > significations?  and if the results  indicated are not

> > > strong

> > > > enough -

> > > > > > what does it  imply? Jupiter is  afflicted by Moon. How

> do

> > > you

> > > > justify

> > > > > > poor  health, weak education, lack  of male progeny,

weak

> > > > health of

> > > > > > spouse reflected in personal stress  (jupiter is karka

for

> > > > husband  as

> > > > > > well).  If a yoga is so strong -  should not it

> manifest 

> > > in

> > > > full - It

> > > > > > does not !!!.

> > > > > >            c.  yoga is   never  meant  to

be

> > > > partial or overridden; it is

> > > > > > sure  shot  indication for its results. For any yoga to

> > give

> > > > results,

> > > > > > planets  engaged therein - must be positively inclined

for

> > > the 

> > > > native

> > > > > > and must  be strong as well. If jupiter is

afflicted,  

> it

> > > is

> > > > not strong.

> > > > > > and  please quote me from classics, if they  support

yoga

> > > > formation by

> > > > > > weak  planets. The fact remains that -  the lady gone

> > > through 3

> > > > > > abortions  (will strong jupiter let it  happen - if

> > > aspecting

> > > > 5th house

> > > > > > in full  with gaj kesari - and  that too in guru maha

> > > dasha).

> > > > Even with

> > > > > > other  factors, strong  lagnesh should have overruled,

> all

> > > its

> > > > > > overriding  factors; and if  it fails to meet the

> > overriding

> > > > factors -

> > > > > > certainly  implies that  guru is rendered weak in the

> > > > chart..and gaj

> > > > > > keasri yoga is  not  manifesting (strictly in line with

> > > > classics..as I

> > > > > > repeat -    please quote a support from parashari

saying

> > > that

> > > > malefic /

> > > > > > weak  planets are candidate for yoga formation).

> > > > > >            I am putting this example,  not to 

> > > prove

> > > > or score; so please

> > > > > > experiment the above rationale  from research 

> perspective.

> > > and

> > > > under any

> > > > > > circumstances, I will  avoid to drag  astrological

> > > experience

> > > > sharing

> > > > > > into unnecessary  arguments.

> > > > > >            regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > > > >      Talk is cheap, because supply exceeds demand.

> > > > > >     

> > > > > >      gbp_kumar@

> > > > > >      Sun, 28 May 2006 00:36:49 -0700 (PDT)

> > > > > >     

> > > > > >      Re: case study - guru / moon gaj

> kesari

> > > > yoga 28/5

> > > > > >      Prafulla,

> > > > > >        ur own line cut ^ pasted here...has lots of

> luck

> > > and

> > > > fortune...

> > > > > >        this is part oft he Gaa kesari yog

> > > > > >        the other issues not par of it, NO male issue

> or

> > > > issues with

> > > > > > lumanaries etc.

> > > > > >        and as u said in earlier posts that there

will

> be

> > > > several other

> > > > > > factors why not here?

> > > > > >        say even Lagna lord going to dusthana, if

lagna

> > > > lord  itself WAK

> > > > > > does  ANY YOGA have a role, will hav eto modified 

isn't

> it

> > > > that is  one

> > > > > > want  to build a multi storied buildign  on weak soil?

or

> > > an 

> > > > earthquake

> > > > > > prone  zone?

> > > > > >        same here u can do it and add other

safeguards

> if

> > > u

> > > > want to buold

> > > > > > in such place.

> > > > > >      Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> wrote:       

Dear

> > > > Members

> > > > > >      I will be posting few charts and let us

investigate

> > the

> > > > > > influences  of dusthana lord moon's effect on natal

guru 

> > > > (whether  gaj

> > > > > > kesari yoga  is initialized).

> > > > > >        Case of denial of male progeny and constant

> > health

> > > > issues

> > > > > >        Female

> > > > > >        July 9, 1972

> > > > > >        18.45 IST

> > > > > >        Jodhpur - India 26N17, 73E04

> > > > > >        dhanu lagna - lagnesh guru in lagna; 8th lord

> > > moon 

> > > > and 9th lord

> > > > > > sun in  7th; saturn / venus in 6th;  ketu/mars/mercury

in

> > > 8th;

> > > > rahu  in

> > > > > > 2nd house

> > > > > >        Let us not build overriding theories; but

> > > validate 

> > > > the fact that

> > > > > > - if  "shubha" yoga is formed with planets  owning

> dusthana

> > > > houses  or

> > > > > > weak  planets. In my view, there  is no partial yoga;

> > > feeble 

> > > > yoga will

> > > > > > produce  highly  inconsistent results and if at all

it 

> > > can -

> > > > then it can

> > > > > > not   override the inherent weakness / bad  results of

> > > > dusthana lords.

> > > > > >        The lady, I read her chart 7/8 years back -

has

> > > > lots  of luck

> > > > > > and  fortune ..but troubled life (more around 

natural 

> > > > significations

> > > > > > of  jupiter).

> > > > > >        Please note that - this is not chart

reading 

> > > > request; but a

> > > > > > sincere submission to validate the existence of yoga.

> > > > > >        regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > > > >  Prashantkumar G B

> > > > > >    -*- The services of this astrologer are free on

> > > > group

> > > > > > but

> > > > > >   off the group consultations are chargeable by chat,

mail

> or

> > > > phone.

> > > > > >    Please  fix times for this in advance -*-

> > > > > >    09840051861

> > > > > > 

> > > > > >  New Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones

from

> > > your

> > > > PC and

> > > > > > save big.

> > > > > > 

[Guest guest]

RRji,

The concept of trikona is one of the key basis for not only Jyotish

but also for tropical astrology, the Grand Trines.

Why.....I am seeking the reason for this, why the first, fifth,

ninth. Why not the first, second and third for example.

That message of mine was not very well composed.

regards

 

rishi

 

 

, "crystal pages" <rrgb>

wrote:

>

> -Dear Rishi,

>

> For most ordinary individuals like yours truly, sans self-

> realization, sans intuition or any special brilliance of reasoning

or

> intellect, reality can only be visualized and understood via the

> mind, whatever its state is. Truly, it is not an unbiased or un-

> conditioned tool, but what else is there for this poor ant?

>

> I am sure there was a time in the history of healing crafts when

the

> clarity of correlated events and certainty was not there, compared

to

> now, and even now it is not fully clear, completely defined and

thus

> remains 'less than certain'. This is not a comparison between

> medicine and astrology but an analogy to which people can relate

to,

> hence its utilization here.

>

> However, when I described my view of the caveman, it was based on

the

> possibility that Darwin was right! Some question that of course.

But

> if indeed human developed from animals, even the smallest animal

has

> instincts and I do not want to elaborate that too much here as I

am

> going to ruffle some feathers again which activity I have no use

for!

>

> Please think about this for a moment, though! The caveman is not

some

> possible or forgotten page in some unrecorded history! Caveman is

> very much alive within all of us! We just are too scared to reach

in

> and touch base with him/her on a regular basis. We do see him in

all

> glory from time to time, even in the 2dimensional medium of

internet,

> need I remind you? Anyway, you must have read Desmond Morrises

Naked

> Ape and The Human zoo books. The simple fact of there being

remnants

> of old brain regions within our modern brains (scientifically

> documented) and the well-known adage or observation of ontogeny

> repeats phylogeny also come to mind in this respect. If God

created hu

> (man) directly, what would be the point of the unborn, unseen

(until

> recent foetus) to go through all those stages during which it

> resembles earlier stages of evolution of animal kingdom?

>

> I have written about trikons in my writings often and enough and

it

> has been made freely available to all who seek my views and my

> understanding of this fascinating subject. I have no need to

flaunt

> that again and waste bandwidth on this august forum and then be

> blamed and accused of being arrogant in repeated posts which

> hopefully are not caused by some virus ;-)

>

> RR

>

> -- In , "rishi_2000in"

> <rishi_2000in@> wrote:

> >

> > Interesting, isn't it, sir, that when we talk of caveman, we

think

> > from our perspective, not really knowing what conditions were

then

> > but trying to recreate/build them up.

> > Instinct or reason, the fact remains that "certain" events are

> limited

> > and known. We tend to take astrology towards certainity because

we

> > seek patterns and expect them to recur and deliver similar

results.

> > The degree of difficulty in astrology increases because unlike

> > medicine which finds definite physiological, anatomical etc

> patterns

> > in healthy human beings, astrology cannot with certainity

pinpoint

> > any single pattern.

> > We often say that no single yoga or combination or graha can

alone

> > dictate the entire chart but an amalgam of various factors needs

to

> > be weighed, analysed and understood. Fair enough.

> > However, most of the problems in empirical astrological research

> > arise because one cannot even list out those various factors

which

> > will amalgamate in a chart holistically.

> > When you do not know what a healthy chart is, how do you start 

> > curing?

> >

> > And,astrology is not merely applying laid down rules. That is

the

> job

> > of a technician in the astrological field. Sadly, even the

> > technicians do not use the same set of approaches.

> > Couldnot it mere coincidences that many pedictions come true.

> > Let me, a mere student of Jyotish, seek answer and a  logical

one,

> > not because its written in a text book to this very basic

question

> to

> > start with.

> >

> > Why is the trikona ..the Lagna, fifth and the ninth house the

key

> to

> > charts?

> > regards

> > rishi

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > , "crystal pages" <rrgb@>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Before doctors learn about diseases and their cures, I have

been

> > > told, they learn about the healthy body and mind and its

> functions

> > > (ties in nicely with the WHO definition of health!).

> > >

> > > Astrology does not exist in vacuum. It must be learned, and

must

> > > incorporate not just its math and rules but also the living

and

> > > changing reality it was created to describe. If not, you will

end

> > up

> > > with a very dry, egg-head astrologer, kind of like the

physician

> > with

> > > all technology but no bedside manners. If only machines could

> heal!

> > > But do they? I will leave it at that. So, regardless of who is

> > trying

> > > to bully the agenda, all of this is astrology. If rules is all

we

> > > want, there is plenty of literature, old to new! Anytime we

talk

> > > about human experience or what a human experiences or could,

we

> are

> > > talking about astrology. <I was almost going to give an

analogy

> > here

> > > but stop because it would be viewed wrongly is my fear!>.

> > >

> > > I think this quest for certainty, is not intellect/reasoning

> based

> > > but very instinctual. Imagine being a caveman, waking up,

still

> > > aching from last week's hunt -- miles of running to avoid the

> > > sabretoothed tiger when all you wanted was to catch that four

> feet

> > > high rabbit and bring it home to 'community home' aka Cave

#666!

> > Your

> > > people depended on you (yes that emotion and role had surfaced

> > > already!) and you would happily die in order to deliver

> > expectations!

> > > But that gaping hole in your calf where the *^%$$## sabretooth

> got

> > > its canines gave you a tattoo, for some reasons hurts so much

> more

> > > this morning than while you were running back to your cave,

> praying

> > > to lord Flamingo (they called Fire that, back then).

> > >

> > > It is in the morning, before one goes out, yet again on

another

> > life-

> > > sustaining adventure (foraging -- to be called later on) that

the

> > > Lord of #666 wished for certainty! And he had this feeling in

the

> > pit

> > > of his stomach that that little stone he was working on that

> > brought

> > > this red stuff each time he touched the stone carelessly, was

the

> > > answer. This queer sensation in the pit of his stomach (he did

> not

> > > know the name of the body part but could only point to it!)

which

> > for

> > > many generations was thought to be just 'bad meat meal' now he

> knew

> > > was really Lord Flamingo telling him from inside that Lord is

> > talking

> > > to Lord #666. Why LORD Flamingo? The caveman did not know but

we

> > > elite moderns know! Stress causes heartburn and acidity!!

> > >

> > > Then he found astrology, but not that easily! More later if

> > moderator

> > > permits ...

> > >

> > > RR

> > >

> > > RR

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > , "rishi_2000in"

> > > <rishi_2000in@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > The intellect/ mental part of human beings seeks certainity

> > indeed.

> > > > The natural arrogance of being born in human race , the part

of

> > > life

> > > > which has bent a large part of nature to suit its

convenience,

> > its

> > > > will always feels that nature can be deciphered fully, if

not

> > today

> > > > then at a future date. This very mode of communication which

we

> > use

> > > > is a simple illustration of human innovation and change..

> > > > Yet, nature , more often than not sends strong signals

saying

> > that

> > > > the humans need more effort in their endeavor to understand

> > nature.

> > > >

> > > > Left unsaid, is perhaps, only a conjecture, that deep within

> each

> > > > human being lies an untapped reservoir of unconscious

awareness

> > > > which gives some more answers. For that, do the humans need

to

> > look

> > > > beyond what the mind can see; to what the intellect can

> absorb ;

> > to

> > > > probe deeper within to look at what emotions can offer, to

look

> > > from

> > > > that perspective which is there, yet not perceptible, to

look

> at

> > > > what the spirit offers?

> > > > Its here that reason and logic merge with faith and belief.

> > > > Just rambling on the philosphy of astrology in case, I

digress

> > from

> > > > astrological context of the forum.

> > > > regards

> > > >

> > > > rishi

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > , "crystal pages"

> <rrgb@>

> > > > wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Prafulla,

> > > > >

> > > > > There is something about 'certainty' that makes the human

> > carnate

> > > > > soul really get all excited and engaged and bent upon

> > justifying

> > > > it!

> > > > >

> > > > > Hence we generally dwell in the past and even Doyens like

> Freud

> > > > > stayed pinned into the past, partly true, mostly imagined

and

> > > > created

> > > > > edifices of reality around that perception.

> > > > >

> > > > > When something has already happened or occurred, taken

place -

> -

> > > we

> > > > > feel we have no option and that must be the truth,

> > > unconditionally!

> > > > >

> > > > > A story told to me when I was young in astrology and

> divination

> > > > that

> > > > > still shakes me to the core, I wish to share with you

today.

> > > > >

> > > > > One of those wars fought between the west and east --

> vietnam,

> > > > korea,

> > > > > india -- matters not at this emancipated time!

> > > > >

> > > > > The soldier found love in this foreign land and what is

> > expected

> > > > out

> > > > > of a 21 year old man happened! He got injured badly and

got

> > > > shipped

> > > > > back home where he lived through the hell of one terrible

> > > > > rehabilitation, day by day -- and when he could remember

her

> or

> > > > those

> > > > > times, pined for same! He was not really capable to think

of

> > > > anything

> > > > > more, given his physical condition and even his psyche

that

> was

> > > > > afflicted if anyone knows how 20 some feel!

> > > > >

> > > > > Meanwhile, his belle with eastern values and all, bore his

> > child

> > > > and

> > > > > was relegated to a life of being shunned and ridiculed for

> > being

> > > > one

> > > > > of those GI brides or whatever else they were called!

> > > > >

> > > > > Surely it is all about karma! Who though, gets the brunt

of

> it?

> > > > The

> > > > > mother who knows it all and must bear the burden of all

these

> > > > > perceived rejections, some she knows are not really there

but

> > she

> > > > has

> > > > > no clue.

> > > > >

> > > > > The GI who pines for his love but given his physical state

> and

> > > > > inability to even sustain a living from day to day in this

> > modern

> > > > > society that remembers him once a year but pretty much

<that

> is

> > > it!

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Or the *innocent* child? What should S/he feel? What if

she

> is

> > > the

> > > > > illegitimate offspring in a puritanical rather rigid

society,

> > > > > exploited too long to even recover en masse!

> > > > >

> > > > > Whose karma is going to be the worst when they are born

> again,

> > as

> > > > > they better or where will astrology and its karmic

foundation

> > > > stand

> > > > > upon?

> > > > >

> > > > > RR

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >  , Prafulla Gang

> > > <jyotish@>

> > > > > wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Mr Kumar

> > > > > >

> > > > > > When started learning astrology - I used to consider

yoga

> > > > heavily

> > > > > (as prescribed) and but with the academic progressions, I

> > started

> > > > > discriminting them (on respective planet's functional role

as

> > > > defined

> > > > > in classics) in my astrological pursuance. In some form or

> > other,

> > > > I

> > > > > could not identify them to give clues for consistent

results;

> > > > > ofcourse, I never d them for events. Yet, the

> keeping

> > > > > astrology to simplistic form has always been my genuine

> efforts

> > > > and

> > > > > worked around the tools, which can definitely render

> > indications

> > > > for

> > > > > events. May be the approach deviates from the classics,

but

> in

> > a

> > > > way -

> > > > >  linking that to current yuga read with the rationale

> provided

> > by

> > > > > classics.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Having said that - for an astrology student - concept of

> > > > overriding

> > > > > principles are always complicated for the fact that - this

> > leads

> > > > to

> > > > > inconsistent interpretations (not for past results - but

for

> > > > future

> > > > > events).

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I am certainly looking forward to receive your notes on

> yoga.

> > I

> > > > am

> > > > > not closed in my mind set for the yogas, yet certainly

look

> > > > forward

> > > > > to fine tune the approach for consistent interpretation

tool.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Neither naked asceticism, matted hair, dirt, fasting,

> > sleeping

> > > > on

> > > > > the ground, dust & mud, nor prolonged sitting on one's

heels

> > can

> > > > > purify a man who is not free of doubts.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > gbp_kumar@

> > > > > > > Sun, 28 May 2006 22:12:13 -0700 (PDT)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Re: case study - guru / moon gaj kesari

> yoga

> > > 29/5

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear Prafulla,

> > > > > > >    I WIL TRY TO PLACE THE PINTS HERE BELOW your lines

in

> > > > CAPS.

> > > > > as fonts

> > > > > > > or colors r not supported in JR

> > > > > > >  Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> wrote:        Dear Mr

> Kumar

> > > > > > >  My contention is very simple - can yoga involve the

> > planets

> > > > > which  are

> > > > > > > negative for a native in general interpretation (or

> > > classics 

> > > > > reference)?

> > > > > > > Can yoga contradicts the fundamental of afflictions?

> Can 

> > > > yoga be

> > > > > > > involving weak planets? Perhaps, we to many

> yogas

> > > > for 

> > > > > results,

> > > > > > > which might exist for some other fundamental reasons.

> > > > > > >    SURE WEAK PLANETS GIVE WEAK YOGAS no denial

> > > > > > >    ABOVE ALL GURU inthis womens chart is in own

house,

> > > > Kendra,

> > > > > Moola

> > > > > > > Trikona, Hamsa Yoga etc at least tis will give her

wealth

> > on

> > > > its

> > > > > own

> > > > > > > even if Moons weak aspect reduces it a bit

> > > > > > >    a la Gajakesari Yoga.

> > > > > > >  If with the aspect / affliction - guru is weak then

its

> > > > > results  will be

> > > > > > > affected proportionately. In my understanding, under

> such 

> > > > > combinations

> > > > > > > yoga cease to exist.

> > > > > > >    WEAK DASA, YOGAS  GIVE weak results.

> > > > > > >    YOU CAN DRAW SOME CLUES FROM THE WAY LONGEVITY IS

> > > ASSESSED

> > > > by

> > > > > so many

> > > > > > > factors yogas.

> > > > > > >    QUITE OFT EN  OUR RISHIS HAVE SAID IM IMPLIED

WORS

> > THAN

> > > > SAID

> > > > > > > DIRECTLYI am sure if you have gone through

> > Uttarakalumrutha,

> > > > Phala

> > > > > > > deepika, Jatakaparijata all derivations from Parashari

it

> > is

> > > > also

> > > > > there.

> > > > > > >    and the guidng axim that Desha, Kala parastithi is

> > > > important

> > > > > without

> > > > > > > loosing the spirit of it we need to adapt the Yoga or

> Dasa

> > > > > RESULTS.

> > > > > > >    Yoga works throughout the life; Parashari does not

> > define

> > > > any

> > > > > > > proportionate yoga results (commentators might have).

I

> > will

> > > > love

> > > > > to  see

> > > > > > > such quote and correct myself, if any. Another logical

> > issue

> > > > > (Yes,  I am

> > > > > > > aware of 5th lord mars with ketu in 8th), if yoga so

> > existing

> > > > with

> > > > > > > strong guru (assuming in your theory - not afflicted),

> then

> > > > can

> > > > > not  this

> > > > > > > override any such negative resultants. Afterall, Yoga

is

> > > > > supposed  to

> > > > > > > give uninterrupted results. Dasa in concern was also

of

> > guru.

> > > > > > >    I can only be suggestive in exploring the basis of

> yoga

> > > > > itself, and

> > > > > > > validate the resultants. I might also be wrong, as I

am

> > > > exploring

> > > > > too;

> > > > > > > and looking for consistent application of any

> configuration.

> > > > > > >    I AM SURE I AM SETIGN YOU ON THE RIGHT TRACK I AM

NO

> > > > > AUTHORITY BUT

> > > > > > > HAVE  BEEN TOLD, BY MY GURUS 2 were founder members

of 

> > > > ICAS,

> > > > > my guiding

> > > > > > > Guru today +(from past 21 yrs) is a 4 generation

> astrologer.

> > > > > > >  BTW, no one is guru basher. How can one be; we are

only

> > > > > discussing  its

> > > > > > > relevance in judging few of its karakatve in current

yuga.

> > > > > > >    THERE R MANY GURU BASHERS in this group Pl read

> threads

> > > on

> > > > it

> > > > > so many

> > > > > > > u  can find during march-May this yr Guru in 5th,

Guru a

> > > > malefic

> > > > > etc

> > > > > > >    THAT WHEREVER GURU IS OR ASPECTS IS RUINED, SATN

IS A

> > > > BEIFIC

> > > > > COMPARED

> > > > > > > TO GURU etc some wild assesments even coverign past

Yogas

> > > > where

> > > > > NONE OF

> > > > > > > US HAVE ANY BASIS TO ENTER OR INTERPRET.

> > > > > > >    I replied to them sayigng what i sumed in last

mail

> > Guru

> > > > > gives slowly

> > > > > > > with  honor, rightfully morally but tests u all the

> way ,

> > but

> > > > > > > materialistic Sukra, Rahi give u faster and by wha the

> > world

> > > > sees

> > > > > how

> > > > > > > rich u r not how u made it then Guru is a malefic.,

that

> > too

> > > > after

> > > > > > > Capitailism, consumerism, liberalism, prermisiveness

> beyond

> > > > sense

> > > > > > > through CINEA, TV came in.

> > > > > > >    for a value based socity Guru is a benific- u earn

> with

> > > > > hnonor, may

> > > > > > > be  poor but academically rich, well know, comands

> respect

> > > > but

> > > > > at times

> > > > > > > no  wealth to flaunt.

> > > > > > >    for a valueless, ethicsless, immoral, unscroupulos

> one

> > it

> > > > is a

> > > > > > > malefic.

> > > > > > >    I WILL EXPLAIN A NEW DIMENSION TO YOGAS IN  post,

> will

> > > > scan

> > > > > a page  of

> > > > > > > NN KRISHA Raos works and show some useflw ays to read

> yogas.

> > > > > > >    regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > > > > >  Neither naked asceticism, matted hair, dirt, fasting,

> > > > sleeping

> > > > > on  the

> > > > > > > ground, dust & mud, nor prolonged sitting on one's

heels

> > > can 

> > > > > purify a

> > > > > > > man who is not free of doubts.

> > > > > > >     

> > > > > > >    gbp_kumar@

> > > > > > >    Sun, 28 May 2006 10:52:41 -0700 (PDT)

> > > > > > >   

> > > > > > >    Re: case study - guru / moon gaj

kesari

> > > yoga

> > > > > 28/5

> > > > > > >      Dear Prafulla,

> > > > > > >      I am surprised that the Guru Bashers [Guru is

a

> > > maleic

> > > > > wherever  he

> > > > > > > is  or asppects, will be v happy to see this case in

> > such 

> > > > > light] did

> > > > > > > not  jump into the fray I am not one of them

> > > > > > >      NOW THE QUESTION WAS DOES GAJAKESARI YOGA

OPERATE

> > OR

> > > > NOT

> > > > > > >      AS I CAN READ IT  it is power, status, money,

etc

> > > > > > >      the other questions are not part of Gajakesari

> Yoga

> > > > but

> > > > > if u want an

> > > > > > > answer on it

> > > > > > >      3 misscarriage= 5th lord in 8th with malefic

> ketu.

> > > > surely

> > > > > will give

> > > > > > > that result who is Neecha too.

> > > > > > >      health sani+Sukra does affect health.

> > > > > > >      I can write seperately on this if u want

> > > > > > >      BUT ALL CLASSICS STATE THE RESULTS ARE

> PROPORTIONAL

> > > TO

> > > > > STRENGTH  OF

> > > > > > > THE  YOGAS AND FOR YOGAS THE DASA MUST RUN AND

GOCHARA

> > and 

> > > > > other Balas

> > > > > > > must  support it.

> > > > > > >      Mixing gaja kesari with poor health, no male

> isuses

> > > > > defeats the

> > > > > > > Yoga itself. it quality i ssurel reduced but not

> eliminated.

> > > > > > >      Hw about Mahatma Gandhi he had Gajakesari yoga

> > > > commended

> > > > > respect

> > > > > > > and  wealth  never ammased wealth though rather slod

> > > > evvery 

> > > > > memorablie

> > > > > > > and made money for the freedom movement or any

relief 

> > > > programm

> > > > > and many

> > > > > > > MALE ISSUES for him Guru is 6th lord in Lagna  in a

> enemy

> > > > sign,

> > > > > with

> > > > > > > shandra in Kataka-aslesha.

> > > > > > >      we can show that there be come qualitative

> > reductuion

> > > > due

> > > > > to

> > > > > > > applying factors, as said dasas, Yogas, gochara etc.

> > > > > > >    Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> wrote:        Dear

Mr

> > > Kumar

> > > > > > >           I was expecting this line of  

> argument

> > > > from

> > > > > you (!!). I know,

> > > > > > > what mean to say; but can we get  down  to few key

> things:

> > > > > > >            a.  is the jupiter strong for its

> > > > > relationship with moon?

> > > > > > >            b.  if the (a) is true  - is

> > jupiter 

> > > > > poweful enough to render

> > > > > > > strong results for - its  occupation, its 

ownership,

> > > > aspects

> > > > > and natural

> > > > > > > significations?  and if the results  indicated are

not

> > > > strong

> > > > > enough -

> > > > > > > what does it  imply? Jupiter is  afflicted by Moon.

How

> > do

> > > > you

> > > > > justify

> > > > > > > poor  health, weak education, lack  of male progeny,

> weak

> > > > > health of

> > > > > > > spouse reflected in personal stress  (jupiter is

karka

> for

> > > > > husband  as

> > > > > > > well).  If a yoga is so strong -  should not it

> > manifest 

> > > > in

> > > > > full - It

> > > > > > > does not !!!.

> > > > > > >            c.  yoga is   never  meant 

to

> be

> > > > > partial or overridden; it is

> > > > > > > sure  shot  indication for its results. For any yoga

to

> > > give

> > > > > results,

> > > > > > > planets  engaged therein - must be positively

inclined

> for

> > > > the 

> > > > > native

> > > > > > > and must  be strong as well. If jupiter is

> afflicted,  

> > it

> > > > is

> > > > > not strong.

> > > > > > > and  please quote me from classics, if they  support

> yoga

> > > > > formation by

> > > > > > > weak  planets. The fact remains that -  the lady

gone

> > > > through 3

> > > > > > > abortions  (will strong jupiter let it  happen - if

> > > > aspecting

> > > > > 5th house

> > > > > > > in full  with gaj kesari - and  that too in guru

maha

> > > > dasha).

> > > > > Even with

> > > > > > > other  factors, strong  lagnesh should have

overruled,

> > all

> > > > its

> > > > > > > overriding  factors; and if  it fails to meet the

> > > overriding

> > > > > factors -

> > > > > > > certainly  implies that  guru is rendered weak in

the

> > > > > chart..and gaj

> > > > > > > keasri yoga is  not  manifesting (strictly in line

with

> > > > > classics..as I

> > > > > > > repeat -    please quote a support from parashari

> saying

> > > > that

> > > > > malefic /

> > > > > > > weak  planets are candidate for yoga formation).

> > > > > > >            I am putting this example,  not

to 

> > > > prove

> > > > > or score; so please

> > > > > > > experiment the above rationale  from research 

> > perspective.

> > > > and

> > > > > under any

> > > > > > > circumstances, I will  avoid to drag  astrological

> > > > experience

> > > > > sharing

> > > > > > > into unnecessary  arguments.

> > > > > > >            regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > > > > >      Talk is cheap, because supply exceeds demand.

> > > > > > >     

> > > > > > >      gbp_kumar@

> > > > > > >      Sun, 28 May 2006 00:36:49 -0700 (PDT)

> > > > > > >     

> > > > > > >      Re: case study - guru / moon gaj

> > kesari

> > > > > yoga 28/5

> > > > > > >      Prafulla,

> > > > > > >        ur own line cut ^ pasted here...has lots

of

> > luck

> > > > and

> > > > > fortune...

> > > > > > >        this is part oft he Gaa kesari yog

> > > > > > >        the other issues not par of it, NO male

issue

> > or

> > > > > issues with

> > > > > > > lumanaries etc.

> > > > > > >        and as u said in earlier posts that there

> will

> > be

> > > > > several other

> > > > > > > factors why not here?

> > > > > > >        say even Lagna lord going to dusthana, if

> lagna

> > > > > lord  itself WAK

> > > > > > > does  ANY YOGA have a role, will hav eto modified 

> isn't

> > it

> > > > > that is  one

> > > > > > > want  to build a multi storied buildign  on weak

soil?

> or

> > > > an 

> > > > > earthquake

> > > > > > > prone  zone?

> > > > > > >        same here u can do it and add other

> safeguards

> > if

> > > > u

> > > > > want to buold

> > > > > > > in such place.

> > > > > > >      Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> wrote:       

> Dear

> > > > > Members

> > > > > > >      I will be posting few charts and let us

> investigate

> > > the

> > > > > > > influences  of dusthana lord moon's effect on natal

> guru 

> > > > > (whether  gaj

> > > > > > > kesari yoga  is initialized).

> > > > > > >        Case of denial of male progeny and

constant

> > > health

> > > > > issues

> > > > > > >        Female

> > > > > > >        July 9, 1972

> > > > > > >        18.45 IST

> > > > > > >        Jodhpur - India 26N17, 73E04

> > > > > > >        dhanu lagna - lagnesh guru in lagna; 8th

lord

> > > > moon 

> > > > > and 9th lord

> > > > > > > sun in  7th; saturn / venus in 6th; 

ketu/mars/mercury

> in

> > > > 8th;

> > > > > rahu  in

> > > > > > > 2nd house

> > > > > > >        Let us not build overriding theories; but

> > > > validate 

> > > > > the fact that

> > > > > > > - if  "shubha" yoga is formed with planets  owning

> > dusthana

> > > > > houses  or

> > > > > > > weak  planets. In my view, there  is no partial

yoga;

> > > > feeble 

> > > > > yoga will

> > > > > > > produce  highly  inconsistent results and if at all

> it 

> > > > can -

> > > > > then it can

> > > > > > > not   override the inherent weakness / bad  results

of

> > > > > dusthana lords.

> > > > > > >        The lady, I read her chart 7/8 years back -

> has

> > > > > lots  of luck

> > > > > > > and  fortune ..but troubled life (more around 

> natural 

> > > > > significations

> > > > > > > of  jupiter).

> > > > > > >        Please note that - this is not chart

> reading 

> > > > > request; but a

> > > > > > > sincere submission to validate the existence of yoga.

> > > > > > >        regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > > > > >  Prashantkumar G B

> > > > > > >    -*- The services of this astrologer are free on

> > > > > group

> > > > > > > but

> > > > > > >   off the group consultations are chargeable by chat,

> mail

> > or

> > > > > phone.

> > > > > > >    Please  fix times for this in advance -*-

> > > > > > >    09840051861

> > > > > > > 

> > > > > > >  New Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones

> from

> > > > your

> > > > > PC and

> > > > > > > save big.

> > > > > > > 

[Guest guest]

Trikonas are not just the 1st 5th and 7th but there are other

triikons too, clusters of houses that reveal other aspects. I recall

having written about that!

 

, "rishi_2000in"

<rishi_2000in> wrote:

>

> RRji,

> The concept of trikona is one of the key basis for not only Jyotish

> but also for tropical astrology, the Grand Trines.

> Why.....I am seeking the reason for this, why the first, fifth,

> ninth. Why not the first, second and third for example.

> That message of mine was not very well composed.

> regards

>

> rishi

>

>

> , "crystal pages" <rrgb@>

> wrote:

> >

> > -Dear Rishi,

> >

> > For most ordinary individuals like yours truly, sans self-

> > realization, sans intuition or any special brilliance of

reasoning

> or

> > intellect, reality can only be visualized and understood via the

> > mind, whatever its state is. Truly, it is not an unbiased or un-

> > conditioned tool, but what else is there for this poor ant?

> >

> > I am sure there was a time in the history of healing crafts when

> the

> > clarity of correlated events and certainty was not there,

compared

> to

> > now, and even now it is not fully clear, completely defined and

> thus

> > remains 'less than certain'. This is not a comparison between

> > medicine and astrology but an analogy to which people can relate

> to,

> > hence its utilization here.

> >

> > However, when I described my view of the caveman, it was based on

> the

> > possibility that Darwin was right! Some question that of course.

> But

> > if indeed human developed from animals, even the smallest animal

> has

> > instincts and I do not want to elaborate that too much here as I

> am

> > going to ruffle some feathers again which activity I have no use

> for!

> >

> > Please think about this for a moment, though! The caveman is not

> some

> > possible or forgotten page in some unrecorded history! Caveman is

> > very much alive within all of us! We just are too scared to reach

> in

> > and touch base with him/her on a regular basis. We do see him in

> all

> > glory from time to time, even in the 2dimensional medium of

> internet,

> > need I remind you? Anyway, you must have read Desmond Morrises

> Naked

> > Ape and The Human zoo books. The simple fact of there being

> remnants

> > of old brain regions within our modern brains (scientifically

> > documented) and the well-known adage or observation of ontogeny

> > repeats phylogeny also come to mind in this respect. If God

> created hu

> > (man) directly, what would be the point of the unborn, unseen

> (until

> > recent foetus) to go through all those stages during which it

> > resembles earlier stages of evolution of animal kingdom?

> >

> > I have written about trikons in my writings often and enough and

> it

> > has been made freely available to all who seek my views and my

> > understanding of this fascinating subject. I have no need to

> flaunt

> > that again and waste bandwidth on this august forum and then be

> > blamed and accused of being arrogant in repeated posts which

> > hopefully are not caused by some virus ;-)

> >

> > RR

> >

> > -- In , "rishi_2000in"

> > <rishi_2000in@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Interesting, isn't it, sir, that when we talk of caveman, we

> think

> > > from our perspective, not really knowing what conditions were

> then

> > > but trying to recreate/build them up.

> > > Instinct or reason, the fact remains that "certain" events are

> > limited

> > > and known. We tend to take astrology towards certainity because

> we

> > > seek patterns and expect them to recur and deliver similar

> results.

> > > The degree of difficulty in astrology increases because unlike

> > > medicine which finds definite physiological, anatomical etc

> > patterns

> > > in healthy human beings, astrology cannot with certainity

> pinpoint

> > > any single pattern.

> > > We often say that no single yoga or combination or graha can

> alone

> > > dictate the entire chart but an amalgam of various factors

needs

> to

> > > be weighed, analysed and understood. Fair enough.

> > > However, most of the problems in empirical astrological

research

> > > arise because one cannot even list out those various factors

> which

> > > will amalgamate in a chart holistically.

> > > When you do not know what a healthy chart is, how do you start 

> > > curing?

> > >

> > > And,astrology is not merely applying laid down rules. That is

> the

> > job

> > > of a technician in the astrological field. Sadly, even the

> > > technicians do not use the same set of approaches.

> > > Couldnot it mere coincidences that many pedictions come true..

> > > Let me, a mere student of Jyotish, seek answer and a  logical

> one,

> > > not because its written in a text book to this very basic

> question

> > to

> > > start with.

> > >

> > > Why is the trikona ..the Lagna, fifth and the ninth house the

> key

> > to

> > > charts?

> > > regards

> > > rishi

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > , "crystal pages"

<rrgb@>

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Before doctors learn about diseases and their cures, I have

> been

> > > > told, they learn about the healthy body and mind and its

> > functions

> > > > (ties in nicely with the WHO definition of health!).

> > > >

> > > > Astrology does not exist in vacuum. It must be learned, and

> must

> > > > incorporate not just its math and rules but also the living

> and

> > > > changing reality it was created to describe. If not, you will

> end

> > > up

> > > > with a very dry, egg-head astrologer, kind of like the

> physician

> > > with

> > > > all technology but no bedside manners. If only machines could

> > heal!

> > > > But do they? I will leave it at that. So, regardless of who

is

> > > trying

> > > > to bully the agenda, all of this is astrology. If rules is

all

> we

> > > > want, there is plenty of literature, old to new! Anytime we

> talk

> > > > about human experience or what a human experiences or could,

> we

> > are

> > > > talking about astrology. <I was almost going to give an

> analogy

> > > here

> > > > but stop because it would be viewed wrongly is my fear!>.

> > > >

> > > > I think this quest for certainty, is not intellect/reasoning

> > based

> > > > but very instinctual. Imagine being a caveman, waking up,

> still

> > > > aching from last week's hunt -- miles of running to avoid the

> > > > sabretoothed tiger when all you wanted was to catch that four

> > feet

> > > > high rabbit and bring it home to 'community home' aka Cave

> #666!

> > > Your

> > > > people depended on you (yes that emotion and role had

surfaced

> > > > already!) and you would happily die in order to deliver

> > > expectations!

> > > > But that gaping hole in your calf where the *^%$$##

sabretooth

> > got

> > > > its canines gave you a tattoo, for some reasons hurts so much

> > more

> > > > this morning than while you were running back to your cave,

> > praying

> > > > to lord Flamingo (they called Fire that, back then).

> > > >

> > > > It is in the morning, before one goes out, yet again on

> another

> > > life-

> > > > sustaining adventure (foraging -- to be called later on) that

> the

> > > > Lord of #666 wished for certainty! And he had this feeling in

> the

> > > pit

> > > > of his stomach that that little stone he was working on that

> > > brought

> > > > this red stuff each time he touched the stone carelessly, was

> the

> > > > answer. This queer sensation in the pit of his stomach (he

did

> > not

> > > > know the name of the body part but could only point to it!)

> which

> > > for

> > > > many generations was thought to be just 'bad meat meal' now

he

> > knew

> > > > was really Lord Flamingo telling him from inside that Lord is

> > > talking

> > > > to Lord #666. Why LORD Flamingo? The caveman did not know but

> we

> > > > elite moderns know! Stress causes heartburn and acidity!!

> > > >

> > > > Then he found astrology, but not that easily! More later if

> > > moderator

> > > > permits ...

> > > >

> > > > RR

> > > >

> > > > RR

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > , "rishi_2000in"

> > > > <rishi_2000in@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > The intellect/ mental part of human beings seeks certainity

> > > indeed.

> > > > > The natural arrogance of being born in human race , the

part

> of

> > > > life

> > > > > which has bent a large part of nature to suit its

> convenience,

> > > its

> > > > > will always feels that nature can be deciphered fully, if

> not

> > > today

> > > > > then at a future date. This very mode of communication

which

> we

> > > use

> > > > > is a simple illustration of human innovation and change.

> > > > > Yet, nature , more often than not sends strong signals

> saying

> > > that

> > > > > the humans need more effort in their endeavor to understand

> > > nature.

> > > > >

> > > > > Left unsaid, is perhaps, only a conjecture, that deep

within

> > each

> > > > > human being lies an untapped reservoir of unconscious

> awareness

> > > > > which gives some more answers. For that, do the humans need

> to

> > > look

> > > > > beyond what the mind can see; to what the intellect can

> > absorb ;

> > > to

> > > > > probe deeper within to look at what emotions can offer, to

> look

> > > > from

> > > > > that perspective which is there, yet not perceptible, to

> look

> > at

> > > > > what the spirit offers?

> > > > > Its here that reason and logic merge with faith and belief.

> > > > > Just rambling on the philosphy of astrology in case, I

> digress

> > > from

> > > > > astrological context of the forum.

> > > > > regards

> > > > >

> > > > > rishi

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > , "crystal pages"

> > <rrgb@>

> > > > > wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Prafulla,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > There is something about 'certainty' that makes the human

> > > carnate

> > > > > > soul really get all excited and engaged and bent upon

> > > justifying

> > > > > it!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Hence we generally dwell in the past and even Doyens like

> > Freud

> > > > > > stayed pinned into the past, partly true, mostly imagined

> and

> > > > > created

> > > > > > edifices of reality around that perception.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > When something has already happened or occurred, taken

> place -

> > -

> > > > we

> > > > > > feel we have no option and that must be the truth,

> > > > unconditionally!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > A story told to me when I was young in astrology and

> > divination

> > > > > that

> > > > > > still shakes me to the core, I wish to share with you

> today.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > One of those wars fought between the west and east --

> > vietnam,

> > > > > korea,

> > > > > > india -- matters not at this emancipated time!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > The soldier found love in this foreign land and what is

> > > expected

> > > > > out

> > > > > > of a 21 year old man happened! He got injured badly and

> got

> > > > > shipped

> > > > > > back home where he lived through the hell of one terrible

> > > > > > rehabilitation, day by day -- and when he could remember

> her

> > or

> > > > > those

> > > > > > times, pined for same! He was not really capable to think

> of

> > > > > anything

> > > > > > more, given his physical condition and even his psyche

> that

> > was

> > > > > > afflicted if anyone knows how 20 some feel!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Meanwhile, his belle with eastern values and all, bore

his

> > > child

> > > > > and

> > > > > > was relegated to a life of being shunned and ridiculed

for

> > > being

> > > > > one

> > > > > > of those GI brides or whatever else they were called!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Surely it is all about karma! Who though, gets the brunt

> of

> > it?

> > > > > The

> > > > > > mother who knows it all and must bear the burden of all

> these

> > > > > > perceived rejections, some she knows are not really there

> but

> > > she

> > > > > has

> > > > > > no clue.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > The GI who pines for his love but given his physical

state

> > and

> > > > > > inability to even sustain a living from day to day in

this

> > > modern

> > > > > > society that remembers him once a year but pretty much

> <that

> > is

> > > > it!

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Or the *innocent* child? What should S/he feel? What if

> she

> > is

> > > > the

> > > > > > illegitimate offspring in a puritanical rather rigid

> society,

> > > > > > exploited too long to even recover en masse!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Whose karma is going to be the worst when they are born

> > again,

> > > as

> > > > > > they better or where will astrology and its karmic

> foundation

> > > > > stand

> > > > > > upon?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > RR

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >  , Prafulla Gang

> > > > <jyotish@>

> > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear Mr Kumar

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > When started learning astrology - I used to consider

> yoga

> > > > > heavily

> > > > > > (as prescribed) and but with the academic progressions, I

> > > started

> > > > > > discriminting them (on respective planet's functional

role

> as

> > > > > defined

> > > > > > in classics) in my astrological pursuance. In some form

or

> > > other,

> > > > > I

> > > > > > could not identify them to give clues for consistent

> results;

> > > > > > ofcourse, I never d them for events. Yet, the

> > keeping

> > > > > > astrology to simplistic form has always been my genuine

> > efforts

> > > > > and

> > > > > > worked around the tools, which can definitely render

> > > indications

> > > > > for

> > > > > > events. May be the approach deviates from the classics,

> but

> > in

> > > a

> > > > > way -

> > > > > >  linking that to current yuga read with the rationale

> > provided

> > > by

> > > > > > classics.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Having said that - for an astrology student - concept

of

> > > > > overriding

> > > > > > principles are always complicated for the fact that -

this

> > > leads

> > > > > to

> > > > > > inconsistent interpretations (not for past results - but

> for

> > > > > future

> > > > > > events).

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I am certainly looking forward to receive your notes on

> > yoga.

> > > I

> > > > > am

> > > > > > not closed in my mind set for the yogas, yet certainly

> look

> > > > > forward

> > > > > > to fine tune the approach for consistent interpretation

> tool.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Neither naked asceticism, matted hair, dirt, fasting,

> > > sleeping

> > > > > on

> > > > > > the ground, dust & mud, nor prolonged sitting on one's

> heels

> > > can

> > > > > > purify a man who is not free of doubts.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > gbp_kumar@

> > > > > > > > Sun, 28 May 2006 22:12:13 -0700 (PDT)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Re: case study - guru / moon gaj kesari

> > yoga

> > > > 29/5

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla,

> > > > > > > >    I WIL TRY TO PLACE THE PINTS HERE BELOW your

lines

> in

> > > > > CAPS.

> > > > > > as fonts

> > > > > > > > or colors r not supported in JR

> > > > > > > >  Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> wrote:        Dear

Mr

> > Kumar

> > > > > > > >  My contention is very simple - can yoga involve the

> > > planets

> > > > > > which  are

> > > > > > > > negative for a native in general interpretation (or

> > > > classics 

> > > > > > reference)?

> > > > > > > > Can yoga contradicts the fundamental of afflictions?

> > Can 

> > > > > yoga be

> > > > > > > > involving weak planets? Perhaps, we to many

> > yogas

> > > > > for 

> > > > > > results,

> > > > > > > > which might exist for some other fundamental reasons.

> > > > > > > >    SURE WEAK PLANETS GIVE WEAK YOGAS no denial

> > > > > > > >    ABOVE ALL GURU inthis womens chart is in own

> house,

> > > > > Kendra,

> > > > > > Moola

> > > > > > > > Trikona, Hamsa Yoga etc at least tis will give her

> wealth

> > > on

> > > > > its

> > > > > > own

> > > > > > > > even if Moons weak aspect reduces it a bit

> > > > > > > >    a la Gajakesari Yoga.

> > > > > > > >  If with the aspect / affliction - guru is weak then

> its

> > > > > > results  will be

> > > > > > > > affected proportionately. In my understanding, under

> > such 

> > > > > > combinations

> > > > > > > > yoga cease to exist.

> > > > > > > >    WEAK DASA, YOGAS  GIVE weak results.

> > > > > > > >    YOU CAN DRAW SOME CLUES FROM THE WAY LONGEVITY IS

> > > > ASSESSED

> > > > > by

> > > > > > so many

> > > > > > > > factors yogas.

> > > > > > > >    QUITE OFT EN  OUR RISHIS HAVE SAID IM IMPLIED

> WORS

> > > THAN

> > > > > SAID

> > > > > > > > DIRECTLYI am sure if you have gone through

> > > Uttarakalumrutha,

> > > > > Phala

> > > > > > > > deepika, Jatakaparijata all derivations from

Parashari

> it

> > > is

> > > > > also

> > > > > > there.

> > > > > > > >    and the guidng axim that Desha, Kala parastithi

is

> > > > > important

> > > > > > without

> > > > > > > > loosing the spirit of it we need to adapt the Yoga or

> > Dasa

> > > > > > RESULTS.

> > > > > > > >    Yoga works throughout the life; Parashari does

not

> > > define

> > > > > any

> > > > > > > > proportionate yoga results (commentators might have).

> I

> > > will

> > > > > love

> > > > > > to  see

> > > > > > > > such quote and correct myself, if any. Another

logical

> > > issue

> > > > > > (Yes,  I am

> > > > > > > > aware of 5th lord mars with ketu in 8th), if yoga so

> > > existing

> > > > > with

> > > > > > > > strong guru (assuming in your theory - not

afflicted),

> > then

> > > > > can

> > > > > > not  this

> > > > > > > > override any such negative resultants. Afterall, Yoga

> is

> > > > > > supposed  to

> > > > > > > > give uninterrupted results. Dasa in concern was also

> of

> > > guru.

> > > > > > > >    I can only be suggestive in exploring the basis

of

> > yoga

> > > > > > itself, and

> > > > > > > > validate the resultants. I might also be wrong, as I

> am

> > > > > exploring

> > > > > > too;

> > > > > > > > and looking for consistent application of any

> > configuration.

> > > > > > > >    I AM SURE I AM SETIGN YOU ON THE RIGHT TRACK I AM

> NO

> > > > > > AUTHORITY BUT

> > > > > > > > HAVE  BEEN TOLD, BY MY GURUS 2 were founder members

> of 

> > > > > ICAS,

> > > > > > my guiding

> > > > > > > > Guru today +(from past 21 yrs) is a 4 generation

> > astrologer.

> > > > > > > >  BTW, no one is guru basher. How can one be; we are

> only

> > > > > > discussing  its

> > > > > > > > relevance in judging few of its karakatve in current

> yuga.

> > > > > > > >    THERE R MANY GURU BASHERS in this group Pl read

> > threads

> > > > on

> > > > > it

> > > > > > so many

> > > > > > > > u  can find during march-May this yr Guru in 5th,

> Guru a

> > > > > malefic

> > > > > > etc

> > > > > > > >    THAT WHEREVER GURU IS OR ASPECTS IS RUINED, SATN

> IS A

> > > > > BEIFIC

> > > > > > COMPARED

> > > > > > > > TO GURU etc some wild assesments even coverign past

> Yogas

> > > > > where

> > > > > > NONE OF

> > > > > > > > US HAVE ANY BASIS TO ENTER OR INTERPRET.

> > > > > > > >    I replied to them sayigng what i sumed in last

> mail

> > > Guru

> > > > > > gives slowly

> > > > > > > > with  honor, rightfully morally but tests u all the

> > way ,

> > > but

> > > > > > > > materialistic Sukra, Rahi give u faster and by wha

the

> > > world

> > > > > sees

> > > > > > how

> > > > > > > > rich u r not how u made it then Guru is a malefic.,

> that

> > > too

> > > > > after

> > > > > > > > Capitailism, consumerism, liberalism, prermisiveness

> > beyond

> > > > > sense

> > > > > > > > through CINEA, TV came in.

> > > > > > > >    for a value based socity Guru is a benific- u

earn

> > with

> > > > > > hnonor, may

> > > > > > > > be  poor but academically rich, well know, comands

> > respect

> > > > > but

> > > > > > at times

> > > > > > > > no  wealth to flaunt.

> > > > > > > >    for a valueless, ethicsless, immoral,

unscroupulos

> > one

> > > it

> > > > > is a

> > > > > > > > malefic.

> > > > > > > >    I WILL EXPLAIN A NEW DIMENSION TO YOGAS IN 

post,

> > will

> > > > > scan

> > > > > > a page  of

> > > > > > > > NN KRISHA Raos works and show some useflw ays to read

> > yogas.

> > > > > > > >    regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > > > > > >  Neither naked asceticism, matted hair, dirt,

fasting,

> > > > > sleeping

> > > > > > on  the

> > > > > > > > ground, dust & mud, nor prolonged sitting on one's

> heels

> > > > can 

> > > > > > purify a

> > > > > > > > man who is not free of doubts.

> > > > > > > >     

> > > > > > > >    gbp_kumar@

> > > > > > > >    Sun, 28 May 2006 10:52:41 -0700 (PDT)

> > > > > > > >   

> > > > > > > >    Re: case study - guru / moon gaj

> kesari

> > > > yoga

> > > > > > 28/5

> > > > > > > >      Dear Prafulla,

> > > > > > > >      I am surprised that the Guru Bashers [Guru is

> a

> > > > maleic

> > > > > > wherever  he

> > > > > > > > is  or asppects, will be v happy to see this case in

> > > such 

> > > > > > light] did

> > > > > > > > not  jump into the fray I am not one of them

> > > > > > > >      NOW THE QUESTION WAS DOES GAJAKESARI YOGA

> OPERATE

> > > OR

> > > > > NOT

> > > > > > > >      AS I CAN READ IT  it is power, status,

money,

> etc

> > > > > > > >      the other questions are not part of

Gajakesari

> > Yoga

> > > > > but

> > > > > > if u want an

> > > > > > > > answer on it

> > > > > > > >      3 misscarriage= 5th lord in 8th with malefic

> > ketu.

> > > > > surely

> > > > > > will give

> > > > > > > > that result who is Neecha too.

> > > > > > > >      health sani+Sukra does affect health.

> > > > > > > >      I can write seperately on this if u want

> > > > > > > >      BUT ALL CLASSICS STATE THE RESULTS ARE

> > PROPORTIONAL

> > > > TO

> > > > > > STRENGTH  OF

> > > > > > > > THE  YOGAS AND FOR YOGAS THE DASA MUST RUN AND

> GOCHARA

> > > and 

> > > > > > other Balas

> > > > > > > > must  support it.

> > > > > > > >      Mixing gaja kesari with poor health, no male

> > isuses

> > > > > > defeats the

> > > > > > > > Yoga itself. it quality i ssurel reduced but not

> > eliminated.

> > > > > > > >      Hw about Mahatma Gandhi he had Gajakesari

yoga

> > > > > commended

> > > > > > respect

> > > > > > > > and  wealth  never ammased wealth though rather

slod

> > > > > evvery 

> > > > > > memorablie

> > > > > > > > and made money for the freedom movement or any

> relief 

> > > > > programm

> > > > > > and many

> > > > > > > > MALE ISSUES for him Guru is 6th lord in Lagna  in a

> > enemy

> > > > > sign,

> > > > > > with

> > > > > > > > shandra in Kataka-aslesha.

> > > > > > > >      we can show that there be come qualitative

> > > reductuion

> > > > > due

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > applying factors, as said dasas, Yogas, gochara etc.

> > > > > > > >    Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> wrote:       

Dear

> Mr

> > > > Kumar

> > > > > > > >           I was expecting this line of  

> > argument

> > > > > from

> > > > > > you (!!). I know,

> > > > > > > > what mean to say; but can we get  down  to few key

> > things:

> > > > > > > >            a.  is the jupiter strong for

its

> > > > > > relationship with moon?

> > > > > > > >            b.  if the (a) is true  - is

> > > jupiter 

> > > > > > poweful enough to render

> > > > > > > > strong results for - its  occupation, its 

> ownership,

> > > > > aspects

> > > > > > and natural

> > > > > > > > significations?  and if the results  indicated are

> not

> > > > > strong

> > > > > > enough -

> > > > > > > > what does it  imply? Jupiter is  afflicted by Moon.

> How

> > > do

> > > > > you

> > > > > > justify

> > > > > > > > poor  health, weak education, lack  of male

progeny,

> > weak

> > > > > > health of

> > > > > > > > spouse reflected in personal stress  (jupiter is

> karka

> > for

> > > > > > husband  as

> > > > > > > > well).  If a yoga is so strong -  should not it

> > > manifest 

> > > > > in

> > > > > > full - It

> > > > > > > > does not !!!.

> > > > > > > >            c.  yoga is   never  meant 

> to

> > be

> > > > > > partial or overridden; it is

> > > > > > > > sure  shot  indication for its results. For any

yoga

> to

> > > > give

> > > > > > results,

> > > > > > > > planets  engaged therein - must be positively

> inclined

> > for

> > > > > the 

> > > > > > native

> > > > > > > > and must  be strong as well. If jupiter is

> > afflicted,  

> > > it

> > > > > is

> > > > > > not strong.

> > > > > > > > and  please quote me from classics, if they 

support

> > yoga

> > > > > > formation by

> > > > > > > > weak  planets. The fact remains that -  the lady

> gone

> > > > > through 3

> > > > > > > > abortions  (will strong jupiter let it  happen - if

> > > > > aspecting

> > > > > > 5th house

> > > > > > > > in full  with gaj kesari - and  that too in guru

> maha

> > > > > dasha).

> > > > > > Even with

> > > > > > > > other  factors, strong  lagnesh should have

> overruled,

> > > all

> > > > > its

> > > > > > > > overriding  factors; and if  it fails to meet the

> > > > overriding

> > > > > > factors -

> > > > > > > > certainly  implies that  guru is rendered weak in

> the

> > > > > > chart..and gaj

> > > > > > > > keasri yoga is  not  manifesting (strictly in line

> with

> > > > > > classics..as I

> > > > > > > > repeat -    please quote a support from parashari

> > saying

> > > > > that

> > > > > > malefic /

> > > > > > > > weak  planets are candidate for yoga formation).

> > > > > > > >            I am putting this example,  not

> to 

> > > > > prove

> > > > > > or score; so please

> > > > > > > > experiment the above rationale  from research 

> > > perspective.

> > > > > and

> > > > > > under any

> > > > > > > > circumstances, I will  avoid to drag  astrological

> > > > > experience

> > > > > > sharing

> > > > > > > > into unnecessary  arguments.

> > > > > > > >            regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > > > > > >      Talk is cheap, because supply exceeds demand.

> > > > > > > >     

> > > > > > > >      gbp_kumar@

> > > > > > > >      Sun, 28 May 2006 00:36:49 -0700 (PDT)

> > > > > > > >     

> > > > > > > >      Re: case study - guru / moon

gaj

> > > kesari

> > > > > > yoga 28/5

> > > > > > > >      Prafulla,

> > > > > > > >        ur own line cut ^ pasted here...has lots

> of

> > > luck

> > > > > and

> > > > > > fortune...

> > > > > > > >        this is part oft he Gaa kesari yog

> > > > > > > >        the other issues not par of it, NO male

> issue

> > > or

> > > > > > issues with

> > > > > > > > lumanaries etc.

> > > > > > > >        and as u said in earlier posts that there

> > will

> > > be

> > > > > > several other

> > > > > > > > factors why not here?

> > > > > > > >        say even Lagna lord going to dusthana, if

> > lagna

> > > > > > lord  itself WAK

> > > > > > > > does  ANY YOGA have a role, will hav eto modified 

> > isn't

> > > it

> > > > > > that is  one

> > > > > > > > want  to build a multi storied buildign  on weak

> soil?

> > or

> > > > > an 

> > > > > > earthquake

> > > > > > > > prone  zone?

> > > > > > > >        same here u can do it and add other

> > safeguards

> > > if

> > > > > u

> > > > > > want to buold

> > > > > > > > in such place.

> > > > > > > >      Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> wrote:       

> > Dear

> > > > > > Members

> > > > > > > >      I will be posting few charts and let us

> > investigate

> > > > the

> > > > > > > > influences  of dusthana lord moon's effect on natal

> > guru 

> > > > > > (whether  gaj

> > > > > > > > kesari yoga  is initialized).

> > > > > > > >        Case of denial of male progeny and

> constant

> > > > health

> > > > > > issues

> > > > > > > >        Female

> > > > > > > >        July 9, 1972

> > > > > > > >        18.45 IST

> > > > > > > >        Jodhpur - India 26N17, 73E04

> > > > > > > >        dhanu lagna - lagnesh guru in lagna; 8th

> lord

> > > > > moon 

> > > > > > and 9th lord

> > > > > > > > sun in  7th; saturn / venus in 6th; 

> ketu/mars/mercury

> > in

> > > > > 8th;

> > > > > > rahu  in

> > > > > > > > 2nd house

> > > > > > > >        Let us not build overriding theories; but

> > > > > validate 

> > > > > > the fact that

> > > > > > > > - if  "shubha" yoga is formed with planets  owning

> > > dusthana

> > > > > > houses  or

> > > > > > > > weak  planets. In my view, there  is no partial

> yoga;

> > > > > feeble 

> > > > > > yoga will

> > > > > > > > produce  highly  inconsistent results and if at all

> > it 

> > > > > can -

> > > > > > then it can

> > > > > > > > not   override the inherent weakness / bad 

results

> of

> > > > > > dusthana lords.

> > > > > > > >        The lady, I read her chart 7/8 years

back -

> 

> > has

> > > > > > lots  of luck

> > > > > > > > and  fortune ..but troubled life (more around 

> > natural 

> > > > > > significations

> > > > > > > > of  jupiter).

> > > > > > > >        Please note that - this is not chart

> > reading 

> > > > > > request; but a

> > > > > > > > sincere submission to validate the existence of yoga.

> > > > > > > >        regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > > > > > >  Prashantkumar G B

> > > > > > > >    -*- The services of this astrologer are free on

> > > > > > group

> > > > > > > > but

> > > > > > > >   off the group consultations are chargeable by chat,

> > mail

> > > or

> > > > > > phone.

> > > > > > > >    Please  fix times for this in advance -*-

> > > > > > > >    09840051861

> > > > > > > > 

> > > > > > > >  New Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones

> > from

> > > > > your

> > > > > > PC and

> > > > > > > > save big.

> > > > > > > >