Guest guest Posted August 18, 2005 Report Share Posted August 18, 2005 Dear Shri Raman After thinking again i found your mapping as correct. As there are day signs which are not odd -example Scorpio your mapping sounds good. I feel four signs ruled by sun in order becomes day signs and 4 by moon becomes night.Those ruled by Jupiter and Saturn gets reversed.May be because of distance or similar astronomical principles?Kindly share if you know any logic behind -derivation of day and night signs. Your mapping is perfect in the rest of the cases. Now i have difference only regarding bhavas. Thanks Pradeep vedic astrology, "vijayadas_pradeep" <vijayadas_pradeep> wrote: > Dear Shri Raman > > ''I don't see any reason why it should be considered only with Prashna''. > > I have read that some use Hora based on 1st and 11th(though widely > accepted is Parashara) for prashna puropose.I just wanted to cross > check this.But i feel it can be used universally ,as you have said. > > Now the points that i disagree are a)consideration of bhava here and > b)usage of different variations of Hora for ''different'' purposes. > > A) i am avoiding a discussion. > > B)My view is, all the variations should finally point to the same > meaning.Similar to a single ''2nd house'' for multiple purposes,hora > too should be able to answer all,from ''any'' among the > various''variations''. > > For example Parashara has said, first half of an Odd sign belongs to > sun and viceversa.And for wealth,male planets give good results in > Hora of Sun.Thus Prashara Hora is not for complexion alone.Now we know > the whole zodiac is ruled by Sun and Moon(Aagneya and Saumya Rashis). > The same rulership pattern can be found in every sign,in the form of > Hora -like Shiva/Shakthi.Now day/night signs and Sun/Moon Horas ,that > you have presented,is a finer understanding of the broader principle > ,that we have discussed so far.Thus these are not variations but > different lordship patterns meant for the same purpose. > > Now the discrepancy that i find in your presentation is the violation > of Parashara fundamentals,in certain cases.For example first hora of > an Odd sign should ideally have an Odd Sign related to it.This is the > basic principle.If Scorpio is the sign corresponding to first part of > Aries- this condition is not met. > When we reconcile day sign we are violating oddsign and sun rulership. > > ''5th house is not Lakshmistana. I consider the 9th house as > Lakshmisthana''. > > I was having Kendras as Vishnushtanas and Trikonas as Lakshmisthanas > in mind. > > Thanks > Pradeep > > > > vedic astrology, "Raman Suprajarama" > <cru115@n...> wrote: > > Dear Mr. Pradeep, > > > > > > > > I don't see any reason why it should be considered only with > Prashna. Most > > rules applicable for Prashna are also applicable to the natal chart and > > vice-versa. Sarwartha Chintamani and Prasna Marga give general results > > applicable to both Prasna and Natal chart. > > > > > > > > In regard to Aishwarya Rai's chart, I agree with some of your > points. The > > Rasi chart does reveal the financial situation. But by looking at > the Hora > > chart, we are making our job easier. One need not go into deeper > analysis > > for understanding the strengths of the planets, if he were to refer > to the > > Hora chart. Infact, in my talk I told the audience that one can predict > > everything by looking at just the Rasi chart but that needed deeper > > understanding of the subject and considerable intuition. > > > > > > > > The mapping of Ashtalakshmis is based on my understanding of the > classical > > works. Sree Sooktam was also referred to. > > > > > > > > Karaka for ''wealth and bhagya'' jupiter is in a > > > > lakshmisthana and aspects bhagya and lagna > > > > > > > > 5th house is not Lakshmistana. I consider the 9th house as > Lakshmisthana. > > There is however some confusion regarding the place of Lakshmi. > > Uttarakalamrita gives 9th house for Lakshmi. On the other hand > > Lakshmihridayam indicates "Rasatalagate Lakshmi". In my mapping Rasatala > > corresponds to 11th house! > > > > > > > > Om Tat Sat, > > > > > > > > Raman Suprajarama > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [] On > > Behalf Of vijayadas_pradeep > > Wednesday, August 17, 2005 7:39 PM > > > > Re: (Multiple replies) New method /Shri Raman > > > > > > > > Dear shri Raman > > > > > > > > Thanks for your reply.There is an opinion amongst scholars that,the > > > > kind of Hora lordship that you have presented,is used only for > > > > prashna purposes.Prashna considers this for arriving at strengths of > > > > planets in various vargas.No bhava considerations.Kindly check this > > > > with elders of your tradition. > > > > > > > > I was specifically looking for the term ''LAGNA'',as you have quoted > > > > HORA as one half of lagna.This understanding has relevance as,first > > > > varga or division of a sign has many names -Lagna,kshethra,Rashi > > > > etc. > > > > Also,we can find ''LAGNEY DEHASYA VIJNANAM,HORAAYAM > > > > SAMPAADIKAM''etc.Thus it is clear that from lagna - one should think > > > > of deha or physique.Some scholars have interpreted this > > > > as ''physical plane and all'' for their convenience.Such > > > > interpretations are needed when we treat Rashi chakra as the first > > > > varga - which is a deviation from the definition.I am not planning > > > > for a debate regarding consideration of bhavas in vargas.Thus we > > > > will concentrate on the rest.I will compile my understandings on the > > > > above in a more productive and fruitful way during a later period. > > > > > > > > Let us take Aishwarya's Rashichakra(assuming this as correct).At a > > > > first glance,as you have rightly mentioned - one can see indications > > > > of poverty.But i have observed the following points.Kindly > > > > review.All points are based on simple principles. > > > > > > > > Sun is debilitated in 2nd.But Sun has attained STRONG neechabhanga. > > > > a) Its dispositor Venus is in a kendra from chandra as well as lagna > > > > and with digbala.b)The planet that gets exalted in the 2nd,viz.Shani > > > > is also in a kendra from chandra as well as Lagna.c)9th & 2nd lord > > > > Shukra is in a kendra with 11th lord Moon(having digbala).d)Kona > > > > lord joining Rahu in a Kendra -Rajayogakaraka.e)Fourth house is > > > > simhasana.Venus and Moon are > > > > placed there with digbala showing the popularity and > > > > beauty/Arts.Karaka for ''wealth and bhagya'' jupiter is in a > > > > lakshmisthana and aspects bhagya and lagna.Though debilitated Guru > > > > too has attained strong neechabhanga -(its exaltaion lord Moon is in > > > > a kendra from lagna.Dispositor Saturn is in a kendra from lagna as > > > > well as chandra).Thus when multiple neechabhngas occur with > > > > strength,one can attain high status and wealth.Mars in strength, > > > > aspects 3rd house giving the necessary valor -perseverence and > > > > hardwork. > > > > > > > > Your points regarding,Jury and ambassador can be understood from the > > > > rashi chakra through Sun and Jupiter.Good points.Is the mapping of > > > > Ashtalakshmis based on parampara or some classical reference.Thanks > > > > for sharing this.I heard of ''Shree Sooktha Homam'' for propitiating > > > > Lakshmi.As you are from the tradition of Dr.Raman, your valuable > > > > contributions are eagerly expected.I humbly suggest not to fall prey > > > > to blind praise.Fall of many were caused by ''sthuthi pathakas'' - > > > > People who simply praise without thinking.Critically analyse our own > > > > works.Hope you will take my mail in the right sense.Wish you all the > > > > best. > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > , "Raman Suprajarama" > > > > <cru115@n...> wrote: > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am glad that my paper has created considerable interest. The > > > > very fact > > > > > that there was more than 200 downloads within 24 hrs has given me > > > > > considerable satisfaction. Below is my reply to all emails. I use > > > > Raman > > > > > Ayanamsa and there could be some differences in the co-ordinates > > > > to that > > > > > when calculated using Lahiri Ayanamsa. Further, the Ayanamsa I use > > > > takes the > > > > > year of coincidence as 397 (Raman value) but calculations are done > > > > with > > > > > slightly different figures. The value I use deviates by about 6-8 > > > > minutes > > > > > from the value calculated by Jagannatha Hora. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Rath, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The first person to give this out in public was Narasimha Rao and > > > > you have > > > > > done an excellent paper on it as well. However there is some > > > > discrepancy in > > > > > the table given by you. > > > > > > > > > > For example, in tha table you have given for Aries the first hora > > > > which is > > > > > surya hora is ruled by Mars-Scorpio (correct as it is day sign) > > > > but then you > > > > > show Capricorn as the night sign. Kindly clarify. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The variation that I have given differs from other variations of > > > > the Hora > > > > > chart found in Jagannatha Hora Software. I think Narasimha Rao > > > > presented a > > > > > version known as Kashinatha Hora which is found in Jagannatha Hora > > > > Software > > > > > which is quite different to what I have presented. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The idea behind the chart is as follows: > > > > > > > > > > 1) Divide the signs into Day strong Signs and Night strong > > > > Signs > > > > > > > > > > 2) The first half of an odd sign is ruled by the lord of > > > > that sign and > > > > > the planets go to the Day sign of this planet > > > > > > > > > > 3) The second half of an odd sign is ruled by the lord of > > > > the 11th > > > > > from that sign and the planet belongs to the Night sign of this > > > > planet > > > > > > > > > > 4) In an even sign, the first half is ruled by the lord of > > > > that sign > > > > > and the planet belongs to the Night sign of this planet > > > > > > > > > > 5) The second half on the even sign is ruled by the lord of > > > > 11th from > > > > > that sign and belongs to the Day sign of this planet > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is one exception here. For Sun and Moon, there are no > > > > separate day and > > > > > night signs. For Moon, both day and night signs are Cancer and for > > > > Sun, both > > > > > day and night signs are Leo. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In your paper ,i could find a statement from Brihat jataka.Hora is > > > > > > > > > > one half of Lagna.I would be pleased to know your understanding on > > > > > > > > > > the same.After that i may share my understanding > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The second divisional chart is constructed by taking a bhava into > > > > 15 > > > > > degrees. So hora is 15 degrees each of a Sign. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Is the chart of Aishwarya from reliable sources. > > > > > > > > > > If yes,then strong neechbhanga yogas are present in the chart(not > > > > > > > > > > vargas, as i do not understand bhavas there).Neechabhangas in full > > > > > > > > > > can give chakravarti/vartini yogas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is the chart I have in my database. The chart was given to me > > > > by a > > > > > close friend. Details are as follows: > > > > > > > > > > Nov 1, 1973, 4:05 am at Mangalore. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Dutt, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hence, am curious to learn more about the Capricorn/Pisces etc > > > > differential > > > > > positioning of planets falling in the 15-30 degree ambit. Could > > > > you kindly > > > > > identify the relevant portion/sloka in Brihat Jataka from whence > > > > this > > > > > reference has been gleaned. Besides the standard text, I still > > > > have a > > > > > tattered old BJ (Bengali version) with excellent annotations by a > > > > noted > > > > > pundit. Would certainly wish to check notations on this one - > > > > carefully. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't have the text with me currently. You can find the verse in > > > > the first > > > > > chapter itself. The verse runs as "Kechittu horam prathamaam > > > > bapsya.." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will definitely test out this option in the SE Asian private > > > > banking > > > > > community over the next 3-6 months and share the feedback. > > > > > > > > > > Trust you can be reached on the Seshadripuram telephone number. In > > > > early > > > > > Sep, I will try to set-up a mutually convenient fixed time call to > > > > clarify > > > > > some of issues arising from your paper. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I will be happy to receive your feedback. You can contact me at our > > > > > Seshadripuram office or call me on +91-80-56991845. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Gupta > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In the special Hora chart of Dr.B.V.Raman (as per my > > > > > > > > > > understanding of the rule and thumb rules given by > > > > > > > > > > you) the tenancy of Raghu, Ketu and Guru seems to be > > > > > > > > > > respectively at Kumbha, Mithuna and Kanya; where as > > > > > > > > > > you have found them at Kumbha, Kataka and Mesha > > > > > > > > > > respectively? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please go by the logic that I have given above. In Dr. Raman's > > > > chart, Rahu > > > > > is 24 degrees Pisces which corresponds to 2nd half of Pisces. This > > > > maps to > > > > > Day sign of Saturn which is Aquarius. For Ketu, its coordinates > > > > are 24 > > > > > degrees Virgo which corresponds to 2nd half of Virgo. This maps to > > > > Day sign > > > > > of Moon which is Cancer itself. For Jupiter, its coordinates are > > > > 14 degrees > > > > > Scorpio which corresponds to first half of Scorpio. This maps to > > > > Night sign > > > > > of Mars which is Aries. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In the special Hora chart exhibit marked by you for > > > > > > > > > > Dr.N.T.RamaRao, I could see Mars in the 2nd house, Sun > > > > > > > > > > in the 10th house, Raghu in the 11th house and SaturnR > > > > > > > > > > in the 12th house. By the application of your thumb > > > > > > > > > > rules(if taken it for granted you were talking about > > > > > > > > > > natural planetary qualities only) 2nd house Mars and > > > > > > > > > > 11th house Raghu indicates to me 'bad income Leval' > > > > > > > > > > and 'increased savings'.12th house SaturnR indicates > > > > > > > > > > 'increased expenses' disproportionate to his gross and > > > > > > > > > > net worth ,made him a penniless during the fag end of > > > > > > > > > > his life. Please advice as to whether my analytical > > > > > > > > > > understanding is correct or otherwise? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I consider influence of Mercury as 2nd lord to overpower all other > > > > effects. > > > > > Hence, higher financial level. However, as indicated by you, the > > > > Saturn in > > > > > the 12th house did give him financial trouble. At the time of his > > > > death he > > > > > was running Venus Dasa - Saturn Bhukti as per Vimshottari Dasa. > > > > Your > > > > > understanding with regard to Saturn in the 12th house is correct. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Narasimha Rao, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I went thru the table given by you and I think I found one error. > > > > > > > > > > The second half of Sc is mapped to Li. Shouldn't it be Vi? > > > > Probably > > > > > > > > > > it was a typo. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually there are three mistakes. The slide that I presented at > > > > the > > > > > Jayanthi had correct values and those who copied it directly from > > > > my slide > > > > > have the correct values. I can send you the revised table. There > > > > are some > > > > > more points which I did not include in the paper but did talk > > > > about them in > > > > > the lecture. The final edited copy of my speech should be > > > > available by the > > > > > end of the week. There are also plans to upload the speech of > > > > revered > > > > > father. I had promised a few of my esteemed friends that my speech > > > > would be > > > > > made available immediately after the Raman Jayanthi and hence had > > > > to upload > > > > > the rough draft. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I will be very > > > > > > > > > > much interested in knowing the rationale behind your mapping. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I will definitely write about this sometime later. I tried to > > > > understand the > > > > > texts and their meaning and mapped them accordingly. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Vijay, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you very much for this lesson on the hora chart. I would > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > to duplicate some of your charts - is it possible to provide DOB > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > place for all the charts you used in this primer. Also what > > > > ayanamsha > > > > > > > > > > do you use? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have provided the Birth data of Aishwarya Rai. Dr. Raman's birth > > > > details > > > > > are August 8, 1912, Bangalore. For the current chart I have used > > > > the > > > > > rectified time (19.43 hrs). The birth details of the rest cannot > > > > be provided > > > > > due to obvious reasons. I use Raman Ayanamsa. More details can be > > > > found at > > > > > the top of this email. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Narasimha Rao, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I get Ketu in neither sign. I get Ketu in Le and Rahu in Aq. > > > > Please confirm > > > > > if you made a mistake. In fact, the rasi chart you gave shows Ketu > > > > in Virgo. > > > > > The two halves of Vi are mapped to Ge and Le as per your table. I > > > > wonder how > > > > > Ketu can be in Aq or Cn. Obviously, there is a typo. If you used a > > > > software, > > > > > it may have an error. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As indicated earlier, the one uploaded is the rough draft. I can > > > > upload my > > > > > slides which carry the correct data. Ketu maps to Cancer and Rahu > > > > maps to > > > > > Aquarius. In the ascendant, Ketu has been mentioned instead of > > > > Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Warm regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raman Suprajarama > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raman Suprajarama [cru115@n...] > > > > > Tuesday, August 16, 2005 1:30 AM > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > Cc: > > > > > New method for understanding finances > > > > > > > > > > Dear Friends, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I spoke on "Assessing finances through Hora chart" on August 15, > > > > 2005 when > > > > > Raman Jayanthi was observed. This is a new method of casting the > > > > Hora chart. > > > > > The same has been uploaded at our website > > > > (http://www.niranjanbabu.com > > > > > <http://www.niranjanbabu.com/> ). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I request the esteemed readers to kindly send their observations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Tat Sat, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raman Suprajarama > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Links > > > > > > > > / > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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