2-Sabir & all: re..... can one grow out of the limitations of one's chart?

[Guest guest]

Namaskaar Sri Mark and Sri Sabri

 

I am sorry for interrupting your dialogue. I couldn't help commenting

on what Mark has indicated:

> You have indicated;

> "In enlightenment, the deepest blocks to our infinite potential will

> be gone, but still, certain aspects of astrological personality and

> mental characteristics will still be there".

 

This is the state of Jeevan Mukta. The residual instinctual desires

carry the body till it is also cast away. The issue of Ketu is

prominent there, as it is the one which is instinctual. Futher

desires, called as Prarabdha Karma Vasanas (desires emanating from the

reactions to Prarabdha) are not there as there is no identification

with the desire.

 

Ketu is the carrier of our actions by way of instincts. It is likely

that this carries the subtle body bundle by the way of instincts from

death to next life.

 

Other planets may play their role through Ketu in this case, but their

bindings are totally gone.

 

I am not being affirmative, but the above seems very logical to me.

Please do share your researches.

 

Thanks and Regards

Bharat

 

 

 

vedic astrology, "Sabri" <korua@e...> wrote:

> Dear Mark, Hi,

>

> Thanks so much for your beautiful reply and thoughts.

>

> Your unique approach to Jyotish has always been very valuable for me.

>

> In your post, you have raised a very curucial issue, about how

> spiritual methods change people, or, change some aspects and maybe

> do not affect other aspects as much.

>

> You have indicated;

> "In enlightenment, the deepest blocks to our infinite potential will

> be gone, but still, certain aspects of astrological personality and

> mental characteristics will still be there".

>

> On this I will have a question to think about in a few days

> (unfortunately don't have enough time right now).

>

> Many many thanks, very best wishes,

> Sabri.

>

> Jai Guru.

>

>

>

>

>

> vedic astrology, Mark Kincaid

> <m.kincaid@m...> wrote:

> > Dear Mark, Hi,

> >

> > Thanks for the comments, and reminding us of the importance and

> > practical validity of transits once again.

> >

> > Regarding your last point, about "consciousness" what do you think

> > about, or what is your experience re:, "the karmas indicated in the

> > birth chart, transforming through changes in consciousness (or

> > tapas/propitiation for that matter)", e.g. about the theory that

> one

> > grows out of ones chart, through spiritual evolution, karmas being

> > indicated softened so to say?

> >

> >

> > Dear Sabri:

> >

> > I think there is an element of Jyotish, especially Consciousness

> Jyotish,

> > wherever we begin,

> > we really can grow beyond the obvious limitations of our charts.

> >

> > I think for most people their chart's are more fatalistic if they

> never do

> > anything especially Vedic to change their stars.

> >

> > Maharishi's Guru, Swami Brahmananda Sarasati used to say, there

> were a

> > million kinds of births you could take before human births, and

> then after

> > that, without meditation, thousands of life-times. However, with

> > meditation, we can so magnificanently, expand ourselves, that we

> really can

> > grow beyond the obvious limitations of our charts.

> >

> > I know many 'meditators', who report much lessening of the obvious

> lessening

> > of the stresses, of their 'malefics' or charts, since meditating,

> and that's

> > been my experience as well.

> >

> > But, then, add on top of that, the growth and self-development of

> the study

> > of Jyotish, itself, and that, especially in conjunction with

> meditation, is

> > an amazing dual, Vedic remedy!

> >

> >

> > Now, I believe that the malefics in our charts represent, really

> the

> > stresses or blocks in our enlightenment.

> >

> > And, as we go to the transcendental realm, and or, even, learn how

> to get

> > more in-tune with those, so-called malefics, we can think in terms

> of

> > eliminating all stresses!, or malefics.

> >

> > In enlightenment, the deepest blocks to our infinite potential

> will be gone,

> > but still, certain aspects of astrological personality and mental

> > characteristics will still be there.

> >

> > But, from the inside, we'll feel no restriction or limitations.

> >

> > Nice talking with you.

> >

> >

> > Sincerely,

> >

> >

> > Mark Kincaid

> >

> >

> >

> > "Sabri" <korua@e...>

> > vedic astrology

> > Sun, 03 Jul 2005 21:57:48 -0000

> > vedic astrology

> > [vedic astrology] Re: 2-Sabir & all: re..... Who were

> > Maharishis?->>> Mark Kincaid 7/3

> >

> >

> > Dear Mark, Hi,

> >

> > Thanks for the comments, and reminding us of the importance and

> > practical validity of transits once again.

> >

> > Regarding your last point, about "consciousness" what do you think

> > about, or what is your experience re:, "the karmas indicated in the

> > birth chart, transforming through changes in consciousness (or

> > tapas/propitiation for that matter)", e.g. about the theory that

> one

> > grows out of ones chart, through spiritual evolution, karmas being

> > indicated softened so to say?

> >

> > Best wishes,

> >

> > Sabri.

> >

> >

> > vedic astrology, Mark Kincaid

> > <m.kincaid@m...> wrote:

> > > Dear Sabir:

> > >

> > > I very much enjoyed your email re. the Maharishi-Seers!

> > >

> > > I'd like to add a few thoughts.

> > >

> > > Even if the Ved, and books like Maharishi Parashara's book on

> Hora

> > > Astrology, are cognitions,

> > > still,

> > >

> > > if their realities are eternal, and of the very laws of

> nature,...

> > >

> > > then, their truths, and significances, will be there for us, in

> > the present!

> > >

> > > In other words, if something is true, then it will show it's

> > validity, in

> > > the every day reality of people today, and tomorrow and the next!

> > >

> > > This has been my experience of Jyotish.

> > >

> > > All the principles and ideas that I have read about, ultimately I

> > found

> > > alive and functioning, real!

> > > so very real, in the live's of every one that I meet.

> > >

> > > That experience has convinced me of Jyotish's power and insight,

> > into

> > > life....

> > >

> > > Now, after doing literally thousands of charts, over these last

> 18

> > years, I

> > > can say, with amazing conviction, that the principles of Jyotish

> > work! I

> > > have not found one chart, in all these years, that hasn't

> > really, 'fit' the

> > > person, and been testaments of all the rules and principles of

> > Jyotish.

> > >

> > > Also, the transits, of every day, life, out there, in the World's

> > > environment, follows the laws and principles of Jyotish.

> > >

> > > Take the Moon & Saturn for example. Jyotish has these rules

> about

> > > conjunction and aspects.

> > > When you watch the Moon & Saturn collide, or aspect, which

> happens

> > every

> > > month, you can really, 'feel' that!

> > >

> > > Take the Moon/conjunct with Saturn. This month, take July 7 &

> > 8th, the Moon

> > > goes into Cancer,

> > > where SAturn is too. On those days you can 'feel' that definite

> > Saturn

> > > affect upon the Moon, or heart and mind.

> > >

> > > It's unmistakable. Then, over the next few days, the Moon

> slides

> > into Leo,

> > > where Saturn is supposed to 'not' influence the Moon so directly.

> > >

> > > And, that too can be your experience.

> > >

> > > Then, over the next few days, as the Moon goes into Virgo, it's

> > supposed to

> > > be influenced again! by Saturn do to it's supposed, 3rd house

> > aspect.

> > >

> > > But, you can experience that for yourself, objectively, and

> > dispassionately!

> > >

> > > These kinds of experience, verify and validate all the rules and

> > principles

> > > of Jyotish, and make this wisdom truely scienific and modern!

> > >

> > >

> > > Sincerely,

> > >

> > >

> > > Mark Kincaid

> > >

> > >

> > > ps... oh, yes one more point. I find the present, period, where

> > some

> > > 'Mahaishis' in fact, are encouraging all of us to become our own,

> > best

> > > Rishi!, and doing that, also will give an amazing power of

> > consciounsess,

> > > within, so as to better understand our Jyotish.

> > >

> > > Without the development of consciousness, Jyotish will continue

> to

> > be very

> > > vast, and almost,

> > > overwhelming...

> > > but,....

> > > with consciouness, Jyotish becomes simple, though profound, and

> > ultiamtely

> > > easy, natural, and understandable!

> > >

> > > Jai Guru!

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Astrologer

> > > Teacher of Meditation & Ayurved

> > > /

> > > 1 641 472-0000.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > "Sabri" <korua@e...>

> > > vedic astrology

> > > Sun, 03 Jul 2005 13:27:30 -0000

> > > vedic astrology

> > > [vedic astrology] Who were Maharishis?-Student or Guru?

> > (Re: Is

> > > Rafal Genderaz a Student or Guru?)

> > >

> > >

> > > Dear Narasimha-Ji, (Dear Friends),

> > >

> > > Thanking so much for the precious notes,

> > >

> > > - Even Spiritual Gurus have their destiny, and evolve during

> their

> > > lifetime, and are known to experiment, change their advises and

> > > teaching sometimes in a dramatic way.

> > > - In the field of knowledge, traditions are if not an

> > > absolute "must" are very very helpful. "The tradition cuts short

> > the

> > > long path of evolution".

> > > - The very nature of Knowledge is such that, it rises and falls

> in

> > > time to be revised and brought to light again. Knowledge like

> waves

> > > of an ocean come and shatter on the rocks of ignorance and is

> lost,

> > > only to be revived again at some later period of time when a

> > > knowledgable and able person is available for this revival. This

> is

> > > the very nature of knowledge.

> > > - For knowledge to flow from the heart of the Guru to the

> disciple,

> > > the disciple "must" approach the Guru, and warm his heart by

> giving

> > > due respect to the knowledge that the Guru has in posession, at

> > > which time only, the teaching starts and the Guru hands over the

> > > knowledge with great enthusiasm.

> > > - Knowledge is akin to light, since it dispells ignorance and

> > > darkness, sometimes for some, knowledge is bewildering, hence the

> > > doubts and reactions about knowledge itself and those who posess

> > it,

> > > on the part of those who are not *karmically* destined to take

> over

> > > that knowledge.

> > > - A subject as Jyotish is so complex and intricate and proper

> > > knowledge and mastering of it has so many prerequisites, not the

> > > least of which is that one should be evolved enough in the

> > direction

> > > of this specific knowledge.

> > > - The wise student, in my humble view, that I have learned from

> > > learned people, should always show respect first, should not

> judge,

> > > and be open to any new knowledge that may come from any direction

> > or

> > > source.

> > > - The Maharishis as Maharishi Parashara, were themselves coming

> > from

> > > a tradition and were "MAHA" Rishis, meaning, they were the

> > > clairvoyant seers, who would see in their minds eye, and express

> > > that which they have seen, for the benefit of others.

> > > - The book written by Maharishi Parashara is not a text or

> teaching

> > > book in the sense that we understand today! It is the written

> > record

> > > of what has been perceived by the enlightened mind of a Rishi,

> > about

> > > the laws of nature or intricate workings of the Universe

> > > specifically Jyotish. It is not that Maharishi Paraashara has sat

> > > down at one time, and had the intention; "O.K. now let me write a

> > > book to teach Jyotish to others", the book is of a different

> > nature,

> > > a written record of nature, which probably had originally been

> > > passed on through oral tradition. I therefore do not agree with

> the

> > > thought that the books of the Maharishis apply to ancient times

> and

> > > not appliacble today, since the laws of nature then and now are

> the

> > > same.

> > > - The schlokas themselves when read, or memorized have the

> quality

> > > of opening channels in the human brain towards attaining Jyotish

> > > Siddhi.

> > > - Most of us here, lacking this Siddhi, are trying to understand

> > the

> > > subject through intellectual processes, but most probably Sage

> > > Parashara would not think in terms of Guru is in this house, and

> is

> > > yuddhi Shukra etc. He would just see the reality. What is written

> > in

> > > his book is what he has seen about the laws of Jyotish, not about

> > > what he observed and experimented and thought was correct.

> > > - I personally have learnt, compared to my limited knowledge and

> > > experience, huge amounts of knowledge from the SJC Gurus,

> > > specifically through Sanjay and Narasimha-Ji, and therefore am

> > > thankful to them. I have learned also other material from other

> > > sources, for them also I am thankful.

> > >

> > > Best wishes, Sabri.

> > >

> > >

> > > vedic astrology, "Narasimha P.V.R. Rao"

> > > <pvr@c...> wrote:

> > > > Dear friend,

> > > >

> > > > I understand your motivation in asking this and I don't mean

> > > disrespect or insensitivity to anyone.

> > > >

> > > > But I just want to say a word about the more generic question

> of

> > > accepting the words of "Proper Gurus" of SJC as a gospel (I am

> not

> > > saying that you are suggesting that).

> > > >

> > > > I am one of the designated Jyotish Gurus of SJC and one of the

> > > earlier ones. I know for a fact that my knowledge has evolved a

> > long

> > > way from where it was when Sanjay ji decided a few years back

> that

> > I

> > > was fit to be a guru. Even today, I am not fully satisfied with

> my

> > > knowledge and constantly keep learning things and refining my

> > > understanding. I will never make a representation to anyone that

> I

> > > have perfect or nearly perfect knowledge. Still I will share my

> > > knowledge with others because even my half-baked knowledge may

> be a

> > > valuable treasure to somebody.

> > > >

> > > > Even Pt Sanjay Rath, the Parama Guru of SJC, does not have

> > perfect

> > > knowledge. I say this with all the respect and humility that I

> can

> > > possess. He himself said so. There were errors in his teachings

> and

> > > there may be more that we will find in future. I always

> maintained

> > > respect and, at the same time, the spirit of honest intellectual

> > > enquiry. And, there were occasions when my intellectual

> > independence

> > > proved worthwhile. For example, Sanjay and I disagreed on Moola

> > dasa

> > > definition and he later agreed with me. Sanjay taught Drigdasa

> one

> > > way and I had it in JHora that way for a long time. I taught it

> the

> > > same way in my book also. But, sometime back, I discovered that

> his

> > > version was influenced more by Narayana dasa and he had some

> > > discrepancies compared to Parasara's unambiguous verses on

> > Drigdasa.

> > > When I pointed it out, Sanjay ji looked at the verses and some

> > > examples and felt that Parasara was correct and his previous

> > > understanding was wrong.

> > > >

> > > > Thus, I do not take even Sanjay ji's words for granted and

> > > investigate them myself to find the Truth! When Sanjay ji himself

> > is

> > > fallible, how infallible can other Gurus be?

> > > >

> > > > The duty of a sincere student is to have respect for the

> teacher

> > > and study the teachings with the spirit of honest intellectual

> > > enquiry and confront the teacher when one has to disagree. A lot

> of

> > > people confuse between the ideal behavior ascribed to a sishya

> of a

> > > diksha guru (spiritual master) and to a sishya of a siksha guru.

> > > >

> > > > Bottomline: It is good to see that some people have confidence

> in

> > > SJC and SJC gurus. That is nice and I hope that SJC gurus will

> help

> > > you in advancing your knowledge. But, at the same time, it should

> > be

> > > borne in mind that we are dealing with a very rich and

> complicated

> > > subject that has been corrupted for a long time and trying to

> stage

> > > a renaissance. Nobody has a perfect understanding of the

> teachings

> > > of maharshis and we are constantly trying to improve. SJC and SJC

> > > Gurus will definitely make great contributions in the coming

> years,

> > > but we will invariably go thru phases of correction and

> evolution.

> > > Basically, we should realize that we all groping in the dark for

> > the

> > > same Light.

> > > >

> > > > No offense meant to anyone and hope none is taken!

> > > >

> > > > May Jupiter's light shine on us,

> > > > Narasimha

> > > > ------------------------------

> -

> > > > Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro.home.comcast.net

> > > > Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAstrologer.org

> > > > SJC website: http://www.SriJagannath.org

> > > > ------------------------------

> -

> > > >

> > > > > Dear Rafal,

> > > > >

> > > > > Thanks for all your help on this forum. I was just

> > > wondering

> > > > > are you a Student of Astrology or a Proper Guru from the

> > > Jaganath

> > > > > Center? You are helping many members that is why. It is nice

> to

> > > know

> > > > > someone is there to help out. Take Care and Best of Luck!

> > > > >

> > > > > Regards,

> > > > > Nava

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Group info: vedic-

> astrology/info.html

> > >

> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-

> >

> > >

> > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Visit your group "vedic astrology

> > > <vedic astrology> " on the web.

> > >

> > >

> > > vedic astrology

> > > <vedic astrology?

> > subject=Un>

> > >

> > > Terms of

> > Service

> > > <> .

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-

>

> >

> > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Visit your group "vedic astrology

> > <vedic astrology> " on the web.

> >

> >

> > vedic astrology

> > <vedic astrology?

> subject=Un>

> >

> > Terms of

> Service

> > <> .