RE: Jhora 7.02 & definition of Hora

[Guest guest]

Respected Narasimharao,

 

Would you please illustrate the standard definition of Hora (i.e. planetary hour) in Jyotisha.

 

I have come across three different definitions, viz.

 

Definition 1: A hora is 1/24 part of a solar day (sunrise to next sunrise).

 

Definition 2: A hora is consisted of 1 hour (2.5 gatis) from 6:00 am LMT,

irrespective of sunrise and sunset.

 

Definition 3: A hora is 1/12 part of Ahas (sunrise to sunset) during daytime and

1/12 part of Ratri (sunset to sunrise) during night.

 

In Jagannatha Hora 7.02 software, described above definition 1 and 2 are given

under "preferences/Hora & Weekday Options". But definition 3 is not provided,

which is assumed standard by many school of astrology. And most of the

astrological programmes consider (even prefer) definition 3.

 

Although on (or region near) equator, Ahas (length of day) and Ratri (length of

night) remain same i.e. approximately 30 gatis or 12 hours each. But as we

deviate from it, the elongation of day and night changes significantly and so

hora should be. Whereas order of hora lordship is based on decreasing velocity

of planets, i.e. Saturn, Jupiter, Mars, Sun, Venus, Mercury and Moon. And there

is no any controversy over it.

 

Example:

In order to understand the difference b/w hora of definition 1 and 3 take an example.

 

Wednesday June 1, 2005, Karachi (67E03, 24N52)

zone: +05:00 east of GMT.

 

Sunrise: 05:46:18 am

Sunset: 07:13:05 pm

JHora option A: centre of sun's disk is truely on eastern horizon.

Manual Calculation JHora Output in

Panchanga-------------------------------No.

Hora Hora (definition 3) Hora starts (definition 1) Lord dd/mm/yyyy

hh:mm:ss dd/mm/yyyy

hh:mm-------------------------------1 Mer

01/06/2005 05:46:18 01/06/2005 05:462 Mon 01/06/2005 06:54:12

01/06/2005 06:463 Sat 01/06/2005 08:02:07 01/06/2005 07:464 Jup

01/06/2005 09:10:01 01/06/2005 08:465 Mar 01/06/2005 10:17:56

01/06/2005 09:466 Sun 01/06/2005 11:25:50 01/06/2005 10:467 Ven

01/06/2005 12:33:45 01/06/2005 11:468 Mer 01/06/2005 13:41:40

01/06/2005 12:469 Mon 01/06/2005 14:49:34 01/06/2005 13:4610 Sat

01/06/2005 15:57:29 01/06/2005 14:4611 Jup 01/06/2005 17:05:23

01/06/2005 15:4612 Mar 01/06/2005 18:13:18 01/06/2005 16:461 Sun

01/06/2005 19:13:05 01/06/2005 17:462 Ven 01/06/2005 20:05:10

01/06/2005 18:463 Mer 01/06/2005 20:57:15 01/06/2005 19:464 Mon

01/06/2005 21:49:19 01/06/2005 20:465

Sat 01/06/2005 22:41:24 01/06/2005 21:466 Jup 01/06/2005 23:33:29

01/06/2005 22:467 Mar 02/06/2005 00:25:34 01/06/2005 23:468 Sun

02/06/2005 01:17:38 02/06/2005 00:469 Ven 02/06/2005 02:09:43

02/06/2005 01:4610 Mer 02/06/2005 03:01:48 02/06/2005 02:4611 Mon

02/06/2005 03:53:53 02/06/2005 03:4612 Sat 02/06/2005 04:45:58

02/06/2005

04:46-------------------------------

 

Hora (as per definition 1 and 2 of JHora) does not apart from each other but

both (1 & 2) are diverging from Hora (as per definition 3).

 

As we all know that Hora is an important element in predictive astrology

specially in delineating parshan, varshphala, tithi pravesha, solar ingress

into Aries etc.

 

Hence please clarify why definition 1 and 2 (options A & B in JHora) are

considered and definition 3 is neglected. Whether definition 3 is propagated by

Greeks and Tajiks and not ancient Indian savants of Jyotish?

 

Please correct me if I've missed any fact or could not understand the Jagannath Hora 7.0.2 options.

 

I remain,

Sincerely,

 

M.Imran

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sanjay Rath <guruji (AT) srath (DOT) com> wrote:

|om |

Dear Narasimha,

 

Thank you for checking this out inspite of your tight schedule.

Your suggestion is nice but I prefer to continue with my sunrise time of

visibility of tip of sun's disk. You have given fine arguments about clouds,

non-visibility and eclipse to defend your point. Shall surely consider them,

but for the moment I continue with the tip of the sun..i.e. option (3) or ©

below.

 

My reasons are a bit too simplistic - Varähamihira knew more about eclipses,

colors of eclipses and bird cries and what not all and almost all kinds of

winds and cloud formations than any living astrologer today. If after all that

he still advises use of *visibility of tip of sun's disk*, I guess I will

follow this until I can understand better.

 

Like all good Vedic Astrologers we continue to discuss these and other such

topics like KCD so that a solution emerges from a better appreciation of the

knowledge of the seers. Sat Siri ji has given a good article on KCD in this

issue of JD and shall await your critique on that after you get and read the

magazine. Honestly I was expecting more serious astrologers to participate and

give their views and doubts on KCD...lets resolve that and then the ayanamsa

issue first before venturing into sunrise and other definitions.

 

With best wishes and warm regards,

Sanjay Rath

* * *

Sri Jagannath Center®

15B Gangaram Hospital Road

New Delhi 110060, India

http://srath.com, +91-11-25717162

* * *

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Narasimha P.V.R. Rao [pvr (AT) charter (DOT) net] Tuesday, June 21, 2005

8:48 PMSanjay Rath; Youry; vedic astrologyCc:

dieter (AT) astro (DOT) chSubject: Re: Jhora 7.02 vs Swiss Ephemeris

Namaste Youry,

 

As the author of "Jagannatha Hora" software, I want to confirm that Dieter Koch

is right. Swiss Ephemeris is correct and Jagannatha Hora is incorrect here.

Though two softwares (Jagannatha Hora and Parasara's Light) give the same time

with option A and only Swiss Ephemeris differs, it is the latter that is

correct.

 

Jagannatha Hora gives three options for sunrise: (A) true rise of Sun's center,

(B) true rise of Sun's upper tip, and, © apparent rise of Sun's upper tip.

The first two options are fine, but an assumption/simplification made in the

computation of the third option results in an error that is unacceptably large

near the poles. This will be fixed in a future release.

 

However, for astrological purposes such as finding special ascendants, I

strongly suggest using option A and not option C.

 

May Jupiter's light shine on

us,Narasimha-------------------------------Free

Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro.home.comcast.netFree Jyotish software

(Windows): http://www.VedicAstrologer.org

SJC website:

http://www.SriJagannath.org-------------------------------

-

Youry

Sanjay Rath

Cc: Narasimha P.V.R. Rao

Monday, June 20, 2005 10:46 PM

RE: Jhora 7.02 vs Swiss Ephemeris

Dear Sanjay Ji, Thank you very much for your reply. In other Jyotisha and

astrology forums the sunrise question is discussing now as well. I have the

answer from Dieter Koch <dieter (AT) astro (DOT) ch> , who developed the Swiss Ephemeris:

>You have to decide between these two possibilities, because the differences>are

considerable:>5:03:58: "the tip of the Sun's disk appears to be on the eastern

horizon">rsmi = SE_CALC_RISE = 1>5:09:15: "the tip of Sun's disk is truly on

the eastern horizon".>rsmi = SE_CALC_RISE + SE_BIT_NO_REFRACTION = 513>I

suggest 5:03:58, because it is in

agreement with observation ("weatherman").>The calculations from Jagannath Hora

Light you mentioned in your previous>e-mail must be wrong. From the other side,

I study TOB rectification by Tatwa/Antartatwa now, where sunrise is crucial. I

have not bad results with Swiss Ephemeris, but I'm still not sure what is

correct. Sincerely yours, Youry Jai Guru Dev "Sanjay Rath"

<sanjayrath > wrote on 06/20/2005 02:24:18 AM:> > > > |om | >

DearYoury > Thank you for bringing this to my notice. I am sure Narasimha >

will look into this at the earliest possible time and do the > necessary

corrections. In fact I think the difference is due to > asc & refraction which

is about 4min and wonder if this has been> accounted for. Anyway let Narasimha

look into this first. > This can make a very big difference in Pranapada and

special > ascendants like HL etc. > With best wishes and warm regards, >

Sanjay Rath > * * * > Sri Jagannath Center® > 15B Gangaram Hospital Road >

New Delhi 110060, India > http://srath.com, +91-11-25717162 > * * * > >

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mailbox protected from unsolicited email by Spam Alarm from> Dignity Software

http://www.dignitysoftware.com > > > Youry [khmelevsky (AT) acm (DOT) org]

> Sunday, June 19, 2005 11:50 PM > vedic astrology >

Cc: Narasimha P. V. R. Rao; srath (AT) srath (DOT) com; guruji (AT) srath (DOT) com; pushya >

Fw: [vedic astrology] RE: Jhora 7.02 vs Swiss Ephemeris > > Om Hari

Krishna > > Dear Narasimha Ji, Sanjay Ji and Members, > > I'm sorry for the

table format in my previous message. The > corrected table with sunrise data

is below: > > For the Edmonton, Jun 15th, 2005: > Lat :53 N33:00 53.5500 TZ

:07 > Long:113W30:00 -113.5000 DST: 1 > > Options within Swiss Ephemeris

(Swep), JHora 7.02 (JH7.02), and> Parashara's Light 6.0 (PL6): > a. "the tip

of the Sun's disk appears to be on the eastern horizon" > b. "the tip of Sun's

disk is truly on the eastern horizon" > c. "True center of solar disk on the

horizon" > > Swep(1) JH7.02(2) PL6(3) |(1)-(2)| |(1)-(3)| |(2)-(3)| > a.

5:03:58 5:08:19 5:08:18 0:04:21 0:04:20 0:0:01 > b. 5:09:15

5:10:43 N/A 0:01:28 N/A N/A > c. 5:11:38 5:11:38 5:11:46

0:0:0 0:0:08 0:0:08 > > Could you please advise what is the reason

for so big difference> and is it possible to make a correction for the "tip of

the > Sun's disk appears to be on the eastern horizon" and "tip of > Sun's disk

is truly on the eastern horizon" calculations by SwissEphemeris? > > Sincerely

yours and Jai Guru Dev, > > YouryArchives:

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