Guest guest Posted March 22, 2005 Report Share Posted March 22, 2005 Dear Hari Thanks for your Kind mail. Thanks for mentioning Kalachakra. I am infact reading on Kalachakra at the moment.To be honest,after that, I feel more worried about Rashi chakra and progression of time. Also it is not that I am not reading other books. I am stressing more on Shri Narasimhas point (regarding amsha definitions), because of kalachakra. It is not at all a waste of time or getting stuck on a topic. Without understanding the basics we cannot build anything. If one is happy with 10 succesul predictions then one can ignore basics. As others have mentioned, there is a huge time constraint on me. Thus I am unable to devote more time. Kalachakra has to be read carefully and it will take time to understand.It should tell us how or in what order, with the progression of time, rashis of rashi chakra will influence us. In another view it can be a progression of time along rashi chakra. There are no different zodiacs or rashi chakras. It is the various movements of kaala that makes us think of different zodiacs. I was assuming kalachakra as a separate entity. But shri Narasimha while helping me to understand, amsha definitions gave the vital clue. He said sages have never mentioned the amshas but only the lords. But for kalachakra we will find exact navasmshas!!. Does this mean the kalachakra navamshas are universally applicable ?. Vimshottari is a tara dasha while kaalchakra is a rashi dasha.In vimshottari, even if we have been understanding navamshas wrongly(for example libra instead of taurus), our dasha calculations will come correct as vimshottari is based on lords alone and not a specific rashi. Now Kalachakra has nine rashi dasha's corresponding to every pada. Like different routes chosen by people living at different places to reach the same destination - based on padas of savya/apasavya - rashi/time progressions take different routes or orders. Now under all these circumstances, we are finding divisional lords within a sign. For example Hora - Though the full sign is lorded by a planet, the horas within that sign are lorded by sun and moon respectively. Similarly individual signs are again divided and allotted to different planets. Your query regarding rashi being the first divisional : We have to understand it differently. One is the zodiac with 12 signs. Next is the division of each of those signs. In the second case you are dividing individual rashis and in the first case it is an 'imaginary division' of rashi chakra. After defining the Rashi chakra, Sage clearly says ''now I will explain the various divisions of a rashi''. Thus please do not misunderstand the natural sign divisions with divisions of a rashi. Now the first division is the full 30 degree itself and is called Kshethra/Rashi lorded by a planet. Then we again divide that sign into two to get Hora, ruled by sun and moon. Again we divide it into 3 for drekkana lorded by planets falling under 1,5,9 rule. Etc etc. Regarding Guru :I have people in my mind at Gurusthana while I am learning.Now if it is regarding Mantra - I am not ready yet.There is a time for everything and it will come.For example my wife got her Guru(Aatmeeya) and Mantra(whispered on her ears) very early. Thanks Pradeep vedic astrology, "onlyhari" <onlyhari> wrote: > > ||Om Brihaspataye Namah|| > > Dear Pradeep, > > Please address me simply as Hari. No need for Sri or ji. > > I have been following your mails on this topic for quite sometime. > Other persons have acknowledged your questions as *valid*. Yet, this > topic has suddenly become an unceasing quest for you; what happened to > the fine analyses we used to see from you in earlier days? I remember > corresponding with you over some quizzes etc. Now there is only this > unvarying thread from you; is it so important that other facets of > Jyotisa sastra do not deserve a lookin at all? When Sarajit referred > you to Jaimini Upadesa sutras and Deva Keralam, why did you not go > there to take a look and reclarify your position? Instead you have > repeated the same strain again. Have you taken a look at kalachakra > dasa verses by Parasara? The way I see it is that you are stuck at a > particular chapter or topic and refuse to move on; it is not correct > (again my view; you are free to disagree); you should read the whole > book and then other classical references before forming a holistic > view on this topic. For your kind information, cakras are not simply a > drawing tool for visualization/easy depiction. For more on this, you > should consider bowing before Vedavyasa and requesting him to send you > a Guru to guide you in this. I caution you that I am not being > facetious here. > > Let me go back to your theme now: > > If you maintain that divisionals are not to be visualized as charts, > then I must ask you why alone is the rasi to be visualized as a chart? > It is the first division of the 360 degrees zodiac (why 12 signs, why > not 8 or 14?) and therefore very much a divisional as envisaged by you. > > If you say that bhavas are applicable in rasi, I will ask you why > bhavas are not applicable in other divisionals because the rasi is a > divisional just like the others? If you had studied Sarajits quotes > from BPHS regarding sodasavargaadhyayah, you would have noticed that > rasi is listed there first, then hora then drekkana etc. > > best regards > Hari > > vedic astrology, "vijayadas_pradeep" > <vijayadas_pradeep> wrote: > > > > Dear Ms.Sarbani and shri Hari > > > > Drawing is symbolic and for convenience.Otherwise we will not get same > > results,irrespective of the style we have chosen -Bengali,south indian > > or north indian:-).We can either write down the rashis on a piece of > > paper,top to bottom or as a chakra. > > > > Thus when we say a chart we mean application of normal zodiacal > > principles - bhavas,aspects etc. > > > > Thus there are contradictory views regarding amshas.Whether when > > arranged together,they can represent zodiac in order or not.I am > > trying to get my doubts cleared through this exercise. > > > > Thanks > > Pradeep > > > > vedic astrology, "onlyhari" <onlyhari> > wrote: > > > > > > ||Om Brihaspataye Namah|| > > > > > > Dear Sarbani & Vijaydas Pradeep, > > > > > > Lets take it one step further; why draw the rasi chart at all? After > > > all, it is the first divisional chart to be considered and according > > > to the terminology of Sri K.N. Rao, it is D-1. > > > > > > best regards > > > Hari > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Sarbani Sarkar" > > > <sarbani@s...> wrote: > > > > Dear Vijaydas, > > > > > > > > Then why do draw the Navamsha chart? Parasara has not mentioned that > > > either. > > > > He has written about it in the same breath as the other divisions. > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > Sarbani > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep [vijayadas_pradeep] > > > > Sunday, March 20, 2005 8:23 PM > > > > vedic astrology > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Fw: Shodasamsa Narayana dasa /Shri > > > Sarajit > > > > Poddar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear shri Sarajit ji > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your time and space.Unfortunately what you have > > > > written has been discussed umpteen times.Though you have mentioned > > > > divisional ''charts'',neither Prashara nor Kalyan Varma has > mentioned > > > > about any charts.It is clearly written divisions of a ''house or > > > > Rashi'' and its strength. > > > > Houses are part of Rashi chart as they have some significance > based on > > > > the number we use and their physical disposition. > > > > For example when we use the number 3 it can be either 3rd house or > > > > eleventh house and both signify siblings. > > > > One is before lagna (elder ones) and the next is after lagna > (younger > > > > ones).Here these rashis are actually 3rd and thus can be > considered as > > > > houses > > > > Vargas are amshas within any house.one tenth of any sign is a > > dashamsha. > > > > After ascertaining a relevant matter from a horoscope one has to see > > > > the strength of that planet/planets in the corresponding varga. > > > > The sage only expects us to do this and he has clearly explained. > > > > Pls see the quote from your mail - read divisions of houses and > > > > strength of lords,with care. > > > > > > > > "The effects of a horoscope should be predicted according to the > > > > divisions of Houses. > > > > Without knowing the strength of such Lords, one cannot lay even > a step > > > > forward in the direction of astrology." > > > > > > > > Thus dash ''amsha'' of our relevant planets(i said planets as > numerous > > > > planets can have a role for 10th house like owner,aspect,conjunction > > > > karaka etc) from rashi related to 10th house has to be > > > > ascertained.Vaisheshikamshas and Vimshopaka strengths too convey the > > > > same meaning. > > > > > > > > Whether we use the word zooming or aspectual patterns we refer > to the > > > > same but not any houses.I have never said amshas are unimportant. > > > > > > > > When we say physique from lagna and co-borns from drekkana,sage > > > > expects us to evaluate the strength of the concerned planets > from the > > > > respective vargas ,before prediction. > > > > > > > > If we read kalyana varmas shloka from your mail, it is very clear. > > > > > > > > ''However, though the intention is little clearer, how exactly to > > > > apply the principles in the divisional charts is not and he "might" > > > > have expected that the guru imparting the knowledge would > demonstrate > > > > how to apply them''. > > > > > > > > Thus as per your above quote it is clear that the interpretation of > > > > Guru on how to use ,that has brought, in divisional ''charts'' > instead > > > > of Divisions. > > > > > > > > I do not know who is right.But the quotes you have given is not > > > > helpful in clearing doubts as as they are only pointing to > divisons of > > > > houses. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Sarajit Poddar" > > > > <sarajit@s...> wrote: > > > > > || Jaya Jagannath || > > > > > Dear Vijayadas, > > > > > > > > > > You have raised some pertinent questions and answering them > > would help > > > > > others too understanding the topic. > > > > > > > > > > Here are the references of the use of divisional charts: > > > > > > > > > > Let's take BPHS by Maharishi Parashara. > > > > > > > > > > Chapter 6: > > > > > Sloka 2-4: > > > > > Names of the 16 Vargas. Lord Brahma has described 16 kinds of > Vargas > > > > > (Divisions) for each Râúi. Listen to those. The names are Râúi, > > Horâ, > > > > > Dreshkan, Chaturthâñú, Saptâñú, Navâñú, Dashâñú, Dvadashâñú, > > > Shodashâñú, > > > > > Vimshâñú, Chaturvimshâñú, Saptavimshâñú, Trimshâñú, Khavedâñú, > > > > Akshavedâñú > > > > > and Shashtiâñú. > > > > > > > > > > Chapter 7: > > > > > Sloka 1-8: > > > > > The physique from Lagn, wealth from Hora, happiness through > > > co-born from > > > > > Dreshkan, fortunes from Chaturthâñú, sons and grandsons from > > > > Saptâñú, spouse > > > > > from Navâñú, power (and position) from Dashâñú, parents from > > > Dvadashâñú, > > > > > benefits and adversities through conveyances from Shodashâñú, > > > > worship from > > > > > Vimshâñú, learning from Chaturvimshâñú, strength and weakness from > > > > > Saptavimshâñú, evil effects from Trimshâñú, auspicious and > > > inauspicious > > > > > effects from Khavedâñú and all indications from both > Akshavedâñú and > > > > > Shashtiâñú: these are the considerations to be made through the > > > > respective > > > > > Vargas. The Bhava, whose Lord is in a malefic Shashtiâñú, will > > > > diminish; so > > > > > say Garga and others. The Bhava, whose Lord is in a benefic > > > Shodashâñú, > > > > > flourish. This is how the 16 Vargas are to be evaluated. > > > > > > > > > > While one reads BPHS one needs to be very careful in reading what > > > > Maharishi > > > > > Really wanted to convey. You would see that he directly went > to the > > > > > divisional charts after explaining the Grahas, Rasis and the > Special > > > > Lagnas. > > > > > Only after explaining the divisional charts he went on describing > > > > the other > > > > > things such as effects of bhava and judgment of different houses. > > > What > > > > > could be the intention of Maharishi in presenting the subject in > > > > this order? > > > > > Only thing which we can make out is that he wanted us to apply the > > > > > principles he mentioned after explaining the divisional charts to > > > > all the > > > > > divisional charts and not only to the rasi charts. However, to > > make it > > > > > clear, he did say what are the areas that can be seen from the > each > > > > of the > > > > > divisions and hence applying the principles he mentioned for > > > bhavas etc. > > > > > after the divisional charts we can arrive at better results > related > > > > to that > > > > > area. However, though the intention is little clearer, how exactly > > > > to apply > > > > > the principles in the divisional charts is not and he "might" have > > > > expected > > > > > that the guru imparting the knowledge would demonstrate how to > apply > > > > them. > > > > > > > > > > *********************** > > > > > Lets take another great Treatise on the Subject Saravali. > > > > > Saravali went ahead one more step and gave the information on the > > > > divisional > > > > > charts in the 3rd chapter itself on the description of Rasi. To > > > > highlight > > > > > the importance of the Divisions he says in the sloka 12 , where he > > > says > > > > > that: > > > > > > > > > > "The effects of a horoscope should be predicted according to the > > > > divisions > > > > > of Houses. Without knowing the strength of such Lords, one cannot > > > > lay even a > > > > > step forward in the direction of astrology." > > > > > > > > > > Only after explaining about different divisions he went on > > > > explaining more > > > > > characteristics of the rasis such as the directions, the day/ > night > > > > signs, > > > > > strength of signs, their cardinality etc. Now why did he > explain the > > > > > divisions before he explained more about the rasis? Here also > we can > > > > think > > > > > that the explanation need not only be applicable to the rasi > charts > > > > but also > > > > > to the divisional charts. > > > > > > > > > > Hope this clears your doubt. > > > > > > > > > > Moreover as you said the Divisions are not the actual mapping > of the > > > > Zodiac, > > > > > but zooming of one of the sign and mapping it to the Kalapurusha. > > > > This is > > > > > based on the principle that everything in this world follows the > > > > > Kalapurusha, the supreme governor of time. Since this is not the > > > actual > > > > > mapping of the zodiac, the principles applicable to actual zodiac > > > can be > > > > > violated, such as Nodes can be in one signs also such as in D-24 > > > > sign and > > > > > few other. I do not see any problem with that. Moreover if > divisions > > > > are not > > > > > to be used, then why only Navamsa which also falls under this > > > > category is > > > > > given so much of importance. > > > > > > > > > > In addition Maharishi Jaimini in his Upadesha Sutras has given > many > > > > gems on > > > > > Divisional Charts such as Saptamsa, Shastamsa, Trimsamsa, Rudramsa > > > etc. > > > > > which can be studied and seen that the principles are the > similar as > > > > that of > > > > > Rasi chart, however applied to a very specific area. > > > > > > > > > > You can also study Deva keralam which gives many gems on Navamsa > > > usage. > > > > > > > > > > Almost all texts have written on the use of Navamsa chart for > > marriage > > > > > purposes in addition to gauging the strength of planets. > > > > > > > > > > NOTE: Pt. Sanjay Rath might not reply to some of the mails, > since he > > > > is very > > > > > busy in multiple things and we should not interpret this as his > > > silence. > > > > > Thanks for understanding. > > > > > > > > > > Best Wishes > > > > > Sarajit > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep [vijayadas_pradeep] > > > > > Sunday, March 20, 2005 8:27 PM > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > [vedic astrology] Fw: Shodasamsa Narayana dasa /Shri > > > > Sarajit Poddar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Shri Pandit ji,Shri Sarajit and respected members. > > > > > > > > > > Sarajit ji you are a far learned astrolger as compared to me.I > have > > > > > not even gained 20% of the basics. > > > > > Also Chandrashekhar ji to whom i am having great respect is in > > > > > agreement with your view.(his postings in the list has been > > helping me > > > > > to grasp the basics over the years). > > > > > > > > > > With GOD's grace, Chandrashekhar jis analysis and suggestions > for my > > > > > son(he was having some stomach related problems and vomiting) > helped > > > > > in getting the problem cured all of a sudden. > > > > > > > > > > But you have said, what i wanted to say - Understanding.I have not > > > > > understood. > > > > > I have been writing all these mails to get a satisfactory answer > > > > > regarding usage of vargas as charts.I thought any of you would be > > > > > willing to give an explanation. > > > > > Shri Sanjay Rath is silent. > > > > > If you have understood could you kindly say why we can use it as a > > > > > chart when parashara has not sanctioned it and when > > astronomically it > > > > > is impossible? > > > > > Rahu and Ketu can be together in one house !! - Some says in > > vargas it > > > > > is ok.Shri K.N.Raoji once said we have to put ketu seven signs > > > > > back.Thus there are contradictions. > > > > > Also other astronomical impossibilities as explained by many, > > happens > > > > > when we treat vargas as charts. > > > > > If we treat them just as amshas Rahu and ketu can conjunct as > > they may > > > > > be a particular tattwa falling from different signs or > belonging to > > > > > different lords. > > > > > (Shri Narasimha said sage has not given sign tattwas, but only > > > lords!!). > > > > > > > > > > Now regarding proof of pudding - As you know, numerous things are > > > > > explained with the help of just 12 signs and 9 planets. > > > > > I beleive even if i give a wrong chart,an astrologer of your > stature > > > > > will be able to explain any given incident from that chart.Can you > > > > > honestly deny that? Thus we should not get carried away. > > > > > If we want we can explain any incident and convince people and > > > > > ourselves from any chart without shattering basics!!. > > > > > A planet can give good effects when well placed in the concerned > > > > > vargamsha,even if we do not consider houses. > > > > > Also i have seen good varga houses giving poor results and vice > > versa. > > > > > > > > > > Also predictive success alone can never be considered as a > gauge for > > > > > knowledge and confirmation. > > > > > Shri Sanjay Rath may have failed predicting US Elections.Does that > > > > > mean his knowledge is scant?. He might have done many good > > predictions > > > > > at other times. > > > > > Thus prediction depends on different factors and time periods. > > > > > Also if we want to quote scholars why did Late shri Santhanam > > found it > > > > > difficult to understand aspects in vargas?Why Did D.v.Subbu Rao > > had a > > > > > different opinion. > > > > > > > > > > For me, asking the clarification when in doubt is Guru > > Vandya.Agreeing > > > > > to the Guru always ,thinking what he will feel, is more of a Guru > > > > > Ninda for me. > > > > > This is just my perception and it can be wrong.It will be kind > > if you > > > > > or Shri Sanjay Rath ji could explain why/how it can be used as > full > > > > > charts. > > > > > Parashara has not snactioned, hence i will be happy to get the > > > > > astronomical reasoning from the ancestors/parampara. > > > > > Western astrologers say harmonics are never to be considered as > > > > > charts,they just shows the aspectual patterns. > > > > > My humble understanding is also the same- They show the tattwas to > > > > > which a planet or lagna is subjected when we go deep layer by > layer. > > > > > And each layer explains different Koshas for different > > > > > matters.Physical,spiritual etc. > > > > > > > > > > Do you think Rashi chart does not contain all the divisions > > right from > > > > > navamsha until shashtyamsha or the nadiamshas? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar > > > > > <chandrashekhar46> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Sarajit, > > > > > > Very well said. > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > Sarajit Poddar wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Jaya Jagannath || > > > > > > > Dear Panditji, Vijaydas, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As you say that the person using the divisional charts > need to > > > > > > > understand the erection of the chart, the philosophy behind > > > its and > > > > > > > the ways to use it before start using it. However, only > because > > > > > > > someone is unable to understand the usage of some aspects > of a > > > > > > > discipline does not mean that that aspect is incorrect. > > > > Moreover, it > > > > > > > is not at all about sophistication as you have mentioned, > it is > > > > about > > > > > > > the depth of the discipline. It is expected that someone > who is > > > > > new to > > > > > > > a discipline, only learns the fundamentals and basics, however > > > when > > > > > > > one gets used to the fundamentals, gets deeper into the > > > subject and > > > > > > > this is true with all subjects and not Jyotish only. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The statement that Shastras do not have sanction of using the > > > > > > > divisional charts is of no ground. If that's so Maharishi > > > > Parashara, > > > > > > > Maharishi Jaimini, Raja Kalyanverma, Vyankatesha Daivagna and > > > many > > > > > > > authors have not said so many things in days where the > > brevity of > > > > > > > words and space were of utmost importance. Whatever the point > > > > it, the > > > > > > > bottomline is that, the taste of the pudding is in eating... > > > try it > > > > > > > and then see how useful are they. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If were to make appeals to the beginners, then tell them to > > study > > > > > > > authentic sources and understand it properly before using > them. > > > > Isn't > > > > > > > it true even with the interpretation of rasi chart!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best Wishes > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sarajit > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - ----- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ** Panditji [navagraha@g...] > > > > > > > *Sent:* Saturday, March 19, 2005 11:15 AM > > > > > > > *To:* vedic astrology > > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: [vedic astrology] Fw: Shodasamsa Narayana dasa > > > (Re: > > > > > > > Accident schematic) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > namaste, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Someone just sent me this. I am posting it here. The > > gentleman who > > > > > > > posted this is vijaydas_pradeep. I have not asked his > > > permission to > > > > > > > post it here but I thought this is in context with various > > > > divisional > > > > > > > and other techniques we are debating. My apologies to Mr. > > > > pradeep if I > > > > > > > am taking too many liberties here. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > > This mail only address my concerns regarding technical points. > > > > > > > I think we are missing the essence. Techniques that ease our > > > > > > > calculation are a boon. No one disagrees. For that reason > we use > > > > > > > software. But Jyotish is not about technical sophistication. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When we have a door and steps to enter a house why should we > > > use our > > > > > > > acrobatic skills and climb through the sewage pipe, at the > > > building > > > > > > > rear? After knowing the basics (purpose of door and steps) > > one can > > > > > > > try climbing through sewage for a change. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But what is happening. One is not aware of the basics and goes > > > > > > > directly to sewage pipe. Many go directly to dashamsha > whenever > > > > > > > professional matters are to be ascertained, even without > > > knowing how > > > > > > > dashamsha is derived. Many believe dashamsha as a division > > of the > > > > > > > 10th house & Navamsha as a division of the 9th house. I got > > > private > > > > > > > mails. This is certainly a bad trend. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is true that dash ''amsha'' is for professional > matters, but > > > > > > > there is no classical reference sanctioning the usage of > it as a > > > > > > > chart. Moreover astronomically it is impossible. As per Shri > > > > > > > Narasimha sage has not even given the amsha tattwas - just the > > > lords > > > > > > > alone!!! - How can we find AL, 9TH from it,Artha trikonas > etc in > > > > > > > divisionals, when considering it as a chart itself is against > > > > > > > rules?. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If we start stretching our legs before we sit, we will fall. > > > > > > > Unfortunately some techniques are taking one away from basics. > > > If we > > > > > > > have a good foundation, any number of floors can be erected on > > > top. > > > > > > > If our basement is weak, irrespective of how many > techniques we > > > > > > > have, the structures can only collapse. One can keep and > > open mind > > > > > > > and pick the good from all sources. It is not necessary to > > accept > > > > > > > all from one place and leave the rest. I can learn from you > > > and vice > > > > > > > versa may be one of the best approaches. Please see this > in the > > > > > > > right spirit. I respect knowledge from all,but do not accept > > > > > > > anything blindly. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > ----- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 22:04:24 -0500, Panditji <navagraha@g...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > >> Namaste Kartik, > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> Excellent question. Everything is derived from rashi and it > > > > > trumps all > > > > > > >> the charts. I do look at the divisional lagna and planets > in it > > > > > or the > > > > > > >> 1-7 axis of the divisional chart.But I do not go jumping to > > > > > divisional > > > > > > >> and use it as a chart with houses. I can not say > parashara said > > > > > to use > > > > > > >> it as a separate chart. ( I do not want to get into pedantic > > > > argument > > > > > > >> about it, I have not seen evidence that parashar said to use > > > > > > >> divisional as a separate chart) Also the divisional influence > > > is a > > > > > > >> Tertiary influence and NOT the primary one. So divisional 1-7 > > > > axis is > > > > > > >> to be used to look for tertiary facors. If the primary > > > factors are > > > > > > >> adverse, I don't care how strong a divisional chart is it > > is not > > > > > going > > > > > > >> to give great results.Yes if a graha is debilited in > rashi but > > > > > exalted > > > > > > >> in navansh then his strength is improved and it is one of the > > > > > > >> strengths ( not THE strength). > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> Now about twins, every one talks about it in connection with > > > > > > >> divisionals. As for me I treat twins as an exception and do > > > not go > > > > > > >> formulating rules for exceptions, thats a dangerous > habit. I am > > > > happy > > > > > > >> if I can make good predictions in 75 percent of the cases. > > Also I > > > > > have > > > > > > >> seen that navansha lagna if it changes can make facial > features > > > > > > >> different in twins. Anyway people say there are 100s or > > 1000s of > > > > > > >> people born on the same day and time and place. This is a > > > > conjecture, > > > > > > >> go and find hospital records and show me statistical record > > > of how > > > > > > >> many births tooks place at the same place and same time. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> Talking about Parashar. He has given avataars ..he says > Moon is > > > > > > >> Krishna, Sun is Ram..and Budh is Budhha. So is this the > > > > parashar who > > > > > > >> was son of vyas ? He did not say future avataar of budhh, > > so that > > > > > > >> shloka could mean that this was written at a much later > date or > > > > > it was > > > > > > >> added to the original text at a later date.He never mentions > > > about > > > > > > >> kalaki avataar. There is a classic , I forget the name,( Hart > > > Defaw > > > > > > >> mentionsi t).It is written in this classic "When budh is in > > > > quadrant > > > > > > >> from Sun.." Now we know thats anastronomical immpossibility. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> Anyway the point is one has to be careful in deciphering > > what was > > > > > said > > > > > > >> in ancient texts. There are controversies in many areas of > > > > > jyotish and > > > > > > >> in interpretation of classics. My point is to use methods > > > that have > > > > > > >> been tested on many many horoscopes. I will be really > surprised > > > > that > > > > > > >> people have calculated so many divisional charts in the past. > > > > May be > > > > > > >> for well to do who could pay money to have these elaborate > > charts > > > > > made > > > > > > >> precomputer era. For most the charts were done Lagna rashi, > > Moon > > > > > > >> rashi, and navansh( Even this was added only if a client > > > > > insisted). In > > > > > > >> the north or may be south it was customary. it is not so > in the > > > > > > >> western part of India. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> Anyway > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> ... > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> On Sat, 19 Mar 2005 02:22:59 -0000, amoebabhu > <amoebabhu> > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > Dear Panditji, > > > > > > >> > I have a question (and I do not believe in > > > personalized > > > > > > >> > arguements so nothing in what I will say will have any > > personal > > > > > > >> > connotations). If we were to focus on rashi charts and > > not give > > > > > much > > > > > > >> > of consideration to divisionals, then would it not be true > > > that a > > > > > > >> > large number of people (a relative terminology) would end > > > up with > > > > > > >> > the same horoscope and one might be a king and the other a > > > > pauper ( > > > > > > >> > a theoretical comparison).Also what about twins? > > > > > > >> > Regards, > > > > > > >> > Kartik > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > vedic astrology, Panditji > > > <navagraha@g...> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > wrote: > > > > > > >> > > Namaste Narayan, > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > Looks like you are taking sides to defend something that > > > > has not > > > > > > >> > been > > > > > > >> > > attacked. I know what parashara said in BPHS. He > mentioned > > > > about > > > > > > >> > > divisions and if you say it was in vogue since the day of > > > > > parashar > > > > > > >> > you > > > > > > >> > > must be really looooong in tooth. You are talking as > if you > > > > just > > > > > > >> > had a > > > > > > >> > > conversation with him. I stand by my statement that > > > divisional > > > > > > >> > came in > > > > > > >> > > vogue after the advent of computers and now even a novice > > > > > with one > > > > > > >> > day > > > > > > >> > > of training or less can put them up and can write off > pages > > > > about > > > > > > >> > > which planet is where in which varga and from what rashi > > > > dasha he > > > > > > >> > is > > > > > > >> > > in what house. Whether there are houses in divisional > > > > charts is a > > > > > > >> > > debate in itself. I do not know sanjay rath and my > > > > intention was > > > > > > >> > not > > > > > > >> > > to question his teachings or his grand fathers', as I do > > > > not know > > > > > > >> > his > > > > > > >> > > teachings. What I commented is based on what I have > seen a > > > > few on > > > > > > >> > the > > > > > > >> > > list who say they are beginners just go on and on about > > > > > divisionals > > > > > > >> > > and dashas in divisionals as if there was no tomorrow. > > I put > > > > > out my > > > > > > >> > > opinion for others to read, they can make their own > > > judgements > > > > > > >> > about > > > > > > >> > > whatever technique they want to use. If you want to use 5 > > > > > kinds of > > > > > > >> > > dashas and 5 kinds of lagnas to arrive at a correct > > > > > prediction, all > > > > > > >> > > the power to you. I am presenting what I feel is a > approach > > > > that > > > > > > >> > has > > > > > > >> > > worked for me. Let others be judge of those methods. I > > am not > > > > > > >> > forcing > > > > > > >> > > any technique down anyone's throat. I do have an opinion > > > and an > > > > > > >> > > methodology( Which is not invented by me, but has been > > > > taught by > > > > > > >> > great > > > > > > >> > > astrologers like KN RAo, Nandan Chirmulay, BV > > > Raman..etc.), why > > > > > > >> > should > > > > > > >> > > you or anyone feel threatened by it. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > People ask questions on this list and if I have time and > > > > > > >> > inclination I > > > > > > >> > > answer to the best of my ability. While doing so, I > feel I > > > > > have to > > > > > > >> > put > > > > > > >> > > my opinions out there for people on the list to read. I > > > > have not > > > > > > >> > > criticized any astrologer on the list, thats not my > style. > > > > > But if I > > > > > > >> > > have differences of opinion with a methodology I voice my > > > > > opinion. > > > > > > >> > Let > > > > > > >> > > the members of the list decide what they want to use. > Your > > > > > methods > > > > > > >> > may > > > > > > >> > > be good for you, why are you threatened if someone > puts out > > > > there > > > > > > >> > > views on the subject. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > Regards > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > ... > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > On Sat, 19 Mar 2005 01:15:35 -0000, naaraayana_iyer > > > > > > >> > > <narayan.iyer@g...> wrote: > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > Namaste Panditji, > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > Panditji <navagraha@g...> wrote: > > > > > > >> > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > These principles are a work in progress. It would > > > > surprise me > > > > > > >> > if > > > > > > >> > > > > they have been tested on tons of charts. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > As with any field of knowledge, there are always > > > principles, > > > > > > >> > idioms, > > > > > > >> > > > patterns, which will be formed and would be > subjected to > > > > > > >> > testing! On > > > > > > >> > > > what basis did you jump to conclusion that these > > principles > > > > > have > > > > > > >> > not > > > > > > >> > > > been tested adequately?? It could be entirely > > probable that > > > > > > >> > these > > > > > > >> > > > principles are a "work in progress", for that matter no > > > > > > >> > principles > > > > > > >> > > > work 100% and research is required! It could also be > > > entirely > > > > > > >> > > > probable that the chart could need some > > rectification. One > > > > > > >> > should > > > > > > >> > > > have an open mind. For that matter, even your > > > principles are > > > > > > >> > > > subjected to testing and cannot be relied upon! If > > > thats the > > > > > > >> > matter, > > > > > > >> > > > then you would be an "Expert/Rishi" > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > To begin with the divisionals came > > > > > > >> > > > > into vogue after the advent of computer programs > > > which made > > > > > > >> > > > > calculation of them fast. In the precomputer days,by > > > > the time > > > > > > >> > one > > > > > > >> > > > > calculated all these accurately and verified, the > jatak > > > > would > > > > > > >> > have > > > > > > >> > > > > been long gone. So this phenomenon is from the > past few > > > > years > > > > > > >> > and I > > > > > > >> > > > > don't see evidence of its unversal applicability or > > even > > > > > > >> > > > > applicability > > > > > > >> > > > > in 75 percent of the cases. I am sure there will > be one > > > > > or two > > > > > > >> > > > charts > > > > > > >> > > > > where it will fit perfectly. But as they say here > > in the > > > > > great > > > > > > >> > cold > > > > > > >> > > > > north, "One Robin does not make a spring". > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > For your esteemed information, Divisionals were in > vogue > > > > since > > > > > > >> > the > > > > > > >> > > > days of Parasara, infact, right at the start, he > > > defined and > > > > > > >> > gave > > > > > > >> > > > meaninings to all divisionals upto D-60 or Shastiamsa! > > > > Are you > > > > > > >> > > > saying that Maharishis defined it and talked about > it so > > > > > that we > > > > > > >> > can > > > > > > >> > > > pass our idle time or do you think they had nothing > > > better to > > > > > > >> > do??? > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > Even in the past, AStrologers have gone into the > > depths of > > > > > > >> > > > calculation, for example Pt Jagannath Rath, grandfather > > > of Pt > > > > > > >> > Sanjay > > > > > > >> > > > Rath, used to MANUALLY calculate all divisions, and > > ... you > > > > > > >> > would be > > > > > > >> > > > surprised, dasas upto deha level, which is the 6 levels > > > deep! > > > > > > >> > > > Ofcourse, these calculations consume a lot of time, and > > > > hence, > > > > > > >> > they > > > > > > >> > > > would limit themselves to a couple of charts. Most > of the > > > > > times, > > > > > > >> > > > these charts are prepared in advance. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > Ofcourse, there are Astrologers who would restrict > > > > > themselves to > > > > > > >> > > > Rasi & Navamsa and make accurate predictions, and > they do > > > > > rely a > > > > > > >> > lot > > > > > > >> > > > on their intuition. If we restrict ourselves to Rasi & > > > > Navamsa, > > > > > > >> > we > > > > > > >> > > > better hope and pray for good solid intuition! Oh > yes ... > > > > > by the > > > > > > >> > > > way ... even those who restrict themselves to Rasi & > > > Navamsa, > > > > > > >> > > > flexibly twist their principles to suit the results, > > if not > > > > > > >> > lagna, > > > > > > >> > > > then chandra lagna ... so on and so forth! > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > Point is ... serious minded & honest research is > > > required to > > > > > > >> > come up > > > > > > >> > > > with principles and then these should be tested > > > > thoroughly. SJC > > > > > > >> > is > > > > > > >> > > > in the process of doing it ... although there is no > > formal > > > > > > >> > process > > > > > > >> > > > for it. We will be taking this matter seriously in the > > > coming > > > > > > >> > years! > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > Another point, Pt Sanjay Rath doesn't like to spoon > feed > > > > ... he > > > > > > >> > > > likes/expects his student to think thoroughly, to whet > > > their > > > > > > >> > > > intelligence! Nothing comes easy ... Adversity breeds > > > > > CHARACTER! > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > New parameters are introduced to fit the event > which is > > > > > > >> > already > > > > > > >> > > > known. > > > > > > >> > > > > On this list some time back one had an example of > > > father's > > > > > > >> > death. > > > > > > >> > > > For > > > > > > >> > > > > that they used 7th from 9th from sun in > > dwadashansha. Now > > > > > > >> > why ? Why > > > > > > >> > > > > not 7th from 9th from ravi in rashi chart ? Then why > > > not 2nd > > > > > > >> > from > > > > > > >> > > > 9th > > > > > > >> > > > > from ravi. Then one can use arudh lagna of d- 12 if > > > one does > > > > > > >> > not > > > > > > >> > > > find > > > > > > >> > > > > it there , then aurdh of 9th in rashi then arudh > of 9th > > > > in D- > > > > > > >> > 12. It > > > > > > >> > > > > can get confusing very fast.This way one can cover > > all 12 > > > > > > >> > rashis > > > > > > >> > > > and I > > > > > > >> > > > > am sure the graha whose dasha you are running at the > > > > time of > > > > > > >> > the > > > > > > >> > > > known > > > > > > >> > > > > event will be there in one of those. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > I am sure, not even Maharishi Jaimini was spoonfed!! > > He too > > > > > must > > > > > > >> > > > have exprimented, just like Pt. Sanjay Rath, KN Rao and > > > > come up > > > > > > >> > with > > > > > > >> > > > idioms & principles. And as I said before, I am not > > > sure, if > > > > > > >> > even > > > > > > >> > > > you have a fool-proof methodology of predicting events, > > > > without > > > > > > >> > > > beating around the bush! > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > My point is ,test priciples on charts you have and > > > > develop a > > > > > > >> > > > > consistent principle applicable to atleast 75 percent > > > > > > >> > cases.Then > > > > > > >> > > > make > > > > > > >> > > > > it a principle. Do not make rules as you go based > > on the > > > > > chart > > > > > > >> > you > > > > > > >> > > > > have in front of you.BTW there are principles > that have > > > > been > > > > > > >> > > > developed > > > > > > >> > > > > by peope like KN Rao, BV Raman, master those first. > > > > Trust me > > > > > > >> > they > > > > > > >> > > > work > > > > > > >> > > > > in majority of cases > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > Principles, should especially be tested on the basis of > > > > > > >> > probability, > > > > > > >> > > > like Narasimha said, if the likelihood of an event > > > > happening is > > > > > > >> > high > > > > > > >> > > > and if you give a numerous paramters explaining the > > event, > > > > > these > > > > > > >> > > > principles are not probabalistically valid, > although they > > > > > may be > > > > > > >> > > > statistacally valid!! > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > Like explaining, the chara dasa aspecting chara Bhratri > > > Karak > > > > > > >> > caused > > > > > > >> > > > birth of siblings!! I consider that an incomplete and a > > > > totally > > > > > > >> > > > inadequate research! > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > Warm Regards > > > > > > >> > > > Narayan > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 15:02:57 -0000, mikefranc01 > > > > > > >> > <mtravass@t...> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > wrote: > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > Hi Narasimha, > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > I applied the same logic in my chart and it shows > > > > something > > > > > > >> > else. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > The time when my car was almost totaled (March > 1993,) > > > > I was > > > > > > >> > > > running > > > > > > >> > > > > > Cn-Li Narayana dasa of D16, 4th from A4. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > The second time I met with an accident was in Dec > > 1996 > > > > > and I > > > > > > >> > was > > > > > > >> > > > > > running Aq-Li Narayana dasa of D16. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > Both the accidents took place in zone 4:00:00 > > (East of > > > > > GMT). > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > I cannot apply any of the principles that you > > stated in > > > > > your > > > > > > >> > > > email > > > > > > >> > > > > > unless there are others, which can be applied, and > > > > you did > > > > > > >> > not > > > > > > >> > > > state. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > Could you assist here? > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > Mike > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > November 14, 1963 > > > > > > >> > > > > > Time: 14:03:00 > > > > > > >> > > > > > Time Zone: 5:30:00 (East of GMT) > > > > > > >> > > > > > Place: 73 E 55' 00", 15 N 18' 00" > > > > > > >> > > > > > Margao, Goa, India > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > vedic- astrology, "Narasimha > > > P.V.R. > > > > > > >> > Rao" > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > <pvr@c...> wrote: > > > > > > >> > > > > > > - > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Wednesday, March 16, 2005 11:53 PM > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Shodasamsa Narayana dasa (Re: Accident > > > > > schematic) > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Dear Sanjay Prabhakaran, > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > D16 is the chart for all Sukha and Hence Cars > > come > > > > > under > > > > > > >> > > > this. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Here is some jist for analysing all yogas > > > > > > >> > (combinations) in > > > > > > >> > > > D16 > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > 1. A4 is to be considered for Cars. Here A4 > > > > should be > > > > > > >> > > > taken in > > > > > > >> > > > > > D16. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > 2. 6th and 8th house cause worries and > anxieties > > > > > > >> > > > respectively, > > > > > > >> > > > > > in D16 they > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > will show for matters related to cars and > > > other > > > > > > >> > sukha. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > 3. Marakas to sign of A4 will destroy the car. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Marakas primarily being 2nd and 7th. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Now for Dasas which will activate the Yoga's > > > > mentioned > > > > > > >> > above. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Add badhaka sthana in shodasamsa also as a > > potential > > > > > > >> > problem > > > > > > >> > > > sign. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > My birthdata is: 4th April 1970, 5:47:13 pm > (IST), > > > > > > >> > > > Machilipatnam, > > > > > > >> > > > > > India > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > I had a vehicular accident on 5th December > 1996 at > > > > > 6:30 pm > > > > > > >> > > > (EST), > > > > > > >> > > > > > Wilmington, MA. I was not hurt, but the car was > > > > "totalled". > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > As per D-16 Narayana dasa, this happened in Li-Ta > > > > > > >> > antardasa. > > > > > > >> > > > In my > > > > > > >> > > > > > D-16, Ta is the badhaka sthana and contains > > > 3rd/12th lord > > > > > > >> > > > Mercury and > > > > > > >> > > > > > nodes. It is the 12th house from A4, showing > the loss > > > > of a > > > > > > >> > > > vehicle. > > > > > > >> > > > > > It is also the 8th house from the 4th house, > showing > > > > > > >> > problems in > > > > > > >> > > > > > sukha. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Those who are into the three parts of rule of > > > Narayana > > > > > > >> > dasa > > > > > > >> > > > > > interpretation can test that too. Mahadasa sign > > Li is a > > > > > > >> > > > seershodaya > > > > > > >> > > > > > rasi. So it gives its results in the first > > > one-third. Its > > > > > > >> > lord > > > > > > >> > > > Venus > > > > > > >> > > > > > is also in a seershodaya rasi (Le). So he gives his > > > > results > > > > > > >> > in > > > > > > >> > > > the > > > > > > >> > > > > > second one-third. The last one-third gives the > > > results of > > > > > > >> > > > occupants > > > > > > >> > > > > > and aspectors. There are four candidates and > they are > > > > > Venus, > > > > > > >> > > > Rahu, > > > > > > >> > > > > > Ketu and Mercury in the order of longitudes. We > > > > divide the > > > > > > >> > last > > > > > > >> > > > one- > > > > > > >> > > > > > third of the dasa into 4 equal parts and give > them to > > > > these > > > > > > >> > 4 > > > > > > >> > > > planets > > > > > > >> > > > > > in this order. The result of Rahu's aspect on > > > > mahadasa sign > > > > > > >> > is > > > > > > >> > > > given > > > > > > >> > > > > > in Oct 1996-Aug 1997. Rahu is the 8th lord, > occupies > > > > > badhaka > > > > > > >> > > > sthana > > > > > > >> > > > > > and aspects the 4th house of vehicles Libra. So the > > > sub- > > > > > > >> > period > > > > > > >> > > > in > > > > > > >> > > > > > question resulted in vehicle problems. Not only > did I > > > > have > > > > > > >> > an > > > > > > >> > > > > > accident in Dec 1996, but the new car I bought > in Jan > > > > 1997 > > > > > > >> > > > suffered > > > > > > >> > > > > > too. It was hit by people twice when it was > > parked in a > > > > > > >> > parking > > > > > > >> > > > lot. > > > > > > >> > > > > > I did not see who hit it, but someone hit it twice. > > > After > > > > > > >> > these > > > > > > >> > > > > > repeated incidents, I sold that "unlucky" car and > > > bought > > > > > > >> > another > > > > > > >> > > > new > > > > > > >> > > > > > car in Sept 1997. All these are due to the > sub-period > > > > > giving > > > > > > >> > the > > > > > > >> > > > > > results of Rahu's aspect on Li. It so happened > > that the > > > > > > >> > > > antardasa was > > > > > > >> > > > > > also of Ta, which contains Rahu. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > As per Vimsottari dasa also, it was Mercury-Ketu > > > > > antardasa. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > In my annual Tithi Pravesha chart of 1996- 97, > D-16 > > > > > had Leo > > > > > > >> > > > rising, > > > > > > >> > > > > > lagna lord Sun in 6h (!!) with 6th lord Saturn, > > > Rahu and > > > > > > >> > Ketu. > > > > > > >> > > > Saturn- > > > > > > >> > > > > > Saturn antardasa as per annual Tithi Ashtottari > > > dasa was > > > > > > >> > running > > > > > > >> > > > from > > > > > > >> > > > > > Dec 3 to Dec 6. Accident was on Dec 5! > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > The technique of Tithi Pravesha never seizes to > > > > amaze me! > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > May Jupiter's light shine on us, > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Narasimha > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > -------------------------- > > > > > > >> > ---- > > > > > > >> > > > - > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): > > > > > > >> > http://vedicastro.home.comcast.net > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Free Jyotish software (Windows): > > > > > > >> > http://www.VedicAstrologer.org > > > > > > >> > > > > > > SJC website: http://www.SriJagannath.org > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > -------------------------- > > > > > > >> > ---- > > > > > > >> > > > - > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > Archives: > > vedic astrology > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > > >> > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic- astrology- > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > > > Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > ________________________________ > > > > > > >> > > > > > Links > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > vedic- astrology/ > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > To from this group, send an email to: > > > > > > >> > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > Your use of is subject to the > > > > Terms of > > > > > > >> > > > Service. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > Archives: vedic- astrology > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > > >> > astrology/info.html > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > Sponsor > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > Children International > > > > > > >> > > > Would you give Hope to a Child in need? > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > ·Click Here to meet a Girl > > > > > > >> > > > And Give Her Hope > > > > > > >> > > > ·Click Here to meet a Boy > > > > > > >> > > > And Change His Life > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > Learn More > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > ________________________________ > > > > > > >> > > > Links > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > vedic astrology/ > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > To from this group, send an email to: > > > > > > >> > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > Your use of is subject to the > > Terms of > > > > > > >> > Service. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > Archives: vedic- astrology > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > Group info: > > > > vedic astrology/info.html > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to > > > > > vedic astrology- > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > Sponsor > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > ________________________________ > > > > > > >> > Links > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > vedic astrology/ > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > vedic astrology > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > Terms of > > > > > Service. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: > > vedic astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to > > > > vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: > > vedic astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to > > > > vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > * Sponsor* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > click here > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <http://us.ard./SIG=129kq6bi4/M=298184.6191685.7192823.30011 76/D=gr > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > oups/S=1705082686:HM/EXP=1111290544/A=2593423/R=0/SIG=11el9gslf/*http ://www. > > > > > netflix.com/Default?mqso=60190075 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <http://us.ard./SIG=129kq6bi4/M=298184.6191685.7192823.30011 76/D=gr > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > oups/S=1705082686:HM/EXP=1111290544/A=2593423/R=0/SIG=11el9gslf/*http :/www.n > > > > > etflix.com/Default?mqso=60190075> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - ----- > > > > > > > * Links* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > * > > > > > > > vedic astrology/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > * > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <vedic astrology? subject=Un> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > * Your use of is subject to the > > Terms of > > > > > > > Service <>. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to > > vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <http://us.ard./SIG=1299sree8/M=298184.6191685.7192823.30011 76/D=gr > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > oups/S=1705082686:HM/EXP=1111408012/A=2593423/R=0/SIG=11el9gslf/*http :/www.n > > > > > etflix.com/Default?mqso=60190075> click here > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <http://us.adserver./l? M=298184.6191685.7192823.3001176/D=groups/S= > > > > > :HM/A=2593423/rand=524349373> > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > Links > > > > > * > > > > > vedic astrology/ > > > > > > > > > > * > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <vedic astrology? subject=Un> > > > > > > > > > > * Terms of > > > Service > > > > > <> . > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to > vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <http://us.ard./SIG=129e8r29v/M=298184.6191685.7192823.30011 76/D=gr > > > > > > > > > > oups/S=1705082686:HM/EXP=1111416815/A=2593423/R=0/SIG=11el9gslf/*http ://www. > > > > netflix.com/Default?mqso=60190075> click here > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <http://us.adserver./l? M=298184.6191685.7192823.3001176/D=groups/S= > > > > :HM/A=2593423/rand=218787452> > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > Links > > > > > > > > > > > > * > > > > vedic astrology/ > > > > > > > > > > > > * > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > <vedic astrology? subject=Un> > > > > > > > > > > > > * Terms of > Service > > > > <> . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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