Fw: : To be Guru or Not to be ?? to Sanjay

[Guest guest]

Dear Sanjay:

 

I've read your notes on Guru and these make a lot of sense. The board

has also received some fine notes from other members regarding "Guru."

 

Sanjay, it's just been 3 years since I've began learning Jyotish as

well as Hindu philosophy, thus I often ask INFANTILE questions and my

intention is never to hurt or belittle anyone.

 

Isn't my case amazing, just 3 years back I considered Jyothish some

mumbo-jumbo for the weak people/minds and thereafter life kicked my

butt so badly that I suddenly and mysteriously embarked upon the path

of understanding Jyotish, Karma, re-birth, the Hindu philosophy and

became a mantra chanting devotee of Ganesh and Durga Ma.

 

It's to nice to hear from you. Hope you continue writing on this

board.

 

Respectfully,

Mukund

 

vedic astrology, "Sanjay Rath" <guruji@s...>

wrote:

>

> ::om namo bhagavate vasudevaya::

> Dear Mukund, Rosemary & Partha

>

> The intention of Mukund cannot be bad. He has an exalted Guru in

the dharma

> bhava. He helps to keep conscience clear by reminding all of us of

our

> duties once in a while. That is a good work. With time and age his

words

> maybe sweeter and softer but there is no doubt in my mind about his

> intentions.

>

> There are some who make strange and sometimes very bad remarks.

Such remarks

> caused from Rajas guna or passion shall never help anyone -neither

they

> themselves nor the person they are being told to. The same view if

> communicated with sweet words will find their mark.

>

> Mukund, in ancient India we had kings like Raja Rama by looking at

whose

> face the Brahmin can confidently renounce everything and

concentrate in his

> work. give me one name...just one name among the 100 billion people

of India

> whose face I can see and confidently give up my tours and

concentrate on

> translating BPHS, Saravali, Deva Keralam and other works or finish

my book

> on Atmakaraka. Yes your statements are right about flying first

class and

> living in Palaces. But that does not prevent them from being Gurus

either.

> Even Raja Janak the giver of the 'Hare Rama Krishna' mantra lived

in a

> palace and was a Rajarshi. He gave the mantra for Veda Vyasa's son.

Was Veda

> Vyasa wrong in advising his son to take mantra from Raja Janaka?

>

> No, we should not judge the calibre of a Guru from the material

goods he

> possesses. We should judge a Guru from the knowledge he has. That

is what

> Vasistha has taught. Imbibe their good values and their knowledge

and ignore

> their bad values and personal traits that comes from living as

human beings

> do.

>

> Just because I do not own even a car, what to talk of property and

house,

> does not qualify me to be a Guru. Knowledge alone qualifies me to

be a

> Jytosih Guru. Just because Narasimha has three cars and a few huge

houses

> does not disqualify him from being a guru. His knowledge qualifies

him to be

> a Jyotish Guru. So Mukund the parameters you use to identify a guru

are

> wrong and this will lead you to the wrong guru. Choose the

parameters

> correctly and you will reach your destination. Choose knowledge,

Satva guna

> predominance in behavior and dharma to be the criteria for a Diksha

Guru;

> choose knowledge as the most important criteria for siksha gurus.

remember

> these four mantra that define the guru -

> OM gurave namah (obeisances to the teacher/remover of darkness)

> OM parama gurave namah

> OM paratpara gurave namah, and

> OM paramesthi gurave namah (that is for Shiva, and all knowledge)

>

> With best regards,

> Sanjay Rath

> SJC Puri, 212 Gopal Ballav Road, Puri 752001, India

> Tel: +91.6752.226269 http://srath.com

>

> -

> monmuk111

> vedic astrology

> Thursday, June 24, 2004 9:27 PM

> [vedic astrology] Re: : To be Guru or Not to be ?? to

Rosemary ,

> Partha, Venkat

>

>

> Hello Rosemary and Partha:

>

> First and foremost,if I offended anyone with my "Guru" questions, I

> apologize.

>

> My intent wasn't malicious. My intent was to understand how can

> people flying first class, riding rolls-royce and living in palatial

> homes claim to be Gurus?

>

> Partha has Indian roots so he knows about the lifestyle of the REAL

> Gurus, but Rosemary, if you're not well-versed about life in India,

> I'd like to tell you that REAL Brahmins and Gurus in India live off

> donations received from patrons and the life style is simple and

> somtimes really poor.

>

> Rosemary, even in ancient India, the Gurus lived off whatever

> donations the Kings made to them and Venkat has already named a few-

-

> Vishwamitra, Drona, etc. In fact, Drona fought on the side of

> Kauravas during the Mahabharat war because he was living off

donation

> from King Duryodhan.

>

> So, the question I had posed was that if some who is profiteering

> from the sacred Vedic knowledge and isn't living like a Hermit on

> donation, can this person call himself a Guru?

>

> I feel I had asked a valid question, but it appears that my

questions

> have riled up somuch negative emotions that we should end this

debate

> as Partha has suggested.

>

> Respectfully,

> Mukund

>

> vedic astrology, "R Innes-Jones" <rf.innes-

> jones@x> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > > Dear Monmuk111,

> > > Why and where are you coming from to paint such a rascist then

> sexist ,

> > separatist

> > > picture? Why are you drawing lines and circles about Brahmins

and

> Gurus

> > and

> > > separating yourself from truth.

> > > Where is the advaita here? It is all one.

> > > You are as much a part of me and I you. This play of creation

> with its

> > > actors is not who we really are. Why the preference and claim to

> one part

> > or

> > > another?

> > >

> > > Ask yourself, in the pureness of your heart, is their any

> difference

> > between

> > > yourself, the 'false' guru and the 'true'

> > guru.............................

> > >

> > > Kind regards

> > > Rosemary

> > >

> > > -

> > > "monmuk111" <monmuk111>

> > > <vedic astrology>

> > > Thursday, June 24, 2004 9:31 AM

> > > [vedic astrology] Re: Fwd: >Venkatarama--to Venkat and

> Aman

> > >

> > >

> > > Hello Aman:

> > >

> > > You have NICELY reflected the SAME sentiments I feel. I've done

> is in

> > > an abrasive way.

> > >

> > > The issues are:

> > >

> > > 1) Who can be a Guru?

> > > 2) And, can someone who IS NOT living a Brahminical life of

> living on

> > > donations and of not profiteering from Vedic knowledge become a

> Guru?

> > > 3) In India, practicing Brahmins live an extremely Brahminic

> > > lifestyle ever since they're kids, i.e. began learning rituals

> from

> > > their father and grandfather in childhood, then go to Benaras

and

> > > study Vedas and Vedic rituals for many, many years AND FINALLY

> become

> > > a PUNDIT/GURU/BRAHMIN who performs various rituals, rites

> including

> > > giving out mantras. Now, can a person who hasn't BEEN thorough

> this

> > > process become a GURU and give out Mantras?

> > >

> > > Venkat has made a nice attempt to answer these, but is sitting

on

> the

> > > fence on some important issue of whether someone who isn't born

a

> > > Brahmin and doesn't live a Brahminic lifestyle become a Guru and

> > > perform rites, rituals and give out Mantras.

> > >

> > > Let's see what other members have to say. I'm hoping I'm not

> BOOTED

> > > from this group for asking such questions.

> > >

> > > Mukund