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2nd house Jup in various roles--to ash

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Hello Ash,

Correction.

Self's grand father was a great personality honoured by all

shankaracharyas and governments .

But his father did not even know any stotra except sandhya vandanam

and he never new astrology.

He was a simple minded trader all his life.

Rgds

Tatvam-Asi

 

Grandfather

15th December 1892

1.22 PM

Rajkot (Near)

India

Lived till age 95

 

 

 

vedic astrology, Ash <ashsam73> wrote:

> Dear Chandrashekhar,

>

> The fact still remains. The BAV scheme given by Parasara is

different from Varharamira. This is one point and this is factual.

One of them is corrupt. I am saying the scheme Parasara has given

has become corrupt over time. The scheme Varharmira has given has

been preserved in time. The two schemes cannot be different.

>

> I am not clear to which point you are alluding when you say that my

information about Parasara and Varharmira is not factual. The BAV

scheme given by Parasara is different from Varharamira. This was

visible in Ramesh's chart when you said using parasarsa BAV scheme

when 7th bhava got 19 bindus and using Varharmiras BAV scheme it

comes to 20. I am not going into other books. The point that I am

emphasising is that BAV scheme given by Parasara or Varharmira or any

other maharishi cannot be different.

>

> Ashtakvarga has been commented on by many maharishis as you have

given but the system of timing of events using Ashtakavarga is not

given which I beleive was a part of Vedic Astrology was saved with

some families and not known to the world.

>

> About the part with which the discussion started is what I agree

with you. There is a part of what Noname is also saying that I agree

with however I beleive that Guru spoils the house its placed in due

to its aspect on primary significator houses. By saying Spoilt I

mean it will not give the result in his antra. Also Guru is

generally with more than 5 bindus. Rarely its with < 4 bindus. The

more powerful Guru is the more damage it will do by its aspect. For

Libra lagna and Cancer lagna Guru is 6th lord and will be very

malefic.

>

> In the chart given by No Names grand father also he commented that

his grand father has Guru in lagna who is powerful and he took

sansaya after early widohood. Again here a powerful guru is showing

its malefic aspect on 7th house. Again guru in lagna made no names

father a famous and person as he was known for his knowledge on

samaveda. Noname has not commented on the effect it had on 9th and

5th house but if his guru is very powerful. I am also not aware what

the lagna is but this can be the sign of a powerful guru in lagna.

>

> Thanking you,

> Cheers !!!

> Ash

>

>

> Chandrashekhar <boxdel> wrote:

> Dear Ash,

> It is good that you at least agree that "GURU ALWAYS ASPECTS 5TH

HOUSE FROM THE HOUSE ITS PLACED IN AND ITS A PRIMARY SIGNIFICATOR

HOUSE SO GURU WILL NOT GIVE RESULT FOR THE HOUSE ITS PLACED IN

GENERALLY."

> This is the point from which the original discussions started.

>

> For your information much detailed interpretation of events (Beyond

what is explained in BPHS,a although based on the principles therein)

by Ashtakavarga is available in Phaladeepika, Jataka Parijata,

Jatakadesh Marg and umpteen other astrological texts. So your

information about only Parashara and Varaha Mihira is not factual.

> Regards,

> Chandrashekhar.

>

>

> Ash wrote:

> Dear Chandrashekhar,

>

> My answers in CAPS.

>

>

> Chandrashekhar <boxdel> wrote:

>

> Dear Ash,

> Ashtakavarga system is based on Bindus allotted to particular

houses for each of the planet with respect to its position from the

planet whose Ashtakavarga is being drawn.

>

> ASH : YES AGREED.

>

>

> The system you are using is based on considering the strengths of

planets and the Bhavas too. This is the system generally referred as

Parashari or more precisely Hora system which also encompasses the

Ashtakavarga system.

>

> ASH : ASHTAKVARGA IS A PART AND PARCLE OF VEDIC ASTROLOGY AND THAT

IS WHAT I HAVE ALSO SAID. I HAVE SAID THAT THE SYSTEM TO TIME EVENTS

IS NOT GIVEN IN TEXTS AVAILABLE TODAY. REST CLARIFICAITON BELOW.

>

> Ashtakavarga is primarily used to find out effects from Transit of

planets and longevity as made clear in conversation between Maitreya

and sage Parashara in BPHS. Ashtakavarga system is clearly defined in

that text.

>

> ASH : THIS IS WHAT THE MISCONCEPTION IS. BASED ON THE TEXTS

AVAILABLE TODAY. DO YOU REALLY THINK THAT ASHTAKVARG IS USED ONLY

FOR FINDING OUT TRANSIT. IS THAT WHY PARASARA HAS SAID THAT TO USE

ASHTAKAVARGA FOR INTELLECUTAL PYGMIES OF KALIYUGA ? I DO NOT THINK

SO SIR. THE SYSTEM OF ASHTAKVARGA IS VERY DETAILED AND KAS AND

VERSES OF ASHTAKAVARGA HAVE BEEN BROUGHT FORWARD BY KRUSHNAJI WHICH

ARE NOT FOUND IN ANY BOOK TODAY. IF YOU CLAIM THAT BHPS IS COMPLETE

AND THAT ALL THAT IS AVAILABLE ABOUT ASHTAKVARGA IS FOUND AND CODED

AND THERE IS NO CORRUPTION THEN I WILL NOT INDULGE YOU ANY FURTHER.

>

> No doubt the system can be adopted to various other predictions, as

it indicates influences on various bhavas. Its various uses have been

well documented in numerous texts besides BPHS and the very short

description of Varahamihira. The assumption that its use is not

mentioned for different uses in any other text but the two you

mentioned is not factually correct.

>

> ASH : THE SYSTEM TO TIME EVENTS USING ASHTAKVARGA IS NOT GIVEN

CLEARLY IS IN ANY TEXTS. THAT IS WHAT I AM SAYING.

>

> Krushna has developed different parameters and as long as the

system delivers results there should be no issue with that.

>

> ASH : HERE I WANT TO POINT OUT THAT KRUSHNAJI HAS NOT DEVELOPED

DIFFERENT PARAMETERS AND THIS SYSTEM. HE HAD BROUGHT IT FORWARD.

THIS SYSTEM WAS KEPT IN FAMILY OF HIS GURU AND THAT WAS TRANSMITTED

FROM FATHER TO SON. KRUSHNAJI WANTED THIS SYSTEM TO REMAIN IN THIS

WORLD. THIS SYSTEM MUST HAVE BEEN IN HIS GURUS LINEAGE FOR

CENTURIES. IF ONE UNDERSTANDS THIS SYSTEM TO TIME EVENTS MAYBE WHAT

AND WHY I AM INDULDING YOU IN THIS THREAD WILL BECOME CLEAR.

>

> It is easy to say that Parashara and Varahamihira's texts are

corrupted, and they could be. But that does not prove that the bindus

used are wrong especially as most of other parameters that you

mention are drawn from these very texts.

>

> ASH : THE SYSTEM OF TIMING OF EVENTS USING ASHTAKAVARGA IS NOT

DIFFERENT FROM VEDIC ASTROLOGY. INFACT VEDIC ASTROLOGY IS MADE CLEAR

WITH THE PROPER USE OF ASHTAKAVARGA AND KAS. I DO NOT THINK PARASARA

LIGHTLY MENTIONED THE USE OF ASHTAKAVARGA FOR US PEOPLE IN KALI

YUGA. A LOT OF ASHTAKVARGA AND SANSKRIT SHLOKAS HAVE BEEN LOST.

THIS IS WHAT I AM SAYING OR KEPT WITH FAMILES TILL SOMEONE LIKE

KRUSHNAJI COMES ALONG AND BRINGS SUCH TECHNIQUES FORWARD. ITS A BIG

CREDIT TO KRUSHNAJI FOR BRINGING FORWARD THIS SYSTEM WITH HAS MADE

TIMING OF EVENTS SO EASY.

>

> It is well known that Varaha Mihira was influenced by Greek

astrologers and has adopted some of their methods, so the bindus that

he attributes could also have come from them.

>

> ASH : ONE THING. BAV IS BAV AND BASIC SCHEME SHOUL.D BE SAME.

ONLY IN BAV OF MOON AND VENUS THERE IS A DIFFERENCE. PARASARA AND

VARHARMIRA CANNOT HAVE DIFFERENT OPINIONS. EITHER PARASARA'S SCHEME

IS CORRUPT OR VARHARMIRAS'S. AT THE END OF THE DAY BOTH MUST MATCH.

SO ITS INFACT QUITE EASY TO SAY THAT EITHER PARSARAS OR VARHARMIRAS

BAV IS CORRPUT. I AM CONFIDENT THAT VARHRMAIRAS HAS REMAINED IN TACT

OVER THE CENTURIES AND PARASARAS BAV SCHME IS CORRPUT. IN ANY CASE I

WILL GO BY WHAT KRUSHNAJI HAS TAUGHT ME AS THIS SYSTEM WAS KEPT IN

HIS GURUS FAMILY AND HE HAS USED THAT FOR DECADES WITH CORRECT

PREDICTIONS. SO ITS TIME TESTED BY HIS GURUS LINEAGE. I AM IN NO

POSITION TO MAKE ANY JUDGEMENT BUT CAN SAY THAT I AM USNIG

VARHARMIRAS SCHEME.

>

> Since you give equal importance to Navamsha and Rasi whereas I go

by the old time system of planetary strength being derived from

Navamsha, it might not be possible for you to follow my meaning and

reasons behind attributing more strength to Saturn over Jupiter.

>

> ASH : I AM FINDING STRENGTH USING ASHTAKVARGA BUT FOR EACH PLANET

AND FOR EACH HOUSE. YOU ARE ALSO TRYING TO FIND THE STRENGH BUT I AM

NOT CLEAR WHEN YOU SAY SHANI IS STRONGER THAN GURU BUT FOR WHAT ? IS

IT FOR EVENT OR ALL 12 HOUSES ? JUST SAYING STRONGER IS VERY

GENERAL. IF I WERE TO ASK YOU IS SHANI STRONGER THAN GURU FOR 4TH

HOUSE OR 10TH HOUSE. THIS IS HOW I AM SEETNG THINGS. AS PER THE

WORKSHEET STRENGTH GURU IS FAR BETTER FOR 10TH HOUSE AS COMPARED TO

SHANI HOWEVER SHANI IS FAR STRONGER THAN GURU FOR 4TH HOUSE MATTERS.

>

> The question of strength of the two planets was raised by Lakshmi

and I was responding to that. I so far as influence over all 12 Rasis

comment is concerned, Vedic astrology does think that planets have

influence over all Bhavas and other planets and the way the results

would manifest depend on their mutual relation.

>

> ASH : EXACTLY. HERE IN LIES THE ESSENCE OF WHAT I WAS SAYING OR

TRYING TO SAY FOR SO LONG. THE BEAUTY OF IS THAT SAV ALREADY TAKES

CARE OF MUTUAL RELATIONS SO IT BECOMES IMPERATIVE THAT BAV IS

ACCURATE AS SAV AS U KNOW IS DERIVED FROM BAV. THAT WAS MY COMMENT

ON COMPOUNDING OF ERRORS. THIS IS WHY WHEN YOU SAY THAT SHANI IS

STRONGER THAN GURU CONFUSES ME BECAUSE YES FOR 4TH HOUSE SHANI IS

STRONGER THAN GURU BUT NOT FOR 10TH HOUSE. HERE I AM BEING VERY

SPECIFIC. SO ARE YOU SAYING THAT YOUR COMMENT ON SHANI BEING

STRONGER THAN GURU WAS CONSIDERING ALL 12 HOUSES AND THE MUTUAL

PLACMENT FOR ALL PLANETS WITH RESPECT TO EACH OTHER ? IF SO THEN I

AM VERY SURE THAT YOU WILL COME TO THE SAME CONCLUSION USING WHATEVER

WAY YOU USE TO FIND THE STRENGH OF SHANI AND GURU I.E NAVAMSA, D

CHARTS OR YOGAS ETC WITH WHAT I HAVE SHOWN IN THE WORKSHEET. THEN IF

YOU COMPARE SHANI AND GURU FOR EACH HOUSE WE WILL HAVE A MORE

STRONGER BASIS FOR COMPARISION. BUT STILL JUST USING THE WORD

STRONGER I AM

> NOT CLEAR OR AM NOT FOLLOWING. THE QUETSIONS THAT COMES TO MY

MIND .. STRONGER FOR WHAT OR WHICH HOUSE OR WHICH EVENT ?

>

> About not considering Navamsha strength, I am not able to follow

what you are saying. On the one hand you say that these being equal

you do not consider Navamsha in worksheet and that you only use

Navamsha to find samdharmi and on the other hand you say that my

contention is not correct.

>

>

> ASH : RASI AND NAVAMSA HAVE EQUAL STATUS AS PER THE TEACHINGS OF

KAS. NAVAMSA IS DERIVED FROM RASI. FOR THE STRENGH AND WORKSHEET

ONLY RASI IS NEEDED. IF IN CASE OF DOUBT YOU CAN GO INTO D-CHARTS

AND FIND OUT FROM THAT. I HAVE DEMONTRATED WITH AN EXAMPLE OF

RAMESH'S MARRIAGE. I WOULD HOPE THAT LAKSHMI WOULD COMMENT ON THIS

PART. I HAVE NOT SAID THAT YOU ARE NOT CORRECT. YOU ARE TRYING TO

FIND THE STRENGTH ALSO FROM NAVAMSA. AS PER KAS I FIND THE STRENGTH

FROM WORKSHEET WHICH IS FROM RASHI. FOR D-CHARTS I CAST WORKSHEET

BUT ONLY PRIMARY SIGNIFICATOR HOUSE. WE DO NOT CONSIDER ASPECTS

PART. SO ONLY TOP PORTION OF WORKSHEET IS USED. WE BOTH ARE

FINDING STRENGTH AND I AM USING AV FROM RASI AND YOU ARE PROBABLY

USING RASI/NAVAMSA/D CHARTS ETC AND SIGN PLACEMENT TO FIND OUT THE

STRENGTH.

>

> Again you are talking about timing of events and the original

thread is about Guru's capacity to harm the house occupied by it.

>

> ASH : FOR ME THIS IS NOT A MATTER OF QUESTION. AS PER KRUSHNAS

ASHTAKAVARGA SYSTEM PLANETS THAT ASPECT PRIMARY SIGNIFICATOR HOUSES

I.E. 8TH FROM HOUSE UNDER FOCUS, 5TH FROM HOUSE UNDER FOCUS AND HOUSE

UNDER FOCUS FOR EXAMPLE FOR READERS IF YOU ARE TIMING MARRIAGE THEN

2ND, 7TH AND 11TH AND IF ANY PLANET HAS ASPECT ON THESE HOUSES THEN

THEY WILL NOT GIVE RESULT IN THEIR ANTRA BUT THEIR SAMDHARMI WILL

GIVE RESULT AND THE EXCEPTION IS THAT IF THE PLANET IS LORD OF 10TH

FROM HOUSE UNDER FOCUS OR 6TH THEN IT WILL GIVE.

>

> GURU ALWAYS ASPECTS 5TH HOUSE FROM THE HOUSE ITS PLACED IN AND ITS

A PRIMARY SIGNIFICATOR HOUSE SO GURU WILL NOT GIVE RESULT FOR THE

HOUSE ITS PLACED IN GENERALLY. ONLY EXCEPTION IS THAT IF GURU IS IN

PISCES SO SUCH A GURU WILL GIVE THE RESULT OF TIMING OF EVENT.

SIMILARLY FOR MARS. I THINK ALSO SOMETHING SIMILAR IS SAID FOR MARS

AS PER VEDIC TEXTS. MARS ASPECTS 8TH HOUSE FROM THE HOUSE ITS PLACED

IN AND 8TH HOUSE SO AS PER VEDIC TEXTS ITS ALSO SAID THAT MARS SPOILS

THE HOUSE ITS PLACED IN. FOR SHANI IT DOES NOT ASPECT ANY OF THE

SIGNIFICATOR HOUSES WHEREEVER ITS PLACED SO ITS NOT SAID TO SPOIL THE

HOUSE AND WILL DELIVER THE RESULT IF IT HAS POWER AS PER WORKSHEET.

SO IT MAY HAVE BEEN NOTED IN TEXTS AS JU SPOILS THE HOUSE IT IS

PLACED IN AND SHANI DOES NOT. MARS ALSO CAN BE SAID TO SPOIL THE

HOUSE IT IS IN HOWEVER THE EXCEPTIONS FOR ALL IS IF THE SAME PLANET

ALSO RULES 10TH AND 6TH FROM THE HOUSE ITS PLACED IN IT WILL GIVE THE

RESULT. THIS CAN BE CHECKED AND I AM SURE IT WILL

> VALIDATE WITH YOUR EXCEPTIONS.

>

> SO I AM NOT TAKING PART IN THE DISCUSSION AS FOR ME PERSONALLY

THERE IS NOTHING TO DISCUSS. THE BASICS OF SUCH THINGS ARE CRYSTAL

CLEAR AND CONSIDERED BY THE RULES OF KRUSHNAS ASHTAVARGA SYSTEM. I

AM VERY GLAD HOWEVER TO SEE THAT YOU HAVE BROUGHT UP THIS TOPIC.

>

> ANOTHER THING, GURU IS A HYOCRATIC PLANET. WHENEVER ONE TRIES TO

POTRAY GURU AS BAD THERE WILL BE RESISTANCE. THIS IS THE POWER OF

GURU. I AM SITTING BACK AND READING WITH INTEREST AND SEEING THE

MAYA GURU CREATES. FUNNY ITS EASIER TO BLAME SHANI FOR THINGS AND

POTRAY IT AS BAD BUT INFACT ITS SHANI WHO IS THE PLANET OF TRUTH.

>

> SUCH THIGNS ARE HARD FOR PEOPLE TO DIGEST AND YOU ARE GETTING SO

MUCH OF EXPLAINING TO DO. THIS ITSELF PROVES MY POINT AND YOUR POINT

ALSO.

>

> Anyway let us await Lakshmi's comment about your observation on

Mercury Antar, though this is not part of the original discussions.

>

> ASH : YES, IT WILL BE NICE IF LAKSHMI CAN COMMENT ON THE MARRIAGE

OF RAMESH IF IT HAPPENED IN MERCURY ANTRA AS PER KAY. IF THE DATE IS

GIVEN IT WILL BE BETTER. THIS WILL PROVE THE POWER OF THE PLANET AS

PER WORKSHEET TO DELIVER THE RESULTS AFTER FINDING OUT THE DELAY FROM

RASHI AND NAVAMSA AS BOTH HAVE SIMILAR STATUS AS PER KAS.

>

>

>

> THANK YOU FOR THIS DICUSSION,

>

> CHEERS !!!

>

> ASH

>

>

> Regards,

> Chandrashekhar.

>

> Ash wrote:

>

> Dear Chandrashekhar,

> My answers in CAPS below.

>

>

> Chandrashekhar <boxdel> wrote:

>

> Dear Ash,

> I forgot that you are using Krushna's Ashtakavarga system. In that

case you must be using Krushna's Ayanamsha. The system you are using

is a combination of Ashtakavarga and traditional Graha Bhava Bala

system.

>

> ASH : THE SYSTEM I USE IS KRUSHNAS ASHTAKVARG AND ITS PART OF VEDIC

ASTROLOGY. I DONT KNOW WHAT U MEAN BY GRAHA BHAVA BALA SYSTEM. IN

SHORT WE CAN COMPUTE THE STRENGTH OF EACH PLANET FOR EACH AND EVERY

HOUSE AND ALSO FOR ALL 16 D CHARTS. SO ITS VEDIC ASTROLOGY ONLY AND

NOT DIFFERENT. AS PER KAS WE DO NOT TALK IN GENERAL TERMS AS SHANI

IS STRONG OR WEAK BUT WE CAN GO INTO DETAILS AS PER POINTS AND FIND

OUT HOW A PLANET WILL ACT FOR EACH HOUSE. IN MOST CASES PLANETS DO

NOT ACT BAD FOR ALL HOUSES. IN SHANI ANTRA AS PER RAMESH'S CHART IT

WILL BE GOOD FOR 4TH HOUSE MATTERS AS COMPARED TO GURU'S ANTRA FOR

4TH HOUSE MATTERS AT THE SAME TIME FOR 10TH HOUSE MATTESR GURU WILL

BE MUCH STRONGER THAN SHANI AS YOU CAN SEE AS PER POINTS. ABOUT

NAVAMSA I SHALL COMMENT BELOW.

>

>

>

> There is no harm in using it as long as results come true. However

it is not a different Ashtakavarga system per se.

>

> ASH : ASHTAKVARG IS ASHTAKVARG AND HOW TO USE IT IS NOT GIVEN

CLEARLY IN ANY TEXTS. PEOPLE ARE UNDER THE IMPRESSION BASED ON

CURRENT TEXTS THAT ITS USED TO TIME DEATH OR ITS USE IS LIMITED TO

TRANSITS WHICH IS NOT CORRECT. THAT HAS ALWAYS BEEN WHAT I TRY TO

SAY AND EXPLAIN WHEN PEOPLE COMMENT ON ASHTAKVARGA AND ITS USED ONLY

IN TRANSITS. THE WHOLE SYSTEM IN WHICH ITS USED TO TIME EVENTS IS

NOT WRITTEN IN ANY BOOK OR CLASSICS DESPITE MANY MAHARISHIS LIKE

PARASARA, VARHARAMIRA ETC HAVE ALL MENTIONED ASHTAKVARGA IN THEIR

TEXTS.

>

> I was talking about a different Ashtakavarga system that you had

suggested exists.

>

> ASH : I HAVE NOT SUGGESTED ANYTHING OF THAT KIND. KRUSHNAS

ASHTAKVARGA SYSTEM IS A SYSTEM IN WHICH WE USE ASHTAKVARGA TO FIND

THE STRENGTH OF EACH PLANET FOR EACH HOUSE. I DO NOT THINK THERE IS

ANY SYSTEM OUT THERE THAT DOES THAT. RESULTS CAN BE SEEN AT A

GLANCE. FOR EXAMPLE RAMESHS MARRIAGE MIGHT HAVE HAPPENED DURING

MERCURY ANTRA. MERCURY HAS THE HIGHEST STRENGTH IN THE CHART FOR 7TH

HOUSE. AND IS LOD OR 10TH LORD FROM 7TH HOUSE. MAHADAHSA CAN BE THAT

OF SHANI. SHANI IS SAMDHARMI TO NAKTURAL KARAK VENUS OF MARRIAGE.

SO SHANI MD/ MERCURY AD CAN GIVE MARRIAGE. THERE ARE 2 ZEROES IN BAV

ONE DUE TO VENUS AND OTHER DUE TO MARS AND MERCURY SO RESULT WILL BE

IN LAST SECTOR OF MERCURY ANTRA. MERCURY ANTRA RUNS IN SHANI MD RUNS

FROM 1983/11 THRU 1986/JULY. 3RD SECTOR STARTS 1985/07 THRU

1986/07. I AM NOT GOING FURTHER. IF THIS IS IN THE BALL PARK ITS

GOOD AND ONE CAN NARROW IT DOWN FURTHER WITH SUNS TRANSIT OVER STRONG

SIGNIFICATORS FOR 7TH HOUSE AS PER THE WORKSHEET POINTS.

> MAYBE LAKSHMI CAN VERIFY WHEN HER MARRIAGE TOOK PLACE WITH RAMESH.

>

> Varahamihira does have a slightly different bindu placement no

doubt yet it is only different by way of allowing Lagna to have one

more bindu of influence for some planet's Ashtakavarga. So it might

not mean that other planet is getting a bindu less.

>

> ASH : THERE IS A BIG DIFFERENCE BETWEEN WHAT SCHEME THAT IS IN

TEXTS TODAY AVAILABLE GIVEN AS PER PARASARA AND WHATS GIVEN OR

PRESERVED FROM VARHARAMIRA. BOTH ARE GREAT SAGES AND THEIR BAV

SCHEMES MUST BE SAME. PARASARAS HAS BEEN CORRPUT OVER TIME. THE

DIFFERENCES IN IN BAV FOR MOONS PLACMENT FROM MOON AND GURU AND VENUS

FROM MARS. THIS HAS VERY DEEP MEANING AND SAYING FOR EXAMPLE IF

VENUS GETS POWER IF IN 4TH FROM MARS AND IF VENUS IS NOT GETTING

POWER OR A BINDU IF IN 4TH FROM MARS HAS A BIG DIFFERENCE. THERE ARE

ONLY 337 POINTS AND IT WOULD MEAN THAT IF AS IN THE CASE OF RAMESHES

CHART IF HIS 7TH BHAVA GETS 19TH IT MEANS THAT THAT 1 BINDU OF FROM

THE POOL OF 337 HAS GONE TO SOME OTHER HOUSE. IF A PLANET IS IN THAT

HOUSE IT MAY GET 1 BINDU MORE STRENGTH AND IT MAY CHANGE THE ENTIRE

CHART. IF THAT PLANET IS IN 4TH FROM A MALEFIC PLANET (BY MALEFIC I

MEAN A PLANET WITH < 4 BINDUS EXCEPT MOON) AND IF THAT PLANET WERE TO

GET STRNGTH THEN THAT PLANET WOULD BECOME VERY STRONG FOR

> ALL 12 HOUSES. THAT WOULD CHANGE THE ENTIRE COMPLEXION OF THE

CHART. WITH ASKTAVARG WE ARE VERY PARTICULAR AND THIS IS NOT A

TRIVIAL MATTER. 1 BINDUS CAN MAKE A HUGE DIFFERENCE.

>

> I said 19 Bindus as the chart sent by Dear Lakshmi was in that

format. Varahamihira has exactly 8 shlokas on Ashtakavarga and his is

not a different system. He only has a different opinion about which

places are influenced by Lagna in case of some of the planets.

Parashara has, on the other hand, exhaustively dealt with

Ashtakavarga.

>

> ASH : THIS IS NOT TRUE. BAV SCHEMES HAVE TO MATCH. I DONT

UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU ARE SAYING BY SYSTEMS. THE CORE AND BASIC OF

ASHTAKVARG SYSTEM IS THE BAV POINTS. IF PARASARA IS SAYING THAT MOON

IS NOT GIVING STRENGTH TO 9TH BHAVA WHEAREAS VARHARAMIRA IS SAYING IT

DOES. THIS IS HUGE DIFFERECE OUT HERE. SIMILARLY MOON IS BENEFIC IN

2ND FROM GURU AND VARHARAMIRA IS SAYING THAT 1 BINDUS STRENGTH IS NOT

GIVEN. THIS IS THE BASIC. YOU JUST CANNOT SAY THAT THE DIFFERENCE

OF OPINION IS "ONLY". THIS CHANGES EVERYTHING. IMAGINE A SYSTEM

THAT IS USED ACCURATELY FOR TIMING OF EVENTS THE SAV VALUES FROM

WHICH THE STRENGTH OF ALL PLANEST AND FOR EACH AND EVERY HOUSE IS

COMPUTED AND ITS BASED ON SAV AND SAV IS BASED ON BAV. IN THE LEAST

WHAT YOU ARE SAYING MIGHT SURMOUNT TO COMPOUNDING OF ERROR. ACTUALLY

IF YOU STUDY HOW ONE COMES TO THE POINTS THAT I HAVE DISPLAYED IN MY

PREVIOUS MAILS YOU WILL BEGIN TO UNDERSTAND WHY I AM SO PICKY WITH

THIS DISTRIBUTION OF BAV AND STICKING TO

> VARHARAMIRA. IF WE DIFFER ON THIS VIEW WE CAN AGREE TO DISAGREE.

>

> I have already given the reason I think Saturn is stronger than

Guru in reply to Lakshmi.

>

> ASH : YES, I DID READ YOUR INTERSTING COMMENT BUT I WAS NOT CLEAR

ON WHAT YOU MEANT BY STRONGER. STRONGER FOR WHAT EVENTS ? DID U

MEAN STRONGER FOR DELIVERING RESULTS OR ALL 12 HOUSES. CAN YOU BE

MORE SPECIFIC. WHEN I GAVE THE POINTS I AM BEING VERY SPECIFIC AND

COMPARING GURU WITH SHANI FOR ALL 12 HOUSES. I AM BEING SPECIFIC IN

SAYING THAT IN GURU ANTRA RAMESH WILL HAVE MORE AUTHORITY AS COMPARED

TO SHANI. GURU IS IN UPCAHYA FROM 10TH HOUSE AND WITH 5 BINDUS. SO

ITS VERY EAGER TO GIVE 2ND AND 10TH HOUSE MATTERS. SHANI IS EAGER TO

GIVE RESULTS FOR 12TH, 4TH, 11TH, AND 3RD HOUSE IN ITS ANTRA. CAN

YOU BE MORE SPECIFIC. I DO NOT THINK SHANI IS BAD FOR EACH AND EVERY

HOUSE AND NEITHER IS GURU IN HIS ANTRA. AGAIN I AM RESTRICTING THE

RESULTS TO THE ANTRA. I THINK IF U ARE MORE SPECIFIC THEN WE MIGHT

BE SAYING THE SAME THING BUT FROM A DIFFERENT VIEW POINT.

>

> The reason it is not reflected in the table given by you is,as you

have indicated Navamsha strength of planets is not considered in the

system you are using.

>

> ASH : THIS IS INCORRECT. THE STRENGTH IS DERIVED FROM RASHI AND

THE WORKSHEET POINTS ARE FROM RASHI ONLY. NAVAMSA HAS EQUAL STATUS

AS COMPARED TO RASHI. WE USE NAVAMSA FOR FINDING OUT THE SAMDHARMIS

AND ALSO DELAY. ALL COMBINATIONS HAVE TO BE CHECKED FROM BOTH RASI

AND NAVAMSA. BUT FOR FINDING OUT THE STRENGH OF PLANET ITS DONE FROM

RASI. A WORKSHEET FOR EACH DIVISIONAL CHART IS ALSO CASTED.

>

> Using Krushna's Ayanamsha the Navamsha placement of planets could

also change. If you apply the strength from Navamsha as given in the

chart provided by Lakshmi, you will see my view point.

>

> ASH : IT WILL NOT CHANGE THINGS. I CHECKED AFTER READING THIS

COMMENT. IN BOTH CASES USING KRUSHNAS AYANAMSA AND LAHIRI SHANI

REMAINS IN LIBRA IN NAVAMSA SO ITS SAMDHARMI TO VENUS. IT WILL

REPLACE VENUS FOR THE HOUSE THAT VENUS IS UNABLE TO DELIVER RESULTS.

THE POSITION OF MARS CHANGES IN LAGNA THOUGH. MAYBE IF U SEE THINGS

WITH MARS BEING IN 12TH INSTEAD OF 11TH YOU MAY SEE MY VIEW POINT.

AGAIN I AM EMPHASISING ON THE FACT THAT STRENGTH OR THE WORKSHEET

THAT I GAVE IS COMPUTED FROM RASHI ONLY AND SAMDHARMIS IS COMPUTED

FROM RASHI AND NAVAMSA. RASHI AND NAVAMSA HAVE EQUAL STATUS AS PER

KAS AND WE FOLLOW CERTAIN RULES FOR FINDING DELAY. I HAVE

DEMONSTRATED IN THIS MAIL REGARDING MARRIAGE OF RAMESH WITH LAKSHMI.

FOR THAT I HAVE COMPUTED DELAY FOR MARRIAGE USING 2 ZEROES, AND SHANI

ASPECTING PRIMIARY SIGNIFICATOR HOUSES FROM RASHI AND THEIR LORDS IN

NAVAMSA AND USING WORKSHEET STRENGTH I HAVE COMPUTED THE TIME FRAME.

IT WILL BE INTERSTING IF LAKSHMI CAN COMMENT ON THE SAME.

> THERE IS A SLIGHT DIFFERENCE IN THE WORKSHEET. SOME HOW IN HASTE

MY AYANAMSA CHANGE BUT IT WILL NOT MAKE A DIFFERENCE FOR MARRAIGE.

HERE IS THE CORRECTED VERSION OF THE WORKSHEET. MERCURY STILL HAS 18

POINTS FOR 7TH HOUSE AND MOSTLY ALL HOUSES.

>

> HseSAV

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7237102353212239191622156321816182158117201014918111810819221292541710

92881214752131034171371621164113816151521415191229101411981415

>

>

>

> THANKING YOU,

>

> CHEERS !!!

>

> ASH

>

>

> Regards,

> Chandrashekhar.

>

> Ash wrote:

> Dear Chandrashekhar and Lakshmi,

> There is a difference between a house getting 20 bindus and a house

getting 19 bindus as you are aware. I agree both are weak with 20

bindus being a stronger than 19 bindus. At the same token if a bhave

gets 1 bindu more it means one other house is getting 1 bindu less.

> It also means that some planet has made a favourable yog w.r.t one

house and not with another. Is it not ?

> I use Krushnas Ashtakvarga system as you are also aware.

> In that SAV is the base from that we derive the strength of each

planet for each and every house and also for each and every 16

divisional chart. When casting the worksheet the aspects are not

considered in the D charts only the basis strength.

> The BAV values given by Parasara in my opinion have become

corrupt. The BAV distribution scheme by Varharamira is correct. The

settings are also given in JHL software where you tick off the check

boxes in the lite version. If you use the option of Varharamira you

will get 20 bindus for 7th house. It would be good to understand if

you have intentionally used Parasara's scheme of BAV or generally use

Varharmiras scheme ?

> To come to the final stength of each and every planet for each

house .

>

> Here is the final strength of planet for Ramesh's chart.

>

> These are total strength of the planets and derived by considering

the following.

>

> 1) 4:10

> 2) Addition of 5 points for LoD and LoE or 10th lord and 6th lord

from house under consideration

> 3) Planets in 10th and 6th hosue from house under consideration

with > 4 bindus.

> 4) Planets aspecting primary significator house i.e Karak, phal and

phalit sthans.

> 5) Benefic/Malefic Aspects on karak, phal and phalit sthan

> 5) Benefic/Malefic Aspect on planets

> 6) Adjustment of 12th from house under focus

> 7) Adjustment of 6th lord.

>

> After meticulously considering all these factors we come to

strength of each planet for each and every house. Like that we also

compute strength for all d charts but in that we only conider the

strength for karak, phal and phalit sthan for each and every house.

>

> You have said that Shani is stronger than Guru. Here you can see

both Shani and Guru at a glace on how they will deliver their results

in their respective antar dasha.

>

> I do hear ya regarding the system not being different from

parasara. Actually parasara did give the BAV scheme but it has

become corrupt over time.

>

> Here Jupiter is in 10th from 10th house so its foritifying 10th

house and also Guru is with 5 bindus in 7th house and in multrikon so

its very eager to give results for 10th house.

>

> If you see the worksheet you can see Ju is having 22 points for

10th house and Shani has 7 points for 10th house. There is a big

difference in authority that Ramesh would have been bestowed in the

antras of Guru and Shani.

> At the same time if you see expenses v/s income in Guru and shani

and compare the 11th v/s 12th points you can see more expenses in

shani compared to Guru antra.

>

>

>

HouseSignsSAVSuMoMaMeJuVeSa1Gemini2316191320177162Cancer24101520232314

163Leo309219191111134Virgo26722924144235Libra338235202216196Scorpio321

6202124139177Sagittarius20719525171288Capricorn211519924912129Aquarius

2971713111422910Pisces291310-

217229711Aries401121102614101912Taurus305211019121020

>

> Thanks,

> Cheers !!!

> Ash

>

>

> Chandrashekhar <boxdel> wrote:

> Dear Ash,

> Even with 20 points the Bhava lacks strength, is it not? Saturn

there however extends protection. By the way I am not aware of any

Ashtakavarga system which gives differential value of Bindus/Rekhas

based on Lagna of a native or placement of a planet in a Rasi,

aspects received by it and association with other planets. May I know

to which system you are referring to and the weightage for these

factors given in that system by increasing or reducing the

Bindus/Rekhas.

> If you are talking about using other parameters in association with

Ashtakavarga then of course that is a different matter and would not

constitute different system than Parashara.

> Regards,

> Chandrashekhar.

>

> ashsam73 wrote:

> Dear Chandrashekhar and Lakshmi

>

> Pardon me for my intervention.

>

> I would like to comment on Ashtakavarga.

>

> 1) It seems that you have used Parasaras scheme of BAV. With

> Varharamiras scheme you get 20 points in Ramesh's 7th house.

>

> 2) For nodes are we know are not planets. They are used

indirectly.

> They are samdharmi to sign lord and nakshatra lord. For natural

> nature as you have said or quoted in numerious posts Rahu is like

> Shani and Ketu like Mars. Functionally they will be more like the

> planet i.e. either sign lord or nak lord as per the points they

> receive in their BAV. For example, if Rahu is in Gemini and nak of

> punarvasu then it will represent Me and Ju. If say Ge is 3rd house

> and in 3rd house Ju gets 5 bindus and Me gets say 6 bindus then

Rahu

> will act more like Mercury.

>

> 3) With regards to your comment on Ashtakavarg not using sign

> placement is not entirely correct. If used with a proper system

the

> sign placement can give idea on quantum of result and its not used

to

> find timing of result. For timing of result Ashtakvarg, SAV and

> total strength of planets derived from SAV is good enough to time

> results effectively.

>

> Maybe knowledge of Ashtakvarg that is available in texts today is

not

> complete and may lead to confusion.

>

> Ashtakvarg system used is an effective tool in timing of events.

>

> A couple of points on Ramesh's chart.

>

> 1) In Ramesh's chart there are 2 consecutive zeroes one given by

> Venus to 7th and one by Mars to 8th.

>

> 2) Jupiter antra will be very eager to bestow authority to Ramesh

and

> also for acquisition of wealth. Between 1997/04 thru 1999/10

Ramesh

> might have been given a role of responsibility. Also a good time

to

> make investments and accumulation of wealth. Lakshami can verify

> this antra.

>

>

> Thanking you,

> Cheers !!!

> Ash

>

> vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar

<boxdel>

> wrote:

> > Dear Lakshmi,

> > I think in Ramesh's case Saturn is Lord of the 9th is it not? He

> not

> > only associates a Kendra Lord but is also is in kendra being a

> trine

> > lord. He is also Lord of Navamsha Lagna aspecting Lagna, besides

> being

> > placed in a trikona. Jupiter on the other hand is Lord of 2nd and

> 11th

> > in Navamsha and in 3rd house. I would certainly treat Saturn as

> more

> > powerful than Jupiter, even if in Lagna Jupiter appears to be

with

> > greater strength. But there too he is only a Kendra Lord in

Kendra

> > associating a trine lord. Since we are talking about 7th house

> would it

> > not be right to look at the Navamsha strengths of the planets,

> before

> > coming to conclusion about 7th house? If we look at Ashtaka Varga

> then

> > SAV would rather prove my view point as it shows 7th house with

19

> > points. Personally I give more weightage to Natal chart read with

> > Navamsha. the reason is Ashtakavarga do not consider effects of

> nodes ,

> > neither do they consider house ownership or Rasi occupation

> > weightage.Your opinion would be appreciated.

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> > lakshmi ramesh wrote:

> >

> > > Om Gurave Namah

> > >

> > > Namaste Chandrasekar ji,

> > >

> > > Even in Ramesh's case, Jupiter is in own house/moolatrikona.

> Please

> > > look at the ashtakavarga & bala of Saturn. Who is more

empowered

> to

> > > protect the house, based on both strength and functionality,

> Jupiter

> > > or Saturn? I request you to ponder on this.

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > > Lakshmi

> > >

> > >

> > > */Chandrashekhar <boxdel>/* wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Lakshmi,

> > > If I may point out, in Javed's case Guru is in own house

and

> in

> > > Ramesh's case Saturn conjuncts Guru. The dictum is Sthana

> rakshati

> > > Mandah. Guru's exception to house damage occurs when he is

in

> own

> > > house.

> > > Chandrashekhar.

> > >

> > > lakshmi ramesh wrote:

> > >

> > >> Om Gurave Namah

> > >>

> > >> Namaste Pradeep ji,

> > >>

> > >> I happen to know of individuals who have strong Guru in

4th

> and

> > >> 7th. Strong Guru in 4th has blessed the individual with

> great

> > >> knowledge, an intelligence that borders on genius and a

rare

> > >> inner harmony. That person, a devout Muslim, is one of the

> finest

> > >> individuals I have ever come across, and he is very

attached

> to

> > >> his family and mother and there are no problems what so

ever

> on

> > >> the home front. This individual is highly esteemed in his

> work

> > >> environment and has all the comforts one could desire.

> Infact,

> > >> Guru in 4th is supposed to cast sukhargala on lagna, which

is

> > >> good for the general health & happiness of the person.

> > >>

> > >> The individual with Jupiter & Saturn in 7th (Dhanus) is my

> own

> > >> dear husband. We have been very happily married for nearly

20

> > >> years. My husband has prospered remarkably after marriage.

> > >>

> > >> I am posting the charts here.

> > >>

> > >> I request that you also post the charts of the individuals

to

> > >> whom you were referring in your post, for our edification

and

> > >> discussion.

> > >>

> > >> Regards,

> > >> Lakshmi

> > >>

> > >>

> > >>

> > >> */vijayadas_pradeep <vijayadas_pradeep>/* wrote:

> > >>

> > >> Dear Chandrashekhar ji

> > >>

> > >> I have been trying to test the principles taught by you

> > >> related to

> > >> guru in various bhavas.

> > >>

> > >> When in 3rd always some difficulties for siblings.Even

> when

> > >> in own

> > >> sign and in 4th,problems for mother and at home front.

> > >>

> > >> When in 7th at marriage front.When in Lagna and not in

> own

> > >> sign some

> > >> physical weakness and health problems in childhood.

> > >>

> > >> Thus Guru tests the individual thouroughly.

> > >>

> > >> Also sages have advised that Guru is not favourable

while

> > >> transiting

> > >> kendra houses 1,4,and 10th from moon.Only the 7th

kendra

> is

> > >> beneficial.(Is there any reason for this?) Only

> 2nd,5th,7th

> > >> and 9th

> > >> are favourable.11th being good for all planets in

> general.

> > >>

> > >> Respect

> > >> Pradeep

> > >>

> > >> vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar

> > >> <boxdel>

> > >> wrote:

> > >> > Dear Anuj,

> > >> > I am glad you agree with me. As you rightly said in

> your

> > >> message

> > >> to

> > >> > Razdan,a the dictum is pretty well known to

> astrologers.

> > >> There are

> > >> many

> > >> > shlokas to that effects and charts prove the

veracity

> of the

> > >> dictum, I

> > >> > have myself posted a few of them earlier.

> > >> > Unfortunately there is a tendency to mix up terms

like

> > >> Benefic/Malefic

> > >> > with the results a planet is likely to give. This

> happens more

> > >> with

> > >> > Jupiter as people usually tend to equate it with

> Deeksha

> > >> Guru as

> > >> his

> > >> > name in Sanskrit is Guru. People tend to forget

> Parashara

> > >> telling

> > >> when

> > >> > Guru can act as Maraka and want to attribute only

good

> and

> > >> pious

> > >> > attributes to him. I prefer to keep my personal

> feelings and

> > >> prejudices

> > >> > apart from application of astrological principles.

> > >> > Take care,

> > >> > Chandrashekhar.

> > >> >

> > >> > nameisego wrote:

> > >> >

> > >> > >

> > >> > > Respected Chandrashekhar ji.

> > >> > > Please accpet my pranams as you are the senior

most

> Guru

> > >> in age

> > >> and

> > >> > > experience in this group.

> > >> > > Your observation about Guru is absolutely right.

> > >> > > Self had posted in this group and elsewhere an

> article on "

> > >> > > "Guru Boon or Bane??" some time back where it was

> shown

> > >> Guru's

> > >> > > position in various houses which had been

> > >> destroyed/troubled by

> > >> Guru.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > "Bhava Nasha Karo Jeeva

> > >> > > Bhava Vriddhhi karau Shanih"

> > >> > > This Dictum had been proved by self.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > You may (Mr.Razdan) go thro' older postings and

read

> for

> > >> yourself and

> > >> > > check the examples that were given.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > Difference between Jupiter and saturn is, Jupiter

> sucks the

> > >> goodness

> > >> > > of a house and gives fruit to houses it aspects.

> Saturn

> > >> sucks the

> > >> > > houses he aspects and increases the house it

> occupies.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > Tatvam-Asi

> > >> > >

> > >> > >

> > >> > >

> > >> > >

> > >> > >

> > >> > >

> > >> > > vedic astrology, PNRazdan

> > >> <pnrazdan>

> > >> > > wrote:

> > >> > > > Dear Chandrashekhar,

> > >> > > > You seem to be extending your arguments against

> Jupiter

> > >> still

> > >> > > further.

> > >> > > > Firstly you said that Jup is ashub in houses it

is

> a

> > >> designated as a

> > >> > > > Karka like 2,5,9,10 and 11 based on the

principle

> of

> > >> "Karka

> > >> Bhavo

> > >> > > Nasa"

> > >> > > > . Now you say that it will harm every house it is

> > >> placed in.

> > >> Why

> > >> > > this

> > >> > > > animosity with Jup, the hope of millions

believing

> in Vedic

> > >> > > Astrology

> > >> > > > (in lighter vein).

> > >> > > >

> > >> > > > You refer to some dictum of a sage, source was

not

> > >> given by

> > >> you. But

> > >> > > > take out any basic book on ancient astrology. It

> always

> > >> speaks

> > >> of

> > >> > > the

> > >> > > > benefic qualities of Jupiter. Somewhere it is

even

> > >> said, that

> > >> > > howsoever

> > >> > > > bad it may be placed in, it will still try to

help

> the

> > >> subject. And

> > >> > > > this has been amply proved by our experience.

> > >> > > > I am afraid. you will have to do some more

> hardwork for

> > >> convincing

> > >> > > all

> > >> > > > about your notions of Jupiter, the heavenly

> Brahiman. This

> > >> would

> > >> > > even

> > >> > > > mean a paradigm shift in Vedic Astrology.

> > >> > > > Pran Razdan

> > >> > > >

> > >> > > > --- Chandrashekhar <boxdel> wrote:

> > >> > > >

> > >> > > > > Dear Prafulla,

> > >> > > > > Reference to Leo was in connection with what

> > >> Shubhangi had

> > >> asked.

> > >> > > > > Jupiter harming the house he is placed in is a

> dictum

> > >> given

> > >> by

> > >> > > sages

> > >> > > > > and

> > >> > > > > there is no reason to try to find out the

> reason. If one

> > >> wants to

> > >> > > > > find

> > >> > > > > the reason about Leo, consider this in natural

> zodiac

> > >> Leo is

> > >> in

> > >> > > 5th

> > >> > > > > house whose occupation by Jupiter leads to

> Karaka Bhava

> > >> Dasha. In

> > >> > > > > 11th

> > >> > > > > all planets are Shubha so it is not only

Jupiter

> who is

> > >> Shubha

> > >> > > there.

> > >> > > > >

> > >> > > > > Disha strength is one amongst many strengths

> > >> considered but

> > >> not

> > >> > > as

> > >> > > > > strong as Digbala and Jupiter gets that in

Lagna.

> > >> > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > >> > > > >

> > >> > > > > Prafulla Gang wrote:

> > >> > > > >

> > >> > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji

> > >> > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > In my humble view, (Jupiter may not be

> preferred in

> > >> Leo for

> > >> > > > > Muhurta,

> > >> > > > > > I do not know much about muhurta related

> > >> configurations),It may

> > >> > > not

> > >> > > > > > become weak in terms of Bala necessarily

> (generally

> > >> speaking).

> > >> > > In

> > >> > > > > > fact, jupiter in 3rd house in Libra is

> considered bad.

> > >> > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > Jupiter in 11th house (any sign) will have

> directional

> > >> strength

> > >> > > to

> > >> > > > > > initiate for results.

> > >> > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > There must be more than this reason, for

> jupiter to

> > >> give

> > >> > > negative

> > >> > > > > > results.

> > >> > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > regards/Prafulla Gang

> > >> > > > > >

> > >> > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > vedic astrology,

> Chandrashekhar

> > >> > > > > <boxdel>

> > >> > > > > > wrote:

> > >> > > > > > > Dear Shubhangi,

> > >> > > > > > > Being an Indian you must know that Jupiter

> looses his

> > >> > > strength in

> > >> > > > > > Leo

> > >> > > > > > > and that is why there are no Muhurtas for

> > >> marriages when

> > >> > > Jupiter

> > >> > > > > > > occupies Leo or what is called as

Simhastha.

> That

> > >> is due

> > >> to

> > >> > > the

> > >> > > > > > fact of

> > >> > > > > > > Guru lacking Bala. In your brother's case

Sun

> > >> being in

> > >> own

> > >> > > Rasi

> > >> > > > > > makes

> > >> > > > > > > him Shubha and therefore good relations

with

> > >> Father. But

> > >> I

> > >> > > would

> > >> > > > > > say he

> > >> > > > > > > would not follow father's profession.

> > >> > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > >> > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > Shubhangi Naik wrote:

> > >> > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > >Dear Sir,

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > >Sorry for intervening in your session,

but

> I am

> > >> curious

> > >> to

> > >> > > know

> > >> > > > > > the logic behind jupiter losing its strength

> in leo

> > >> and

> > >> hence

> > >> > > this

> > >> > > > > > email.

> > >> > > > > > > >Yes, your dictum worked in my brother's

> case also.

> > >> > > > > > > >My brother has sun+jup in leo but in 8th,

no

> > >> doubt he

> > >> is very

> > >> > > > > > intelligent but did not do much well in

> academics

> > >> and yes,

> > >> he

> > >> > > did

> > >> > > > > > fail once in his 10th class.

> > >> > > > > > > >With my half knowledge I thought the

reason

> to

> > >> be the

> > >> > > > > positioning

> > >> > > > > > of both the planets in 8th, but now curious

to

> know

> > >> why jup

> > >> > > losses

> > >> > > > > > strength in leo.

> > >> > > > > > > >But though both planets are positioned in

> 8th, both

> > >> father

> > >> > > and

> > >> > > > > > son shares good relation with each other.

> > >> > > > > > > >Thanks,

> > >> > > > > > > >Shubhangi

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > >On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 Chandrashekhar wrote :

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > >>Dear Dhira,

> > >> > > > > > > >>There you see the dictum working. Is it

> not?

> > >> > > > > > > >>Regards,

> > >> > > > > > > >>Chandrashekhar.

> > >> > > > > > > >>

> > >&

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Take Mail with you! Get it on your mobile phone.

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Hello Noname,

Thanks for the correction. It was a typo.

A very nice chart. Chart has blessing of Guru/Father.

Cheers !!!

Ash

 

 

vedic astrology, "nameisego" <nameisego>

wrote:

>

>

> Hello Ash,

> Correction.

> Self's grand father was a great personality honoured by all

> shankaracharyas and governments .

> But his father did not even know any stotra except sandhya vandanam

> and he never new astrology.

> He was a simple minded trader all his life.

> Rgds

> Tatvam-Asi

>

> Grandfather

> 15th December 1892

> 1.22 PM

> Rajkot (Near)

> India

> Lived till age 95

>

>

>

> vedic astrology, Ash <ashsam73> wrote:

> > Dear Chandrashekhar,

> >

> > The fact still remains. The BAV scheme given by Parasara is

> different from Varharamira. This is one point and this is

factual.

> One of them is corrupt. I am saying the scheme Parasara has given

> has become corrupt over time. The scheme Varharmira has given has

> been preserved in time. The two schemes cannot be different.

> >

> > I am not clear to which point you are alluding when you say that

my

> information about Parasara and Varharmira is not factual. The BAV

> scheme given by Parasara is different from Varharamira. This was

> visible in Ramesh's chart when you said using parasarsa BAV scheme

> when 7th bhava got 19 bindus and using Varharmiras BAV scheme it

> comes to 20. I am not going into other books. The point that I am

> emphasising is that BAV scheme given by Parasara or Varharmira or

any

> other maharishi cannot be different.

> >

> > Ashtakvarga has been commented on by many maharishis as you have

> given but the system of timing of events using Ashtakavarga is not

> given which I beleive was a part of Vedic Astrology was saved with

> some families and not known to the world.

> >

> > About the part with which the discussion started is what I agree

> with you. There is a part of what Noname is also saying that I

agree

> with however I beleive that Guru spoils the house its placed in due

> to its aspect on primary significator houses. By saying Spoilt I

> mean it will not give the result in his antra. Also Guru is

> generally with more than 5 bindus. Rarely its with < 4 bindus.

The

> more powerful Guru is the more damage it will do by its aspect.

For

> Libra lagna and Cancer lagna Guru is 6th lord and will be very

> malefic.

> >

> > In the chart given by No Names grand father also he commented

that

> his grand father has Guru in lagna who is powerful and he took

> sansaya after early widohood. Again here a powerful guru is

showing

> its malefic aspect on 7th house. Again guru in lagna made no names

> father a famous and person as he was known for his knowledge on

> samaveda. Noname has not commented on the effect it had on 9th and

> 5th house but if his guru is very powerful. I am also not aware

what

> the lagna is but this can be the sign of a powerful guru in lagna.

> >

> > Thanking you,

> > Cheers !!!

> > Ash

> >

> >

> > Chandrashekhar <boxdel> wrote:

> > Dear Ash,

> > It is good that you at least agree that "GURU ALWAYS ASPECTS 5TH

> HOUSE FROM THE HOUSE ITS PLACED IN AND ITS A PRIMARY SIGNIFICATOR

> HOUSE SO GURU WILL NOT GIVE RESULT FOR THE HOUSE ITS PLACED IN

> GENERALLY."

> > This is the point from which the original discussions started.

> >

> > For your information much detailed interpretation of events

(Beyond

> what is explained in BPHS,a although based on the principles

therein)

> by Ashtakavarga is available in Phaladeepika, Jataka Parijata,

> Jatakadesh Marg and umpteen other astrological texts. So your

> information about only Parashara and Varaha Mihira is not factual.

> > Regards,

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> >

> > Ash wrote:

> > Dear Chandrashekhar,

> >

> > My answers in CAPS.

> >

> >

> > Chandrashekhar <boxdel> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Ash,

> > Ashtakavarga system is based on Bindus allotted to particular

> houses for each of the planet with respect to its position from the

> planet whose Ashtakavarga is being drawn.

> >

> > ASH : YES AGREED.

> >

> >

> > The system you are using is based on considering the strengths of

> planets and the Bhavas too. This is the system generally referred

as

> Parashari or more precisely Hora system which also encompasses the

> Ashtakavarga system.

> >

> > ASH : ASHTAKVARGA IS A PART AND PARCLE OF VEDIC ASTROLOGY AND

THAT

> IS WHAT I HAVE ALSO SAID. I HAVE SAID THAT THE SYSTEM TO TIME

EVENTS

> IS NOT GIVEN IN TEXTS AVAILABLE TODAY. REST CLARIFICAITON BELOW.

> >

> > Ashtakavarga is primarily used to find out effects from Transit

of

> planets and longevity as made clear in conversation between

Maitreya

> and sage Parashara in BPHS. Ashtakavarga system is clearly defined

in

> that text.

> >

> > ASH : THIS IS WHAT THE MISCONCEPTION IS. BASED ON THE TEXTS

> AVAILABLE TODAY. DO YOU REALLY THINK THAT ASHTAKVARG IS USED ONLY

> FOR FINDING OUT TRANSIT. IS THAT WHY PARASARA HAS SAID THAT TO USE

> ASHTAKAVARGA FOR INTELLECUTAL PYGMIES OF KALIYUGA ? I DO NOT THINK

> SO SIR. THE SYSTEM OF ASHTAKVARGA IS VERY DETAILED AND KAS AND

> VERSES OF ASHTAKAVARGA HAVE BEEN BROUGHT FORWARD BY KRUSHNAJI WHICH

> ARE NOT FOUND IN ANY BOOK TODAY. IF YOU CLAIM THAT BHPS IS

COMPLETE

> AND THAT ALL THAT IS AVAILABLE ABOUT ASHTAKVARGA IS FOUND AND CODED

> AND THERE IS NO CORRUPTION THEN I WILL NOT INDULGE YOU ANY

FURTHER.

> >

> > No doubt the system can be adopted to various other predictions,

as

> it indicates influences on various bhavas. Its various uses have

been

> well documented in numerous texts besides BPHS and the very short

> description of Varahamihira. The assumption that its use is not

> mentioned for different uses in any other text but the two you

> mentioned is not factually correct.

> >

> > ASH : THE SYSTEM TO TIME EVENTS USING ASHTAKVARGA IS NOT GIVEN

> CLEARLY IS IN ANY TEXTS. THAT IS WHAT I AM SAYING.

> >

> > Krushna has developed different parameters and as long as the

> system delivers results there should be no issue with that.

> >

> > ASH : HERE I WANT TO POINT OUT THAT KRUSHNAJI HAS NOT DEVELOPED

> DIFFERENT PARAMETERS AND THIS SYSTEM. HE HAD BROUGHT IT FORWARD.

> THIS SYSTEM WAS KEPT IN FAMILY OF HIS GURU AND THAT WAS TRANSMITTED

> FROM FATHER TO SON. KRUSHNAJI WANTED THIS SYSTEM TO REMAIN IN THIS

> WORLD. THIS SYSTEM MUST HAVE BEEN IN HIS GURUS LINEAGE FOR

> CENTURIES. IF ONE UNDERSTANDS THIS SYSTEM TO TIME EVENTS MAYBE

WHAT

> AND WHY I AM INDULDING YOU IN THIS THREAD WILL BECOME CLEAR.

> >

> > It is easy to say that Parashara and Varahamihira's texts are

> corrupted, and they could be. But that does not prove that the

bindus

> used are wrong especially as most of other parameters that you

> mention are drawn from these very texts.

> >

> > ASH : THE SYSTEM OF TIMING OF EVENTS USING ASHTAKAVARGA IS NOT

> DIFFERENT FROM VEDIC ASTROLOGY. INFACT VEDIC ASTROLOGY IS MADE

CLEAR

> WITH THE PROPER USE OF ASHTAKAVARGA AND KAS. I DO NOT THINK

PARASARA

> LIGHTLY MENTIONED THE USE OF ASHTAKAVARGA FOR US PEOPLE IN KALI

> YUGA. A LOT OF ASHTAKVARGA AND SANSKRIT SHLOKAS HAVE BEEN LOST.

> THIS IS WHAT I AM SAYING OR KEPT WITH FAMILES TILL SOMEONE LIKE

> KRUSHNAJI COMES ALONG AND BRINGS SUCH TECHNIQUES FORWARD. ITS A

BIG

> CREDIT TO KRUSHNAJI FOR BRINGING FORWARD THIS SYSTEM WITH HAS MADE

> TIMING OF EVENTS SO EASY.

> >

> > It is well known that Varaha Mihira was influenced by Greek

> astrologers and has adopted some of their methods, so the bindus

that

> he attributes could also have come from them.

> >

> > ASH : ONE THING. BAV IS BAV AND BASIC SCHEME SHOUL.D BE SAME.

> ONLY IN BAV OF MOON AND VENUS THERE IS A DIFFERENCE. PARASARA AND

> VARHARMIRA CANNOT HAVE DIFFERENT OPINIONS. EITHER PARASARA'S

SCHEME

> IS CORRUPT OR VARHARMIRAS'S. AT THE END OF THE DAY BOTH MUST

MATCH.

> SO ITS INFACT QUITE EASY TO SAY THAT EITHER PARSARAS OR VARHARMIRAS

> BAV IS CORRPUT. I AM CONFIDENT THAT VARHRMAIRAS HAS REMAINED IN

TACT

> OVER THE CENTURIES AND PARASARAS BAV SCHME IS CORRPUT. IN ANY CASE

I

> WILL GO BY WHAT KRUSHNAJI HAS TAUGHT ME AS THIS SYSTEM WAS KEPT IN

> HIS GURUS FAMILY AND HE HAS USED THAT FOR DECADES WITH CORRECT

> PREDICTIONS. SO ITS TIME TESTED BY HIS GURUS LINEAGE. I AM IN NO

> POSITION TO MAKE ANY JUDGEMENT BUT CAN SAY THAT I AM USNIG

> VARHARMIRAS SCHEME.

> >

> > Since you give equal importance to Navamsha and Rasi whereas I go

> by the old time system of planetary strength being derived from

> Navamsha, it might not be possible for you to follow my meaning and

> reasons behind attributing more strength to Saturn over Jupiter.

> >

> > ASH : I AM FINDING STRENGTH USING ASHTAKVARGA BUT FOR EACH PLANET

> AND FOR EACH HOUSE. YOU ARE ALSO TRYING TO FIND THE STRENGH BUT I

AM

> NOT CLEAR WHEN YOU SAY SHANI IS STRONGER THAN GURU BUT FOR WHAT ?

IS

> IT FOR EVENT OR ALL 12 HOUSES ? JUST SAYING STRONGER IS VERY

> GENERAL. IF I WERE TO ASK YOU IS SHANI STRONGER THAN GURU FOR 4TH

> HOUSE OR 10TH HOUSE. THIS IS HOW I AM SEETNG THINGS. AS PER THE

> WORKSHEET STRENGTH GURU IS FAR BETTER FOR 10TH HOUSE AS COMPARED TO

> SHANI HOWEVER SHANI IS FAR STRONGER THAN GURU FOR 4TH HOUSE

MATTERS.

> >

> > The question of strength of the two planets was raised by Lakshmi

> and I was responding to that. I so far as influence over all 12

Rasis

> comment is concerned, Vedic astrology does think that planets have

> influence over all Bhavas and other planets and the way the results

> would manifest depend on their mutual relation.

> >

> > ASH : EXACTLY. HERE IN LIES THE ESSENCE OF WHAT I WAS SAYING OR

> TRYING TO SAY FOR SO LONG. THE BEAUTY OF IS THAT SAV ALREADY TAKES

> CARE OF MUTUAL RELATIONS SO IT BECOMES IMPERATIVE THAT BAV IS

> ACCURATE AS SAV AS U KNOW IS DERIVED FROM BAV. THAT WAS MY COMMENT

> ON COMPOUNDING OF ERRORS. THIS IS WHY WHEN YOU SAY THAT SHANI IS

> STRONGER THAN GURU CONFUSES ME BECAUSE YES FOR 4TH HOUSE SHANI IS

> STRONGER THAN GURU BUT NOT FOR 10TH HOUSE. HERE I AM BEING VERY

> SPECIFIC. SO ARE YOU SAYING THAT YOUR COMMENT ON SHANI BEING

> STRONGER THAN GURU WAS CONSIDERING ALL 12 HOUSES AND THE MUTUAL

> PLACMENT FOR ALL PLANETS WITH RESPECT TO EACH OTHER ? IF SO THEN I

> AM VERY SURE THAT YOU WILL COME TO THE SAME CONCLUSION USING

WHATEVER

> WAY YOU USE TO FIND THE STRENGH OF SHANI AND GURU I.E NAVAMSA, D

> CHARTS OR YOGAS ETC WITH WHAT I HAVE SHOWN IN THE WORKSHEET. THEN

IF

> YOU COMPARE SHANI AND GURU FOR EACH HOUSE WE WILL HAVE A MORE

> STRONGER BASIS FOR COMPARISION. BUT STILL JUST USING THE WORD

> STRONGER I AM

> > NOT CLEAR OR AM NOT FOLLOWING. THE QUETSIONS THAT COMES TO MY

> MIND .. STRONGER FOR WHAT OR WHICH HOUSE OR WHICH EVENT ?

> >

> > About not considering Navamsha strength, I am not able to follow

> what you are saying. On the one hand you say that these being equal

> you do not consider Navamsha in worksheet and that you only use

> Navamsha to find samdharmi and on the other hand you say that my

> contention is not correct.

> >

> >

> > ASH : RASI AND NAVAMSA HAVE EQUAL STATUS AS PER THE TEACHINGS OF

> KAS. NAVAMSA IS DERIVED FROM RASI. FOR THE STRENGH AND WORKSHEET

> ONLY RASI IS NEEDED. IF IN CASE OF DOUBT YOU CAN GO INTO D-CHARTS

> AND FIND OUT FROM THAT. I HAVE DEMONTRATED WITH AN EXAMPLE OF

> RAMESH'S MARRIAGE. I WOULD HOPE THAT LAKSHMI WOULD COMMENT ON THIS

> PART. I HAVE NOT SAID THAT YOU ARE NOT CORRECT. YOU ARE TRYING TO

> FIND THE STRENGTH ALSO FROM NAVAMSA. AS PER KAS I FIND THE

STRENGTH

> FROM WORKSHEET WHICH IS FROM RASHI. FOR D-CHARTS I CAST WORKSHEET

> BUT ONLY PRIMARY SIGNIFICATOR HOUSE. WE DO NOT CONSIDER ASPECTS

> PART. SO ONLY TOP PORTION OF WORKSHEET IS USED. WE BOTH ARE

> FINDING STRENGTH AND I AM USING AV FROM RASI AND YOU ARE PROBABLY

> USING RASI/NAVAMSA/D CHARTS ETC AND SIGN PLACEMENT TO FIND OUT THE

> STRENGTH.

> >

> > Again you are talking about timing of events and the original

> thread is about Guru's capacity to harm the house occupied by it.

> >

> > ASH : FOR ME THIS IS NOT A MATTER OF QUESTION. AS PER KRUSHNAS

> ASHTAKAVARGA SYSTEM PLANETS THAT ASPECT PRIMARY SIGNIFICATOR HOUSES

> I.E. 8TH FROM HOUSE UNDER FOCUS, 5TH FROM HOUSE UNDER FOCUS AND

HOUSE

> UNDER FOCUS FOR EXAMPLE FOR READERS IF YOU ARE TIMING MARRIAGE THEN

> 2ND, 7TH AND 11TH AND IF ANY PLANET HAS ASPECT ON THESE HOUSES THEN

> THEY WILL NOT GIVE RESULT IN THEIR ANTRA BUT THEIR SAMDHARMI WILL

> GIVE RESULT AND THE EXCEPTION IS THAT IF THE PLANET IS LORD OF 10TH

> FROM HOUSE UNDER FOCUS OR 6TH THEN IT WILL GIVE.

> >

> > GURU ALWAYS ASPECTS 5TH HOUSE FROM THE HOUSE ITS PLACED IN AND

ITS

> A PRIMARY SIGNIFICATOR HOUSE SO GURU WILL NOT GIVE RESULT FOR THE

> HOUSE ITS PLACED IN GENERALLY. ONLY EXCEPTION IS THAT IF GURU IS

IN

> PISCES SO SUCH A GURU WILL GIVE THE RESULT OF TIMING OF EVENT.

> SIMILARLY FOR MARS. I THINK ALSO SOMETHING SIMILAR IS SAID FOR

MARS

> AS PER VEDIC TEXTS. MARS ASPECTS 8TH HOUSE FROM THE HOUSE ITS

PLACED

> IN AND 8TH HOUSE SO AS PER VEDIC TEXTS ITS ALSO SAID THAT MARS

SPOILS

> THE HOUSE ITS PLACED IN. FOR SHANI IT DOES NOT ASPECT ANY OF THE

> SIGNIFICATOR HOUSES WHEREEVER ITS PLACED SO ITS NOT SAID TO SPOIL

THE

> HOUSE AND WILL DELIVER THE RESULT IF IT HAS POWER AS PER

WORKSHEET.

> SO IT MAY HAVE BEEN NOTED IN TEXTS AS JU SPOILS THE HOUSE IT IS

> PLACED IN AND SHANI DOES NOT. MARS ALSO CAN BE SAID TO SPOIL THE

> HOUSE IT IS IN HOWEVER THE EXCEPTIONS FOR ALL IS IF THE SAME PLANET

> ALSO RULES 10TH AND 6TH FROM THE HOUSE ITS PLACED IN IT WILL GIVE

THE

> RESULT. THIS CAN BE CHECKED AND I AM SURE IT WILL

> > VALIDATE WITH YOUR EXCEPTIONS.

> >

> > SO I AM NOT TAKING PART IN THE DISCUSSION AS FOR ME PERSONALLY

> THERE IS NOTHING TO DISCUSS. THE BASICS OF SUCH THINGS ARE CRYSTAL

> CLEAR AND CONSIDERED BY THE RULES OF KRUSHNAS ASHTAVARGA SYSTEM. I

> AM VERY GLAD HOWEVER TO SEE THAT YOU HAVE BROUGHT UP THIS TOPIC.

> >

> > ANOTHER THING, GURU IS A HYOCRATIC PLANET. WHENEVER ONE TRIES TO

> POTRAY GURU AS BAD THERE WILL BE RESISTANCE. THIS IS THE POWER OF

> GURU. I AM SITTING BACK AND READING WITH INTEREST AND SEEING THE

> MAYA GURU CREATES. FUNNY ITS EASIER TO BLAME SHANI FOR THINGS AND

> POTRAY IT AS BAD BUT INFACT ITS SHANI WHO IS THE PLANET OF TRUTH.

> >

> > SUCH THIGNS ARE HARD FOR PEOPLE TO DIGEST AND YOU ARE GETTING SO

> MUCH OF EXPLAINING TO DO. THIS ITSELF PROVES MY POINT AND YOUR

POINT

> ALSO.

> >

> > Anyway let us await Lakshmi's comment about your observation on

> Mercury Antar, though this is not part of the original discussions.

> >

> > ASH : YES, IT WILL BE NICE IF LAKSHMI CAN COMMENT ON THE MARRIAGE

> OF RAMESH IF IT HAPPENED IN MERCURY ANTRA AS PER KAY. IF THE DATE

IS

> GIVEN IT WILL BE BETTER. THIS WILL PROVE THE POWER OF THE PLANET

AS

> PER WORKSHEET TO DELIVER THE RESULTS AFTER FINDING OUT THE DELAY

FROM

> RASHI AND NAVAMSA AS BOTH HAVE SIMILAR STATUS AS PER KAS.

> >

> >

> >

> > THANK YOU FOR THIS DICUSSION,

> >

> > CHEERS !!!

> >

> > ASH

> >

> >

> > Regards,

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> > Ash wrote:

> >

> > Dear Chandrashekhar,

> > My answers in CAPS below.

> >

> >

> > Chandrashekhar <boxdel> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Ash,

> > I forgot that you are using Krushna's Ashtakavarga system. In

that

> case you must be using Krushna's Ayanamsha. The system you are

using

> is a combination of Ashtakavarga and traditional Graha Bhava Bala

> system.

> >

> > ASH : THE SYSTEM I USE IS KRUSHNAS ASHTAKVARG AND ITS PART OF

VEDIC

> ASTROLOGY. I DONT KNOW WHAT U MEAN BY GRAHA BHAVA BALA SYSTEM. IN

> SHORT WE CAN COMPUTE THE STRENGTH OF EACH PLANET FOR EACH AND EVERY

> HOUSE AND ALSO FOR ALL 16 D CHARTS. SO ITS VEDIC ASTROLOGY ONLY

AND

> NOT DIFFERENT. AS PER KAS WE DO NOT TALK IN GENERAL TERMS AS SHANI

> IS STRONG OR WEAK BUT WE CAN GO INTO DETAILS AS PER POINTS AND FIND

> OUT HOW A PLANET WILL ACT FOR EACH HOUSE. IN MOST CASES PLANETS DO

> NOT ACT BAD FOR ALL HOUSES. IN SHANI ANTRA AS PER RAMESH'S CHART

IT

> WILL BE GOOD FOR 4TH HOUSE MATTERS AS COMPARED TO GURU'S ANTRA FOR

> 4TH HOUSE MATTERS AT THE SAME TIME FOR 10TH HOUSE MATTESR GURU WILL

> BE MUCH STRONGER THAN SHANI AS YOU CAN SEE AS PER POINTS. ABOUT

> NAVAMSA I SHALL COMMENT BELOW.

> >

> >

> >

> > There is no harm in using it as long as results come true.

However

> it is not a different Ashtakavarga system per se.

> >

> > ASH : ASHTAKVARG IS ASHTAKVARG AND HOW TO USE IT IS NOT GIVEN

> CLEARLY IN ANY TEXTS. PEOPLE ARE UNDER THE IMPRESSION BASED ON

> CURRENT TEXTS THAT ITS USED TO TIME DEATH OR ITS USE IS LIMITED TO

> TRANSITS WHICH IS NOT CORRECT. THAT HAS ALWAYS BEEN WHAT I TRY TO

> SAY AND EXPLAIN WHEN PEOPLE COMMENT ON ASHTAKVARGA AND ITS USED

ONLY

> IN TRANSITS. THE WHOLE SYSTEM IN WHICH ITS USED TO TIME EVENTS IS

> NOT WRITTEN IN ANY BOOK OR CLASSICS DESPITE MANY MAHARISHIS LIKE

> PARASARA, VARHARAMIRA ETC HAVE ALL MENTIONED ASHTAKVARGA IN THEIR

> TEXTS.

> >

> > I was talking about a different Ashtakavarga system that you had

> suggested exists.

> >

> > ASH : I HAVE NOT SUGGESTED ANYTHING OF THAT KIND. KRUSHNAS

> ASHTAKVARGA SYSTEM IS A SYSTEM IN WHICH WE USE ASHTAKVARGA TO FIND

> THE STRENGTH OF EACH PLANET FOR EACH HOUSE. I DO NOT THINK THERE

IS

> ANY SYSTEM OUT THERE THAT DOES THAT. RESULTS CAN BE SEEN AT A

> GLANCE. FOR EXAMPLE RAMESHS MARRIAGE MIGHT HAVE HAPPENED DURING

> MERCURY ANTRA. MERCURY HAS THE HIGHEST STRENGTH IN THE CHART FOR

7TH

> HOUSE. AND IS LOD OR 10TH LORD FROM 7TH HOUSE. MAHADAHSA CAN BE

THAT

> OF SHANI. SHANI IS SAMDHARMI TO NAKTURAL KARAK VENUS OF MARRIAGE.

> SO SHANI MD/ MERCURY AD CAN GIVE MARRIAGE. THERE ARE 2 ZEROES IN

BAV

> ONE DUE TO VENUS AND OTHER DUE TO MARS AND MERCURY SO RESULT WILL

BE

> IN LAST SECTOR OF MERCURY ANTRA. MERCURY ANTRA RUNS IN SHANI MD

RUNS

> FROM 1983/11 THRU 1986/JULY. 3RD SECTOR STARTS 1985/07 THRU

> 1986/07. I AM NOT GOING FURTHER. IF THIS IS IN THE BALL PARK ITS

> GOOD AND ONE CAN NARROW IT DOWN FURTHER WITH SUNS TRANSIT OVER

STRONG

> SIGNIFICATORS FOR 7TH HOUSE AS PER THE WORKSHEET POINTS.

> > MAYBE LAKSHMI CAN VERIFY WHEN HER MARRIAGE TOOK PLACE WITH

RAMESH.

> >

> > Varahamihira does have a slightly different bindu placement no

> doubt yet it is only different by way of allowing Lagna to have one

> more bindu of influence for some planet's Ashtakavarga. So it

might

> not mean that other planet is getting a bindu less.

> >

> > ASH : THERE IS A BIG DIFFERENCE BETWEEN WHAT SCHEME THAT IS IN

> TEXTS TODAY AVAILABLE GIVEN AS PER PARASARA AND WHATS GIVEN OR

> PRESERVED FROM VARHARAMIRA. BOTH ARE GREAT SAGES AND THEIR BAV

> SCHEMES MUST BE SAME. PARASARAS HAS BEEN CORRPUT OVER TIME. THE

> DIFFERENCES IN IN BAV FOR MOONS PLACMENT FROM MOON AND GURU AND

VENUS

> FROM MARS. THIS HAS VERY DEEP MEANING AND SAYING FOR EXAMPLE IF

> VENUS GETS POWER IF IN 4TH FROM MARS AND IF VENUS IS NOT GETTING

> POWER OR A BINDU IF IN 4TH FROM MARS HAS A BIG DIFFERENCE. THERE

ARE

> ONLY 337 POINTS AND IT WOULD MEAN THAT IF AS IN THE CASE OF

RAMESHES

> CHART IF HIS 7TH BHAVA GETS 19TH IT MEANS THAT THAT 1 BINDU OF FROM

> THE POOL OF 337 HAS GONE TO SOME OTHER HOUSE. IF A PLANET IS IN

THAT

> HOUSE IT MAY GET 1 BINDU MORE STRENGTH AND IT MAY CHANGE THE ENTIRE

> CHART. IF THAT PLANET IS IN 4TH FROM A MALEFIC PLANET (BY MALEFIC

I

> MEAN A PLANET WITH < 4 BINDUS EXCEPT MOON) AND IF THAT PLANET WERE

TO

> GET STRNGTH THEN THAT PLANET WOULD BECOME VERY STRONG FOR

> > ALL 12 HOUSES. THAT WOULD CHANGE THE ENTIRE COMPLEXION OF THE

> CHART. WITH ASKTAVARG WE ARE VERY PARTICULAR AND THIS IS NOT A

> TRIVIAL MATTER. 1 BINDUS CAN MAKE A HUGE DIFFERENCE.

> >

> > I said 19 Bindus as the chart sent by Dear Lakshmi was in that

> format. Varahamihira has exactly 8 shlokas on Ashtakavarga and his

is

> not a different system. He only has a different opinion about which

> places are influenced by Lagna in case of some of the planets.

> Parashara has, on the other hand, exhaustively dealt with

> Ashtakavarga.

> >

> > ASH : THIS IS NOT TRUE. BAV SCHEMES HAVE TO MATCH. I DONT

> UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU ARE SAYING BY SYSTEMS. THE CORE AND BASIC OF

> ASHTAKVARG SYSTEM IS THE BAV POINTS. IF PARASARA IS SAYING THAT

MOON

> IS NOT GIVING STRENGTH TO 9TH BHAVA WHEAREAS VARHARAMIRA IS SAYING

IT

> DOES. THIS IS HUGE DIFFERECE OUT HERE. SIMILARLY MOON IS BENEFIC

IN

> 2ND FROM GURU AND VARHARAMIRA IS SAYING THAT 1 BINDUS STRENGTH IS

NOT

> GIVEN. THIS IS THE BASIC. YOU JUST CANNOT SAY THAT THE DIFFERENCE

> OF OPINION IS "ONLY". THIS CHANGES EVERYTHING. IMAGINE A SYSTEM

> THAT IS USED ACCURATELY FOR TIMING OF EVENTS THE SAV VALUES FROM

> WHICH THE STRENGTH OF ALL PLANEST AND FOR EACH AND EVERY HOUSE IS

> COMPUTED AND ITS BASED ON SAV AND SAV IS BASED ON BAV. IN THE

LEAST

> WHAT YOU ARE SAYING MIGHT SURMOUNT TO COMPOUNDING OF ERROR.

ACTUALLY

> IF YOU STUDY HOW ONE COMES TO THE POINTS THAT I HAVE DISPLAYED IN

MY

> PREVIOUS MAILS YOU WILL BEGIN TO UNDERSTAND WHY I AM SO PICKY WITH

> THIS DISTRIBUTION OF BAV AND STICKING TO

> > VARHARAMIRA. IF WE DIFFER ON THIS VIEW WE CAN AGREE TO DISAGREE.

> >

> > I have already given the reason I think Saturn is stronger than

> Guru in reply to Lakshmi.

> >

> > ASH : YES, I DID READ YOUR INTERSTING COMMENT BUT I WAS NOT CLEAR

> ON WHAT YOU MEANT BY STRONGER. STRONGER FOR WHAT EVENTS ? DID U

> MEAN STRONGER FOR DELIVERING RESULTS OR ALL 12 HOUSES. CAN YOU BE

> MORE SPECIFIC. WHEN I GAVE THE POINTS I AM BEING VERY SPECIFIC AND

> COMPARING GURU WITH SHANI FOR ALL 12 HOUSES. I AM BEING SPECIFIC

IN

> SAYING THAT IN GURU ANTRA RAMESH WILL HAVE MORE AUTHORITY AS

COMPARED

> TO SHANI. GURU IS IN UPCAHYA FROM 10TH HOUSE AND WITH 5 BINDUS.

SO

> ITS VERY EAGER TO GIVE 2ND AND 10TH HOUSE MATTERS. SHANI IS EAGER

TO

> GIVE RESULTS FOR 12TH, 4TH, 11TH, AND 3RD HOUSE IN ITS ANTRA. CAN

> YOU BE MORE SPECIFIC. I DO NOT THINK SHANI IS BAD FOR EACH AND

EVERY

> HOUSE AND NEITHER IS GURU IN HIS ANTRA. AGAIN I AM RESTRICTING THE

> RESULTS TO THE ANTRA. I THINK IF U ARE MORE SPECIFIC THEN WE MIGHT

> BE SAYING THE SAME THING BUT FROM A DIFFERENT VIEW POINT.

> >

> > The reason it is not reflected in the table given by you is,as

you

> have indicated Navamsha strength of planets is not considered in

the

> system you are using.

> >

> > ASH : THIS IS INCORRECT. THE STRENGTH IS DERIVED FROM RASHI AND

> THE WORKSHEET POINTS ARE FROM RASHI ONLY. NAVAMSA HAS EQUAL STATUS

> AS COMPARED TO RASHI. WE USE NAVAMSA FOR FINDING OUT THE

SAMDHARMIS

> AND ALSO DELAY. ALL COMBINATIONS HAVE TO BE CHECKED FROM BOTH RASI

> AND NAVAMSA. BUT FOR FINDING OUT THE STRENGH OF PLANET ITS DONE

FROM

> RASI. A WORKSHEET FOR EACH DIVISIONAL CHART IS ALSO CASTED.

> >

> > Using Krushna's Ayanamsha the Navamsha placement of planets could

> also change. If you apply the strength from Navamsha as given in

the

> chart provided by Lakshmi, you will see my view point.

> >

> > ASH : IT WILL NOT CHANGE THINGS. I CHECKED AFTER READING THIS

> COMMENT. IN BOTH CASES USING KRUSHNAS AYANAMSA AND LAHIRI SHANI

> REMAINS IN LIBRA IN NAVAMSA SO ITS SAMDHARMI TO VENUS. IT WILL

> REPLACE VENUS FOR THE HOUSE THAT VENUS IS UNABLE TO DELIVER

RESULTS.

> THE POSITION OF MARS CHANGES IN LAGNA THOUGH. MAYBE IF U SEE

THINGS

> WITH MARS BEING IN 12TH INSTEAD OF 11TH YOU MAY SEE MY VIEW POINT.

> AGAIN I AM EMPHASISING ON THE FACT THAT STRENGTH OR THE WORKSHEET

> THAT I GAVE IS COMPUTED FROM RASHI ONLY AND SAMDHARMIS IS COMPUTED

> FROM RASHI AND NAVAMSA. RASHI AND NAVAMSA HAVE EQUAL STATUS AS PER

> KAS AND WE FOLLOW CERTAIN RULES FOR FINDING DELAY. I HAVE

> DEMONSTRATED IN THIS MAIL REGARDING MARRIAGE OF RAMESH WITH

LAKSHMI.

> FOR THAT I HAVE COMPUTED DELAY FOR MARRIAGE USING 2 ZEROES, AND

SHANI

> ASPECTING PRIMIARY SIGNIFICATOR HOUSES FROM RASHI AND THEIR LORDS

IN

> NAVAMSA AND USING WORKSHEET STRENGTH I HAVE COMPUTED THE TIME

FRAME.

> IT WILL BE INTERSTING IF LAKSHMI CAN COMMENT ON THE SAME.

> > THERE IS A SLIGHT DIFFERENCE IN THE WORKSHEET. SOME HOW IN

HASTE

> MY AYANAMSA CHANGE BUT IT WILL NOT MAKE A DIFFERENCE FOR MARRAIGE.

> HERE IS THE CORRECTED VERSION OF THE WORKSHEET. MERCURY STILL HAS

18

> POINTS FOR 7TH HOUSE AND MOSTLY ALL HOUSES.

> >

> > HseSAV

>

PtSuMoMaMeJuVeSa125172012201171022391614222214123311615121141474261117

>

7237102353212239191622156321816182158117201014918111810819221292541710

> 92881214752131034171371621164113816151521415191229101411981415

> >

> >

> >

> > THANKING YOU,

> >

> > CHEERS !!!

> >

> > ASH

> >

> >

> > Regards,

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> > Ash wrote:

> > Dear Chandrashekhar and Lakshmi,

> > There is a difference between a house getting 20 bindus and a

house

> getting 19 bindus as you are aware. I agree both are weak with 20

> bindus being a stronger than 19 bindus. At the same token if a

bhave

> gets 1 bindu more it means one other house is getting 1 bindu

less.

> > It also means that some planet has made a favourable yog w.r.t

one

> house and not with another. Is it not ?

> > I use Krushnas Ashtakvarga system as you are also aware.

> > In that SAV is the base from that we derive the strength of each

> planet for each and every house and also for each and every 16

> divisional chart. When casting the worksheet the aspects are not

> considered in the D charts only the basis strength.

> > The BAV values given by Parasara in my opinion have become

> corrupt. The BAV distribution scheme by Varharamira is correct.

The

> settings are also given in JHL software where you tick off the

check

> boxes in the lite version. If you use the option of Varharamira

you

> will get 20 bindus for 7th house. It would be good to understand

if

> you have intentionally used Parasara's scheme of BAV or generally

use

> Varharmiras scheme ?

> > To come to the final stength of each and every planet for each

> house .

> >

> > Here is the final strength of planet for Ramesh's chart.

> >

> > These are total strength of the planets and derived by

considering

> the following.

> >

> > 1) 4:10

> > 2) Addition of 5 points for LoD and LoE or 10th lord and 6th lord

> from house under consideration

> > 3) Planets in 10th and 6th hosue from house under consideration

> with > 4 bindus.

> > 4) Planets aspecting primary significator house i.e Karak, phal

and

> phalit sthans.

> > 5) Benefic/Malefic Aspects on karak, phal and phalit sthan

> > 5) Benefic/Malefic Aspect on planets

> > 6) Adjustment of 12th from house under focus

> > 7) Adjustment of 6th lord.

> >

> > After meticulously considering all these factors we come to

> strength of each planet for each and every house. Like that we

also

> compute strength for all d charts but in that we only conider the

> strength for karak, phal and phalit sthan for each and every house.

> >

> > You have said that Shani is stronger than Guru. Here you can see

> both Shani and Guru at a glace on how they will deliver their

results

> in their respective antar dasha.

> >

> > I do hear ya regarding the system not being different from

> parasara. Actually parasara did give the BAV scheme but it has

> become corrupt over time.

> >

> > Here Jupiter is in 10th from 10th house so its foritifying 10th

> house and also Guru is with 5 bindus in 7th house and in multrikon

so

> its very eager to give results for 10th house.

> >

> > If you see the worksheet you can see Ju is having 22 points for

> 10th house and Shani has 7 points for 10th house. There is a big

> difference in authority that Ramesh would have been bestowed in the

> antras of Guru and Shani.

> > At the same time if you see expenses v/s income in Guru and shani

> and compare the 11th v/s 12th points you can see more expenses in

> shani compared to Guru antra.

> >

> >

> >

>

HouseSignsSAVSuMoMaMeJuVeSa1Gemini2316191320177162Cancer24101520232314

>

163Leo309219191111134Virgo26722924144235Libra338235202216196Scorpio321

>

6202124139177Sagittarius20719525171288Capricorn211519924912129Aquarius

> 2971713111422910Pisces291310-

> 217229711Aries401121102614101912Taurus305211019121020

> >

> > Thanks,

> > Cheers !!!

> > Ash

> >

> >

> > Chandrashekhar <boxdel> wrote:

> > Dear Ash,

> > Even with 20 points the Bhava lacks strength, is it not? Saturn

> there however extends protection. By the way I am not aware of any

> Ashtakavarga system which gives differential value of Bindus/Rekhas

> based on Lagna of a native or placement of a planet in a Rasi,

> aspects received by it and association with other planets. May I

know

> to which system you are referring to and the weightage for these

> factors given in that system by increasing or reducing the

> Bindus/Rekhas.

> > If you are talking about using other parameters in association

with

> Ashtakavarga then of course that is a different matter and would

not

> constitute different system than Parashara.

> > Regards,

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> > ashsam73 wrote:

> > Dear Chandrashekhar and Lakshmi

> >

> > Pardon me for my intervention.

> >

> > I would like to comment on Ashtakavarga.

> >

> > 1) It seems that you have used Parasaras scheme of BAV. With

> > Varharamiras scheme you get 20 points in Ramesh's 7th house.

> >

> > 2) For nodes are we know are not planets. They are used

> indirectly.

> > They are samdharmi to sign lord and nakshatra lord. For natural

> > nature as you have said or quoted in numerious posts Rahu is like

> > Shani and Ketu like Mars. Functionally they will be more like

the

> > planet i.e. either sign lord or nak lord as per the points they

> > receive in their BAV. For example, if Rahu is in Gemini and nak

of

> > punarvasu then it will represent Me and Ju. If say Ge is 3rd

house

> > and in 3rd house Ju gets 5 bindus and Me gets say 6 bindus then

> Rahu

> > will act more like Mercury.

> >

> > 3) With regards to your comment on Ashtakavarg not using sign

> > placement is not entirely correct. If used with a proper system

> the

> > sign placement can give idea on quantum of result and its not

used

> to

> > find timing of result. For timing of result Ashtakvarg, SAV and

> > total strength of planets derived from SAV is good enough to time

> > results effectively.

> >

> > Maybe knowledge of Ashtakvarg that is available in texts today is

> not

> > complete and may lead to confusion.

> >

> > Ashtakvarg system used is an effective tool in timing of events.

> >

> > A couple of points on Ramesh's chart.

> >

> > 1) In Ramesh's chart there are 2 consecutive zeroes one given by

> > Venus to 7th and one by Mars to 8th.

> >

> > 2) Jupiter antra will be very eager to bestow authority to Ramesh

> and

> > also for acquisition of wealth. Between 1997/04 thru 1999/10

> Ramesh

> > might have been given a role of responsibility. Also a good time

> to

> > make investments and accumulation of wealth. Lakshami can verify

> > this antra.

> >

> >

> > Thanking you,

> > Cheers !!!

> > Ash

> >

> > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar

> <boxdel>

> > wrote:

> > > Dear Lakshmi,

> > > I think in Ramesh's case Saturn is Lord of the 9th is it not?

He

> > not

> > > only associates a Kendra Lord but is also is in kendra being a

> > trine

> > > lord. He is also Lord of Navamsha Lagna aspecting Lagna,

besides

> > being

> > > placed in a trikona. Jupiter on the other hand is Lord of 2nd

and

> > 11th

> > > in Navamsha and in 3rd house. I would certainly treat Saturn as

> > more

> > > powerful than Jupiter, even if in Lagna Jupiter appears to be

> with

> > > greater strength. But there too he is only a Kendra Lord in

> Kendra

> > > associating a trine lord. Since we are talking about 7th house

> > would it

> > > not be right to look at the Navamsha strengths of the planets,

> > before

> > > coming to conclusion about 7th house? If we look at Ashtaka

Varga

> > then

> > > SAV would rather prove my view point as it shows 7th house with

> 19

> > > points. Personally I give more weightage to Natal chart read

with

> > > Navamsha. the reason is Ashtakavarga do not consider effects of

> > nodes ,

> > > neither do they consider house ownership or Rasi occupation

> > > weightage.Your opinion would be appreciated.

> > > Chandrashekhar.

> > >

> > > lakshmi ramesh wrote:

> > >

> > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > >

> > > > Namaste Chandrasekar ji,

> > > >

> > > > Even in Ramesh's case, Jupiter is in own house/moolatrikona.

> > Please

> > > > look at the ashtakavarga & bala of Saturn. Who is more

> empowered

> > to

> > > > protect the house, based on both strength and functionality,

> > Jupiter

> > > > or Saturn? I request you to ponder on this.

> > > >

> > > > Regards,

> > > > Lakshmi

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > */Chandrashekhar <boxdel>/* wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Lakshmi,

> > > > If I may point out, in Javed's case Guru is in own house

> and

> > in

> > > > Ramesh's case Saturn conjuncts Guru. The dictum is Sthana

> > rakshati

> > > > Mandah. Guru's exception to house damage occurs when he

is

> in

> > own

> > > > house.

> > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > >

> > > > lakshmi ramesh wrote:

> > > >

> > > >> Om Gurave Namah

> > > >>

> > > >> Namaste Pradeep ji,

> > > >>

> > > >> I happen to know of individuals who have strong Guru in

> 4th

> > and

> > > >> 7th. Strong Guru in 4th has blessed the individual with

> > great

> > > >> knowledge, an intelligence that borders on genius and a

> rare

> > > >> inner harmony. That person, a devout Muslim, is one of

the

> > finest

> > > >> individuals I have ever come across, and he is very

> attached

> > to

> > > >> his family and mother and there are no problems what so

> ever

> > on

> > > >> the home front. This individual is highly esteemed in

his

> > work

> > > >> environment and has all the comforts one could desire.

> > Infact,

> > > >> Guru in 4th is supposed to cast sukhargala on lagna,

which

> is

> > > >> good for the general health & happiness of the person.

> > > >>

> > > >> The individual with Jupiter & Saturn in 7th (Dhanus) is

my

> > own

> > > >> dear husband. We have been very happily married for

nearly

> 20

> > > >> years. My husband has prospered remarkably after

marriage.

> > > >>

> > > >> I am posting the charts here.

> > > >>

> > > >> I request that you also post the charts of the

individuals

> to

> > > >> whom you were referring in your post, for our

edification

> and

> > > >> discussion.

> > > >>

> > > >> Regards,

> > > >> Lakshmi

> > > >>

> > > >>

> > > >>

> > > >> */vijayadas_pradeep <vijayadas_pradeep>/* wrote:

> > > >>

> > > >> Dear Chandrashekhar ji

> > > >>

> > > >> I have been trying to test the principles taught by

you

> > > >> related to

> > > >> guru in various bhavas.

> > > >>

> > > >> When in 3rd always some difficulties for

siblings.Even

> > when

> > > >> in own

> > > >> sign and in 4th,problems for mother and at home

front.

> > > >>

> > > >> When in 7th at marriage front.When in Lagna and not

in

> > own

> > > >> sign some

> > > >> physical weakness and health problems in childhood.

> > > >>

> > > >> Thus Guru tests the individual thouroughly.

> > > >>

> > > >> Also sages have advised that Guru is not favourable

> while

> > > >> transiting

> > > >> kendra houses 1,4,and 10th from moon.Only the 7th

> kendra

> > is

> > > >> beneficial.(Is there any reason for this?) Only

> > 2nd,5th,7th

> > > >> and 9th

> > > >> are favourable.11th being good for all planets in

> > general.

> > > >>

> > > >> Respect

> > > >> Pradeep

> > > >>

> > > >> vedic astrology,

Chandrashekhar

> > > >> <boxdel>

> > > >> wrote:

> > > >> > Dear Anuj,

> > > >> > I am glad you agree with me. As you rightly said

in

> > your

> > > >> message

> > > >> to

> > > >> > Razdan,a the dictum is pretty well known to

> > astrologers.

> > > >> There are

> > > >> many

> > > >> > shlokas to that effects and charts prove the

> veracity

> > of the

> > > >> dictum, I

> > > >> > have myself posted a few of them earlier.

> > > >> > Unfortunately there is a tendency to mix up terms

> like

> > > >> Benefic/Malefic

> > > >> > with the results a planet is likely to give. This

> > happens more

> > > >> with

> > > >> > Jupiter as people usually tend to equate it with

> > Deeksha

> > > >> Guru as

> > > >> his

> > > >> > name in Sanskrit is Guru. People tend to forget

> > Parashara

> > > >> telling

> > > >> when

> > > >> > Guru can act as Maraka and want to attribute only

> good

> > and

> > > >> pious

> > > >> > attributes to him. I prefer to keep my personal

> > feelings and

> > > >> prejudices

> > > >> > apart from application of astrological principles.

> > > >> > Take care,

> > > >> > Chandrashekhar.

> > > >> >

> > > >> > nameisego wrote:

> > > >> >

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > Respected Chandrashekhar ji.

> > > >> > > Please accpet my pranams as you are the senior

> most

> > Guru

> > > >> in age

> > > >> and

> > > >> > > experience in this group.

> > > >> > > Your observation about Guru is absolutely right.

> > > >> > > Self had posted in this group and elsewhere an

> > article on "

> > > >> > > "Guru Boon or Bane??" some time back where it

was

> > shown

> > > >> Guru's

> > > >> > > position in various houses which had been

> > > >> destroyed/troubled by

> > > >> Guru.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > "Bhava Nasha Karo Jeeva

> > > >> > > Bhava Vriddhhi karau Shanih"

> > > >> > > This Dictum had been proved by self.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > You may (Mr.Razdan) go thro' older postings and

> read

> > for

> > > >> yourself and

> > > >> > > check the examples that were given.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > Difference between Jupiter and saturn is,

Jupiter

> > sucks the

> > > >> goodness

> > > >> > > of a house and gives fruit to houses it aspects.

> > Saturn

> > > >> sucks the

> > > >> > > houses he aspects and increases the house it

> > occupies.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > Tatvam-Asi

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > vedic astrology, PNRazdan

> > > >> <pnrazdan>

> > > >> > > wrote:

> > > >> > > > Dear Chandrashekhar,

> > > >> > > > You seem to be extending your arguments

against

> > Jupiter

> > > >> still

> > > >> > > further.

> > > >> > > > Firstly you said that Jup is ashub in houses

it

> is

> > a

> > > >> designated as a

> > > >> > > > Karka like 2,5,9,10 and 11 based on the

> principle

> > of

> > > >> "Karka

> > > >> Bhavo

> > > >> > > Nasa"

> > > >> > > > . Now you say that it will harm every house it

is

> > > >> placed in.

> > > >> Why

> > > >> > > this

> > > >> > > > animosity with Jup, the hope of millions

> believing

> > in Vedic

> > > >> > > Astrology

> > > >> > > > (in lighter vein).

> > > >> > > >

> > > >> > > > You refer to some dictum of a sage, source was

> not

> > > >> given by

> > > >> you. But

> > > >> > > > take out any basic book on ancient astrology.

It

> > always

> > > >> speaks

> > > >> of

> > > >> > > the

> > > >> > > > benefic qualities of Jupiter. Somewhere it is

> even

> > > >> said, that

> > > >> > > howsoever

> > > >> > > > bad it may be placed in, it will still try to

> help

> > the

> > > >> subject. And

> > > >> > > > this has been amply proved by our experience.

> > > >> > > > I am afraid. you will have to do some more

> > hardwork for

> > > >> convincing

> > > >> > > all

> > > >> > > > about your notions of Jupiter, the heavenly

> > Brahiman. This

> > > >> would

> > > >> > > even

> > > >> > > > mean a paradigm shift in Vedic Astrology.

> > > >> > > > Pran Razdan

> > > >> > > >

> > > >> > > > --- Chandrashekhar <boxdel> wrote:

> > > >> > > >

> > > >> > > > > Dear Prafulla,

> > > >> > > > > Reference to Leo was in connection with what

> > > >> Shubhangi had

> > > >> asked.

> > > >> > > > > Jupiter harming the house he is placed in is

a

> > dictum

> > > >> given

> > > >> by

> > > >> > > sages

> > > >> > > > > and

> > > >> > > > > there is no reason to try to find out the

> > reason. If one

> > > >> wants to

> > > >> > > > > find

> > > >> > > > > the reason about Leo, consider this in

natural

> > zodiac

> > > >> Leo is

> > > >> in

> > > >> > > 5th

> > > >> > > > > house whose occupation by Jupiter leads to

> > Karaka Bhava

> > > >> Dasha. In

> > > >> > > > > 11th

> > > >> > > > > all planets are Shubha so it is not only

> Jupiter

> > who is

> > > >> Shubha

> > > >> > > there.

> > > >> > > > >

> > > >> > > > > Disha strength is one amongst many strengths

> > > >> considered but

> > > >> not

> > > >> > > as

> > > >> > > > > strong as Digbala and Jupiter gets that in

> Lagna.

> > > >> > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > >> > > > >

> > > >> > > > > Prafulla Gang wrote:

> > > >> > > > >

> > > >> > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji

> > > >> > > > > >

> > > >> > > > > > In my humble view, (Jupiter may not be

> > preferred in

> > > >> Leo for

> > > >> > > > > Muhurta,

> > > >> > > > > > I do not know much about muhurta related

> > > >> configurations),It may

> > > >> > > not

> > > >> > > > > > become weak in terms of Bala necessarily

> > (generally

> > > >> speaking).

> > > >> > > In

> > > >> > > > > > fact, jupiter in 3rd house in Libra is

> > considered bad.

> > > >> > > > > >

> > > >> > > > > > Jupiter in 11th house (any sign) will have

> > directional

> > > >> strength

> > > >> > > to

> > > >> > > > > > initiate for results.

> > > >> > > > > >

> > > >> > > > > > There must be more than this reason, for

> > jupiter to

> > > >> give

> > > >> > > negative

> > > >> > > > > > results.

> > > >> > > > > >

> > > >> > > > > > regards/Prafulla Gang

> > > >> > > > > >

> > > >> > > > > >

> > > >> > > > > > vedic astrology,

> > Chandrashekhar

> > > >> > > > > <boxdel>

> > > >> > > > > > wrote:

> > > >> > > > > > > Dear Shubhangi,

> > > >> > > > > > > Being an Indian you must know that

Jupiter

> > looses his

> > > >> > > strength in

> > > >> > > > > > Leo

> > > >> > > > > > > and that is why there are no Muhurtas for

> > > >> marriages when

> > > >> > > Jupiter

> > > >> > > > > > > occupies Leo or what is called as

> Simhastha.

> > That

> > > >> is due

> > > >> to

> > > >> > > the

> > > >> > > > > > fact of

> > > >> > > > > > > Guru lacking Bala. In your brother's

case

> Sun

> > > >> being in

> > > >> own

> > > >> > > Rasi

> > > >> > > > > > makes

> > > >> > > > > > > him Shubha and therefore good relations

> with

> > > >> Father. But

> > > >> I

> > > >> > > would

> > > >> > > > > > say he

> > > >> > > > > > > would not follow father's profession.

> > > >> > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > >> > > > > > >

> > > >> > > > > > > Shubhangi Naik wrote:

> > > >> > > > > > >

> > > >> > > > > > > >Dear Sir,

> > > >> > > > > > > >

> > > >> > > > > > > >Sorry for intervening in your session,

> but

> > I am

> > > >> curious

> > > >> to

> > > >> > > know

> > > >> > > > > > the logic behind jupiter losing its

strength

> > in leo

> > > >> and

> > > >> hence

> > > >> > > this

> > > >> > > > > > email.

> > > >> > > > > > > >Yes, your dictum worked in my brother's

> > case also.

> > > >> > > > > > > >My brother has sun+jup in leo but in

8th,

> no

> > > >> doubt he

> > > >> is very

> > > >> > > > > > intelligent but did not do much well in

> > academics

> > > >> and yes,

> > > >> he

> > > >> > > did

> > > >> > > > > > fail once in his 10th class.

> > > >> > > > > > > >With my half knowledge I thought the

> reason

> > to

> > > >> be the

> > > >> > > > > positioning

> > > >> > > > > > of both the planets in 8th, but now

curious

> to

> > know

> > > >> why jup

> > > >> > > losses

> > > >> > > > > > strength in leo.

> > > >> > > > > > > >But though both planets are positioned

in

> > 8th, both

> > > >> father

> > > >> > > and

> > > >> > > > > > son shares good relation with each other.

> > > >> > > > > > > >Thanks,

> > > >> > > > > > > >Shubhangi

> > > >> > > > > > > >

> > > >> > > > > > > >

> > > >> > > > > > > >

> > > >> > > > > > > >

> > > >> > > > > > > >

> > > >> > > > > > > >

> > > >> > > > > > > >On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 Chandrashekhar

wrote :

> > > >> > > > > > > >

> > > >> > > > > > > >

> > > >> > > > > > > >>Dear Dhira,

> > > >> > > > > > > >>There you see the dictum working. Is

it

> > not?

> > > >> > > > > > > >>Regards,

> > > >> > > > > > > >>Chandrashekhar.

> > > >> > > > > > > >>

> > > >&

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Take Mail with you! Get it on your mobile phone.

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Hello Ash:

 

Why would the 8th house from a house become the Karaka? The Karakas

are set in stone, i.e Venus is the karaka for marriage, etc. The

sages have already established the karakattatwa for various planets.

 

Mukund

 

vedic astrology, "ashsam73" <ashsam73>

wrote:

> Dear Chandrashekhar,

>

> In vedic texts no where it is written that Dhanu rashi is called

> Saggitarius isnt it so ?. But people on this list still call it

> Saggitarius and its accepted as Vedic Astrology. You can also put

> forward an argument that Parasara has never said Saggitarius is

> Dhanu and no where in any scriptural reference is it called

> by "Saggitarius". But we adapt and its understood that when

someone

> says Saggitarius it means Dhanu.

>

> Your approach is that if something does not have backing of some

> shokes that is available in the limited pool of this antient sience

> as we know which is not complete its hard for you to digest despite

> the fact you know it works.

>

> For me it does not matter who wrote the shokes or how or where it

was

> found. For me I have to see something has to work and work

> consistently. If it does it worth a million shokes.

>

> Mistakes everyone makes as no one can learn to walk without falling

> first and that a part of learning but its not because system does

not

> work. Its infact Krushnaji who encouraged me to make mistakes and

> told me thats the way I will learn as once u make a mistake the

next

> time one will remember why the person made the mistake and will not

> repeat it. Thats also the way finer things about KAS system will

come

> out. No 2 charts are same. So I am not afraid to make mistakes.

>

> Now Logic dictates that if something works then whatever is taught

is

> proper. Now just because you cannot find the shokes in the limited

> texts that its available to you cannot be the basis to disregard it

> in my opinion. If you do that then one will be stuck in the

limited

> pool of information and never try to look beyond and always in the

> garb of saying that its not given in any scripture or not supported

> by any scriptures. I would agree with that approach IF the

> scriptures were complete.

>

> That to me is common sense. But just to say that despite something

> working and one is not able to find sholokes and asking me again

and

> again to support your pallete and approach is in my opinion a

futile

> task. As to me what matters is something works and works

> consistently.

>

> As per KAS 8th house from a house is called KARAK. You can choose

to

> call it House A, 2nd from lagna, KARAK or whatever you would like

as

> long as u understand it.

>

> For me 8th house from a house is called KARAK or we call it House

A.

> 5th house from the house under focus is called House C. 10th from

a

> house under focus is called D and 6th from a house under focus is

> called House E and the use under focus is called B.

>

> I am not going to sit here and argue about the method MY TEACHER

has

> chosen to teach just because you like it to be called in a certain

> way or sanskrit terms. Many students who learn KAS might not even

> know english or just a little bit of English. Just because you

know

> good Sanskrit and English and other languages it does not mean

that

> all know and can follow the same.

>

> If you also see on website Donna has created, Margarita has taken

> pains to convert the lessons into French so that this knowledge can

> spread. Denis and Alain Poinsot have converted the worksheet into

> French so that it helps people from other non English /

> Sanskrit/Hindi/Marathi etc countries so that this knowlege of Vedic

> Astrology and KAS spreads.

>

> You cannot judge the way others teach or how they teach. If one is

> willing to learn then he must abide by the way his teacher chooses

to

> teach. Isnt that vedic culture ?

>

> If one uses 12 houses, nakshatras, graha dristi, ashtakavarga,

> vimshottari dasha all sound principles as given by Maharishis.

Isnt

> that vedic astrology ?

>

>

> Cheers !!!

> Ash

>

> vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar

<boxdel>

> wrote:

> > Dear Ash,

> >

> > I note your saying that it is hard for me to stomach what you

have

> said.

> > I will tell you why. You have not made any remarks about the

> shlokas. I

> > do not understand why this hesitance since you claim that the

> system is

> > Vedic Astrology. You have also, not commented about mention of

> wrong

> > names of even sages in the lessons of KAS. You have also chosen

not

> to

> > comment on the portion from the lesson posted. Do I understand

that

> the

> > position about beneficence or malfeasance of planets has now been

> > changed ? If so why? If this is Vedic astrology why refer to

house

> > aspected as C or D or anything else rather than give them their

> proper

> > names in accordance with Vedic Astrology? If Vedic Astrology then

> how

> > can the defined aspects of Jupiter be changed? You say:

> > "I HAVE ALSO GONE ON TO COMMENT THAT FROM KAS VIEW POINT ALSO

MARS

> WILL

> > NOT BE ABLE TO GIVE THE RESULT OF THE HOUSE ITS PLACED IN AS MARS

> > ASPECTS 8TH HOUSE FROM THE HOUSE LOCATED AND 8TH HOUSE IS KARAK

AS

> PER

> > TERMINOLOGY. "

> > Since when is a house itself a Karaka in Vedic Astrology terms?

> Could

> > you quote at least one shloka, from any known text on Vedic

> Astrology,

> > saying this? If that is also a "secret-unrevealed" how does one

> take the

> > statement about the system being Vedic Astrology to be right?

> Should

> > that not be possible, It is difficult to believe Vedic Astrology

> origin

> > of the system. If this is not Vedic Astrology then how can one

hold

> > discussions in a rational manner, on a list devoted to Vedic

> Astrology?

> > This is why I said it would be futile to carry on this

discussion.

> > Unless texts are quoted in support of theories advanced or at

least

> > similar observations from standard texts quoted, I do not see any

> point

> > in carrying on this discussion.

> >

> > Regards,

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> > Ash wrote:

> >

> > > Dear Chandrashekhar,

> > >

> > > You have quoted

> > >

> > > " For the knowledge of all I am pasting below the last

paragraph

> of

> > > that lesson, which will confirm that even your own system

> confirms

> > > that Saturn does not give malefic effects for the house it is

> placed

> > > in. The lesson also says that Jupiter with more Bindus gives

> malefic

> > > aspect. Your argument has been that Jupiter with more bindu is

a

> > > Benefic in all 12 bhavas."

> > >

> > > ASH : I HAVE TOLD YOU RIGHT IN THE BEGINING THAT I AGREE WITH

> YOUR

> > > ORIGINAL POINT AND MY DISCUSSION WAS NOT ON THE BASIC THREAD

> ABOUT

> > > GURU SPOILING THE RESULT.

> > >

> > > I HAVE ALREADY TOLD YOU MY STAND THAT IF THE SAME IS SEEN FROM

> KAS

> > > VIEW POINT GURU WILL ASPECT HOUSE C OR ONE OF THE PRIMARY

> SIGNIFICATOR

> > > HOUSES AND THEREBY ITSELF WILL BE UNABLE TO GIVE THE RESULT AND

> ITS

> > > SAMDHARMI WILL GIVE. SUCH THINGS ARE ALL PART OF KAS AND THERE

> WAS

> > > NOTHING TO DISCUSS. ITS OTHERS WHO HAVE A HARD TIME TO

STOMACH

> AS

> > > YOU HAVE SAID AND SUCH THINGS AS MY POINTS ON ASHTAKAVARGA ARE

> HARD

> > > FOR YOU TO STOMACH.

> > >

> > > IN THAT MAIL IF MEMORY SERVES ME RIGHT I HAVE ALSO SAID THAT

> SHANI IF

> > > IT HAS POWER AS PER THE WORKSHEET AND IF DELAY IS OVER AND BY

> THAT I

> > > MEAN COMBINED OR WORKSHEET STRENGTH OF > 12 THEN ITSELF CAN

GIVE

> > > RESULT AS SHANI ITSELF DOES NOT ASPECT ANY PRIMARY SIGNIFICATOR

> > > HOUSES. I HAVE ALSO GONE ON TO COMMENT THAT FROM KAS VIEW

POINT

> ALSO

> > > MARS WILL NOT BE ABLE TO GIVE THE RESULT OF THE HOUSE ITS

PLACED

> IN AS

> > > MARS ASPECTS 8TH HOUSE FROM THE HOUSE LOCATED AND 8TH HOUSE IS

> KARAK

> > > AS PER TERMINOLOGY. OFCOUSE THERE ARE EXCEPTIONS BUT I AM

> TALKING IN

> > > GENERAL CASE.

> > >

> > > I HAVE NEVER SAID THAT GURU WITH MORE POINTS IS BENEFIC FOR ALL

> 12

> > > HOUSE !!! THERE MUST BE SOME MISUNDERTANDING.

> > >

> > > IF AS PER WORKSHEET IF GURU HAS MORE THAN 12 POINTS FOR ALL 12

> HOUSES

> > > THEN SUCH A GURU WILL GIVE BENEFIC RESULT FOR ALL 12 HOUSES.

> > > AGAIN WE SHOULD ALSO KEEP IN MIND ABOUT THE POINT ABOUT GURU

> ASPECTING

> > > PRIMARY SIGNIFICATOR HOUSES ETC ETC.

> > >

> > > WORKSHEET GIVES FINAL STRENGH OF PLANET. WHAT YOU HAVE TAKED

> ABOUT IS

> > > SAV.

> > >

> > > WORKSHEEET IS DERIVED FROM SAV.

> > >

> > > PLEASE REFER TO THE ORIGINAL MAIL IN WHICH I HAVE GIVEN THE

> WORKSHEET

> > > OF RAMESH. I HAVE SAID CLEARLY THAT FOR 7TH HOSUE BOTH ARE

WEAK

> I.E

> > > GURU AND SHANI. THIS IS BASED ON WORKSHEET TOTAL POINTS.

TOTAL

> OF

> > > GURU = 11 AND THAT OF SHANI IS 10. THIS IS AND I EMPHASISE THE

> SUM OF

> > > ROW 17 IN THE WORKSHEET.

> > >

> > > FOR RAMESH GURU IS FAR STRONGER FOR 10TH HOUSE THAN SHANI.

THIS

> AGAIN

> > > IS BASED ON FINAL STRENGTH AS PER WORKSHEET. IN THE WORKSHEET

WE

> ARE

> > > TAKING COMBINED EFFECT OF ALL PLANETS AND THE ASPECTS.

> > >

> > > IF SA IS IN 5TH HOUSE AND SAY WITH 2 BINDUS THEN ITS ASPECT ON

> 7TH,

> > > 11TH AND 2ND HOUSE WILL BE WITH +6 [THIS PORTION YOU HAVE CUT

AND

> > > PASTED]. SO THE BASIC STRENGH OF SA WILL BE AS PER BAV I.E.

THE

> > > BINDUS THAT SA GETS FOR 7TH, 11TH AND 2ND HOUSE AND THEN ITS

OWN

> > > ASPECT ON PRIMARY SIGNIFICATOR HOUSES WILL BE +18 I.E +6 FOR

7TH,

> +6

> > > ON 11 AND +6 ON 2ND.

> > >

> > > SO UNLESS THERE ARE A HOST OF PLANEST WITH > 4 BINDUS HAVING

> DIRECT

> > > ASPECT ON SHANI AND REDUCING ITS POINTS SHANI [AS THEY WILL

> ASPECT

> > > SHANI WITH A MALEFIC DRSITI AS PER THE PORITION THAT YOU HAVE

CUT

> AND

> > > PASTE] WILL BE VERY STRONG FOR 7TH HOUSE MATTERS. I AM NOT

> > > CONSIDERING EXCEPTIONS BUT TALKING OF GENERAL RULE.

> > >

> > > PLEASE DO NOT CONFUSE SAV WITH FINAL WORKSHEET WHICH I HAVE

SEEN

> YOU

> > > DO IN OUR DISCUSSIONS. IN THE FINAL WORKSHEET THE PLANETS CAN

> GET

> > > MORE THAN 8 POINTS. IN SAV THE PLANET CAN GET MAX 8 BINDUS AND

> THAT

> > > IS BY LAGNA AND 7 PLANETS. PLEASE DO NOT CONFUSE DIFFERENT

> ASPECTS OF

> > > THE SYSTEM. IF YOU WANT TO DISCUSS THE NITTY AND GRITTY OF KAS

> WE CAN

> > > DO IT ON KAS LIST AND STOP USING THE BANDWIDTH OF VA LIST.

> > >

> > > THERE IS NO MIS REPRESENTATION. PLEASE READ THE OTHER CHAPTERS

> AND

> > > WHEN YOU STUDY THE WORKSHEET YOU WILL UNDERSTAND HOW PLANETS

GET

> THE

> > > POINTS AND HOW THE PORTION GIVEN BY YOU IN THIS MAIL IS USED.

> > >

> > > THIS IS THE BASICS OF KAS.

> > >

> > > HAVE U STUDIED THE ARCHIVES OF THE LIST. YOU WILL SEE THAT

AFTER

> THE

> > > INITIAL LESSON WAS GIVEN THERE WAS A LOT OF DISCUSSION ON EACH

> AND

> > > EVERY LESSON AND FINER POINTS AND ALL QUESTIONS WERE ANSWERED

BY

> SHRI

> > > KRUSHNAJI WHICH AND WERE ALSO INCORPORATED IN THE LESSONS TO

> REMOVE

> > > ANY CONFUSION AND HENCE LABELED AS REVISED AS THEY WERE A

> > > RIVISION FROM THE ORIGINAL VERSION AS TYPED BY KRUSHNAJI. I

HOPE

> THAT

> > > CLARIFIES YOUR QUESTION ON WHY THINGS ARE LABELLED AS REVISED.

> > >

> > >

> > > I AGREE WITH YOU ON YOUR LAST POINT. TO HAVE RATIONAL

DISCUSSION

> ON A

> > > SUBJECT ONE MUST HAVE GOOD UNDERSTANDING OF A SYSTEM ONE IS

> DEBATING

> > > ON. IN MY OPINION YOU HAVE FAILED TO GRASP THE ESSENCE OF THE

> POWER

> > > SHOWED BY THE WORKSHEET. MAYBE ONCE YOU STUDY THE LESSONS ON

> > > WORKSHEET AND HOW ITS COMPUTED USING THE PORTION YOU HAVE CUT

AND

> > > PASTE MAYBE YOU WILL UNDERTSAND WHAT I HAVE SAID.

> > >

> > >

> > > CHEERS !!!

> > > ASH

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > */Chandrashekhar <boxdel>/* wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Ash,

> > > I am aware how the worksheet was created. The reference was

in

> > > context of your advancing the argument that since work

sheet

> shows

> > > a particular number it is the only correct position and not

> giving

> > > any text reference to the argument advanced. You even chose

> to say

> > > that there is inconsistency in Parashara's method of

assessing

> > > strength of planets. If my memory serves me right, the

entire

> > > discussion started with the dictum of Jupiter harming the

> place he

> > > occupies and Saturn protecting the same. For reasons best

> known t

> > > you, you chose to divert it to timing of events and then

went

> on

> > > calling every system being corrupt but that advanced by you.

> > >

> > > I had many times said that I do not mind which system one

> follows

> > > if one thinks it right. But carrying a serious discussion

> thread

> > > to a direction it was not aimed at and then advancing

> arguments

> > > with support of standard texts is a bit too much. When none

> of the

> > > parameters accepted by all the Vedic astrologers including

> > > Varahamihira , whose texts by your own declaration have not

> been

> > > corrupted, are considered in the system and yet you want to

> call

> > > it a Vedic Astrology in purest form is something very

> confusing.

> > >

> > > I am certain if you show the entire argument thread to

> Krushna, he

> > > too will agree to the soundness of the arguments advanced me

> > > within the parameters prescribed by Vedic Astrology.

> > >

> > > In so far as reading the Lessons are concerned, would you

> care to

> > > explain as to why so many lessons had to be revised when the

> > > system is derived from some hidden and not available to

> anybody

> > > knowledge. the shlokas you are telling me to look at

mention

> > > wrong reference to names of Authors except Jataka

Parijatakar.

> > > You were reluctant to accept that these are available when

I

> gave

> > > you the other texts in which information on Ashtakavarga is

> given

> > > at length. Even the Granthas from which the shlokas are

taken

> are

> > > not named. You also talked disparagingly about commentators

> in an

> > > earlier mail. Now I see why, Bhattotpal who haas written a

> > > commentary on Varahamihira's Brihat Jataka is mentioned in

you

> > > lesson as the original Acharya who has written Brihat

Jataka.

> > >

> > > This does not deduct from the contribution of Bhattotpal, I

am

> > > just mentioning the fact to show how your views are biased

> without

> > > due consideration to the basis of your own favored system.

> For the

> > > knowledge of all I am pasting below the last paragraph of

that

> > > lesson, which will confirm that even your own system

confirms

> that

> > > Saturn does not give malefic effects for the house it is

> placed

> > > in. The lesson also says that Jupiter with more Bindus gives

> > > malefic aspect. Your argument has been that Jupiter with

more

> > > bindu is a Benefic in all 12 bhavas.

> > >

> > > *"The Late Shri K.S. Krishanamurti, founder of K.P.

Paddhat,

> also

> > > agrees that the planets do not give the results as per their

> > > natural natures. In reference to Jupiter, he states that it

> has

> > > lost its benefic power in the era of Kalyuga and that he has

> > > experienced the malefic effects of Jupiter firsthand. But

in

> spite

> > > of Kalyuga, I tend to disagree. It is the effect of the

points

> > > that it receives in its own place that truly makes the

> difference.

> > > An aspect of Jupiter with more points is always malefic.

The

> same

> > > rule applies to all planets. With reference to Saturn,

> > > Krishnamurti says it gives malefic effects based on the

> > > constellation in which it resides. Perhaps, if he would

have

> come

> > > across the Ashtakavarga system first, his whole theory

would

> have

> > > been quite different. "

> > >

> > > Since you have all along been saying that Jupiter will be

> stronger

> > > than Saturn having 4 bindus as against 1 of Saturn and

think I

> > > have not understood your system, let me reproduce below what

> > > Krushna has said in Lesson 3 and effects overall of the

> planets.

> > > Let the others who are watching our discussions decide what

> is the

> > > right position under your system.

> > > MALEFIC AND BENEFIC PLANETARY ASPECTS TABLE

> > >

> > >

> 1

> > >

> 2

> > > 3

> > > MAXIMUM POINTS ALLOWED IN HOUSE BENEFIC POINTS ACQUIRED

BY

> THE

> > > PLANET ITS EFFECT IN THE HOUSE WHERE IT

> > >

> 4

> > > 5

> > > IS THE OPPOSITE ASPECT THAT IT CREATES AND ITS

> > > FINAL EFFECT

> > > _1 2 3

> > > 4 5_

> > >

> > > 8 0 Malefic by -8 Plus

> 8

> > > Benefic

> > > 8 1 Malefic by -7 Plus

> 7

> > > Benefic

> > > 8 2 Malefic by -6 Plus

> 6

> > > Benefic

> > > 8 3 Malefic by -5 Plus

> 5

> > > Benefic

> > >

> > > 8 4 NEUTRAL WITH 4 NEUTRAL WITH 4 NEUTRAL WITH 4

> > >

> > > 8 5 Benefic by +5 Minus

> 5

> > > Malefic

> > > 8 6 Benefic by +6 Minus

> 6

> > > Malefic

> > > 8 7 Benefic by +7 Minus

> 7

> > > Malefic

> > > 8 8 Benefic by +8 Minus

> 8

> > > Malefic

> > >

> > >

> > > *

> > > I do not wish to extend the argument further as there is no

> point

> > > when, even with a different system, one chooses to

> misrepresent

> > > what has been said in that system to advance one's

argument.

> No

> > > one can have a rational discussion in this manner.

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > > Chandrashekhar

> > >

> > >

> > > ashsam73 wrote:

> > >

> > >> Dear Chandrashekhar,

> > >>

> > >> I shall try once again to explain rather than get personal.

> > >>

> > >> If you are using Jaganatha Hora Software please go to

> Preference,

> > >> Related to Calculation, Ashtakavarga Calculation

Preferences.

> > >>

> > >> Please carefully read what the Author of the software has

> written in

> > >> the setting response box about the check boxes.

> > >>

> > >> I am quoting whats written.

> > >>

> > >> "If you want to use Parasara's definitions, check all the

> options

> > >> below"

> > >>

> > >> "If you want to use Varharamira's definitions, uncheck all

> the

> > >> options below".

> > >>

> > >> I am saying that its not possible to have a different

scheme

> and

> > >> either one of the schemes has got corrupt over time. I

> recon its

> > >> Parasaras that has got corrupt.

> > >>

> > >> There is nothing about being superior or inferior. I keep

> saying

> > >> this part again and again and you keep thinking that I am

> comparing

> > >> and saying one is superior and other is inferior.

> > >>

> > >> I think it will now be clear that Parasaras BAV scheme is

> different

> > >> from Varharmiras.

> > >>

> > >> KAS uses Varharmiras scheme.

> > >>

> > >> The worksheet in Excel did not exist 20 years back.

> > >>

> > >> If you have claimed to have studied the lessons then how

is

> it that

> > >> you have not observed that a lesson on casting the

worksheet

> > >> manually

> > >> has been given. Lesson 7.

> > >>

> > >> I think pen and paper existed 20 years back. Worksheet is

a

> term I

> > >> use as Sanjay Jaggia has made a worksheet to help make all

> these

> > >> computations easy.

> > >>

> > >> About the point of Quoting shokes is your style of doing

> things. If

> > >> you had bothered to read the lessons you would not have

> asked me

> > >> this

> > >> question. Have you read lesson 2. Sanskrit shloks that

you

> have

> > >> asked for are given there.

> > >>

> > >> Thanking you,

> > >> Cheers !!!

> > >> Ash

> > >>

> > >> vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar

> <boxdel>

> > >> wrote:

> > >> > Dear Ash,

> > >> > I do not understand what you mean by saying there is

> inconsistency

> > >> in

> > >> > the strength derived by the traditional system and

telling

> that

> > >> some

> > >> > other system by saying

> > >> > "I AM SAYING THAT VARAHARMIRA AND PARSASARA HAVE BOTH

> TAUGHT

> > >> > ASHTAKAVARGA BUT THE SYSTEM TO TIME EVENTS IS NOT GIVEN

> WHICH IS

> > >> WHAT

> > >> > HAS BEEN BROUGHT FORWARD BY KRUSHNAJI. SO INFACT THIS

IS

> A HUGE

> > >> > ACHEIVEMENT FOR THE JYOTISH WORLD WHERE ONE HAS A SYSTEM

> > >> ABIDING BY

> > >> THE

> > >> > CLASSICS AND AN INTEGRAL PART OF VEDIC ASTROLOGY. IF

YOU

> ARE

> > >> TRYING TO

> > >> > DISSUADE NEW LEARNERS OF JYOTISH TO LEARN SUCH A GEM OF

A

> SYSTEM

> > >> WITHOUT

> > >> > FIRST EXPERIENCING IT FIRST HAND THAT WOULD NOT BE GOOD

> SERVICE TO

> > >> > JYOTISH SHASTRA." (your words). If this does not infer

> that the

> > >> system

> > >> > is superior to the Parashara system, perhaps my grasp of

> the

> > >> English

> > >> > language is not as good as yours.

> > >> >

> > >> > About whether I have bothered to understand the system,

> please

> > >> find

> > >> out

> > >> > the list of members of the relevant list and then

comment.

> You

> > >> will

> > >> be

> > >> > surprised. If you want others to learn a system that you

> like

> > >> it is

> > >> all

> > >> > right with me. However every argument being based on

other

> systems

> > >> > having been corrupt are difficult to stomacha. If as you

> say the

> > >> system

> > >> > is the only pure version available of the ancient texts,

> why not

> > >> quote

> > >> > original shlokas? I do not think that any worksheet (the

> only

> > >> argument I

> > >> > have seen offered from your side) exhisted in those days

or

> > >> even 20

> > >> > years back in India.

> > >> >

> > >> > I am certain you will again try to attribute different

> meaning to

> > >> what I

> > >> > have said above. Just to illustrate where the system you

> are

> > >> advocating

> > >> > has its focus, try to find out why 10th and 6th house

are

> of prime

> > >> > importance there.

> > >> > Chandrashekhar.

> > >> >

> > >> >

> > >> > Ash wrote:

> > >> >

> > >> > > Dear Chandrashekhar,

> > >> > >

> > >> > > No where have I ever said that any system is superior

to

> > >> another.

> > >> > > This is your inference.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > First thing. Have you bothered to read the write up

on

> the

> > >> worksheet

> > >> > > and how its derived. Based on that you can give your

> expert

> > >> > > comments. If you havent read it and are just going by

> your

> > >> > > assumptions this conversation will get no where.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > Secondly I am not trying to show anyone down or saying

> anything

> > >> is

> > >> > > superior or inferior. KAS has been discolosed to the

> world and

> > >> with

> > >> > > that one can time events very precicely. For that and

to

> > >> understand

> > >> > > how one has to experience it and then one can comment

on

> if

> > >> something

> > >> > > is right or wrong.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > My assumption from this entire conversation is that

you

> have not

> > >> tried

> > >> > > to understand KAS and just holding on to the limited

> texts on

> > >> > > Ashtakvarga that is available and passing judgements

and

> > >> proclaiming

> > >> > > that the use of Ashtakvarga is for transits as said by

> the texts

> > >> and I

> > >> > > am trying to get people away from such an

understanding.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > The point where this conversation stands is before

> passing any

> > >> > > judgement one must experience it first. Try it on

> various

> > >> charts

> > >> and

> > >> > > try to understand the theory. For that one needs to

> keep an

> > >> open

> > >> > > mind and one must be encouraged. So many new students

> are there

> > >> who

> > >> > > can benefit and learn how to time events using KAS.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > Rest of the answers in CAPS.

> > >> > >

> > >> > >

> > >> > > */Chandrashekhar <boxdel>/* wrote:

> > >> > >

> > >> > > Dear Ash,

> > >> > > I have never said that the system of strength used

> by me is

> > >> > > consistent.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > ASH : YOU HAD SAID THAT JU IS WEAKER THAN SA FOR

7TH

> > >> HOUSE. I

> > >> > > HAVE SAID THAT AS PER THE WORKSHEET BOTH ARE WEAK

> BUT IF ONE

> > >> WANTS

> > >> > > TO GET TO THE NITTY GRITTY THEN JU IS STRONGER

THAN

> SA BY 1

> > >> > > BINDU. THIS IS THE OVERALL EFFECT. I AM SAYING

> THAT THIS

> > >> WILL BE

> > >> > > CONSISTENT FOR ALL PERSONS USING KAS. SO LETS

CLOSE

> ON THIS

> > >> > > POINT. AS FAR AS CONSISTENCY IS CONCERNED. HERE

THE

> > >> READERS

> > >> CAN

> > >> > > SEE FOR THEMSELVES UPON APPLICATION OF KAS.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > If you want to ascribe what has not been said, I

> think others

> > >> > > reading the discussion can draw their own

> conclusions.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > ASH : ABSOLUTELY. THAT IS WHY YOU AND ME HAVE

TAKEN

> THIS

> > >> MUCH

> > >> > > PAIN TO GO THROUGH THIS DEBATE. I REALLY HOPE

> PEOPLE TRY TO

> > >> > > UNDERSTAND BOTH STANDS.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > I had already explained how strength of Saturn

was

> arrived

> > >> at in

> > >> > > my original mail to Lakshmi. None barring you has

so

> far

> > >> found

> > >> > > fault with it.So either you have not read the mail

> or you

> > >> have not

> > >> > > understood the parameters used.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > ASH : I HAVE READ THE MAIL. AT THE END OF THE DAY

> AS PER

> > >> KAS

> > >> BOTH

> > >> > > ARE WEAK. YOU CAN SEE THE STRENGTH OF GURU AND

> SHANI FOR ALL

> > >> > > HOUSES. THIS DISUCSION WAS ONLY FOR 7TH HOUSE AND

> FOR THAT

> > >> BOTH

> > >> > > ARE WEAK I.E. BOTH SA AND JU HAVE POINTS LESS THAN

> 12 AS PER

> > >> > > THE WORKSHEET AND IT MEANS BOTH ARE WEAK. JUST

FOR

> THE

> > >> READERS IF

> > >> > > POINTS ARE < 12 IN THE WORKSHEET IT MEANS THAT

> PLANETS

> > >> ARE NOT

> > >> > > CONDUSIVE FOR THE BENEFIC RESULT OF THAT HOUSE.

> THIS CAN BE

> > >> SEEN

> > >> > > IN A NUMERICAL MANNER.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > If you want to say that your system is superior to

> what has

> > >> been

> > >> > > taught by Parashara and other Acharyas, that is

your

> opinion.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > ASH : THIS IS YOUR ASSUMPTION. NO WHERE I HAVE

SAID

> IN ANY

> > >> EMAIL

> > >> > > THAT ANYTHING IS SUPERIOR OR INFERIOR. INFACT I

AM

> SAYING

> > >> THAT

> > >> > > VARAHARMIRA AND PARSASARA HAVE BOTH TAUGHT

> ASHTAKAVARGA BUT

> > >> THE

> > >> > > SYSTEM TO TIME EVENTS IS NOT GIVEN WHICH IS WHAT

HAS

> BEEN

> > >> BROUGHT

> > >> > > FORWARD BY KRUSHNAJI. SO INFACT THIS IS A HUGE

> ACHEIVEMENT

> > >> FOR

> > >> > > THE JYOTISH WORLD WHERE ONE HAS A SYSTEM ABIDING

BY

> THE

> > >> CLASSICS

> > >> > > AND AN INTEGRAL PART OF VEDIC ASTROLOGY. IF YOU

ARE

> > >> TRYING TO

> > >> > > DISSUADE NEW LEARNERS OF JYOTISH TO LEARN SUCH A

GEM

> OF A

> > >> SYSTEM

> > >> > > WITHOUT FIRST EXPERIENCING IT FIRST HAND THAT

WOULD

> NOT BE

> > >> GOOD

> > >> > > SERVICE TO JYOTISH SHASTRA.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > I AM VERY SURE OF ONE THING. IF STUDENTS OF

JYOTISH

> SHASTRA

> > >> > > ACTUALLY KEEP AN OPEN MIND AND TRY TO GRASP THE

> ESSENCE

> > >> OF KAS

> > >> > > THEY WILL BE ABLE TO TIME EVENTS AND GET

CONFIDENCE

> IN

> > >> JYOTISH

> > >> > > SHASTRA. SO MY SUGGESTION IS THAT FIRST YOU TRY

THE

> SYSTEM

> > >> IF YOU

> > >> > > HAVENT ALREADY AND THEN MAKE A JUDGEMENT.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > In so far as consistency is concerned, as far as I

> know I

> > >> have

> > >> > > applied the principles given consistently. If I

may

> point

> > >> out, it

> > >> > > is you who equated Navamsha strength with Rasi

> strength.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > ASH : PLEASE DONT BELITTLE ANY TECHNIQUE WITHOUT

> FULLY

> > >> > > UNDERSTNADING IT. THIS IS NOT RIGHT. THERE ARE

35

> LESSONS

> > >> GIVEN

> > >> > > THIS FAR. MY SUGGESTION TO YOU AND REQUEST TO YOU

> IS GO

> > >> THOUGH

> > >> > > THEM AND APPLY THEM ON SEVERAL CHARTS AND THEN TRY

TO

> > >> UNDERSTAND

> > >> > > WHAT I HAVE TRIED TO SAY. YOU ALREADY KNOW YOUR

> SYSTEM SO

> > >> WHATS

> > >> > > THE HARM IN KEEP AN OPEN MIND.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > BY SAYING GURU SPOILS THE HOUSE ITS PLACED IN IS A

> HUGE STEP

> > >> AND

> > >> > > YOU KNOW THAT FOR PEOPLE TO ACCEPT. FOR YOU

> YOURSELF WOULD

> > >> EXPECT

> > >> > > PEOPLE TO KEEP ASIDE PRECONCEPTIONS AND NOTIONS

AND

> TRY TO

> > >> > > UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU HAVE SAID ISNT THAT SO ? SAME

> THING I AM

> > >> > > SAYING TO YOU.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > Again the worksheet being the sole argument being

> > >> advanced by

> > >> you

> > >> > > discussion on Vedic Astrology principles is not

> possible. If

> > >> > > different arguments are advanced every time under

the

> > >> garb of

> > >> a

> > >> > > different system and reference to original thread

is

> given a

> > >> go by

> > >> > > nothing can be achieved. This is why I had said

that

> > >> discussion

> > >> > > will be futile.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > ASH : THIS IS MY LAST POST ON THIS TOPIC. THERE

IS

> NOTHING

> > >> NEW.

> > >> > > THE LESSONS HAVENT CHANGED SINCE THE TIME THIS

> DISCUSSION

> > >> STARTED

> > >> > > AS YOU CLAIM THAT EACH TIME THERE IS SOMETHING NEW

> IN THE

> > >> GARB OF

> > >> > > A NEW SYSTEM. SYSTEM IS SAME AND LESSONS ARE SAME

> AND 35

> > >> LESSONS

> > >> > > CANNOT BE DISCUSSED IN A FEW EMAIL EXCHANGES. FOR

> THAT ONE

> > >> HAS TO

> > >> > > READ AND UNDERSTAND THE LESSONS FIRST AND MUST

KEEP

> AN OPEN

> > >> MIND.

> > >> > >

> > >> > >

> > >> > > Before closing the discussion, I will give an

> example of how

> > >> you

> > >> > > have changed stand to suit your viewpoint. On one

> hand you

> > >> said

> > >> > > that Parashara's Ashtakavarga is corrupt and on

the

> other

> > >> hand you

> > >> > > want to take help of what Parashara has said about

> who

> > >> should

> > >> use

> > >> > > Ashtakavarga.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > ASH : I KEEP SAYING THAT THE BAV SCHEME GIVEN BY

> PARASARA IS

> > >> > > DIFFERENT AS COMPARED TO VARHARMRIAS. BOTH CANNOT

BE

> > >> DIFFERENT.

> > >> > > PARASARAS VERSION HAS BECOME CORRUPT OVER TIME.

> WHAT IS IT

> > >> ABOUT

> > >> > > WHAT I HAVE WRITTEN THAT IS SO HARD TO

UNDERSTAND.

> I HAVE

> > >> NEVER

> > >> > > SAID NOR CLAIMED THAT PARASARA DID NOT TEACH

> ASHTAKAVARGA.

> > >> THERE

> > >> > > IS BIG DIFFERENCE.

> > >> > >

> > >> > >

> > >> > > Even here you have chosen to give only half of

what

> he has

> > >> said.

> > >> > > For record I shall write what he has said (hope

your

> > >> worksheet

> > >> > > does not have another version of Parashari). To

put

> record

> > >> > > straight it i9s not Parashara who has said what

you

> put

> > >> in his

> > >> > > mouth. It is Maitreya who says " *In Kaliyuga

human

> beings

> > >> will

> > >> > > become dull owing to their indulgence in sinful

> deeds and

> > >> > > therefore, be considerate and expound a system of

> > >> science /for the

> > >> > > persons who would be having slow perception /and

> through

> > >> which

> > >> > > they could gain a clear knowledge about their

> happiness,

> > >> sorrows

> > >> > > and longevity merely be delineating the position of

> > >> planets in

> > >> > > transi*t"

> > >> > >

> > >> > > ASH : I FAIL TO UNDERSTAND YOUR COMMENT ABOUT THE

> WORKSHEET

> > >> HAVING

> > >> > > A DIFFERENT VERSION OF PARASHARI. PLEASE READ MY

> COMMENT

> > >> ABOUT

> > >> > > THE MISCONCEPTION THAT YOU HAVE GOT THAT I HAVE

> CLEARED IN MY

> > >> > > PREVIOUS POINT.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > ON A FINAL NOTE. BPHS AS WE HAVE IT TODAY IS NOT

> > >> COMPLETE.

> > >> FOR

> > >> > > THIS PART YOU WERE SILENT AND DID NOT COMMENT WHEN

I

> HAVE

> > >> ASKED U

> > >> > > IN MY PREVIOUS MAIL. YOU BEING SO LEARNED MUST

KNOW

> THAT.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > THE KNOWLEGE OF ASHTAKAVARGA IS ALSO NOT COMPLETE

> OTHERWISE

> > >> THE

> > >> > > VERSES THAT WAS IN THE OLD HAND WRITTEN BOOKS OF

> KRUSHNAJIS

> > >> GURU

> > >> > > ON ASHTAKAVARGA WOULD BE FOUND IN SOME BOOK OR THE

> OTHER AND

> > >> SO

> > >> > > WOULD THIS SYSTEM ALSO.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > SO LET US NOT CLOSE OUR EYES AND MINDS TO THIS

> WONDERFUL

> > >> TOOL

> > >> AND

> > >> > > A SYSTEM WHICH IS GIVING SUCH WONDERFUL RESULTS

> DESPITE

> > >> KNOWING

> > >> > > AND BEING AWARE OF THE FACT ABOUT THE LOST

CHAPTERS

> OF BPHS

> > >> AND

> > >> > > MAYBE OTHER CLASSICS.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > Regards,

> > >> > > Chandrashekhar

> > >> > >

> > >> > > CHEERS !!!

> > >> > >

> > >> > > ASH

> > >> > >

> > >> > >

> > >> --------------------------

--

> -----

> > >> ------

> > >> > >

> > >> > > vote. <http://vote.

> > >> <http://vote./>> - Register online to vote

> > >> today!

> > >>

> > >>

> > >>

> > >>

> > >>

> > >> Group info: vedic-

> astrology/info.html

> > >>

> > >> To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-

>

> > >>

> > >> ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

> > >>

> > >>

> > >>

> > >>

> > > -------------------------------

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> > >

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> > >

> > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

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Dear Mukund,

 

Venus is natural karak for marriage. It rules 2nd house in kal

purush chart which is taurus. Venus also rules 8th house from 12th

house i.e. libra and is also karak for pleasures.

 

Functional karak is 2nd house based on the chart. If Scorpio is

lagna then functional karak would be Guru and natural karak is Venus.

 

Cheers !!!

Ash

 

 

vedic astrology, "monmuk111" <monmuk111>

wrote:

> Hello Ash:

>

> Why would the 8th house from a house become the Karaka? The

Karakas

> are set in stone, i.e Venus is the karaka for marriage, etc. The

> sages have already established the karakattatwa for various planets.

>

> Mukund

>

> vedic astrology, "ashsam73" <ashsam73>

> wrote:

> > Dear Chandrashekhar,

> >

> > In vedic texts no where it is written that Dhanu rashi is called

> > Saggitarius isnt it so ?. But people on this list still call it

> > Saggitarius and its accepted as Vedic Astrology. You can also

put

> > forward an argument that Parasara has never said Saggitarius is

> > Dhanu and no where in any scriptural reference is it called

> > by "Saggitarius". But we adapt and its understood that when

> someone

> > says Saggitarius it means Dhanu.

> >

> > Your approach is that if something does not have backing of some

> > shokes that is available in the limited pool of this antient

sience

> > as we know which is not complete its hard for you to digest

despite

> > the fact you know it works.

> >

> > For me it does not matter who wrote the shokes or how or where it

> was

> > found. For me I have to see something has to work and work

> > consistently. If it does it worth a million shokes.

> >

> > Mistakes everyone makes as no one can learn to walk without

falling

> > first and that a part of learning but its not because system does

> not

> > work. Its infact Krushnaji who encouraged me to make mistakes

and

> > told me thats the way I will learn as once u make a mistake the

> next

> > time one will remember why the person made the mistake and will

not

> > repeat it. Thats also the way finer things about KAS system will

> come

> > out. No 2 charts are same. So I am not afraid to make mistakes.

> >

> > Now Logic dictates that if something works then whatever is

taught

> is

> > proper. Now just because you cannot find the shokes in the

limited

> > texts that its available to you cannot be the basis to disregard

it

> > in my opinion. If you do that then one will be stuck in the

> limited

> > pool of information and never try to look beyond and always in

the

> > garb of saying that its not given in any scripture or not

supported

> > by any scriptures. I would agree with that approach IF the

> > scriptures were complete.

> >

> > That to me is common sense. But just to say that despite

something

> > working and one is not able to find sholokes and asking me again

> and

> > again to support your pallete and approach is in my opinion a

> futile

> > task. As to me what matters is something works and works

> > consistently.

> >

> > As per KAS 8th house from a house is called KARAK. You can

choose

> to

> > call it House A, 2nd from lagna, KARAK or whatever you would like

> as

> > long as u understand it.

> >

> > For me 8th house from a house is called KARAK or we call it House

> A.

> > 5th house from the house under focus is called House C. 10th

from

> a

> > house under focus is called D and 6th from a house under focus is

> > called House E and the use under focus is called B.

> >

> > I am not going to sit here and argue about the method MY TEACHER

> has

> > chosen to teach just because you like it to be called in a

certain

> > way or sanskrit terms. Many students who learn KAS might not even

> > know english or just a little bit of English. Just because you

> know

> > good Sanskrit and English and other languages it does not mean

> that

> > all know and can follow the same.

> >

> > If you also see on website Donna has created, Margarita has taken

> > pains to convert the lessons into French so that this knowledge

can

> > spread. Denis and Alain Poinsot have converted the worksheet

into

> > French so that it helps people from other non English /

> > Sanskrit/Hindi/Marathi etc countries so that this knowlege of

Vedic

> > Astrology and KAS spreads.

> >

> > You cannot judge the way others teach or how they teach. If one

is

> > willing to learn then he must abide by the way his teacher

chooses

> to

> > teach. Isnt that vedic culture ?

> >

> > If one uses 12 houses, nakshatras, graha dristi, ashtakavarga,

> > vimshottari dasha all sound principles as given by Maharishis.

> Isnt

> > that vedic astrology ?

> >

> >

> > Cheers !!!

> > Ash

> >

> > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar

> <boxdel>

> > wrote:

> > > Dear Ash,

> > >

> > > I note your saying that it is hard for me to stomach what you

> have

> > said.

> > > I will tell you why. You have not made any remarks about the

> > shlokas. I

> > > do not understand why this hesitance since you claim that the

> > system is

> > > Vedic Astrology. You have also, not commented about mention of

> > wrong

> > > names of even sages in the lessons of KAS. You have also chosen

> not

> > to

> > > comment on the portion from the lesson posted. Do I understand

> that

> > the

> > > position about beneficence or malfeasance of planets has now

been

> > > changed ? If so why? If this is Vedic astrology why refer to

> house

> > > aspected as C or D or anything else rather than give them their

> > proper

> > > names in accordance with Vedic Astrology? If Vedic Astrology

then

> > how

> > > can the defined aspects of Jupiter be changed? You say:

> > > "I HAVE ALSO GONE ON TO COMMENT THAT FROM KAS VIEW POINT ALSO

> MARS

> > WILL

> > > NOT BE ABLE TO GIVE THE RESULT OF THE HOUSE ITS PLACED IN AS

MARS

> > > ASPECTS 8TH HOUSE FROM THE HOUSE LOCATED AND 8TH HOUSE IS KARAK

> AS

> > PER

> > > TERMINOLOGY. "

> > > Since when is a house itself a Karaka in Vedic Astrology terms?

> > Could

> > > you quote at least one shloka, from any known text on Vedic

> > Astrology,

> > > saying this? If that is also a "secret-unrevealed" how does one

> > take the

> > > statement about the system being Vedic Astrology to be right?

> > Should

> > > that not be possible, It is difficult to believe Vedic

Astrology

> > origin

> > > of the system. If this is not Vedic Astrology then how can one

> hold

> > > discussions in a rational manner, on a list devoted to Vedic

> > Astrology?

> > > This is why I said it would be futile to carry on this

> discussion.

> > > Unless texts are quoted in support of theories advanced or at

> least

> > > similar observations from standard texts quoted, I do not see

any

> > point

> > > in carrying on this discussion.

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > > Chandrashekhar.

> > >

> > > Ash wrote:

> > >

> > > > Dear Chandrashekhar,

> > > >

> > > > You have quoted

> > > >

> > > > " For the knowledge of all I am pasting below the last

> paragraph

> > of

> > > > that lesson, which will confirm that even your own system

> > confirms

> > > > that Saturn does not give malefic effects for the house it is

> > placed

> > > > in. The lesson also says that Jupiter with more Bindus gives

> > malefic

> > > > aspect. Your argument has been that Jupiter with more bindu

is

> a

> > > > Benefic in all 12 bhavas."

> > > >

> > > > ASH : I HAVE TOLD YOU RIGHT IN THE BEGINING THAT I AGREE WITH

> > YOUR

> > > > ORIGINAL POINT AND MY DISCUSSION WAS NOT ON THE BASIC THREAD

> > ABOUT

> > > > GURU SPOILING THE RESULT.

> > > >

> > > > I HAVE ALREADY TOLD YOU MY STAND THAT IF THE SAME IS SEEN

FROM

> > KAS

> > > > VIEW POINT GURU WILL ASPECT HOUSE C OR ONE OF THE PRIMARY

> > SIGNIFICATOR

> > > > HOUSES AND THEREBY ITSELF WILL BE UNABLE TO GIVE THE RESULT

AND

> > ITS

> > > > SAMDHARMI WILL GIVE. SUCH THINGS ARE ALL PART OF KAS AND

THERE

> > WAS

> > > > NOTHING TO DISCUSS. ITS OTHERS WHO HAVE A HARD TIME TO

> STOMACH

> > AS

> > > > YOU HAVE SAID AND SUCH THINGS AS MY POINTS ON ASHTAKAVARGA

ARE

> > HARD

> > > > FOR YOU TO STOMACH.

> > > >

> > > > IN THAT MAIL IF MEMORY SERVES ME RIGHT I HAVE ALSO SAID THAT

> > SHANI IF

> > > > IT HAS POWER AS PER THE WORKSHEET AND IF DELAY IS OVER AND BY

> > THAT I

> > > > MEAN COMBINED OR WORKSHEET STRENGTH OF > 12 THEN ITSELF CAN

> GIVE

> > > > RESULT AS SHANI ITSELF DOES NOT ASPECT ANY PRIMARY

SIGNIFICATOR

> > > > HOUSES. I HAVE ALSO GONE ON TO COMMENT THAT FROM KAS VIEW

> POINT

> > ALSO

> > > > MARS WILL NOT BE ABLE TO GIVE THE RESULT OF THE HOUSE ITS

> PLACED

> > IN AS

> > > > MARS ASPECTS 8TH HOUSE FROM THE HOUSE LOCATED AND 8TH HOUSE

IS

> > KARAK

> > > > AS PER TERMINOLOGY. OFCOUSE THERE ARE EXCEPTIONS BUT I AM

> > TALKING IN

> > > > GENERAL CASE.

> > > >

> > > > I HAVE NEVER SAID THAT GURU WITH MORE POINTS IS BENEFIC FOR

ALL

> > 12

> > > > HOUSE !!! THERE MUST BE SOME MISUNDERTANDING.

> > > >

> > > > IF AS PER WORKSHEET IF GURU HAS MORE THAN 12 POINTS FOR ALL

12

> > HOUSES

> > > > THEN SUCH A GURU WILL GIVE BENEFIC RESULT FOR ALL 12 HOUSES.

> > > > AGAIN WE SHOULD ALSO KEEP IN MIND ABOUT THE POINT ABOUT GURU

> > ASPECTING

> > > > PRIMARY SIGNIFICATOR HOUSES ETC ETC.

> > > >

> > > > WORKSHEET GIVES FINAL STRENGH OF PLANET. WHAT YOU HAVE TAKED

> > ABOUT IS

> > > > SAV.

> > > >

> > > > WORKSHEEET IS DERIVED FROM SAV.

> > > >

> > > > PLEASE REFER TO THE ORIGINAL MAIL IN WHICH I HAVE GIVEN THE

> > WORKSHEET

> > > > OF RAMESH. I HAVE SAID CLEARLY THAT FOR 7TH HOSUE BOTH ARE

> WEAK

> > I.E

> > > > GURU AND SHANI. THIS IS BASED ON WORKSHEET TOTAL POINTS.

> TOTAL

> > OF

> > > > GURU = 11 AND THAT OF SHANI IS 10. THIS IS AND I EMPHASISE

THE

> > SUM OF

> > > > ROW 17 IN THE WORKSHEET.

> > > >

> > > > FOR RAMESH GURU IS FAR STRONGER FOR 10TH HOUSE THAN SHANI.

> THIS

> > AGAIN

> > > > IS BASED ON FINAL STRENGTH AS PER WORKSHEET. IN THE

WORKSHEET

> WE

> > ARE

> > > > TAKING COMBINED EFFECT OF ALL PLANETS AND THE ASPECTS.

> > > >

> > > > IF SA IS IN 5TH HOUSE AND SAY WITH 2 BINDUS THEN ITS ASPECT

ON

> > 7TH,

> > > > 11TH AND 2ND HOUSE WILL BE WITH +6 [THIS PORTION YOU HAVE CUT

> AND

> > > > PASTED]. SO THE BASIC STRENGH OF SA WILL BE AS PER BAV I.E.

> THE

> > > > BINDUS THAT SA GETS FOR 7TH, 11TH AND 2ND HOUSE AND THEN ITS

> OWN

> > > > ASPECT ON PRIMARY SIGNIFICATOR HOUSES WILL BE +18 I.E +6 FOR

> 7TH,

> > +6

> > > > ON 11 AND +6 ON 2ND.

> > > >

> > > > SO UNLESS THERE ARE A HOST OF PLANEST WITH > 4 BINDUS HAVING

> > DIRECT

> > > > ASPECT ON SHANI AND REDUCING ITS POINTS SHANI [AS THEY WILL

> > ASPECT

> > > > SHANI WITH A MALEFIC DRSITI AS PER THE PORITION THAT YOU HAVE

> CUT

> > AND

> > > > PASTE] WILL BE VERY STRONG FOR 7TH HOUSE MATTERS. I AM NOT

> > > > CONSIDERING EXCEPTIONS BUT TALKING OF GENERAL RULE.

> > > >

> > > > PLEASE DO NOT CONFUSE SAV WITH FINAL WORKSHEET WHICH I HAVE

> SEEN

> > YOU

> > > > DO IN OUR DISCUSSIONS. IN THE FINAL WORKSHEET THE PLANETS

CAN

> > GET

> > > > MORE THAN 8 POINTS. IN SAV THE PLANET CAN GET MAX 8 BINDUS

AND

> > THAT

> > > > IS BY LAGNA AND 7 PLANETS. PLEASE DO NOT CONFUSE DIFFERENT

> > ASPECTS OF

> > > > THE SYSTEM. IF YOU WANT TO DISCUSS THE NITTY AND GRITTY OF

KAS

> > WE CAN

> > > > DO IT ON KAS LIST AND STOP USING THE BANDWIDTH OF VA LIST.

> > > >

> > > > THERE IS NO MIS REPRESENTATION. PLEASE READ THE OTHER

CHAPTERS

> > AND

> > > > WHEN YOU STUDY THE WORKSHEET YOU WILL UNDERSTAND HOW PLANETS

> GET

> > THE

> > > > POINTS AND HOW THE PORTION GIVEN BY YOU IN THIS MAIL IS USED.

> > > >

> > > > THIS IS THE BASICS OF KAS.

> > > >

> > > > HAVE U STUDIED THE ARCHIVES OF THE LIST. YOU WILL SEE THAT

> AFTER

> > THE

> > > > INITIAL LESSON WAS GIVEN THERE WAS A LOT OF DISCUSSION ON

EACH

> > AND

> > > > EVERY LESSON AND FINER POINTS AND ALL QUESTIONS WERE

ANSWERED

> BY

> > SHRI

> > > > KRUSHNAJI WHICH AND WERE ALSO INCORPORATED IN THE LESSONS TO

> > REMOVE

> > > > ANY CONFUSION AND HENCE LABELED AS REVISED AS THEY WERE A

> > > > RIVISION FROM THE ORIGINAL VERSION AS TYPED BY KRUSHNAJI. I

> HOPE

> > THAT

> > > > CLARIFIES YOUR QUESTION ON WHY THINGS ARE LABELLED AS REVISED.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > I AGREE WITH YOU ON YOUR LAST POINT. TO HAVE RATIONAL

> DISCUSSION

> > ON A

> > > > SUBJECT ONE MUST HAVE GOOD UNDERSTANDING OF A SYSTEM ONE IS

> > DEBATING

> > > > ON. IN MY OPINION YOU HAVE FAILED TO GRASP THE ESSENCE OF

THE

> > POWER

> > > > SHOWED BY THE WORKSHEET. MAYBE ONCE YOU STUDY THE LESSONS

ON

> > > > WORKSHEET AND HOW ITS COMPUTED USING THE PORTION YOU HAVE CUT

> AND

> > > > PASTE MAYBE YOU WILL UNDERTSAND WHAT I HAVE SAID.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > CHEERS !!!

> > > > ASH

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > */Chandrashekhar <boxdel>/* wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Ash,

> > > > I am aware how the worksheet was created. The reference

was

> in

> > > > context of your advancing the argument that since work

> sheet

> > shows

> > > > a particular number it is the only correct position and

not

> > giving

> > > > any text reference to the argument advanced. You even

chose

> > to say

> > > > that there is inconsistency in Parashara's method of

> assessing

> > > > strength of planets. If my memory serves me right, the

> entire

> > > > discussion started with the dictum of Jupiter harming the

> > place he

> > > > occupies and Saturn protecting the same. For reasons best

> > known t

> > > > you, you chose to divert it to timing of events and then

> went

> > on

> > > > calling every system being corrupt but that advanced by

you.

> > > >

> > > > I had many times said that I do not mind which system one

> > follows

> > > > if one thinks it right. But carrying a serious discussion

> > thread

> > > > to a direction it was not aimed at and then advancing

> > arguments

> > > > with support of standard texts is a bit too much. When

none

> > of the

> > > > parameters accepted by all the Vedic astrologers including

> > > > Varahamihira , whose texts by your own declaration have

not

> > been

> > > > corrupted, are considered in the system and yet you want

to

> > call

> > > > it a Vedic Astrology in purest form is something very

> > confusing.

> > > >

> > > > I am certain if you show the entire argument thread to

> > Krushna, he

> > > > too will agree to the soundness of the arguments advanced

me

> > > > within the parameters prescribed by Vedic Astrology.

> > > >

> > > > In so far as reading the Lessons are concerned, would you

> > care to

> > > > explain as to why so many lessons had to be revised when

the

> > > > system is derived from some hidden and not available to

> > anybody

> > > > knowledge. the shlokas you are telling me to look at

> mention

> > > > wrong reference to names of Authors except Jataka

> Parijatakar.

> > > > You were reluctant to accept that these are available

when

> I

> > gave

> > > > you the other texts in which information on Ashtakavarga

is

> > given

> > > > at length. Even the Granthas from which the shlokas are

> taken

> > are

> > > > not named. You also talked disparagingly about

commentators

> > in an

> > > > earlier mail. Now I see why, Bhattotpal who haas written a

> > > > commentary on Varahamihira's Brihat Jataka is mentioned

in

> you

> > > > lesson as the original Acharya who has written Brihat

> Jataka.

> > > >

> > > > This does not deduct from the contribution of Bhattotpal,

I

> am

> > > > just mentioning the fact to show how your views are

biased

> > without

> > > > due consideration to the basis of your own favored

system.

> > For the

> > > > knowledge of all I am pasting below the last paragraph of

> that

> > > > lesson, which will confirm that even your own system

> confirms

> > that

> > > > Saturn does not give malefic effects for the house it is

> > placed

> > > > in. The lesson also says that Jupiter with more Bindus

gives

> > > > malefic aspect. Your argument has been that Jupiter with

> more

> > > > bindu is a Benefic in all 12 bhavas.

> > > >

> > > > *"The Late Shri K.S. Krishanamurti, founder of K.P.

> Paddhat,

> > also

> > > > agrees that the planets do not give the results as per

their

> > > > natural natures. In reference to Jupiter, he states that

it

> > has

> > > > lost its benefic power in the era of Kalyuga and that he

has

> > > > experienced the malefic effects of Jupiter firsthand. But

> in

> > spite

> > > > of Kalyuga, I tend to disagree. It is the effect of the

> points

> > > > that it receives in its own place that truly makes the

> > difference.

> > > > An aspect of Jupiter with more points is always malefic.

> The

> > same

> > > > rule applies to all planets. With reference to Saturn,

> > > > Krishnamurti says it gives malefic effects based on the

> > > > constellation in which it resides. Perhaps, if he would

> have

> > come

> > > > across the Ashtakavarga system first, his whole theory

> would

> > have

> > > > been quite different. "

> > > >

> > > > Since you have all along been saying that Jupiter will be

> > stronger

> > > > than Saturn having 4 bindus as against 1 of Saturn and

> think I

> > > > have not understood your system, let me reproduce below

what

> > > > Krushna has said in Lesson 3 and effects overall of the

> > planets.

> > > > Let the others who are watching our discussions decide

what

> > is the

> > > > right position under your system.

> > > > MALEFIC AND BENEFIC PLANETARY ASPECTS TABLE

> > > >

> > > >

> > 1

> > > >

> > 2

> > > >

3

> > > > MAXIMUM POINTS ALLOWED IN HOUSE BENEFIC POINTS

ACQUIRED

> BY

> > THE

> > > > PLANET ITS EFFECT IN THE HOUSE WHERE IT

> > > >

> > 4

> > > > 5

> > > > IS THE OPPOSITE ASPECT THAT IT CREATES AND

ITS

> > > > FINAL EFFECT

> > > > _1 2 3

> > > > 4 5_

> > > >

> > > > 8 0 Malefic by -8 Plus

> > 8

> > > > Benefic

> > > > 8 1 Malefic by -7 Plus

> > 7

> > > > Benefic

> > > > 8 2 Malefic by -6 Plus

> > 6

> > > > Benefic

> > > > 8 3 Malefic by -5 Plus

> > 5

> > > > Benefic

> > > >

> > > > 8 4 NEUTRAL WITH 4 NEUTRAL WITH 4 NEUTRAL

WITH 4

> > > >

> > > > 8 5 Benefic by +5 Minus

> > 5

> > > > Malefic

> > > > 8 6 Benefic by +6 Minus

> > 6

> > > > Malefic

> > > > 8 7 Benefic by +7 Minus

> > 7

> > > > Malefic

> > > > 8 8 Benefic by +8 Minus

> > 8

> > > > Malefic

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > *

> > > > I do not wish to extend the argument further as there is

no

> > point

> > > > when, even with a different system, one chooses to

> > misrepresent

> > > > what has been said in that system to advance one's

> argument.

> > No

> > > > one can have a rational discussion in this manner.

> > > >

> > > > Regards,

> > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > ashsam73 wrote:

> > > >

> > > >> Dear Chandrashekhar,

> > > >>

> > > >> I shall try once again to explain rather than get

personal.

> > > >>

> > > >> If you are using Jaganatha Hora Software please go to

> > Preference,

> > > >> Related to Calculation, Ashtakavarga Calculation

> Preferences.

> > > >>

> > > >> Please carefully read what the Author of the software

has

> > written in

> > > >> the setting response box about the check boxes.

> > > >>

> > > >> I am quoting whats written.

> > > >>

> > > >> "If you want to use Parasara's definitions, check all

the

> > options

> > > >> below"

> > > >>

> > > >> "If you want to use Varharamira's definitions, uncheck

all

> > the

> > > >> options below".

> > > >>

> > > >> I am saying that its not possible to have a different

> scheme

> > and

> > > >> either one of the schemes has got corrupt over time. I

> > recon its

> > > >> Parasaras that has got corrupt.

> > > >>

> > > >> There is nothing about being superior or inferior. I

keep

> > saying

> > > >> this part again and again and you keep thinking that I

am

> > comparing

> > > >> and saying one is superior and other is inferior.

> > > >>

> > > >> I think it will now be clear that Parasaras BAV scheme

is

> > different

> > > >> from Varharmiras.

> > > >>

> > > >> KAS uses Varharmiras scheme.

> > > >>

> > > >> The worksheet in Excel did not exist 20 years back.

> > > >>

> > > >> If you have claimed to have studied the lessons then how

> is

> > it that

> > > >> you have not observed that a lesson on casting the

> worksheet

> > > >> manually

> > > >> has been given. Lesson 7.

> > > >>

> > > >> I think pen and paper existed 20 years back. Worksheet

is

> a

> > term I

> > > >> use as Sanjay Jaggia has made a worksheet to help make

all

> > these

> > > >> computations easy.

> > > >>

> > > >> About the point of Quoting shokes is your style of doing

> > things. If

> > > >> you had bothered to read the lessons you would not have

> > asked me

> > > >> this

> > > >> question. Have you read lesson 2. Sanskrit shloks that

> you

> > have

> > > >> asked for are given there.

> > > >>

> > > >> Thanking you,

> > > >> Cheers !!!

> > > >> Ash

> > > >>

> > > >> vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar

> > <boxdel>

> > > >> wrote:

> > > >> > Dear Ash,

> > > >> > I do not understand what you mean by saying there is

> > inconsistency

> > > >> in

> > > >> > the strength derived by the traditional system and

> telling

> > that

> > > >> some

> > > >> > other system by saying

> > > >> > "I AM SAYING THAT VARAHARMIRA AND PARSASARA HAVE BOTH

> > TAUGHT

> > > >> > ASHTAKAVARGA BUT THE SYSTEM TO TIME EVENTS IS NOT

GIVEN

> > WHICH IS

> > > >> WHAT

> > > >> > HAS BEEN BROUGHT FORWARD BY KRUSHNAJI. SO INFACT THIS

> IS

> > A HUGE

> > > >> > ACHEIVEMENT FOR THE JYOTISH WORLD WHERE ONE HAS A

SYSTEM

> > > >> ABIDING BY

> > > >> THE

> > > >> > CLASSICS AND AN INTEGRAL PART OF VEDIC ASTROLOGY. IF

> YOU

> > ARE

> > > >> TRYING TO

> > > >> > DISSUADE NEW LEARNERS OF JYOTISH TO LEARN SUCH A GEM

OF

> A

> > SYSTEM

> > > >> WITHOUT

> > > >> > FIRST EXPERIENCING IT FIRST HAND THAT WOULD NOT BE

GOOD

> > SERVICE TO

> > > >> > JYOTISH SHASTRA." (your words). If this does not infer

> > that the

> > > >> system

> > > >> > is superior to the Parashara system, perhaps my grasp

of

> > the

> > > >> English

> > > >> > language is not as good as yours.

> > > >> >

> > > >> > About whether I have bothered to understand the

system,

> > please

> > > >> find

> > > >> out

> > > >> > the list of members of the relevant list and then

> comment.

> > You

> > > >> will

> > > >> be

> > > >> > surprised. If you want others to learn a system that

you

> > like

> > > >> it is

> > > >> all

> > > >> > right with me. However every argument being based on

> other

> > systems

> > > >> > having been corrupt are difficult to stomacha. If as

you

> > say the

> > > >> system

> > > >> > is the only pure version available of the ancient

texts,

> > why not

> > > >> quote

> > > >> > original shlokas? I do not think that any worksheet

(the

> > only

> > > >> argument I

> > > >> > have seen offered from your side) exhisted in those

days

> or

> > > >> even 20

> > > >> > years back in India.

> > > >> >

> > > >> > I am certain you will again try to attribute different

> > meaning to

> > > >> what I

> > > >> > have said above. Just to illustrate where the system

you

> > are

> > > >> advocating

> > > >> > has its focus, try to find out why 10th and 6th house

> are

> > of prime

> > > >> > importance there.

> > > >> > Chandrashekhar.

> > > >> >

> > > >> >

> > > >> > Ash wrote:

> > > >> >

> > > >> > > Dear Chandrashekhar,

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > No where have I ever said that any system is

superior

> to

> > > >> another.

> > > >> > > This is your inference.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > First thing. Have you bothered to read the write up

> on

> > the

> > > >> worksheet

> > > >> > > and how its derived. Based on that you can give

your

> > expert

> > > >> > > comments. If you havent read it and are just going

by

> > your

> > > >> > > assumptions this conversation will get no where.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > Secondly I am not trying to show anyone down or

saying

> > anything

> > > >> is

> > > >> > > superior or inferior. KAS has been discolosed to

the

> > world and

> > > >> with

> > > >> > > that one can time events very precicely. For that

and

> to

> > > >> understand

> > > >> > > how one has to experience it and then one can

comment

> on

> > if

> > > >> something

> > > >> > > is right or wrong.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > My assumption from this entire conversation is that

> you

> > have not

> > > >> tried

> > > >> > > to understand KAS and just holding on to the limited

> > texts on

> > > >> > > Ashtakvarga that is available and passing judgements

> and

> > > >> proclaiming

> > > >> > > that the use of Ashtakvarga is for transits as said

by

> > the texts

> > > >> and I

> > > >> > > am trying to get people away from such an

> understanding.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > The point where this conversation stands is before

> > passing any

> > > >> > > judgement one must experience it first. Try it on

> > various

> > > >> charts

> > > >> and

> > > >> > > try to understand the theory. For that one needs to

> > keep an

> > > >> open

> > > >> > > mind and one must be encouraged. So many new

students

> > are there

> > > >> who

> > > >> > > can benefit and learn how to time events using KAS.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > Rest of the answers in CAPS.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > */Chandrashekhar <boxdel>/* wrote:

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > Dear Ash,

> > > >> > > I have never said that the system of strength

used

> > by me is

> > > >> > > consistent.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > ASH : YOU HAD SAID THAT JU IS WEAKER THAN SA FOR

> 7TH

> > > >> HOUSE. I

> > > >> > > HAVE SAID THAT AS PER THE WORKSHEET BOTH ARE

WEAK

> > BUT IF ONE

> > > >> WANTS

> > > >> > > TO GET TO THE NITTY GRITTY THEN JU IS STRONGER

> THAN

> > SA BY 1

> > > >> > > BINDU. THIS IS THE OVERALL EFFECT. I AM SAYING

> > THAT THIS

> > > >> WILL BE

> > > >> > > CONSISTENT FOR ALL PERSONS USING KAS. SO LETS

> CLOSE

> > ON THIS

> > > >> > > POINT. AS FAR AS CONSISTENCY IS CONCERNED.

HERE

> THE

> > > >> READERS

> > > >> CAN

> > > >> > > SEE FOR THEMSELVES UPON APPLICATION OF KAS.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > If you want to ascribe what has not been said, I

> > think others

> > > >> > > reading the discussion can draw their own

> > conclusions.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > ASH : ABSOLUTELY. THAT IS WHY YOU AND ME HAVE

> TAKEN

> > THIS

> > > >> MUCH

> > > >> > > PAIN TO GO THROUGH THIS DEBATE. I REALLY HOPE

> > PEOPLE TRY TO

> > > >> > > UNDERSTAND BOTH STANDS.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > I had already explained how strength of Saturn

> was

> > arrived

> > > >> at in

> > > >> > > my original mail to Lakshmi. None barring you

has

> so

> > far

> > > >> found

> > > >> > > fault with it.So either you have not read the

mail

> > or you

> > > >> have not

> > > >> > > understood the parameters used.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > ASH : I HAVE READ THE MAIL. AT THE END OF THE

DAY

> > AS PER

> > > >> KAS

> > > >> BOTH

> > > >> > > ARE WEAK. YOU CAN SEE THE STRENGTH OF GURU AND

> > SHANI FOR ALL

> > > >> > > HOUSES. THIS DISUCSION WAS ONLY FOR 7TH HOUSE

AND

> > FOR THAT

> > > >> BOTH

> > > >> > > ARE WEAK I.E. BOTH SA AND JU HAVE POINTS LESS

THAN

> > 12 AS PER

> > > >> > > THE WORKSHEET AND IT MEANS BOTH ARE WEAK. JUST

> FOR

> > THE

> > > >> READERS IF

> > > >> > > POINTS ARE < 12 IN THE WORKSHEET IT MEANS THAT

> > PLANETS

> > > >> ARE NOT

> > > >> > > CONDUSIVE FOR THE BENEFIC RESULT OF THAT HOUSE.

> > THIS CAN BE

> > > >> SEEN

> > > >> > > IN A NUMERICAL MANNER.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > If you want to say that your system is superior

to

> > what has

> > > >> been

> > > >> > > taught by Parashara and other Acharyas, that is

> your

> > opinion.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > ASH : THIS IS YOUR ASSUMPTION. NO WHERE I HAVE

> SAID

> > IN ANY

> > > >> EMAIL

> > > >> > > THAT ANYTHING IS SUPERIOR OR INFERIOR. INFACT I

> AM

> > SAYING

> > > >> THAT

> > > >> > > VARAHARMIRA AND PARSASARA HAVE BOTH TAUGHT

> > ASHTAKAVARGA BUT

> > > >> THE

> > > >> > > SYSTEM TO TIME EVENTS IS NOT GIVEN WHICH IS WHAT

> HAS

> > BEEN

> > > >> BROUGHT

> > > >> > > FORWARD BY KRUSHNAJI. SO INFACT THIS IS A HUGE

> > ACHEIVEMENT

> > > >> FOR

> > > >> > > THE JYOTISH WORLD WHERE ONE HAS A SYSTEM ABIDING

> BY

> > THE

> > > >> CLASSICS

> > > >> > > AND AN INTEGRAL PART OF VEDIC ASTROLOGY. IF YOU

> ARE

> > > >> TRYING TO

> > > >> > > DISSUADE NEW LEARNERS OF JYOTISH TO LEARN SUCH A

> GEM

> > OF A

> > > >> SYSTEM

> > > >> > > WITHOUT FIRST EXPERIENCING IT FIRST HAND THAT

> WOULD

> > NOT BE

> > > >> GOOD

> > > >> > > SERVICE TO JYOTISH SHASTRA.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > I AM VERY SURE OF ONE THING. IF STUDENTS OF

> JYOTISH

> > SHASTRA

> > > >> > > ACTUALLY KEEP AN OPEN MIND AND TRY TO GRASP THE

> > ESSENCE

> > > >> OF KAS

> > > >> > > THEY WILL BE ABLE TO TIME EVENTS AND GET

> CONFIDENCE

> > IN

> > > >> JYOTISH

> > > >> > > SHASTRA. SO MY SUGGESTION IS THAT FIRST YOU TRY

> THE

> > SYSTEM

> > > >> IF YOU

> > > >> > > HAVENT ALREADY AND THEN MAKE A JUDGEMENT.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > In so far as consistency is concerned, as far as

I

> > know I

> > > >> have

> > > >> > > applied the principles given consistently. If I

> may

> > point

> > > >> out, it

> > > >> > > is you who equated Navamsha strength with Rasi

> > strength.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > ASH : PLEASE DONT BELITTLE ANY TECHNIQUE WITHOUT

> > FULLY

> > > >> > > UNDERSTNADING IT. THIS IS NOT RIGHT. THERE ARE

> 35

> > LESSONS

> > > >> GIVEN

> > > >> > > THIS FAR. MY SUGGESTION TO YOU AND REQUEST TO

YOU

> > IS GO

> > > >> THOUGH

> > > >> > > THEM AND APPLY THEM ON SEVERAL CHARTS AND THEN

TRY

> TO

> > > >> UNDERSTAND

> > > >> > > WHAT I HAVE TRIED TO SAY. YOU ALREADY KNOW YOUR

> > SYSTEM SO

> > > >> WHATS

> > > >> > > THE HARM IN KEEP AN OPEN MIND.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > BY SAYING GURU SPOILS THE HOUSE ITS PLACED IN IS

A

> > HUGE STEP

> > > >> AND

> > > >> > > YOU KNOW THAT FOR PEOPLE TO ACCEPT. FOR YOU

> > YOURSELF WOULD

> > > >> EXPECT

> > > >> > > PEOPLE TO KEEP ASIDE PRECONCEPTIONS AND NOTIONS

> AND

> > TRY TO

> > > >> > > UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU HAVE SAID ISNT THAT SO ?

SAME

> > THING I AM

> > > >> > > SAYING TO YOU.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > Again the worksheet being the sole argument being

> > > >> advanced by

> > > >> you

> > > >> > > discussion on Vedic Astrology principles is not

> > possible. If

> > > >> > > different arguments are advanced every time

under

> the

> > > >> garb of

> > > >> a

> > > >> > > different system and reference to original

thread

> is

> > given a

> > > >> go by

> > > >> > > nothing can be achieved. This is why I had said

> that

> > > >> discussion

> > > >> > > will be futile.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > ASH : THIS IS MY LAST POST ON THIS TOPIC. THERE

> IS

> > NOTHING

> > > >> NEW.

> > > >> > > THE LESSONS HAVENT CHANGED SINCE THE TIME THIS

> > DISCUSSION

> > > >> STARTED

> > > >> > > AS YOU CLAIM THAT EACH TIME THERE IS SOMETHING

NEW

> > IN THE

> > > >> GARB OF

> > > >> > > A NEW SYSTEM. SYSTEM IS SAME AND LESSONS ARE

SAME

> > AND 35

> > > >> LESSONS

> > > >> > > CANNOT BE DISCUSSED IN A FEW EMAIL EXCHANGES.

FOR

> > THAT ONE

> > > >> HAS TO

> > > >> > > READ AND UNDERSTAND THE LESSONS FIRST AND MUST

> KEEP

> > AN OPEN

> > > >> MIND.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > Before closing the discussion, I will give an

> > example of how

> > > >> you

> > > >> > > have changed stand to suit your viewpoint. On

one

> > hand you

> > > >> said

> > > >> > > that Parashara's Ashtakavarga is corrupt and on

> the

> > other

> > > >> hand you

> > > >> > > want to take help of what Parashara has said

about

> > who

> > > >> should

> > > >> use

> > > >> > > Ashtakavarga.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > ASH : I KEEP SAYING THAT THE BAV SCHEME GIVEN BY

> > PARASARA IS

> > > >> > > DIFFERENT AS COMPARED TO VARHARMRIAS. BOTH

CANNOT

> BE

> > > >> DIFFERENT.

> > > >> > > PARASARAS VERSION HAS BECOME CORRUPT OVER TIME.

> > WHAT IS IT

> > > >> ABOUT

> > > >> > > WHAT I HAVE WRITTEN THAT IS SO HARD TO

> UNDERSTAND.

> > I HAVE

> > > >> NEVER

> > > >> > > SAID NOR CLAIMED THAT PARASARA DID NOT TEACH

> > ASHTAKAVARGA.

> > > >> THERE

> > > >> > > IS BIG DIFFERENCE.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > Even here you have chosen to give only half of

> what

> > he has

> > > >> said.

> > > >> > > For record I shall write what he has said (hope

> your

> > > >> worksheet

> > > >> > > does not have another version of Parashari). To

> put

> > record

> > > >> > > straight it i9s not Parashara who has said what

> you

> > put

> > > >> in his

> > > >> > > mouth. It is Maitreya who says " *In Kaliyuga

> human

> > beings

> > > >> will

> > > >> > > become dull owing to their indulgence in sinful

> > deeds and

> > > >> > > therefore, be considerate and expound a system of

> > > >> science /for the

> > > >> > > persons who would be having slow perception /and

> > through

> > > >> which

> > > >> > > they could gain a clear knowledge about their

> > happiness,

> > > >> sorrows

> > > >> > > and longevity merely be delineating the position

of

> > > >> planets in

> > > >> > > transi*t"

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > ASH : I FAIL TO UNDERSTAND YOUR COMMENT ABOUT

THE

> > WORKSHEET

> > > >> HAVING

> > > >> > > A DIFFERENT VERSION OF PARASHARI. PLEASE READ

MY

> > COMMENT

> > > >> ABOUT

> > > >> > > THE MISCONCEPTION THAT YOU HAVE GOT THAT I HAVE

> > CLEARED IN MY

> > > >> > > PREVIOUS POINT.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > ON A FINAL NOTE. BPHS AS WE HAVE IT TODAY IS NOT

> > > >> COMPLETE.

> > > >> FOR

> > > >> > > THIS PART YOU WERE SILENT AND DID NOT COMMENT

WHEN

> I

> > HAVE

> > > >> ASKED U

> > > >> > > IN MY PREVIOUS MAIL. YOU BEING SO LEARNED MUST

> KNOW

> > THAT.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > THE KNOWLEGE OF ASHTAKAVARGA IS ALSO NOT

COMPLETE

> > OTHERWISE

> > > >> THE

> > > >> > > VERSES THAT WAS IN THE OLD HAND WRITTEN BOOKS OF

> > KRUSHNAJIS

> > > >> GURU

> > > >> > > ON ASHTAKAVARGA WOULD BE FOUND IN SOME BOOK OR

THE

> > OTHER AND

> > > >> SO

> > > >> > > WOULD THIS SYSTEM ALSO.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > SO LET US NOT CLOSE OUR EYES AND MINDS TO THIS

> > WONDERFUL

> > > >> TOOL

> > > >> AND

> > > >> > > A SYSTEM WHICH IS GIVING SUCH WONDERFUL RESULTS

> > DESPITE

> > > >> KNOWING

> > > >> > > AND BEING AWARE OF THE FACT ABOUT THE LOST

> CHAPTERS

> > OF BPHS

> > > >> AND

> > > >> > > MAYBE OTHER CLASSICS.

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > Regards,

> > > >> > > Chandrashekhar

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > CHEERS !!!

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > ASH

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > >

> > > >> ------------------------

--

> --

> > -----

> > > >> ------

> > > >> > >

> > > >> > > vote. <http://vote.

> > > >> <http://vote./>> - Register online to vote

> > > >> today!

> > > >>

> > > >>

> > > >>

> > > >>

> > > >>

> > > >> Group info: vedic-

> > astrology/info.html

> > > >>

> > > >> To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-

> >

> > > >>

> > > >> ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

> > > >>

> > > >>

> > > >>

> > > >>

> > > > -----------------------------

--

> --

> > ------

> > > >

> > > > Mail

> > > >

> >

>

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> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Group info: vedic-

> astrology/info.html

> > > >

> > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-

> >

> > > >

> > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > * Sponsor*

> > > >

> > > > click here

> > > >

> >

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> > pf=PLApply&media=EMYHNL40WL1004SS>

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > -----------------------------

--

> --

> > ------

> > > > * Links*

> > > >

> > > > *

> > > > vedic astrology/

> > > >

> > > > *

> > > > vedic astrology

> > > > <vedic astrology?

> > subject=Un>

> > > >

> > > > *

Terms

> of

> > > > Service <>.

> > > >

> > > >

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