Astrological challange beyond your wildest fantasy

[Guest guest]

-Humble, humble, humbler= is in order

-As is: Adjust, adjust..No room for denial..

WOW! Life is getting more and more exciting!

/Adhnana lagna, conception chart... how many concepts we've used to use will become 'obsolete'?/

Futuristic astrology unter portas- Jay, I know you'll like this!"J.Weiss"

<jayhw (AT) telia (DOT) com> wrote:

Hi all,

 

We have seen various astrological dilemmas in the past, some of which remain a future challenge.

If the surrogate mother issue confused you in the past, this one will blow your

mind out as it is beyond anything known so far, breaking every rule in the

book(s)!

 

Imagine that a woman's eggs are fertilized outside the womb. Nothing new about that, right ?

That was back in 1990.

As a result of this process 12 embryos were 'created' of which 4 were returned

to the mothers womb, 2 were accepted, resulting in the birth of 2 healthy girls

(now about 11 years old).

The other 8 embryos were FROZEN and stored in the hospital!

 

Two years ago the couple decided to have more children and the hospital

defrosted 4 of the frozen embryos, which were placed in the mothers womb, three

were accepted, one removed AND 2 developed normaly into a boy and a girl that

were born about 9 month ago.

That is 12 years (!!!) AFTER 'creation'.

The doctors say that the now 9 month old twins develop normally.

 

The above true event happened in Jerusalem's (Israel) Hadasa hospital and the

entire story appears in the February issue of "The Reproduction Journal" and I

assume will be available on the net in a couple of month

(http://www.reproduction-online.org/).

 

This event is a historical and as such it is in a complete opposition to any

theory of a conception chart in relation with a birth chart.

 

Instead of writing tons of astrological and moral issues here I leave the rest

to your vivid imagination.

 

What does any learned astrologer have to say about such a challenge ?

 

Blessings/Jay Weisshttp://www.alvicomm.com/http://www.alvicomm.com/privat.htm

 

 

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[Guest guest]

||Om Brihaspataye Namah||

 

Dear Jay,

 

What is the challenge? I fail to see one...Jyotish is based on

nature and the natural scheme of things. The case that you cite is

not natural (works against the laws of nature) and hence I doubt if

Jyotish is applicable in this case. This case is proof that there is

a divine intelligence operating above us.

 

Having said that, I think that Jyotish must certainly be applicable

in the charts of the parents to show that child birth must have

occurred at the specified times.

 

Here's another real-life case for you to ponder: An intelligent

Jyotisha & his wife in their late forties and childless had gone to

Varanasi or some such holy place to perform the rites for their

ancestors AND themselves (thus acknowledging that there would be no

child to do the rites for themselves after they're long gone). Two

or three years later, a baby was born to them. Now these people are

in their early seventies and a handsome young man prances about

their home in such a searing display of divinity as can be seen

visually. What do you say for Jyotish in this case?

 

regards

Hari

 

vedic astrology, "J.Weiss" <jayhw@t...> wrote:

> Hi all,

>

> We have seen various astrological dilemmas in the past, some of

which remain a future challenge.

> If the surrogate mother issue confused you in the past, this one

will blow your mind out as it is beyond anything known so far,

breaking every rule in the book(s)!

>

> Imagine that a woman's eggs are fertilized outside the womb.

Nothing new about that, right ?

> That was back in 1990.

> As a result of this process 12 embryos were 'created' of which 4

were returned to the mothers womb, 2 were accepted, resulting in the

birth of 2 healthy girls (now about 11 years old).

> The other 8 embryos were FROZEN and stored in the hospital!

>

> Two years ago the couple decided to have more children and the

hospital defrosted 4 of the frozen embryos, which were placed in the

mothers womb, three were accepted, one removed AND 2 developed

normaly into a boy and a girl that were born about 9 month ago.

> That is 12 years (!!!) AFTER 'creation'.

> The doctors say that the now 9 month old twins develop normally.

>

> The above true event happened in Jerusalem's (Israel) Hadasa

hospital and the entire story appears in the February issue of "The

Reproduction Journal" and I assume will be available on the net in a

couple of month (http://www.reproduction-online.org/).

>

> This event is a historical and as such it is in a complete

opposition to any theory of a conception chart in relation with a

birth chart.

>

> Instead of writing tons of astrological and moral issues here I

leave the rest to your vivid imagination.

>

> What does any learned astrologer have to say about such a

challenge ?

>

> Blessings

> /Jay Weiss

> http://www.alvicomm.com

> http://www.alvicomm.com/privat.htm

[Guest guest]

Dear Hari,

 

1) The case I brought up is only the first in many more to come. A clear

human manipulation.

The issue in question here is NOT the birth chart nor the parents BUT

the ADHANA and conception chart that was often under discussion here.

 

2. The case you tell about is as natural as nature itself if I understand

your "rites for their ancestors" correctly <smile>.

 

Regards

/Jay Weiss

 

-

"onlyhari" <onlyhari

<vedic astrology>

Wednesday, February 04, 2004 7:16 AM

[vedic astrology] Re: Astrological challange beyond your wildest

fantasy

 

 

> ||Om Brihaspataye Namah||

>

> Dear Jay,

>

> What is the challenge? I fail to see one...Jyotish is based on

> nature and the natural scheme of things. The case that you cite is

> not natural (works against the laws of nature) and hence I doubt if

> Jyotish is applicable in this case. This case is proof that there is

> a divine intelligence operating above us.

>

> Having said that, I think that Jyotish must certainly be applicable

> in the charts of the parents to show that child birth must have

> occurred at the specified times.

>

> Here's another real-life case for you to ponder: An intelligent

> Jyotisha & his wife in their late forties and childless had gone to

> Varanasi or some such holy place to perform the rites for their

> ancestors AND themselves (thus acknowledging that there would be no

> child to do the rites for themselves after they're long gone). Two

> or three years later, a baby was born to them. Now these people are

> in their early seventies and a handsome young man prances about

> their home in such a searing display of divinity as can be seen

> visually. What do you say for Jyotish in this case?

>

> regards

> Hari

>

> vedic astrology, "J.Weiss" <jayhw@t...> wrote:

> > Hi all,

> >

> > We have seen various astrological dilemmas in the past, some of

> which remain a future challenge.

> > If the surrogate mother issue confused you in the past, this one

> will blow your mind out as it is beyond anything known so far,

> breaking every rule in the book(s)!

> >

> > Imagine that a woman's eggs are fertilized outside the womb.

> Nothing new about that, right ?

> > That was back in 1990.

> > As a result of this process 12 embryos were 'created' of which 4

> were returned to the mothers womb, 2 were accepted, resulting in the

> birth of 2 healthy girls (now about 11 years old).

> > The other 8 embryos were FROZEN and stored in the hospital!

> >

> > Two years ago the couple decided to have more children and the

> hospital defrosted 4 of the frozen embryos, which were placed in the

> mothers womb, three were accepted, one removed AND 2 developed

> normaly into a boy and a girl that were born about 9 month ago.

> > That is 12 years (!!!) AFTER 'creation'.

> > The doctors say that the now 9 month old twins develop normally.

> >

> > The above true event happened in Jerusalem's (Israel) Hadasa

> hospital and the entire story appears in the February issue of "The

> Reproduction Journal" and I assume will be available on the net in a

> couple of month (http://www.reproduction-online.org/).

> >

> > This event is a historical and as such it is in a complete

> opposition to any theory of a conception chart in relation with a

> birth chart.

> >

> > Instead of writing tons of astrological and moral issues here I

> leave the rest to your vivid imagination.

> >

> > What does any learned astrologer have to say about such a

> challenge ?

> >

> > Blessings

> > /Jay Weiss

> > http://www.alvicomm.com

> > http://www.alvicomm.com/privat.htm

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

>

>

>

> Links

>

>

> vedic astrology/

>

>

> vedic astrology

>

> Your

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Good posting and very good question.

I will just put a counter question.

Suppose, if you go to sleep.

You slip into coma.

You wake up after two years.

The sunrise you see after your awake is to be counted as Next sunrise after you slept ?

 

Aadhana lagna is moment an egg is fertilized.

There is no precondition that a baby needs to be born after 10 months.

Just because we get babies at 10 months conception.

In shastras, there are conditions laid down for long and very long pregnency.

May be we should apply such theory in such a case.

My 2 cents worth.

VB

 

 

 

 

"J.Weiss" <jayhw (AT) telia (DOT) com> wrote:

Hi all,

 

We have seen various astrological dilemmas in the past, some of which remain a future challenge.

If the surrogate mother issue confused you in the past, this one will blow your

mind out as it is beyond anything known so far, breaking every rule in the

book(s)!

 

Imagine that a woman's eggs are fertilized outside the womb. Nothing new about that, right ?

That was back in 1990.

As a result of this process 12 embryos were 'created' of which 4 were returned

to the mothers womb, 2 were accepted, resulting in the birth of 2 healthy girls

(now about 11 years old).

The other 8 embryos were FROZEN and stored in the hospital!

 

Two years ago the couple decided to have more children and the hospital

defrosted 4 of the frozen embryos, which were placed in the mothers womb, three

were accepted, one removed AND 2 developed normaly into a boy and a girl that

were born about 9 month ago.

That is 12 years (!!!) AFTER 'creation'.

The doctors say that the now 9 month old twins develop normally.

 

The above true event happened in Jerusalem's (Israel) Hadasa hospital and the

entire story appears in the February issue of "The Reproduction Journal" and I

assume will be available on the net in a couple of month

(http://www.reproduction-online.org/).

 

This event is a historical and as such it is in a complete opposition to any

theory of a conception chart in relation with a birth chart.

 

Instead of writing tons of astrological and moral issues here I leave the rest

to your vivid imagination.

 

What does any learned astrologer have to say about such a challenge ?

 

Blessings/Jay Weisshttp://www.alvicomm.com/http://www.alvicomm.com/privat.htm

 

 

Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info:

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[Guest guest]

Haven't read about conditions for very long pregnancy /I was in actually born

'later' in 10th month, longer pregnancy/ What would that mean in in general, if

anything?

 

But 12 yr. lenght..Nothing so far to compare with, LOL

Regards,

Annavidyut bhatt <vidyut_bhatt > wrote:

Hello J.Weiss,

 

Good posting and very good question.

I will just put a counter question.

Suppose, if you go to sleep.

You slip into coma.

You wake up after two years.

The sunrise you see after your awake is to be counted as Next sunrise after you slept ?

 

Aadhana lagna is moment an egg is fertilized.

There is no precondition that a baby needs to be born after 10 months.

Just because we get babies at 10 months conception.

In shastras, there are conditions laid down for long and very long pregnency.

May be we should apply such theory in such a case.

My 2 cents worth.

VB

 

 

 

 

"J.Weiss" <jayhw (AT) telia (DOT) com> wrote:

Hi all,

 

We have seen various astrological dilemmas in the past, some of which remain a future challenge.

If the surrogate mother issue confused you in the past, this one will blow your

mind out as it is beyond anything known so far, breaking every rule in the

book(s)!

 

Imagine that a woman's eggs are fertilized outside the womb. Nothing new about that, right ?

That was back in 1990.

As a result of this process 12 embryos were 'created' of which 4 were returned

to the mothers womb, 2 were accepted, resulting in the birth of 2 healthy girls

(now about 11 years old).

The other 8 embryos were FROZEN and stored in the hospital!

 

Two years ago the couple decided to have more children and the hospital

defrosted 4 of the frozen embryos, which were placed in the mothers womb, three

were accepted, one removed AND 2 developed normaly into a boy and a girl that

were born about 9 month ago.

That is 12 years (!!!) AFTER 'creation'.

The doctors say that the now 9 month old twins develop normally.

 

The above true event happened in Jerusalem's (Israel) Hadasa hospital and the

entire story appears in the February issue of "The Reproduction Journal" and I

assume will be available on the net in a couple of month

(http://www.reproduction-online.org/).

 

This event is a historical and as such it is in a complete opposition to any

theory of a conception chart in relation with a birth chart.

 

Instead of writing tons of astrological and moral issues here I leave the rest

to your vivid imagination.

 

What does any learned astrologer have to say about such a challenge ?

 

Blessings/Jay Weisshttp://www.alvicomm.com/http://www.alvicomm.com/privat.htm

 

 

Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info:

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[Guest guest]

Dear Vidyut,

 

MAYBE ...

That is what I am trying to find out but I can not buy into a 'maybe'...

Sunrise will not make any difference as one is alive before going into

sleep/comma as well as after ..

 

Current Science is challenging astrology by manipulation and we need to find a

logical answer to those issues.

It is a new era which none of the sages nor the old scripts ever dreamed of.

Take an example (as was brought up on another list just a few days ago) of a

mother who acted surrogate mother for her daughter. Astrologically, who's the

mother ?

Time for new astrological thinking ?

 

Kind regards/Jay Weiss

-

vidyut bhatt

J.Weiss

Cc: vedic astrology

Wednesday, February 04, 2004 7:53 AM

Re: [vedic astrology] Astrological challange beyond your wildest fantasy

Hello J.Weiss,

 

Good posting and very good question.

I will just put a counter question.

Suppose, if you go to sleep.

You slip into coma.

You wake up after two years.

The sunrise you see after your awake is to be counted as Next sunrise after you slept ?

 

Aadhana lagna is moment an egg is fertilized.

There is no precondition that a baby needs to be born after 10 months.

Just because we get babies at 10 months conception.

In shastras, there are conditions laid down for long and very long pregnency.

May be we should apply such theory in such a case.

My 2 cents worth.

VB

 

 

 

 

"J.Weiss" <jayhw (AT) telia (DOT) com> wrote:

Hi all,

 

We have seen various astrological dilemmas in the past, some of which remain a future challenge.

If the surrogate mother issue confused you in the past, this one will blow your

mind out as it is beyond anything known so far, breaking every rule in the

book(s)!

 

Imagine that a woman's eggs are fertilized outside the womb. Nothing new about that, right ?

That was back in 1990.

As a result of this process 12 embryos were 'created' of which 4 were returned

to the mothers womb, 2 were accepted, resulting in the birth of 2 healthy girls

(now about 11 years old).

The other 8 embryos were FROZEN and stored in the hospital!

 

Two years ago the couple decided to have more children and the hospital

defrosted 4 of the frozen embryos, which were placed in the mothers womb, three

were accepted, one removed AND 2 developed normaly into a boy and a girl that

were born about 9 month ago.

That is 12 years (!!!) AFTER 'creation'.

The doctors say that the now 9 month old twins develop normally.

 

The above true event happened in Jerusalem's (Israel) Hadasa hospital and the

entire story appears in the February issue of "The Reproduction Journal" and I

assume will be available on the net in a couple of month

(http://www.reproduction-online.org/).

 

This event is a historical and as such it is in a complete opposition to any

theory of a conception chart in relation with a birth chart.

 

Instead of writing tons of astrological and moral issues here I leave the rest

to your vivid imagination.

 

What does any learned astrologer have to say about such a challenge ?

 

Blessings/Jay Weisshttp://www.alvicomm.com/http://www.alvicomm.com/privat.htm

 

 

Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info:

vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank

mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light

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[Guest guest]

Dear Jay

 

SHiva gives the mantra Soham to the yet unborn child in the 7th

month. This means that the child becomes aware of its own reality,

and starts moving and understanding its surroundings, which causes

pain to itself and mother.,

 

Consciousness is a very important part of Jivatma which does not come

till 7th month. WHether you freeze for 1 year or 100 years, the

embryo gets consciounss only after 7th month, and this is clearly

explained in Gita. Krishna says that the material energy is His

inferior energy, whereas The live beings are his superior energies.

The differentation is ofcourse Jivatma which has consciouness.

Conception is one thing, but consciouness is what separates us from

objects.

regards

partha

 

 

vedic astrology, "J.Weiss" <jayhw@t...> wrote:

> Dear Vidyut,

>

> MAYBE ...

> That is what I am trying to find out but I can not buy into

a 'maybe'...

> Sunrise will not make any difference as one is alive before going

into sleep/comma as well as after ..

>

> Current Science is challenging astrology by manipulation and we

need to find a logical answer to those issues.

> It is a new era which none of the sages nor the old scripts ever

dreamed of.

> Take an example (as was brought up on another list just a few days

ago) of a mother who acted surrogate mother for her daughter.

Astrologically, who's the mother ?

> Time for new astrological thinking ?

>

> Kind regards

> /Jay Weiss

>

> -

> vidyut bhatt

> J.Weiss

> Cc: vedic astrology

> Wednesday, February 04, 2004 7:53 AM

> Re: [vedic astrology] Astrological challange beyond your

wildest fantasy

>

>

> Hello J.Weiss,

>

> Good posting and very good question.

> I will just put a counter question.

> Suppose, if you go to sleep.

> You slip into coma.

> You wake up after two years.

> The sunrise you see after your awake is to be counted as Next

sunrise after you slept ?

>

> Aadhana lagna is moment an egg is fertilized.

> There is no precondition that a baby needs to be born after 10

months.

> Just because we get babies at 10 months conception.

> In shastras, there are conditions laid down for long and very

long pregnency.

> May be we should apply such theory in such a case.

> My 2 cents worth.

> VB

"J.Weiss" <jayhw@t...> wrote:

> Hi all,

>

> We have seen various astrological dilemmas in the past, some of

which remain a future challenge.

> If the surrogate mother issue confused you in the past, this

one will blow your mind out as it is beyond anything known so far,

breaking every rule in the book(s)!

>

> Imagine that a woman's eggs are fertilized outside the womb.

Nothing new about that, right ?

> That was back in 1990.

> As a result of this process 12 embryos were 'created' of which

4 were returned to the mothers womb, 2 were accepted, resulting in

the birth of 2 healthy girls (now about 11 years old).

> The other 8 embryos were FROZEN and stored in the hospital!

>

> Two years ago the couple decided to have more children and the

hospital defrosted 4 of the frozen embryos, which were placed in the

mothers womb, three were accepted, one removed AND 2 developed

normaly into a boy and a girl that were born about 9 month ago.

> That is 12 years (!!!) AFTER 'creation'.

> The doctors say that the now 9 month old twins develop normally.

>

> The above true event happened in Jerusalem's (Israel) Hadasa

hospital and the entire story appears in the February issue of "The

Reproduction Journal" and I assume will be available on the net in a

couple of month (http://www.reproduction-online.org/).

>

> This event is a historical and as such it is in a complete

opposition to any theory of a conception chart in relation with a

birth chart.

>

> Instead of writing tons of astrological and moral issues here I

leave the rest to your vivid imagination.

>

> What does any learned astrologer have to say about such a

challenge ?

>

> Blessings

> /Jay Weiss

> http://www.alvicomm.com/

> http://www.alvicomm.com/privat.htm

>

>

>

>

> Group info: vedic-

astrology/info.html

>

> To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-

 

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[Guest guest]

Good point Partha seen from the Gita's view point (religion ?), but what is

it then between conception and 7 month ?

(we do know for sure that a foster is alive in the womb long before that (at

least physically) and may even react to external signals).

 

Still, how do you "fix" Adhana lagna from a birth chart when there are years

between conception (decided by a doctor ?) and birth ?

 

Regards

/Jay Weiss

 

 

-

"V.Partha sarathy" <partvinu5

<vedic astrology>

Wednesday, February 04, 2004 8:41 AM

[vedic astrology] Re: Astrological challange beyond your wildest

fantasy

 

 

> Dear Jay

>

> SHiva gives the mantra Soham to the yet unborn child in the 7th

> month. This means that the child becomes aware of its own reality,

> and starts moving and understanding its surroundings, which causes

> pain to itself and mother.,

>

> Consciousness is a very important part of Jivatma which does not come

> till 7th month. WHether you freeze for 1 year or 100 years, the

> embryo gets consciounss only after 7th month, and this is clearly

> explained in Gita. Krishna says that the material energy is His

> inferior energy, whereas The live beings are his superior energies.

> The differentation is ofcourse Jivatma which has consciouness.

> Conception is one thing, but consciouness is what separates us from

> objects.

> regards

> partha

>

>

> vedic astrology, "J.Weiss" <jayhw@t...> wrote:

> > Dear Vidyut,

> >

> > MAYBE ...

> > That is what I am trying to find out but I can not buy into

> a 'maybe'...

> > Sunrise will not make any difference as one is alive before going

> into sleep/comma as well as after ..

> >

> > Current Science is challenging astrology by manipulation and we

> need to find a logical answer to those issues.

> > It is a new era which none of the sages nor the old scripts ever

> dreamed of.

> > Take an example (as was brought up on another list just a few days

> ago) of a mother who acted surrogate mother for her daughter.

> Astrologically, who's the mother ?

> > Time for new astrological thinking ?

> >

> > Kind regards

> > /Jay Weiss

> >

> > -

> > vidyut bhatt

> > J.Weiss

> > Cc: vedic astrology

> > Wednesday, February 04, 2004 7:53 AM

> > Re: [vedic astrology] Astrological challange beyond your

> wildest fantasy

> >

> >

> > Hello J.Weiss,

> >

> > Good posting and very good question.

> > I will just put a counter question.

> > Suppose, if you go to sleep.

> > You slip into coma.

> > You wake up after two years.

> > The sunrise you see after your awake is to be counted as Next

> sunrise after you slept ?

> >

> > Aadhana lagna is moment an egg is fertilized.

> > There is no precondition that a baby needs to be born after 10

> months.

> > Just because we get babies at 10 months conception.

> > In shastras, there are conditions laid down for long and very

> long pregnency.

> > May be we should apply such theory in such a case.

> > My 2 cents worth.

> > VB

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > "J.Weiss" <jayhw@t...> wrote:

> > Hi all,

> >

> > We have seen various astrological dilemmas in the past, some of

> which remain a future challenge.

> > If the surrogate mother issue confused you in the past, this

> one will blow your mind out as it is beyond anything known so far,

> breaking every rule in the book(s)!

> >

> > Imagine that a woman's eggs are fertilized outside the womb.

> Nothing new about that, right ?

> > That was back in 1990.

> > As a result of this process 12 embryos were 'created' of which

> 4 were returned to the mothers womb, 2 were accepted, resulting in

> the birth of 2 healthy girls (now about 11 years old).

> > The other 8 embryos were FROZEN and stored in the hospital!

> >

> > Two years ago the couple decided to have more children and the

> hospital defrosted 4 of the frozen embryos, which were placed in the

> mothers womb, three were accepted, one removed AND 2 developed

> normaly into a boy and a girl that were born about 9 month ago.

> > That is 12 years (!!!) AFTER 'creation'.

> > The doctors say that the now 9 month old twins develop normally.

> >

> > The above true event happened in Jerusalem's (Israel) Hadasa

> hospital and the entire story appears in the February issue of "The

> Reproduction Journal" and I assume will be available on the net in a

> couple of month (http://www.reproduction-online.org/).

> >

> > This event is a historical and as such it is in a complete

> opposition to any theory of a conception chart in relation with a

> birth chart.

> >

> > Instead of writing tons of astrological and moral issues here I

> leave the rest to your vivid imagination.

> >

> > What does any learned astrologer have to say about such a

> challenge ?

> >

> > Blessings

> > /Jay Weiss

> > http://www.alvicomm.com/

> > http://www.alvicomm.com/privat.htm

> >

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[Guest guest]

Dear Jay

 

Gita is not about religion alone, it is about science. Krishna's

voice covers all the topics, ganita, smahita, vedanta, conception and

so on.

 

The point about conception is from upanishads, which are very

scientific and detailed study of the human existence.

 

I have read somewhere that Garbha Upanishad has these details.

 

Coming back to Gita, Krishna has clearly stated some principles which

have jyotish implications. For example when he says that Brahmanas

eat fatty foods, he means that Fatty foods especially ghee have lot

of Dhi Shakti(intelligence) ruled by Jupiter. BPHS has clear rules

for foods, and colours and other such things for planets.

In those days, A student used to learn 60 subjects in school, and

used to specialise in one field. The purpose of studying was to

integrate the knowledge from various fields, and develop a unique

understanding. So we cannot separate Jyotish from Gita, and we can

get lot of Jyotish meaning, if we have patience to decipher it.

regards

partha

 

 

vedic astrology, "J.Weiss" <jayhw@t...> wrote:

>

> Good point Partha seen from the Gita's view point (religion ?), but

what is

> it then between conception and 7 month ?

> (we do know for sure that a foster is alive in the womb long before

that (at

> least physically) and may even react to external signals).

>

> Still, how do you "fix" Adhana lagna from a birth chart when there

are years

> between conception (decided by a doctor ?) and birth ?

>

> Regards

> /Jay Weiss

>

>

> -

> "V.Partha sarathy" <partvinu5>

> <vedic astrology>

> Wednesday, February 04, 2004 8:41 AM

> [vedic astrology] Re: Astrological challange beyond your

wildest

> fantasy

>

>

> > Dear Jay

> >

> > SHiva gives the mantra Soham to the yet unborn child in the 7th

> > month. This means that the child becomes aware of its own reality,

> > and starts moving and understanding its surroundings, which causes

> > pain to itself and mother.,

> >

> > Consciousness is a very important part of Jivatma which does not

come

> > till 7th month. WHether you freeze for 1 year or 100 years, the

> > embryo gets consciounss only after 7th month, and this is clearly

> > explained in Gita. Krishna says that the material energy is His

> > inferior energy, whereas The live beings are his superior

energies.

> > The differentation is ofcourse Jivatma which has consciouness.

> > Conception is one thing, but consciouness is what separates us

from

> > objects.

> > regards

> > partha

> >

> >

> > vedic astrology, "J.Weiss" <jayhw@t...>

wrote:

> > > Dear Vidyut,

> > >

> > > MAYBE ...

> > > That is what I am trying to find out but I can not buy into

> > a 'maybe'...

> > > Sunrise will not make any difference as one is alive before

going

> > into sleep/comma as well as after ..

> > >

> > > Current Science is challenging astrology by manipulation and we

> > need to find a logical answer to those issues.

> > > It is a new era which none of the sages nor the old scripts ever

> > dreamed of.

> > > Take an example (as was brought up on another list just a few

days

> > ago) of a mother who acted surrogate mother for her daughter.

> > Astrologically, who's the mother ?

> > > Time for new astrological thinking ?

> > >

> > > Kind regards

> > > /Jay Weiss

> > >

> > > -

> > > vidyut bhatt

> > > J.Weiss

> > > Cc: vedic astrology

> > > Wednesday, February 04, 2004 7:53 AM

> > > Re: [vedic astrology] Astrological challange beyond

your

> > wildest fantasy

> > >

> > >

> > > Hello J.Weiss,

> > >

> > > Good posting and very good question.

> > > I will just put a counter question.

> > > Suppose, if you go to sleep.

> > > You slip into coma.

> > > You wake up after two years.

> > > The sunrise you see after your awake is to be counted as Next

> > sunrise after you slept ?

> > >

> > > Aadhana lagna is moment an egg is fertilized.

> > > There is no precondition that a baby needs to be born after 10

> > months.

> > > Just because we get babies at 10 months conception.

> > > In shastras, there are conditions laid down for long and very

> > long pregnency.

> > > May be we should apply such theory in such a case.

> > > My 2 cents worth.

> > > VB

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > "J.Weiss" <jayhw@t...> wrote:

> > > Hi all,

> > >

> > > We have seen various astrological dilemmas in the past,

some of

> > which remain a future challenge.

> > > If the surrogate mother issue confused you in the past, this

> > one will blow your mind out as it is beyond anything known so far,

> > breaking every rule in the book(s)!

> > >

> > > Imagine that a woman's eggs are fertilized outside the womb.

> > Nothing new about that, right ?

> > > That was back in 1990.

> > > As a result of this process 12 embryos were 'created' of

which

> > 4 were returned to the mothers womb, 2 were accepted, resulting in

> > the birth of 2 healthy girls (now about 11 years old).

> > > The other 8 embryos were FROZEN and stored in the hospital!

> > >

> > > Two years ago the couple decided to have more children and

the

> > hospital defrosted 4 of the frozen embryos, which were placed in

the

> > mothers womb, three were accepted, one removed AND 2 developed

> > normaly into a boy and a girl that were born about 9 month ago.

> > > That is 12 years (!!!) AFTER 'creation'.

> > > The doctors say that the now 9 month old twins develop

normally.

> > >

> > > The above true event happened in Jerusalem's (Israel) Hadasa

> > hospital and the entire story appears in the February issue

of "The

> > Reproduction Journal" and I assume will be available on the net

in a

> > couple of month (http://www.reproduction-online.org/).

> > >

> > > This event is a historical and as such it is in a complete

> > opposition to any theory of a conception chart in relation with a

> > birth chart.

> > >

> > > Instead of writing tons of astrological and moral issues

here I

> > leave the rest to your vivid imagination.

> > >

> > > What does any learned astrologer have to say about such a

> > challenge ?

> > >

> > > Blessings

> > > /Jay Weiss

> > > http://www.alvicomm.com/

> > > http://www.alvicomm.com/privat.htm

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Group info: vedic-

> > astrology/info.html

> > >

> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-

> >

> > >

> > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > -------------------------------

----

> > --------

> > > Links

> > >

> > >

> > > vedic astrology/

> > >

> > > b..

> > > vedic astrology?

> > subject=Un

> > >

> > > c..

Terms

> > of Service.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > -------------------------------

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> > ----------

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> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

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> >

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> >

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> >

> >

> > vedic astrology/

> >

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> > vedic astrology

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> >

> >

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> >

[Guest guest]

Yesterday evening I was , for the first time in my Astro life, casting and

pondering on the subject of surrogate mother and how to determine the MOTHER

part from her horoscope.

Meaning, if her Horoscope indicates health related problems to mother, then who

is the person affected??.And also what about her siblings ??

The real biological (Chromosomal) or Surrogate mother?

I have a case of a girl born to parents in US .The real mother could not have a

child after many years of marriage.

So the doctors decided to plant the fertilized egg in a surrogate mother. In

this case, an aunt did the job.(Mom's sister).

It so happened that after planting the embryo, the real mom got naturally

pregnent with twins. And all the children were delivered approximately at the

same time. AMAZING!!!

If people are interested, here is the birth data.

Baby girl

Born.....0ct 17th 1997

5.05 AM

Rahaway New Jersey

USA

It would be interesting to read learned Gur's inputs.

Rgds

Vidyut

"J.Weiss" <jayhw (AT) telia (DOT) com> wrote:

Dear Vidyut,

 

MAYBE ...

That is what I am trying to find out but I can not buy into a 'maybe'...

Sunrise will not make any difference as one is alive before going into

sleep/comma as well as after ..

 

Current Science is challenging astrology by manipulation and we need to find a

logical answer to those issues.

It is a new era which none of the sages nor the old scripts ever dreamed of.

Take an example (as was brought up on another list just a few days ago) of a

mother who acted surrogate mother for her daughter. Astrologically, who's the

mother ?

Time for new astrological thinking ?

 

Kind regards/Jay Weiss

-

vidyut bhatt

J.Weiss

Cc: vedic astrology

Wednesday, February 04, 2004 7:53 AM

Re: [vedic astrology] Astrological challange beyond your wildest fantasy

Hello J.Weiss,

 

Good posting and very good question.

I will just put a counter question.

Suppose, if you go to sleep.

You slip into coma.

You wake up after two years.

The sunrise you see after your awake is to be counted as Next sunrise after you slept ?

 

Aadhana lagna is moment an egg is fertilized.

There is no precondition that a baby needs to be born after 10 months.

Just because we get babies at 10 months conception.

In shastras, there are conditions laid down for long and very long pregnency.

May be we should apply such theory in such a case.

My 2 cents worth.

VB

 

 

 

 

"J.Weiss" <jayhw (AT) telia (DOT) com> wrote:

Hi all,

 

We have seen various astrological dilemmas in the past, some of which remain a future challenge.

If the surrogate mother issue confused you in the past, this one will blow your

mind out as it is beyond anything known so far, breaking every rule in the

book(s)!

 

Imagine that a woman's eggs are fertilized outside the womb. Nothing new about that, right ?

That was back in 1990.

As a result of this process 12 embryos were 'created' of which 4 were returned

to the mothers womb, 2 were accepted, resulting in the birth of 2 healthy girls

(now about 11 years old).

The other 8 embryos were FROZEN and stored in the hospital!

 

Two years ago the couple decided to have more children and the hospital

defrosted 4 of the frozen embryos, which were placed in the mothers womb, three

were accepted, one removed AND 2 developed normaly into a boy and a girl that

were born about 9 month ago.

That is 12 years (!!!) AFTER 'creation'.

The doctors say that the now 9 month old twins develop normally.

 

The above true event happened in Jerusalem's (Israel) Hadasa hospital and the

entire story appears in the February issue of "The Reproduction Journal" and I

assume will be available on the net in a couple of month

(http://www.reproduction-online.org/).

 

This event is a historical and as such it is in a complete opposition to any

theory of a conception chart in relation with a birth chart.

 

Instead of writing tons of astrological and moral issues here I leave the rest

to your vivid imagination.

 

What does any learned astrologer have to say about such a challenge ?

 

Blessings/Jay Weisshttp://www.alvicomm.com/http://www.alvicomm.com/privat.htm

 

 

Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info:

vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank

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shine on us ....... To visit your group on the web, go

to:vedic astrology/ To from this

group, send an email

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[Guest guest]

Dear members and Jay,

isn't the problem similar to the horoscope of a

chicken or a crocodile. The obvious questions are:

What is the birth date? Birth Time?

Well is it the horoscope of the egg that should be

considered or that of the chicken? Well, sounds funny

isn't it?

It isn't funny enough, since it the question on the

integrity of a very ancient and reverred science

called Astrology.

 

The time of the egg is important but for the egg. The

time when the chicken is born determines the life of

the chicken.

One can play table tennis with an egg, eat it, put it

in the oven for a thousand times, but it still is the

egg u r dealing with. Only when it sees the world as a

chicken, does it becomes an individual.

 

Similarly, one can take out an ovary, treat it with as

many experiments as possible, do anything, put it back

in the womb but this has no relation to the individual

who is born. Only when the individual is separated

from the mother's womb does it become an individual.

That moment determines his life, his destiny, his

will.

 

 

ur comments are welcome,

 

Regards

 

--- vidyut bhatt <vidyut_bhatt wrote:

> Hello Jey Weiss,

>

> Yesterday evening I was , for the first time in my

> Astro life, casting and pondering on the subject of

> surrogate mother and how to determine the MOTHER

> part from her horoscope.

> Meaning, if her Horoscope indicates health related

> problems to mother, then who is the person

> affected??.And also what about her siblings ??

> The real biological (Chromosomal) or Surrogate

> mother?

> I have a case of a girl born to parents in US .The

> real mother could not have a child after many years

> of marriage.

> So the doctors decided to plant the fertilized egg

> in a surrogate mother. In this case, an aunt did the

> job.(Mom's sister).

> It so happened that after planting the embryo, the

> real mom got naturally pregnent with twins. And all

> the children were delivered approximately at the

> same time. AMAZING!!!

> If people are interested, here is the birth data.

> Baby girl

> Born.....0ct 17th 1997

> 5.05 AM

> Rahaway New Jersey

> USA

> It would be interesting to read learned Gur's

> inputs.

> Rgds

> Vidyut

>

>

> "J.Weiss" <jayhw wrote:

> Dear Vidyut,

>

> MAYBE ...

> That is what I am trying to find out but I can not

> buy into a 'maybe'...

> Sunrise will not make any difference as one is alive

> before going into sleep/comma as well as after ..

>

> Current Science is challenging astrology by

> manipulation and we need to find a logical answer to

> those issues.

> It is a new era which none of the sages nor the old

> scripts ever dreamed of.

> Take an example (as was brought up on another list

> just a few days ago) of a mother who acted surrogate

> mother for her daughter. Astrologically, who's the

> mother ?

> Time for new astrological thinking ?

>

> Kind regards

> /Jay Weiss

>

> -

> vidyut bhatt

> J.Weiss

> Cc: vedic astrology

> Wednesday, February 04, 2004 7:53 AM

> Re: [vedic astrology] Astrological

> challange beyond your wildest fantasy

>

>

> Hello J.Weiss,

>

> Good posting and very good question.

> I will just put a counter question.

> Suppose, if you go to sleep.

> You slip into coma.

> You wake up after two years.

> The sunrise you see after your awake is to be

> counted as Next sunrise after you slept ?

>

> Aadhana lagna is moment an egg is fertilized.

> There is no precondition that a baby needs to be

> born after 10 months.

> Just because we get babies at 10 months conception.

> In shastras, there are conditions laid down for long

> and very long pregnency.

> May be we should apply such theory in such a case.

> My 2 cents worth.

> VB

"J.Weiss" <jayhw wrote:

> Hi all,

>

> We have seen various astrological dilemmas in the

> past, some of which remain a future challenge.

> If the surrogate mother issue confused you in the

> past, this one will blow your mind out as it is

> beyond anything known so far, breaking every rule in

> the book(s)!

>

> Imagine that a woman's eggs are fertilized outside

> the womb. Nothing new about that, right ?

> That was back in 1990.

> As a result of this process 12 embryos were

> 'created' of which 4 were returned to the mothers

> womb, 2 were accepted, resulting in the birth of 2

> healthy girls (now about 11 years old).

> The other 8 embryos were FROZEN and stored in the

> hospital!

>

> Two years ago the couple decided to have more

> children and the hospital defrosted 4 of the frozen

> embryos, which were placed in the mothers womb,

> three were accepted, one removed AND 2 developed

> normaly into a boy and a girl that were born about 9

> month ago.

> That is 12 years (!!!) AFTER 'creation'.

> The doctors say that the now 9 month old twins

> develop normally.

>

> The above true event happened in Jerusalem's

> (Israel) Hadasa hospital and the entire story

> appears in the February issue of "The Reproduction

> Journal" and I assume will be available on the net

> in a couple of month

> (http://www.reproduction-online.org/).

>

> This event is a historical and as such it is in a

> complete opposition to any theory of a conception

> chart in relation with a birth chart.

>

> Instead of writing tons of astrological and moral

> issues here I leave the rest to your vivid

> imagination.

>

> What does any learned astrologer have to say about

> such a challenge ?

>

> Blessings

> /Jay Weiss

> http://www.alvicomm.com/

> http://www.alvicomm.com/privat.htm

>

>

>

Archives:

> vedic astrology

>

> Group info:

>

vedic astrology/info.html

>

> To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to

> vedic astrology-

>

> ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

>

> || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu

> ||

>

>

>

>

> Links

>

>

> vedic astrology/

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vedic astrology?subject=Un

>

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>

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> Archives:

> vedic astrology

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vedic astrology/info.html

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> ||

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>

>

=== message truncated ===

 

 

 

 

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[Guest guest]

AUM GURUBYO NAMAH

Dear Jay & Partha,

Namaste. i request you to kindly refer Chatper IV Stanza 22 of Brihat Jataka

which speaks about gajagarbham. i shall reproduce the english translation of

the stanza below: -

"If Makara or Kumbha navamsa rises at the time of conception(decided either by

the couple or by the doctor), aspected by Sani, the child will be born after 4

years. If katakamsa rises at the time of conception(decided either by the

couple or by the doctor), aspected by Chandra, then the birth occurs after 12

years of pregnancy. The details in this chapter must be carefully understood

and applied with sense and judgement."

 

In the notes appended below Shri Suryanarain Rao the translator states that the

astrologer must be careful, prudent and well versed in the nature of times,

conditions, classes and the circumstances before he ventures into the fields of

future predictions and that it is a fact that a high intellectual development,

practice in yoga and excellent mathematical and predictive skill must be

combined in a man to make him a successful astrologer.

The moment we think that we have mastered the subject a puzzle shoots up.

Brahmaanda, the cosmic egg is indeed too big. Why talk about the brahmaanda

when there are lots to learn about the skull/kabala.

Is not the projector superior to the projection? Let us pray for the blessings

of the sages with firm faith and conviction. Kaala rahasya will surface.

SIVOHAM.

Best wishes.

Astrologically yours,

psramanrayananGifts for Him &; Her. Valentine’s Day. At MSN Shopping.

[Guest guest]

Dear P.S. Ramanarayanan,

 

I have to applaud your reference. Very well done!

As soon as I read your mail I pulled Brihat Jatak from the shelf and ... you are right.

However I will need to UNDERSTAND what this Stanza really means because in the

case given it is not pregnancy but frozen state which could last for far more

than just 12 years (remember there are still 4 embryos in the freezer...).

My doubts are with the fact that the technology is not many year old but Brihat Jataka is...

Secondly I can not read the original text in the book, only the English

translation. Does the original really say "pregnancy" ?

 

Regards/Jay Weiss

-

P.S. RAMANARAYANAN

partvinu5 ; vedic astrology

Wednesday, February 04, 2004 4:14 PM

RE: [vedic astrology] Re: Astrological challange beyond your wildest fantasy

SARVAM GYANANANDAMAYAM JAGAT

AUM GURUBYO NAMAH

Dear Jay & Partha,

Namaste. i request you to kindly refer Chatper IV Stanza 22 of Brihat Jataka

which speaks about gajagarbham. i shall reproduce the english translation of

the stanza below: -

"If Makara or Kumbha navamsa rises at the time of conception(decided either by

the couple or by the doctor), aspected by Sani, the child will be born after 4

years. If katakamsa rises at the time of conception(decided either by the

couple or by the doctor), aspected by Chandra, then the birth occurs after 12

years of pregnancy. The details in this chapter must be carefully understood

and applied with sense and judgement."

 

In the notes appended below Shri Suryanarain Rao the translator states that the

astrologer must be careful, prudent and well versed in the nature of times,

conditions, classes and the circumstances before he ventures into the fields of

future predictions and that it is a fact that a high intellectual development,

practice in yoga and excellent mathematical and predictive skill must be

combined in a man to make him a successful astrologer.

The moment we think that we have mastered the subject a puzzle shoots up.

Brahmaanda, the cosmic egg is indeed too big. Why talk about the brahmaanda

when there are lots to learn about the skull/kabala.

Is not the projector superior to the projection? Let us pray for the blessings

of the sages with firm faith and conviction. Kaala rahasya will surface.

SIVOHAM.

Best wishes.

Astrologically yours,

psramanrayanan

Gifts for Him & Her. Valentine’s Day. At MSN Shopping. Archives:

vedic astrologyGroup info:

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mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light

shine on us ....... To visit your group on the web, go

to:vedic astrology/ To from this

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of is subject to the

[Guest guest]

Dear Jay,

I think the confusion arises as astrologers want to calculate Adhana

time from time of birth. I have always been of the opinion that it might

be possible to arrive at probable time of birth based on Adhana time

with some latitude, but not vice-a-versa. I, being from an earlier

generation, prefer to stay away from both and only try to predict when

the couple is likely to have a progeny.

My reason is again based on ancient texts where children born to one

parent without another parent having cohabited are numerous and examples

like multiple ovulation and frozen embryos can be observed in ancient

epics too, if one applies one's logic to the mythological stories.

Examples would be birth of Dronacharya and Kauravas.

But then I am still a student and others might hold different views.

Chandrashekhar.

 

J.Weiss wrote:

 

> Dear Hari,

>

> 1) The case I brought up is only the first in many more to come. A clear

> human manipulation.

> The issue in question here is NOT the birth chart nor the parents BUT

> the ADHANA and conception chart that was often under discussion here.

>

> 2. The case you tell about is as natural as nature itself if I understand

> your "rites for their ancestors" correctly <smile>.

>

> Regards

> /Jay Weiss

>

> -

> "onlyhari" <onlyhari

> <vedic astrology>

> Wednesday, February 04, 2004 7:16 AM

> [vedic astrology] Re: Astrological challange beyond your wildest

> fantasy

>

>

> > ||Om Brihaspataye Namah||

> >

> > Dear Jay,

> >

> > What is the challenge? I fail to see one...Jyotish is based on

> > nature and the natural scheme of things. The case that you cite is

> > not natural (works against the laws of nature) and hence I doubt if

> > Jyotish is applicable in this case. This case is proof that there is

> > a divine intelligence operating above us.

> >

> > Having said that, I think that Jyotish must certainly be applicable

> > in the charts of the parents to show that child birth must have

> > occurred at the specified times.

> >

> > Here's another real-life case for you to ponder: An intelligent

> > Jyotisha & his wife in their late forties and childless had gone to

> > Varanasi or some such holy place to perform the rites for their

> > ancestors AND themselves (thus acknowledging that there would be no

> > child to do the rites for themselves after they're long gone). Two

> > or three years later, a baby was born to them. Now these people are

> > in their early seventies and a handsome young man prances about

> > their home in such a searing display of divinity as can be seen

> > visually. What do you say for Jyotish in this case?

> >

> > regards

> > Hari

> >

> > vedic astrology, "J.Weiss" <jayhw@t...> wrote:

> > > Hi all,

> > >

> > > We have seen various astrological dilemmas in the past, some of

> > which remain a future challenge.

> > > If the surrogate mother issue confused you in the past, this one

> > will blow your mind out as it is beyond anything known so far,

> > breaking every rule in the book(s)!

> > >

> > > Imagine that a woman's eggs are fertilized outside the womb.

> > Nothing new about that, right ?

> > > That was back in 1990.

> > > As a result of this process 12 embryos were 'created' of which 4

> > were returned to the mothers womb, 2 were accepted, resulting in the

> > birth of 2 healthy girls (now about 11 years old).

> > > The other 8 embryos were FROZEN and stored in the hospital!

> > >

> > > Two years ago the couple decided to have more children and the

> > hospital defrosted 4 of the frozen embryos, which were placed in the

> > mothers womb, three were accepted, one removed AND 2 developed

> > normaly into a boy and a girl that were born about 9 month ago.

> > > That is 12 years (!!!) AFTER 'creation'.

> > > The doctors say that the now 9 month old twins develop normally.

> > >

> > > The above true event happened in Jerusalem's (Israel) Hadasa

> > hospital and the entire story appears in the February issue of "The

> > Reproduction Journal" and I assume will be available on the net in a

> > couple of month (http://www.reproduction-online.org/).

> <http://www.reproduction-online.org/%29.>

> > >

> > > This event is a historical and as such it is in a complete

> > opposition to any theory of a conception chart in relation with a

> > birth chart.

> > >

> > > Instead of writing tons of astrological and moral issues here I

> > leave the rest to your vivid imagination.

> > >

> > > What does any learned astrologer have to say about such a

> > challenge ?

> > >

> > > Blessings

> > > /Jay Weiss

> > > http://www.alvicomm.com

> > > http://www.alvicomm.com/privat.htm

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

> >

> >

> >

> > Links

> >

> >

> > vedic astrology/

> >

> >

> > vedic astrology

> >

> > Your

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

>

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>

> ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

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[Guest guest]

AUM GURUBYO NAMAH

Dear Jay,

Thank you. The word 'suti' in the first sentence(sentence which speaks of birth

of child after 4 years) means procreating/begetting. The word 'prakurya' in

the second sentence(sentence which speaks of birth of child after 12 years)

speaks about manifestation.

May be Narasimha can throw more light in this regard.

Best wishes.

SIVOHAM.

Astrologically yours,

psramanrayananPlay the prediction game on MEZ. Win Sehwag’s autographed

T-shirts. Predict and win on myenjoyzone.com

[Guest guest]

Thanks to both of you for enhancing my brain capacity-- I am amazed: birth after

four, or 20 years- doesn't matter, IT DID exist as foreseen possibility

centuries ago-WOW!

 

With the reverse order, we can 'foresee' scientific novelties in the future, as well, can't we?

 

Thanks,

Anna"P.S. RAMANARAYANAN" <p_s_ramanarayanan (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote:

SARVAM GYANANANDAMAYAM JAGAT

yaAUM GURUBYO NAMAH

Dear Jay,

Thank you. The word 'suti' in the first sentence(sentence which speaks of birth

of child after 4 years) means procreating/begetting. The word 'prakurya' in

the second sentence(sentence which speaks of birth of child after 12 years)

speaks about manifestation.

May be Narasimha can throw more light in this regard.

Best wishes.

SIVOHAM.

Astrologically yours,

psramanrayanan

Play the prediction game on MEZ. Win Sehwag’s autographed T-shirts. Predict and

win on myenjoyzone.com Archives:

vedic astrologyGroup info:

vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank

mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light

shine on us .......

 

 

Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online

[Guest guest]

Dear Jay,

 

>The issue in question here is NOT the birth chart nor the parents BUT

>the ADHANA and conception chart that was often under discussion here.

 

It would be interesting to check if at that opportune moment, lagna was

Cancer with Saturn and Moon in 7th house, which according to Brhat Jataka

results in birth in the 12th year after conception. Do you have the charts

of those twins of your example?

 

Another interesting story is that of Sukadeva Goswami. He was for 16 years

in the womb of his mother because he was afraid when he would come out, he

would fall prey to Maya. Until his father Vyasadeva went for the help of

Krsna. Bygone ages, which were even more amazing as our surrogate mother

stories. When he finally came out of the womb, he immediately grew up to a

youth of 16 years old and didn't age further beyond that. He was a

transcendental personality, and we have to accept his birth as such also.

What to say about this then astrologically speaking?

 

Yours,

Dhira Krsna dasa,

Jyotishi

http://www.radhadesh.com