Guest guest Posted November 8, 2003 Report Share Posted November 8, 2003 HARE RAMA KRISHNA Dear List and Jk, The chara Karaka replacement principle was discussed very recently in a workshop by Sanjay ji and yesterday Visti happened to clarify the same to me in detail.Since JK brought the question up in his recent email, Visti suggested that I explain the principle. Chara karakas get replaced when they fall in the same degree. The planet with the lower degree loses its chara karakatwa and moves up the ladder. As a result the planet with the higher degree drops off the chara karaka list.For example, if the Atmakaraka and Amatyakaraka share the same longitude but differ only by a few minutes, at some point, the Amtyakaraka ascends to act as the Atmakaraka and the planet that was acting as the Atmakaraka completely moves out of the picture. The empty slot of the Amatyakaraka is filled by the sthira Amatyakaraka. If the sthira karaka is weak, the relative of the native represented by the planet lose their longevity. For example if the slot of Darakaraka is filled by the Sthira Darakaraka Venus, and Venus is weak in the chart, the longevity of the Spouse(in the case of males) can be affected. After having ascertained grahas occupying the same degree, here are the steps: i) The Graha with a lower Chara Karakatwa is going to replace the higher. ii) As a result the lower Chara Karakatwa is going to disappear, in favor of a higher Karakatwa. iii) See the Sthira Karaka of the disappeared Chara Karakatwa and see its strength. A good example of Chara Karaka replacement is in the case of the late prime minister of India, Indira Gandhi. The details of Karakas are given below and we find that Saturn is the AK posited in lagna and Venus is the Amatyakaraka posited in the sixth house with Rahu. Both Saturn and Venus share the longitude, of 21 Degrees.At the natural age of Saturn, i.e 36,Saturn moved out of the picture and Venus took up the role of Atmakaraka(I am not certain about the timing as to whether it was the natural age of Venus or Saturn). It was observed that the native initially was never interested in politics and was very family and tradition bound. These are clear signs of the influence of Saturn as Atmakaraka. She was infact very attached and devoted to her husband. But once Venus took over as Atmakaraka,there was a 180 degree turn and she got into politics at the cost of her family.Venus is placed in the sixth with Rahu and she was a good administrator(Venus) but also had the influence of Rahu.There are other influences in the chart like that of the parivarthana between Jupiter and Venus that explain the role of the ninth lord(Father) who was the reason for her entry into politics.Now Venus is also in a 2/12 relationship with the Sun who is the chara darakaraka. Sanjay ji suggested that we could use Naisargika Dasa to time these changes incombination with the natural age of planets.However, we didnt get into details and this is a topic for further research and of course the mercy of Sanjay ji. I request Visti to add or correct the above if needed. Hare Krishna Sudharsan Indira Gandhi Natal Chart November 19, 1917Time: 11:07:00 pmTime Zone: 5:30:00 (East of GMT)Place: 81 E 52' 00", 25 N 28' 00" Edison, New Jersey, USAAltitude: 160.00 meters Lunar Yr-Mo: Pingala - KarthikaTithi: Sukla Shashthi (Ve) (88.15% left)Vedic Weekday: Monday (Mo)Nakshatra: Uttarashadha (Su) (33.38% left)Yoga: Ganda (Sa)Karana: Kaulava (Ma)Hora Lord: Jupiter (5 min sign: Le)Mahakala Hora: Mars (5 min sign: Ar)Kaala Lord: Saturn (Mahakala: Saturn) Sunrise: 6:22:23 amSunset: 5:12:22 pmJanma Ghatis: 41.8592 Ayanamsa: 22-42-54.40Sidereal Time: 2:57:10 Body Longitude Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa Lagna 26 Cn 30' 54.66" Asre 3 Cn AqSun - DK 4 Sc 07' 39.45" Anu 1 Sc LeMoon - GK 5 Cp 32' 57.86" USha 3 Cp AqMars - MK 16 Le 22' 39.05" PPha 1 Le LeMercury - PK 13 Sc 14' 13.92" Anu 3 Sc LiJupiter ® - PiK 14 Ta 59' 54.96" Rohi 2 Ta TaVenus - AmK 21 Sg 00' 23.54" PSha 3 Sg LiSaturn - AK 21 Cn 47' 14.55" Asre 2 Cn CpRahu - BK 10 Sg 33' 54.70" Mool 4 Sg CnKetu 10 Ge 33' 54.70" Ardr 2 Ge CpMaandi 11 Ge 21' 52.00" Ardr 2 Ge CpGulika 29 Ta 54' 51.50" Mrig 2 Ta ViUranus 27 Cp 15' 15.47" Dhan 2 Cp ViNeptune ® 14 Cn 22' 00.67" Push 4 Cn ScPluto ® 12 Ge 27' 16.92" Ardr 2 Ge CpBhava Lagna 14 Cn 34' 41.66" Push 4 Cn ScHora Lagna 25 Pi 43' 59.98" Reva 3 Pi AqGhati Lagna 29 Ar 11' 54.95" Krit 1 Ar SgVighati Lagna 16 Li 31' 29.82" Swat 3 Li AqVarnada Lagna 22 Cn 14' 54.64" Asre 2 Cn CpSree Lagna 26 Pi 20' 56.86" Reva 3 Pi AqPranapada Lagna 17 Ge 13' 45.94" Ardr 4 Ge PiIndu Lagna 5 Ge 32' 57.86" Mrig 4 Ge ScDhooma 17 Pi 27' 39.45" Reva 1 Pi SgVyatipata 12 Ar 32' 20.55" Aswi 4 Ar CnParivesha 12 Li 32' 20.55" Swat 2 Li CpIndra Chapa 17 Vi 27' 39.45" Hast 3 Vi GeUpaketu 4 Li 07' 39.45" Chit 4 Li ScKaala 24 Cn 37' 00.87" Asre 3 Cn AqMrityu 8 Vi 47' 45.44" UPha 4 Vi PiArtha Prahara 1 Li 03' 52.96" Chit 3 Li LiYama Ghantaka 22 Li 51' 56.34" Visa 1 Li ArPrana Sphuta 12 Cp 29' 24.80" Srav 1 Cp ArDeha Sphuta 14 Cn 18' 34.37" Push 4 Cn ScMrityu Sphuta 3 Cp 31' 39.93" USha 3 Cp AqTrisphuta 0 Aq 19' 39.10" Dhan 3 Aq LiV2 22 Vi 14' 54.64" Hast 4 Vi CnV3 22 Sc 14' 54.64" Jye 2 Sc CpV4 22 Cp 14' 54.64" Srav 4 Cp CnV5 22 Pi 14' 54.64" Reva 2 Pi CpV6 22 Ta 14' 54.64" Rohi 4 Ta CnV7 22 Cn 14' 54.64" Asre 2 Cn CpV8 22 Vi 14' 54.64" Hast 4 Vi CnV9 22 Sc 14' 54.64" Jye 2 Sc CpV10 22 Cp 14' 54.64" Srav 4 Cp CnV11 22 Pi 14' 54.64" Reva 2 Pi CpV12 22 Ta 14' 54.64" Rohi 4 Ta CnKunda 17 Ge 43' 47.51" Ardr 4 Ge Pi +--------------+|HL |GL AL |JuR Gk |Ke Md || | | | || | | | || | | | || | | | ||-----------+-----------------------+-----------|| | |As Sa || | | || | | || | | || | | ||-----------| Rasi |-----------||Mo | |Ma || | | || | | || | | || | | ||-----------+-----------------------+-----------||Ve Ra |Su Me | | || | | | || | | | || | | | || | | | |+--------------+ +--------------+| | |JuR | || | | | || | | | || | | | || | | | ||-----------+-----------------------+-----------||As Mo | |Ra ||HL | | || | | || | | || | | ||-----------| Navamsa |-----------||Sa Ke | |Su Ma ||Md | | || | | || | | || | | ||-----------+-----------------------+-----------||GL AL | |Me Ve |Gk || | | | || | | | || | | | || | | | |+--------------+ Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon): Sun Sun 1913-11-20 Moon 1914-03-07 Mars 1914-09-09 Rah 1915-01-13 Jup 1915-12-09 Sat 1916-09-27 Merc 1917-09-09 Ket 1918-07-15 Ven 1918-11-21 Moon Moon 1919-11-21 Mars 1920-09-21 Rah 1921-04-18 Jup 1922-10-22 Sat 1924-02-18 Merc 1925-09-21 Ket 1927-02-17 Ven 1927-09-22 Sun 1929-05-19 Mars Mars 1929-11-21 Rah 1930-04-15 Jup 1931-05-04 Sat 1932-04-09 Merc 1933-05-19 Ket 1934-05-16 Ven 1934-10-16 Sun 1935-12-15 Moon 1936-04-18 Rah Rah 1936-11-20 Jup 1939-08-03 Sat 1941-12-26 Merc 1944-11-02 Ket 1947-05-20 Ven 1948-06-07 Sun 1951-06-08 Moon 1952-04-30 Mars 1953-11-03 Jup Jup 1954-11-21 Sat 1957-01-07 Merc 1959-07-22 Ket 1961-10-28 Ven 1962-10-04 Sun 1965-06-01 Moon 1966-03-19 Mars 1967-07-22 Rah 1968-06-26 Sat Sat 1970-11-21 Merc 1973-11-24 Ket 1976-08-03 Ven 1977-09-12 Sun 1980-11-12 Moon 1981-10-25 Mars 1983-05-23 Rah 1984-07-02 Jup 1987-05-08 Merc Merc 1989-11-21 Ket 1992-04-15 Ven 1993-04-13 Sun 1996-02-12 Moon 1996-12-20 Mars 1998-05-20 Rah 1999-05-17 Jup 2001-12-06 Sat 2004-03-10 Ket Ket 2006-11-21 Ven 2007-04-16 Sun 2008-06-17 Moon 2008-10-25 Mars 2009-05-23 Rah 2009-10-22 Jup 2010-11-09 Sat 2011-10-17 Merc 2012-11-24 Ven Ven 2013-11-21 Sun 2017-03-19 Moon 2018-03-20 Mars 2019-11-22 Rah 2021-01-19 Jup 2024-01-20 Sat 2026-09-22 Merc 2029-11-21 Ket 2032-09-22 Please Chant ---- HARE KRISHNA HARE KRISHNA KRISHNA KRISHNA HARE HARE HARE RAMA HARE RAMA RAMA RAMA HARE HARE and Be happy Attachment: (application/octet-stream) Indira Gandhi.jhd [not stored] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 9, 2003 Report Share Posted November 9, 2003 Dear Sudharsan ji, My husband's Amatyakaraka and Bhrartu-karaka occupy the same degree longitudes except for a few min. difference. Jupiter ® (AMK) is at 28 deg 29 min and Mercury (BK) is at 28 deg 22 min. His Mars the sthirakaraka for brothers is in Sun's house, strong being Vargottam at 14 deg. So I guess at some point in his life, his Mercury the BK will ascend to be his AMK and Mars will get to be his BK? May I know what is the age that Mercury matures for this to happen (this may have already happened) given my husband's dob: Nov 22 1964, 11:20 AM, Chennai. Best regards, Jayashree vedic astrology, Sudharsan Srinivasan <sudhar108> wrote: > HARE RAMA KRISHNA > > Dear List and Jk, > > The chara Karaka replacement principle was discussed very recently in a workshop by Sanjay ji and yesterday Visti happened to clarify the same to me in detail.Since JK brought the question up in his recent email, Visti suggested that I explain the principle. > > Chara karakas get replaced when they fall in the same degree. The planet with the lower degree loses its chara karakatwa and moves up the ladder. As a result the planet with the higher degree drops off the chara karaka list.For example, if the Atmakaraka and Amatyakaraka share the same longitude but differ only by a few minutes, at some point, the Amtyakaraka ascends to act as the Atmakaraka and the planet that was acting as the Atmakaraka completely moves out of the picture. The empty slot of the Amatyakaraka is filled by the sthira Amatyakaraka. If the sthira karaka is weak, the relative of the native represented by the planet lose their longevity. For example if the slot of Darakaraka is filled by the Sthira Darakaraka Venus, and Venus is weak in the chart, the longevity of the Spouse(in the case of males) can be affected. > > > After having ascertained grahas occupying the same degree, here are the steps: > > i) The Graha with a lower Chara Karakatwa is going to replace the higher. > > ii) As a result the lower Chara Karakatwa is going to disappear, in favor of a higher Karakatwa. > > iii) See the Sthira Karaka of the disappeared Chara Karakatwa and see its strength. > > > A good example of Chara Karaka replacement is in the case of the late prime minister of India, Indira Gandhi. The details of Karakas are given below and we find that Saturn is the AK posited in lagna and Venus is the Amatyakaraka posited in the sixth house with Rahu. Both Saturn and Venus share the longitude, of 21 Degrees.At the natural age of Saturn, i.e 36,Saturn moved out of the picture and Venus took up the role of Atmakaraka(I am not certain about the timing as to whether it was the natural age of Venus or Saturn). It was observed that the native initially was never interested in politics and was very family and tradition bound. These are clear signs of the influence of Saturn as Atmakaraka. She was infact very attached and devoted to her husband. But once Venus took over as Atmakaraka,there was a 180 degree turn and she got into politics at the cost of her family.Venus is placed in the sixth with Rahu and she was a good administrator(Venus) but also had the influence of > Rahu.There are other influences in the chart like that of the parivarthana between Jupiter and Venus that explain the role of the ninth lord(Father) who was the reason for her entry into politics.Now Venus is also in a 2/12 relationship with the Sun who is the chara darakaraka. > > > > Sanjay ji suggested that we could use Naisargika Dasa to time these changes incombination with the natural age of planets.However, we didnt get into details and this is a topic for further research and of course the mercy of Sanjay ji. > > I request Visti to add or correct the above if needed. > > Hare Krishna > > Sudharsan > > > Indira Gandhi > Natal Chart > November 19, 1917 > Time: 11:07:00 pm > Time Zone: 5:30:00 (East of GMT) > Place: 81 E 52' 00", 25 N 28' 00" > Edison, New Jersey, USA > Altitude: 160.00 meters > Lunar Yr-Mo: Pingala - Karthika > Tithi: Sukla Shashthi (Ve) (88.15% left) > Vedic Weekday: Monday (Mo) > Nakshatra: Uttarashadha (Su) (33.38% left) > Yoga: Ganda (Sa) > Karana: Kaulava (Ma) > Hora Lord: Jupiter (5 min sign: Le) > Mahakala Hora: Mars (5 min sign: Ar) > Kaala Lord: Saturn (Mahakala: Saturn) > Sunrise: 6:22:23 am > Sunset: 5:12:22 pm > Janma Ghatis: 41.8592 > Ayanamsa: 22-42-54.40 > Sidereal Time: 2:57:10 > Body Longitude Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa > Lagna 26 Cn 30' 54.66" Asre 3 Cn Aq > Sun - DK 4 Sc 07' 39.45" Anu 1 Sc Le > Moon - GK 5 Cp 32' 57.86" USha 3 Cp Aq > Mars - MK 16 Le 22' 39.05" PPha 1 Le Le > Mercury - PK 13 Sc 14' 13.92" Anu 3 Sc Li > Jupiter ® - PiK 14 Ta 59' 54.96" Rohi 2 Ta Ta > Venus - AmK 21 Sg 00' 23.54" PSha 3 Sg Li > Saturn - AK 21 Cn 47' 14.55" Asre 2 Cn Cp > Rahu - BK 10 Sg 33' 54.70" Mool 4 Sg Cn > Ketu 10 Ge 33' 54.70" Ardr 2 Ge Cp > Maandi 11 Ge 21' 52.00" Ardr 2 Ge Cp > Gulika 29 Ta 54' 51.50" Mrig 2 Ta Vi > Uranus 27 Cp 15' 15.47" Dhan 2 Cp Vi > Neptune ® 14 Cn 22' 00.67" Push 4 Cn Sc > Pluto ® 12 Ge 27' 16.92" Ardr 2 Ge Cp > Bhava Lagna 14 Cn 34' 41.66" Push 4 Cn Sc > Hora Lagna 25 Pi 43' 59.98" Reva 3 Pi Aq > Ghati Lagna 29 Ar 11' 54.95" Krit 1 Ar Sg > Vighati Lagna 16 Li 31' 29.82" Swat 3 Li Aq > Varnada Lagna 22 Cn 14' 54.64" Asre 2 Cn Cp > Sree Lagna 26 Pi 20' 56.86" Reva 3 Pi Aq > Pranapada Lagna 17 Ge 13' 45.94" Ardr 4 Ge Pi > Indu Lagna 5 Ge 32' 57.86" Mrig 4 Ge Sc > Dhooma 17 Pi 27' 39.45" Reva 1 Pi Sg > Vyatipata 12 Ar 32' 20.55" Aswi 4 Ar Cn > Parivesha 12 Li 32' 20.55" Swat 2 Li Cp > Indra Chapa 17 Vi 27' 39.45" Hast 3 Vi Ge > Upaketu 4 Li 07' 39.45" Chit 4 Li Sc > Kaala 24 Cn 37' 00.87" Asre 3 Cn Aq > Mrityu 8 Vi 47' 45.44" UPha 4 Vi Pi > Artha Prahara 1 Li 03' 52.96" Chit 3 Li Li > Yama Ghantaka 22 Li 51' 56.34" Visa 1 Li Ar > Prana Sphuta 12 Cp 29' 24.80" Srav 1 Cp Ar > Deha Sphuta 14 Cn 18' 34.37" Push 4 Cn Sc > Mrityu Sphuta 3 Cp 31' 39.93" USha 3 Cp Aq > Trisphuta 0 Aq 19' 39.10" Dhan 3 Aq Li > V2 22 Vi 14' 54.64" Hast 4 Vi Cn > V3 22 Sc 14' 54.64" Jye 2 Sc Cp > V4 22 Cp 14' 54.64" Srav 4 Cp Cn > V5 22 Pi 14' 54.64" Reva 2 Pi Cp > V6 22 Ta 14' 54.64" Rohi 4 Ta Cn > V7 22 Cn 14' 54.64" Asre 2 Cn Cp > V8 22 Vi 14' 54.64" Hast 4 Vi Cn > V9 22 Sc 14' 54.64" Jye 2 Sc Cp > V10 22 Cp 14' 54.64" Srav 4 Cp Cn > V11 22 Pi 14' 54.64" Reva 2 Pi Cp > V12 22 Ta 14' 54.64" Rohi 4 Ta Cn > Kunda 17 Ge 43' 47.51" Ardr 4 Ge Pi > +--------------+ > |HL |GL AL |JuR Gk |Ke Md | > | | | | | > | | | | | > | | | | | > | | | | | > |-----------+-----------------------+-----------| > | | |As Sa | > | | | | > | | | | > | | | | > | | | | > |-----------| Rasi |-----------| > |Mo | |Ma | > | | | | > | | | | > | | | | > | | | | > |-----------+-----------------------+-----------| > |Ve Ra |Su Me | | | > | | | | | > | | | | | > | | | | | > | | | | | > +--------------+ > > +--------------+ > | | |JuR | | > | | | | | > | | | | | > | | | | | > | | | | | > |-----------+-----------------------+-----------| > |As Mo | |Ra | > |HL | | | > | | | | > | | | | > | | | | > |-----------| Navamsa |-----------| > |Sa Ke | |Su Ma | > |Md | | | > | | | | > | | | | > | | | | > |-----------+-----------------------+-----------| > |GL AL | |Me Ve |Gk | > | | | | | > | | | | | > | | | | | > | | | | | > +--------------+ > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon): > Sun Sun 1913-11-20 Moon 1914-03-07 Mars 1914-09-09 > Rah 1915-01-13 Jup 1915-12-09 Sat 1916-09-27 > Merc 1917-09-09 Ket 1918-07-15 Ven 1918-11-21 > Moon Moon 1919-11-21 Mars 1920-09-21 Rah 1921-04-18 > Jup 1922-10-22 Sat 1924-02-18 Merc 1925-09-21 > Ket 1927-02-17 Ven 1927-09-22 Sun 1929-05-19 > Mars Mars 1929-11-21 Rah 1930-04-15 Jup 1931-05-04 > Sat 1932-04-09 Merc 1933-05-19 Ket 1934-05-16 > Ven 1934-10-16 Sun 1935-12-15 Moon 1936-04-18 > Rah Rah 1936-11-20 Jup 1939-08-03 Sat 1941-12-26 > Merc 1944-11-02 Ket 1947-05-20 Ven 1948-06-07 > Sun 1951-06-08 Moon 1952-04-30 Mars 1953-11-03 > Jup Jup 1954-11-21 Sat 1957-01-07 Merc 1959-07-22 > Ket 1961-10-28 Ven 1962-10-04 Sun 1965-06-01 > Moon 1966-03-19 Mars 1967-07-22 Rah 1968-06-26 > Sat Sat 1970-11-21 Merc 1973-11-24 Ket 1976-08-03 > Ven 1977-09-12 Sun 1980-11-12 Moon 1981-10-25 > Mars 1983-05-23 Rah 1984-07-02 Jup 1987-05-08 > Merc Merc 1989-11-21 Ket 1992-04-15 Ven 1993-04-13 > Sun 1996-02-12 Moon 1996-12-20 Mars 1998-05-20 > Rah 1999-05-17 Jup 2001-12-06 Sat 2004-03-10 > Ket Ket 2006-11-21 Ven 2007-04-16 Sun 2008-06-17 > Moon 2008-10-25 Mars 2009-05-23 Rah 2009-10-22 > Jup 2010-11-09 Sat 2011-10-17 Merc 2012-11-24 > Ven Ven 2013-11-21 Sun 2017-03-19 Moon 2018-03-20 > Mars 2019-11-22 Rah 2021-01-19 Jup 2024-01-20 > Sat 2026-09-22 Merc 2029-11-21 Ket 2032-09-22 > Please Chant ---- > > HARE KRISHNA HARE KRISHNA > KRISHNA KRISHNA HARE HARE > HARE RAMA HARE RAMA > RAMA RAMA HARE HARE > > and Be happy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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