Astrology is rubbish, says new research

[Guest guest]

Dear Jagmeet ji,

 

Thanks for posting this article. These types of articles will continue till such

time we as Astrologers, embrace the principles of Shri Parasara and Jaimini

etal. in full. This article again proves that trying to predict without the use

of divisional charts is a futile exercise and is a game of chance. The real

clues are within the divisions and there is no mystery as to why the study

which compared the charts of many twins gave the same predictions while in

reality the life of the twins was very diverse.

 

As Shri Ramadas Ji pointed out in an earlier post Divine blessings are a must.

Incombination with full use of all the principles and Divine blessings, we no

doubt can restore the glory that this science truly deserves.

Its a wake up call along with many others that have been written on the same lines.

 

Hare Krishna

 

Sudharsanjagmeet s dheendsa <jsdheendsa (AT) juno (DOT) com> wrote:

Dear friends,

Please check out the following where an article from Journal of Consciousness Studies is quoted.

Regards,

Jagmeet

P.S.Do we consider this a wake up call?

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/cms.dll/html/uncomp/articleshow?msid=134558

 

 

Is Astrology Relevant to Consciousness and Psi

http://www.imprint.co.uk/jcs_10_6-7.html

Abstract: Many astrologers attribute a successful birth-chart reading to what

they call intuition or psychic ability, where the birth chart acts like a

crystal ball. As in shamanism, they relate consciousness to a transcendent

reality that, if true, might require a re-assessment of present biological

theories of consciousness. In Western countries roughly 1 person in 10,000 is

practising or seriously studying astrology, so their total number is

substantial. Many tests of astrologers have been made since the 1950s but only

recently has a coherent review been possible. A large-scale test of persons

born less than five minutes apart found no hint of the similarities predicted

by astrology. Meta-analysis of more than forty controlled studies suggests that

astrologers are unable to perform significantly better than chance even on the

more basic tasks such as predicting extraversion. More specifically,

astrologers who claim to use psychic ability perform no better

than those who do not. The possibility that astrology might be relevant to

consciousness and psi is not denied, but such influences, if they exist in

astrology, would seem to be very weak or very rare.

The complete article is available only to rs for $26/-Archives:

vedic astrologyGroup info:

vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank

mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light

shine on us .......

Please

Chant ---- HARE KRISHNA HARE KRISHNA KRISHNA KRISHNA

HARE HARE HARE RAMA HARE RAMA RAMA RAMA HARE HARE and Be happy

[Guest guest]

Dear Jagmeet,

Unless the methodology used is understood, the article must stand as opinion of

one who has not understood astrology at all. The system of astrology tested is

also not mentioned. So any comment would and must remain a conjecture.

Regards,

Chandrashekhar.

jagmeet s dheendsa

[jsdheendsa (AT) juno (DOT) com]Sunday, August 17, 2003 9:09 PMTo:

vedic astrologySubject: [vedic astrology] Astrology is rubbish,

says new research

Dear friends,

Please check out the following where an article from Journal of Consciousness Studies is quoted.

Regards,

Jagmeet

P.S.Do we consider this a wake up call?

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/cms.dll/html/uncomp/articleshow?msid=134558

 

 

Is Astrology Relevant to Consciousness and Psi

http://www.imprint.co.uk/jcs_10_6-7.html

Abstract: Many astrologers attribute a successful birth-chart reading to what

they call intuition or psychic ability, where the birth chart acts like a

crystal ball. As in shamanism, they relate consciousness to a transcendent

reality that, if true, might require a re-assessment of present biological

theories of consciousness. In Western countries roughly 1 person in 10,000 is

practising or seriously studying astrology, so their total number is

substantial. Many tests of astrologers have been made since the 1950s but only

recently has a coherent review been possible. A large-scale test of persons

born less than five minutes apart found no hint of the similarities predicted

by astrology. Meta-analysis of more than forty controlled studies suggests that

astrologers are unable to perform significantly better than chance even on the

more basic tasks such as predicting extraversion. More specifically,

astrologers who claim to use psychic ability perform no better than those who

do not. The possibility that astrology might be relevant to consciousness and

psi is not denied, but such influences, if they exist in astrology, would seem

to be very weak or very rare.

The complete article is available only to rs for $26/-Archives:

vedic astrologyGroup info:

vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank

mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light

shine on us .......

 

[Guest guest]

Dear Chandrashekhar ji,

 

The following is from Telegraph India, covering the same news item:

 

For several decades, researchers tracked more than 2,000 people — most of them

born within minutes of each other. According to astrology, the subject should

have had very similar traits.

 

The babies were originally recruited as part of a medical study begun in London

in 1958 into how the circumstances of birth can affect future health. More than

2,000 babies born in early March that year were registered and their development

monitored at regular intervals.

 

Researchers looked at more than 100 different characteristics, including

occupation, anxiety levels, marital status, aggressiveness, sociability, IQ

levels and ability in art, sport, mathematics and reading — all of which

astrologers claim can be gauged from birth charts.

 

The scientists failed to find any evidence of similarities between the “time

twins”, however. They reported in the current issue of the Journal of

Consciousness Studies: “The test conditions could hardly have been more

conducive to success… but the results are uniformly negative.”

 

The original claim itself ("According to astrology, the subject should have had

very similar traits") is untrue, if one were to follow Vedic astrology as

taught by Parasara. Clearly, those who conducted this research did not know

about Indian astrology, divisional charts etc. If D-16, D-27 and D-60 lagna

change, anxiety levels, aggressiveness etc will change. If D-9, D-27 and D-60

lagnas change, sociability etc will change. If D-20, D-24, D-27 and D-60 lagnas

change, IQ will change. Moreover, out of the things listed, only IQ is

objectively defined. Others are quite subjective. I don't know how they were

quantified. With due respect to the scientists involved, it is easy to induce

biases in a statistical study dealing essentially with subjective concepts.

 

Jagmeetji, I don't really think this research is a wake-up call to us. If at

all, it is a wake-up call to those who think that rasi chart is all you need.

Rasi chart is the window through which all divisional charts express at the

physical level. But it is not enough to make predictions. The study enhances

this belief that many of us had had for a long time.

 

There is so much statistical research done on matters relating to health,

socialogy, psychology etc, which is quite unreliable. You see scientists

conducting one statistical study telling you onething one day and another group

telling you the opposite after 3 years. All these statistical studies have an

inherent weakness, however intelligently the control group is selected.

 

If 1% of the money spent on various statistical studies by scientists in the

world is spent on Vedic astrology research, we will have a very reliable and

thorough subject for public use. In my years of experience with Vedic

astrology, I have definitely seen its worth. But, to convert it into a reliable

subject, we need a lot of research (on the basis of the teachings of sages).

This genuine work is now done by hobbyists who have full-time jobs and active

family lives. People like me struggle with the little time left in their lives

and try to do something meaningful. If only the governments and educational

institutions support us...

May Jupiter's light shine on us,Narasimha

vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" <boxdel>

wrote:> Dear Jagmeet,> Unless the methodology used is understood, the article

must stand as opinion> of one who has not understood astrology at all. The

system of astrology> tested is also not mentioned. So any comment would and

must remain a> conjecture.> Regards,> Chandrashekhar.> -----Original

Message-----> jagmeet s dheendsa [jsdheendsa@j...]> Sent:

Sunday, August 17, 2003 9:09 PM> vedic astrology>

[vedic astrology] Astrology is rubbish, says new research> > > Dear

friends,> Please check out the following where an article from Journal of>

Consciousness Studies is quoted.> Regards,> Jagmeet> P.S.Do we consider

this a wake up call?> >

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/cms.dll/html/uncomp/articleshow?msid=1345>

58

[Guest guest]

Dear Gurugis

 

Similar article was published in GULF TIMES, a Qatari

local daily news paper. I can send the full article if

it is of any use to any one.

thanks and regards

 

Muthu

 

 

 

--- "Narasimha P.V.R. Rao" <pvr wrote:

> Dear Chandrashekhar ji,

>

> The following is from Telegraph India, covering the

> same news item:

>

> For several decades, researchers tracked more than

> 2,000 people - most of them born within minutes of

> each other. According to astrology, the subject

> should have had very similar traits.

>

> The babies were originally recruited as part of a

> medical study begun in London in 1958 into how the

> circumstances of birth can affect future health.

> More than 2,000 babies born in early March that year

> were registered and their development monitored at

> regular intervals.

>

> Researchers looked at more than 100 different

> characteristics, including occupation, anxiety

> levels, marital status, aggressiveness, sociability,

> IQ levels and ability in art, sport, mathematics and

> reading - all of which astrologers claim can be

> gauged from birth charts.

>

> The scientists failed to find any evidence of

> similarities between the "time twins", however. They

> reported in the current issue of the Journal of

> Consciousness Studies: "The test conditions could

> hardly have been more conducive to success. but the

> results are uniformly negative."

>

> The original claim itself ("According to astrology,

> the subject should have had very similar traits") is

> untrue, if one were to follow Vedic astrology as

> taught by Parasara. Clearly, those who conducted

> this research did not know about Indian astrology,

> divisional charts etc. If D-16, D-27 and D-60 lagna

> change, anxiety levels, aggressiveness etc will

> change. If D-9, D-27 and D-60 lagnas change,

> sociability etc will change. If D-20, D-24, D-27 and

> D-60 lagnas change, IQ will change. Moreover, out of

> the things listed, only IQ is objectively defined.

> Others are quite subjective. I don't know how they

> were quantified. With due respect to the scientists

> involved, it is easy to induce biases in a

> statistical study dealing essentially with

> subjective concepts.

>

> Jagmeetji, I don't really think this research is a

> wake-up call to us. If at all, it is a wake-up call

> to those who think that rasi chart is all you need.

> Rasi chart is the window through which all

> divisional charts express at the physical level. But

> it is not enough to make predictions. The study

> enhances this belief that many of us had had for a

> long time.

>

> There is so much statistical research done on

> matters relating to health, socialogy, psychology

> etc, which is quite unreliable. You see scientists

> conducting one statistical study telling you

> onething one day and another group telling you the

> opposite after 3 years. All these statistical

> studies have an inherent weakness, however

> intelligently the control group is selected.

>

> If 1% of the money spent on various statistical

> studies by scientists in the world is spent on Vedic

> astrology research, we will have a very reliable and

> thorough subject for public use. In my years of

> experience with Vedic astrology, I have definitely

> seen its worth. But, to convert it into a reliable

> subject, we need a lot of research (on the basis of

> the teachings of sages). This genuine work is now

> done by hobbyists who have full-time jobs and active

> family lives. People like me struggle with the

> little time left in their lives and try to do

> something meaningful. If only the governments and

> educational institutions support us...

>

> May Jupiter's light shine on us,

> Narasimha

>

> vedic astrology,

> "Chandrashekhar Sharma" <boxdel> wrote:

> > Dear Jagmeet,

> > Unless the methodology used is understood, the

> article must stand as opinion

> > of one who has not understood astrology at all.

> The system of astrology

> > tested is also not mentioned. So any comment would

> and must remain a

> > conjecture.

> > Regards,

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> > jagmeet s dheendsa

> [jsdheendsa@j...]

> > Sunday, August 17, 2003 9:09 PM

> > vedic astrology

> > [vedic astrology] Astrology is rubbish,

> says new research

> >

> >

> > Dear friends,

> > Please check out the following where an article

> from Journal of

> > Consciousness Studies is quoted.

> > Regards,

> > Jagmeet

> > P.S.Do we consider this a wake up call?

> >

> >

>

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/cms.dll/html/uncomp/articleshow?msid=1345

> > 58

>

>

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

I believe the article is more focussed on western astrology and is not a

commentary about other types followed elsewhere.

 

Such articles are usually prevalent in environments where

show-me-evidence-I-will-believe attitude is very strong. An attempt to analyse

a topic like astrology in an evidence based judgement system ((ie) in a

material plane) is bound to throw up contradictions in same way as

non-believers in rebirth theories debunk scriptures like Bhagavad Gita and its

emphasis on Karma based rebirths.

 

To understand astrology one must be first of all capable of understanding its

subtle nature. If everyone can predict things accurately, where is the option

for God to create uncertainity and pose a challenge. We ourselves might become

God in such cases.

 

As clearly mentioned in Bhagavad Gita, all divine messages are intended only for

those who need to see it. Not all can or will believe it during their material

existance. Same applies to astrology too. Its made simple to some extent by all

the explanations given by various Gurus. Yet, our own chart in a subtle way will

indicate whether we can really understand it or not and that too depends on

whether our karmic needs require it or not.

 

In a nutshell, one need not always have evidence in a repeatable pattern to

prove that something works. Surrender to almighty being the ultimate objective,

all that we are trying to do in astrology is find reassurances for ourselves

about our ability to improve in this life.

 

Any attempt to relate the learnings on to a material plain with the aim of

getting profit of some kind is not what was originally intended by the sages.

So attempts to make a subject / science out of astrology will remain a daunting

tasks for a simple reason that perfect science here will interfere with cosmic

order intended by God.

 

Raju

 

vedic astrology, Muthu S <s_muthu> wrote:> Dear

Gurugis> > Similar article was published in GULF TIMES, a Qatari> local daily

news paper. I can send the full article if> it is of any use to any one.>

thanks and regards> > Muthu> > > > --- "Narasimha P.V.R. Rao" <pvr@c...>

wrote:> > Dear Chandrashekhar ji,> > > > The following is from Telegraph

India, covering the> > same news item:> > > > For several decades, researchers

tracked more than> > 2,000 people - most of them born within minutes of> > each

other. According to astrology, the subject> > should have had very similar

traits.> > > > The babies were originally recruited as part of a> > medical

study begun in London in 1958 into how the> > circumstances of birth can affect

future health.> > More than 2,000 babies born in early March that year> > were

registered and their development monitored at> > regular intervals.> > > >

Researchers looked at more than 100 different> > characteristics, including

occupation, anxiety> > levels, marital status, aggressiveness, sociability,> >

IQ levels and ability in art, sport, mathematics and> > reading - all of which

astrologers claim can be> > gauged from birth charts.> > > > The scientists

failed to find any evidence of> > similarities between the "time twins",

however. They> > reported in the current issue of the Journal of> >

Consciousness Studies: "The test conditions could> > hardly have been more

conducive to success. but the> > results are uniformly negative."> > > > The

original claim itself ("According to astrology,> > the subject should have had

very similar traits") is> > untrue, if one were to follow Vedic astrology as> >

taught by Parasara. Clearly, those who conducted> > this research did not know

about Indian astrology,> > divisional charts etc. If D-16, D-27 and D-60 lagna>

> change, anxiety levels, aggressiveness etc will> > change. If D-9, D-27 and

D-60 lagnas change,> > sociability etc will change. If D-20, D-24, D-27 and> >

D-60 lagnas change, IQ will change. Moreover, out of> > the things listed, only

IQ is objectively defined.> > Others are quite subjective. I don't know how

they> > were quantified. With due respect to the scientists> > involved, it is

easy to induce biases in a> > statistical study dealing essentially with> >

subjective concepts.> > > > Jagmeetji, I don't really think this research is

a> > wake-up call to us. If at all, it is a wake-up call> > to those who think

that rasi chart is all you need.> > Rasi chart is the window through which all>

> divisional charts express at the physical level. But> > it is not enough to

make predictions. The study> > enhances this belief that many of us had had for

a> > long time.> > > > There is so much statistical research done on> > matters

relating to health, socialogy, psychology> > etc, which is quite unreliable. You

see scientists> > conducting one statistical study telling you> > onething one

day and another group telling you the> > opposite after 3 years. All these

statistical> > studies have an inherent weakness, however> > intelligently the

control group is selected.> > > > If 1% of the money spent on various

statistical> > studies by scientists in the world is spent on Vedic> >

astrology research, we will have a very reliable and> > thorough subject for

public use. In my years of> > experience with Vedic astrology, I have

definitely> > seen its worth. But, to convert it into a reliable> > subject, we

need a lot of research (on the basis of> > the teachings of sages). This genuine

work is now> > done by hobbyists who have full-time jobs and active> > family

lives. People like me struggle with the> > little time left in their lives and

try to do> > something meaningful. If only the governments and> > educational

institutions support us...> > > > May Jupiter's light shine on us,> >

Narasimha> > > > vedic astrology,> > "Chandrashekhar

Sharma" <boxdel> wrote:> > > Dear Jagmeet,> > > Unless the methodology

used is understood, the> > article must stand as opinion> > > of one who has

not understood astrology at all.> > The system of astrology> > > tested is also

not mentioned. So any comment would> > and must remain a> > > conjecture.> > >

Regards,> > > Chandrashekhar.> > > > > >

jagmeet s dheendsa> > [jsdheendsa@j...]> > > Sunday, August 17,

2003 9:09 PM> > > vedic astrology> > > Subject:

[vedic astrology] Astrology is rubbish,> > says new research> > > > > > > > >

Dear friends,> > > Please check out the following where an article> > from

Journal of> > > Consciousness Studies is quoted.> > > Regards,> > >

Jagmeet> > > P.S.Do we consider this a wake up call?> > > > > >> >>

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/cms.dll/html/uncomp/articleshow?msid=1345> >

> 58> > > > > > > > >

>

 

[Guest guest]

Dear Jagmeetji,

I think the article is given by someone who does not have any idea of our Vedic

astrology.You might have seen in these colums,god Astrologers are giving

analysis of some difficult charts whom they have not seen at all and most of

the predictions turned out to be true by the Divine Blessings.So such kind of

articles are coming to increase our will power to prove that Vedic Astrology is

not rubbish but is a Divine and is true.Let us all Pray Lord Krishna/Lord

Jagannath to give such people good intellect to think over their ridiculous

statements being reproduced in public News Letters.

I hope this helps all.

Surrendered at the Holy Feet of Mother Bhuvaneshwari,

Ramadas Rao.

jagmeet s dheendsa <jsdheendsa (AT) juno (DOT) com> wrote:

Dear friends,

Please check out the following where an article from Journal of Consciousness Studies is quoted.

Regards,

Jagmeet

P.S.Do we consider this a wake up call?

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/cms.dll/html/uncomp/articleshow?msid=134558

 

 

Is Astrology Relevant to Consciousness and Psi

http://www.imprint.co.uk/jcs_10_6-7.html

Abstract: Many astrologers attribute a successful birth-chart reading to what

they call intuition or psychic ability, where the birth chart acts like a

crystal ball. As in shamanism, they relate consciousness to a transcendent

reality that, if true, might require a re-assessment of present biological

theories of consciousness. In Western countries roughly 1 person in 10,000 is

practising or seriously studying astrology, so their total number is

substantial. Many tests of astrologers have been made since the 1950s but only

recently has a coherent review been possible. A large-scale test of persons

born less than five minutes apart found no hint of the similarities predicted

by astrology. Meta-analysis of more than forty controlled studies suggests that

astrologers are unable to perform significantly better than chance even on the

more basic tasks such as predicting extraversion. More specifically,

astrologers who claim to use psychic ability perform no better

than those who do not. The possibility that astrology might be relevant to

consciousness and psi is not denied, but such influences, if they exist in

astrology, would seem to be very weak or very rare.

The complete article is available only to rs for $26/-Archives:

vedic astrologyGroup info:

vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank

mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light

shine on us .......

 

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[Guest guest]

Dear Narasimharaoji,

Yes you are right. The point I wanted to skip over , for the reason og avoiding

too long a comment, is that the first line itself indicates that the times pf

birth of subects( and also the place of birth) were not identical(the report

says"born within minutes of each other" ). This itself is enough to underscore

the unscientific methodology used. I did not want to comment on the lack of

understanding og Astrology on the part of researchers(?), to avoid lengthy

pointless debate consuming space on the list.

Regards,

Chandrashekhar.

Narasimha P.V.R. Rao

[pvr (AT) charter (DOT) net]Monday, August 18, 2003 11:17 AMTo:

vedic astrologySubject: [vedic astrology] Re: Astrology is

rubbish, says new research

Dear Chandrashekhar ji,

 

The following is from Telegraph India, covering the same news item:

 

For several decades, researchers tracked more than 2,000 people — most of them

born within minutes of each other. According to astrology, the subject should

have had very similar traits.

 

The babies were originally recruited as part of a medical study begun in London

in 1958 into how the circumstances of birth can affect future health. More than

2,000 babies born in early March that year were registered and their development

monitored at regular intervals.

 

Researchers looked at more than 100 different characteristics, including

occupation, anxiety levels, marital status, aggressiveness, sociability, IQ

levels and ability in art, sport, mathematics and reading — all of which

astrologers claim can be gauged from birth charts.

 

The scientists failed to find any evidence of similarities between the “time

twins”, however. They reported in the current issue of the Journal of

Consciousness Studies: “The test conditions could hardly have been more

conducive to success… but the results are uniformly negative.”

 

The original claim itself ("According to astrology, the subject should have had

very similar traits") is untrue, if one were to follow Vedic astrology as

taught by Parasara. Clearly, those who conducted this research did not know

about Indian astrology, divisional charts etc. If D-16, D-27 and D-60 lagna

change, anxiety levels, aggressiveness etc will change. If D-9, D-27 and D-60

lagnas change, sociability etc will change. If D-20, D-24, D-27 and D-60 lagnas

change, IQ will change. Moreover, out of the things listed, only IQ is

objectively defined. Others are quite subjective. I don't know how they were

quantified. With due respect to the scientists involved, it is easy to induce

biases in a statistical study dealing essentially with subjective concepts.

 

Jagmeetji, I don't really think this research is a wake-up call to us. If at

all, it is a wake-up call to those who think that rasi chart is all you need.

Rasi chart is the window through which all divisional charts express at the

physical level. But it is not enough to make predictions. The study enhances

this belief that many of us had had for a long time.

 

There is so much statistical research done on matters relating to health,

socialogy, psychology etc, which is quite unreliable. You see scientists

conducting one statistical study telling you onething one day and another group

telling you the opposite after 3 years. All these statistical studies have an

inherent weakness, however intelligently the control group is selected.

 

If 1% of the money spent on various statistical studies by scientists in the

world is spent on Vedic astrology research, we will have a very reliable and

thorough subject for public use. In my years of experience with Vedic

astrology, I have definitely seen its worth. But, to convert it into a reliable

subject, we need a lot of research (on the basis of the teachings of sages).

This genuine work is now done by hobbyists who have full-time jobs and active

family lives. People like me struggle with the little time left in their lives

and try to do something meaningful. If only the governments and educational

institutions support us...

May Jupiter's light shine on us,Narasimha

vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" <boxdel>

wrote:> Dear Jagmeet,> Unless the methodology used is understood, the article

must stand as opinion> of one who has not understood astrology at all. The

system of astrology> tested is also not mentioned. So any comment would and

must remain a> conjecture.> Regards,> Chandrashekhar.> -----Original

Message-----> jagmeet s dheendsa [jsdheendsa@j...]> Sent:

Sunday, August 17, 2003 9:09 PM> vedic astrology>

[vedic astrology] Astrology is rubbish, says new research> > > Dear

friends,> Please check out the following where an article from Journal of>

Consciousness Studies is quoted.> Regards,> Jagmeet> P.S.Do we consider

this a wake up call?> >

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/cms.dll/html/uncomp/articleshow?msid=1345>

58Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info:

vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank

mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light

shine on us .......