Guest guest Posted July 3, 2003 Report Share Posted July 3, 2003 Om namah Shivaya Dear Amol Lagna and Arudha Lagna are never the same. This is a truth. There is no fortune involved in making them the same. they can never be the same, however hard one may try, regards partha om tat sat vedic astrology, "amolmandar" <amolmandar> wrote: > Dear Shailesh > > If you allow me to join this discussion..... > > I think we should read it as AruDha or aaruDha. Literally ruDha means > popular or traditional and 'aa' prefix makes it more popular or more > traditional. The prefix 'a' to ruDha will make it opposite. aruDha > will be that is not popular.So aaruDha means morepopular or we can > say Maha-popular. That way aaruDha will make what is popularly known > about you. It need not be other than Satya. If you are fortunate > enough your Lagna(true identity) and Arudha Lagna(Popular identity) > will be same. All great persons should belong to that class. Both > identies are govern by satya i.e.you(Lagna) and hence Lagna is more > important. > > After all we say satyam eva jayate! > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > AmolMandar > > vedic astrology, "Shailesh Chadha" <scc@s...> > wrote: > > || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha, > > May I join in this discussion? > > If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis-à-vis our > > understanding of a jataka, the confusion about Arudha Padas will > > dissolve to a great extent. > > "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - that which > relates to > > "Atma" and "Parmatma" . > > This material world is in fact "maya" - an illusion, but we treat > this > > world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules of "satya" to it. > > Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this world of "maya" and, > > hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are more relevant to > this > > material existence. > > Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana-arudha, Gaja- arudha, > > etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level". > > So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made by the > individual > > (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards achieving the highest > > ability/ perfection. > > Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood as "manifestation" or > > "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I think we will be > able to > > better appreciate this concept of "arudha". > > Of course, this is only as per my understanding - hopefully, Gurus > and > > seniors will correct, or confirm, it. > > Regards & best wishes, > > Shailesh > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5] > > Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PM > > vedic astrology > > [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear chandrashekhar > > > > Om Namah SHivaya > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > I have a habit of saving all important messages by the various > gurus > > and learned members. I have around 50 MB material just by this work > > (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the old message for > > your perusal > > > > regards > > partha > > om tat sat > > > > > > """"""- > > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > > vedic astrology > > Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM > > [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha > > > > Dear Imran, > > > > > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > The concept of Arudha of different houses beautifully eloborates > > the difference between reality(Satya) and perception(Maya). Sage > > Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat and tackle > these > > Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold specific > > posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > > > > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas collectively, thus > > require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa and vorgottama > > of Arudhas. > > > > > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. For example in > > case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in Scorpio (9th from > > lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > > > > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) is to be > > assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and 10th lords, > > Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > > > > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with respect of lagna > > position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in chart of Dalai > > Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th from lagna. > > > > > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association(sambndha) with > the > > help of rashi aspect? > > > > > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead of lagan? or > its > > not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields satisfactory > > results at a certain level. > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > Imran > > > > You are on the right track and Visti has nicely addressed the > points > > in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points. > > > > (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the > activity/things > > shown by the houses. My communication skills are not a "tangible > > thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises out of my > > communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house shows my > > communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this mail (tangible). > > > > Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), they are the > > only tangible things - the only reality - in this material world! > > They are very important. > > > > (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) together in D- 10, > > be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing them will be > > great. > > > > (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. However, note > > that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are different from the > > rules of the world of maya (illusion). > > > > For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's interactions. It > is > > the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed house of kama > > trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) and the > > intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc (shaping of desire > > and working on the desire) and the culmination house (11th) shows > the > > final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th house shows > > dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. While the seed > > house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the intermediate > > house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), the culmination > > house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall duty). > > > > The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the world of maya, > but > > the meanings are different. In the world of truth, shaping of > desire > > and working on the desires happens through interactions and finally > > leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. But the world > of > > maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the world of > maya, > > shaping of desire and working on the desire happens only thru > > domination and the results are only material gains. So the 7th from > > arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and domination. > The > > 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include religiousness, > > righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma (duty) - > protect > > itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about protecting > the > > status and image. > > > > The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which trikona it > > belongs to and whether it is the seed house, intermediate house or > > the culmination house of that trikona) is constant for all > > references. But building the meaning further based on the axioms > > requires an understanding of the two worlds - world of satya and > > world of maya. > > > > I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish Workshop" and the CD > > will be available for buying online in a day or two at most. > > > > (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa > > interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana dasa that is > > computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the changing > > impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the resulting luck) on > > one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana Dasa" by Pt. > > Sanjay Rath. > > > > (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa interpretation, but > you > > can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition to transits > > from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits from natal arudha > > lagna! > > > > However, again, different rules may apply in the case of arudha > > lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma from Moon or > > lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter loves dharma. > > However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha lagna, the wise > > teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the rules of the > world > > of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a shallow dharma > > (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So there will be > > material setbacks and the illusion is broken. However, if Jupiter > has > > a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal chart also, > the > > negative results may be mitigated. > > > > Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally different > > worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one understands > and > > appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha lagna. Try to > > give it some thought. > > > > Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck with your > > arudha pada studies! > > > > May Jupiter's light shine on us, > > Narasimha""""""" > > """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > Dear Partha, > > > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I indicated > (About > > pada > > > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji says verbatim " > > > Use of arudha lagna > > > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha lagna is maya > > peetha or > > > the seat of > > > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for different shades > > of self. > > > Lagna stands for > > > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived self. Arudha lagna > > stands > > > for "self, as > > > peceived by this maya world". > > > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to comment. > Regards, > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > > > vedic astrology > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse -dear Anu > > > > > > Om namah shivaya > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > > > > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this world of Maya. > > This > > > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages. > > > regards > > > partha > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > Dear Hari, > > > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are perception of what > > > people think > > > > about one, this is the only logical inference. Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > > > vedic astrology > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse -dear Anu > > > > > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with the > > consummation > > > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it correct? > > > > > > > > regards > > > > Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- astrology/info.html > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release 6/25/2003 > > > > > > --- > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release 6/25/2003 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 3, 2003 Report Share Posted July 3, 2003 Dear Amolmandar, I agree with Parthaji. Look up what happens when Arudhapada falls in 1st,4th and 7th. Again Aarudha could also mean mounted, which could in a way show perception, is it not? Chandrashekhar. V.Partha sarathy wrote: Om namah Shivaya Dear Amol Lagna and Arudha Lagna are never the same. This is a truth. There is no fortune involved in making them the same. they can never be the same, however hard one may try, regards partha om tat sat vedic astrology, "amolmandar" <amolmandar> wrote: > Dear Shailesh > > If you allow me to join this discussion..... > > I think we should read it as AruDha or aaruDha. Literally ruDha means > popular or traditional and 'aa' prefix makes it more popular or more > traditional. The prefix 'a' to ruDha will make it opposite. aruDha > will be that is not popular.So aaruDha means morepopular or we can > say Maha-popular. That way aaruDha will make what is popularly known > about you. It need not be other than Satya. If you are fortunate > enough your Lagna(true identity) and Arudha Lagna(Popular identity) > will be same. All great persons should belong to that class. Both > identies are govern by satya i.e.you(Lagna) and hence Lagna is more > important. > > After all we say satyam eva jayate! > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > AmolMandar > > vedic astrology, "Shailesh Chadha" <scc@s...> > wrote: > > || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha, > > May I join in this discussion? > > If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis-à-vis our > > understanding of a jataka, the confusion about Arudha Padas will > > dissolve to a great extent. > > "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - that which > relates to > > "Atma" and "Parmatma" . > > This material world is in fact "maya" - an illusion, but we treat > this > > world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules of "satya" to it. > > Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this world of "maya" and, > > hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are more relevant to > this > > material existence. > > Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana-arudha, Gaja- arudha, > > etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level". > > So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made by the > individual > > (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards achieving the highest > > ability/ perfection. > > Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood as "manifestation" or > > "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I think we will be > able to > > better appreciate this concept of "arudha". > > Of course, this is only as per my understanding - hopefully, Gurus > and > > seniors will correct, or confirm, it. > > Regards & best wishes, > > Shailesh > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5] > > Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PM > > vedic astrology > > [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear chandrashekhar > > > > Om Namah SHivaya > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > I have a habit of saving all important messages by the various > gurus > > and learned members. I have around 50 MB material just by this work > > (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the old message for > > your perusal > > > > regards > > partha > > om tat sat > > > > > > """"""- > > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > > vedic astrology > > Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM > > [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha > > > > Dear Imran, > > > > > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > The concept of Arudha of different houses beautifully eloborates > > the difference between reality(Satya) and perception(Maya). Sage > > Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat and tackle > these > > Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold specific > > posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > > > > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas collectively, thus > > require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa and vorgottama > > of Arudhas. > > > > > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. For example in > > case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in Scorpio (9th from > > lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > > > > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) is to be > > assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and 10th lords, > > Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > > > > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with respect of lagna > > position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in chart of Dalai > > Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th from lagna. > > > > > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association(sambndha) with > the > > help of rashi aspect? > > > > > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead of lagan? or > its > > not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields satisfactory > > results at a certain level. > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > Imran > > > > You are on the right track and Visti has nicely addressed the > points > > in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points. > > > > (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the > activity/things > > shown by the houses. My communication skills are not a "tangible > > thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises out of my > > communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house shows my > > communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this mail (tangible). > > > > Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), they are the > > only tangible things - the only reality - in this material world! > > They are very important. > > > > (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) together in D- 10, > > be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing them will be > > great. > > > > (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. However, note > > that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are different from the > > rules of the world of maya (illusion). > > > > For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's interactions. It > is > > the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed house of kama > > trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) and the > > intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc (shaping of desire > > and working on the desire) and the culmination house (11th) shows > the > > final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th house shows > > dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. While the seed > > house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the intermediate > > house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), the culmination > > house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall duty). > > > > The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the world of maya, > but > > the meanings are different. In the world of truth, shaping of > desire > > and working on the desires happens through interactions and finally > > leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. But the world > of > > maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the world of > maya, > > shaping of desire and working on the desire happens only thru > > domination and the results are only material gains. So the 7th from > > arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and domination. > The > > 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include religiousness, > > righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma (duty) - > protect > > itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about protecting > the > > status and image. > > > > The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which trikona it > > belongs to and whether it is the seed house, intermediate house or > > the culmination house of that trikona) is constant for all > > references. But building the meaning further based on the axioms > > requires an understanding of the two worlds - world of satya and > > world of maya. > > > > I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish Workshop" and the CD > > will be available for buying online in a day or two at most. > > > > (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa > > interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana dasa that is > > computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the changing > > impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the resulting luck) on > > one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana Dasa" by Pt. > > Sanjay Rath. > > > > (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa interpretation, but > you > > can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition to transits > > from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits from natal arudha > > lagna! > > > > However, again, different rules may apply in the case of arudha > > lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma from Moon or > > lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter loves dharma. > > However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha lagna, the wise > > teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the rules of the > world > > of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a shallow dharma > > (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So there will be > > material setbacks and the illusion is broken. However, if Jupiter > has > > a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal chart also, > the > > negative results may be mitigated. > > > > Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally different > > worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one understands > and > > appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha lagna. Try to > > give it some thought. > > > > Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck with your > > arudha pada studies! > > > > May Jupiter's light shine on us, > > Narasimha""""""" > > """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > Dear Partha, > > > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I indicated > (About > > pada > > > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji says verbatim " > > > Use of arudha lagna > > > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha lagna is maya > > peetha or > > > the seat of > > > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for different shades > > of self. > > > Lagna stands for > > > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived self. Arudha lagna > > stands > > > for "self, as > > > peceived by this maya world". > > > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to comment. > Regards, > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > > > vedic astrology > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse -dear Anu > > > > > > Om namah shivaya > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > > > > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this world of Maya. > > This > > > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages. > > > regards > > > partha > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > Dear Hari, > > > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are perception of what > > > people think > > > > about one, this is the only logical inference. Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > > > vedic astrology > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse -dear Anu > > > > > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with the > > consummation > > > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it correct? > > > > > > > > regards > > > > Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- astrology/info.html > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > Terms of > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: 6/25/2003 > > > > > > --- > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: 6/25/2003 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 4, 2003 Report Share Posted July 4, 2003 Respected Chandrashekharji I understand that but when we say meaning literally we should take correct approch to it. The word Maya and Satya have been used to AL and L many times. Maya is popular and difficult to overcome and hence traditional. With this string it suits the meaning of the word aaruDha. Moreover if we take aaruDha as mounted then question arises what gets mounted who mounts it where and why?. One can not 'mount' oneself different for the public. It is the public that forms the opinion or mounts you. So we dont have any control over this mounting phenomenon. That is why I said it is popular identity which is always created by the public. It may be correct i.e. as you are(1st house or Lagna) or it may be something different(any other house) or even exactly opposite(7th house). Had it not been so how do we see,great men like Maharishi Valmiki and Vedvyasa? Or modern day Mahatma Gandhi? Does taht mean what ever we know about them is all aaruDha and their real identity is different? But BPHS says that 1st and 7th house can not be AL house? Why? Parashara can not be wrong. I must be wrong but where I am not getting. Either my premise is wrong and hence the inference. But at least to me and my little Sanskrit knowledge, my premise about aaruDha seems to be correct. In that case my inference should also be correct. I am sure you will solve this and clear my doubts astrologically and its social aspects as well. Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. AmolMandar vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma <boxdel> wrote: > Dear Amolmandar, > I agree with Parthaji. Look up what happens when Arudhapada falls in > 1st,4th and 7th. Again Aarudha could also mean mounted, which could in a > way show perception, is it not? > Chandrashekhar. > > V.Partha sarathy wrote: > > > Om namah Shivaya > > > > Dear Amol > > > > Lagna and Arudha Lagna are never the same. This is a truth. There is > > no fortune involved in making them the same. they can never be the > > same, however hard one may try, > > regards > > partha > > om tat sat > > > > > > vedic astrology, "amolmandar" > > <amolmandar> wrote: > > > Dear Shailesh > > > > > > If you allow me to join this discussion..... > > > > > > I think we should read it as AruDha or aaruDha. Literally ruDha > > means > > > popular or traditional and 'aa' prefix makes it more popular or > > more > > > traditional. The prefix 'a' to ruDha will make it opposite. aruDha > > > will be that is not popular.So aaruDha means morepopular or we can > > > say Maha-popular. That way aaruDha will make what is popularly > > known > > > about you. It need not be other than Satya. If you are fortunate > > > enough your Lagna(true identity) and Arudha Lagna(Popular identity) > > > will be same. All great persons should belong to that class. Both > > > identies are govern by satya i.e.you(Lagna) and hence Lagna is > > more > > > important. > > > > > > After all we say satyam eva jayate! > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Shailesh Chadha" > > <scc@s...> > > > wrote: > > > > || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha, > > > > May I join in this discussion? > > > > If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis-à-vis our > > > > understanding of a jataka, the confusion about Arudha Padas will > > > > dissolve to a great extent. > > > > "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - that which > > > relates to > > > > "Atma" and "Parmatma" . > > > > This material world is in fact "maya" - an illusion, but we treat > > > this > > > > world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules of "satya" to it. > > > > Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this world of "maya" > > and, > > > > hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are more relevant to > > > this > > > > material existence. > > > > Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana-arudha, Gaja- > > arudha, > > > > etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level". > > > > So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made by the > > > individual > > > > (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards achieving the > > highest > > > > ability/ perfection. > > > > Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood as "manifestation" or > > > > "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I think we will be > > > able to > > > > better appreciate this concept of "arudha". > > > > Of course, this is only as per my understanding - hopefully, > > Gurus > > > and > > > > seniors will correct, or confirm, it. > > > > Regards & best wishes, > > > > Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5] > > > > Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PM > > > > vedic astrology > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > Om Namah SHivaya > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > I have a habit of saving all important messages by the various > > > gurus > > > > and learned members. I have around 50 MB material just by this > > work > > > > (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the old message > > for > > > > your perusal > > > > > > > > regards > > > > partha > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > """"""- > > > > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > > > > vedic astrology > > > > Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha > > > > > > > > Dear Imran, > > > > > > > > > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > > > > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > > > > > The concept of Arudha of different houses beautifully eloborates > > > > the difference between reality(Satya) and perception(Maya). Sage > > > > Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat and tackle > > > these > > > > Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold specific > > > > posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas collectively, > > thus > > > > require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa and > > vorgottama > > > > of Arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. For example in > > > > case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in Scorpio (9th from > > > > lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > > > > > > > > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) is to be > > > > assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and 10th lords, > > > > Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > > > > > > > > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with respect of > > lagna > > > > position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in chart of Dalai > > > > Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th from lagna. > > > > > > > > > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association(sambndha) with > > > the > > > > help of rashi aspect? > > > > > > > > > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead of lagan? or > > > its > > > > not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields > > satisfactory > > > > results at a certain level. > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > Imran > > > > > > > > You are on the right track and Visti has nicely addressed the > > > points > > > > in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points. > > > > > > > > (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the > > > activity/things > > > > shown by the houses. My communication skills are not a "tangible > > > > thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises out of my > > > > communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house shows my > > > > communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this mail > > (tangible). > > > > > > > > Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), they are the > > > > only tangible things - the only reality - in this material world! > > > > They are very important. > > > > > > > > (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) together in D- > > 10, > > > > be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing them will > > be > > > > great. > > > > > > > > (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. However, note > > > > that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are different from > > the > > > > rules of the world of maya (illusion). > > > > > > > > For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's interactions. > > It > > > is > > > > the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed house of kama > > > > trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) and the > > > > intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc (shaping of > > desire > > > > and working on the desire) and the culmination house (11th) shows > > > the > > > > final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th house shows > > > > dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. While the > > seed > > > > house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the intermediate > > > > house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), the > > culmination > > > > house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall duty). > > > > > > > > The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the world of maya, > > > but > > > > the meanings are different. In the world of truth, shaping of > > > desire > > > > and working on the desires happens through interactions and > > finally > > > > leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. But the > > world > > > of > > > > maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the world of > > > maya, > > > > shaping of desire and working on the desire happens only thru > > > > domination and the results are only material gains. So the 7th > > from > > > > arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and domination. > > > The > > > > 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include > > religiousness, > > > > righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma (duty) - > > > protect > > > > itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about protecting > > > the > > > > status and image. > > > > > > > > The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which trikona it > > > > belongs to and whether it is the seed house, intermediate house > > or > > > > the culmination house of that trikona) is constant for all > > > > references. But building the meaning further based on the axioms > > > > requires an understanding of the two worlds - world of satya and > > > > world of maya. > > > > > > > > I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish Workshop" and the > > CD > > > > will be available for buying online in a day or two at most. > > > > > > > > (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa > > > > interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana dasa that is > > > > computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the changing > > > > impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the resulting luck) > > on > > > > one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana Dasa" by Pt. > > > > Sanjay Rath. > > > > > > > > (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa interpretation, but > > > you > > > > can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition to transits > > > > from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits from natal > > arudha > > > > lagna! > > > > > > > > However, again, different rules may apply in the case of arudha > > > > lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma from Moon or > > > > lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter loves dharma. > > > > However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha lagna, the > > wise > > > > teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the rules of the > > > world > > > > of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a shallow dharma > > > > (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So there will > > be > > > > material setbacks and the illusion is broken. However, if Jupiter > > > has > > > > a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal chart also, > > > the > > > > negative results may be mitigated. > > > > > > > > Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally different > > > > worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one understands > > > and > > > > appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha lagna. Try > > to > > > > give it some thought. > > > > > > > > Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck with your > > > > arudha pada studies! > > > > > > > > May Jupiter's light shine on us, > > > > Narasimha""""""" > > > > """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > Dear Partha, > > > > > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I indicated > > > (About > > > > pada > > > > > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji says > > verbatim " > > > > > Use of arudha lagna > > > > > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha lagna is > > maya > > > > peetha or > > > > > the seat of > > > > > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for different > > shades > > > > of self. > > > > > Lagna stands for > > > > > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived self. Arudha > > lagna > > > > stands > > > > > for "self, as > > > > > peceived by this maya world". > > > > > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to comment. > > > Regards, > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse - dear Anu > > > > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > > > > > > > > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this world of Maya. > > > > This > > > > > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages. > > > > > regards > > > > > partha > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Hari, > > > > > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are perception of what > > > > > people think > > > > > > about one, this is the only logical inference. Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse - dear > > Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > > > > > > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with the > > > > consummation > > > > > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it correct? > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: 6/25/2003 > > > > > > Sponsor > > <http://rd./M=249982.3512844.4795476.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 05082686:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o72ctft/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi- bin/autoredir?camp=556&lineid=3512844∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > Terms of Service > > <>. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 5, 2003 Report Share Posted July 5, 2003 Dear Amolmandar, If you look at how Arudha Lagna or other Padas are calculated, why Aarudha is to be interpreted as Mounted will be clear. The angle between a planet and its house reflected on other side gets you the Arudha Lagna and Padas. So the logic behind this appears to be reflection by the planet on either side. This being the case, Aarudha has to be taken as connected with Aarohana (To mount).It (the meaning) could well mean outer layer as perceived. It is said that meanings of words are to be taken based on custom in relevant science where a possibility of two meanings for the same word arises. In legal documents also trade terms override dictionary meaning. I am no Pandita of Sanskrita, but think that the corect meaning would be mounted. Analysing the intent it would mean outer layer. If we start taking literal meanings per dictionary, many words would mean something other than what they mean in Jyotish. Here the mounting means the perception others might have about certain bhava activity of the Jataka. About your question about Vedvyasa and Gandhi, find out what were opinions of true form of Vedavyasa of the public when he was young and what was known to Gods, similarly find out what was the opinion of Gandhi's son about him and contrast it with the perception of public like Us. The answer would be crystal clear. This is precisely why Lagna and 7th house padas fall in 10th and 4th house. The Sages knew that human beings do not reveal everything about either themselves or their marital life. So others form opinion about the Jataka from results of his Karma(10th) and about his marital bliss from Sukha(4th House). You will also observe that Pada of 4th falls in 4th house itself, for similar reasons. If you go deeper in to Arudha scheme of things, then you will find that certain yogas are said to be read from 7th arudha and the rishis further enjoin one to read similar results from 2nd Arudha. The reason is that 7th house persception is formed from Dhana and Kutumba of a person by outsiders. Of course these are my views and others might have different views. Chandrashekhar. amolmandar wrote: Respected Chandrashekharji I understand that but when we say meaning literally we should take correct approch to it. The word Maya and Satya have been used to AL and L many times. Maya is popular and difficult to overcome and hence traditional. With this string it suits the meaning of the word aaruDha. Moreover if we take aaruDha as mounted then question arises what gets mounted who mounts it where and why?. One can not 'mount' oneself different for the public. It is the public that forms the opinion or mounts you. So we dont have any control over this mounting phenomenon. That is why I said it is popular identity which is always created by the public. It may be correct i.e. as you are(1st house or Lagna) or it may be something different(any other house) or even exactly opposite(7th house). Had it not been so how do we see,great men like Maharishi Valmiki and Vedvyasa? Or modern day Mahatma Gandhi? Does taht mean what ever we know about them is all aaruDha and their real identity is different? But BPHS says that 1st and 7th house can not be AL house? Why? Parashara can not be wrong. I must be wrong but where I am not getting. Either my premise is wrong and hence the inference. But at least to me and my little Sanskrit knowledge, my premise about aaruDha seems to be correct. In that case my inference should also be correct. I am sure you will solve this and clear my doubts astrologically and its social aspects as well. Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. AmolMandar vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma <boxdel> wrote: > Dear Amolmandar, > I agree with Parthaji. Look up what happens when Arudhapada falls in > 1st,4th and 7th. Again Aarudha could also mean mounted, which could in a > way show perception, is it not? > Chandrashekhar. > > V.Partha sarathy wrote: > > > Om namah Shivaya > > > > Dear Amol > > > > Lagna and Arudha Lagna are never the same. This is a truth. There is > > no fortune involved in making them the same. they can never be the > > same, however hard one may try, > > regards > > partha > > om tat sat > > > > > > vedic astrology, "amolmandar" > > <amolmandar> wrote: > > > Dear Shailesh > > > > > > If you allow me to join this discussion..... > > > > > > I think we should read it as AruDha or aaruDha. Literally ruDha > > means > > > popular or traditional and 'aa' prefix makes it more popular or > > more > > > traditional. The prefix 'a' to ruDha will make it opposite. aruDha > > > will be that is not popular.So aaruDha means morepopular or we can > > > say Maha-popular. That way aaruDha will make what is popularly > > known > > > about you. It need not be other than Satya. If you are fortunate > > > enough your Lagna(true identity) and Arudha Lagna(Popular identity) > > > will be same. All great persons should belong to that class. Both > > > identies are govern by satya i.e.you(Lagna) and hence Lagna is > > more > > > important. > > > > > > After all we say satyam eva jayate! > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Shailesh Chadha" > > <scc@s...> > > > wrote: > > > > || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha, > > > > May I join in this discussion? > > > > If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis-à-vis our > > > > understanding of a jataka, the confusion about Arudha Padas will > > > > dissolve to a great extent. > > > > "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - that which > > > relates to > > > > "Atma" and "Parmatma" . > > > > This material world is in fact "maya" - an illusion, but we treat > > > this > > > > world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules of "satya" to it. > > > > Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this world of "maya" > > and, > > > > hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are more relevant to > > > this > > > > material existence. > > > > Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana-arudha, Gaja- > > arudha, > > > > etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level". > > > > So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made by the > > > individual > > > > (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards achieving the > > highest > > > > ability/ perfection. > > > > Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood as "manifestation" or > > > > "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I think we will be > > > able to > > > > better appreciate this concept of "arudha". > > > > Of course, this is only as per my understanding - hopefully, > > Gurus > > > and > > > > seniors will correct, or confirm, it. > > > > Regards & best wishes, > > > > Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5] > > > > Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PM > > > > vedic astrology > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > Om Namah SHivaya > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > I have a habit of saving all important messages by the various > > > gurus > > > > and learned members. I have around 50 MB material just by this > > work > > > > (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the old message > > for > > > > your perusal > > > > > > > > regards > > > > partha > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > """"""- > > > > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > > > > vedic astrology > > > > Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha > > > > > > > > Dear Imran, > > > > > > > > > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > > > > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > > > > > The concept of Arudha of different houses beautifully eloborates > > > > the difference between reality(Satya) and perception(Maya). Sage > > > > Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat and tackle > > > these > > > > Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold specific > > > > posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas collectively, > > thus > > > > require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa and > > vorgottama > > > > of Arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. For example in > > > > case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in Scorpio (9th from > > > > lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > > > > > > > > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) is to be > > > > assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and 10th lords, > > > > Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > > > > > > > > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with respect of > > lagna > > > > position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in chart of Dalai > > > > Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th from lagna. > > > > > > > > > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association(sambndha) with > > > the > > > > help of rashi aspect? > > > > > > > > > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead of lagan? or > > > its > > > > not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields > > satisfactory > > > > results at a certain level. > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > Imran > > > > > > > > You are on the right track and Visti has nicely addressed the > > > points > > > > in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points. > > > > > > > > (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the > > > activity/things > > > > shown by the houses. My communication skills are not a "tangible > > > > thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises out of my > > > > communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house shows my > > > > communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this mail > > (tangible). > > > > > > > > Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), they are the > > > > only tangible things - the only reality - in this material world! > > > > They are very important. > > > > > > > > (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) together in D- > > 10, > > > > be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing them will > > be > > > > great. > > > > > > > > (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. However, note > > > > that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are different from > > the > > > > rules of the world of maya (illusion). > > > > > > > > For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's interactions. > > It > > > is > > > > the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed house of kama > > > > trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) and the > > > > intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc (shaping of > > desire > > > > and working on the desire) and the culmination house (11th) shows > > > the > > > > final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th house shows > > > > dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. While the > > seed > > > > house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the intermediate > > > > house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), the > > culmination > > > > house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall duty). > > > > > > > > The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the world of maya, > > > but > > > > the meanings are different. In the world of truth, shaping of > > > desire > > > > and working on the desires happens through interactions and > > finally > > > > leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. But the > > world > > > of > > > > maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the world of > > > maya, > > > > shaping of desire and working on the desire happens only thru > > > > domination and the results are only material gains. So the 7th > > from > > > > arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and domination. > > > The > > > > 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include > > religiousness, > > > > righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma (duty) - > > > protect > > > > itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about protecting > > > the > > > > status and image. > > > > > > > > The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which trikona it > > > > belongs to and whether it is the seed house, intermediate house > > or > > > > the culmination house of that trikona) is constant for all > > > > references. But building the meaning further based on the axioms > > > > requires an understanding of the two worlds - world of satya and > > > > world of maya. > > > > > > > > I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish Workshop" and the > > CD > > > > will be available for buying online in a day or two at most. > > > > > > > > (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa > > > > interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana dasa that is > > > > computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the changing > > > > impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the resulting luck) > > on > > > > one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana Dasa" by Pt. > > > > Sanjay Rath. > > > > > > > > (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa interpretation, but > > > you > > > > can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition to transits > > > > from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits from natal > > arudha > > > > lagna! > > > > > > > > However, again, different rules may apply in the case of arudha > > > > lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma from Moon or > > > > lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter loves dharma. > > > > However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha lagna, the > > wise > > > > teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the rules of the > > > world > > > > of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a shallow dharma > > > > (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So there will > > be > > > > material setbacks and the illusion is broken. However, if Jupiter > > > has > > > > a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal chart also, > > > the > > > > negative results may be mitigated. > > > > > > > > Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally different > > > > worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one understands > > > and > > > > appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha lagna. Try > > to > > > > give it some thought. > > > > > > > > Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck with your > > > > arudha pada studies! > > > > > > > > May Jupiter's light shine on us, > > > > Narasimha""""""" > > > > """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > Dear Partha, > > > > > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I indicated > > > (About > > > > pada > > > > > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji says > > verbatim " > > > > > Use of arudha lagna > > > > > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha lagna is > > maya > > > > peetha or > > > > > the seat of > > > > > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for different > > shades > > > > of self. > > > > > Lagna stands for > > > > > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived self. Arudha > > lagna > > > > stands > > > > > for "self, as > > > > > peceived by this maya world". > > > > > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to comment. > > > Regards, > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse - dear Anu > > > > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > > > > > > > > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this world of Maya. > > > > This > > > > > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages. > > > > > regards > > > > > partha > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Hari, > > > > > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are perception of what > > > > > people think > > > > > > about one, this is the only logical inference. Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse - dear > > Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > > > > > > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with the > > > > consummation > > > > > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it correct? > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ........ May Jupiter's light shine on us ........ > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ........ May Jupiter's light shine on us ........ > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release 6/25/2003 > > > > > > Sponsor > > <http://rd./M=249982.3512844.4795476.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 05082686:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o72ctft/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi- bin/autoredir?camp=556&lineid=3512844∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > Terms of Service > > <>. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 6, 2003 Report Share Posted July 6, 2003 Respected Chandrashekharji Thanks for the detailed mail. I have some doubts remaining. Sir, why should we connect the word aarohana when not mentioned by the sages? Is it not correct to stick to the word used. The general perception of the word aaruDha might be different. It may be because of time that has gone between the scriptures written and present time. But when scriptures were written the word had only dictionary meanings. Moreover sir is it not the case of doing the reverse logic? First make the result and then find out the suitable reasons for that.( Sir please do not take it otherwise). Applying a word which has the meaning suitable to our logic would be doing injustice to the sages. It would be interesting to find out a word used in Jyotish with the meaning different than dictionary meaning. If there exits (I know since you have said it must be there) then is it required to put forward the correct meanings and reinterpret the shlokas correctly? Regarding the VedVyasa and Mahatma Gandhi I supposed I was not eble to express properly. What I wanted to focus was that popular identity of a person must be in tandem with the actual identity of the person. If a person is popularly known as Mahatma then actually he should be Mahatma. If it is not so then many problems on many fronts may crop up. Those who considered him as Mahatma and their intelligence would be questioned. The person who falsely becomes mahatma gets the credit of cheating people. Matahtma was Mahatma in the eyes of the people because he was Mahatma. The son and for that matter any other close relative (who became known as critic of Mahatma otherwise had no standings of his own) may have different opinion. That can not be considered as True or actual of Mahatma. There might be different individual opinions about any body including Mahatma.My point is that an un-deserving person may never get acknowledgements from the masses. There were so many leaders but only one Mahatma. Normal human being may not reveal about themselves but Mahatmas dont have anything to hide. In that case only Lagna and aaruDha can be same. That is why I said only fortunates will have actual(Lagna) and popular identity(aaruDha) same. I, in the flow of the thought process, find in crossing my limits I apologise for that. Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. AmolMandar vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma <boxdel> wrote: > Dear Amolmandar, > If you look at how Arudha Lagna or other Padas are calculated, why > Aarudha is to be interpreted as Mounted will be clear. The angle between > a planet and its house reflected on other side gets you the Arudha Lagna > and Padas. So the logic behind this appears to be reflection by the > planet on either side. This being the case, Aarudha has to be taken as > connected with Aarohana (To mount).It (the meaning) could well mean > outer layer as perceived. > It is said that meanings of words are to be taken based on custom in > relevant science where a possibility of two meanings for the same word > arises. In legal documents also trade terms override dictionary meaning. > I am no Pandita of Sanskrita, but think that the corect meaning would be > mounted. Analysing the intent it would mean outer layer. If we start > taking literal meanings per dictionary, many words would mean something > other than what they mean in Jyotish. Here the mounting means the > perception others might have about certain bhava activity of the Jataka. > About your question about Vedvyasa and Gandhi, find out what were > opinions of true form of Vedavyasa of the public when he was young and > what was known to Gods, similarly find out what was the opinion of > Gandhi's son about him and contrast it with the perception of public > like Us. The answer would be crystal clear. > This is precisely why Lagna and 7th house padas fall in 10th and 4th > house. The Sages knew that human beings do not reveal everything about > either themselves or their marital life. So others form opinion about > the Jataka from results of his Karma(10th) and about his marital bliss > from Sukha(4th House). You will also observe that Pada of 4th falls in > 4th house itself, for similar reasons. > If you go deeper in to Arudha scheme of things, then you will find that > certain yogas are said to be read from 7th arudha and the rishis further > enjoin one to read similar results from 2nd Arudha. The reason is that > 7th house persception is formed from Dhana and Kutumba of a person by > outsiders. > Of course these are my views and others might have different views. > Chandrashekhar. > > amolmandar wrote: > > > Respected Chandrashekharji > > > > I understand that but when we say meaning literally we should take > > correct approch to it. The word Maya and Satya have been used to AL > > and L many times. Maya is popular and difficult to overcome and hence > > traditional. With this string it suits the meaning of the word > > aaruDha. Moreover if we take aaruDha as mounted then question arises > > what gets mounted who mounts it where and why?. One can not 'mount' > > oneself different for the public. It is the public that forms the > > opinion or mounts you. So we dont have any control over this mounting > > phenomenon. That is why I said it is popular identity which is always > > created by the public. It may be correct i.e. as you are(1st house or > > Lagna) or it may be something different(any other house) or even > > exactly opposite(7th house). Had it not been so how do we see,great > > men like Maharishi Valmiki and Vedvyasa? Or modern day Mahatma > > Gandhi? Does taht mean what ever we know about them is all aaruDha > > and their real identity is different? But BPHS says that 1st and 7th > > house can not be AL house? Why? Parashara can not be wrong. I must be > > wrong but where I am not getting. Either my premise is wrong and > > hence the inference. But at least to me and my little Sanskrit > > knowledge, my premise about aaruDha seems to be correct. In that case > > my inference should also be correct. > > > > I am sure you will solve this and clear my doubts astrologically and > > its social aspects as well. > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > AmolMandar > > > > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > Dear Amolmandar, > > > I agree with Parthaji. Look up what happens when Arudhapada falls > > in > > > 1st,4th and 7th. Again Aarudha could also mean mounted, which could > > in a > > > way show perception, is it not? > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy wrote: > > > > > > > Om namah Shivaya > > > > > > > > Dear Amol > > > > > > > > Lagna and Arudha Lagna are never the same. This is a truth. There > > is > > > > no fortune involved in making them the same. they can never be the > > > > same, however hard one may try, > > > > regards > > > > partha > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "amolmandar" > > > > <amolmandar> wrote: > > > > > Dear Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > If you allow me to join this discussion..... > > > > > > > > > > I think we should read it as AruDha or aaruDha. Literally ruDha > > > > means > > > > > popular or traditional and 'aa' prefix makes it more popular or > > > > more > > > > > traditional. The prefix 'a' to ruDha will make it opposite. > > aruDha > > > > > will be that is not popular.So aaruDha means morepopular or we > > can > > > > > say Maha-popular. That way aaruDha will make what is popularly > > > > known > > > > > about you. It need not be other than Satya. If you are fortunate > > > > > enough your Lagna(true identity) and Arudha Lagna(Popular > > identity) > > > > > will be same. All great persons should belong to that class. > > Both > > > > > identies are govern by satya i.e.you(Lagna) and hence Lagna is > > > > more > > > > > important. > > > > > > > > > > After all we say satyam eva jayate! > > > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Shailesh Chadha" > > > > <scc@s...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha, > > > > > > May I join in this discussion? > > > > > > If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis-à-vis our > > > > > > understanding of a jataka, the confusion about Arudha Padas > > will > > > > > > dissolve to a great extent. > > > > > > "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - that which > > > > > relates to > > > > > > "Atma" and "Parmatma" . > > > > > > This material world is in fact "maya" - an illusion, but we > > treat > > > > > this > > > > > > world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules of "satya" to > > it. > > > > > > Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this world > > of "maya" > > > > and, > > > > > > hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are more relevant > > to > > > > > this > > > > > > material existence. > > > > > > Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana-arudha, Gaja- > > > > arudha, > > > > > > etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level". > > > > > > So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made by the > > > > > individual > > > > > > (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards achieving the > > > > highest > > > > > > ability/ perfection. > > > > > > Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood > > as "manifestation" or > > > > > > "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I think we will > > be > > > > > able to > > > > > > better appreciate this concept of "arudha". > > > > > > Of course, this is only as per my understanding - hopefully, > > > > Gurus > > > > > and > > > > > > seniors will correct, or confirm, it. > > > > > > Regards & best wishes, > > > > > > Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5] > > > > > > Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PM > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear > > chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Namah SHivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > > > > > I have a habit of saving all important messages by the various > > > > > gurus > > > > > > and learned members. I have around 50 MB material just by this > > > > work > > > > > > (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the old message > > > > for > > > > > > your perusal > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > partha > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > """"""- > > > > > > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Imran, > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The concept of Arudha of different houses beautifully > > eloborates > > > > > > the difference between reality(Satya) and perception (Maya). > > Sage > > > > > > Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat and > > tackle > > > > > these > > > > > > Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold specific > > > > > > posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas collectively, > > > > thus > > > > > > require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa and > > > > vorgottama > > > > > > of Arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. For > > example in > > > > > > case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in Scorpio (9th > > from > > > > > > lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) is to be > > > > > > assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and 10th > > lords, > > > > > > Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with respect of > > > > lagna > > > > > > position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in chart of > > Dalai > > > > > > Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th from > > lagna. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association (sambndha) > > with > > > > > the > > > > > > help of rashi aspect? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead of > > lagan? or > > > > > its > > > > > > not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields > > > > satisfactory > > > > > > results at a certain level. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imran > > > > > > > > > > > > You are on the right track and Visti has nicely addressed the > > > > > points > > > > > > in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points. > > > > > > > > > > > > (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the > > > > > activity/things > > > > > > shown by the houses. My communication skills are not > > a "tangible > > > > > > thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises out of my > > > > > > communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house shows my > > > > > > communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this mail > > > > (tangible). > > > > > > > > > > > > Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), they are > > the > > > > > > only tangible things - the only reality - in this material > > world! > > > > > > They are very important. > > > > > > > > > > > > (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) together in > > D- > > > > 10, > > > > > > be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing them > > will > > > > be > > > > > > great. > > > > > > > > > > > > (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. However, > > note > > > > > > that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are different > > from > > > > the > > > > > > rules of the world of maya (illusion). > > > > > > > > > > > > For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's > > interactions. > > > > It > > > > > is > > > > > > the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed house of kama > > > > > > trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) and the > > > > > > intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc (shaping of > > > > desire > > > > > > and working on the desire) and the culmination house (11th) > > shows > > > > > the > > > > > > final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th house shows > > > > > > dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. While the > > > > seed > > > > > > house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the > > intermediate > > > > > > house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), the > > > > culmination > > > > > > house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall duty). > > > > > > > > > > > > The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the world of > > maya, > > > > > but > > > > > > the meanings are different. In the world of truth, shaping of > > > > > desire > > > > > > and working on the desires happens through interactions and > > > > finally > > > > > > leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. But the > > > > world > > > > > of > > > > > > maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the world of > > > > > maya, > > > > > > shaping of desire and working on the desire happens only thru > > > > > > domination and the results are only material gains. So the 7th > > > > from > > > > > > arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and > > domination. > > > > > The > > > > > > 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include > > > > religiousness, > > > > > > righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma (duty) - > > > > > protect > > > > > > itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about > > protecting > > > > > the > > > > > > status and image. > > > > > > > > > > > > The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which > > trikona it > > > > > > belongs to and whether it is the seed house, intermediate > > house > > > > or > > > > > > the culmination house of that trikona) is constant for all > > > > > > references. But building the meaning further based on the > > axioms > > > > > > requires an understanding of the two worlds - world of satya > > and > > > > > > world of maya. > > > > > > > > > > > > I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish Workshop" and > > the > > > > CD > > > > > > will be available for buying online in a day or two at most. > > > > > > > > > > > > (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa > > > > > > interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana dasa > > that is > > > > > > computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the > > changing > > > > > > impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the resulting > > luck) > > > > on > > > > > > one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana Dasa" by > > Pt. > > > > > > Sanjay Rath. > > > > > > > > > > > > (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa interpretation, > > but > > > > > you > > > > > > can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition to > > transits > > > > > > from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits from natal > > > > arudha > > > > > > lagna! > > > > > > > > > > > > However, again, different rules may apply in the case of > > arudha > > > > > > lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma from > > Moon or > > > > > > lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter loves dharma. > > > > > > However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha lagna, the > > > > wise > > > > > > teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the rules of the > > > > > world > > > > > > of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a shallow > > dharma > > > > > > (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So there > > will > > > > be > > > > > > material setbacks and the illusion is broken. However, if > > Jupiter > > > > > has > > > > > > a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal chart > > also, > > > > > the > > > > > > negative results may be mitigated. > > > > > > > > > > > > Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally > > different > > > > > > worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one > > understands > > > > > and > > > > > > appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha lagna. > > Try > > > > to > > > > > > give it some thought. > > > > > > > > > > > > Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck with > > your > > > > > > arudha pada studies! > > > > > > > > > > > > May Jupiter's light shine on us, > > > > > > Narasimha""""""" > > > > > > """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar > > Sharma" > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > Dear Partha, > > > > > > > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I > > indicated > > > > > (About > > > > > > pada > > > > > > > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji says > > > > verbatim " > > > > > > > Use of arudha lagna > > > > > > > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha lagna is > > > > maya > > > > > > peetha or > > > > > > > the seat of > > > > > > > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for different > > > > shades > > > > > > of self. > > > > > > > Lagna stands for > > > > > > > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived self. Arudha > > > > lagna > > > > > > stands > > > > > > > for "self, as > > > > > > > peceived by this maya world". > > > > > > > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to comment. > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse - > > dear Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this world of > > Maya. > > > > > > This > > > > > > > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages. > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar > > Sharma" > > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Hari, > > > > > > > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are perception of > > what > > > > > > > people think > > > > > > > > about one, this is the only logical inference. > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse - > > dear > > > > Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with the > > > > > > consummation > > > > > > > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it correct? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms > > of > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: > > 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: > > 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > <http://rd./M=249982.3512844.4795476.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 > > 05082686:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o72ctft/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi- > > bin/autoredir?camp=556&lineid=3512844∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > Service > > > > <>. > > > > > > Sponsor > > <http://rd./M=249982.3512844.4795476.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 05082686:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o72ctft/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi- bin/autoredir?camp=556&lineid=3512844∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > Terms of Service > > <>. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 7, 2003 Report Share Posted July 7, 2003 Om Namah SHivaya Dear Amol You are confusing the concepts. It is very clear that Lagna and Arudha lagna can never be the same. This is from the dicta of the sages and we should not try to use words that condradict the same. As i said earlier, Arudha Lagna is not asatya, it is only a manfiestation of the self+intelligence in the society. Lagna+Paka lagna = arudha lagna. Manifestation is not a false identity , it is an identity in itself andd we should not use the words such as false, and illusion etc for these identities. regards partha om tat sat vedic astrology, "amolmandar" <amolmandar> wrote: > Respected Chandrashekharji > > Thanks for the detailed mail. I have some doubts remaining. Sir, why > should we connect the word aarohana when not mentioned by the sages? > Is it not correct to stick to the word used. The general perception > of the word aaruDha might be different. It may be because of time > that has gone between the scriptures written and present time. > But when scriptures were written the word had only dictionary > meanings. > > Moreover sir is it not the case of doing the reverse logic? First > make the result and then find out the suitable reasons for that.( Sir > please do not take it otherwise). Applying a word which has the > meaning suitable to our logic would be doing injustice to the sages. > > It would be interesting to find out a word used in Jyotish with the > meaning different than dictionary meaning. If there exits (I know > since you have said it must be there) then is it required to put > forward the correct meanings and reinterpret the shlokas correctly? > > Regarding the VedVyasa and Mahatma Gandhi I supposed I was not eble > to express properly. What I wanted to focus was that popular identity > of a person must be in tandem with the actual identity of the person. > If a person is popularly known as Mahatma then actually he should be > Mahatma. If it is not so then many problems on many fronts may crop > up. Those who considered him as Mahatma and their intelligence would > be questioned. The person who falsely becomes mahatma gets the credit > of cheating people. Matahtma was Mahatma in the eyes of the people > because he was Mahatma. The son and for that matter any other close > relative (who became known as critic of Mahatma otherwise had no > standings of his own) may have different opinion. That can not be > considered as True or actual of Mahatma. There might be different > individual opinions about any body including Mahatma.My point is that > an un-deserving person may never get acknowledgements from the > masses. There were so many leaders but only one Mahatma. > > Normal human being may not reveal about themselves but Mahatmas dont > have anything to hide. In that case only Lagna and aaruDha can be > same. That is why I said only fortunates will have actual(Lagna) and > popular identity(aaruDha) same. > > I, in the flow of the thought process, find in crossing my limits I > apologise for that. > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > AmolMandar > > > > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma > <boxdel> wrote: > > Dear Amolmandar, > > If you look at how Arudha Lagna or other Padas are calculated, why > > Aarudha is to be interpreted as Mounted will be clear. The angle > between > > a planet and its house reflected on other side gets you the Arudha > Lagna > > and Padas. So the logic behind this appears to be reflection by the > > planet on either side. This being the case, Aarudha has to be taken > as > > connected with Aarohana (To mount).It (the meaning) could well mean > > outer layer as perceived. > > It is said that meanings of words are to be taken based on custom > in > > relevant science where a possibility of two meanings for the same > word > > arises. In legal documents also trade terms override dictionary > meaning. > > I am no Pandita of Sanskrita, but think that the corect meaning > would be > > mounted. Analysing the intent it would mean outer layer. If we > start > > taking literal meanings per dictionary, many words would mean > something > > other than what they mean in Jyotish. Here the mounting means the > > perception others might have about certain bhava activity of the > Jataka. > > About your question about Vedvyasa and Gandhi, find out what were > > opinions of true form of Vedavyasa of the public when he was young > and > > what was known to Gods, similarly find out what was the opinion of > > Gandhi's son about him and contrast it with the perception of > public > > like Us. The answer would be crystal clear. > > This is precisely why Lagna and 7th house padas fall in 10th and > 4th > > house. The Sages knew that human beings do not reveal everything > about > > either themselves or their marital life. So others form opinion > about > > the Jataka from results of his Karma(10th) and about his marital > bliss > > from Sukha(4th House). You will also observe that Pada of 4th falls > in > > 4th house itself, for similar reasons. > > If you go deeper in to Arudha scheme of things, then you will find > that > > certain yogas are said to be read from 7th arudha and the rishis > further > > enjoin one to read similar results from 2nd Arudha. The reason is > that > > 7th house persception is formed from Dhana and Kutumba of a person > by > > outsiders. > > Of course these are my views and others might have different views. > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > amolmandar wrote: > > > > > Respected Chandrashekharji > > > > > > I understand that but when we say meaning literally we should take > > > correct approch to it. The word Maya and Satya have been used to > AL > > > and L many times. Maya is popular and difficult to overcome and > hence > > > traditional. With this string it suits the meaning of the word > > > aaruDha. Moreover if we take aaruDha as mounted then question > arises > > > what gets mounted who mounts it where and why?. One can > not 'mount' > > > oneself different for the public. It is the public that forms the > > > opinion or mounts you. So we dont have any control over this > mounting > > > phenomenon. That is why I said it is popular identity which is > always > > > created by the public. It may be correct i.e. as you are(1st > house or > > > Lagna) or it may be something different(any other house) or even > > > exactly opposite(7th house). Had it not been so how do we > see,great > > > men like Maharishi Valmiki and Vedvyasa? Or modern day Mahatma > > > Gandhi? Does taht mean what ever we know about them is all aaruDha > > > and their real identity is different? But BPHS says that 1st and > 7th > > > house can not be AL house? Why? Parashara can not be wrong. I > must be > > > wrong but where I am not getting. Either my premise is wrong and > > > hence the inference. But at least to me and my little Sanskrit > > > knowledge, my premise about aaruDha seems to be correct. In that > case > > > my inference should also be correct. > > > > > > I am sure you will solve this and clear my doubts astrologically > and > > > its social aspects as well. > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > Dear Amolmandar, > > > > I agree with Parthaji. Look up what happens when Arudhapada > falls > > > in > > > > 1st,4th and 7th. Again Aarudha could also mean mounted, which > could > > > in a > > > > way show perception, is it not? > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy wrote: > > > > > > > > > Om namah Shivaya > > > > > > > > > > Dear Amol > > > > > > > > > > Lagna and Arudha Lagna are never the same. This is a truth. > There > > > is > > > > > no fortune involved in making them the same. they can never > be the > > > > > same, however hard one may try, > > > > > regards > > > > > partha > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "amolmandar" > > > > > <amolmandar> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > > > If you allow me to join this discussion..... > > > > > > > > > > > > I think we should read it as AruDha or aaruDha. Literally > ruDha > > > > > means > > > > > > popular or traditional and 'aa' prefix makes it more > popular or > > > > > more > > > > > > traditional. The prefix 'a' to ruDha will make it opposite. > > > aruDha > > > > > > will be that is not popular.So aaruDha means morepopular or > we > > > can > > > > > > say Maha-popular. That way aaruDha will make what is > popularly > > > > > known > > > > > > about you. It need not be other than Satya. If you are > fortunate > > > > > > enough your Lagna(true identity) and Arudha Lagna(Popular > > > identity) > > > > > > will be same. All great persons should belong to that > class. > > > Both > > > > > > identies are govern by satya i.e.you(Lagna) and hence > Lagna is > > > > > more > > > > > > important. > > > > > > > > > > > > After all we say satyam eva jayate! > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Shailesh Chadha" > > > > > <scc@s...> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha, > > > > > > > May I join in this discussion? > > > > > > > If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis-à-vis > our > > > > > > > understanding of a jataka, the confusion about Arudha > Padas > > > will > > > > > > > dissolve to a great extent. > > > > > > > "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - that > which > > > > > > relates to > > > > > > > "Atma" and "Parmatma" . > > > > > > > This material world is in fact "maya" - an illusion, but > we > > > treat > > > > > > this > > > > > > > world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules > of "satya" to > > > it. > > > > > > > Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this world > > > of "maya" > > > > > and, > > > > > > > hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are more > relevant > > > to > > > > > > this > > > > > > > material existence. > > > > > > > Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana-arudha, > Gaja- > > > > > arudha, > > > > > > > etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level". > > > > > > > So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made by the > > > > > > individual > > > > > > > (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards achieving > the > > > > > highest > > > > > > > ability/ perfection. > > > > > > > Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood > > > as "manifestation" or > > > > > > > "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I think we > will > > > be > > > > > > able to > > > > > > > better appreciate this concept of "arudha". > > > > > > > Of course, this is only as per my understanding - > hopefully, > > > > > Gurus > > > > > > and > > > > > > > seniors will correct, or confirm, it. > > > > > > > Regards & best wishes, > > > > > > > Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5] > > > > > > > Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PM > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear > > > chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Namah SHivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have a habit of saving all important messages by the > various > > > > > > gurus > > > > > > > and learned members. I have around 50 MB material just by > this > > > > > work > > > > > > > (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the old > message > > > > > for > > > > > > > your perusal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > """"""- > > > > > > > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Imran, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The concept of Arudha of different houses beautifully > > > eloborates > > > > > > > the difference between reality(Satya) and perception > (Maya). > > > Sage > > > > > > > Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat and > > > tackle > > > > > > these > > > > > > > Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold > specific > > > > > > > posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas > collectively, > > > > > thus > > > > > > > require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa and > > > > > vorgottama > > > > > > > of Arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. For > > > example in > > > > > > > case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in Scorpio > (9th > > > from > > > > > > > lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) is > to be > > > > > > > assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and 10th > > > lords, > > > > > > > Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with > respect of > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in chart > of > > > Dalai > > > > > > > Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th from > > > lagna. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association > (sambndha) > > > with > > > > > > the > > > > > > > help of rashi aspect? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead of > > > lagan? or > > > > > > its > > > > > > > not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields > > > > > satisfactory > > > > > > > results at a certain level. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imran > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You are on the right track and Visti has nicely addressed > the > > > > > > points > > > > > > > in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the > > > > > > activity/things > > > > > > > shown by the houses. My communication skills are not > > > a "tangible > > > > > > > thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises out > of my > > > > > > > communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house shows my > > > > > > > communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this mail > > > > > (tangible). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), they > are > > > the > > > > > > > only tangible things - the only reality - in this material > > > world! > > > > > > > They are very important. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) > together in > > > D- > > > > > 10, > > > > > > > be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing them > > > will > > > > > be > > > > > > > great. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. > However, > > > note > > > > > > > that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are different > > > from > > > > > the > > > > > > > rules of the world of maya (illusion). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's > > > interactions. > > > > > It > > > > > > is > > > > > > > the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed house of > kama > > > > > > > trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) and > the > > > > > > > intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc (shaping > of > > > > > desire > > > > > > > and working on the desire) and the culmination house > (11th) > > > shows > > > > > > the > > > > > > > final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th house > shows > > > > > > > dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. While > the > > > > > seed > > > > > > > house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the > > > intermediate > > > > > > > house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), the > > > > > culmination > > > > > > > house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall duty). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the world of > > > maya, > > > > > > but > > > > > > > the meanings are different. In the world of truth, > shaping of > > > > > > desire > > > > > > > and working on the desires happens through interactions > and > > > > > finally > > > > > > > leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. But > the > > > > > world > > > > > > of > > > > > > > maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the > world of > > > > > > maya, > > > > > > > shaping of desire and working on the desire happens only > thru > > > > > > > domination and the results are only material gains. So > the 7th > > > > > from > > > > > > > arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and > > > domination. > > > > > > The > > > > > > > 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include > > > > > religiousness, > > > > > > > righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma > (duty) - > > > > > > protect > > > > > > > itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about > > > protecting > > > > > > the > > > > > > > status and image. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which > > > trikona it > > > > > > > belongs to and whether it is the seed house, intermediate > > > house > > > > > or > > > > > > > the culmination house of that trikona) is constant for all > > > > > > > references. But building the meaning further based on the > > > axioms > > > > > > > requires an understanding of the two worlds - world of > satya > > > and > > > > > > > world of maya. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish Workshop" > and > > > the > > > > > CD > > > > > > > will be available for buying online in a day or two at > most. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa > > > > > > > interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana dasa > > > that is > > > > > > > computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the > > > changing > > > > > > > impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the resulting > > > luck) > > > > > on > > > > > > > one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana > Dasa" by > > > Pt. > > > > > > > Sanjay Rath. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa > interpretation, > > > but > > > > > > you > > > > > > > can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition to > > > transits > > > > > > > from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits from > natal > > > > > arudha > > > > > > > lagna! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, again, different rules may apply in the case of > > > arudha > > > > > > > lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma from > > > Moon or > > > > > > > lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter loves > dharma. > > > > > > > However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha > lagna, the > > > > > wise > > > > > > > teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the rules > of the > > > > > > world > > > > > > > of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a shallow > > > dharma > > > > > > > (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So > there > > > will > > > > > be > > > > > > > material setbacks and the illusion is broken. However, if > > > Jupiter > > > > > > has > > > > > > > a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal chart > > > also, > > > > > > the > > > > > > > negative results may be mitigated. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally > > > different > > > > > > > worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one > > > understands > > > > > > and > > > > > > > appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha > lagna. > > > Try > > > > > to > > > > > > > give it some thought. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck with > > > your > > > > > > > arudha pada studies! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > May Jupiter's light shine on us, > > > > > > > Narasimha""""""" > > > > > > > """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar > > > Sharma" > > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Partha, > > > > > > > > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I > > > indicated > > > > > > (About > > > > > > > pada > > > > > > > > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji says > > > > > verbatim " > > > > > > > > Use of arudha lagna > > > > > > > > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha > lagna is > > > > > maya > > > > > > > peetha or > > > > > > > > the seat of > > > > > > > > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for > different > > > > > shades > > > > > > > of self. > > > > > > > > Lagna stands for > > > > > > > > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived self. > Arudha > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > stands > > > > > > > > for "self, as > > > > > > > > peceived by this maya world". > > > > > > > > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to > comment. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse - > > > dear Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this world > of > > > Maya. > > > > > > > This > > > > > > > > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages. > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic- astrology, "Chandrashekhar > > > Sharma" > > > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Dear Hari, > > > > > > > > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are > perception of > > > what > > > > > > > > people think > > > > > > > > > about one, this is the only logical inference. > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the > spouse - > > > dear > > > > > Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with the > > > > > > > consummation > > > > > > > > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it correct? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic- astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms > > > of > > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu > || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system > (http://www.grisoft.com). > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: > > > 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system > (http://www.grisoft.com). > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: > > > 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > <http://rd./M=249982.3512844.4795476.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 > > > > 05082686:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o72ctft/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi- > > > bin/autoredir?camp=556&lineid=3512844∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > > Service > > > > > <>. > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > <http://rd./M=249982.3512844.4795476.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 > 05082686:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o72ctft/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi- > bin/autoredir?camp=556&lineid=3512844∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- astrology/info.html > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > Service > > > <>. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 7, 2003 Report Share Posted July 7, 2003 Dear Partha Sorry for the confusion caused. I am basically trying to understand the concept behind what sages have written about aaruDha. In the process we must understand the semantics of the words used by the sages. Yes I know sages have mentioned that Lagna and aaruDha can not be same. They have also mentioned many other things and as we try to understand logic behind these other things, I am trying to find out correct reason for aaruDha as well. If any other topic by the sages can be critically analyzed then I think there is nothing abnormal in analysing this topic(aaruDha) as well. We dont always take sages verbatim. Moreover at no point we want to go against what is written by the sages. This is for sure. We want to elevate our knowledge to understand them in correct way. See when we say Lagna as Satya and aaruDha as reflection of LAgna then we have to term it as asatya in the sense that it is what is others see about you(popular identity). This perception of others about you might be wrong. Most of the time you yourself are responsible that to happen. As Chandrashekharji pointed out rightly that human beings have tendency to hide. That way aaruDha may not reflect correct image of you. That might be the reason why it is said that Lagna (true identity known to you only) and aaruDha(popular identity known to masses) can not be same. But all this hold true for normal human beings. What about MAhatmas? Now if we consider that it is only the manefistation of self + intelligence in the society then still the problem remains as to what is self without intelligence? Moreover,as this involves society, the third element is as well introduced. The society may read your intelligence correctly. It may not. So uncertanity comes in. Hence asatya. In the case of nomal mortals it is 100% true but what about Mahatmas? They must have self and intelligence known to society and to themselves as same. Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. AmolMandar vedic astrology, "V.Partha sarathy" <partvinu5> wrote: > Om Namah SHivaya > > Dear Amol > > You are confusing the concepts. It is very clear that Lagna and > Arudha lagna can never be the same. This is from the dicta of the > sages and we should not try to use words that condradict the same. As > i said earlier, Arudha Lagna is not asatya, it is only a > manfiestation of the self+intelligence in the society. Lagna+Paka > lagna = arudha lagna. > Manifestation is not a false identity , it is an identity in itself > andd we should not use the words such as false, and illusion etc for > these identities. > regards > partha > om tat sat > > > > vedic astrology, "amolmandar" > <amolmandar> wrote: > > Respected Chandrashekharji > > > > Thanks for the detailed mail. I have some doubts remaining. Sir, > why > > should we connect the word aarohana when not mentioned by the > sages? > > Is it not correct to stick to the word used. The general perception > > of the word aaruDha might be different. It may be because of time > > that has gone between the scriptures written and present time. > > But when scriptures were written the word had only dictionary > > meanings. > > > > Moreover sir is it not the case of doing the reverse logic? First > > make the result and then find out the suitable reasons for that.( > Sir > > please do not take it otherwise). Applying a word which has the > > meaning suitable to our logic would be doing injustice to the > sages. > > > > It would be interesting to find out a word used in Jyotish with the > > meaning different than dictionary meaning. If there exits (I know > > since you have said it must be there) then is it required to put > > forward the correct meanings and reinterpret the shlokas correctly? > > > > Regarding the VedVyasa and Mahatma Gandhi I supposed I was not eble > > to express properly. What I wanted to focus was that popular > identity > > of a person must be in tandem with the actual identity of the > person. > > If a person is popularly known as Mahatma then actually he should > be > > Mahatma. If it is not so then many problems on many fronts may crop > > up. Those who considered him as Mahatma and their intelligence > would > > be questioned. The person who falsely becomes mahatma gets the > credit > > of cheating people. Matahtma was Mahatma in the eyes of the people > > because he was Mahatma. The son and for that matter any other close > > relative (who became known as critic of Mahatma otherwise had no > > standings of his own) may have different opinion. That can not be > > considered as True or actual of Mahatma. There might be different > > individual opinions about any body including Mahatma.My point is > that > > an un-deserving person may never get acknowledgements from the > > masses. There were so many leaders but only one Mahatma. > > > > Normal human being may not reveal about themselves but Mahatmas > dont > > have anything to hide. In that case only Lagna and aaruDha can be > > same. That is why I said only fortunates will have actual(Lagna) > and > > popular identity(aaruDha) same. > > > > I, in the flow of the thought process, find in crossing my limits > I > > apologise for that. > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > Dear Amolmandar, > > > If you look at how Arudha Lagna or other Padas are calculated, > why > > > Aarudha is to be interpreted as Mounted will be clear. The angle > > between > > > a planet and its house reflected on other side gets you the > Arudha > > Lagna > > > and Padas. So the logic behind this appears to be reflection by > the > > > planet on either side. This being the case, Aarudha has to be > taken > > as > > > connected with Aarohana (To mount).It (the meaning) could well > mean > > > outer layer as perceived. > > > It is said that meanings of words are to be taken based on custom > > in > > > relevant science where a possibility of two meanings for the > same > > word > > > arises. In legal documents also trade terms override dictionary > > meaning. > > > I am no Pandita of Sanskrita, but think that the corect meaning > > would be > > > mounted. Analysing the intent it would mean outer layer. If we > > start > > > taking literal meanings per dictionary, many words would mean > > something > > > other than what they mean in Jyotish. Here the mounting means the > > > perception others might have about certain bhava activity of the > > Jataka. > > > About your question about Vedvyasa and Gandhi, find out what were > > > opinions of true form of Vedavyasa of the public when he was > young > > and > > > what was known to Gods, similarly find out what was the opinion > of > > > Gandhi's son about him and contrast it with the perception of > > public > > > like Us. The answer would be crystal clear. > > > This is precisely why Lagna and 7th house padas fall in 10th and > > 4th > > > house. The Sages knew that human beings do not reveal everything > > about > > > either themselves or their marital life. So others form opinion > > about > > > the Jataka from results of his Karma(10th) and about his marital > > bliss > > > from Sukha(4th House). You will also observe that Pada of 4th > falls > > in > > > 4th house itself, for similar reasons. > > > If you go deeper in to Arudha scheme of things, then you will > find > > that > > > certain yogas are said to be read from 7th arudha and the rishis > > further > > > enjoin one to read similar results from 2nd Arudha. The reason is > > that > > > 7th house persception is formed from Dhana and Kutumba of a > person > > by > > > outsiders. > > > Of course these are my views and others might have different > views. > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > amolmandar wrote: > > > > > > > Respected Chandrashekharji > > > > > > > > I understand that but when we say meaning literally we should > take > > > > correct approch to it. The word Maya and Satya have been used > to > > AL > > > > and L many times. Maya is popular and difficult to overcome and > > hence > > > > traditional. With this string it suits the meaning of the word > > > > aaruDha. Moreover if we take aaruDha as mounted then question > > arises > > > > what gets mounted who mounts it where and why?. One can > > not 'mount' > > > > oneself different for the public. It is the public that forms > the > > > > opinion or mounts you. So we dont have any control over this > > mounting > > > > phenomenon. That is why I said it is popular identity which is > > always > > > > created by the public. It may be correct i.e. as you are(1st > > house or > > > > Lagna) or it may be something different(any other house) or even > > > > exactly opposite(7th house). Had it not been so how do we > > see,great > > > > men like Maharishi Valmiki and Vedvyasa? Or modern day Mahatma > > > > Gandhi? Does taht mean what ever we know about them is all > aaruDha > > > > and their real identity is different? But BPHS says that 1st > and > > 7th > > > > house can not be AL house? Why? Parashara can not be wrong. I > > must be > > > > wrong but where I am not getting. Either my premise is wrong and > > > > hence the inference. But at least to me and my little Sanskrit > > > > knowledge, my premise about aaruDha seems to be correct. In > that > > case > > > > my inference should also be correct. > > > > > > > > I am sure you will solve this and clear my doubts > astrologically > > and > > > > its social aspects as well. > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > Dear Amolmandar, > > > > > I agree with Parthaji. Look up what happens when Arudhapada > > falls > > > > in > > > > > 1st,4th and 7th. Again Aarudha could also mean mounted, which > > could > > > > in a > > > > > way show perception, is it not? > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Om namah Shivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Amol > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna and Arudha Lagna are never the same. This is a truth. > > There > > > > is > > > > > > no fortune involved in making them the same. they can never > > be the > > > > > > same, however hard one may try, > > > > > > regards > > > > > > partha > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "amolmandar" > > > > > > <amolmandar> wrote: > > > > > > > Dear Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you allow me to join this discussion..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think we should read it as AruDha or aaruDha. Literally > > ruDha > > > > > > means > > > > > > > popular or traditional and 'aa' prefix makes it more > > popular or > > > > > > more > > > > > > > traditional. The prefix 'a' to ruDha will make it > opposite. > > > > aruDha > > > > > > > will be that is not popular.So aaruDha means morepopular > or > > we > > > > can > > > > > > > say Maha-popular. That way aaruDha will make what is > > popularly > > > > > > known > > > > > > > about you. It need not be other than Satya. If you are > > fortunate > > > > > > > enough your Lagna(true identity) and Arudha Lagna (Popular > > > > identity) > > > > > > > will be same. All great persons should belong to that > > class. > > > > Both > > > > > > > identies are govern by satya i.e.you(Lagna) and hence > > Lagna is > > > > > > more > > > > > > > important. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > After all we say satyam eva jayate! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Shailesh Chadha" > > > > > > <scc@s...> > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha, > > > > > > > > May I join in this discussion? > > > > > > > > If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis-à- vis > > our > > > > > > > > understanding of a jataka, the confusion about Arudha > > Padas > > > > will > > > > > > > > dissolve to a great extent. > > > > > > > > "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - that > > which > > > > > > > relates to > > > > > > > > "Atma" and "Parmatma" . > > > > > > > > This material world is in fact "maya" - an illusion, > but > > we > > > > treat > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules > > of "satya" to > > > > it. > > > > > > > > Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this world > > > > of "maya" > > > > > > and, > > > > > > > > hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are more > > relevant > > > > to > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > material existence. > > > > > > > > Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana- arudha, > > Gaja- > > > > > > arudha, > > > > > > > > etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level". > > > > > > > > So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made by > the > > > > > > > individual > > > > > > > > (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards > achieving > > the > > > > > > highest > > > > > > > > ability/ perfection. > > > > > > > > Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood > > > > as "manifestation" or > > > > > > > > "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I think > we > > will > > > > be > > > > > > > able to > > > > > > > > better appreciate this concept of "arudha". > > > > > > > > Of course, this is only as per my understanding - > > hopefully, > > > > > > Gurus > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > seniors will correct, or confirm, it. > > > > > > > > Regards & best wishes, > > > > > > > > Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5] > > > > > > > > Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PM > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear > > > > chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Namah SHivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have a habit of saving all important messages by the > > various > > > > > > > gurus > > > > > > > > and learned members. I have around 50 MB material just > by > > this > > > > > > work > > > > > > > > (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the old > > message > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > your perusal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > """"""- > > > > > > > > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Imran, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The concept of Arudha of different houses beautifully > > > > eloborates > > > > > > > > the difference between reality(Satya) and perception > > (Maya). > > > > Sage > > > > > > > > Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat and > > > > tackle > > > > > > > these > > > > > > > > Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold > > specific > > > > > > > > posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas > > collectively, > > > > > > thus > > > > > > > > require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa and > > > > > > vorgottama > > > > > > > > of Arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. For > > > > example in > > > > > > > > case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in Scorpio > > (9th > > > > from > > > > > > > > lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) > is > > to be > > > > > > > > assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and 10th > > > > lords, > > > > > > > > Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with > > respect of > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > > position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in > chart > > of > > > > Dalai > > > > > > > > Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th > from > > > > lagna. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association > > (sambndha) > > > > with > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > help of rashi aspect? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead of > > > > lagan? or > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields > > > > > > satisfactory > > > > > > > > results at a certain level. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imran > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You are on the right track and Visti has nicely > addressed > > the > > > > > > > points > > > > > > > > in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the > > > > > > > activity/things > > > > > > > > shown by the houses. My communication skills are not > > > > a "tangible > > > > > > > > thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises > out > > of my > > > > > > > > communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house shows > my > > > > > > > > communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this mail > > > > > > (tangible). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), > they > > are > > > > the > > > > > > > > only tangible things - the only reality - in this > material > > > > world! > > > > > > > > They are very important. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) > > together in > > > > D- > > > > > > 10, > > > > > > > > be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing > them > > > > will > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > great. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. > > However, > > > > note > > > > > > > > that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are > different > > > > from > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > rules of the world of maya (illusion). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's > > > > interactions. > > > > > > It > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed house > of > > kama > > > > > > > > trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) and > > the > > > > > > > > intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc > (shaping > > of > > > > > > desire > > > > > > > > and working on the desire) and the culmination house > > (11th) > > > > shows > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th > house > > shows > > > > > > > > dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. > While > > the > > > > > > seed > > > > > > > > house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the > > > > intermediate > > > > > > > > house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), the > > > > > > culmination > > > > > > > > house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall duty). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the world > of > > > > maya, > > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > the meanings are different. In the world of truth, > > shaping of > > > > > > > desire > > > > > > > > and working on the desires happens through interactions > > and > > > > > > finally > > > > > > > > leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. > But > > the > > > > > > world > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the > > world of > > > > > > > maya, > > > > > > > > shaping of desire and working on the desire happens > only > > thru > > > > > > > > domination and the results are only material gains. So > > the 7th > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and > > > > domination. > > > > > > > The > > > > > > > > 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include > > > > > > religiousness, > > > > > > > > righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma > > (duty) - > > > > > > > protect > > > > > > > > itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about > > > > protecting > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > status and image. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which > > > > trikona it > > > > > > > > belongs to and whether it is the seed house, > intermediate > > > > house > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > the culmination house of that trikona) is constant for > all > > > > > > > > references. But building the meaning further based on > the > > > > axioms > > > > > > > > requires an understanding of the two worlds - world of > > satya > > > > and > > > > > > > > world of maya. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish > Workshop" > > and > > > > the > > > > > > CD > > > > > > > > will be available for buying online in a day or two at > > most. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa > > > > > > > > interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana > dasa > > > > that is > > > > > > > > computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the > > > > changing > > > > > > > > impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the > resulting > > > > luck) > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana > > Dasa" by > > > > Pt. > > > > > > > > Sanjay Rath. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa > > interpretation, > > > > but > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition to > > > > transits > > > > > > > > from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits from > > natal > > > > > > arudha > > > > > > > > lagna! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, again, different rules may apply in the case of > > > > arudha > > > > > > > > lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma > from > > > > Moon or > > > > > > > > lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter loves > > dharma. > > > > > > > > However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha > > lagna, the > > > > > > wise > > > > > > > > teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the rules > > of the > > > > > > > world > > > > > > > > of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a > shallow > > > > dharma > > > > > > > > (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So > > there > > > > will > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > material setbacks and the illusion is broken. However, > if > > > > Jupiter > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal > chart > > > > also, > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > negative results may be mitigated. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally > > > > different > > > > > > > > worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one > > > > understands > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha > > lagna. > > > > Try > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > give it some thought. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck > with > > > > your > > > > > > > > arudha pada studies! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > May Jupiter's light shine on us, > > > > > > > > Narasimha""""""" > > > > > > > > > """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic- astrology, "Chandrashekhar > > > > Sharma" > > > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Dear Partha, > > > > > > > > > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I > > > > indicated > > > > > > > (About > > > > > > > > pada > > > > > > > > > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji > says > > > > > > verbatim " > > > > > > > > > Use of arudha lagna > > > > > > > > > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha > > lagna is > > > > > > maya > > > > > > > > peetha or > > > > > > > > > the seat of > > > > > > > > > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for > > different > > > > > > shades > > > > > > > > of self. > > > > > > > > > Lagna stands for > > > > > > > > > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived self. > > Arudha > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > > stands > > > > > > > > > for "self, as > > > > > > > > > peceived by this maya world". > > > > > > > > > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to > > comment. > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the > spouse - > > > > dear Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this > world > > of > > > > Maya. > > > > > > > > This > > > > > > > > > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages. > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic- > astrology, "Chandrashekhar > > > > Sharma" > > > > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Hari, > > > > > > > > > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are > > perception of > > > > what > > > > > > > > > people think > > > > > > > > > > about one, this is the only logical inference. > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the > > spouse - > > > > dear > > > > > > Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with > the > > > > > > > > consummation > > > > > > > > > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it correct? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic- > astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > > Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the > > Terms > > > > of > > > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic- astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > Krishnaarpanamastu > > || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu > || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > > > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system > > (http://www.grisoft.com). > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: > > > > 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system > > (http://www.grisoft.com). > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: > > > > 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > <http://rd./M=249982.3512844.4795476.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 > > > > > > 05082686:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o72ctft/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi- > > > > bin/autoredir?camp=556&lineid=3512844∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > > > Service > > > > > > <>. > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > <http://rd./M=249982.3512844.4795476.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 > > 05082686:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o72ctft/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi- > > bin/autoredir?camp=556&lineid=3512844∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > Service > > > > <>. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 7, 2003 Report Share Posted July 7, 2003 Dear Partha Sorry for the confusion caused. I am basically trying to understand the concept behind what sages have written about aaruDha. In the process we must understand the semantics of the words used by the sages. Yes I know sages have mentioned that Lagna and aaruDha can not be same. They have also mentioned many other things and as we try to understand logic behind these other things, I am trying to find out correct reason for aaruDha as well. If any other topic by the sages can be critically analyzed then I think there is nothing abnormal in analysing this topic(aaruDha) as well. We dont always take sages verbatim. Moreover at no point we want to go against what is written by the sages. This is for sure. We want to elevate our knowledge to understand them in correct way. See when we say Lagna as Satya and aaruDha as reflection of LAgna then we have to term it as asatya in the sense that it is what is others see about you(popular identity). This perception of others about you might be wrong. Most of the time you yourself are responsible that to happen. As Chandrashekharji pointed out rightly that human beings have tendency to hide. That way aaruDha may not reflect correct image of you. That might be the reason why it is said that Lagna (true identity known to you only) and aaruDha(popular identity known to masses) can not be same. But all this hold true for normal human beings. What about MAhatmas? Now if we consider that it is only the manefistation of self + intelligence in the society then still the problem remains as to what is self without intelligence? Moreover,as this involves society, the third element is as well introduced. The society may read your intelligence correctly. It may not. So uncertanity comes in. Hence asatya. In the case of nomal mortals it is 100% true but what about Mahatmas? They must have self and intelligence known to society and to themselves as same. Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. AmolMandar vedic astrology, "V.Partha sarathy" <partvinu5> wrote: > Om Namah SHivaya > > Dear Amol > > You are confusing the concepts. It is very clear that Lagna and > Arudha lagna can never be the same. This is from the dicta of the > sages and we should not try to use words that condradict the same. As > i said earlier, Arudha Lagna is not asatya, it is only a > manfiestation of the self+intelligence in the society. Lagna+Paka > lagna = arudha lagna. > Manifestation is not a false identity , it is an identity in itself > andd we should not use the words such as false, and illusion etc for > these identities. > regards > partha > om tat sat > > > > vedic astrology, "amolmandar" > <amolmandar> wrote: > > Respected Chandrashekharji > > > > Thanks for the detailed mail. I have some doubts remaining. Sir, > why > > should we connect the word aarohana when not mentioned by the > sages? > > Is it not correct to stick to the word used. The general perception > > of the word aaruDha might be different. It may be because of time > > that has gone between the scriptures written and present time. > > But when scriptures were written the word had only dictionary > > meanings. > > > > Moreover sir is it not the case of doing the reverse logic? First > > make the result and then find out the suitable reasons for that.( > Sir > > please do not take it otherwise). Applying a word which has the > > meaning suitable to our logic would be doing injustice to the > sages. > > > > It would be interesting to find out a word used in Jyotish with the > > meaning different than dictionary meaning. If there exits (I know > > since you have said it must be there) then is it required to put > > forward the correct meanings and reinterpret the shlokas correctly? > > > > Regarding the VedVyasa and Mahatma Gandhi I supposed I was not eble > > to express properly. What I wanted to focus was that popular > identity > > of a person must be in tandem with the actual identity of the > person. > > If a person is popularly known as Mahatma then actually he should > be > > Mahatma. If it is not so then many problems on many fronts may crop > > up. Those who considered him as Mahatma and their intelligence > would > > be questioned. The person who falsely becomes mahatma gets the > credit > > of cheating people. Matahtma was Mahatma in the eyes of the people > > because he was Mahatma. The son and for that matter any other close > > relative (who became known as critic of Mahatma otherwise had no > > standings of his own) may have different opinion. That can not be > > considered as True or actual of Mahatma. There might be different > > individual opinions about any body including Mahatma.My point is > that > > an un-deserving person may never get acknowledgements from the > > masses. There were so many leaders but only one Mahatma. > > > > Normal human being may not reveal about themselves but Mahatmas > dont > > have anything to hide. In that case only Lagna and aaruDha can be > > same. That is why I said only fortunates will have actual(Lagna) > and > > popular identity(aaruDha) same. > > > > I, in the flow of the thought process, find in crossing my limits > I > > apologise for that. > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > Dear Amolmandar, > > > If you look at how Arudha Lagna or other Padas are calculated, > why > > > Aarudha is to be interpreted as Mounted will be clear. The angle > > between > > > a planet and its house reflected on other side gets you the > Arudha > > Lagna > > > and Padas. So the logic behind this appears to be reflection by > the > > > planet on either side. This being the case, Aarudha has to be > taken > > as > > > connected with Aarohana (To mount).It (the meaning) could well > mean > > > outer layer as perceived. > > > It is said that meanings of words are to be taken based on custom > > in > > > relevant science where a possibility of two meanings for the > same > > word > > > arises. In legal documents also trade terms override dictionary > > meaning. > > > I am no Pandita of Sanskrita, but think that the corect meaning > > would be > > > mounted. Analysing the intent it would mean outer layer. If we > > start > > > taking literal meanings per dictionary, many words would mean > > something > > > other than what they mean in Jyotish. Here the mounting means the > > > perception others might have about certain bhava activity of the > > Jataka. > > > About your question about Vedvyasa and Gandhi, find out what were > > > opinions of true form of Vedavyasa of the public when he was > young > > and > > > what was known to Gods, similarly find out what was the opinion > of > > > Gandhi's son about him and contrast it with the perception of > > public > > > like Us. The answer would be crystal clear. > > > This is precisely why Lagna and 7th house padas fall in 10th and > > 4th > > > house. The Sages knew that human beings do not reveal everything > > about > > > either themselves or their marital life. So others form opinion > > about > > > the Jataka from results of his Karma(10th) and about his marital > > bliss > > > from Sukha(4th House). You will also observe that Pada of 4th > falls > > in > > > 4th house itself, for similar reasons. > > > If you go deeper in to Arudha scheme of things, then you will > find > > that > > > certain yogas are said to be read from 7th arudha and the rishis > > further > > > enjoin one to read similar results from 2nd Arudha. The reason is > > that > > > 7th house persception is formed from Dhana and Kutumba of a > person > > by > > > outsiders. > > > Of course these are my views and others might have different > views. > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > amolmandar wrote: > > > > > > > Respected Chandrashekharji > > > > > > > > I understand that but when we say meaning literally we should > take > > > > correct approch to it. The word Maya and Satya have been used > to > > AL > > > > and L many times. Maya is popular and difficult to overcome and > > hence > > > > traditional. With this string it suits the meaning of the word > > > > aaruDha. Moreover if we take aaruDha as mounted then question > > arises > > > > what gets mounted who mounts it where and why?. One can > > not 'mount' > > > > oneself different for the public. It is the public that forms > the > > > > opinion or mounts you. So we dont have any control over this > > mounting > > > > phenomenon. That is why I said it is popular identity which is > > always > > > > created by the public. It may be correct i.e. as you are(1st > > house or > > > > Lagna) or it may be something different(any other house) or even > > > > exactly opposite(7th house). Had it not been so how do we > > see,great > > > > men like Maharishi Valmiki and Vedvyasa? Or modern day Mahatma > > > > Gandhi? Does taht mean what ever we know about them is all > aaruDha > > > > and their real identity is different? But BPHS says that 1st > and > > 7th > > > > house can not be AL house? Why? Parashara can not be wrong. I > > must be > > > > wrong but where I am not getting. Either my premise is wrong and > > > > hence the inference. But at least to me and my little Sanskrit > > > > knowledge, my premise about aaruDha seems to be correct. In > that > > case > > > > my inference should also be correct. > > > > > > > > I am sure you will solve this and clear my doubts > astrologically > > and > > > > its social aspects as well. > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > Dear Amolmandar, > > > > > I agree with Parthaji. Look up what happens when Arudhapada > > falls > > > > in > > > > > 1st,4th and 7th. Again Aarudha could also mean mounted, which > > could > > > > in a > > > > > way show perception, is it not? > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Om namah Shivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Amol > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna and Arudha Lagna are never the same. This is a truth. > > There > > > > is > > > > > > no fortune involved in making them the same. they can never > > be the > > > > > > same, however hard one may try, > > > > > > regards > > > > > > partha > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "amolmandar" > > > > > > <amolmandar> wrote: > > > > > > > Dear Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you allow me to join this discussion..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think we should read it as AruDha or aaruDha. Literally > > ruDha > > > > > > means > > > > > > > popular or traditional and 'aa' prefix makes it more > > popular or > > > > > > more > > > > > > > traditional. The prefix 'a' to ruDha will make it > opposite. > > > > aruDha > > > > > > > will be that is not popular.So aaruDha means morepopular > or > > we > > > > can > > > > > > > say Maha-popular. That way aaruDha will make what is > > popularly > > > > > > known > > > > > > > about you. It need not be other than Satya. If you are > > fortunate > > > > > > > enough your Lagna(true identity) and Arudha Lagna (Popular > > > > identity) > > > > > > > will be same. All great persons should belong to that > > class. > > > > Both > > > > > > > identies are govern by satya i.e.you(Lagna) and hence > > Lagna is > > > > > > more > > > > > > > important. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > After all we say satyam eva jayate! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Shailesh Chadha" > > > > > > <scc@s...> > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha, > > > > > > > > May I join in this discussion? > > > > > > > > If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis-à- vis > > our > > > > > > > > understanding of a jataka, the confusion about Arudha > > Padas > > > > will > > > > > > > > dissolve to a great extent. > > > > > > > > "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - that > > which > > > > > > > relates to > > > > > > > > "Atma" and "Parmatma" . > > > > > > > > This material world is in fact "maya" - an illusion, > but > > we > > > > treat > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules > > of "satya" to > > > > it. > > > > > > > > Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this world > > > > of "maya" > > > > > > and, > > > > > > > > hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are more > > relevant > > > > to > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > material existence. > > > > > > > > Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana- arudha, > > Gaja- > > > > > > arudha, > > > > > > > > etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level". > > > > > > > > So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made by > the > > > > > > > individual > > > > > > > > (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards > achieving > > the > > > > > > highest > > > > > > > > ability/ perfection. > > > > > > > > Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood > > > > as "manifestation" or > > > > > > > > "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I think > we > > will > > > > be > > > > > > > able to > > > > > > > > better appreciate this concept of "arudha". > > > > > > > > Of course, this is only as per my understanding - > > hopefully, > > > > > > Gurus > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > seniors will correct, or confirm, it. > > > > > > > > Regards & best wishes, > > > > > > > > Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5] > > > > > > > > Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PM > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear > > > > chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Namah SHivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have a habit of saving all important messages by the > > various > > > > > > > gurus > > > > > > > > and learned members. I have around 50 MB material just > by > > this > > > > > > work > > > > > > > > (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the old > > message > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > your perusal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > """"""- > > > > > > > > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Imran, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The concept of Arudha of different houses beautifully > > > > eloborates > > > > > > > > the difference between reality(Satya) and perception > > (Maya). > > > > Sage > > > > > > > > Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat and > > > > tackle > > > > > > > these > > > > > > > > Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold > > specific > > > > > > > > posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas > > collectively, > > > > > > thus > > > > > > > > require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa and > > > > > > vorgottama > > > > > > > > of Arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. For > > > > example in > > > > > > > > case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in Scorpio > > (9th > > > > from > > > > > > > > lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) > is > > to be > > > > > > > > assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and 10th > > > > lords, > > > > > > > > Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with > > respect of > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > > position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in > chart > > of > > > > Dalai > > > > > > > > Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th > from > > > > lagna. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association > > (sambndha) > > > > with > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > help of rashi aspect? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead of > > > > lagan? or > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields > > > > > > satisfactory > > > > > > > > results at a certain level. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imran > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You are on the right track and Visti has nicely > addressed > > the > > > > > > > points > > > > > > > > in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the > > > > > > > activity/things > > > > > > > > shown by the houses. My communication skills are not > > > > a "tangible > > > > > > > > thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises > out > > of my > > > > > > > > communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house shows > my > > > > > > > > communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this mail > > > > > > (tangible). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), > they > > are > > > > the > > > > > > > > only tangible things - the only reality - in this > material > > > > world! > > > > > > > > They are very important. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) > > together in > > > > D- > > > > > > 10, > > > > > > > > be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing > them > > > > will > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > great. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. > > However, > > > > note > > > > > > > > that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are > different > > > > from > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > rules of the world of maya (illusion). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's > > > > interactions. > > > > > > It > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed house > of > > kama > > > > > > > > trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) and > > the > > > > > > > > intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc > (shaping > > of > > > > > > desire > > > > > > > > and working on the desire) and the culmination house > > (11th) > > > > shows > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th > house > > shows > > > > > > > > dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. > While > > the > > > > > > seed > > > > > > > > house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the > > > > intermediate > > > > > > > > house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), the > > > > > > culmination > > > > > > > > house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall duty). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the world > of > > > > maya, > > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > the meanings are different. In the world of truth, > > shaping of > > > > > > > desire > > > > > > > > and working on the desires happens through interactions > > and > > > > > > finally > > > > > > > > leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. > But > > the > > > > > > world > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the > > world of > > > > > > > maya, > > > > > > > > shaping of desire and working on the desire happens > only > > thru > > > > > > > > domination and the results are only material gains. So > > the 7th > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and > > > > domination. > > > > > > > The > > > > > > > > 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include > > > > > > religiousness, > > > > > > > > righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma > > (duty) - > > > > > > > protect > > > > > > > > itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about > > > > protecting > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > status and image. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which > > > > trikona it > > > > > > > > belongs to and whether it is the seed house, > intermediate > > > > house > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > the culmination house of that trikona) is constant for > all > > > > > > > > references. But building the meaning further based on > the > > > > axioms > > > > > > > > requires an understanding of the two worlds - world of > > satya > > > > and > > > > > > > > world of maya. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish > Workshop" > > and > > > > the > > > > > > CD > > > > > > > > will be available for buying online in a day or two at > > most. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa > > > > > > > > interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana > dasa > > > > that is > > > > > > > > computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the > > > > changing > > > > > > > > impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the > resulting > > > > luck) > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana > > Dasa" by > > > > Pt. > > > > > > > > Sanjay Rath. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa > > interpretation, > > > > but > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition to > > > > transits > > > > > > > > from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits from > > natal > > > > > > arudha > > > > > > > > lagna! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, again, different rules may apply in the case of > > > > arudha > > > > > > > > lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma > from > > > > Moon or > > > > > > > > lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter loves > > dharma. > > > > > > > > However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha > > lagna, the > > > > > > wise > > > > > > > > teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the rules > > of the > > > > > > > world > > > > > > > > of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a > shallow > > > > dharma > > > > > > > > (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So > > there > > > > will > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > material setbacks and the illusion is broken. However, > if > > > > Jupiter > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal > chart > > > > also, > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > negative results may be mitigated. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally > > > > different > > > > > > > > worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one > > > > understands > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha > > lagna. > > > > Try > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > give it some thought. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck > with > > > > your > > > > > > > > arudha pada studies! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > May Jupiter's light shine on us, > > > > > > > > Narasimha""""""" > > > > > > > > > """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic- astrology, "Chandrashekhar > > > > Sharma" > > > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Dear Partha, > > > > > > > > > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I > > > > indicated > > > > > > > (About > > > > > > > > pada > > > > > > > > > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji > says > > > > > > verbatim " > > > > > > > > > Use of arudha lagna > > > > > > > > > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha > > lagna is > > > > > > maya > > > > > > > > peetha or > > > > > > > > > the seat of > > > > > > > > > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for > > different > > > > > > shades > > > > > > > > of self. > > > > > > > > > Lagna stands for > > > > > > > > > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived self. > > Arudha > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > > stands > > > > > > > > > for "self, as > > > > > > > > > peceived by this maya world". > > > > > > > > > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to > > comment. > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the > spouse - > > > > dear Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this > world > > of > > > > Maya. > > > > > > > > This > > > > > > > > > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages. > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic- > astrology, "Chandrashekhar > > > > Sharma" > > > > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Hari, > > > > > > > > > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are > > perception of > > > > what > > > > > > > > > people think > > > > > > > > > > about one, this is the only logical inference. > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the > > spouse - > > > > dear > > > > > > Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with > the > > > > > > > > consummation > > > > > > > > > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it correct? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic- > astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > > Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the > > Terms > > > > of > > > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic- astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > Krishnaarpanamastu > > || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu > || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > > > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system > > (http://www.grisoft.com). > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: > > > > 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system > > (http://www.grisoft.com). > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: > > > > 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > <http://rd./M=249982.3512844.4795476.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 > > > > > > 05082686:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o72ctft/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi- > > > > bin/autoredir?camp=556&lineid=3512844∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > > > Service > > > > > > <>. > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > <http://rd./M=249982.3512844.4795476.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 > > 05082686:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o72ctft/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi- > > bin/autoredir?camp=556&lineid=3512844∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > Service > > > > <>. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 7, 2003 Report Share Posted July 7, 2003 Dear Amolmandar, I think the confusion is on account of the fact that you have not read shlokas about Arudha Lagna. Read below text and tell me whether it means Traditional(Rudha) Lagna. l¶aêFe inzanawe l¶raizdza Vywam!, lagnärüòhe niçaanäthe lagnaräçidaçä vyathäm | jnnI ¬ezmaßaeit ipÇusaEoy< n iv*te. janané kleçamäpnoti pitrusaukhayaà na vidyate || Again you must have seen words like "Ashwaarudha"(One who is mounted on a horse), which mean what I had conveyed. For usage of dictionary words to denote something else in Jyotish, look at what is dictionary meaning of Rasi,Kshetra,Gruha, Ruksha,Bha, Bhavan and then find out what is meant by them in Jyotish. Varaha mihira , after explaining that he is writing Brihatjatakam as pupils get confused by the ancient texts says in the 4th shloka "Raashayo Raashi Kshetragruharkshabhaani Bhavanam ChaikaarthasampratyayaaH". He understood that pupils might try to take dictionary meaning of words, for meanings accepted by tradition in Jyotish. Therefore he specifically tells that all the foregoing mean one and the same thing. Some even think that Rasi is not Varga, forgetting what vargas are said to consist of shadvarga,saptajavarga etc. About the logic that many people perceive one as mahatma and therefore he must be Mahatma, I differ. There have been scores of Cults where the followers and sometimes the world too thought the Cult Gurus(?) as Saints. Had they not been expose , may be they would even today be called as Greats. This dioes not make one Great from an Astrological view point. If I need to give you a classic Indian Example, look at how people Bihar perceive Lalooprasad Yadava and compare it with your opinion of him. I think this will help clarify your confusion. Historical figures are seen through history that is written, but remember that History is written by those who have one and got the control of Government. You might like to look at what Aurangajeb's historian wrote about Shivaji and compare it with what people ruled by Shivaji thought about him. Lagna and Arudha can never be the same as truth and even one's perception of oneself differ. If we assume that the Great ones are always truthful and correct, then think what the Mahatma thought he was giving the people of India and what they got, in terms of political morality. Chandrashekhar. amolmandar wrote: Respected Chandrashekharji Thanks for the detailed mail. I have some doubts remaining. Sir, why should we connect the word aarohana when not mentioned by the sages? Is it not correct to stick to the word used. The general perception of the word aaruDha might be different. It may be because of time that has gone between the scriptures written and present time. But when scriptures were written the word had only dictionary meanings. Moreover sir is it not the case of doing the reverse logic? First make the result and then find out the suitable reasons for that.( Sir please do not take it otherwise). Applying a word which has the meaning suitable to our logic would be doing injustice to the sages. It would be interesting to find out a word used in Jyotish with the meaning different than dictionary meaning. If there exits (I know since you have said it must be there) then is it required to put forward the correct meanings and reinterpret the shlokas correctly? Regarding the VedVyasa and Mahatma Gandhi I supposed I was not eble to express properly. What I wanted to focus was that popular identity of a person must be in tandem with the actual identity of the person. If a person is popularly known as Mahatma then actually he should be Mahatma. If it is not so then many problems on many fronts may crop up. Those who considered him as Mahatma and their intelligence would be questioned. The person who falsely becomes mahatma gets the credit of cheating people. Matahtma was Mahatma in the eyes of the people because he was Mahatma. The son and for that matter any other close relative (who became known as critic of Mahatma otherwise had no standings of his own) may have different opinion. That can not be considered as True or actual of Mahatma. There might be different individual opinions about any body including Mahatma.My point is that an un-deserving person may never get acknowledgements from the masses. There were so many leaders but only one Mahatma. Normal human being may not reveal about themselves but Mahatmas dont have anything to hide. In that case only Lagna and aaruDha can be same. That is why I said only fortunates will have actual(Lagna) and popular identity(aaruDha) same. I, in the flow of the thought process, find in crossing my limits I apologise for that. Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. AmolMandar vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma <boxdel> wrote: > Dear Amolmandar, > If you look at how Arudha Lagna or other Padas are calculated, why > Aarudha is to be interpreted as Mounted will be clear. The angle between > a planet and its house reflected on other side gets you the Arudha Lagna > and Padas. So the logic behind this appears to be reflection by the > planet on either side. This being the case, Aarudha has to be taken as > connected with Aarohana (To mount).It (the meaning) could well mean > outer layer as perceived. > It is said that meanings of words are to be taken based on custom in > relevant science where a possibility of two meanings for the same word > arises. In legal documents also trade terms override dictionary meaning. > I am no Pandita of Sanskrita, but think that the corect meaning would be > mounted. Analysing the intent it would mean outer layer. If we start > taking literal meanings per dictionary, many words would mean something > other than what they mean in Jyotish. Here the mounting means the > perception others might have about certain bhava activity of the Jataka. > About your question about Vedvyasa and Gandhi, find out what were > opinions of true form of Vedavyasa of the public when he was young and > what was known to Gods, similarly find out what was the opinion of > Gandhi's son about him and contrast it with the perception of public > like Us. The answer would be crystal clear. > This is precisely why Lagna and 7th house padas fall in 10th and 4th > house. The Sages knew that human beings do not reveal everything about > either themselves or their marital life. So others form opinion about > the Jataka from results of his Karma(10th) and about his marital bliss > from Sukha(4th House). You will also observe that Pada of 4th falls in > 4th house itself, for similar reasons. > If you go deeper in to Arudha scheme of things, then you will find that > certain yogas are said to be read from 7th arudha and the rishis further > enjoin one to read similar results from 2nd Arudha. The reason is that > 7th house persception is formed from Dhana and Kutumba of a person by > outsiders. > Of course these are my views and others might have different views. > Chandrashekhar. > > amolmandar wrote: > > > Respected Chandrashekharji > > > > I understand that but when we say meaning literally we should take > > correct approch to it. The word Maya and Satya have been used to AL > > and L many times. Maya is popular and difficult to overcome and hence > > traditional. With this string it suits the meaning of the word > > aaruDha. Moreover if we take aaruDha as mounted then question arises > > what gets mounted who mounts it where and why?. One can not 'mount' > > oneself different for the public. It is the public that forms the > > opinion or mounts you. So we dont have any control over this mounting > > phenomenon. That is why I said it is popular identity which is always > > created by the public. It may be correct i.e. as you are(1st house or > > Lagna) or it may be something different(any other house) or even > > exactly opposite(7th house). Had it not been so how do we see,great > > men like Maharishi Valmiki and Vedvyasa? Or modern day Mahatma > > Gandhi? Does taht mean what ever we know about them is all aaruDha > > and their real identity is different? But BPHS says that 1st and 7th > > house can not be AL house? Why? Parashara can not be wrong. I must be > > wrong but where I am not getting. Either my premise is wrong and > > hence the inference. But at least to me and my little Sanskrit > > knowledge, my premise about aaruDha seems to be correct. In that case > > my inference should also be correct. > > > > I am sure you will solve this and clear my doubts astrologically and > > its social aspects as well. > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > AmolMandar > > > > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > Dear Amolmandar, > > > I agree with Parthaji. Look up what happens when Arudhapada falls > > in > > > 1st,4th and 7th. Again Aarudha could also mean mounted, which could > > in a > > > way show perception, is it not? > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy wrote: > > > > > > > Om namah Shivaya > > > > > > > > Dear Amol > > > > > > > > Lagna and Arudha Lagna are never the same. This is a truth. There > > is > > > > no fortune involved in making them the same. they can never be the > > > > same, however hard one may try, > > > > regards > > > > partha > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "amolmandar" > > > > <amolmandar> wrote: > > > > > Dear Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > If you allow me to join this discussion..... > > > > > > > > > > I think we should read it as AruDha or aaruDha. Literally ruDha > > > > means > > > > > popular or traditional and 'aa' prefix makes it more popular or > > > > more > > > > > traditional. The prefix 'a' to ruDha will make it opposite. > > aruDha > > > > > will be that is not popular.So aaruDha means morepopular or we > > can > > > > > say Maha-popular. That way aaruDha will make what is popularly > > > > known > > > > > about you. It need not be other than Satya. If you are fortunate > > > > > enough your Lagna(true identity) and Arudha Lagna(Popular > > identity) > > > > > will be same. All great persons should belong to that class. > > Both > > > > > identies are govern by satya i.e.you(Lagna) and hence Lagna is > > > > more > > > > > important. > > > > > > > > > > After all we say satyam eva jayate! > > > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Shailesh Chadha" > > > > <scc@s...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha, > > > > > > May I join in this discussion? > > > > > > If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis-à-vis our > > > > > > understanding of a jataka, the confusion about Arudha Padas > > will > > > > > > dissolve to a great extent. > > > > > > "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - that which > > > > > relates to > > > > > > "Atma" and "Parmatma" . > > > > > > This material world is in fact "maya" - an illusion, but we > > treat > > > > > this > > > > > > world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules of "satya" to > > it. > > > > > > Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this world > > of "maya" > > > > and, > > > > > > hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are more relevant > > to > > > > > this > > > > > > material existence. > > > > > > Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana-arudha, Gaja- > > > > arudha, > > > > > > etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level". > > > > > > So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made by the > > > > > individual > > > > > > (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards achieving the > > > > highest > > > > > > ability/ perfection. > > > > > > Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood > > as "manifestation" or > > > > > > "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I think we will > > be > > > > > able to > > > > > > better appreciate this concept of "arudha". > > > > > > Of course, this is only as per my understanding - hopefully, > > > > Gurus > > > > > and > > > > > > seniors will correct, or confirm, it. > > > > > > Regards & best wishes, > > > > > > Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5] > > > > > > Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PM > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear > > chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Namah SHivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > > > > > I have a habit of saving all important messages by the various > > > > > gurus > > > > > > and learned members. I have around 50 MB material just by this > > > > work > > > > > > (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the old message > > > > for > > > > > > your perusal > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > partha > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > """"""- > > > > > > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Imran, > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The concept of Arudha of different houses beautifully > > eloborates > > > > > > the difference between reality(Satya) and perception (Maya). > > Sage > > > > > > Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat and > > tackle > > > > > these > > > > > > Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold specific > > > > > > posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas collectively, > > > > thus > > > > > > require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa and > > > > vorgottama > > > > > > of Arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. For > > example in > > > > > > case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in Scorpio (9th > > from > > > > > > lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) is to be > > > > > > assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and 10th > > lords, > > > > > > Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with respect of > > > > lagna > > > > > > position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in chart of > > Dalai > > > > > > Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th from > > lagna. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association (sambndha) > > with > > > > > the > > > > > > help of rashi aspect? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead of > > lagan? or > > > > > its > > > > > > not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields > > > > satisfactory > > > > > > results at a certain level. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imran > > > > > > > > > > > > You are on the right track and Visti has nicely addressed the > > > > > points > > > > > > in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points. > > > > > > > > > > > > (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the > > > > > activity/things > > > > > > shown by the houses. My communication skills are not > > a "tangible > > > > > > thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises out of my > > > > > > communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house shows my > > > > > > communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this mail > > > > (tangible). > > > > > > > > > > > > Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), they are > > the > > > > > > only tangible things - the only reality - in this material > > world! > > > > > > They are very important. > > > > > > > > > > > > (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) together in > > D- > > > > 10, > > > > > > be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing them > > will > > > > be > > > > > > great. > > > > > > > > > > > > (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. However, > > note > > > > > > that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are different > > from > > > > the > > > > > > rules of the world of maya (illusion). > > > > > > > > > > > > For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's > > interactions. > > > > It > > > > > is > > > > > > the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed house of kama > > > > > > trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) and the > > > > > > intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc (shaping of > > > > desire > > > > > > and working on the desire) and the culmination house (11th) > > shows > > > > > the > > > > > > final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th house shows > > > > > > dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. While the > > > > seed > > > > > > house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the > > intermediate > > > > > > house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), the > > > > culmination > > > > > > house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall duty). > > > > > > > > > > > > The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the world of > > maya, > > > > > but > > > > > > the meanings are different. In the world of truth, shaping of > > > > > desire > > > > > > and working on the desires happens through interactions and > > > > finally > > > > > > leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. But the > > > > world > > > > > of > > > > > > maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the world of > > > > > maya, > > > > > > shaping of desire and working on the desire happens only thru > > > > > > domination and the results are only material gains. So the 7th > > > > from > > > > > > arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and > > domination. > > > > > The > > > > > > 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include > > > > religiousness, > > > > > > righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma (duty) - > > > > > protect > > > > > > itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about > > protecting > > > > > the > > > > > > status and image. > > > > > > > > > > > > The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which > > trikona it > > > > > > belongs to and whether it is the seed house, intermediate > > house > > > > or > > > > > > the culmination house of that trikona) is constant for all > > > > > > references. But building the meaning further based on the > > axioms > > > > > > requires an understanding of the two worlds - world of satya > > and > > > > > > world of maya. > > > > > > > > > > > > I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish Workshop" and > > the > > > > CD > > > > > > will be available for buying online in a day or two at most. > > > > > > > > > > > > (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa > > > > > > interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana dasa > > that is > > > > > > computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the > > changing > > > > > > impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the resulting > > luck) > > > > on > > > > > > one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana Dasa" by > > Pt. > > > > > > Sanjay Rath. > > > > > > > > > > > > (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa interpretation, > > but > > > > > you > > > > > > can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition to > > transits > > > > > > from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits from natal > > > > arudha > > > > > > lagna! > > > > > > > > > > > > However, again, different rules may apply in the case of > > arudha > > > > > > lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma from > > Moon or > > > > > > lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter loves dharma. > > > > > > However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha lagna, the > > > > wise > > > > > > teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the rules of the > > > > > world > > > > > > of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a shallow > > dharma > > > > > > (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So there > > will > > > > be > > > > > > material setbacks and the illusion is broken. However, if > > Jupiter > > > > > has > > > > > > a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal chart > > also, > > > > > the > > > > > > negative results may be mitigated. > > > > > > > > > > > > Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally > > different > > > > > > worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one > > understands > > > > > and > > > > > > appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha lagna. > > Try > > > > to > > > > > > give it some thought. > > > > > > > > > > > > Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck with > > your > > > > > > arudha pada studies! > > > > > > > > > > > > May Jupiter's light shine on us, > > > > > > Narasimha""""""" > > > > > > """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar > > Sharma" > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > Dear Partha, > > > > > > > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I > > indicated > > > > > (About > > > > > > pada > > > > > > > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji says > > > > verbatim " > > > > > > > Use of arudha lagna > > > > > > > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha lagna is > > > > maya > > > > > > peetha or > > > > > > > the seat of > > > > > > > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for different > > > > shades > > > > > > of self. > > > > > > > Lagna stands for > > > > > > > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived self. Arudha > > > > lagna > > > > > > stands > > > > > > > for "self, as > > > > > > > peceived by this maya world". > > > > > > > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to comment. > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse - > > dear Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this world of > > Maya. > > > > > > This > > > > > > > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages. > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar > > Sharma" > > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Hari, > > > > > > > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are perception of > > what > > > > > > > people think > > > > > > > > about one, this is the only logical inference. > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > > > > > > > To: vedic astrology > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse - > > dear > > > > Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with the > > > > > > consummation > > > > > > > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it correct? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ........ May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the Terms > > of > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ........ May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ........ > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: > > 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: > > 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > <http://rd./M=249982.3512844.4795476.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 > > 05082686:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o72ctft/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi- > > bin/autoredir?camp=556&lineid=3512844∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > ....... 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Guest guest Posted July 7, 2003 Report Share Posted July 7, 2003 Om Namah Shivaya Dear Amol What is ur lagna, is it a fixed sign. regards partha om tat sat vedic astrology, "amolmandar" <amolmandar> wrote: > Dear Partha > > Sorry for the confusion caused. I am basically trying to understand > the concept behind what sages have written about aaruDha. In the > process we must understand the semantics of the words used by the > sages. Yes I know sages have mentioned that Lagna and aaruDha can not > be same. They have also mentioned many other things and as we try to > understand logic behind these other things, I am trying to find out > correct reason for aaruDha as well. If any other topic by the sages > can be critically analyzed then I think there is nothing abnormal in > analysing this topic(aaruDha) as well. We dont always take sages > verbatim. Moreover at no point we want to go against what is written > by the sages. This is for sure. We want to elevate our knowledge to > understand them in correct way. > > See when we say Lagna as Satya and aaruDha as reflection of LAgna > then we have to term it as asatya in the sense that it is what is > others see about you(popular identity). This perception of others > about you might be wrong. Most of the time you yourself are > responsible that to happen. As Chandrashekharji pointed out rightly > that human beings have tendency to hide. That way aaruDha may not > reflect correct image of you. That might be the reason why it is said > that Lagna (true identity known to you only) and aaruDha(popular > identity known to masses) can not be same. But all this hold true for > normal human beings. What about MAhatmas? > > Now if we consider that it is only the manefistation of self + > intelligence in the society then still the problem remains as to what > is self without intelligence? Moreover,as this involves society, the > third element is as well introduced. The society may read your > intelligence correctly. It may not. So uncertanity comes in. Hence > asatya. In the case of nomal mortals it is 100% true but what about > Mahatmas? They must have self and intelligence known to society and > to themselves as same. > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > AmolMandar > > > vedic astrology, "V.Partha sarathy" > <partvinu5> wrote: > > Om Namah SHivaya > > > > Dear Amol > > > > You are confusing the concepts. It is very clear that Lagna and > > Arudha lagna can never be the same. This is from the dicta of the > > sages and we should not try to use words that condradict the same. > As > > i said earlier, Arudha Lagna is not asatya, it is only a > > manfiestation of the self+intelligence in the society. Lagna+Paka > > lagna = arudha lagna. > > Manifestation is not a false identity , it is an identity in itself > > andd we should not use the words such as false, and illusion etc > for > > these identities. > > regards > > partha > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "amolmandar" > > <amolmandar> wrote: > > > Respected Chandrashekharji > > > > > > Thanks for the detailed mail. I have some doubts remaining. Sir, > > why > > > should we connect the word aarohana when not mentioned by the > > sages? > > > Is it not correct to stick to the word used. The general > perception > > > of the word aaruDha might be different. It may be because of time > > > that has gone between the scriptures written and present time. > > > But when scriptures were written the word had only dictionary > > > meanings. > > > > > > Moreover sir is it not the case of doing the reverse logic? > First > > > make the result and then find out the suitable reasons for that. ( > > Sir > > > please do not take it otherwise). Applying a word which has the > > > meaning suitable to our logic would be doing injustice to the > > sages. > > > > > > It would be interesting to find out a word used in Jyotish with > the > > > meaning different than dictionary meaning. If there exits (I know > > > since you have said it must be there) then is it required to put > > > forward the correct meanings and reinterpret the shlokas > correctly? > > > > > > Regarding the VedVyasa and Mahatma Gandhi I supposed I was not > eble > > > to express properly. What I wanted to focus was that popular > > identity > > > of a person must be in tandem with the actual identity of the > > person. > > > If a person is popularly known as Mahatma then actually he should > > be > > > Mahatma. If it is not so then many problems on many fronts may > crop > > > up. Those who considered him as Mahatma and their intelligence > > would > > > be questioned. The person who falsely becomes mahatma gets the > > credit > > > of cheating people. Matahtma was Mahatma in the eyes of the > people > > > because he was Mahatma. The son and for that matter any other > close > > > relative (who became known as critic of Mahatma otherwise had no > > > standings of his own) may have different opinion. That can not be > > > considered as True or actual of Mahatma. There might be different > > > individual opinions about any body including Mahatma.My point is > > that > > > an un-deserving person may never get acknowledgements from the > > > masses. There were so many leaders but only one Mahatma. > > > > > > Normal human being may not reveal about themselves but Mahatmas > > dont > > > have anything to hide. In that case only Lagna and aaruDha can be > > > same. That is why I said only fortunates will have actual (Lagna) > > and > > > popular identity(aaruDha) same. > > > > > > I, in the flow of the thought process, find in crossing my > limits > > I > > > apologise for that. > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > Dear Amolmandar, > > > > If you look at how Arudha Lagna or other Padas are calculated, > > why > > > > Aarudha is to be interpreted as Mounted will be clear. The > angle > > > between > > > > a planet and its house reflected on other side gets you the > > Arudha > > > Lagna > > > > and Padas. So the logic behind this appears to be reflection by > > the > > > > planet on either side. This being the case, Aarudha has to be > > taken > > > as > > > > connected with Aarohana (To mount).It (the meaning) could well > > mean > > > > outer layer as perceived. > > > > It is said that meanings of words are to be taken based on > custom > > > in > > > > relevant science where a possibility of two meanings for the > > same > > > word > > > > arises. In legal documents also trade terms override dictionary > > > meaning. > > > > I am no Pandita of Sanskrita, but think that the corect meaning > > > would be > > > > mounted. Analysing the intent it would mean outer layer. If we > > > start > > > > taking literal meanings per dictionary, many words would mean > > > something > > > > other than what they mean in Jyotish. Here the mounting means > the > > > > perception others might have about certain bhava activity of > the > > > Jataka. > > > > About your question about Vedvyasa and Gandhi, find out what > were > > > > opinions of true form of Vedavyasa of the public when he was > > young > > > and > > > > what was known to Gods, similarly find out what was the opinion > > of > > > > Gandhi's son about him and contrast it with the perception of > > > public > > > > like Us. The answer would be crystal clear. > > > > This is precisely why Lagna and 7th house padas fall in 10th > and > > > 4th > > > > house. The Sages knew that human beings do not reveal > everything > > > about > > > > either themselves or their marital life. So others form opinion > > > about > > > > the Jataka from results of his Karma(10th) and about his > marital > > > bliss > > > > from Sukha(4th House). You will also observe that Pada of 4th > > falls > > > in > > > > 4th house itself, for similar reasons. > > > > If you go deeper in to Arudha scheme of things, then you will > > find > > > that > > > > certain yogas are said to be read from 7th arudha and the > rishis > > > further > > > > enjoin one to read similar results from 2nd Arudha. The reason > is > > > that > > > > 7th house persception is formed from Dhana and Kutumba of a > > person > > > by > > > > outsiders. > > > > Of course these are my views and others might have different > > views. > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > amolmandar wrote: > > > > > > > > > Respected Chandrashekharji > > > > > > > > > > I understand that but when we say meaning literally we should > > take > > > > > correct approch to it. The word Maya and Satya have been used > > to > > > AL > > > > > and L many times. Maya is popular and difficult to overcome > and > > > hence > > > > > traditional. With this string it suits the meaning of the word > > > > > aaruDha. Moreover if we take aaruDha as mounted then question > > > arises > > > > > what gets mounted who mounts it where and why?. One can > > > not 'mount' > > > > > oneself different for the public. It is the public that forms > > the > > > > > opinion or mounts you. So we dont have any control over this > > > mounting > > > > > phenomenon. That is why I said it is popular identity which > is > > > always > > > > > created by the public. It may be correct i.e. as you are (1st > > > house or > > > > > Lagna) or it may be something different(any other house) or > even > > > > > exactly opposite(7th house). Had it not been so how do we > > > see,great > > > > > men like Maharishi Valmiki and Vedvyasa? Or modern day Mahatma > > > > > Gandhi? Does taht mean what ever we know about them is all > > aaruDha > > > > > and their real identity is different? But BPHS says that 1st > > and > > > 7th > > > > > house can not be AL house? Why? Parashara can not be wrong. I > > > must be > > > > > wrong but where I am not getting. Either my premise is wrong > and > > > > > hence the inference. But at least to me and my little Sanskrit > > > > > knowledge, my premise about aaruDha seems to be correct. In > > that > > > case > > > > > my inference should also be correct. > > > > > > > > > > I am sure you will solve this and clear my doubts > > astrologically > > > and > > > > > its social aspects as well. > > > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Amolmandar, > > > > > > I agree with Parthaji. Look up what happens when Arudhapada > > > falls > > > > > in > > > > > > 1st,4th and 7th. Again Aarudha could also mean mounted, > which > > > could > > > > > in a > > > > > > way show perception, is it not? > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om namah Shivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Amol > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna and Arudha Lagna are never the same. This is a > truth. > > > There > > > > > is > > > > > > > no fortune involved in making them the same. they can > never > > > be the > > > > > > > same, however hard one may try, > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "amolmandar" > > > > > > > <amolmandar> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you allow me to join this discussion..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think we should read it as AruDha or aaruDha. > Literally > > > ruDha > > > > > > > means > > > > > > > > popular or traditional and 'aa' prefix makes it more > > > popular or > > > > > > > more > > > > > > > > traditional. The prefix 'a' to ruDha will make it > > opposite. > > > > > aruDha > > > > > > > > will be that is not popular.So aaruDha means > morepopular > > or > > > we > > > > > can > > > > > > > > say Maha-popular. That way aaruDha will make what is > > > popularly > > > > > > > known > > > > > > > > about you. It need not be other than Satya. If you are > > > fortunate > > > > > > > > enough your Lagna(true identity) and Arudha Lagna > (Popular > > > > > identity) > > > > > > > > will be same. All great persons should belong to that > > > class. > > > > > Both > > > > > > > > identies are govern by satya i.e.you(Lagna) and hence > > > Lagna is > > > > > > > more > > > > > > > > important. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > After all we say satyam eva jayate! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Shailesh > Chadha" > > > > > > > <scc@s...> > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha, > > > > > > > > > May I join in this discussion? > > > > > > > > > If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis-à- > vis > > > our > > > > > > > > > understanding of a jataka, the confusion about Arudha > > > Padas > > > > > will > > > > > > > > > dissolve to a great extent. > > > > > > > > > "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - > that > > > which > > > > > > > > relates to > > > > > > > > > "Atma" and "Parmatma" . > > > > > > > > > This material world is in fact "maya" - an illusion, > > but > > > we > > > > > treat > > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules > > > of "satya" to > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this world > > > > > of "maya" > > > > > > > and, > > > > > > > > > hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are more > > > relevant > > > > > to > > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > material existence. > > > > > > > > > Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana- > arudha, > > > Gaja- > > > > > > > arudha, > > > > > > > > > etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level". > > > > > > > > > So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made > by > > the > > > > > > > > individual > > > > > > > > > (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards > > achieving > > > the > > > > > > > highest > > > > > > > > > ability/ perfection. > > > > > > > > > Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood > > > > > as "manifestation" or > > > > > > > > > "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I think > > we > > > will > > > > > be > > > > > > > > able to > > > > > > > > > better appreciate this concept of "arudha". > > > > > > > > > Of course, this is only as per my understanding - > > > hopefully, > > > > > > > Gurus > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > seniors will correct, or confirm, it. > > > > > > > > > Regards & best wishes, > > > > > > > > > Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5] > > > > > > > > > Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PM > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear > > > > > chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Namah SHivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have a habit of saving all important messages by > the > > > various > > > > > > > > gurus > > > > > > > > > and learned members. I have around 50 MB material > just > > by > > > this > > > > > > > work > > > > > > > > > (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the > old > > > message > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > your perusal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > """"""- > > > > > > > > > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM > > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Imran, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The concept of Arudha of different houses > beautifully > > > > > eloborates > > > > > > > > > the difference between reality(Satya) and perception > > > (Maya). > > > > > Sage > > > > > > > > > Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat > and > > > > > tackle > > > > > > > > these > > > > > > > > > Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold > > > specific > > > > > > > > > posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas > > > collectively, > > > > > > > thus > > > > > > > > > require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa > and > > > > > > > vorgottama > > > > > > > > > of Arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. > For > > > > > example in > > > > > > > > > case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in > Scorpio > > > (9th > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) > > is > > > to be > > > > > > > > > assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and > 10th > > > > > lords, > > > > > > > > > Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with > > > respect of > > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > > > position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in > > chart > > > of > > > > > Dalai > > > > > > > > > Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th > > from > > > > > lagna. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association > > > (sambndha) > > > > > with > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > help of rashi aspect? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead > of > > > > > lagan? or > > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields > > > > > > > satisfactory > > > > > > > > > results at a certain level. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imran > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You are on the right track and Visti has nicely > > addressed > > > the > > > > > > > > points > > > > > > > > > in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the > > > > > > > > activity/things > > > > > > > > > shown by the houses. My communication skills are not > > > > > a "tangible > > > > > > > > > thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises > > out > > > of my > > > > > > > > > communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house > shows > > my > > > > > > > > > communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this > mail > > > > > > > (tangible). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), > > they > > > are > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > only tangible things - the only reality - in this > > material > > > > > world! > > > > > > > > > They are very important. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) > > > together in > > > > > D- > > > > > > > 10, > > > > > > > > > be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing > > them > > > > > will > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > great. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. > > > However, > > > > > note > > > > > > > > > that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are > > different > > > > > from > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > rules of the world of maya (illusion). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's > > > > > interactions. > > > > > > > It > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed > house > > of > > > kama > > > > > > > > > trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) > and > > > the > > > > > > > > > intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc > > (shaping > > > of > > > > > > > desire > > > > > > > > > and working on the desire) and the culmination house > > > (11th) > > > > > shows > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th > > house > > > shows > > > > > > > > > dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. > > While > > > the > > > > > > > seed > > > > > > > > > house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the > > > > > intermediate > > > > > > > > > house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), > the > > > > > > > culmination > > > > > > > > > house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall > duty). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the > world > > of > > > > > maya, > > > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > > the meanings are different. In the world of truth, > > > shaping of > > > > > > > > desire > > > > > > > > > and working on the desires happens through > interactions > > > and > > > > > > > finally > > > > > > > > > leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. > > But > > > the > > > > > > > world > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the > > > world of > > > > > > > > maya, > > > > > > > > > shaping of desire and working on the desire happens > > only > > > thru > > > > > > > > > domination and the results are only material gains. > So > > > the 7th > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and > > > > > domination. > > > > > > > > The > > > > > > > > > 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include > > > > > > > religiousness, > > > > > > > > > righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma > > > (duty) - > > > > > > > > protect > > > > > > > > > itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about > > > > > protecting > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > status and image. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which > > > > > trikona it > > > > > > > > > belongs to and whether it is the seed house, > > intermediate > > > > > house > > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > the culmination house of that trikona) is constant > for > > all > > > > > > > > > references. But building the meaning further based on > > the > > > > > axioms > > > > > > > > > requires an understanding of the two worlds - world > of > > > satya > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > world of maya. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish > > Workshop" > > > and > > > > > the > > > > > > > CD > > > > > > > > > will be available for buying online in a day or two > at > > > most. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa > > > > > > > > > interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana > > dasa > > > > > that is > > > > > > > > > computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the > > > > > changing > > > > > > > > > impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the > > resulting > > > > > luck) > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana > > > Dasa" by > > > > > Pt. > > > > > > > > > Sanjay Rath. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa > > > interpretation, > > > > > but > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition > to > > > > > transits > > > > > > > > > from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits > from > > > natal > > > > > > > arudha > > > > > > > > > lagna! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, again, different rules may apply in the case > of > > > > > arudha > > > > > > > > > lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma > > from > > > > > Moon or > > > > > > > > > lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter > loves > > > dharma. > > > > > > > > > However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha > > > lagna, the > > > > > > > wise > > > > > > > > > teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the > rules > > > of the > > > > > > > > world > > > > > > > > > of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a > > shallow > > > > > dharma > > > > > > > > > (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So > > > there > > > > > will > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > material setbacks and the illusion is broken. > However, > > if > > > > > Jupiter > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal > > chart > > > > > also, > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > negative results may be mitigated. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally > > > > > different > > > > > > > > > worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one > > > > > understands > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha > > > lagna. > > > > > Try > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > give it some thought. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck > > with > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > arudha pada studies! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > May Jupiter's light shine on us, > > > > > > > > > Narasimha""""""" > > > > > > > > > > > """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic- > astrology, "Chandrashekhar > > > > > Sharma" > > > > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Partha, > > > > > > > > > > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I > > > > > indicated > > > > > > > > (About > > > > > > > > > pada > > > > > > > > > > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji > > says > > > > > > > verbatim " > > > > > > > > > > Use of arudha lagna > > > > > > > > > > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha > > > lagna is > > > > > > > maya > > > > > > > > > peetha or > > > > > > > > > > the seat of > > > > > > > > > > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for > > > different > > > > > > > shades > > > > > > > > > of self. > > > > > > > > > > Lagna stands for > > > > > > > > > > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived > self. > > > Arudha > > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > > > stands > > > > > > > > > > for "self, as > > > > > > > > > > peceived by this maya world". > > > > > > > > > > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to > > > comment. > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the > > spouse - > > > > > dear Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this > > world > > > of > > > > > Maya. > > > > > > > > > This > > > > > > > > > > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages. > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic- > > astrology, "Chandrashekhar > > > > > Sharma" > > > > > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Hari, > > > > > > > > > > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are > > > perception of > > > > > what > > > > > > > > > > people think > > > > > > > > > > > about one, this is the only logical inference. > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the > > > spouse - > > > > > dear > > > > > > > Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with > > the > > > > > > > > > consummation > > > > > > > > > > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it > correct? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > > Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic- > > astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > > > Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the > > > > Terms > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic- > astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > > Krishnaarpanamastu > > > || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the > > > Terms of > > > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic- astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > Krishnaarpanamastu > > || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > > > > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system > > > (http://www.grisoft.com). > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: > > > > > 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system > > > (http://www.grisoft.com). > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: > > > > > 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <http://rd./M=249982.3512844.4795476.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 > > > > > > > > > 05082686:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o72ctft/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi- > > > > > bin/autoredir?camp=556&lineid=3512844∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms > of > > > > > Service > > > > > > > <>. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > <http://rd./M=249982.3512844.4795476.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 > > > > 05082686:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o72ctft/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi- > > > bin/autoredir?camp=556&lineid=3512844∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > > Service > > > > > <>. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 7, 2003 Report Share Posted July 7, 2003 Dear Partha Your aaruDha about me is wrong!!! Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. AmolMandar vedic astrology, "V.Partha sarathy" <partvinu5> wrote: > Om Namah Shivaya > Dear Amol > > What is ur lagna, is it a fixed sign. > regards > partha > om tat sat > > vedic astrology, "amolmandar" > <amolmandar> wrote: > > Dear Partha > > > > Sorry for the confusion caused. I am basically trying to understand > > the concept behind what sages have written about aaruDha. In the > > process we must understand the semantics of the words used by the > > sages. Yes I know sages have mentioned that Lagna and aaruDha can > not > > be same. They have also mentioned many other things and as we try > to > > understand logic behind these other things, I am trying to find out > > correct reason for aaruDha as well. If any other topic by the sages > > can be critically analyzed then I think there is nothing abnormal > in > > analysing this topic(aaruDha) as well. We dont always take sages > > verbatim. Moreover at no point we want to go against what is > written > > by the sages. This is for sure. We want to elevate our knowledge to > > understand them in correct way. > > > > See when we say Lagna as Satya and aaruDha as reflection of LAgna > > then we have to term it as asatya in the sense that it is what is > > others see about you(popular identity). This perception of others > > about you might be wrong. Most of the time you yourself are > > responsible that to happen. As Chandrashekharji pointed out rightly > > that human beings have tendency to hide. That way aaruDha may not > > reflect correct image of you. That might be the reason why it is > said > > that Lagna (true identity known to you only) and aaruDha(popular > > identity known to masses) can not be same. But all this hold true > for > > normal human beings. What about MAhatmas? > > > > Now if we consider that it is only the manefistation of self + > > intelligence in the society then still the problem remains as to > what > > is self without intelligence? Moreover,as this involves society, > the > > third element is as well introduced. The society may read your > > intelligence correctly. It may not. So uncertanity comes in. Hence > > asatya. In the case of nomal mortals it is 100% true but what about > > Mahatmas? They must have self and intelligence known to society and > > to themselves as same. > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > vedic astrology, "V.Partha sarathy" > > <partvinu5> wrote: > > > Om Namah SHivaya > > > > > > Dear Amol > > > > > > You are confusing the concepts. It is very clear that Lagna and > > > Arudha lagna can never be the same. This is from the dicta of the > > > sages and we should not try to use words that condradict the > same. > > As > > > i said earlier, Arudha Lagna is not asatya, it is only a > > > manfiestation of the self+intelligence in the society. Lagna+Paka > > > lagna = arudha lagna. > > > Manifestation is not a false identity , it is an identity in > itself > > > andd we should not use the words such as false, and illusion etc > > for > > > these identities. > > > regards > > > partha > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "amolmandar" > > > <amolmandar> wrote: > > > > Respected Chandrashekharji > > > > > > > > Thanks for the detailed mail. I have some doubts remaining. > Sir, > > > why > > > > should we connect the word aarohana when not mentioned by the > > > sages? > > > > Is it not correct to stick to the word used. The general > > perception > > > > of the word aaruDha might be different. It may be because of > time > > > > that has gone between the scriptures written and present time. > > > > But when scriptures were written the word had only dictionary > > > > meanings. > > > > > > > > Moreover sir is it not the case of doing the reverse logic? > > First > > > > make the result and then find out the suitable reasons for that. > ( > > > Sir > > > > please do not take it otherwise). Applying a word which has the > > > > meaning suitable to our logic would be doing injustice to the > > > sages. > > > > > > > > It would be interesting to find out a word used in Jyotish with > > the > > > > meaning different than dictionary meaning. If there exits (I > know > > > > since you have said it must be there) then is it required to > put > > > > forward the correct meanings and reinterpret the shlokas > > correctly? > > > > > > > > Regarding the VedVyasa and Mahatma Gandhi I supposed I was not > > eble > > > > to express properly. What I wanted to focus was that popular > > > identity > > > > of a person must be in tandem with the actual identity of the > > > person. > > > > If a person is popularly known as Mahatma then actually he > should > > > be > > > > Mahatma. If it is not so then many problems on many fronts may > > crop > > > > up. Those who considered him as Mahatma and their intelligence > > > would > > > > be questioned. The person who falsely becomes mahatma gets the > > > credit > > > > of cheating people. Matahtma was Mahatma in the eyes of the > > people > > > > because he was Mahatma. The son and for that matter any other > > close > > > > relative (who became known as critic of Mahatma otherwise had > no > > > > standings of his own) may have different opinion. That can not > be > > > > considered as True or actual of Mahatma. There might be > different > > > > individual opinions about any body including Mahatma.My point > is > > > that > > > > an un-deserving person may never get acknowledgements from the > > > > masses. There were so many leaders but only one Mahatma. > > > > > > > > Normal human being may not reveal about themselves but Mahatmas > > > dont > > > > have anything to hide. In that case only Lagna and aaruDha can > be > > > > same. That is why I said only fortunates will have actual > (Lagna) > > > and > > > > popular identity(aaruDha) same. > > > > > > > > I, in the flow of the thought process, find in crossing my > > limits > > > I > > > > apologise for that. > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > Dear Amolmandar, > > > > > If you look at how Arudha Lagna or other Padas are > calculated, > > > why > > > > > Aarudha is to be interpreted as Mounted will be clear. The > > angle > > > > between > > > > > a planet and its house reflected on other side gets you the > > > Arudha > > > > Lagna > > > > > and Padas. So the logic behind this appears to be reflection > by > > > the > > > > > planet on either side. This being the case, Aarudha has to be > > > taken > > > > as > > > > > connected with Aarohana (To mount).It (the meaning) could > well > > > mean > > > > > outer layer as perceived. > > > > > It is said that meanings of words are to be taken based on > > custom > > > > in > > > > > relevant science where a possibility of two meanings for the > > > same > > > > word > > > > > arises. In legal documents also trade terms override > dictionary > > > > meaning. > > > > > I am no Pandita of Sanskrita, but think that the corect > meaning > > > > would be > > > > > mounted. Analysing the intent it would mean outer layer. If > we > > > > start > > > > > taking literal meanings per dictionary, many words would mean > > > > something > > > > > other than what they mean in Jyotish. Here the mounting means > > the > > > > > perception others might have about certain bhava activity of > > the > > > > Jataka. > > > > > About your question about Vedvyasa and Gandhi, find out what > > were > > > > > opinions of true form of Vedavyasa of the public when he was > > > young > > > > and > > > > > what was known to Gods, similarly find out what was the > opinion > > > of > > > > > Gandhi's son about him and contrast it with the perception > of > > > > public > > > > > like Us. The answer would be crystal clear. > > > > > This is precisely why Lagna and 7th house padas fall in 10th > > and > > > > 4th > > > > > house. The Sages knew that human beings do not reveal > > everything > > > > about > > > > > either themselves or their marital life. So others form > opinion > > > > about > > > > > the Jataka from results of his Karma(10th) and about his > > marital > > > > bliss > > > > > from Sukha(4th House). You will also observe that Pada of 4th > > > falls > > > > in > > > > > 4th house itself, for similar reasons. > > > > > If you go deeper in to Arudha scheme of things, then you will > > > find > > > > that > > > > > certain yogas are said to be read from 7th arudha and the > > rishis > > > > further > > > > > enjoin one to read similar results from 2nd Arudha. The > reason > > is > > > > that > > > > > 7th house persception is formed from Dhana and Kutumba of a > > > person > > > > by > > > > > outsiders. > > > > > Of course these are my views and others might have different > > > views. > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > amolmandar wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Chandrashekharji > > > > > > > > > > > > I understand that but when we say meaning literally we > should > > > take > > > > > > correct approch to it. The word Maya and Satya have been > used > > > to > > > > AL > > > > > > and L many times. Maya is popular and difficult to overcome > > and > > > > hence > > > > > > traditional. With this string it suits the meaning of the > word > > > > > > aaruDha. Moreover if we take aaruDha as mounted then > question > > > > arises > > > > > > what gets mounted who mounts it where and why?. One can > > > > not 'mount' > > > > > > oneself different for the public. It is the public that > forms > > > the > > > > > > opinion or mounts you. So we dont have any control over > this > > > > mounting > > > > > > phenomenon. That is why I said it is popular identity which > > is > > > > always > > > > > > created by the public. It may be correct i.e. as you are > (1st > > > > house or > > > > > > Lagna) or it may be something different(any other house) or > > even > > > > > > exactly opposite(7th house). Had it not been so how do we > > > > see,great > > > > > > men like Maharishi Valmiki and Vedvyasa? Or modern day > Mahatma > > > > > > Gandhi? Does taht mean what ever we know about them is all > > > aaruDha > > > > > > and their real identity is different? But BPHS says that > 1st > > > and > > > > 7th > > > > > > house can not be AL house? Why? Parashara can not be wrong. > I > > > > must be > > > > > > wrong but where I am not getting. Either my premise is > wrong > > and > > > > > > hence the inference. But at least to me and my little > Sanskrit > > > > > > knowledge, my premise about aaruDha seems to be correct. In > > > that > > > > case > > > > > > my inference should also be correct. > > > > > > > > > > > > I am sure you will solve this and clear my doubts > > > astrologically > > > > and > > > > > > its social aspects as well. > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar > Sharma > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > Dear Amolmandar, > > > > > > > I agree with Parthaji. Look up what happens when > Arudhapada > > > > falls > > > > > > in > > > > > > > 1st,4th and 7th. Again Aarudha could also mean mounted, > > which > > > > could > > > > > > in a > > > > > > > way show perception, is it not? > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om namah Shivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Amol > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna and Arudha Lagna are never the same. This is a > > truth. > > > > There > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > no fortune involved in making them the same. they can > > never > > > > be the > > > > > > > > same, however hard one may try, > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "amolmandar" > > > > > > > > <amolmandar> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Dear Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you allow me to join this discussion..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think we should read it as AruDha or aaruDha. > > Literally > > > > ruDha > > > > > > > > means > > > > > > > > > popular or traditional and 'aa' prefix makes it more > > > > popular or > > > > > > > > more > > > > > > > > > traditional. The prefix 'a' to ruDha will make it > > > opposite. > > > > > > aruDha > > > > > > > > > will be that is not popular.So aaruDha means > > morepopular > > > or > > > > we > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > say Maha-popular. That way aaruDha will make what is > > > > popularly > > > > > > > > known > > > > > > > > > about you. It need not be other than Satya. If you > are > > > > fortunate > > > > > > > > > enough your Lagna(true identity) and Arudha Lagna > > (Popular > > > > > > identity) > > > > > > > > > will be same. All great persons should belong to that > > > > class. > > > > > > Both > > > > > > > > > identies are govern by satya i.e.you(Lagna) and > hence > > > > Lagna is > > > > > > > > more > > > > > > > > > important. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > After all we say satyam eva jayate! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Shailesh > > Chadha" > > > > > > > > <scc@s...> > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha, > > > > > > > > > > May I join in this discussion? > > > > > > > > > > If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis- à- > > vis > > > > our > > > > > > > > > > understanding of a jataka, the confusion about > Arudha > > > > Padas > > > > > > will > > > > > > > > > > dissolve to a great extent. > > > > > > > > > > "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - > > that > > > > which > > > > > > > > > relates to > > > > > > > > > > "Atma" and "Parmatma" . > > > > > > > > > > This material world is in fact "maya" - an > illusion, > > > but > > > > we > > > > > > treat > > > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > > world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules > > > > of "satya" to > > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this > world > > > > > > of "maya" > > > > > > > > and, > > > > > > > > > > hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are > more > > > > relevant > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > > material existence. > > > > > > > > > > Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana- > > arudha, > > > > Gaja- > > > > > > > > arudha, > > > > > > > > > > etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level". > > > > > > > > > > So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made > > by > > > the > > > > > > > > > individual > > > > > > > > > > (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards > > > achieving > > > > the > > > > > > > > highest > > > > > > > > > > ability/ perfection. > > > > > > > > > > Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood > > > > > > as "manifestation" or > > > > > > > > > > "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I > think > > > we > > > > will > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > able to > > > > > > > > > > better appreciate this concept of "arudha". > > > > > > > > > > Of course, this is only as per my understanding - > > > > hopefully, > > > > > > > > Gurus > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > seniors will correct, or confirm, it. > > > > > > > > > > Regards & best wishes, > > > > > > > > > > Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5] > > > > > > > > > > Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PM > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear > > > > > > chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Namah SHivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have a habit of saving all important messages by > > the > > > > various > > > > > > > > > gurus > > > > > > > > > > and learned members. I have around 50 MB material > > just > > > by > > > > this > > > > > > > > work > > > > > > > > > > (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the > > old > > > > message > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > your perusal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > """"""- > > > > > > > > > > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM > > > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Imran, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The concept of Arudha of different houses > > beautifully > > > > > > eloborates > > > > > > > > > > the difference between reality(Satya) and perception > > > > (Maya). > > > > > > Sage > > > > > > > > > > Jaimini has described some golden rules how to > treat > > and > > > > > > tackle > > > > > > > > > these > > > > > > > > > > Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold > > > > specific > > > > > > > > > > posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas > > > > collectively, > > > > > > > > thus > > > > > > > > > > require guidance regarding association, aspect, > dasa > > and > > > > > > > > vorgottama > > > > > > > > > > of Arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. > > For > > > > > > example in > > > > > > > > > > case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in > > Scorpio > > > > (9th > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > > lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 > (H.P.Blavatsky) > > > is > > > > to be > > > > > > > > > > assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and > > 10th > > > > > > lords, > > > > > > > > > > Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with > > > > respect of > > > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > > > > position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in > > > chart > > > > of > > > > > > Dalai > > > > > > > > > > Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and > 12th > > > from > > > > > > lagna. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association > > > > (sambndha) > > > > > > with > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > help of rashi aspect? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken > instead > > of > > > > > > lagan? or > > > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, > yields > > > > > > > > satisfactory > > > > > > > > > > results at a certain level. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imran > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You are on the right track and Visti has nicely > > > addressed > > > > the > > > > > > > > > points > > > > > > > > > > in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of > points. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from > the > > > > > > > > > activity/things > > > > > > > > > > shown by the houses. My communication skills are not > > > > > > a "tangible > > > > > > > > > > thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that > rises > > > out > > > > of my > > > > > > > > > > communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house > > shows > > > my > > > > > > > > > > communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this > > mail > > > > > > > > (tangible). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" > (illusion), > > > they > > > > are > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > only tangible things - the only reality - in this > > > material > > > > > > world! > > > > > > > > > > They are very important. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) > > > > together in > > > > > > D- > > > > > > > > 10, > > > > > > > > > > be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign > containing > > > them > > > > > > will > > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > > great. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. > > > > However, > > > > > > note > > > > > > > > > > that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are > > > different > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > rules of the world of maya (illusion). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's > > > > > > interactions. > > > > > > > > It > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed > > house > > > of > > > > kama > > > > > > > > > > trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) > > and > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc > > > (shaping > > > > of > > > > > > > > desire > > > > > > > > > > and working on the desire) and the culmination > house > > > > (11th) > > > > > > shows > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th > > > house > > > > shows > > > > > > > > > > dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. > > > While > > > > the > > > > > > > > seed > > > > > > > > > > house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the > > > > > > intermediate > > > > > > > > > > house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), > > the > > > > > > > > culmination > > > > > > > > > > house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall > > duty). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the > > world > > > of > > > > > > maya, > > > > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > > > the meanings are different. In the world of truth, > > > > shaping of > > > > > > > > > desire > > > > > > > > > > and working on the desires happens through > > interactions > > > > and > > > > > > > > finally > > > > > > > > > > leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships > too. > > > But > > > > the > > > > > > > > world > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In > the > > > > world of > > > > > > > > > maya, > > > > > > > > > > shaping of desire and working on the desire happens > > > only > > > > thru > > > > > > > > > > domination and the results are only material gains. > > So > > > > the 7th > > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > > arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and > > > > > > domination. > > > > > > > > > The > > > > > > > > > > 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include > > > > > > > > religiousness, > > > > > > > > > > righteousness etc. But the image has only one > dharma > > > > (duty) - > > > > > > > > > protect > > > > > > > > > > itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly > about > > > > > > protecting > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > status and image. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The basic axioms of what a house means (based on > which > > > > > > trikona it > > > > > > > > > > belongs to and whether it is the seed house, > > > intermediate > > > > > > house > > > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > the culmination house of that trikona) is constant > > for > > > all > > > > > > > > > > references. But building the meaning further based > on > > > the > > > > > > axioms > > > > > > > > > > requires an understanding of the two worlds - world > > of > > > > satya > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > world of maya. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish > > > Workshop" > > > > and > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > CD > > > > > > > > > > will be available for buying online in a day or two > > at > > > > most. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana > dasa > > > > > > > > > > interpretation, but there is a variation of > Narayana > > > dasa > > > > > > that is > > > > > > > > > > computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows > the > > > > > > changing > > > > > > > > > > impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the > > > resulting > > > > > > luck) > > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > > one's material status/image. Read the > book "Narayana > > > > Dasa" by > > > > > > Pt. > > > > > > > > > > Sanjay Rath. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa > > > > interpretation, > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > > can use it in transit interpretation too! In > addition > > to > > > > > > transits > > > > > > > > > > from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits > > from > > > > natal > > > > > > > > arudha > > > > > > > > > > lagna! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, again, different rules may apply in the > case > > of > > > > > > arudha > > > > > > > > > > lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of > dharma > > > from > > > > > > Moon or > > > > > > > > > > lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter > > loves > > > > dharma. > > > > > > > > > > However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha > > > > lagna, the > > > > > > > > wise > > > > > > > > > > teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the > > rules > > > > of the > > > > > > > > > world > > > > > > > > > > of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a > > > shallow > > > > > > dharma > > > > > > > > > > (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! > So > > > > there > > > > > > will > > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > > material setbacks and the illusion is broken. > > However, > > > if > > > > > > Jupiter > > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in > natal > > > chart > > > > > > also, > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > negative results may be mitigated. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two > totally > > > > > > different > > > > > > > > > > worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one > > > > > > understands > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > appreciates this, one cannot master the use of > arudha > > > > lagna. > > > > > > Try > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > give it some thought. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good > luck > > > with > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > > arudha pada studies! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > May Jupiter's light shine on us, > > > > > > > > > > Narasimha""""""" > > > > > > > > > > > > > """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic- > > astrology, "Chandrashekhar > > > > > > Sharma" > > > > > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Partha, > > > > > > > > > > > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what > I > > > > > > indicated > > > > > > > > > (About > > > > > > > > > > pada > > > > > > > > > > > being perception). And here is what > narasimharaoji > > > says > > > > > > > > verbatim " > > > > > > > > > > > Use of arudha lagna > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. > Arudha > > > > lagna is > > > > > > > > maya > > > > > > > > > > peetha or > > > > > > > > > > > the seat of > > > > > > > > > > > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for > > > > different > > > > > > > > shades > > > > > > > > > > of self. > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna stands for > > > > > > > > > > > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived > > self. > > > > Arudha > > > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > > > > stands > > > > > > > > > > > for "self, as > > > > > > > > > > > peceived by this maya world". > > > > > > > > > > > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to > > > > comment. > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the > > > spouse - > > > > > > dear Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this > > > world > > > > of > > > > > > Maya. > > > > > > > > > > This > > > > > > > > > > > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier > messages. > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic- > > > astrology, "Chandrashekhar > > > > > > Sharma" > > > > > > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Hari, > > > > > > > > > > > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are > > > > perception of > > > > > > what > > > > > > > > > > > people think > > > > > > > > > > > > about one, this is the only logical inference. > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the > > > > spouse - > > > > > > dear > > > > > > > > Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do > with > > > the > > > > > > > > > > consummation > > > > > > > > > > > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it > > correct? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > > > Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic- > > > astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ........ May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > > > > Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the > > > > > > Terms > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic- > > astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > > > Krishnaarpanamastu > > > > || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the > > > > > Terms of > > > > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic- > astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > > Krishnaarpanamastu > > > || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > > > > > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system > > > > (http://www.grisoft.com). > > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release > Date: > > > > > > 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > > > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system > > > > (http://www.grisoft.com). > > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release > Date: > > > > > > 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <http://rd./M=249982.3512844.4795476.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 > > > > > > > > > > > > 05082686:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o72ctft/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi- > > > > > > bin/autoredir? camp=556&lineid=3512844∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu > || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms > > of > > > > > > Service > > > > > > > > <>. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <http://rd./M=249982.3512844.4795476.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 > > > > > > 05082686:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o72ctft/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi- > > > > bin/autoredir?camp=556&lineid=3512844∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > > > Service > > > > > > <>. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 8, 2003 Report Share Posted July 8, 2003 Respected Chandrashekharji According to what little bit grammer I understand of Sanskrit,I analysed the first line of the above shloka as this. The word lagnaruDha is not used here as verb. For that matter in Lagna+aauDha here as well it is not used as verb. Had it been so we would not have formed Saptami of that. Since we are using Saptami(LagnaruDhe) it is signifactor of the action (Kriya Karana). That is the place where the action is performed. Moreover as Chandra too is a reason for the action it is as well used in Saptami(nishanathe). This is Sati- Saptami. The action is explained in the next line. But the point is that the lagnaruDhe is not used here as verb so we can conclude it (depending on the context) that aaruDhalagna when contains chandra problems occur as mentioned in 2nd line (I have some doubt with 2nd line). Secondly if consider as lagnaruDhenishanathe we understand it as ascending chandra in the Lagna creates problems.. Here again chandra is not 'aaruDha' in Lagna. That is it is not mounted, rather aaruDha is used here as adjective to indicate the state of the chandra. So it says that the ascending/growing/popular moon (from amavays to poorneema) if present in Lagna creates problems. Chandra is in Lagna is indicated by the Spatami Vibhakti the aaruDha word has nothing to do with that. It is not chandra mounted in Lagna creates problems.To make the matter more complicated we can take aaruDhenishanathe as completion of the aaruDha(ascending or most popular moon) to indicate the state of the moon as poorneema only. So all in all we get three different meanings of the first line of the shhloka 1)LagnaaaruDhe nishanathe ----> assuming that context is of aaruDha lagna and the author has uesd it as aaruDhaLagna to adjust the metre,in that case it means aaruDha Lagna. So meaning becomes aaruDha Lagna and Moon together. Here we can not consider Chandra mounting or mounted on Lagna. 2)LagnaruDhenishanathe -----> Ascending/Growing/popular Chandra in the Lagna. Here as well chandra is not mounted in/on Lagna. 3)lagnaruDhenishanathe -----> As completion of the aaction ascending hence state of the Chandra as in the state of poorneema. That is full moon in the Lagna. Here as well Nothing is mounted in/on Lagna. So we find that every time it is used as adjective or noun or kriya karan. To support my argument let me quote the first word of first line of some of the shlokas of padhadhya for BPHS.shloka 14 begins with padasthanatvyaye i.e. padasthanat is panchami it means from padasthana vyaye is saptami i.e. in 12th house. Hence it means from padasthana in the 12th house. Shloka no 20 begins with aaruDhat i.e. panchami again,saptame again saptami. Hence from padasthana in the 7th house. All such shlokas are considering the aaruDha or pada as adjective or noun or Karana for kriya. Hence it is not considered here as Kiryapada or verb. That is why I apply the yaskacharya nirukta to get the meaning of the word. When we use aaruDha as kriyapada then possibly we can used the meaing as mounted but not in this case. That is why aarohana is not applicable in this case. To continue to the second line, there are two verbs used and in my opinion are not in tandem. The first verb is aapnoti indicates to obtain. Hence Janani(Mother) Klesham (pain) aapnoti (obtaines). Hence the meaning of first part of the second line is Mother obtains pains or sufferings. Now the second part of the second line is little bit doubtful. It uses the verb vidyate. Vidyate means to be. So meaning is The jatak does not get pitru saukhaya. Here the first part says that mother does get pain but in the next part it says that Jatak does not get pitasukha. It should have been, pitasaukhayam na vindyante. This way now it becomes pita will not get saukhyam. So ultimatly we would mean, mother gets troubles and father as well gets problems. That is why, the SandhiVigraha of aaruDha is done as aa (all,encompasing)+ ruDha(traditional or pupular) as adjective. So that gives Lagna as real identity and aaruDha Lagna as popular identity. That is why I say for mahatmas it must be same. Since the lenght of the mail is incresing and it would be difficult for me to handle several issues at a time I request you to clear my doubts till this point. Once we agree on this much then possibly we can go in the later part i.e. regarding mahatmas. I again request you to pardon me if you feel that I have crossed my limits. Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. AmolMandar vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma <boxdel> wrote: > Dear Amolmandar, > I think the confusion is on account of the fact that you have not read > shlokas about Arudha Lagna. Read below text and tell me whether it means > Traditional(Rudha) Lagna. > > l¶aêFe inzanawe l¶raizdza Vywam!, > > lagnärüòhe niçaanäthe lagnaräçidaçä vyathäm | > > jnnI ¬ezmaßaeit ipÇusaEoy< n iv*te. > > janané kleçamäpnoti pitrusaukhayaà na vidyate || > > Again you must have seen words like "Ashwaarudha"(One who is mounted on > a horse), which mean what I had conveyed. For usage of dictionary words > to denote something else in Jyotish, look at what is dictionary meaning > of Rasi,Kshetra,Gruha, Ruksha,Bha, Bhavan and then find out what is > meant by them in Jyotish. > Varaha mihira , after explaining that he is writing Brihatjatakam as > pupils get confused by the ancient texts says in the 4th shloka > "Raashayo Raashi Kshetragruharkshabhaani Bhavanam > ChaikaarthasampratyayaaH". He understood that pupils might try to take > dictionary meaning of words, for meanings accepted by tradition in > Jyotish. Therefore he specifically tells that all the foregoing mean one > and the same thing. Some even think that Rasi is not Varga, forgetting > what vargas are said to consist of shadvarga,saptajavarga etc. > About the logic that many people perceive one as mahatma and therefore > he must be Mahatma, I differ. There have been scores of Cults where the > followers and sometimes the world too thought the Cult Gurus(?) as > Saints. Had they not been expose , may be they would even today be > called as Greats. This dioes not make one Great from an Astrological > view point. If I need to give you a classic Indian Example, look at how > people Bihar perceive Lalooprasad Yadava and compare it with your > opinion of him. > I think this will help clarify your confusion. > Historical figures are seen through history that is written, but > remember that History is written by those who have one and got the > control of Government. You might like to look at what Aurangajeb's > historian wrote about Shivaji and compare it with what people ruled by > Shivaji thought about him. > Lagna and Arudha can never be the same as truth and even one's > perception of oneself differ. If we assume that the Great ones are > always truthful and correct, then think what the Mahatma thought he was > giving the people of India and what they got, in terms of political > morality. > Chandrashekhar. > > amolmandar wrote: > > > Respected Chandrashekharji > > > > Thanks for the detailed mail. I have some doubts remaining. Sir, why > > should we connect the word aarohana when not mentioned by the sages? > > Is it not correct to stick to the word used. The general perception > > of the word aaruDha might be different. It may be because of time > > that has gone between the scriptures written and present time. > > But when scriptures were written the word had only dictionary > > meanings. > > > > Moreover sir is it not the case of doing the reverse logic? First > > make the result and then find out the suitable reasons for that.( Sir > > please do not take it otherwise). Applying a word which has the > > meaning suitable to our logic would be doing injustice to the sages. > > > > It would be interesting to find out a word used in Jyotish with the > > meaning different than dictionary meaning. If there exits (I know > > since you have said it must be there) then is it required to put > > forward the correct meanings and reinterpret the shlokas correctly? > > > > Regarding the VedVyasa and Mahatma Gandhi I supposed I was not eble > > to express properly. What I wanted to focus was that popular identity > > of a person must be in tandem with the actual identity of the person. > > If a person is popularly known as Mahatma then actually he should be > > Mahatma. If it is not so then many problems on many fronts may crop > > up. Those who considered him as Mahatma and their intelligence would > > be questioned. The person who falsely becomes mahatma gets the credit > > of cheating people. Matahtma was Mahatma in the eyes of the people > > because he was Mahatma. The son and for that matter any other close > > relative (who became known as critic of Mahatma otherwise had no > > standings of his own) may have different opinion. That can not be > > considered as True or actual of Mahatma. There might be different > > individual opinions about any body including Mahatma.My point is that > > an un-deserving person may never get acknowledgements from the > > masses. There were so many leaders but only one Mahatma. > > > > Normal human being may not reveal about themselves but Mahatmas dont > > have anything to hide. In that case only Lagna and aaruDha can be > > same. That is why I said only fortunates will have actual(Lagna) and > > popular identity(aaruDha) same. > > > > I, in the flow of the thought process, find in crossing my limits I > > apologise for that. > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > Dear Amolmandar, > > > If you look at how Arudha Lagna or other Padas are calculated, why > > > Aarudha is to be interpreted as Mounted will be clear. The angle > > between > > > a planet and its house reflected on other side gets you the Arudha > > Lagna > > > and Padas. So the logic behind this appears to be reflection by the > > > planet on either side. This being the case, Aarudha has to be taken > > as > > > connected with Aarohana (To mount).It (the meaning) could well mean > > > outer layer as perceived. > > > It is said that meanings of words are to be taken based on custom > > in > > > relevant science where a possibility of two meanings for the same > > word > > > arises. In legal documents also trade terms override dictionary > > meaning. > > > I am no Pandita of Sanskrita, but think that the corect meaning > > would be > > > mounted. Analysing the intent it would mean outer layer. If we > > start > > > taking literal meanings per dictionary, many words would mean > > something > > > other than what they mean in Jyotish. Here the mounting means the > > > perception others might have about certain bhava activity of the > > Jataka. > > > About your question about Vedvyasa and Gandhi, find out what were > > > opinions of true form of Vedavyasa of the public when he was young > > and > > > what was known to Gods, similarly find out what was the opinion of > > > Gandhi's son about him and contrast it with the perception of > > public > > > like Us. The answer would be crystal clear. > > > This is precisely why Lagna and 7th house padas fall in 10th and > > 4th > > > house. The Sages knew that human beings do not reveal everything > > about > > > either themselves or their marital life. So others form opinion > > about > > > the Jataka from results of his Karma(10th) and about his marital > > bliss > > > from Sukha(4th House). You will also observe that Pada of 4th falls > > in > > > 4th house itself, for similar reasons. > > > If you go deeper in to Arudha scheme of things, then you will find > > that > > > certain yogas are said to be read from 7th arudha and the rishis > > further > > > enjoin one to read similar results from 2nd Arudha. The reason is > > that > > > 7th house persception is formed from Dhana and Kutumba of a person > > by > > > outsiders. > > > Of course these are my views and others might have different views. > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > amolmandar wrote: > > > > > > > Respected Chandrashekharji > > > > > > > > I understand that but when we say meaning literally we should take > > > > correct approch to it. The word Maya and Satya have been used to > > AL > > > > and L many times. Maya is popular and difficult to overcome and > > hence > > > > traditional. With this string it suits the meaning of the word > > > > aaruDha. Moreover if we take aaruDha as mounted then question > > arises > > > > what gets mounted who mounts it where and why?. One can > > not 'mount' > > > > oneself different for the public. It is the public that forms the > > > > opinion or mounts you. So we dont have any control over this > > mounting > > > > phenomenon. That is why I said it is popular identity which is > > always > > > > created by the public. It may be correct i.e. as you are(1st > > house or > > > > Lagna) or it may be something different(any other house) or even > > > > exactly opposite(7th house). Had it not been so how do we > > see,great > > > > men like Maharishi Valmiki and Vedvyasa? Or modern day Mahatma > > > > Gandhi? Does taht mean what ever we know about them is all aaruDha > > > > and their real identity is different? But BPHS says that 1st and > > 7th > > > > house can not be AL house? Why? Parashara can not be wrong. I > > must be > > > > wrong but where I am not getting. Either my premise is wrong and > > > > hence the inference. But at least to me and my little Sanskrit > > > > knowledge, my premise about aaruDha seems to be correct. In that > > case > > > > my inference should also be correct. > > > > > > > > I am sure you will solve this and clear my doubts astrologically > > and > > > > its social aspects as well. > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > Dear Amolmandar, > > > > > I agree with Parthaji. Look up what happens when Arudhapada > > falls > > > > in > > > > > 1st,4th and 7th. Again Aarudha could also mean mounted, which > > could > > > > in a > > > > > way show perception, is it not? > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Om namah Shivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Amol > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna and Arudha Lagna are never the same. This is a truth. > > There > > > > is > > > > > > no fortune involved in making them the same. they can never > > be the > > > > > > same, however hard one may try, > > > > > > regards > > > > > > partha > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "amolmandar" > > > > > > <amolmandar> wrote: > > > > > > > Dear Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you allow me to join this discussion..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think we should read it as AruDha or aaruDha. Literally > > ruDha > > > > > > means > > > > > > > popular or traditional and 'aa' prefix makes it more > > popular or > > > > > > more > > > > > > > traditional. The prefix 'a' to ruDha will make it opposite. > > > > aruDha > > > > > > > will be that is not popular.So aaruDha means morepopular or > > we > > > > can > > > > > > > say Maha-popular. That way aaruDha will make what is > > popularly > > > > > > known > > > > > > > about you. It need not be other than Satya. If you are > > fortunate > > > > > > > enough your Lagna(true identity) and Arudha Lagna (Popular > > > > identity) > > > > > > > will be same. All great persons should belong to that > > class. > > > > Both > > > > > > > identies are govern by satya i.e.you(Lagna) and hence > > Lagna is > > > > > > more > > > > > > > important. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > After all we say satyam eva jayate! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Shailesh Chadha" > > > > > > <scc@s...> > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha, > > > > > > > > May I join in this discussion? > > > > > > > > If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis-à- vis > > our > > > > > > > > understanding of a jataka, the confusion about Arudha > > Padas > > > > will > > > > > > > > dissolve to a great extent. > > > > > > > > "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - that > > which > > > > > > > relates to > > > > > > > > "Atma" and "Parmatma" . > > > > > > > > This material world is in fact "maya" - an illusion, but > > we > > > > treat > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules > > of "satya" to > > > > it. > > > > > > > > Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this world > > > > of "maya" > > > > > > and, > > > > > > > > hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are more > > relevant > > > > to > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > material existence. > > > > > > > > Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana-arudha, > > Gaja- > > > > > > arudha, > > > > > > > > etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level". > > > > > > > > So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made by the > > > > > > > individual > > > > > > > > (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards achieving > > the > > > > > > highest > > > > > > > > ability/ perfection. > > > > > > > > Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood > > > > as "manifestation" or > > > > > > > > "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I think we > > will > > > > be > > > > > > > able to > > > > > > > > better appreciate this concept of "arudha". > > > > > > > > Of course, this is only as per my understanding - > > hopefully, > > > > > > Gurus > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > seniors will correct, or confirm, it. > > > > > > > > Regards & best wishes, > > > > > > > > Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5] > > > > > > > > Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PM > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear > > > > chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Namah SHivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have a habit of saving all important messages by the > > various > > > > > > > gurus > > > > > > > > and learned members. I have around 50 MB material just by > > this > > > > > > work > > > > > > > > (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the old > > message > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > your perusal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > """"""- > > > > > > > > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Imran, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The concept of Arudha of different houses beautifully > > > > eloborates > > > > > > > > the difference between reality(Satya) and perception > > (Maya). > > > > Sage > > > > > > > > Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat and > > > > tackle > > > > > > > these > > > > > > > > Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold > > specific > > > > > > > > posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas > > collectively, > > > > > > thus > > > > > > > > require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa and > > > > > > vorgottama > > > > > > > > of Arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. For > > > > example in > > > > > > > > case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in Scorpio > > (9th > > > > from > > > > > > > > lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) is > > to be > > > > > > > > assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and 10th > > > > lords, > > > > > > > > Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with > > respect of > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > > position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in chart > > of > > > > Dalai > > > > > > > > Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th from > > > > lagna. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association > > (sambndha) > > > > with > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > help of rashi aspect? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead of > > > > lagan? or > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields > > > > > > satisfactory > > > > > > > > results at a certain level. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imran > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You are on the right track and Visti has nicely addressed > > the > > > > > > > points > > > > > > > > in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the > > > > > > > activity/things > > > > > > > > shown by the houses. My communication skills are not > > > > a "tangible > > > > > > > > thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises out > > of my > > > > > > > > communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house shows my > > > > > > > > communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this mail > > > > > > (tangible). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), they > > are > > > > the > > > > > > > > only tangible things - the only reality - in this material > > > > world! > > > > > > > > They are very important. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) > > together in > > > > D- > > > > > > 10, > > > > > > > > be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing them > > > > will > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > great. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. > > However, > > > > note > > > > > > > > that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are different > > > > from > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > rules of the world of maya (illusion). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's > > > > interactions. > > > > > > It > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed house of > > kama > > > > > > > > trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) and > > the > > > > > > > > intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc (shaping > > of > > > > > > desire > > > > > > > > and working on the desire) and the culmination house > > (11th) > > > > shows > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th house > > shows > > > > > > > > dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. While > > the > > > > > > seed > > > > > > > > house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the > > > > intermediate > > > > > > > > house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), the > > > > > > culmination > > > > > > > > house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall duty). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the world of > > > > maya, > > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > the meanings are different. In the world of truth, > > shaping of > > > > > > > desire > > > > > > > > and working on the desires happens through interactions > > and > > > > > > finally > > > > > > > > leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. But > > the > > > > > > world > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the > > world of > > > > > > > maya, > > > > > > > > shaping of desire and working on the desire happens only > > thru > > > > > > > > domination and the results are only material gains. So > > the 7th > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and > > > > domination. > > > > > > > The > > > > > > > > 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include > > > > > > religiousness, > > > > > > > > righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma > > (duty) - > > > > > > > protect > > > > > > > > itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about > > > > protecting > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > status and image. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which > > > > trikona it > > > > > > > > belongs to and whether it is the seed house, intermediate > > > > house > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > the culmination house of that trikona) is constant for all > > > > > > > > references. But building the meaning further based on the > > > > axioms > > > > > > > > requires an understanding of the two worlds - world of > > satya > > > > and > > > > > > > > world of maya. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish Workshop" > > and > > > > the > > > > > > CD > > > > > > > > will be available for buying online in a day or two at > > most. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa > > > > > > > > interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana dasa > > > > that is > > > > > > > > computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the > > > > changing > > > > > > > > impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the resulting > > > > luck) > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana > > Dasa" by > > > > Pt. > > > > > > > > Sanjay Rath. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa > > interpretation, > > > > but > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition to > > > > transits > > > > > > > > from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits from > > natal > > > > > > arudha > > > > > > > > lagna! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, again, different rules may apply in the case of > > > > arudha > > > > > > > > lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma from > > > > Moon or > > > > > > > > lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter loves > > dharma. > > > > > > > > However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha > > lagna, the > > > > > > wise > > > > > > > > teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the rules > > of the > > > > > > > world > > > > > > > > of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a shallow > > > > dharma > > > > > > > > (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So > > there > > > > will > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > material setbacks and the illusion is broken. However, if > > > > Jupiter > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal chart > > > > also, > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > negative results may be mitigated. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally > > > > different > > > > > > > > worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one > > > > understands > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha > > lagna. > > > > Try > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > give it some thought. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck with > > > > your > > > > > > > > arudha pada studies! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > May Jupiter's light shine on us, > > > > > > > > Narasimha""""""" > > > > > > > > """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic- astrology, "Chandrashekhar > > > > Sharma" > > > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Dear Partha, > > > > > > > > > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I > > > > indicated > > > > > > > (About > > > > > > > > pada > > > > > > > > > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji says > > > > > > verbatim " > > > > > > > > > Use of arudha lagna > > > > > > > > > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha > > lagna is > > > > > > maya > > > > > > > > peetha or > > > > > > > > > the seat of > > > > > > > > > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for > > different > > > > > > shades > > > > > > > > of self. > > > > > > > > > Lagna stands for > > > > > > > > > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived self. > > Arudha > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > > stands > > > > > > > > > for "self, as > > > > > > > > > peceived by this maya world". > > > > > > > > > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to > > comment. > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse - > > > > dear Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this world > > of > > > > Maya. > > > > > > > > This > > > > > > > > > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages. > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic- astrology, "Chandrashekhar > > > > Sharma" > > > > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Hari, > > > > > > > > > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are > > perception of > > > > what > > > > > > > > > people think > > > > > > > > > > about one, this is the only logical inference. > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the > > spouse - > > > > dear > > > > > > Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with the > > > > > > > > consummation > > > > > > > > > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it correct? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic- astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > > Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms > > > > of > > > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic- astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu > > || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > > > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system > > (http://www.grisoft.com). <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: > > > > 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system > > (http://www.grisoft.com). <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: > > > > 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > <http://rd./M=249982.3512844.4795476.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 > > > > > > 05082686:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o72ctft/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi- > > > > bin/autoredir?camp=556&lineid=3512844∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > > > Service > > > > > > <>. > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > <http://rd./M=249982.3512844.4795476.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 > > 05082686:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o72ctft/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi- > > bin/autoredir?camp=556&lineid=3512844∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > Service > > > > <>. > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > <http://rd./M=244522.3512152.4794593.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 05082686:HM/A=1595056/R=0/SIG=124bf4lrb/*http://ashnin.com/clk/muryuta itakenattogyo?YH=3512152&yhad=1595056> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > Terms of Service > > <>. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 8, 2003 Report Share Posted July 8, 2003 || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || Dear Amol, WRT your question:: question arises what gets mounted who mounts it where and why? I repeat what I mentioned in another mail - the words used in classics are: 'pada', 'arudha' and 'pada-arudha'. It seems logical to presume that we have to understand 'arudha' as 'pada-arudha' - mounted on the position. The position will refer to 'bhava' or 'graha' - depending upon whether the subject under consideration is 'bhava=pada' or 'graha-pada'. May I request the Gurus to lindly confirm. Regards & best wishes, Shailesh - "amolmandar" <amolmandar <vedic astrology> Friday, July 04, 2003 12:14 PM [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear amol Respected Chandrashekharji I understand that but when we say meaning literally we should take correct approch to it. The word Maya and Satya have been used to AL and L many times. Maya is popular and difficult to overcome and hence traditional. With this string it suits the meaning of the word aaruDha. Moreover if we take aaruDha as mounted then question arises what gets mounted who mounts it where and why?. One can not 'mount' oneself different for the public. It is the public that forms the opinion or mounts you. So we dont have any control over this mounting phenomenon. That is why I said it is popular identity which is always created by the public. It may be correct i.e. as you are(1st house or Lagna) or it may be something different(any other house) or even exactly opposite(7th house). Had it not been so how do we see,great men like Maharishi Valmiki and Vedvyasa? Or modern day Mahatma Gandhi? Does taht mean what ever we know about them is all aaruDha and their real identity is different? But BPHS says that 1st and 7th house can not be AL house? Why? Parashara can not be wrong. I must be wrong but where I am not getting. Either my premise is wrong and hence the inference. But at least to me and my little Sanskrit knowledge, my premise about aaruDha seems to be correct. In that case my inference should also be correct. I am sure you will solve this and clear my doubts astrologically and its social aspects as well. Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. AmolMandar vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma <boxdel> wrote: > Dear Amolmandar, > I agree with Parthaji. Look up what happens when Arudhapada falls in > 1st,4th and 7th. Again Aarudha could also mean mounted, which could in a > way show perception, is it not? > Chandrashekhar. > > V.Partha sarathy wrote: > > > Om namah Shivaya > > > > Dear Amol > > > > Lagna and Arudha Lagna are never the same. This is a truth. There is > > no fortune involved in making them the same. they can never be the > > same, however hard one may try, > > regards > > partha > > om tat sat > > > > > > vedic astrology, "amolmandar" > > <amolmandar> wrote: > > > Dear Shailesh > > > > > > If you allow me to join this discussion..... > > > > > > I think we should read it as AruDha or aaruDha. Literally ruDha > > means > > > popular or traditional and 'aa' prefix makes it more popular or > > more > > > traditional. The prefix 'a' to ruDha will make it opposite. aruDha > > > will be that is not popular.So aaruDha means morepopular or we can > > > say Maha-popular. That way aaruDha will make what is popularly > > known > > > about you. It need not be other than Satya. If you are fortunate > > > enough your Lagna(true identity) and Arudha Lagna(Popular identity) > > > will be same. All great persons should belong to that class. Both > > > identies are govern by satya i.e.you(Lagna) and hence Lagna is > > more > > > important. > > > > > > After all we say satyam eva jayate! > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Shailesh Chadha" > > <scc@s...> > > > wrote: > > > > || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha, > > > > May I join in this discussion? > > > > If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis-à-vis our > > > > understanding of a jataka, the confusion about Arudha Padas will > > > > dissolve to a great extent. > > > > "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - that which > > > relates to > > > > "Atma" and "Parmatma" . > > > > This material world is in fact "maya" - an illusion, but we treat > > > this > > > > world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules of "satya" to it. > > > > Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this world of "maya" > > and, > > > > hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are more relevant to > > > this > > > > material existence. > > > > Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana-arudha, Gaja- > > arudha, > > > > etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level". > > > > So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made by the > > > individual > > > > (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards achieving the > > highest > > > > ability/ perfection. > > > > Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood as "manifestation" or > > > > "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I think we will be > > > able to > > > > better appreciate this concept of "arudha". > > > > Of course, this is only as per my understanding - hopefully, > > Gurus > > > and > > > > seniors will correct, or confirm, it. > > > > Regards & best wishes, > > > > Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5] > > > > Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PM > > > > vedic astrology > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > Om Namah SHivaya > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > I have a habit of saving all important messages by the various > > > gurus > > > > and learned members. I have around 50 MB material just by this > > work > > > > (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the old message > > for > > > > your perusal > > > > > > > > regards > > > > partha > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > """"""- > > > > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > > > > vedic astrology > > > > Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha > > > > > > > > Dear Imran, > > > > > > > > > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > > > > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > > > > > The concept of Arudha of different houses beautifully eloborates > > > > the difference between reality(Satya) and perception(Maya). Sage > > > > Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat and tackle > > > these > > > > Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold specific > > > > posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas collectively, > > thus > > > > require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa and > > vorgottama > > > > of Arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. For example in > > > > case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in Scorpio (9th from > > > > lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > > > > > > > > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) is to be > > > > assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and 10th lords, > > > > Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > > > > > > > > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with respect of > > lagna > > > > position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in chart of Dalai > > > > Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th from lagna. > > > > > > > > > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association(sambndha) with > > > the > > > > help of rashi aspect? > > > > > > > > > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead of lagan? or > > > its > > > > not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields > > satisfactory > > > > results at a certain level. > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > Imran > > > > > > > > You are on the right track and Visti has nicely addressed the > > > points > > > > in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points. > > > > > > > > (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the > > > activity/things > > > > shown by the houses. My communication skills are not a "tangible > > > > thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises out of my > > > > communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house shows my > > > > communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this mail > > (tangible). > > > > > > > > Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), they are the > > > > only tangible things - the only reality - in this material world! > > > > They are very important. > > > > > > > > (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) together in D- > > 10, > > > > be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing them will > > be > > > > great. > > > > > > > > (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. However, note > > > > that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are different from > > the > > > > rules of the world of maya (illusion). > > > > > > > > For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's interactions. > > It > > > is > > > > the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed house of kama > > > > trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) and the > > > > intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc (shaping of > > desire > > > > and working on the desire) and the culmination house (11th) shows > > > the > > > > final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th house shows > > > > dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. While the > > seed > > > > house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the intermediate > > > > house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), the > > culmination > > > > house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall duty). > > > > > > > > The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the world of maya, > > > but > > > > the meanings are different. In the world of truth, shaping of > > > desire > > > > and working on the desires happens through interactions and > > finally > > > > leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. But the > > world > > > of > > > > maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the world of > > > maya, > > > > shaping of desire and working on the desire happens only thru > > > > domination and the results are only material gains. So the 7th > > from > > > > arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and domination. > > > The > > > > 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include > > religiousness, > > > > righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma (duty) - > > > protect > > > > itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about protecting > > > the > > > > status and image. > > > > > > > > The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which trikona it > > > > belongs to and whether it is the seed house, intermediate house > > or > > > > the culmination house of that trikona) is constant for all > > > > references. But building the meaning further based on the axioms > > > > requires an understanding of the two worlds - world of satya and > > > > world of maya. > > > > > > > > I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish Workshop" and the > > CD > > > > will be available for buying online in a day or two at most. > > > > > > > > (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa > > > > interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana dasa that is > > > > computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the changing > > > > impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the resulting luck) > > on > > > > one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana Dasa" by Pt. > > > > Sanjay Rath. > > > > > > > > (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa interpretation, but > > > you > > > > can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition to transits > > > > from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits from natal > > arudha > > > > lagna! > > > > > > > > However, again, different rules may apply in the case of arudha > > > > lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma from Moon or > > > > lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter loves dharma. > > > > However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha lagna, the > > wise > > > > teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the rules of the > > > world > > > > of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a shallow dharma > > > > (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So there will > > be > > > > material setbacks and the illusion is broken. However, if Jupiter > > > has > > > > a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal chart also, > > > the > > > > negative results may be mitigated. > > > > > > > > Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally different > > > > worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one understands > > > and > > > > appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha lagna. Try > > to > > > > give it some thought. > > > > > > > > Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck with your > > > > arudha pada studies! > > > > > > > > May Jupiter's light shine on us, > > > > Narasimha""""""" > > > > """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > Dear Partha, > > > > > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I indicated > > > (About > > > > pada > > > > > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji says > > verbatim " > > > > > Use of arudha lagna > > > > > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha lagna is > > maya > > > > peetha or > > > > > the seat of > > > > > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for different > > shades > > > > of self. > > > > > Lagna stands for > > > > > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived self. Arudha > > lagna > > > > stands > > > > > for "self, as > > > > > peceived by this maya world". > > > > > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to comment. > > > Regards, > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse - dear Anu > > > > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > > > > > > > > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this world of Maya. > > > > This > > > > > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages. > > > > > regards > > > > > partha > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Hari, > > > > > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are perception of what > > > > > people think > > > > > > about one, this is the only logical inference. Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse - dear > > Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > > > > > > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with the > > > > consummation > > > > > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it correct? > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > ....... 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Guest guest Posted July 8, 2003 Report Share Posted July 8, 2003 Dear Amolmandar, The meaning of the shloka as given by the commentator , more at ease with sanskrita than either of Us(Professor of Sanskrit at Varanashi Hindu University), is when Chandra is placed in the rasi of Aarudhalagna then.... etc. Therefore your translation that lagnaarudhe should mean Traditional Lagna appears to be faulty. If we take your translation to be correct then placement of Chandra in Lagna indicating trouble to mother and not giving pitru sukha would be against all tenets of Jyotisha It is interesting to note that you had stated that other than dictionary words are niot used in Jyotish, but failed to comment on the symonyms given in Brihatjatakam of Varhamihira for Rasi that I quoted. As I remember, Sanskrit has undergone a lot of change from ancient times till modern day. This I have on authority of a Professor of Linguistics, who himself is a Sanskrita Pandita, and happens to be very well known to me. The Jyotish texts were written in times bygone and this has to be kept in mind while interpreting the texts. Try to think why more than 6 known commentators including those of the time near to Varahamihira have interpreted shlokas of Varahamihira's Brihatjataka containing about 400 shlokas, and needed to comment on it at length. Chandrashekhar. amolmandar wrote: Respected Chandrashekharji According to what little bit grammer I understand of Sanskrit,I analysed the first line of the above shloka as this. The word lagnaruDha is not used here as verb. For that matter in Lagna+aauDha here as well it is not used as verb. Had it been so we would not have formed Saptami of that. Since we are using Saptami(LagnaruDhe) it is signifactor of the action (Kriya Karana). That is the place where the action is performed. Moreover as Chandra too is a reason for the action it is as well used in Saptami(nishanathe). This is Sati- Saptami. The action is explained in the next line. But the point is that the lagnaruDhe is not used here as verb so we can conclude it (depending on the context) that aaruDhalagna when contains chandra problems occur as mentioned in 2nd line (I have some doubt with 2nd line). Secondly if consider as lagnaruDhenishanathe we understand it as ascending chandra in the Lagna creates problems.. Here again chandra is not 'aaruDha' in Lagna. That is it is not mounted, rather aaruDha is used here as adjective to indicate the state of the chandra. So it says that the ascending/growing/popular moon (from amavays to poorneema) if present in Lagna creates problems. Chandra is in Lagna is indicated by the Spatami Vibhakti the aaruDha word has nothing to do with that. It is not chandra mounted in Lagna creates problems.To make the matter more complicated we can take aaruDhenishanathe as completion of the aaruDha(ascending or most popular moon) to indicate the state of the moon as poorneema only. So all in all we get three different meanings of the first line of the shhloka 1)LagnaaaruDhe nishanathe ----> assuming that context is of aaruDha lagna and the author has uesd it as aaruDhaLagna to adjust the metre,in that case it means aaruDha Lagna. So meaning becomes aaruDha Lagna and Moon together. Here we can not consider Chandra mounting or mounted on Lagna. 2)LagnaruDhenishanathe -----> Ascending/Growing/popular Chandra in the Lagna. Here as well chandra is not mounted in/on Lagna. 3)lagnaruDhenishanathe -----> As completion of the aaction ascending hence state of the Chandra as in the state of poorneema. That is full moon in the Lagna. Here as well Nothing is mounted in/on Lagna. So we find that every time it is used as adjective or noun or kriya karan. To support my argument let me quote the first word of first line of some of the shlokas of padhadhya for BPHS.shloka 14 begins with padasthanatvyaye i.e. padasthanat is panchami it means from padasthana vyaye is saptami i.e. in 12th house. Hence it means from padasthana in the 12th house. Shloka no 20 begins with aaruDhat i.e. panchami again,saptame again saptami. Hence from padasthana in the 7th house. All such shlokas are considering the aaruDha or pada as adjective or noun or Karana for kriya. Hence it is not considered here as Kiryapada or verb. That is why I apply the yaskacharya nirukta to get the meaning of the word. When we use aaruDha as kriyapada then possibly we can used the meaing as mounted but not in this case. That is why aarohana is not applicable in this case. To continue to the second line, there are two verbs used and in my opinion are not in tandem. The first verb is aapnoti indicates to obtain. Hence Janani(Mother) Klesham (pain) aapnoti (obtaines). Hence the meaning of first part of the second line is Mother obtains pains or sufferings. Now the second part of the second line is little bit doubtful. It uses the verb vidyate. Vidyate means to be. So meaning is The jatak does not get pitru saukhaya. Here the first part says that mother does get pain but in the next part it says that Jatak does not get pitasukha. It should have been, pitasaukhayam na vindyante. This way now it becomes pita will not get saukhyam. So ultimatly we would mean, mother gets troubles and father as well gets problems. That is why, the SandhiVigraha of aaruDha is done as aa (all,encompasing)+ ruDha(traditional or pupular) as adjective. So that gives Lagna as real identity and aaruDha Lagna as popular identity. That is why I say for mahatmas it must be same. Since the lenght of the mail is incresing and it would be difficult for me to handle several issues at a time I request you to clear my doubts till this point. Once we agree on this much then possibly we can go in the later part i.e. regarding mahatmas. I again request you to pardon me if you feel that I have crossed my limits. Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. AmolMandar vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma <boxdel> wrote: > Dear Amolmandar, > I think the confusion is on account of the fact that you have not read > shlokas about Arudha Lagna. Read below text and tell me whether it means > Traditional(Rudha) Lagna. > > l¶aêFe inzanawe l¶raizdza Vywam!, > > lagnärüòhe niçaanäthe lagnaräçidaçä vyathäm | > > jnnI ¬ezmaßaeit ipÇusaEoy< n iv*te. > > janané kleçamäpnoti pitrusaukhayaà na vidyate || > > Again you must have seen words like "Ashwaarudha"(One who is mounted on > a horse), which mean what I had conveyed. For usage of dictionary words > to denote something else in Jyotish, look at what is dictionary meaning > of Rasi,Kshetra,Gruha, Ruksha,Bha, Bhavan and then find out what is > meant by them in Jyotish. > Varaha mihira , after explaining that he is writing Brihatjatakam as > pupils get confused by the ancient texts says in the 4th shloka > "Raashayo Raashi Kshetragruharkshabhaani Bhavanam > ChaikaarthasampratyayaaH". He understood that pupils might try to take > dictionary meaning of words, for meanings accepted by tradition in > Jyotish. Therefore he specifically tells that all the foregoing mean one > and the same thing. Some even think that Rasi is not Varga, forgetting > what vargas are said to consist of shadvarga,saptajavarga etc. > About the logic that many people perceive one as mahatma and therefore > he must be Mahatma, I differ. There have been scores of Cults where the > followers and sometimes the world too thought the Cult Gurus(?) as > Saints. Had they not been expose , may be they would even today be > called as Greats. This dioes not make one Great from an Astrological > view point. If I need to give you a classic Indian Example, look at how > people Bihar perceive Lalooprasad Yadava and compare it with your > opinion of him. > I think this will help clarify your confusion. > Historical figures are seen through history that is written, but > remember that History is written by those who have one and got the > control of Government. You might like to look at what Aurangajeb's > historian wrote about Shivaji and compare it with what people ruled by > Shivaji thought about him. > Lagna and Arudha can never be the same as truth and even one's > perception of oneself differ. If we assume that the Great ones are > always truthful and correct, then think what the Mahatma thought he was > giving the people of India and what they got, in terms of political > morality. > Chandrashekhar. > > amolmandar wrote: > > > Respected Chandrashekharji > > > > Thanks for the detailed mail. I have some doubts remaining. Sir, why > > should we connect the word aarohana when not mentioned by the sages? > > Is it not correct to stick to the word used. The general perception > > of the word aaruDha might be different. It may be because of time > > that has gone between the scriptures written and present time. > > But when scriptures were written the word had only dictionary > > meanings. > > > > Moreover sir is it not the case of doing the reverse logic? First > > make the result and then find out the suitable reasons for that.( Sir > > please do not take it otherwise). Applying a word which has the > > meaning suitable to our logic would be doing injustice to the sages. > > > > It would be interesting to find out a word used in Jyotish with the > > meaning different than dictionary meaning. If there exits (I know > > since you have said it must be there) then is it required to put > > forward the correct meanings and reinterpret the shlokas correctly? > > > > Regarding the VedVyasa and Mahatma Gandhi I supposed I was not eble > > to express properly. What I wanted to focus was that popular identity > > of a person must be in tandem with the actual identity of the person. > > If a person is popularly known as Mahatma then actually he should be > > Mahatma. If it is not so then many problems on many fronts may crop > > up. Those who considered him as Mahatma and their intelligence would > > be questioned. The person who falsely becomes mahatma gets the credit > > of cheating people. Matahtma was Mahatma in the eyes of the people > > because he was Mahatma. The son and for that matter any other close > > relative (who became known as critic of Mahatma otherwise had no > > standings of his own) may have different opinion. That can not be > > considered as True or actual of Mahatma. There might be different > > individual opinions about any body including Mahatma.My point is that > > an un-deserving person may never get acknowledgements from the > > masses. There were so many leaders but only one Mahatma. > > > > Normal human being may not reveal about themselves but Mahatmas dont > > have anything to hide. In that case only Lagna and aaruDha can be > > same. That is why I said only fortunates will have actual(Lagna) and > > popular identity(aaruDha) same. > > > > I, in the flow of the thought process, find in crossing my limits I > > apologise for that. > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > Dear Amolmandar, > > > If you look at how Arudha Lagna or other Padas are calculated, why > > > Aarudha is to be interpreted as Mounted will be clear. The angle > > between > > > a planet and its house reflected on other side gets you the Arudha > > Lagna > > > and Padas. So the logic behind this appears to be reflection by the > > > planet on either side. This being the case, Aarudha has to be taken > > as > > > connected with Aarohana (To mount).It (the meaning) could well mean > > > outer layer as perceived. > > > It is said that meanings of words are to be taken based on custom > > in > > > relevant science where a possibility of two meanings for the same > > word > > > arises. In legal documents also trade terms override dictionary > > meaning. > > > I am no Pandita of Sanskrita, but think that the corect meaning > > would be > > > mounted. Analysing the intent it would mean outer layer. If we > > start > > > taking literal meanings per dictionary, many words would mean > > something > > > other than what they mean in Jyotish. Here the mounting means the > > > perception others might have about certain bhava activity of the > > Jataka. > > > About your question about Vedvyasa and Gandhi, find out what were > > > opinions of true form of Vedavyasa of the public when he was young > > and > > > what was known to Gods, similarly find out what was the opinion of > > > Gandhi's son about him and contrast it with the perception of > > public > > > like Us. The answer would be crystal clear. > > > This is precisely why Lagna and 7th house padas fall in 10th and > > 4th > > > house. The Sages knew that human beings do not reveal everything > > about > > > either themselves or their marital life. So others form opinion > > about > > > the Jataka from results of his Karma(10th) and about his marital > > bliss > > > from Sukha(4th House). You will also observe that Pada of 4th falls > > in > > > 4th house itself, for similar reasons. > > > If you go deeper in to Arudha scheme of things, then you will find > > that > > > certain yogas are said to be read from 7th arudha and the rishis > > further > > > enjoin one to read similar results from 2nd Arudha. The reason is > > that > > > 7th house persception is formed from Dhana and Kutumba of a person > > by > > > outsiders. > > > Of course these are my views and others might have different views. > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > amolmandar wrote: > > > > > > > Respected Chandrashekharji > > > > > > > > I understand that but when we say meaning literally we should take > > > > correct approch to it. The word Maya and Satya have been used to > > AL > > > > and L many times. Maya is popular and difficult to overcome and > > hence > > > > traditional. With this string it suits the meaning of the word > > > > aaruDha. Moreover if we take aaruDha as mounted then question > > arises > > > > what gets mounted who mounts it where and why?. One can > > not 'mount' > > > > oneself different for the public. It is the public that forms the > > > > opinion or mounts you. So we dont have any control over this > > mounting > > > > phenomenon. That is why I said it is popular identity which is > > always > > > > created by the public. It may be correct i.e. as you are(1st > > house or > > > > Lagna) or it may be something different(any other house) or even > > > > exactly opposite(7th house). Had it not been so how do we > > see,great > > > > men like Maharishi Valmiki and Vedvyasa? Or modern day Mahatma > > > > Gandhi? Does taht mean what ever we know about them is all aaruDha > > > > and their real identity is different? But BPHS says that 1st and > > 7th > > > > house can not be AL house? Why? Parashara can not be wrong. I > > must be > > > > wrong but where I am not getting. Either my premise is wrong and > > > > hence the inference. But at least to me and my little Sanskrit > > > > knowledge, my premise about aaruDha seems to be correct. In that > > case > > > > my inference should also be correct. > > > > > > > > I am sure you will solve this and clear my doubts astrologically > > and > > > > its social aspects as well. > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > Dear Amolmandar, > > > > > I agree with Parthaji. Look up what happens when Arudhapada > > falls > > > > in > > > > > 1st,4th and 7th. Again Aarudha could also mean mounted, which > > could > > > > in a > > > > > way show perception, is it not? > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Om namah Shivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Amol > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna and Arudha Lagna are never the same. This is a truth. > > There > > > > is > > > > > > no fortune involved in making them the same. they can never > > be the > > > > > > same, however hard one may try, > > > > > > regards > > > > > > partha > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "amolmandar" > > > > > > <amolmandar> wrote: > > > > > > > Dear Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you allow me to join this discussion..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think we should read it as AruDha or aaruDha. Literally > > ruDha > > > > > > means > > > > > > > popular or traditional and 'aa' prefix makes it more > > popular or > > > > > > more > > > > > > > traditional. The prefix 'a' to ruDha will make it opposite. > > > > aruDha > > > > > > > will be that is not popular.So aaruDha means morepopular or > > we > > > > can > > > > > > > say Maha-popular. That way aaruDha will make what is > > popularly > > > > > > known > > > > > > > about you. It need not be other than Satya. If you are > > fortunate > > > > > > > enough your Lagna(true identity) and Arudha Lagna (Popular > > > > identity) > > > > > > > will be same. All great persons should belong to that > > class. > > > > Both > > > > > > > identies are govern by satya i.e.you(Lagna) and hence > > Lagna is > > > > > > more > > > > > > > important. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > After all we say satyam eva jayate! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In vedic astrology, "Shailesh Chadha" > > > > > > <scc@s...> > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha, > > > > > > > > May I join in this discussion? > > > > > > > > If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis-à- vis > > our > > > > > > > > understanding of a jataka, the confusion about Arudha > > Padas > > > > will > > > > > > > > dissolve to a great extent. > > > > > > > > "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - that > > which > > > > > > > relates to > > > > > > > > "Atma" and "Parmatma" . > > > > > > > > This material world is in fact "maya" - an illusion, but > > we > > > > treat > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules > > of "satya" to > > > > it. > > > > > > > > Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this world > > > > of "maya" > > > > > > and, > > > > > > > > hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are more > > relevant > > > > to > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > material existence. > > > > > > > > Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana-arudha, > > Gaja- > > > > > > arudha, > > > > > > > > etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level". > > > > > > > > So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made by the > > > > > > > individual > > > > > > > > (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards achieving > > the > > > > > > highest > > > > > > > > ability/ perfection. > > > > > > > > Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood > > > > as "manifestation" or > > > > > > > > "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I think we > > will > > > > be > > > > > > > able to > > > > > > > > better appreciate this concept of "arudha". > > > > > > > > Of course, this is only as per my understanding - > > hopefully, > > > > > > Gurus > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > seniors will correct, or confirm, it. > > > > > > > > Regards & best wishes, > > > > > > > > Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5] > > > > > > > > Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PM > > > > > > > > To: vedic astrology > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear > > > > chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Namah SHivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have a habit of saving all important messages by the > > various > > > > > > > gurus > > > > > > > > and learned members. I have around 50 MB material just by > > this > > > > > > work > > > > > > > > (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the old > > message > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > your perusal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > """"""----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > > > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > > > > > > > > To: vedic astrology > > > > > > > > Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Imran, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The concept of Arudha of different houses beautifully > > > > eloborates > > > > > > > > the difference between reality(Satya) and perception > > (Maya). > > > > Sage > > > > > > > > Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat and > > > > tackle > > > > > > > these > > > > > > > > Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold > > specific > > > > > > > > posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas > > collectively, > > > > > > thus > > > > > > > > require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa and > > > > > > vorgottama > > > > > > > > of Arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. For > > > > example in > > > > > > > > case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in Scorpio > > (9th > > > > from > > > > > > > > lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) is > > to be > > > > > > > > assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and 10th > > > > lords, > > > > > > > > Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with > > respect of > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > > position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in chart > > of > > > > Dalai > > > > > > > > Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th from > > > > lagna. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association > > (sambndha) > > > > with > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > help of rashi aspect? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead of > > > > lagan? or > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields > > > > > > satisfactory > > > > > > > > results at a certain level. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imran > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You are on the right track and Visti has nicely addressed > > the > > > > > > > points > > > > > > > > in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the > > > > > > > activity/things > > > > > > > > shown by the houses. My communication skills are not > > > > a "tangible > > > > > > > > thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises out > > of my > > > > > > > > communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house shows my > > > > > > > > communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this mail > > > > > > (tangible). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), they > > are > > > > the > > > > > > > > only tangible things - the only reality - in this material > > > > world! > > > > > > > > They are very important. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) > > together in > > > > D- > > > > > > 10, > > > > > > > > be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing them > > > > will > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > great. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. > > However, > > > > note > > > > > > > > that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are different > > > > from > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > rules of the world of maya (illusion). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's > > > > interactions. > > > > > > It > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed house of > > kama > > > > > > > > trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) and > > the > > > > > > > > intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc (shaping > > of > > > > > > desire > > > > > > > > and working on the desire) and the culmination house > > (11th) > > > > shows > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th house > > shows > > > > > > > > dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. While > > the > > > > > > seed > > > > > > > > house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the > > > > intermediate > > > > > > > > house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), the > > > > > > culmination > > > > > > > > house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall duty). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the world of > > > > maya, > > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > the meanings are different. In the world of truth, > > shaping of > > > > > > > desire > > > > > > > > and working on the desires happens through interactions > > and > > > > > > finally > > > > > > > > leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. But > > the > > > > > > world > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the > > world of > > > > > > > maya, > > > > > > > > shaping of desire and working on the desire happens only > > thru > > > > > > > > domination and the results are only material gains. So > > the 7th > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and > > > > domination. > > > > > > > The > > > > > > > > 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include > > > > > > religiousness, > > > > > > > > righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma > > (duty) - > > > > > > > protect > > > > > > > > itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about > > > > protecting > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > status and image. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which > > > > trikona it > > > > > > > > belongs to and whether it is the seed house, intermediate > > > > house > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > the culmination house of that trikona) is constant for all > > > > > > > > references. But building the meaning further based on the > > > > axioms > > > > > > > > requires an understanding of the two worlds - world of > > satya > > > > and > > > > > > > > world of maya. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish Workshop" > > and > > > > the > > > > > > CD > > > > > > > > will be available for buying online in a day or two at > > most. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa > > > > > > > > interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana dasa > > > > that is > > > > > > > > computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the > > > > changing > > > > > > > > impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the resulting > > > > luck) > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana > > Dasa" by > > > > Pt. > > > > > > > > Sanjay Rath. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa > > interpretation, > > > > but > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition to > > > > transits > > > > > > > > from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits from > > natal > > > > > > arudha > > > > > > > > lagna! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, again, different rules may apply in the case of > > > > arudha > > > > > > > > lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma from > > > > Moon or > > > > > > > > lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter loves > > dharma. > > > > > > > > However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha > > lagna, the > > > > > > wise > > > > > > > > teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the rules > > of the > > > > > > > world > > > > > > > > of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a shallow > > > > dharma > > > > > > > > (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So > > there > > > > will > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > material setbacks and the illusion is broken. However, if > > > > Jupiter > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal chart > > > > also, > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > negative results may be mitigated. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally > > > > different > > > > > > > > worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one > > > > understands > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha > > lagna. > > > > Try > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > give it some thought. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck with > > > > your > > > > > > > > arudha pada studies! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > May Jupiter's light shine on us, > > > > > > > > Narasimha""""""" > > > > > > > > """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic- astrology, "Chandrashekhar > > > > Sharma" > > > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Dear Partha, > > > > > > > > > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I > > > > indicated > > > > > > > (About > > > > > > > > pada > > > > > > > > > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji says > > > > > > verbatim " > > > > > > > > > Use of arudha lagna > > > > > > > > > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha > > lagna is > > > > > > maya > > > > > > > > peetha or > > > > > > > > > the seat of > > > > > > > > > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for > > different > > > > > > shades > > > > > > > > of self. > > > > > > > > > Lagna stands for > > > > > > > > > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived self. > > Arudha > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > > stands > > > > > > > > > for "self, as > > > > > > > > > peceived by this maya world". > > > > > > > > > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to > > comment. > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------Original Message------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > > > > > > > > > To: vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse - > > > > dear Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this world > > of > > > > Maya. > > > > > > > > This > > > > > > > > > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages. > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic- astrology, "Chandrashekhar > > > > Sharma" > > > > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Hari, > > > > > > > > > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are > > perception of > > > > what > > > > > > > > > people think > > > > > > > > > > about one, this is the only logical inference. > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------Original Message------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > > > > > > > > > To: vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > Subject: [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the > > spouse - > > > > dear > > > > > > Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with the > > > > > > > > consummation > > > > > > > > > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it correct? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic- astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ........ May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > > Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of Groups is subject to the > > Terms > > > > of > > > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic- astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ........ May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu > > || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the > > Terms of > > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > > > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system > > (http://www.grisoft.com). <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: > > > > 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system > > (http://www.grisoft.com). <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: > > > > 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > <http://rd./M=249982.3512844.4795476.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 > > > > > > 05082686:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o72ctft/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi- > > > > bin/autoredir?camp=556&lineid=3512844∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ........ > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of > > > > Service > > > > > > <>. > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > <http://rd./M=249982.3512844.4795476.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 > > 05082686:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o72ctft/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi- > > bin/autoredir?camp=556&lineid=3512844∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > ....... 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Guest guest Posted July 8, 2003 Report Share Posted July 8, 2003 Respected Chandrashekharji With all respects, I wanted to draw your attention to the fact that initially only I stated that it should be treated as aaruDhaLagna. Hence my point is proved which you did not appriciate. I reapeat from my last mail for your kind considerations. > > 1)LagnaaaruDhe nishanathe ----> assuming that context is of aaruDha > > lagna and the author has uesd it as aaruDhaLagna to adjust the > > metre,in that case it means aaruDha Lagna. So meaning becomes aaruDha > > Lagna and Moon together. Here we can not consider Chandra mounting or > > mounted on Lagna. Sir I repeat, it is not chandra mounted or mounting in lagna nor it is lagna being mounted, rather it is aaruDhaLagna and moon together.Togetherness of Al and Moon is because of Saptami vibakti and not because of aaruDha word. As I was not aware of the author and the context,I gave you all the possible meanings (Sadly you took only the wrong one).If it is indeed aaruDhalagna that means it is not something aaruDha on Lagna or lanaga getting aaruDha as assumed (by many in the list). LagnaruDhe is one term and here aaruDha word is indicative of adjective and hence my analysis is correct that it must describe more about lagna and no action is involved. That is why it must be popular lagna i.e popular identity. I have as well given other shlokas from BPHS where again aaruDha is used likewise. Varahamihira has given some words to mean same, like wise we should have similar list for the other word as well. Since dictionary meaning is at times different of the word listed for the Rasi it was necessary for sages to clear confusion. That is why explicit mention of the words. This as well means that other words should be taken as per the dictionary. If we allow non-dictionary meanings or popular or present day meanings to the words then we may land up in more problems and in each Yuga different interpretations of the same shlokas can be done. Therefore, I dont think Varahamihira has given considerations, by explicitly mentioning similar words for a word,to attach suitable meanings to the other words. On the contrary we must appriciate our sage's particularness about the dictionay meanings. Yes I agree that Sanskrit has undergone lot many changes but that does not eliminate the importance of dictionary. Thanks a lot for your Time and Sapce. AmolMandar vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma <boxdel> wrote: > Dear Amolmandar, > The meaning of the shloka as given by the commentator , more at ease > with sanskrita than either of Us(Professor of Sanskrit at Varanashi > Hindu University), is when Chandra is placed in the rasi of > Aarudhalagna then.... etc. Therefore your translation that lagnaarudhe > should mean Traditional Lagna appears to be faulty. If we take your > translation to be correct then placement of Chandra in Lagna indicating > trouble to mother and not giving pitru sukha would be against all > tenets of Jyotisha > It is interesting to note that you had stated that other than dictionary > words are niot used in Jyotish, but failed to comment on the symonyms > given in Brihatjatakam of Varhamihira for Rasi that I quoted. > As I remember, Sanskrit has undergone a lot of change from ancient > times till modern day. This I have on authority of a Professor of > Linguistics, who himself is a Sanskrita Pandita, and happens to be very > well known to me. The Jyotish texts were written in times bygone and > this has to be kept in mind while interpreting the texts. Try to think > why more than 6 known commentators including those of the time near to > Varahamihira have interpreted shlokas of Varahamihira's Brihatjataka > containing about 400 shlokas, and needed to comment on it at length. > Chandrashekhar. > > amolmandar wrote: > > > Respected Chandrashekharji > > > > According to what little bit grammer I understand of Sanskrit,I > > analysed the first line of the above shloka as this. The word > > lagnaruDha is not used here as verb. For that matter in Lagna+aauDha > > here as well it is not used as verb. Had it been so we would not have > > formed Saptami of that. Since we are using Saptami(LagnaruDhe) it is > > signifactor of the action (Kriya Karana). That is the place where the > > action is performed. Moreover as Chandra too is a reason for the > > action it is as well used in Saptami(nishanathe). This is Sati- > > Saptami. The action is explained in the next line. But the point is > > that the lagnaruDhe is not used here as verb so we can conclude it > > (depending on the context) that aaruDhalagna when contains chandra > > problems occur as mentioned in 2nd line (I have some doubt with 2nd > > line). > > > > Secondly if consider as lagnaruDhenishanathe we understand it as > > ascending chandra in the Lagna creates problems.. Here again chandra > > is not 'aaruDha' in Lagna. That is it is not mounted, rather aaruDha > > is used here as adjective to indicate the state of the chandra. So it > > says that the ascending/growing/popular moon (from amavays to > > poorneema) if present in Lagna creates problems. Chandra is in Lagna > > is indicated by the Spatami Vibhakti the aaruDha word has nothing to > > do with that. It is not chandra mounted in Lagna creates problems.To > > make the matter more complicated we can take aaruDhenishanathe as > > completion of the aaruDha(ascending or most popular moon) to > > indicate the state of the moon as poorneema only. > > > > So all in all we get three different meanings of the first line of > > the shhloka > > > > 1)LagnaaaruDhe nishanathe ----> assuming that context is of aaruDha > > lagna and the author has uesd it as aaruDhaLagna to adjust the > > metre,in that case it means aaruDha Lagna. So meaning becomes aaruDha > > Lagna and Moon together. Here we can not consider Chandra mounting or > > mounted on Lagna. > > 2)LagnaruDhenishanathe -----> Ascending/Growing/popular Chandra in > > the Lagna. Here as well chandra is not mounted in/on Lagna. > > 3)lagnaruDhenishanathe -----> As completion of the aaction ascending > > hence state of the Chandra as in the state of poorneema. That is full > > moon in the Lagna. Here as well Nothing is mounted in/on Lagna. > > > > So we find that every time it is used as adjective or noun or kriya > > karan. To support my argument let me quote the first word of first > > line of some of the shlokas of padhadhya for BPHS.shloka 14 begins > > with padasthanatvyaye i.e. padasthanat is panchami it means from > > padasthana vyaye is saptami i.e. in 12th house. Hence it means from > > padasthana in the 12th house. Shloka no 20 begins with aaruDhat i.e. > > panchami again,saptame again saptami. Hence from padasthana in the > > 7th house. > > > > All such shlokas are considering the aaruDha or pada as adjective or > > noun or Karana for kriya. > > > > Hence it is not considered here as Kiryapada or verb. That is why I > > apply the yaskacharya nirukta to get the meaning of the word. When > > we use aaruDha as kriyapada then possibly we can used the meaing as > > mounted but not in this case. That is why aarohana is not applicable > > in this case. > > > > To continue to the second line, there are two verbs used and in my > > opinion are not in tandem. The first verb is aapnoti indicates to > > obtain. Hence Janani(Mother) Klesham (pain) aapnoti (obtaines). Hence > > the meaning of first part of the second line is Mother obtains pains > > or sufferings. Now the second part of the second line is little bit > > doubtful. It uses the verb vidyate. Vidyate means to be. So meaning > > is The jatak does not get pitru saukhaya. Here the first part says > > that mother does get pain but in the next part it says that Jatak > > does not get pitasukha. It should have been, pitasaukhayam na > > vindyante. This way now it becomes pita will not get saukhyam. So > > ultimatly we would mean, mother gets troubles and father as well gets > > problems. > > > > That is why, the SandhiVigraha of aaruDha is done as aa > > (all,encompasing)+ ruDha(traditional or pupular) as adjective. So > > that gives Lagna as real identity and aaruDha Lagna as popular > > identity. That is why I say for mahatmas it must be same. Since the > > lenght of the mail is incresing and it would be difficult for me to > > handle several issues at a time I request you to clear my doubts till > > this point. Once we agree on this much then possibly we can go in > > the later part i.e. regarding mahatmas. > > > > I again request you to pardon me if you feel that I have crossed my > > limits. > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > AmolMandar > > > > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > Dear Amolmandar, > > > I think the confusion is on account of the fact that you have not > > read > > > shlokas about Arudha Lagna. Read below text and tell me whether it > > means > > > Traditional(Rudha) Lagna. > > > > > > l¶aêFe inzanawe l¶raizdza Vywam!, > > > > > > lagnärüòhe niçaanäthe lagnaräçidaçä vyathäm | > > > > > > jnnI ¬ezmaßaeit ipÇusaEoy< n iv*te. > > > > > > janané kleçamäpnoti pitrusaukhayaà na vidyate || > > > > > > Again you must have seen words like "Ashwaarudha"(One who is > > mounted on > > > a horse), which mean what I had conveyed. For usage of dictionary > > words > > > to denote something else in Jyotish, look at what is dictionary > > meaning > > > of Rasi,Kshetra,Gruha, Ruksha,Bha, Bhavan and then find out what is > > > meant by them in Jyotish. > > > Varaha mihira , after explaining that he is writing Brihatjatakam > > as > > > pupils get confused by the ancient texts says in the 4th shloka > > > "Raashayo Raashi Kshetragruharkshabhaani Bhavanam > > > ChaikaarthasampratyayaaH". He understood that pupils might try to > > take > > > dictionary meaning of words, for meanings accepted by tradition in > > > Jyotish. Therefore he specifically tells that all the foregoing > > mean one > > > and the same thing. Some even think that Rasi is not Varga, > > forgetting > > > what vargas are said to consist of shadvarga,saptajavarga etc. > > > About the logic that many people perceive one as mahatma and > > therefore > > > he must be Mahatma, I differ. There have been scores of Cults where > > the > > > followers and sometimes the world too thought the Cult Gurus(?) as > > > Saints. Had they not been expose , may be they would even today be > > > called as Greats. This dioes not make one Great from an > > Astrological > > > view point. If I need to give you a classic Indian Example, look at > > how > > > people Bihar perceive Lalooprasad Yadava and compare it with your > > > opinion of him. > > > I think this will help clarify your confusion. > > > Historical figures are seen through history that is written, but > > > remember that History is written by those who have one and got the > > > control of Government. You might like to look at what Aurangajeb's > > > historian wrote about Shivaji and compare it with what people ruled > > by > > > Shivaji thought about him. > > > Lagna and Arudha can never be the same as truth and even one's > > > perception of oneself differ. If we assume that the Great ones are > > > always truthful and correct, then think what the Mahatma thought he > > was > > > giving the people of India and what they got, in terms of > > political > > > morality. > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > amolmandar wrote: > > > > > > > Respected Chandrashekharji > > > > > > > > Thanks for the detailed mail. I have some doubts remaining. Sir, > > why > > > > should we connect the word aarohana when not mentioned by the > > sages? > > > > Is it not correct to stick to the word used. The general > > perception > > > > of the word aaruDha might be different. It may be because of time > > > > that has gone between the scriptures written and present time. > > > > But when scriptures were written the word had only dictionary > > > > meanings. > > > > > > > > Moreover sir is it not the case of doing the reverse logic? First > > > > make the result and then find out the suitable reasons for that.( > > Sir > > > > please do not take it otherwise). Applying a word which has the > > > > meaning suitable to our logic would be doing injustice to the > > sages. > > > > > > > > It would be interesting to find out a word used in Jyotish with > > the > > > > meaning different than dictionary meaning. If there exits (I know > > > > since you have said it must be there) then is it required to put > > > > forward the correct meanings and reinterpret the shlokas > > correctly? > > > > > > > > Regarding the VedVyasa and Mahatma Gandhi I supposed I was not > > eble > > > > to express properly. What I wanted to focus was that popular > > identity > > > > of a person must be in tandem with the actual identity of the > > person. > > > > If a person is popularly known as Mahatma then actually he should > > be > > > > Mahatma. If it is not so then many problems on many fronts may > > crop > > > > up. Those who considered him as Mahatma and their intelligence > > would > > > > be questioned. The person who falsely becomes mahatma gets the > > credit > > > > of cheating people. Matahtma was Mahatma in the eyes of the people > > > > because he was Mahatma. The son and for that matter any other > > close > > > > relative (who became known as critic of Mahatma otherwise had no > > > > standings of his own) may have different opinion. That can not be > > > > considered as True or actual of Mahatma. There might be different > > > > individual opinions about any body including Mahatma.My point is > > that > > > > an un-deserving person may never get acknowledgements from the > > > > masses. There were so many leaders but only one Mahatma. > > > > > > > > Normal human being may not reveal about themselves but Mahatmas > > dont > > > > have anything to hide. In that case only Lagna and aaruDha can be > > > > same. That is why I said only fortunates will have actual (Lagna) > > and > > > > popular identity(aaruDha) same. > > > > > > > > I, in the flow of the thought process, find in crossing my > > limits I > > > > apologise for that. > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > Dear Amolmandar, > > > > > If you look at how Arudha Lagna or other Padas are calculated, > > why > > > > > Aarudha is to be interpreted as Mounted will be clear. The angle > > > > between > > > > > a planet and its house reflected on other side gets you the > > Arudha > > > > Lagna > > > > > and Padas. So the logic behind this appears to be reflection by > > the > > > > > planet on either side. This being the case, Aarudha has to be > > taken > > > > as > > > > > connected with Aarohana (To mount).It (the meaning) could well > > mean > > > > > outer layer as perceived. > > > > > It is said that meanings of words are to be taken based on > > custom > > > > in > > > > > relevant science where a possibility of two meanings for the > > same > > > > word > > > > > arises. In legal documents also trade terms override dictionary > > > > meaning. > > > > > I am no Pandita of Sanskrita, but think that the corect meaning > > > > would be > > > > > mounted. Analysing the intent it would mean outer layer. If we > > > > start > > > > > taking literal meanings per dictionary, many words would mean > > > > something > > > > > other than what they mean in Jyotish. Here the mounting means > > the > > > > > perception others might have about certain bhava activity of > > the > > > > Jataka. > > > > > About your question about Vedvyasa and Gandhi, find out what > > were > > > > > opinions of true form of Vedavyasa of the public when he was > > young > > > > and > > > > > what was known to Gods, similarly find out what was the opinion > > of > > > > > Gandhi's son about him and contrast it with the perception of > > > > public > > > > > like Us. The answer would be crystal clear. > > > > > This is precisely why Lagna and 7th house padas fall in 10th and > > > > 4th > > > > > house. The Sages knew that human beings do not reveal everything > > > > about > > > > > either themselves or their marital life. So others form opinion > > > > about > > > > > the Jataka from results of his Karma(10th) and about his marital > > > > bliss > > > > > from Sukha(4th House). You will also observe that Pada of 4th > > falls > > > > in > > > > > 4th house itself, for similar reasons. > > > > > If you go deeper in to Arudha scheme of things, then you will > > find > > > > that > > > > > certain yogas are said to be read from 7th arudha and the rishis > > > > further > > > > > enjoin one to read similar results from 2nd Arudha. The reason > > is > > > > that > > > > > 7th house persception is formed from Dhana and Kutumba of a > > person > > > > by > > > > > outsiders. > > > > > Of course these are my views and others might have different > > views. > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > amolmandar wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Chandrashekharji > > > > > > > > > > > > I understand that but when we say meaning literally we should > > take > > > > > > correct approch to it. The word Maya and Satya have been used > > to > > > > AL > > > > > > and L many times. Maya is popular and difficult to overcome > > and > > > > hence > > > > > > traditional. With this string it suits the meaning of the word > > > > > > aaruDha. Moreover if we take aaruDha as mounted then question > > > > arises > > > > > > what gets mounted who mounts it where and why?. One can > > > > not 'mount' > > > > > > oneself different for the public. It is the public that forms > > the > > > > > > opinion or mounts you. So we dont have any control over this > > > > mounting > > > > > > phenomenon. That is why I said it is popular identity which is > > > > always > > > > > > created by the public. It may be correct i.e. as you are (1st > > > > house or > > > > > > Lagna) or it may be something different(any other house) or > > even > > > > > > exactly opposite(7th house). Had it not been so how do we > > > > see,great > > > > > > men like Maharishi Valmiki and Vedvyasa? Or modern day Mahatma > > > > > > Gandhi? Does taht mean what ever we know about them is all > > aaruDha > > > > > > and their real identity is different? But BPHS says that 1st > > and > > > > 7th > > > > > > house can not be AL house? Why? Parashara can not be wrong. I > > > > must be > > > > > > wrong but where I am not getting. Either my premise is wrong > > and > > > > > > hence the inference. But at least to me and my little Sanskrit > > > > > > knowledge, my premise about aaruDha seems to be correct. In > > that > > > > case > > > > > > my inference should also be correct. > > > > > > > > > > > > I am sure you will solve this and clear my doubts > > astrologically > > > > and > > > > > > its social aspects as well. > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Chandrashekhar Sharma > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > Dear Amolmandar, > > > > > > > I agree with Parthaji. Look up what happens when Arudhapada > > > > falls > > > > > > in > > > > > > > 1st,4th and 7th. Again Aarudha could also mean mounted, > > which > > > > could > > > > > > in a > > > > > > > way show perception, is it not? > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om namah Shivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Amol > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna and Arudha Lagna are never the same. This is a > > truth. > > > > There > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > no fortune involved in making them the same. they can > > never > > > > be the > > > > > > > > same, however hard one may try, > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "amolmandar" > > > > > > > > <amolmandar> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Dear Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you allow me to join this discussion..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think we should read it as AruDha or aaruDha. > > Literally > > > > ruDha > > > > > > > > means > > > > > > > > > popular or traditional and 'aa' prefix makes it more > > > > popular or > > > > > > > > more > > > > > > > > > traditional. The prefix 'a' to ruDha will make it > > opposite. > > > > > > aruDha > > > > > > > > > will be that is not popular.So aaruDha means > > morepopular or > > > > we > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > say Maha-popular. That way aaruDha will make what is > > > > popularly > > > > > > > > known > > > > > > > > > about you. It need not be other than Satya. If you are > > > > fortunate > > > > > > > > > enough your Lagna(true identity) and Arudha Lagna > > (Popular > > > > > > identity) > > > > > > > > > will be same. All great persons should belong to that > > > > class. > > > > > > Both > > > > > > > > > identies are govern by satya i.e.you(Lagna) and hence > > > > Lagna is > > > > > > > > more > > > > > > > > > important. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > After all we say satyam eva jayate! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AmolMandar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Shailesh > > Chadha" > > > > > > > > <scc@s...> > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha, > > > > > > > > > > May I join in this discussion? > > > > > > > > > > If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis- à- > > vis > > > > our > > > > > > > > > > understanding of a jataka, the confusion about Arudha > > > > Padas > > > > > > will > > > > > > > > > > dissolve to a great extent. > > > > > > > > > > "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - > > that > > > > which > > > > > > > > > relates to > > > > > > > > > > "Atma" and "Parmatma" . > > > > > > > > > > This material world is in fact "maya" - an illusion, > > but > > > > we > > > > > > treat > > > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > > world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules > > > > of "satya" to > > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this world > > > > > > of "maya" > > > > > > > > and, > > > > > > > > > > hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are more > > > > relevant > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > > material existence. > > > > > > > > > > Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana- arudha, > > > > Gaja- > > > > > > > > arudha, > > > > > > > > > > etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level". > > > > > > > > > > So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made > > by the > > > > > > > > > individual > > > > > > > > > > (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards > > achieving > > > > the > > > > > > > > highest > > > > > > > > > > ability/ perfection. > > > > > > > > > > Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood > > > > > > as "manifestation" or > > > > > > > > > > "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I think > > we > > > > will > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > able to > > > > > > > > > > better appreciate this concept of "arudha". > > > > > > > > > > Of course, this is only as per my understanding - > > > > hopefully, > > > > > > > > Gurus > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > seniors will correct, or confirm, it. > > > > > > > > > > Regards & best wishes, > > > > > > > > > > Shailesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5] > > > > > > > > > > Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PM > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear > > > > > > chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Namah SHivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have a habit of saving all important messages by the > > > > various > > > > > > > > > gurus > > > > > > > > > > and learned members. I have around 50 MB material > > just by > > > > this > > > > > > > > work > > > > > > > > > > (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the old > > > > message > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > your perusal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > """"""- > > > > > > > > > > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM > > > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Imran, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The concept of Arudha of different houses > > beautifully > > > > > > eloborates > > > > > > > > > > the difference between reality(Satya) and perception > > > > (Maya). > > > > > > Sage > > > > > > > > > > Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat > > and > > > > > > tackle > > > > > > > > > these > > > > > > > > > > Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold > > > > specific > > > > > > > > > > posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas > > > > collectively, > > > > > > > > thus > > > > > > > > > > require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa > > and > > > > > > > > vorgottama > > > > > > > > > > of Arudhas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. > > For > > > > > > example in > > > > > > > > > > case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in > > Scorpio > > > > (9th > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > > lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) > > is > > > > to be > > > > > > > > > > assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and > > 10th > > > > > > lords, > > > > > > > > > > Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with > > > > respect of > > > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > > > > position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in > > chart > > > > of > > > > > > Dalai > > > > > > > > > > Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th > > from > > > > > > lagna. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association > > > > (sambndha) > > > > > > with > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > help of rashi aspect? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead > > of > > > > > > lagan? or > > > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields > > > > > > > > satisfactory > > > > > > > > > > results at a certain level. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imran > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You are on the right track and Visti has nicely > > addressed > > > > the > > > > > > > > > points > > > > > > > > > > in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the > > > > > > > > > activity/things > > > > > > > > > > shown by the houses. My communication skills are not > > > > > > a "tangible > > > > > > > > > > thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises > > out > > > > of my > > > > > > > > > > communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house > > shows my > > > > > > > > > > communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this > > mail > > > > > > > > (tangible). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), > > they > > > > are > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > only tangible things - the only reality - in this > > material > > > > > > world! > > > > > > > > > > They are very important. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) > > > > together in > > > > > > D- > > > > > > > > 10, > > > > > > > > > > be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing > > them > > > > > > will > > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > > great. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. > > > > However, > > > > > > note > > > > > > > > > > that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are > > different > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > rules of the world of maya (illusion). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's > > > > > > interactions. > > > > > > > > It > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed > > house of > > > > kama > > > > > > > > > > trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) > > and > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc > > (shaping > > > > of > > > > > > > > desire > > > > > > > > > > and working on the desire) and the culmination house > > > > (11th) > > > > > > shows > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th > > house > > > > shows > > > > > > > > > > dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. > > While > > > > the > > > > > > > > seed > > > > > > > > > > house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the > > > > > > intermediate > > > > > > > > > > house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), > > the > > > > > > > > culmination > > > > > > > > > > house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall > > duty). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the > > world of > > > > > > maya, > > > > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > > > the meanings are different. In the world of truth, > > > > shaping of > > > > > > > > > desire > > > > > > > > > > and working on the desires happens through > > interactions > > > > and > > > > > > > > finally > > > > > > > > > > leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. > > But > > > > the > > > > > > > > world > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the > > > > world of > > > > > > > > > maya, > > > > > > > > > > shaping of desire and working on the desire happens > > only > > > > thru > > > > > > > > > > domination and the results are only material gains. So > > > > the 7th > > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > > arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and > > > > > > domination. > > > > > > > > > The > > > > > > > > > > 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include > > > > > > > > religiousness, > > > > > > > > > > righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma > > > > (duty) - > > > > > > > > > protect > > > > > > > > > > itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about > > > > > > protecting > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > status and image. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which > > > > > > trikona it > > > > > > > > > > belongs to and whether it is the seed house, > > intermediate > > > > > > house > > > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > the culmination house of that trikona) is constant > > for all > > > > > > > > > > references. But building the meaning further based on > > the > > > > > > axioms > > > > > > > > > > requires an understanding of the two worlds - world of > > > > satya > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > world of maya. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish > > Workshop" > > > > and > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > CD > > > > > > > > > > will be available for buying online in a day or two at > > > > most. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa > > > > > > > > > > interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana > > dasa > > > > > > that is > > > > > > > > > > computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the > > > > > > changing > > > > > > > > > > impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the > > resulting > > > > > > luck) > > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > > one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana > > > > Dasa" by > > > > > > Pt. > > > > > > > > > > Sanjay Rath. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa > > > > interpretation, > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > > can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition > > to > > > > > > transits > > > > > > > > > > from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits from > > > > natal > > > > > > > > arudha > > > > > > > > > > lagna! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, again, different rules may apply in the case > > of > > > > > > arudha > > > > > > > > > > lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma > > from > > > > > > Moon or > > > > > > > > > > lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter loves > > > > dharma. > > > > > > > > > > However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha > > > > lagna, the > > > > > > > > wise > > > > > > > > > > teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the > > rules > > > > of the > > > > > > > > > world > > > > > > > > > > of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a > > shallow > > > > > > dharma > > > > > > > > > > (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So > > > > there > > > > > > will > > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > > material setbacks and the illusion is broken. > > However, if > > > > > > Jupiter > > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal > > chart > > > > > > also, > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > negative results may be mitigated. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally > > > > > > different > > > > > > > > > > worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one > > > > > > understands > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha > > > > lagna. > > > > > > Try > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > give it some thought. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck > > with > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > > arudha pada studies! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > May Jupiter's light shine on us, > > > > > > > > > > Narasimha""""""" > > > > > > > > > > > > """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic- > > astrology, "Chandrashekhar > > > > > > Sharma" > > > > > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Partha, > > > > > > > > > > > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I > > > > > > indicated > > > > > > > > > (About > > > > > > > > > > pada > > > > > > > > > > > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji > > says > > > > > > > > verbatim " > > > > > > > > > > > Use of arudha lagna > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha > > > > lagna is > > > > > > > > maya > > > > > > > > > > peetha or > > > > > > > > > > > the seat of > > > > > > > > > > > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for > > > > different > > > > > > > > shades > > > > > > > > > > of self. > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna stands for > > > > > > > > > > > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived > > self. > > > > Arudha > > > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > > > > stands > > > > > > > > > > > for "self, as > > > > > > > > > > > peceived by this maya world". > > > > > > > > > > > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to > > > > comment. > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the > > spouse - > > > > > > dear Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this > > world > > > > of > > > > > > Maya. > > > > > > > > > > This > > > > > > > > > > > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages. > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic- > > astrology, "Chandrashekhar > > > > > > Sharma" > > > > > > > > > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Hari, > > > > > > > > > > > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are > > > > perception of > > > > > > what > > > > > > > > > > > people think > > > > > > > > > > > > about one, this is the only logical inference. > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the > > > > spouse - > > > > > > dear > > > > > > > > Anu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with > > the > > > > > > > > > > consummation > > > > > > > > > > > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it > > correct? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > > > Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic- > > astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ........ May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > > > > Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the > > > > Terms > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic- > > astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > > Krishnaarpanamastu > > > > || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the > > > > Terms of > > > > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic- astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > > Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > > > > > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system > > > > (http://www.grisoft.com). <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: > > > > > > 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > > > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system > > > > (http://www.grisoft.com). <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > > <http://www.grisoft.com%29.> > > > > > > > > > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: > > > > > > 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <http://rd./M=249982.3512844.4795476.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 > > > > > > > > > > > > 05082686:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o72ctft/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi- > > > > > > bin/autoredir? camp=556&lineid=3512844∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms > > of > > > > > > Service > > > > > > > > <>. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > <http://rd./M=249982.3512844.4795476.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 > > > > > > 05082686:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o72ctft/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi- > > > > bin/autoredir?camp=556&lineid=3512844∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > > > Service > > > > > > <>. > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > <http://rd./M=244522.3512152.4794593.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 > > 05082686:HM/A=1595056/R=0/SIG=124bf4lrb/*http://ashnin.com/clk/muryuta > > itakenattogyo?YH=3512152&yhad=1595056> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > Service > > > > <>. > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > <http://rd./M=244522.3512152.4794593.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17 05082686:HM/A=1595053/R=0/SIG=1245der9k/*http://ashnin.com/clk/muryuta itakenattogyo?YH=3512152&yhad=1595053> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > Terms of Service > > <>. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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