Guest guest Posted April 19, 2003 Report Share Posted April 19, 2003 Thanks for your comments. I have my difference of opinion regarding KP (Even for lal kitab, but that I don't want to discuss here). It seems that KP has taken some other path than vedic astrology but if you go through this system, you will find parahsari jyotish in the heart. I see four major differences from parashari astrology - 1. Use of Placidus system of house division (western one) 2. User of SUB theory 3. Giving more importance to Naksharta. Saying that planet gives the result of nakshatra in which it is situated. 4. Differenct ayanamsa (but no one know which ayanamsa was used by Parashara himself) >From above you can see the 2,3 and 4 and based more or less on vedic astrology. SUB theory is devised from Vimshottari Dasha system as it is. The same division has been used. The same is for Nakshatra, some nadi author also give importance to nakshatra this way. And as you said that there is lack of concensus even among vedic astrologers for ayanamsas. Only the point 1 (i.e. the house division system) does not match with vedic astrology. Although I don't say that I have sufficient knowledge for discussing this topic but in my opinion even KP should be part of vedic astrology. Even I have no intention to hurt anyone. We must keep inventing and improving astrology, if it is possible. If we will oppose KP, It will be just like scientists opposing astrology without trying to understand it. Even some vedic astrologers are using principles similar to KP in some way or other to improve predicitons. In my opinion KP with divisional charts and some more dasas might become next step in astrology. And it is only possible if we will first open ourselves for discussion on non-vedic sounding systems of astrology. It will be good for discussion if we will get opinion of all Gurus. I also want to know whether anything build/developed/invented on the foundation of vedic astrology can be called vedic astrology or not? Thanks & Regards,Punit PandeyVisti Larsen <vishnu (AT) lbq (DOT) dk> wrote: Hare Rama Krishna ----------------------- Dear Punit, It is all vedic astrology, however even within vedic astrology, the Jyotishis have a mind of their own. Those who follow Parasari strictly understand that the nodes must always be mean, and not true, to fulfill the duty assigned to them, hence by implication of this, one uses mean nodes. But yet some people do not follow this. As for ayanamsa, the reason for lack of consensus is lack of valid research. Some oppine an ayanamsa that is more than 10 degrees from lahiri, but i can assure you that their basis for their readings is much different from that taught by parasara.. mainly because those natives don't read scriptures to begin with, and make up their own rules along the way! This is not Jyotish the way Parasara wanted it to be. Krishnamurty created the KP system on a similar basis.. namely that noone would teach him Jyotish! Tajik is incorperated into the systems we know today and is no doubt an interesting system of astrology, but i won't comment. Bhrigu-Jyotish is Nadi-Jyotish and Nadi-Jyotish is the same Jyotish that Parasara taught.. have no doubt about that. Now to adress your question on acuracy. Once an astrologer gets a birth chart, his/her prime objective is to confirm its acuracy. So the question of birthtime acuracy is simply not relevant, as usually the Astrologer is out to prove its acuracy to begin with. When the astrologer has done so, the readings may flow like nectar, so the question is Birth-time rectification. Hope this helps. Best wishesVisti---Sri Jagannath Center: http://.orgBhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.orgiTRANS 99 Font: http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org - Punit Pandey vedic astrology Friday, April 18, 2003 1:16 PM Re: [vedic astrology] Re: accuracy in time of birth Dear Mr. Partha, Sorry for mistake. I used to think that Jaimini, Tajik, Hora, Nadi, Bhrigu, KP, Lal Kitab etc. all belong to vedic astrology. Probably some are not as vedic. Seeking experts' comments. Punit Pandey"V.partha sarathy" <partvinu5 > wrote: hare rama krishnadear punitthe group discusses vedic astrology. the name of the group is written in bold letters. i hope you understandregardspartha--- In vedic astrology, Punit Pandey <punitastrologer> wrote:> > Hello All KP Experts,> > I have a question to ask to all experts of this group. Today we utilize sub and sub-sub lords of cusps in nearly all predictions based on KP System. > > We all know that there is no consensus on ayanamsa, no consensus on true rahu and mean rahu, known variations of computer programs, unsteady motion of planets, unavailability of atomic clocks at hospitals/homes etc., is it OK to use sub-sub (cuspal sub-sub lords change in average of 25 seconds) lord or even sub lord (cuspal sub lords changes in average of 4 minuts)???> > I think it is a basic question and good subject to debate. At least lots of people in India don't have accurate timing with them (accuracy less than 4 minutes).> > Thanks in advance.> > Regards,> > Punit Pandey > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-........ May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Do you ? The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 19, 2003 Report Share Posted April 19, 2003 Hare Rama Krishna --------------------- Dear Punit, I agree with most of your points, except the inventing bit. I feel its more important to learn what we have thoroughly.. then later if needed we build. Best wishesVisti---Sri Jagannath Center: http://.orgBhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.orgiTRANS 99 Font: http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org - Punit Pandey vedic astrology Saturday, April 19, 2003 9:01 AM Re: [vedic astrology] Is KP sufficiently vedic? Dear Mr. Visti, Thanks for your comments. I have my difference of opinion regarding KP (Even for lal kitab, but that I don't want to discuss here). It seems that KP has taken some other path than vedic astrology but if you go through this system, you will find parahsari jyotish in the heart. I see four major differences from parashari astrology - 1. Use of Placidus system of house division (western one) 2. User of SUB theory 3. Giving more importance to Naksharta. Saying that planet gives the result of nakshatra in which it is situated. 4. Differenct ayanamsa (but no one know which ayanamsa was used by Parashara himself) >From above you can see the 2,3 and 4 and based more or less on vedic astrology. SUB theory is devised from Vimshottari Dasha system as it is. The same division has been used. The same is for Nakshatra, some nadi author also give importance to nakshatra this way. And as you said that there is lack of concensus even among vedic astrologers for ayanamsas. Only the point 1 (i.e. the house division system) does not match with vedic astrology. Although I don't say that I have sufficient knowledge for discussing this topic but in my opinion even KP should be part of vedic astrology. Even I have no intention to hurt anyone. We must keep inventing and improving astrology, if it is possible. If we will oppose KP, It will be just like scientists opposing astrology without trying to understand it. Even some vedic astrologers are using principles similar to KP in some way or other to improve predicitons. In my opinion KP with divisional charts and some more dasas might become next step in astrology. And it is only possible if we will first open ourselves for discussion on non-vedic sounding systems of astrology. It will be good for discussion if we will get opinion of all Gurus. I also want to know whether anything build/developed/invented on the foundation of vedic astrology can be called vedic astrology or not? Thanks & Regards,Punit PandeyVisti Larsen <vishnu (AT) lbq (DOT) dk> wrote: Hare Rama Krishna ----------------------- Dear Punit, It is all vedic astrology, however even within vedic astrology, the Jyotishis have a mind of their own. Those who follow Parasari strictly understand that the nodes must always be mean, and not true, to fulfill the duty assigned to them, hence by implication of this, one uses mean nodes. But yet some people do not follow this. As for ayanamsa, the reason for lack of consensus is lack of valid research. Some oppine an ayanamsa that is more than 10 degrees from lahiri, but i can assure you that their basis for their readings is much different from that taught by parasara.. mainly because those natives don't read scriptures to begin with, and make up their own rules along the way! This is not Jyotish the way Parasara wanted it to be. Krishnamurty created the KP system on a similar basis.. namely that noone would teach him Jyotish! Tajik is incorperated into the systems we know today and is no doubt an interesting system of astrology, but i won't comment. Bhrigu-Jyotish is Nadi-Jyotish and Nadi-Jyotish is the same Jyotish that Parasara taught.. have no doubt about that. Now to adress your question on acuracy. Once an astrologer gets a birth chart, his/her prime objective is to confirm its acuracy. So the question of birthtime acuracy is simply not relevant, as usually the Astrologer is out to prove its acuracy to begin with. When the astrologer has done so, the readings may flow like nectar, so the question is Birth-time rectification. Hope this helps. Best wishesVisti---Sri Jagannath Center: http://.orgBhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.orgiTRANS 99 Font: http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org - Punit Pandey vedic astrology Friday, April 18, 2003 1:16 PM Re: [vedic astrology] Re: accuracy in time of birth Dear Mr. Partha, Sorry for mistake. I used to think that Jaimini, Tajik, Hora, Nadi, Bhrigu, KP, Lal Kitab etc. all belong to vedic astrology. Probably some are not as vedic. Seeking experts' comments. Punit Pandey"V.partha sarathy" <partvinu5 > wrote: hare rama krishnadear punitthe group discusses vedic astrology. the name of the group is written in bold letters. i hope you understandregardspartha--- In vedic astrology, Punit Pandey <punitastrologer> wrote:> > Hello All KP Experts,> > I have a question to ask to all experts of this group. Today we utilize sub and sub-sub lords of cusps in nearly all predictions based on KP System. > > We all know that there is no consensus on ayanamsa, no consensus on true rahu and mean rahu, known variations of computer programs, unsteady motion of planets, unavailability of atomic clocks at hospitals/homes etc., is it OK to use sub-sub (cuspal sub-sub lords change in average of 25 seconds) lord or even sub lord (cuspal sub lords changes in average of 4 minuts)???> > I think it is a basic question and good subject to debate. At least lots of people in India don't have accurate timing with them (accuracy less than 4 minutes).> > Thanks in advance.> > Regards,> > Punit Pandey > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-........ May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-........ May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 19, 2003 Report Share Posted April 19, 2003 This group is one of the most active groups on Indian astrology. That's why I was interested to discuss even KP and other related branches in this group. Most of the KP astrologer start their learning process from Parashari and regularly watch activities of this group. So I thought that it is better place to discuss all Vedic Astrology and related branches whereas there are already few groups especially for KP discussion. I think my opinion would be worth a thought. Regards, Punit PandeyVisti Larsen <vishnu (AT) lbq (DOT) dk> wrote: Hare Rama Krishna --------------------- Dear Punit, I agree with most of your points, except the inventing bit. I feel its more important to learn what we have thoroughly.. then later if needed we build. Best wishesVisti---Sri Jagannath Center: http://.orgBhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.orgiTRANS 99 Font: http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org - Punit Pandey vedic astrology Saturday, April 19, 2003 9:01 AM Re: [vedic astrology] Is KP sufficiently vedic? Dear Mr. Visti, Thanks for your comments. I have my difference of opinion regarding KP (Even for lal kitab, but that I don't want to discuss here). It seems that KP has taken some other path than vedic astrology but if you go through this system, you will find parahsari jyotish in the heart. I see four major differences from parashari astrology - 1. Use of Placidus system of house division (western one) 2. User of SUB theory 3. Giving more importance to Naksharta. Saying that planet gives the result of nakshatra in which it is situated. 4. Differenct ayanamsa (but no one know which ayanamsa was used by Parashara himself) >From above you can see the 2,3 and 4 and based more or less on vedic astrology. SUB theory is devised from Vimshottari Dasha system as it is. The same division has been used. The same is for Nakshatra, some nadi author also give importance to nakshatra this way. And as you said that there is lack of concensus even among vedic astrologers for ayanamsas. Only the point 1 (i.e. the house division system) does not match with vedic astrology. Although I don't say that I have sufficient knowledge for discussing this topic but in my opinion even KP should be part of vedic astrology. Even I have no intention to hurt anyone. We must keep inventing and improving astrology, if it is possible. If we will oppose KP, It will be just like scientists opposing astrology without trying to understand it. Even some vedic astrologers are using principles similar to KP in some way or other to improve predicitons. In my opinion KP with divisional charts and some more dasas might become next step in astrology. And it is only possible if we will first open ourselves for discussion on non-vedic sounding systems of astrology. It will be good for discussion if we will get opinion of all Gurus. I also want to know whether anything build/developed/invented on the foundation of vedic astrology can be called vedic astrology or not? Thanks & Regards,Punit PandeyVisti Larsen <vishnu (AT) lbq (DOT) dk> wrote: Hare Rama Krishna ----------------------- Dear Punit, It is all vedic astrology, however even within vedic astrology, the Jyotishis have a mind of their own. Those who follow Parasari strictly understand that the nodes must always be mean, and not true, to fulfill the duty assigned to them, hence by implication of this, one uses mean nodes. But yet some people do not follow this. As for ayanamsa, the reason for lack of consensus is lack of valid research. Some oppine an ayanamsa that is more than 10 degrees from lahiri, but i can assure you that their basis for their readings is much different from that taught by parasara.. mainly because those natives don't read scriptures to begin with, and make up their own rules along the way! This is not Jyotish the way Parasara wanted it to be. Krishnamurty created the KP system on a similar basis.. namely that noone would teach him Jyotish! Tajik is incorperated into the systems we know today and is no doubt an interesting system of astrology, but i won't comment. Bhrigu-Jyotish is Nadi-Jyotish and Nadi-Jyotish is the same Jyotish that Parasara taught.. have no doubt about that. Now to adress your question on acuracy. Once an astrologer gets a birth chart, his/her prime objective is to confirm its acuracy. So the question of birthtime acuracy is simply not relevant, as usually the Astrologer is out to prove its acuracy to begin with. When the astrologer has done so, the readings may flow like nectar, so the question is Birth-time rectification. Hope this helps. Best wishesVisti---Sri Jagannath Center: http://.orgBhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.orgiTRANS 99 Font: http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org - Punit Pandey vedic astrology Friday, April 18, 2003 1:16 PM Re: [vedic astrology] Re: accuracy in time of birth Dear Mr. Partha, Sorry for mistake. I used to think that Jaimini, Tajik, Hora, Nadi, Bhrigu, KP, Lal Kitab etc. all belong to vedic astrology. Probably some are not as vedic. Seeking experts' comments. Punit Pandey"V.partha sarathy" <partvinu5 > wrote: hare rama krishnadear punitthe group discusses vedic astrology. the name of the group is written in bold letters. i hope you understandregardspartha--- In vedic astrology, Punit Pandey <punitastrologer> wrote:> > Hello All KP Experts,> > I have a question to ask to all experts of this group. Today we utilize sub and sub-sub lords of cusps in nearly all predictions based on KP System. > > We all know that there is no consensus on ayanamsa, no consensus on true rahu and mean rahu, known variations of computer programs, unsteady motion of planets, unavailability of atomic clocks at hospitals/homes etc., is it OK to use sub-sub (cuspal sub-sub lords change in average of 25 seconds) lord or even sub lord (cuspal sub lords changes in average of 4 minuts)???> > I think it is a basic question and good subject to debate. At least lots of people in India don't have accurate timing with them (accuracy less than 4 minutes).> > Thanks in advance.> > Regards,> > Punit Pandey > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-........ May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-........ May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Do you ? The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 21, 2003 Report Share Posted April 21, 2003 Dear friends: Are you guys talking about the KP/Systems approach. I've sincerely with an open mind tried to study the Systems approach and I geniunely feels that Systems approach is a big heap of crap. To give you an example--it says that for a Scorpio ascendant, Saturn in the most benefic planet. Now, per the PURE vedic astrology, Saturn is a functional malefic for Scorpio ascendant and this principle applies in my personal life, every time I go throug the antardasha of Saturn, my life turns upside down. Now, when Systems approach says that Saturn is the MBPF for Scorpio ascendant, it is just a joke or a lie or just a heap of crap. I tried to apply the Sytems approach principles to the charts of my family and friends and NOTHING applies. Not one prediction made per Systems Approach coinsides with the lives and events in the life of my friends and family; whereas, all the PURE vedic principlea and predictions apply. This is just my experience of the KP/Systems approach. I'm not sure if KP and Systems are one and the same thing, I'm only commenting on the Systems Approach developed by somebody named Chowdry. M.Desai vedic astrology, Punit Pandey <punitastrologer> wrote: > Dear Mr. Visti, > Thanks for your comments. > > I have my difference of opinion regarding KP (Even for lal kitab, but that I don't want to discuss here). It seems that KP has taken some other path than vedic astrology but if you go through this system, you will find parahsari jyotish in the heart. I see four major differences from parashari astrology - > > 1. Use of Placidus system of house division (western one) > > 2. User of SUB theory > > 3. Giving more importance to Naksharta. Saying that planet gives the result of nakshatra in which it is situated. > > 4. Differenct ayanamsa (but no one know which ayanamsa was used by Parashara himself) > > From above you can see the 2,3 and 4 and based more or less on vedic astrology. SUB theory is devised from Vimshottari Dasha system as it is. The same division has been used. The same is for Nakshatra, some nadi author also give importance to nakshatra this way. And as you said that there is lack of concensus even among vedic astrologers for ayanamsas. Only the point 1 (i.e. the house division system) does not match with vedic astrology. > > Although I don't say that I have sufficient knowledge for discussing this topic but in my opinion even KP should be part of vedic astrology. Even I have no intention to hurt anyone. We must keep inventing and improving astrology, if it is possible. If we will oppose KP, It will be just like scientists opposing astrology without trying to understand it. Even some vedic astrologers are using principles similar to KP in some way or other to improve predicitons. In my opinion KP with divisional charts and some more dasas might become next step in astrology. And it is only possible if we will first open ourselves for discussion on non-vedic sounding systems of astrology. > > It will be good for discussion if we will get opinion of all Gurus. I also want to know whether anything build/developed/invented on the foundation of vedic astrology can be called vedic astrology or not? > > > > Thanks & Regards, > Punit Pandey > > Visti Larsen <vishnu@l...> wrote:Hare Rama Krishna------------------ -----Dear Punit,It is all vedic astrology, however even within vedic astrology, the Jyotishis have a mind of their own. Those who follow Parasari strictly understand that the nodes must always be mean, and not true, to fulfill the duty assigned to them, hence by implication of this, one uses mean nodes. But yet some people do not follow this. As for ayanamsa, the reason for lack of consensus is lack of valid research. Some oppine an ayanamsa that is more than 10 degrees from lahiri, but i can assure you that their basis for their readings is much different from that taught by parasara.. mainly because those natives don't read scriptures to begin with, and make up their own rules along the way! This is not Jyotish the way Parasara wanted it to be. Krishnamurty created the KP system on a similar basis.. namely that noone would teach him Jyotish! Tajik is incorperated into the systems we know today and is no doubt an interesting system of astrology, but i won't comment. Bhrigu-Jyotish is Nadi-Jyotish and Nadi-Jyotish is the same Jyotish that Parasara taught.. have no doubt about that. Now to adress your question on acuracy.Once an astrologer gets a birth chart, his/her prime objective is to confirm its acuracy. So the question of birthtime acuracy is simply not relevant, as usually the Astrologer is out to prove its acuracy to begin with. When the astrologer has done so, the readings may flow like nectar, so the question is Birth-time rectification. Hope this helps.Best wishes > Visti > --- > Sri Jagannath Center: http://.org > Bhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.org > iTRANS 99 Font: http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org----- Original Message ----- Punit Pandey vedic astrology Friday, April 18, 2003 1:16 PMRe: [vedic astrology] Re: accuracy in time of birth > Dear Mr. Partha, Sorry for mistake. I used to think that Jaimini, Tajik, Hora, Nadi, Bhrigu, KP, Lal Kitab etc. all belong to vedic astrology. Probably some are not as vedic. Seeking experts' comments. Punit Pandey > > "V.partha sarathy" <partvinu5> wrote:hare rama krishna > dear punit > > the group discusses vedic astrology. the name of the group is written > in bold letters. i hope you understand > regards > partha > > > vedic astrology, Punit Pandey > <punitastrologer> wrote: > > > > Hello All KP Experts, > > > > I have a question to ask to all experts of this group. Today we > utilize sub and sub-sub lords of cusps in nearly all predictions > based on KP System. > > > > We all know that there is no consensus on ayanamsa, no consensus on > true rahu and mean rahu, known variations of computer programs, > unsteady motion of planets, unavailability of atomic clocks at > hospitals/homes etc., is it OK to use sub-sub (cuspal sub-sub lords > change in average of 25 seconds) lord or even sub lord (cuspal sub > lords changes in average of 4 minuts)??? > > > > I think it is a basic question and good subject to debate. At least > lots of people in India don't have accurate timing with them > (accuracy less than 4 minutes). > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > Regards, > > > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > Terms of Service. > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > Terms of Service. > > Sponsor > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > Terms of Service. > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 21, 2003 Report Share Posted April 21, 2003 Dear Desaiji, You are right on point!! SA really is a bunch of ****. Trust me it wasted 300 $ of a very good friend of mine without getting her anything out of it. More than that Mr. Choudhry gave her all kinds of false hopes and poor she believed in him and really expected that her husband's life would change completely by wearing one of Mr. Choudhry's Special Power (What a joke!) Kavach... Unfortunately, I did not have much clue about astrology then to guide her to not go the short route Mr. Choudhry and gang were professing. I really wish there could be some way of stopping this mischief with Vedic Astrology in the form of SA. I sincerely believe that it is a setup created by Mr. Choudhry and likes to make big bucks! I must say even I was a bit lured to that side when I was a fresher. I read how simple it was and what else would a beginner in a subject as complex as astrology need? However, experience on their forum for about 3-4 months told me that none of the predictions the members were doing on the forum came true. So I just dropped it and started learning conventional astrology. I think one of the reasons why people go to SA is because the professor make it seem very simple and he makes it sound as if like Sage Parashara et al wasted their lifetimes in emptiness creating unneeded complexity and like he is the only one with all the wisdom in the world... I am sorry for sounding a bit rude, but this SA thing really rolls on my heads. Namaste. Rageshwari. vedic astrology, "monmuk111" <monmuk111> wrote: > Dear friends: > > Are you guys talking about the KP/Systems approach. I've sincerely > with an open mind tried to study the Systems approach and I geniunely > feels that Systems approach is a big heap of crap. To give you an > example--it says that for a Scorpio ascendant, Saturn in the most > benefic planet. Now, per the PURE vedic astrology, Saturn is a > functional malefic for Scorpio ascendant and this principle applies > in my personal life, every time I go throug the antardasha of Saturn, > my life turns upside down. > > Now, when Systems approach says that Saturn is the MBPF for Scorpio > ascendant, it is just a joke or a lie or just a heap of crap. > > I tried to apply the Sytems approach principles to the charts of my > family and friends and NOTHING applies. Not one prediction made per > Systems Approach coinsides with the lives and events in the life of > my friends and family; whereas, all the PURE vedic principlea and > predictions apply. > > This is just my experience of the KP/Systems approach. I'm not sure > if KP and Systems are one and the same thing, I'm only commenting on > the Systems Approach developed by somebody named Chowdry. > > M.Desai > > > vedic astrology, Punit Pandey > <punitastrologer> wrote: > > Dear Mr. Visti, > > Thanks for your comments. > > > > I have my difference of opinion regarding KP (Even for lal kitab, > but that I don't want to discuss here). It seems that KP has taken > some other path than vedic astrology but if you go through this > system, you will find parahsari jyotish in the heart. I see four > major differences from parashari astrology - > > > > 1. Use of Placidus system of house division (western one) > > > > 2. User of SUB theory > > > > 3. Giving more importance to Naksharta. Saying that planet gives > the result of nakshatra in which it is situated. > > > > 4. Differenct ayanamsa (but no one know which ayanamsa was used by > Parashara himself) > > > > From above you can see the 2,3 and 4 and based more or less on > vedic astrology. SUB theory is devised from Vimshottari Dasha system > as it is. The same division has been used. The same is for Nakshatra, > some nadi author also give importance to nakshatra this way. And as > you said that there is lack of concensus even among vedic astrologers > for ayanamsas. Only the point 1 (i.e. the house division system) does > not match with vedic astrology. > > > > Although I don't say that I have sufficient knowledge for > discussing this topic but in my opinion even KP should be part of > vedic astrology. Even I have no intention to hurt anyone. We must > keep inventing and improving astrology, if it is possible. If we will > oppose KP, It will be just like scientists opposing astrology without > trying to understand it. Even some vedic astrologers are using > principles similar to KP in some way or other to improve predicitons. > In my opinion KP with divisional charts and some more dasas might > become next step in astrology. And it is only possible if we will > first open ourselves for discussion on non-vedic sounding systems of > astrology. > > > > It will be good for discussion if we will get opinion of all Gurus. > I also want to know whether anything build/developed/invented on the > foundation of vedic astrology can be called vedic astrology or not? > > > > > > > > Thanks & Regards, > > Punit Pandey > > > > Visti Larsen <vishnu@l...> wrote:Hare Rama Krishna---------------- -- > -----Dear Punit,It is all vedic astrology, however even within vedic > astrology, the Jyotishis have a mind of their own. Those who follow > Parasari strictly understand that the nodes must always be mean, and > not true, to fulfill the duty assigned to them, hence by implication > of this, one uses mean nodes. But yet some people do not follow this. > As for ayanamsa, the reason for lack of consensus is lack of valid > research. Some oppine an ayanamsa that is more than 10 degrees from > lahiri, but i can assure you that their basis for their readings is > much different from that taught by parasara.. mainly because those > natives don't read scriptures to begin with, and make up their own > rules along the way! This is not Jyotish the way Parasara wanted it > to be. Krishnamurty created the KP system on a similar basis.. namely > that noone would teach him Jyotish! Tajik is incorperated into the > systems we know today and is no doubt an interesting system of > astrology, but i won't comment. Bhrigu-Jyotish is Nadi-Jyotish and > Nadi-Jyotish is the same Jyotish that Parasara taught.. have no doubt > about that. Now to adress your question on acuracy.Once an > astrologer gets a birth chart, his/her prime objective is to confirm > its acuracy. So the question of birthtime acuracy is simply not > relevant, as usually the Astrologer is out to prove its acuracy to > begin with. When the astrologer has done so, the readings may flow > like nectar, so the question is Birth-time rectification. Hope this > helps.Best wishes > > Visti > > --- > > Sri Jagannath Center: http://.org > > Bhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.org > > iTRANS 99 Font: http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org----- Original > Message ----- Punit Pandey vedic- astrology > Friday, April 18, 2003 1:16 PMRe: [vedic astrology] > Re: accuracy in time of birth > > Dear Mr. Partha, Sorry for mistake. I used to think that Jaimini, > Tajik, Hora, Nadi, Bhrigu, KP, Lal Kitab etc. all belong to vedic > astrology. Probably some are not as vedic. Seeking experts' comments. > Punit Pandey > > > > "V.partha sarathy" <partvinu5> wrote:hare rama krishna > > dear punit > > > > the group discusses vedic astrology. the name of the group is > written > > in bold letters. i hope you understand > > regards > > partha > > > > > > vedic astrology, Punit Pandey > > <punitastrologer> wrote: > > > > > > Hello All KP Experts, > > > > > > I have a question to ask to all experts of this group. Today we > > utilize sub and sub-sub lords of cusps in nearly all predictions > > based on KP System. > > > > > > We all know that there is no consensus on ayanamsa, no consensus > on > > true rahu and mean rahu, known variations of computer programs, > > unsteady motion of planets, unavailability of atomic clocks at > > hospitals/homes etc., is it OK to use sub-sub (cuspal sub-sub lords > > change in average of 25 seconds) lord or even sub lord (cuspal sub > > lords changes in average of 4 minuts)??? > > > > > > I think it is a basic question and good subject to debate. At > least > > lots of people in India don't have accurate timing with them > > (accuracy less than 4 minutes). > > > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > Terms of > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > Service. > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > Terms of > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 21, 2003 Report Share Posted April 21, 2003 Besides the K.P issue, can you please tell the placement of your saturn.. like in which rashi etc? I am also a scorpio ascendent and i have saturn in the 7th house vargottama. Thanks! Prakash. rageshwari75 <rageshwari75 > wrote: Dear Desaiji,You are right on point!!SA really is a bunch of ****. Trust me it wasted 300 $ of a very good friend of mine without getting her anything out of it. More than that Mr. Choudhry gave her all kinds of false hopes and poor she believed in him and really expected that her husband's life would change completely by wearing one of Mr. Choudhry's Special Power (What a joke!) Kavach...Unfortunately, I did not have much clue about astrology then to guide her to not go the short route Mr. Choudhry and gang were professing.I really wish there could be some way of stopping this mischief with Vedic Astrology in the form of SA. I sincerely believe that it is a setup created by Mr. Choudhry and likes to make big bucks! I must say even I was a bit lured to that side when I was a fresher. I read how simple it was and what else would a beginner in a subject as complex as astrology need? However, experience on their forum for about 3-4 months told me that none of the predictions the members were doing on the forum came true. So I just dropped it and started learning conventional astrology. I think one of the reasons why people go to SA is because the professor make it seem very simple and he makes it sound as if like Sage Parashara et al wasted their lifetimes in emptiness creating unneeded complexity and like he is the only one with all the wisdom in the world...I am sorry for sounding a bit rude, but this SA thing really rolls on my heads.Namaste.Rageshwari.vedic astrology, "monmuk111" <monmuk111> wrote:> Dear friends:> > Are you guys talking about the KP/Systems approach. I've sincerely > with an open mind tried to study the Systems approach and I geniunely > feels that Systems approach is a big heap of crap. To give you an > example--it says that for a Scorpio ascendant, Saturn in the most > benefic planet. Now, per the PURE vedic astrology, Saturn is a > functional malefic for Scorpio ascendant and this principle applies > in my personal life, every time I go throug the antardasha of Saturn, > my life turns upside down. > > Now, when Systems approach says that Saturn is the MBPF for Scorpio > ascendant, it is just a joke or a lie or just a heap of crap.> > I tried to apply the Sytems approach principles to the charts of my > family and friends and NOTHING applies. Not one prediction made per > Systems Approach coinsides with the lives and events in the life of > my friends and family; whereas, all the PURE vedic principlea and > predictions apply.> > This is just my experience of the KP/Systems approach. I'm not sure > if KP and Systems are one and the same thing, I'm only commenting on > the Systems Approach developed by somebody named Chowdry.> > M.Desai> > > --- In vedic astrology, Punit Pandey > <punitastrologer> wrote:> > Dear Mr. Visti,> > Thanks for your comments. > > > > I have my difference of opinion regarding KP (Even for lal kitab, > but that I don't want to discuss here). It seems that KP has taken > some other path than vedic astrology but if you go through this > system, you will find parahsari jyotish in the heart. I see four > major differences from parashari astrology -> > > > 1. Use of Placidus system of house division (western one)> > > > 2. User of SUB theory> > > > 3. Giving more importance to Naksharta. Saying that planet gives > the result of nakshatra in which it is situated.> > > > 4. Differenct ayanamsa (but no one know which ayanamsa was used by > Parashara himself)> > > > From above you can see the 2,3 and 4 and based more or less on > vedic astrology. SUB theory is devised from Vimshottari Dasha system > as it is. The same division has been used. The same is for Nakshatra, > some nadi author also give importance to nakshatra this way. And as > you said that there is lack of concensus even among vedic astrologers > for ayanamsas. Only the point 1 (i.e. the house division system) does > not match with vedic astrology. > > > > Although I don't say that I have sufficient knowledge for > discussing this topic but in my opinion even KP should be part of > vedic astrology. Even I have no intention to hurt anyone. We must > keep inventing and improving astrology, if it is possible. If we will > oppose KP, It will be just like scientists opposing astrology without > trying to understand it. Even some vedic astrologers are using > principles similar to KP in some way or other to improve predicitons. > In my opinion KP with divisional charts and some more dasas might > become next step in astrology. And it is only possible if we will > first open ourselves for discussion on non-vedic sounding systems of > astrology.> > > > It will be good for discussion if we will get opinion of all Gurus. > I also want to know whether anything build/developed/invented on the > foundation of vedic astrology can be called vedic astrology or not? > > > > > > > > Thanks & Regards,> > Punit Pandey> > > > Visti Larsen <vishnu@l...> wrote:Hare Rama Krishna------------------> -----Dear Punit,It is all vedic astrology, however even within vedic > astrology, the Jyotishis have a mind of their own. Those who follow > Parasari strictly understand that the nodes must always be mean, and > not true, to fulfill the duty assigned to them, hence by implication > of this, one uses mean nodes. But yet some people do not follow this. > As for ayanamsa, the reason for lack of consensus is lack of valid > research. Some oppine an ayanamsa that is more than 10 degrees from > lahiri, but i can assure you that their basis for their readings is > much different from that taught by parasara.. mainly because those > natives don't read scriptures to begin with, and make up their own > rules along the way! This is not Jyotish the way Parasara wanted it > to be. Krishnamurty created the KP system on a similar basis.. namely > that noone would teach him Jyotish! Tajik is incorperated into the > systems we know today and is no doubt an interesting system of > astrology, but i won't comment. Bhrigu-Jyotish is Nadi-Jyotish and > Nadi-Jyotish is the same Jyotish that Parasara taught.. have no doubt > about that. Now to adress your question on acuracy.Once an > astrologer gets a birth chart, his/her prime objective is to confirm > its acuracy. So the question of birthtime acuracy is simply not > relevant, as usually the Astrologer is out to prove its acuracy to > begin with. When the astrologer has done so, the readings may flow > like nectar, so the question is Birth-time rectification. Hope this > helps.Best wishes> > Visti> > ---> > Sri Jagannath Center: http://.org> > Bhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.org> > iTRANS 99 Font: http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org----- Original > Message ----- Punit Pandey vedic astrology > Friday, April 18, 2003 1:16 PMRe: [vedic astrology] > Re: accuracy in time of birth> > Dear Mr. Partha, Sorry for mistake. I used to think that Jaimini, > Tajik, Hora, Nadi, Bhrigu, KP, Lal Kitab etc. all belong to vedic > astrology. Probably some are not as vedic. Seeking experts' comments. > Punit Pandey> > > > "V.partha sarathy" <partvinu5> wrote:hare rama krishna> > dear punit> > > > the group discusses vedic astrology. the name of the group is > written > > in bold letters. i hope you understand> > regards> > partha> > > > > > --- In vedic astrology, Punit Pandey > > <punitastrologer> wrote:> > > > > > Hello All KP Experts,> > > > > > I have a question to ask to all experts of this group. Today we > > utilize sub and sub-sub lords of cusps in nearly all predictions > > based on KP System. > > > > > > We all know that there is no consensus on ayanamsa, no consensus > on > > true rahu and mean rahu, known variations of computer programs, > > unsteady motion of planets, unavailability of atomic clocks at > > hospitals/homes etc., is it OK to use sub-sub (cuspal sub-sub lords > > change in average of 25 seconds) lord or even sub lord (cuspal sub > > lords changes in average of 4 minuts)???> > > > > > I think it is a basic question and good subject to debate. At > least > > lots of people in India don't have accurate timing with them > > (accuracy less than 4 minutes).> > > > > > Thanks in advance.> > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Do you ?> > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.> > > > > > > > Archives: vedic astrology> > > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > Archives: vedic astrology> > > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > > > > ........ May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of > Service. > > > > Sponsor> > > > Archives: vedic astrology> > > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Do you ? The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 21, 2003 Report Share Posted April 21, 2003 Systems Approach (SA) is far long away than Vedic Astrology. Though they call it to "be" Vedic Astrology. Their list "SATVA" is derived from "Systems Approach To Vedic Astrology". SA claims to make many successful predictions where I found it not working for me. I have heard people telling it did not work at all for them, even in the SATVA list there were case studies like this. Some of the rules of SA- 1) The planet who has a non-MT (Mool-trikona) sign will not be significating that house significations. Suppose, you are a Scorpio native. Then, though it is ruled by Mars, but Mars does not have it's MT (Mool-trikona) in Scorpio; it does in Aries. So, though as per Vedic Astrology Mars has to be seen for your Ascendant related matters, but as per SA, Mars has nothing to do with your Ascendant! (Because it's MT is not in Scorpio.) So, as per SA, even though Mars is heavily afflicted or exalted, it will have no impact on your ascendant! In these non-MT matters, the fixed significator has to be judged. So being a scorpio native, your healtgh related issues will not depend on Mars at all! It will depend on the Sun, the natural significator. Similarly, if you are a cancer native, then Saturn's position will not impact your marital life at all! Because though Saturn is your 7th lord, but it has no MT in Capricorn. So Saturn has no impact on your married life. Venus, the fixed significator will decide here!! 2) SA declares that only 6th, 8th, 12th houselords with MT are evils. Suppose you are Aries Native. Though Vedic Astrology tells that 3rd, 6th, 11th lords are malefic, but SA does not do so! For Aries native, we will have to see which of the 6th, 8th, 12th houses have MTs - which signs have MTs in them, their lords will be malefics. For Aries, 6th house Virgo has MT. But 8th and 12th houses (Scorpio and Pisces) have no MT so their lords will not be malefics. So, as per SA, for Aries natives, Only Mercury, Rahu and Ketu are malefics. Similarly, for Gemini natives, none of 6th, 8th, 12th houses have any MT so for them, only Rahu and Ketu will be malefic. Other seven planets are benefics!!! 3) SA recommends strengthening all the benefic planets. Like, for Gemini natives, it suggests wearing stones of all the seven planets from Sun to Saturn!! All stones will be good. 4) Debilitated and inimically placed are weak so they have to be given strength by stones if they are benefics as per SA. Like, for a Gemini native, all the seven planets from Sun to Saturn should be strengthened through stones, and if any of them are debilitated, then it's stone has to be worn first. 5) As per theory of SA, a person can have maximum 3 planets malefic from the main seven planets. So, a person can wear minimum 4 stones safely. Lucky natives like Gemini, can wear all seven stones for the seven main planets. 6) If a planet is exalted, it already has much strength so wearing it's stone will give only "some" good (or even not at all). Say for Scorpios, Moon is very benefic ruling the 9th house. Now, if moon is already exalted, then it's stone (Pearl) will give the native only some good, or may not give good at all since Moon is already got it's strength. 7) Even being in the same sign, if two planets are not within five degree close, they will not be treated as in conjunction! Say Moon in 3rd degree Aries, and Rahu in 9th degree Aries. Since their distance is more than five degrees, they will not be influencing each other at all! 8) Same rule applies to aspects. Though the planets are from different signs, in degree position they will have to be close within five degrees. Otherwise even being in Aries-Libra, they will not aspect, afflict, or benefic each other at all! 9) Retrogradation of any planet does not make any difference. Retrograde planets are just same to normal planets! (Quote - "the author is of the firm view that retrograde planets are to be treated in a normal way as per their longitudes.")!!!! 10) The five degrees of both sides of your ascendant-degree is the "MEP" (Most effective point) in any house. If you are born 10 degree Aries, then your MEP is 5 - 15 degree of any houses. So, if any malefic planet is not in 5-15 degree of a sign, that planet will not harm the house at all! To influence any house, the planet have to be within 5-15 degrees of that house! Otherwise, it will not effect the house at all!!! 11) If you visit the site of SA (http://www.yournetastrologer.com/) then you will see some "Rare Opportunity to ENERGISE your weak planets" (Quoted exactly) through some "kavach" they sell. The kavach costs US $ 300. But it is a rare chance, because, one single kavach can strengthen all the 4-7 benefic planets for you - if you bought all there stones, you would have to spend much more than $300. So this offer of buying a kavach with $300 is money saving and kavach works better than stones, too! *This kavach are designed and offered by Prof Choudhry. 12) Wearing the Kavach ensures all round happiness in life's every fields. *There were a lot of controversories recently that SAVTA list on the efficacy of kavach where an astrologer told that he took 14 kavachs for his clients as well as for himself and family and none of them worked so later he left them and was embarrassed before his clients. I am copying the difference between Vedic Astrology and SA found from SAVTA list - (START) Traditional Approach versus System’s Approach SA provides one consistent, non-confusing and non-contradictory principles as per the experience of those who have studies classical principles for decades. If somebody on the list does not want to make use of the experience of others and want to start afresh, he/she is welcome to do that.There are many concepts in traditional astrology which are totally redundant.There are many points of difference:The first and foremost principle of SA is the functional nature of planets. The second is that we only see the chart from Asdt only both the natal and transit charts.-The third is orb of conjunction and aspect.-All houses except 6th, 8th and 12th houses are good. - SA does not believe in:(i) Chalit (ii) Jamini karakas (iii) jamini dasas (iv) important yogas aslaid down in the fixed mode without identifying the functional nature of theplanets (v) maraka planets (vi) that the benefics owning good houses become malefic planets (vii) Badhaka principlesn, (vii) calculation of strengthas per traditional graha and bhava balas (viii) traditional manglik (ix)traditional sade-sati, (x) conditional dasas, etc. etc.The advocates of the traditional astrology principles can never match (i) the shortest time required for learning predictive techniques,(ii)confidence, (iii) competence and (iv) speed of an SA astrologer. However, choice is with the person his/her ownself. (END) Be well,Deepak vedic astrology, "monmuk111" <monmuk111> wrote:> Dear friends:> > Are you guys talking about the KP/Systems approach. I've sincerely > with an open mind tried to study the Systems approach and I geniunely > feels that Systems approach is a big heap of crap. To give you an > example--it says that for a Scorpio ascendant, Saturn in the most > benefic planet. Now, per the PURE vedic astrology, Saturn is a > functional malefic for Scorpio ascendant and this principle applies > in my personal life, every time I go throug the antardasha of Saturn, > my life turns upside down. > > Now, when Systems approach says that Saturn is the MBPF for Scorpio > ascendant, it is just a joke or a lie or just a heap of crap.> > I tried to apply the Sytems approach principles to the charts of my > family and friends and NOTHING applies. Not one prediction made per > Systems Approach coinsides with the lives and events in the life of > my friends and family; whereas, all the PURE vedic principlea and > predictions apply.> > This is just my experience of the KP/Systems approach. I'm not sure > if KP and Systems are one and the same thing, I'm only commenting on > the Systems Approach developed by somebody named Chowdry.> > M.Desai> > > vedic astrology, Punit Pandey > <punitastrologer> wrote:> > Dear Mr. Visti,> > Thanks for your comments. > > > > I have my difference of opinion regarding KP (Even for lal kitab, > but that I don't want to discuss here). It seems that KP has taken > some other path than vedic astrology but if you go through this > system, you will find parahsari jyotish in the heart. I see four > major differences from parashari astrology -> > > > 1. Use of Placidus system of house division (western one)> > > > 2. User of SUB theory> > > > 3. Giving more importance to Naksharta. Saying that planet gives > the result of nakshatra in which it is situated.> > > > 4. Differenct ayanamsa (but no one know which ayanamsa was used by > Parashara himself)> > > > From above you can see the 2,3 and 4 and based more or less on > vedic astrology. SUB theory is devised from Vimshottari Dasha system > as it is. The same division has been used. The same is for Nakshatra, > some nadi author also give importance to nakshatra this way. And as > you said that there is lack of concensus even among vedic astrologers > for ayanamsas. Only the point 1 (i.e. the house division system) does > not match with vedic astrology. > > > > Although I don't say that I have sufficient knowledge for > discussing this topic but in my opinion even KP should be part of > vedic astrology. Even I have no intention to hurt anyone. We must > keep inventing and improving astrology, if it is possible. If we will > oppose KP, It will be just like scientists opposing astrology without > trying to understand it. Even some vedic astrologers are using > principles similar to KP in some way or other to improve predicitons. > In my opinion KP with divisional charts and some more dasas might > become next step in astrology. And it is only possible if we will > first open ourselves for discussion on non-vedic sounding systems of > astrology.> > > > It will be good for discussion if we will get opinion of all Gurus. > I also want to know whether anything build/developed/invented on the > foundation of vedic astrology can be called vedic astrology or not? > > > > > > > > Thanks & Regards,> > Punit Pandey> > > > Visti Larsen <vishnu@l...> wrote:Hare Rama Krishna------------------> -----Dear Punit,It is all vedic astrology, however even within vedic > astrology, the Jyotishis have a mind of their own. Those who follow > Parasari strictly understand that the nodes must always be mean, and > not true, to fulfill the duty assigned to them, hence by implication > of this, one uses mean nodes. But yet some people do not follow this. > As for ayanamsa, the reason for lack of consensus is lack of valid > research. Some oppine an ayanamsa that is more than 10 degrees from > lahiri, but i can assure you that their basis for their readings is > much different from that taught by parasara.. mainly because those > natives don't read scriptures to begin with, and make up their own > rules along the way! This is not Jyotish the way Parasara wanted it > to be. Krishnamurty created the KP system on a similar basis.. namely > that noone would teach him Jyotish! Tajik is incorperated into the > systems we know today and is no doubt an interesting system of > astrology, but i won't comment. Bhrigu-Jyotish is Nadi-Jyotish and > Nadi-Jyotish is the same Jyotish that Parasara taught.. have no doubt > about that. Now to adress your question on acuracy.Once an > astrologer gets a birth chart, his/her prime objective is to confirm > its acuracy. So the question of birthtime acuracy is simply not > relevant, as usually the Astrologer is out to prove its acuracy to > begin with. When the astrologer has done so, the readings may flow > like nectar, so the question is Birth-time rectification. Hope this > helps.Best wishes> > Visti> > ---> > Sri Jagannath Center: http://.org> > Bhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.org> > iTRANS 99 Font: http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org----- Original > Message ----- Punit Pandey vedic astrology > Friday, April 18, 2003 1:16 PMRe: [vedic astrology] > Re: accuracy in time of birth> > Dear Mr. Partha, Sorry for mistake. I used to think that Jaimini, > Tajik, Hora, Nadi, Bhrigu, KP, Lal Kitab etc. all belong to vedic > astrology. Probably some are not as vedic. Seeking experts' comments. > Punit Pandey> > > > "V.partha sarathy" <partvinu5> wrote:hare rama krishna> > dear punit> > > > the group discusses vedic astrology. the name of the group is > written > > in bold letters. i hope you understand> > regards> > partha> > > > > > --- In vedic astrology, Punit Pandey > > <punitastrologer> wrote:> > > > > > Hello All KP Experts,> > > > > > I have a question to ask to all experts of this group. Today we > > utilize sub and sub-sub lords of cusps in nearly all predictions > > based on KP System. > > > > > > We all know that there is no consensus on ayanamsa, no consensus > on > > true rahu and mean rahu, known variations of computer programs, > > unsteady motion of planets, unavailability of atomic clocks at > > hospitals/homes etc., is it OK to use sub-sub (cuspal sub-sub lords > > change in average of 25 seconds) lord or even sub lord (cuspal sub > > lords changes in average of 4 minuts)???> > > > > > I think it is a basic question and good subject to debate. At > least > > lots of people in India don't have accurate timing with them > > (accuracy less than 4 minutes).> > > > > > Thanks in advance.> > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Do you ?> > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.> > > > > > > > Archives: vedic astrology> > > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > Archives: vedic astrology> > > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > > > > ........ May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of > Service. > > > > Sponsor> > > > Archives: vedic astrology> > > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 21, 2003 Report Share Posted April 21, 2003 Hi Rageshwari, Very well said. And do not be afraid of being rude - we need not to be afraid to tell the truth. Sometimes people do such things that if you have to tell something then you will have no ways than being rude! So they deserve it!! About the "Special Power Kavach" (Huh?) it is said to be capable of strengthening planets more than stones and working for 6/7 first class quality stones all alone!! It surely sounds good but who knows if it also WORKS good or what?? See the principles of SA, the rule to determine benefic-malefic planets. They suggest to strengthen even 7 planets! They try to prove that it is safe and they strengthen all planets by kavach (?) and people wear so they prove it safe. But what if a person tries to strengthen the all 7 planets by stones? The outcome will be disasterous!! Then SA people will tell (probably) that the stones are flawed or something like that!!! I have heard some people sincerely saying that kavach did some good to them. So I guess it has something. But surely strengthening all the planets will be disasterous. SO I GUESS THE SO CALLED KAVACH DOES NOT EVEN STRENGTHEN THE PLANETS OR SOMETHING. THEN THE RESULT WOULD BE DISASTEROUS - WE ALL KNOW THIS PROVED TRUTH. But still it does some good to SOME PEOPLE, SOME TIMES - then I think it is a kind of yantra which gives some people some good. But it has no direct contact with strengthening planets. So I think it is some yantra which sometimes work for some people IN SOME AREAS (RANDOMLY, depending on luck) and for some people it does not. It is all matter of luck if the yantra will give some good or not. But as it does not strengthen planets (I suspect) it can never solve a particular problem. If it does, then it is a co incident or something. So I believe that is only a yantra which sometimes does some good being a yantra but it has nothing to do with strengthening planets. When incidentally it does some good then people think it is for strengthening the planets. But it is not! Because if all the planets were strengthened with the kavach as they claim, the result would be disasterous!! And you are absolutely correct why poeple use SA. The reason is, it is so simple to learn! You will see that many of them are westerners - they have no patience or capacity to enter real Vedic Astrology so they grabs SA as a slightly better way which works as a co-incident. SA, fortunately, is better than Western astrology ONLY BECAUSE it uses sidereal zodiac in stead of tropical - that IS the reason. So westerners grab it thinking they got a very easy but effective way. Ina-mina-dika!!! SA tells that Vedic Astrology is only confusing and contradictory. Actually the reason for people saying this is lack of brain, insight, intellect, patient to understand and stick to deep and real vedic astrology. SA is a well-organized team to cheat on people. You will notice they formed a society to convince people on this - names "INTERNATIONAL INSTITUTE OF PREDICTIVE ASTROLOGY" (http://www.iipa.net/) Where they have president, secretary, Chairman etc... NEEDLESS TO SAY ALL ARE CHOUDHRY'S OWN PEOPLE... A WELL ORGANIZED CHEATING CLUB TO GET QUICK $$$$. In their list (SATVA) they all post regularly to convince people to seek their services and sell kavach... You will be surprised to notice that the free software junior jyotish is made by a pure SA guy who is also Secretary General in their team. IN THE SOFTWARE IT GIVES BASIC ANALYSIS AND TRANSITS ACCORDING TO SA. So do you understand something? The software is actually a very good marketting policy! People will use this software as it is free, and seeing the SA analysis and Transit, they will be convinced by SA. So they will rush to buy all those rubbish with 300$ and seek consultation for 200/250 $. So Choudhry made his people develop and distribute the software free. It is nothing than a very good marektting policy of SA. Some so called 'disciple' are also active outside their list! In many list, when someone needs help, those SA guys respons quickly. So that they can convince people in problem to sell service and those kavach. Beware of them!!! And that Choudhry has bunch of excellent feedbacks and case studies where all the people were so helped and thanked him. (huh??) It needs no question to understand the trueness of those feedbacks - all made up stinky rubbish!!!! Thanks for such a very spirited post :-))))) Deepak vedic astrology, "rageshwari75" <rageshwari75> wrote: > Dear Desaiji, > > You are right on point!! > > SA really is a bunch of ****. Trust me it wasted 300 $ of a very good > friend of mine without getting her anything out of it. More than that > Mr. Choudhry gave her all kinds of false hopes and poor she believed > in him and really expected that her husband's life would change > completely by wearing one of Mr. Choudhry's Special Power (What a > joke!) Kavach... > > Unfortunately, I did not have much clue about astrology then to guide > her to not go the short route Mr. Choudhry and gang were professing. > > I really wish there could be some way of stopping this mischief with > Vedic Astrology in the form of SA. I sincerely believe that it is a > setup created by Mr. Choudhry and likes to make big bucks! I must say > even I was a bit lured to that side when I was a fresher. I read how > simple it was and what else would a beginner in a subject as complex > as astrology need? However, experience on their forum for about 3-4 > months told me that none of the predictions the members were doing on > the forum came true. So I just dropped it and started learning > conventional astrology. I think one of the reasons why people go to > SA is because the professor make it seem very simple and he makes it > sound as if like Sage Parashara et al wasted their lifetimes in > emptiness creating unneeded complexity and like he is the only one > with all the wisdom in the world... > > I am sorry for sounding a bit rude, but this SA thing really rolls on > my heads. > > Namaste. > > Rageshwari. > > vedic astrology, "monmuk111" <monmuk111> > wrote: > > Dear friends: > > > > Are you guys talking about the KP/Systems approach. I've sincerely > > with an open mind tried to study the Systems approach and I > geniunely > > feels that Systems approach is a big heap of crap. To give you an > > example--it says that for a Scorpio ascendant, Saturn in the most > > benefic planet. Now, per the PURE vedic astrology, Saturn is a > > functional malefic for Scorpio ascendant and this principle applies > > in my personal life, every time I go throug the antardasha of > Saturn, > > my life turns upside down. > > > > Now, when Systems approach says that Saturn is the MBPF for Scorpio > > ascendant, it is just a joke or a lie or just a heap of crap. > > > > I tried to apply the Sytems approach principles to the charts of my > > family and friends and NOTHING applies. Not one prediction made per > > Systems Approach coinsides with the lives and events in the life of > > my friends and family; whereas, all the PURE vedic principlea and > > predictions apply. > > > > This is just my experience of the KP/Systems approach. I'm not sure > > if KP and Systems are one and the same thing, I'm only commenting > on > > the Systems Approach developed by somebody named Chowdry. > > > > M.Desai > > > > > > vedic astrology, Punit Pandey > > <punitastrologer> wrote: > > > Dear Mr. Visti, > > > Thanks for your comments. > > > > > > I have my difference of opinion regarding KP (Even for lal kitab, > > but that I don't want to discuss here). It seems that KP has taken > > some other path than vedic astrology but if you go through this > > system, you will find parahsari jyotish in the heart. I see four > > major differences from parashari astrology - > > > > > > 1. Use of Placidus system of house division (western one) > > > > > > 2. User of SUB theory > > > > > > 3. Giving more importance to Naksharta. Saying that planet gives > > the result of nakshatra in which it is situated. > > > > > > 4. Differenct ayanamsa (but no one know which ayanamsa was used > by > > Parashara himself) > > > > > > From above you can see the 2,3 and 4 and based more or less on > > vedic astrology. SUB theory is devised from Vimshottari Dasha > system > > as it is. The same division has been used. The same is for > Nakshatra, > > some nadi author also give importance to nakshatra this way. And as > > you said that there is lack of concensus even among vedic > astrologers > > for ayanamsas. Only the point 1 (i.e. the house division system) > does > > not match with vedic astrology. > > > > > > Although I don't say that I have sufficient knowledge for > > discussing this topic but in my opinion even KP should be part of > > vedic astrology. Even I have no intention to hurt anyone. We must > > keep inventing and improving astrology, if it is possible. If we > will > > oppose KP, It will be just like scientists opposing astrology > without > > trying to understand it. Even some vedic astrologers are using > > principles similar to KP in some way or other to improve > predicitons. > > In my opinion KP with divisional charts and some more dasas might > > become next step in astrology. And it is only possible if we will > > first open ourselves for discussion on non-vedic sounding systems > of > > astrology. > > > > > > It will be good for discussion if we will get opinion of all > Gurus. > > I also want to know whether anything build/developed/invented on > the > > foundation of vedic astrology can be called vedic astrology or > not? > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks & Regards, > > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > Visti Larsen <vishnu@l...> wrote:Hare Rama Krishna---------------- > -- > > -----Dear Punit,It is all vedic astrology, however even within > vedic > > astrology, the Jyotishis have a mind of their own. Those who follow > > Parasari strictly understand that the nodes must always be mean, > and > > not true, to fulfill the duty assigned to them, hence by > implication > > of this, one uses mean nodes. But yet some people do not follow > this. > > As for ayanamsa, the reason for lack of consensus is lack of valid > > research. Some oppine an ayanamsa that is more than 10 degrees from > > lahiri, but i can assure you that their basis for their readings is > > much different from that taught by parasara.. mainly because those > > natives don't read scriptures to begin with, and make up their own > > rules along the way! This is not Jyotish the way Parasara wanted it > > to be. Krishnamurty created the KP system on a similar basis.. > namely > > that noone would teach him Jyotish! Tajik is incorperated into the > > systems we know today and is no doubt an interesting system of > > astrology, but i won't comment. Bhrigu-Jyotish is Nadi-Jyotish and > > Nadi-Jyotish is the same Jyotish that Parasara taught.. have no > doubt > > about that. Now to adress your question on acuracy.Once an > > astrologer gets a birth chart, his/her prime objective is to > confirm > > its acuracy. So the question of birthtime acuracy is simply not > > relevant, as usually the Astrologer is out to prove its acuracy to > > begin with. When the astrologer has done so, the readings may flow > > like nectar, so the question is Birth-time rectification. Hope this > > helps.Best wishes > > > Visti > > > --- > > > Sri Jagannath Center: http://.org > > > Bhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.org > > > iTRANS 99 Font: http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org----- Original > > Message ----- Punit Pandey vedic- > astrology > > Friday, April 18, 2003 1:16 PMRe: [vedic astrology] > > Re: accuracy in time of birth > > > Dear Mr. Partha, Sorry for mistake. I used to think that Jaimini, > > Tajik, Hora, Nadi, Bhrigu, KP, Lal Kitab etc. all belong to vedic > > astrology. Probably some are not as vedic. Seeking experts' > comments. > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > "V.partha sarathy" <partvinu5> wrote:hare rama krishna > > > dear punit > > > > > > the group discusses vedic astrology. the name of the group is > > written > > > in bold letters. i hope you understand > > > regards > > > partha > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Punit Pandey > > > <punitastrologer> wrote: > > > > > > > > Hello All KP Experts, > > > > > > > > I have a question to ask to all experts of this group. Today we > > > utilize sub and sub-sub lords of cusps in nearly all predictions > > > based on KP System. > > > > > > > > We all know that there is no consensus on ayanamsa, no > consensus > > on > > > true rahu and mean rahu, known variations of computer programs, > > > unsteady motion of planets, unavailability of atomic clocks at > > > hospitals/homes etc., is it OK to use sub-sub (cuspal sub-sub > lords > > > change in average of 25 seconds) lord or even sub lord (cuspal > sub > > > lords changes in average of 4 minuts)??? > > > > > > > > I think it is a basic question and good subject to debate. At > > least > > > lots of people in India don't have accurate timing with them > > > (accuracy less than 4 minutes). > > > > > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic astrology > > > > > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > > > Archives: vedic astrology > > > > > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > Archives: vedic astrology > > > > > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo http://search. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 21, 2003 Report Share Posted April 21, 2003 Dear Group, Is this a Forum to learn and exchange ideas and certain principles on Vedic Astrology, or a forum to bash other Systems, Westerners, Professor VKC, and people who seek a different, or vast road of eastern and western astrological systems and experience? I enjoy all branches of astrology, and I can tell you that there are both good Jyotishis and good people on the SATVA list, many of who have made successful predictions. Predictions fail and succeed on any list, and it is usually a human error in judgment, which all of us who are human are bound to make from time to time. I find this denigration of other System’s of Jyotish a bit juvenile and disheartening with respect to what the true spirit of jyotish is actually all about. I am Vice-President of the IIPA and not out to “convince” anyone of anything. Nor do I push or even sell kavaches, of any kind. I don’t “convince” people to buy my services, nor have I ever “cheated” anyone. I feel that people should be given a bit of respect in all forums that discuss Jyotish – whether or not you agree with any certain branch. I am not one of “Choudhry’s own people”, and not out to “get quick $$$$$”. I am simply my own person and an individual who studied System’s Approach along with a large variety of other systems – to include Western – and am very interested in ALL teachings of Astrology. I am a Westerner, and believe I do have “patience”, otherwise I would have stopped learning and studying 34 years ago when I began my initial interest in astrology. This forum is certainly a very legitimate forum, but you do not have to eradicate the legitimacy and intent of one forum, to prove the legitimacy and intent of another. I kindly ask that you show a bit more bold;font-style:italic">respect to italic">ALL who may be present on this list. To each his own… 12.0pt;font-family:Arial'> AUTOTEXTLIST \s "E-mail Signature" yes"> ~Namaste~ yes"> Sandy Crowther http://www.jupitersweb.com/ 12.0pt;font-family:Arial'> 10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial"> -----Original Message----- Deepak Singh [deepak_28_2 ] Monday, April 21, 2003 9:57 PM To: vedic astrology [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic? color:black">Hi Rageshwari, mso-fareast-font-family:"Courier New";color:black"> Very well said. And do not be afraid of being rude - we need not to be afraid to tell the truth. Sometimes people do such things that if you have to tell something then you will have no ways than being rude! So they deserve it!! About the "Special Power Kavach" (Huh?) it is said to be capable of strengthening planets more than stones and working for 6/7 first class quality stones all alone!! It surely sounds good but who knows if it also WORKS good or what?? See the principles of SA, the rule to determine benefic-malefic planets. They suggest to strengthen even 7 planets! They try to prove that it is safe and they strengthen all planets by kavach (?) and people wear so they prove it safe. But what if a person tries to strengthen the all 7 planets by stones? The outcome will be disasterous!! Then SA people will tell (probably) that the stones are flawed or something like that!!! I have heard some people sincerely saying that kavach did some good to them. So I guess it has something. But surely strengthening all the planets will be disasterous. SO I GUESS THE SO CALLED KAVACH DOES NOT EVEN STRENGTHEN THE PLANETS OR SOMETHING. THEN THE RESULT WOULD BE DISASTEROUS - WE ALL KNOW THIS PROVED TRUTH. But still it does some good to SOME PEOPLE, SOME TIMES - then I think it is a kind of yantra which gives some people some good. But it has no direct contact with strengthening planets. So I think it is some yantra which sometimes work for some people IN SOME AREAS (RANDOMLY, depending on luck) and for some people it does not. It is all matter of luck if the yantra will give some good or not. But as it does not strengthen planets (I suspect) it can never solve a particular problem. If it does, then it is a co incident or something. So I believe that is only a yantra which sometimes does some good being a yantra but it has nothing to do with strengthening planets. When incidentally it does some good then people think it is for strengthening the planets. But it is not! Because if all the planets were strengthened with the kavach as they claim, the result would be disasterous!! And you are absolutely correct why poeple use SA. The reason is, it is so simple to learn! You will see that many of them are westerners - they have no patience or capacity to enter real Vedic Astrology so they grabs SA as a slightly better way which works as a co-incident. SA, fortunately, is better than Western astrology ONLY BECAUSE it uses sidereal zodiac in stead of tropical - that IS the reason. So westerners grab it thinking they got a very easy but effective way. Ina-mina-dika!!! SA tells that Vedic Astrology is only confusing and contradictory. Actually the reason for people saying this is lack of brain, insight, intellect, patient to understand and stick to deep and real vedic astrology. SA is a well-organized team to cheat on people. You will notice they formed a society to convince people on this - names "INTERNATIONAL INSTITUTE OF PREDICTIVE ASTROLOGY" (http://www.iipa.net/) Where they have president, secretary, Chairman etc... NEEDLESS TO SAY ALL ARE CHOUDHRY'S OWN PEOPLE... A WELL ORGANIZED CHEATING CLUB TO GET QUICK $$$$. In their list (SATVA) they all post regularly to convince people to seek their services and sell kavach... You will be surprised to notice that the free software junior jyotish is made by a pure SA guy who is also Secretary General in their team. IN THE SOFTWARE IT GIVES BASIC ANALYSIS AND TRANSITS ACCORDING TO SA. So do you understand something? The software is actually a very good marketting policy! People will use this software as it is free, and seeing the SA analysis and Transit, they will be convinced by SA. So they will rush to buy all those rubbish with 300$ and seek consultation for 200/250 $. So Choudhry made his people develop and distribute the software free. It is nothing than a very good marektting policy of SA. Some so called 'disciple' are also active outside their list! In many list, when someone needs help, those SA guys respons quickly. So that they can convince people in problem to sell service and those kavach. Beware of them!!! And that Choudhry has bunch of excellent feedbacks and case studies where all the people were so helped and thanked him. (huh??) It needs no question to understand the trueness of those feedbacks - all made up stinky rubbish!!!! Thanks for such a very spirited post :-))))) Deepak vedic astrology, "rageshwari75" <rageshwari75> wrote: > Dear Desaiji, > > You are right on point!! > > SA really is a bunch of ****. Trust me it wasted 300 $ of a very good > friend of mine without getting her anything out of it. More than that > Mr. Choudhry gave her all kinds of false hopes and poor she believed > in him and really expected that her husband's life would change > completely by wearing one of Mr. Choudhry's Special Power (What a > joke!) Kavach... > > Unfortunately, I did not have much clue about astrology then to guide > her to not go the short route Mr. Choudhry and gang were professing. > > I really wish there could be some way of stopping this mischief with > Vedic Astrology in the form of SA. I sincerely believe that it is a > setup created by Mr. Choudhry and likes to make big bucks! I must say > even I was a bit lured to that side when I was a fresher. I read how > simple it was and what else would a beginner in a subject as complex > as astrology need? However, experience on their forum for about 3-4 > months told me that none of the predictions the members were doing on > the forum came true. So I just dropped it and started learning > conventional astrology. I think one of the reasons why people go to > SA is because the professor make it seem very simple and he makes it > sound as if like Sage Parashara et al wasted their lifetimes in > emptiness creating unneeded complexity and like he is the only one > with all the wisdom in the world... > > I am sorry for sounding a bit rude, but this SA thing really rolls on > my heads. > > Namaste. > > Rageshwari. > > vedic astrology, "monmuk111" <monmuk111> > wrote: > > Dear friends: > > > > Are you guys talking about the KP/Systems approach. I've sincerely > > with an open mind tried to study the Systems approach and I > geniunely > > feels that Systems approach is a big heap of crap. To give you an > > example--it says that for a Scorpio ascendant, Saturn in the most > > benefic planet. Now, per the PURE vedic astrology, Saturn is a > > functional malefic for Scorpio ascendant and this principle applies > > in my personal life, every time I go throug the antardasha of > Saturn, > > my life turns upside down. > > > > Now, when Systems approach says that Saturn is the MBPF for Scorpio > > ascendant, it is just a joke or a lie or just a heap of crap. > > > > I tried to apply the Sytems approach principles to the charts of my > > family and friends and NOTHING applies. Not one prediction made per > > Systems Approach coinsides with the lives and events in the life of > > my friends and family; whereas, all the PURE vedic principlea and > > predictions apply. > > > > This is just my experience of the KP/Systems approach. I'm not sure > > if KP and Systems are one and the same thing, I'm only commenting > on > > the Systems Approach developed by somebody named Chowdry. > > > > M.Desai > > > > > > vedic astrology, Punit Pandey > > <punitastrologer> wrote: > > > Dear Mr. Visti, > > > Thanks for your comments. > > > > > > I have my difference of opinion regarding KP (Even for lal kitab, > > but that I don't want to discuss here). It seems that KP has taken > > some other path than vedic astrology but if you go through this > > system, you will find parahsari jyotish in the heart. I see four > > major differences from parashari astrology - > > > > > > 1. Use of Placidus system of house division (western one) > > > > > > 2. User of SUB theory > > > > > > 3. Giving more importance to Naksharta. Saying that planet gives > > the result of nakshatra in which it is situated. > > > > > > 4. Differenct ayanamsa (but no one know which ayanamsa was used > by > > Parashara himself) > > > > > > From above you can see the 2,3 and 4 and based more or less on > > vedic astrology. SUB theory is devised from Vimshottari Dasha > system > > as it is. The same division has been used. The same is for > Nakshatra, > > some nadi author also give importance to nakshatra this way. And as > > you said that there is lack of concensus even among vedic > astrologers > > for ayanamsas. Only the point 1 (i.e. the house division system) > does > > not match with vedic astrology. > > > > > > Although I don't say that I have sufficient knowledge for > > discussing this topic but in my opinion even KP should be part of > > vedic astrology. Even I have no intention to hurt anyone. We must > > keep inventing and improving astrology, if it is possible. If we > will > > oppose KP, It will be just like scientists opposing astrology > without > > trying to understand it. Even some vedic astrologers are using > > principles similar to KP in some way or other to improve > predicitons. > > In my opinion KP with divisional charts and some more dasas might > > become next step in astrology. And it is only possible if we will > > first open ourselves for discussion on non-vedic sounding systems > of > > astrology. > > > > > > It will be good for discussion if we will get opinion of all > Gurus. > > I also want to know whether anything build/developed/invented on > the > > foundation of vedic astrology can be called vedic astrology or > not? > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks & Regards, > > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > Visti Larsen <vishnu@l...> wrote:Hare Rama Krishna---------------- > -- > > -----Dear Punit,It is all vedic astrology, however even within > vedic > > astrology, the Jyotishis have a mind of their own. Those who follow > > Parasari strictly understand that the nodes must always be mean, > and > > not true, to fulfill the duty assigned to them, hence by > implication > > of this, one uses mean nodes. But yet some people do not follow > this. > > As for ayanamsa, the reason for lack of consensus is lack of valid > > research. Some oppine an ayanamsa that is more than 10 degrees from > > lahiri, but i can assure you that their basis for their readings is > > much different from that taught by parasara.. mainly because those > > natives don't read scriptures to begin with, and make up their own > > rules along the way! This is not Jyotish the way Parasara wanted it > > to be. Krishnamurty created the KP system on a similar basis.. > namely > > that noone would teach him Jyotish! Tajik is incorperated into the > > systems we know today and is no doubt an interesting system of > > astrology, but i won't comment. Bhrigu-Jyotish is Nadi-Jyotish and > > Nadi-Jyotish is the same Jyotish that Parasara taught.. have no > doubt > > about that. Now to adress your question on acuracy.Once an > > astrologer gets a birth chart, his/her prime objective is to > confirm > > its acuracy. So the question of birthtime acuracy is simply not > > relevant, as usually the Astrologer is out to prove its acuracy to > > begin with. When the astrologer has done so, the readings may flow > > like nectar, so the question is Birth-time rectification. Hope this > > helps.Best wishes > > > Visti > > > --- > > > Sri Jagannath Center: http://.org > > > Bhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.org > > > iTRANS 99 Font: http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org----- Original > > Message ----- Punit Pandey vedic- > astrology > > Friday, April 18, 2003 1:16 PMRe: [vedic astrology] > > Re: accuracy in time of birth > > > Dear Mr. Partha, Sorry for mistake. I used to think that Jaimini, > > Tajik, Hora, Nadi, Bhrigu, KP, Lal Kitab etc. all belong to vedic > > astrology. Probably some are not as vedic. Seeking experts' > comments. > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > "V.partha sarathy" <partvinu5> wrote:hare rama krishna > > > dear punit > > > > > > the group discusses vedic astrology. the name of the group is > > written > > > in bold letters. i hope you understand > > > regards > > > partha > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Punit Pandey > > > <punitastrologer> wrote: > > > > > > > > Hello All KP Experts, > > > > > > > > I have a question to ask to all experts of this group. Today we > > > utilize sub and sub-sub lords of cusps in nearly all predictions > > > based on KP System. > > > > > > > > We all know that there is no consensus on ayanamsa, no > consensus > > on > > > true rahu and mean rahu, known variations of computer programs, > > > unsteady motion of planets, unavailability of atomic clocks at > > > hospitals/homes etc., is it OK to use sub-sub (cuspal sub-sub > lords > > > change in average of 25 seconds) lord or even sub lord (cuspal > sub > > > lords changes in average of 4 minuts)??? > > > > > > > > I think it is a basic question and good subject to debate. At > > least > > > lots of people in India don't have accurate timing with them > > > (accuracy less than 4 minutes). > > > > > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic astrology > > > > > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > > > Archives: vedic astrology > > > > > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > Archives: vedic astrology > > > > > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo http://search. line-break"> windowtext"> color:black"> "Courier New";mso-fareast-font-family:"Courier New";color:black"> || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || Your use of is subject to the Terms of Service. mso-color-alt:windowtext"> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 21, 2003 Report Share Posted April 21, 2003 What is developed by CHOWDRY is NOT NOT the K.P.System. The KP System was developed by Late Prof K.S.Krishnamurti- and it is an extention of the Vedic Sysyem. It was called the Stellar System, but is called KP krishnamurthy paddhati, to honour the Person who developed it. There is already a posting showing the differences between it and the Vedic System.monmuk111 <monmuk111 > wrote: Dear friends:Are you guys talking about the KP/Systems approach. I've sincerely with an open mind tried to study the Systems approach and I geniunely feels that Systems approach is a big heap of crap. To give you an example--it says that for a Scorpio ascendant, Saturn in the most benefic planet. Now, per the PURE vedic astrology, Saturn is a functional malefic for Scorpio ascendant and this principle applies in my personal life, every time I go throug the antardasha of Saturn, my life turns upside down. Now, when Systems approach says that Saturn is the MBPF for Scorpio ascendant, it is just a joke or a lie or just a heap of crap.I tried to apply the Sytems approach principles to the charts of my family and friends and NOTHING applies. Not one prediction made per Systems Approach coinsides with the lives and events in the life of my friends and family; whereas, all the PURE vedic principlea and predictions apply.This is just my experience of the KP/Systems approach. I'm not sure if KP and Systems are one and the same thing, I'm only commenting on the Systems Approach developed by somebody named Chowdry.M.Desai--- In vedic astrology, Punit Pandey <punitastrologer> wrote:> Dear Mr. Visti,> Thanks for your comments. > > I have my difference of opinion regarding KP (Even for lal kitab, but that I don't want to discuss here). It seems that KP has taken some other path than vedic astrology but if you go through this system, you will find parahsari jyotish in the heart. I see four major differences from parashari astrology -> > 1. Use of Placidus system of house division (western one)> > 2. User of SUB theory> > 3. Giving more importance to Naksharta. Saying that planet gives the result of nakshatra in which it is situated.> > 4. Differenct ayanamsa (but no one know which ayanamsa was used by Parashara himself)> > From above you can see the 2,3 and 4 and based more or less on vedic astrology. SUB theory is devised from Vimshottari Dasha system as it is. The same division has been used. The same is for Nakshatra, some nadi author also give importance to nakshatra this way. And as you said that there is lack of concensus even among vedic astrologers for ayanamsas. Only the point 1 (i.e. the house division system) does not match with vedic astrology. > > Although I don't say that I have sufficient knowledge for discussing this topic but in my opinion even KP should be part of vedic astrology. Even I have no intention to hurt anyone. We must keep inventing and improving astrology, if it is possible. If we will oppose KP, It will be just like scientists opposing astrology without trying to understand it. Even some vedic astrologers are using principles similar to KP in some way or other to improve predicitons. In my opinion KP with divisional charts and some more dasas might become next step in astrology. And it is only possible if we will first open ourselves for discussion on non-vedic sounding systems of astrology.> > It will be good for discussion if we will get opinion of all Gurus. I also want to know whether anything build/developed/invented on the foundation of vedic astrology can be called vedic astrology or not? > > > > Thanks & Regards,> Punit Pandey> > Visti Larsen <vishnu@l...> wrote:Hare Rama Krishna-----------------------Dear Punit,It is all vedic astrology, however even within vedic astrology, the Jyotishis have a mind of their own. Those who follow Parasari strictly understand that the nodes must always be mean, and not true, to fulfill the duty assigned to them, hence by implication of this, one uses mean nodes. But yet some people do not follow this. As for ayanamsa, the reason for lack of consensus is lack of valid research. Some oppine an ayanamsa that is more than 10 degrees from lahiri, but i can assure you that their basis for their readings is much different from that taught by parasara.. mainly because those natives don't read scriptures to begin with, and make up their own rules along the way! This is not Jyotish the way Parasara wanted it to be. Krishnamurty created the KP system on a similar basis.. namely that noone would teach him Jyotish! Tajik is incorperated into the systems we know today and is no doubt an interesting system of astrology, but i won't comment. Bhrigu-Jyotish is Nadi-Jyotish and Nadi-Jyotish is the same Jyotish that Parasara taught.. have no doubt about that. Now to adress your question on acuracy.Once an astrologer gets a birth chart, his/her prime objective is to confirm its acuracy. So the question of birthtime acuracy is simply not relevant, as usually the Astrologer is out to prove its acuracy to begin with. When the astrologer has done so, the readings may flow like nectar, so the question is Birth-time rectification. Hope this helps.Best wishes> Visti> ---> Sri Jagannath Center: http://.org> Bhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.org> iTRANS 99 Font: http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org----- Original Message ----- Punit Pandey vedic astrology Friday, April 18, 2003 1:16 PMRe: [vedic astrology] Re: accuracy in time of birth> Dear Mr. Partha, Sorry for mistake. I used to think that Jaimini, Tajik, Hora, Nadi, Bhrigu, KP, Lal Kitab etc. all belong to vedic astrology. Probably some are not as vedic. Seeking experts' comments. Punit Pandey> > "V.partha sarathy" <partvinu5> wrote:hare rama krishna> dear punit> > the group discusses vedic astrology. the name of the group is written > in bold letters. i hope you understand> regards> partha> > > vedic astrology, Punit Pandey > <punitastrologer> wrote:> > > > Hello All KP Experts,> > > > I have a question to ask to all experts of this group. Today we > utilize sub and sub-sub lords of cusps in nearly all predictions > based on KP System. > > > > We all know that there is no consensus on ayanamsa, no consensus on > true rahu and mean rahu, known variations of computer programs, > unsteady motion of planets, unavailability of atomic clocks at > hospitals/homes etc., is it OK to use sub-sub (cuspal sub-sub lords > change in average of 25 seconds) lord or even sub lord (cuspal sub > lords changes in average of 4 minuts)???> > > > I think it is a basic question and good subject to debate. At least > lots of people in India don't have accurate timing with them > (accuracy less than 4 minutes).> > > > Thanks in advance.> > > > Regards,> > > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.> > > > Archives: vedic astrology> > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > Archives: vedic astrology> > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > ........ May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > Sponsor> > Archives: vedic astrology> > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Do you ? The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 22, 2003 Report Share Posted April 22, 2003 Dear list members, Let us not discuss the same further. Like medicine (Allopathy, Homeopathy, Ayurveda etc) there are so many systems/techniques available in astrology. You any one does not want to study a particular system let him/her not. It they have any doubt on the system there are so many groups which are specially meant for these techniques. You post your queries there instead of this group. My sincere request is don't use the word CRAP etc. We should respect others before we expect the same. With warm regards Muruli. S sridhar k [kopparsa ] Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2003 11:01 AMvedic astrologySubject: Re: [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic? dEAR fRIENDS What is developed by CHOWDRY is NOT NOT the K.P.System. The KP System was developed by Late Prof K.S.Krishnamurti- and it is an extention of the Vedic Sysyem. It was called the Stellar System, but is called KP krishnamurthy paddhati, to honour the Person who developed it. There is already a posting showing the differences between it and the Vedic System.monmuk111 <monmuk111 > wrote: Dear friends:Are you guys talking about the KP/Systems approach. I've sincerely with an open mind tried to study the Systems approach and I geniunely feels that Systems approach is a big heap of crap. To give you an example--it says that for a Scorpio ascendant, Saturn in the most benefic planet. Now, per the PURE vedic astrology, Saturn is a functional malefic for Scorpio ascendant and this principle applies in my personal life, every time I go throug the antardasha of Saturn, my life turns upside down. Now, when Systems approach says that Saturn is the MBPF for Scorpio ascendant, it is just a joke or a lie or just a heap of crap.I tried to apply the Sytems approach principles to the charts of my family and friends and NOTHING applies. Not one prediction made per Systems Approach coinsides with the lives and events in th! e life of my friends and family; whereas, all the PURE vedic principlea and predictions apply.This is just my experience of the KP/Systems approach. I'm not sure if KP and Systems are one and the same thing, I'm only commenting on the Systems Approach developed by somebody named Chowdry.M.Desai--- In vedic astrology, Punit Pandey <punitastrologer> wrote:> Dear Mr. Visti,> Thanks for your comments. > > I have my difference of opinion regarding KP (Even for lal kitab, but that I don't want to discuss here). It seems that KP has taken some other path than vedic astrology but if you go through this system, you will find parahsari jyotish in the heart. I see four major differences from parashari astrology -> > 1. Use of Placidus system of house division (western one)> > 2. User of SUB theory> > 3. Giving more importance t! o Naksharta. Saying that planet gives the result of nakshatra in which it is situated.> > 4. Differenct ayanamsa (but no one know which ayanamsa was used by Parashara himself)> > From above you can see the 2,3 and 4 and based more or less on vedic astrology. SUB theory is devised from Vimshottari Dasha system as it is. The same division has been used. The same is for Nakshatra, some nadi author also give importance to nakshatra this way. And as you said that there is lack of concensus even among vedic astrologers for ayanamsas. Only the point 1 (i.e. the house division system) does not match with vedic astrology. > > Although I don't say that I have sufficient knowledge for discussing this topic but in my opinion even KP should be part of vedic astrology. Even I have no intention to hurt anyone. We must keep inventing and improving astrology, if it is possible. If we will oppose K! P, It will be just like scientists opposing astrology without trying to understand it. Even some vedic astrologers are using principles similar to KP in some way or other to improve predicitons. In my opinion KP with divisional charts and some more dasas might become next step in astrology. And it is only possible if we will first open ourselves for discussion on non-vedic sounding systems of astrology.> > It will be good for discussion if we will get opinion of all Gurus. I also want to know whether anything build/developed/invented on the foundation of vedic astrology can be called vedic astrology or not? > > > > Thanks & Regards,> Punit Pandey> > Visti Larsen <vishnu@l...> wrote:Hare Rama Krishna-----------------------Dear Punit,It is all vedic astrology, however even within vedic astrology, the Jyotishis have a mind of their own. Those who follow Parasari strictly understand that the nodes must always be mean, and not true, to fulfill the duty assigned to them, hence by implication of this, one uses mean nodes. But yet some people do not follow this. As for ayanamsa, the reason for lack of consensus is lack of valid research. Some oppine an ayanamsa that is more than 10 degrees from lahiri, but i can assure you that their basis for their readings is much different from that taught by parasara.. mainly because those natives don't read scriptures to begin with, and make up their own rules along the way! This is not Jyotish the way Parasara wanted it to be. Krishnamurty created the KP system on a similar basis.. namely that noone would teach him Jyotish! Tajik is incorperated into the systems we know today and is no doubt an interesting system of astrology, but i won't comment. Bhrigu-Jyotish is Nadi-Jyotish and Nadi-Jyotish is the same Jyotish that Parasara taught.! . have no doubt about that. Now to adress your question on acuracy.Once an astrologer gets a birth chart, his/her prime objective is to confirm its acuracy. So the question of birthtime acuracy is simply not relevant, as usually the Astrologer is out to prove its acuracy to begin with. When the astrologer has done so, the readings may flow like nectar, so the question is Birth-time rectification. Hope this helps.Best wishes> Visti> ---> Sri Jagannath Center: http://.org> Bhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.org> iTRANS 99 Font: http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org----- Original Message ----- Punit Pandey vedic astrology Friday, April 18, 2003 1:16 PMRe: [vedic astrology] Re: accuracy in time of birth> Dear Mr. Partha, Sorry for mistake. I used to think that Jaimini, Tajik, Hora, Nadi, Bhrigu, KP, Lal Kitab etc. all belong to vedic astrology. Probably some are not as vedic. Seeking experts' comments. Punit Pandey> > "V.partha sarathy" <partvinu5> wrote:hare rama krishna> dear punit> > the group discusses vedic astrology. the name of the group is written > in bold letters. i hope you understand> regards> partha> > > vedic astrology, Punit Pandey > <punitastrologer> wrote:> > > > Hello All KP Experts,> > > > I have a question to ask to all experts of this group. Today we > utilize sub and sub-sub lords of cusps in nearly all predictions > based on KP System. > > > > We all know that there is no consensus on ayanamsa, no consensus on > true r! ahu and mean rahu, known variations of computer programs, > unsteady motion of planets, unavailability of atomic clocks at > hospitals/homes etc., is it OK to use sub-sub (cuspal sub-sub lords > change in average of 25 seconds) lord or even sub lord (cuspal sub > lords changes in average of 4 minuts)???> > > > I think it is a basic question and good subject to debate. At least > lots of people in India don't have accurate timing with them > (accuracy less than 4 minutes).> > > > Thanks in advance.> > > > Regards,> > > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.> > > > Archives: vedic astrology> > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > Archives: vedic astrology> > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank! mail to vedic astrology-> > ........ May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > Terms of Service. > > Sponsor> > Archives: vedic astrology> > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > Your use of is subject t! o the > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 22, 2003 Report Share Posted April 22, 2003 Dear Sandyji, I apologize for losing my patience. However, I still am not ready to change my mind about SA. Like you, I was a student of SA too. There have been numerous weekends when I would crawl over the pages of www.yournetastrologer.com to understand the various case studies and other stuff by Mr. Choudhry. But guess what, I could not make sense out of it. I agree that unwarranted bashing is not constructive. However, I truly intended to make a point in the last post i.e. SA does not do justice to anybody and least to its customers who spend so many $$$. My friend feels so cheated now that she does not even want to do remedies that conventional vedic astrologers are suggesting. To her all of these seems like a big business to cheat people. But that is not what Vedic Astrology stands for. This science is there to help people and not to discourage them from getting any help. I could have not said a word about SA and just kept quiet and respected people's opinions. But I think that would not have helped my cohorts on this group. I must say the truth even if it is bitter. And the truth is I am yet to meet anybody who feels fortunate to have applied SA. Neither have I seen any prediction on SATVA or SAMVA lists coming true. But I have kept my mind open. If you or any other SATVA/SAMVA learned peoples would like to help me change my mind, they are most welcome. Thanks for listening. Namaste. Rageshwari. vedic astrology, "Sandy Crowther" <sandy@t...> wrote: > Dear Group, > > Is this a Forum to learn and exchange ideas and certain principles on Vedic > Astrology, or a forum to bash other Systems, Westerners, Professor VKC, and > people who seek a different, or vast road of eastern and western > astrological systems and experience? > > I enjoy all branches of astrology, and I can tell you that there are both > good Jyotishis and good people on the SATVA list, many of who have made > successful predictions. Predictions fail and succeed on any list, and it is > usually a human error in judgment, which all of us who are human are bound > to make from time to time. I find this denigration of other System's of > Jyotish a bit juvenile and disheartening with respect to what the true > spirit of jyotish is actually all about. > > I am Vice-President of the IIPA and not out to "convince" anyone of > anything. Nor do I push or even sell kavaches, of any kind. I don't > "convince" people to buy my services, nor have I ever "cheated" anyone. I > feel that people should be given a bit of respect in all forums that discuss > Jyotish – whether or not you agree with any certain branch. I am not one of > "Choudhry's own people", and not out to "get quick $$$$$". I am simply my > own person and an individual who studied System's Approach along with a > large variety of other systems – to include Western – and am very interested > in ALL teachings of Astrology. I am a Westerner, and believe I do have > "patience", otherwise I would have stopped learning and studying 34 years > ago when I began my initial interest in astrology. > > This forum is certainly a very legitimate forum, but you do not have to > eradicate the legitimacy and intent of one forum, to prove the legitimacy > and intent of another. I kindly ask that you show a bit more respect to ALL > who may be present on this list. To each his own… > > > ~Namaste~ > Sandy Crowther > http://www.jupitersweb.com/ <http://www.jupitersweb.com/> > > > Deepak Singh [deepak_28_2] > Monday, April 21, 2003 9:57 PM > vedic astrology > [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic? > > Hi Rageshwari, > > Very well said. And do not be afraid of being rude - > we need not to be afraid to tell the truth. Sometimes > people do such things that if you have to tell > something then you will have no ways than being rude! > So they deserve it!! > > About the "Special Power Kavach" (Huh?) it is said to > be capable of strengthening planets more than stones > and working for 6/7 first class quality stones all > alone!! It surely sounds good but who knows if it also > WORKS good or what?? > > See the principles of SA, the rule to determine > benefic-malefic planets. They suggest to strengthen > even 7 planets! They try to prove that it is safe and > they strengthen all planets by kavach (?) and people > wear so they prove it safe. > > But what if a person tries to strengthen the all 7 > planets by stones? The outcome will be disasterous!! > Then SA people will tell (probably) that the stones > are flawed or something like that!!! > > I have heard some people sincerely saying that kavach > did some good to them. So I guess it has something. > But surely strengthening all the planets will be > disasterous. > > SO I GUESS THE SO CALLED KAVACH DOES NOT EVEN > STRENGTHEN THE PLANETS OR SOMETHING. THEN THE RESULT > WOULD BE DISASTEROUS - WE ALL KNOW THIS PROVED TRUTH. > > But still it does some good to SOME PEOPLE, SOME TIMES > - then I think it is a kind of yantra which gives some > people some good. But it has no direct contact with > strengthening planets. So I think it is some yantra > which sometimes work for some people IN SOME AREAS > (RANDOMLY, depending on luck) and for some people it > does not. It is all matter of luck if the yantra will > give some good or not. But as it does not strengthen > planets (I suspect) it can never solve a particular > problem. If it does, then it is a co incident or > something. > > So I believe that is only a yantra which sometimes > does some good being a yantra but it has nothing to do > with strengthening planets. When incidentally it does > some good then people think it is for strengthening > the planets. But it is not! Because if all the planets > were strengthened with the kavach as they claim, the > result would be disasterous!! > > And you are absolutely correct why poeple use SA. The > reason is, it is so simple to learn! You will see that > many of them are westerners - they have no patience or > capacity to enter real Vedic Astrology so they grabs > SA as a slightly better way which works as a > co-incident. SA, fortunately, is better than Western > astrology ONLY BECAUSE it uses sidereal zodiac in > stead of tropical - that IS the reason. So westerners > grab it thinking they got a very easy but effective > way. Ina-mina-dika!!! > > SA tells that Vedic Astrology is only confusing and > contradictory. Actually the reason for people saying > this is lack of brain, insight, intellect, patient to > understand and stick to deep and real vedic astrology. > > SA is a well-organized team to cheat on people. You > will notice they formed a society to convince people > on this - names "INTERNATIONAL INSTITUTE OF PREDICTIVE > ASTROLOGY" ( http://www.iipa.net/) Where they have > president, secretary, Chairman etc... NEEDLESS TO SAY > ALL ARE CHOUDHRY'S OWN PEOPLE... A WELL ORGANIZED > CHEATING CLUB TO GET QUICK $$$$. In their list (SATVA) > they all post regularly to convince people to seek > their services and sell kavach... > > You will be surprised to notice that the free software > junior jyotish is made by a pure SA guy who is also > Secretary General in their team. IN THE SOFTWARE IT > GIVES BASIC ANALYSIS AND TRANSITS ACCORDING TO SA. > > So do you understand something? The software is > actually a very good marketting policy! People will > use this software as it is free, and seeing the SA > analysis and Transit, they will be convinced by SA. So > they will rush to buy all those rubbish with 300$ and > seek consultation for 200/250 $. So Choudhry made his > people develop and distribute the software free. It is > nothing than a very good marektting policy of SA. > > Some so called 'disciple' are also active outside > their list! In many list, when someone needs help, > those SA guys respons quickly. So that they can > convince people in problem to sell service and those > kavach. Beware of them!!! > > And that Choudhry has bunch of excellent feedbacks and > case studies where all the people were so helped and > thanked him. (huh??) It needs no question to > understand the trueness of those feedbacks - all made > up stinky rubbish!!!! > > Thanks for such a very spirited post :-))))) > Deepak > > > > vedic astrology, "rageshwari75" > <rageshwari75> wrote: > > Dear Desaiji, > > > > You are right on point!! > > > > SA really is a bunch of ****. Trust me it wasted 300 > $ of a very good > > friend of mine without getting her anything out of > it. More than that > > Mr. Choudhry gave her all kinds of false hopes and > poor she believed > > in him and really expected that her husband's life > would change > > completely by wearing one of Mr. Choudhry's Special > Power (What a > > joke!) Kavach... > > > > Unfortunately, I did not have much clue about > astrology then to guide > > her to not go the short route Mr. Choudhry and gang > were professing. > > > > I really wish there could be some way of stopping > this mischief with > > Vedic Astrology in the form of SA. I sincerely > believe that it is a > > setup created by Mr. Choudhry and likes to make big > bucks! I must say > > even I was a bit lured to that side when I was a > fresher. I read how > > simple it was and what else would a beginner in a > subject as complex > > as astrology need? However, experience on their > forum for about 3-4 > > months told me that none of the predictions the > members were doing on > > the forum came true. So I just dropped it and > started learning > > conventional astrology. I think one of the reasons > why people go to > > SA is because the professor make it seem very simple > and he makes it > > sound as if like Sage Parashara et al wasted their > lifetimes in > > emptiness creating unneeded complexity and like he > is the only one > > with all the wisdom in the world... > > > > I am sorry for sounding a bit rude, but this SA > thing really rolls on > > my heads. > > > > Namaste. > > > > Rageshwari. > > > > vedic astrology, "monmuk111" > <monmuk111> > > wrote: > > > Dear friends: > > > > > > Are you guys talking about the KP/Systems > approach. I've sincerely > > > with an open mind tried to study the Systems > approach and I > > geniunely > > > feels that Systems approach is a big heap of crap. > To give you an > > > example--it says that for a Scorpio ascendant, > Saturn in the most > > > benefic planet. Now, per the PURE vedic astrology, > Saturn is a > > > functional malefic for Scorpio ascendant and this > principle applies > > > in my personal life, every time I go throug the > antardasha of > > Saturn, > > > my life turns upside down. > > > > > > Now, when Systems approach says that Saturn is the > MBPF for Scorpio > > > ascendant, it is just a joke or a lie or just a > heap of crap. > > > > > > I tried to apply the Sytems approach principles to > the charts of my > > > family and friends and NOTHING applies. Not one > prediction made per > > > Systems Approach coinsides with the lives and > events in the life of > > > my friends and family; whereas, all the PURE vedic > principlea and > > > predictions apply. > > > > > > This is just my experience of the KP/Systems > approach. I'm not sure > > > if KP and Systems are one and the same thing, I'm > only commenting > > on > > > the Systems Approach developed by somebody named > Chowdry. > > > > > > M.Desai > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Punit > Pandey > > > <punitastrologer> wrote: > > > > Dear Mr. Visti, > > > > Thanks for your comments. > > > > > > > > I have my difference of opinion regarding KP > (Even for lal kitab, > > > but that I don't want to discuss here). It seems > that KP has taken > > > some other path than vedic astrology but if you go > through this > > > system, you will find parahsari jyotish in the > heart. I see four > > > major differences from parashari astrology - > > > > > > > > 1. Use of Placidus system of house division > (western one) > > > > > > > > 2. User of SUB theory > > > > > > > > 3. Giving more importance to Naksharta. Saying > that planet gives > > > the result of nakshatra in which it is situated. > > > > > > > > 4. Differenct ayanamsa (but no one know which > ayanamsa was used > > by > > > Parashara himself) > > > > > > > > From above you can see the 2,3 and 4 and based > more or less on > > > vedic astrology. SUB theory is devised from > Vimshottari Dasha > > system > > > as it is. The same division has been used. The > same is for > > Nakshatra, > > > some nadi author also give importance to nakshatra > this way. And as > > > you said that there is lack of concensus even > among vedic > > astrologers > > > for ayanamsas. Only the point 1 (i.e. the house > division system) > > does > > > not match with vedic astrology. > > > > > > > > Although I don't say that I have sufficient > knowledge for > > > discussing this topic but in my opinion even KP > should be part of > > > vedic astrology. Even I have no intention to hurt > anyone. We must > > > keep inventing and improving astrology, if it is > possible. If we > > will > > > oppose KP, It will be just like scientists > opposing astrology > > without > > > trying to understand it. Even some vedic > astrologers are using > > > principles similar to KP in some way or other to > improve > > predicitons. > > > In my opinion KP with divisional charts and some > more dasas might > > > become next step in astrology. And it is only > possible if we will > > > first open ourselves for discussion on non-vedic > sounding systems > > of > > > astrology. > > > > > > > > It will be good for discussion if we will get > opinion of all > > Gurus. > > > I also want to know whether anything > build/developed/invented on > > the > > > foundation of vedic astrology can be called vedic > astrology or > > not? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks & Regards, > > > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > > > Visti Larsen <vishnu@l...> wrote:Hare Rama > Krishna---------------- > > -- > > > -----Dear Punit,It is all vedic astrology, however > even within > > vedic > > > astrology, the Jyotishis have a mind of their own. > Those who follow > > > Parasari strictly understand that the nodes must > always be mean, > > and > > > not true, to fulfill the duty assigned to them, > hence by > > implication > > > of this, one uses mean nodes. But yet some people > do not follow > > this. > > > As for ayanamsa, the reason for lack of consensus > is lack of valid > > > research. Some oppine an ayanamsa that is more > than 10 degrees from > > > lahiri, but i can assure you that their basis for > their readings is > > > much different from that taught by parasara.. > mainly because those > > > natives don't read scriptures to begin with, and > make up their own > > > rules along the way! This is not Jyotish the way > Parasara wanted it > > > to be. Krishnamurty created the KP system on a > similar basis.. > > namely > > > that noone would teach him Jyotish! Tajik is > incorperated into the > > > systems we know today and is no doubt an > interesting system of > > > astrology, but i won't comment. Bhrigu-Jyotish is > Nadi-Jyotish and > > > Nadi-Jyotish is the same Jyotish that Parasara > taught.. have no > > doubt > > > about that. Now to adress your question on > acuracy.Once an > > > astrologer gets a birth chart, his/her prime > objective is to > > confirm > > > its acuracy. So the question of birthtime acuracy > is simply not > > > relevant, as usually the Astrologer is out to > prove its acuracy to > > > begin with. When the astrologer has done so, the > readings may flow > > > like nectar, so the question is Birth-time > rectification. Hope this > > > helps.Best wishes > > > > Visti > > > > --- > > > > Sri Jagannath Center: http://.org > > > > Bhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.org > > > > iTRANS 99 Font: > http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org----- Original > > > Message ----- Punit Pandey vedic- > > astrology > > > Friday, April 18, 2003 1:16 PMRe: > [vedic astrology] > > > Re: accuracy in time of birth > > > > Dear Mr. Partha, Sorry for mistake. I used to > think that Jaimini, > > > Tajik, Hora, Nadi, Bhrigu, KP, Lal Kitab etc. all > belong to vedic > > > astrology. Probably some are not as vedic. Seeking > experts' > > comments. > > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > > > "V.partha sarathy" <partvinu5> wrote:hare > rama krishna > > > > dear punit > > > > > > > > the group discusses vedic astrology. the name of > the group is > > > written > > > > in bold letters. i hope you understand > > > > regards > > > > partha > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Punit > Pandey > > > > <punitastrologer> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Hello All KP Experts, > > > > > > > > > > I have a question to ask to all experts of > this group. Today we > > > > utilize sub and sub-sub lords of cusps in nearly > all predictions > > > > based on KP System. > > > > > > > > > > We all know that there is no consensus on > ayanamsa, no > > consensus > > > on > > > > true rahu and mean rahu, known variations of > computer programs, > > > > unsteady motion of planets, unavailability of > atomic clocks at > > > > hospitals/homes etc., is it OK to use sub-sub > (cuspal sub-sub > > lords > > > > change in average of 25 seconds) lord or even > sub lord (cuspal > > sub > > > > lords changes in average of 4 minuts)??? > > > > > > > > > > I think it is a basic question and good > subject to debate. At > > > least > > > > lots of people in India don't have accurate > timing with them > > > > (accuracy less than 4 minutes). > > > > > > > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > Group info: > vedic astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the > Terms of > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > > > > > Archives: > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > Group info: > vedic astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the > Terms of > > > Service. > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > Archives: > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > Group info: > vedic astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the > Terms of > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo > http://search. > > > > Sponsor > > <http://rd./M=249982.3179269.4495679.1728375/D=egroupweb/S=17 050826 > 86:HM/A=1524963/R=0/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi-bin/autoredir? camp=556&linei > d=3179269?=egroupweb&pos=HM> > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > Terms of Service > <> . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 22, 2003 Report Share Posted April 22, 2003 JAYA JAGANNATHA! Dear friends, Namaste. I'm not conversant in detail with the KP system, but as far as I remember from our talks on the Nyderabad SJC conference, they use the Vimsottari lords as lords of Nakshatras. If you look more deeply into BPHS, you will see that Maharishis Parashara assigns different planets ot the 27 Naksatras, whcih become rulers of the initial Vimsottari Dasa if their Moon is placed there. However, I would not equate this to rulership of the Nakshatra itself, for which he presents 27 Devatas. You should bear in mind that for Astottari, Sodasottari or for that matter any other Udu dasha, the distribution of dasha lords linked to nakshatras is utterly different. So even if one assumes that nakshatras are lorded by Vimsottari lords, if let's say Astottari describes his chart better than this will not work. Alos reffering to Deha and Jiva, for me it is too far stretched, so I cna't really relate to it. As you may know they use not only nakshatra lords but sublords, sub-sublords etc. This however does not disprove that the KP system may give accurate predictions. Those who use it may give their experience. In the same vain, Vedic astrologers do not consider western astrology to be sufficiently grounded, however some western astrologers may still be able to issue proper predictions. This is because the astrological calculations are tools that we use but intuition or giudance from the Paramatma is actually crucial. If one fdoes not get guidance from God then no amount of astrological tools however authentic will help him to give accurate predictions. Yours, Gauranga Das Vedic Astrologer gauranga Jyotish Remedies: WWW.BRIHASPATI.NET Phone:+36-309-140-839 - "monmuk111" <monmuk111 <vedic astrology> Monday, April 21, 2003 7:05 PM [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic? > Dear friends: > > Are you guys talking about the KP/Systems approach. I've sincerely > with an open mind tried to study the Systems approach and I geniunely > feels that Systems approach is a big heap of crap. To give you an > example--it says that for a Scorpio ascendant, Saturn in the most > benefic planet. Now, per the PURE vedic astrology, Saturn is a > functional malefic for Scorpio ascendant and this principle applies > in my personal life, every time I go throug the antardasha of Saturn, > my life turns upside down. > > Now, when Systems approach says that Saturn is the MBPF for Scorpio > ascendant, it is just a joke or a lie or just a heap of crap. > > I tried to apply the Sytems approach principles to the charts of my > family and friends and NOTHING applies. Not one prediction made per > Systems Approach coinsides with the lives and events in the life of > my friends and family; whereas, all the PURE vedic principlea and > predictions apply. > > This is just my experience of the KP/Systems approach. I'm not sure > if KP and Systems are one and the same thing, I'm only commenting on > the Systems Approach developed by somebody named Chowdry. > > M.Desai > > > vedic astrology, Punit Pandey > <punitastrologer> wrote: > > Dear Mr. Visti, > > Thanks for your comments. > > > > I have my difference of opinion regarding KP (Even for lal kitab, > but that I don't want to discuss here). It seems that KP has taken > some other path than vedic astrology but if you go through this > system, you will find parahsari jyotish in the heart. I see four > major differences from parashari astrology - > > > > 1. Use of Placidus system of house division (western one) > > > > 2. User of SUB theory > > > > 3. Giving more importance to Naksharta. Saying that planet gives > the result of nakshatra in which it is situated. > > > > 4. Differenct ayanamsa (but no one know which ayanamsa was used by > Parashara himself) > > > > From above you can see the 2,3 and 4 and based more or less on > vedic astrology. SUB theory is devised from Vimshottari Dasha system > as it is. The same division has been used. The same is for Nakshatra, > some nadi author also give importance to nakshatra this way. And as > you said that there is lack of concensus even among vedic astrologers > for ayanamsas. Only the point 1 (i.e. the house division system) does > not match with vedic astrology. > > > > Although I don't say that I have sufficient knowledge for > discussing this topic but in my opinion even KP should be part of > vedic astrology. Even I have no intention to hurt anyone. We must > keep inventing and improving astrology, if it is possible. If we will > oppose KP, It will be just like scientists opposing astrology without > trying to understand it. Even some vedic astrologers are using > principles similar to KP in some way or other to improve predicitons. > In my opinion KP with divisional charts and some more dasas might > become next step in astrology. And it is only possible if we will > first open ourselves for discussion on non-vedic sounding systems of > astrology. > > > > It will be good for discussion if we will get opinion of all Gurus. > I also want to know whether anything build/developed/invented on the > foundation of vedic astrology can be called vedic astrology or not? > > > > > > > > Thanks & Regards, > > Punit Pandey > > > > Visti Larsen <vishnu@l...> wrote:Hare Rama Krishna------------------ > -----Dear Punit,It is all vedic astrology, however even within vedic > astrology, the Jyotishis have a mind of their own. Those who follow > Parasari strictly understand that the nodes must always be mean, and > not true, to fulfill the duty assigned to them, hence by implication > of this, one uses mean nodes. But yet some people do not follow this. > As for ayanamsa, the reason for lack of consensus is lack of valid > research. Some oppine an ayanamsa that is more than 10 degrees from > lahiri, but i can assure you that their basis for their readings is > much different from that taught by parasara.. mainly because those > natives don't read scriptures to begin with, and make up their own > rules along the way! This is not Jyotish the way Parasara wanted it > to be. Krishnamurty created the KP system on a similar basis.. namely > that noone would teach him Jyotish! Tajik is incorperated into the > systems we know today and is no doubt an interesting system of > astrology, but i won't comment. Bhrigu-Jyotish is Nadi-Jyotish and > Nadi-Jyotish is the same Jyotish that Parasara taught.. have no doubt > about that. Now to adress your question on acuracy.Once an > astrologer gets a birth chart, his/her prime objective is to confirm > its acuracy. So the question of birthtime acuracy is simply not > relevant, as usually the Astrologer is out to prove its acuracy to > begin with. When the astrologer has done so, the readings may flow > like nectar, so the question is Birth-time rectification. Hope this > helps.Best wishes > > Visti > > --- > > Sri Jagannath Center: http://.org > > Bhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.org > > iTRANS 99 Font: http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org----- Original > Message ----- Punit Pandey vedic astrology > Friday, April 18, 2003 1:16 PMRe: [vedic astrology] > Re: accuracy in time of birth > > Dear Mr. Partha, Sorry for mistake. I used to think that Jaimini, > Tajik, Hora, Nadi, Bhrigu, KP, Lal Kitab etc. all belong to vedic > astrology. Probably some are not as vedic. Seeking experts' comments. > Punit Pandey > > > > "V.partha sarathy" <partvinu5> wrote:hare rama krishna > > dear punit > > > > the group discusses vedic astrology. the name of the group is > written > > in bold letters. i hope you understand > > regards > > partha > > > > > > vedic astrology, Punit Pandey > > <punitastrologer> wrote: > > > > > > Hello All KP Experts, > > > > > > I have a question to ask to all experts of this group. Today we > > utilize sub and sub-sub lords of cusps in nearly all predictions > > based on KP System. > > > > > > We all know that there is no consensus on ayanamsa, no consensus > on > > true rahu and mean rahu, known variations of computer programs, > > unsteady motion of planets, unavailability of atomic clocks at > > hospitals/homes etc., is it OK to use sub-sub (cuspal sub-sub lords > > change in average of 25 seconds) lord or even sub lord (cuspal sub > > lords changes in average of 4 minuts)??? > > > > > > I think it is a basic question and good subject to debate. At > least > > lots of people in India don't have accurate timing with them > > (accuracy less than 4 minutes). > > > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > Terms of > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > Service. > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > Terms of > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > Your use of is subject to > > > > > ---- > Legyen on is virusmentes! > http://ad.adverticum.net/b/cl,1,4008,20109,25526/click.prm > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 22, 2003 Report Share Posted April 22, 2003 Dear Rageshwar and Group, Thanks very much for your considerate email… Please understand I have no axe to grind, and that I am not d here to be a watchdog or to sing the praises of any one system in particular as being the one and only way to learn either Vedic or Western astrology. Yes - I am still a practitioner of System’s Approach, along with simultaneously also practicing with the tools of many other systems. Being certified over the years with the teachings of ACVA, Third Level Degree as an Associate Magi (Western Astrology – which many folks also find distasteful), and a Certified Teacher of Mahabote and Founder of an Email Correspondence Course on Burmese Birthday Astrology, I employ a variety of techniques. I have studied and taken various courses in astrology on and off for years by various teachers – some of whose teachings I am in agreement with, other’s whose teaching I find very vague and incomplete. I love astrology of all kinds, let my intuition guide me, and therefore I like to implement a variety of approaches to see how close one system’s findings back up another system’s findings, and therefore personally prefer a multi-system approach – but I never mix the apples with the oranges, as I have learned that each system and Teacher has its own unique gems to offer. I simply find it not at all necessary to do an injustice to any system, or to be blatantly disrespectful to any specific individual or group of individuals, be it System’s Approach list members or ANY other list members, based on an incompatibility with the teachings of any given system, or dislike/disagreement with any specific system of astrology. It is one thing to state an opinion – but quite another to bash the Founder and the followers when you do not know them personally, the level of their intellect, or their personal capacity to comprehend. I can respect anyone’s opinion – as we are all individual’s and have varying opinions on different things. But to each his own. What I find hard to tolerate is disrespect. I think we all must have the freedom to listen to our own drummer, as we all have our own personal opinions and roads to travel. And if that means that you must leave one group because you find no benefit in the teachings of that group, then you should definitely leave it. I have nothing to prove to you or anyone else, and nothing to convince you of, or anyone else, nor do I have time for that. I just prefer not to be badmouthed for deciding to experience the teachings from a variety of systems to see what they have to offer. I have been on the SA list since its inception, and can tell you that the system cannot be learned in its entirety in a one month period of time – perhaps 3 months of intensive study is more realistic. It appears at first glance to be extremely simplistic in its basic teachings, but there are ins and outs that also must be taken into consideration to fully and properly implement the study. As far as accurate predictions using SA – many have been made on the SA list by various list members who are brave enough to post a prediction. Many very astute predictions have also been made on this list by those who are brave enough to post a prediction. Many predictions have also failed on both lists. We are human and prone to experience some failure. I cannot direct you to those SA posts that have been right on the money because one list member took it upon himself/herself to hack into to the SATVA archives and permanently delete over 23,000 archived messages on that list, just last month. Someone with an attitude got disgruntled over there, just as there have been certain disgruntled individuals from time to time here also. I have noted over the past few months a few very insulting remarks that have been directed at Westerners on this list, and I find that both disheartening and disappointing. Should we not keep in mind that this is a universal list? I do not believe that Easterners are by birthright any more gifted or superior in the department of astrological intelligence by those who diligently apply themselves, than are Westerners…but perhaps we do not share the same viewpoint on that. Lastly, with respect to Professor VKC, I have met him, and do know him personally. He is a good and decent human being. His intentions are honorable, and he has a true belief in his SA teachings and in the power of his kavach. He bases this on the majority of the feedback and responses he receives, and I do not for one minute believe that he is out just to strictly make a buck. The IIPA is a free organization, however, he does charge for his personal one on one email Correspondence Courses on System’s Approach. I have never taken his Course so I cannot intelligently comment on the content. However, because he charges for that, does that make him a bad person? His very active presence on the SATVA list is heard from daily, he receives numerous requests for assistance, and his intent and mission is to answer each and every request that comes his way – not an easy task. So he does put out the effort daily to help and assist those who sincerely want to learn SA, and his intentions are quite noble. Whether or not you agree with him or his teachings is certainly a personal matter, and I have no objection to that, or even any disagreement with anyone as long as it is done with respect. He sincerely does believe in his own system, and for that I cannot find any fault. There are close to 700 list members on that list – some of whom certainly find a great deal of credibility in his teachings, and many very good jyotishis who are not, by any stretch of the imagination, lazy. A good majority of the SA practitioners are Easterners. So what rings as personal truth for one, may not always ring as italic">personal truth for another. So I’ll leave it at that. I just think that the true spirit of Jyotish should make us all a bit more tolerant of other’s individual preferences or leanings toward any system, and while we can certainly disagree with any teachings we encounter, we should also be able to be fine enough human beings to do so with a good deal of respect, rather than name calling. Sorry for the length of this post. 12.0pt;font-family:Arial'> AUTOTEXTLIST \s "E-mail Signature" yes"> ~Namaste~ yes"> Sandy Crowther http://www.jupitersweb.com/ 12.0pt;font-family:Arial'> 10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial"> -----Original Message----- rageshwari75 [rageshwari75 ] Tuesday, April 22, 2003 9:43 AM To: vedic astrology [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic? color:black">Dear Sandyji, I apologize for losing my patience. However, I still am not ready to change my mind about SA. Like you, I was a student of SA too. There have been numerous weekends when I would crawl over the pages of www.yournetastrologer.com to understand the various case studies and other stuff by Mr. Choudhry. But guess what, I could not make sense out of it. I agree that unwarranted bashing is not constructive. However, I truly intended to make a point in the last post i.e. SA does not do justice to anybody and least to its customers who spend so many $$$. My friend feels so cheated now that she does not even want to do remedies that conventional vedic astrologers are suggesting. To her all of these seems like a big business to cheat people. But that is not what Vedic Astrology stands for. This science is there to help people and not to discourage them from getting any help. I could have not said a word about SA and just kept quiet and respected people's opinions. But I think that would not have helped my cohorts on this group. I must say the truth even if it is bitter. And the truth is I am yet to meet anybody who feels fortunate to have applied SA. Neither have I seen any prediction on SATVA or SAMVA lists coming true. But I have kept my mind open. If you or any other SATVA/SAMVA learned peoples would like to help me change my mind, they are most welcome. "Courier New";color:black"> Thanks for listening. "Courier New";color:black"> Namaste. Rageshwari. --- In vedic astrology, "Sandy Crowther" <sandy@t...> wrote: > Dear Group, > > Is this a Forum to learn and exchange ideas and certain principles on Vedic > Astrology, or a forum to bash other Systems, Westerners, Professor VKC, and > people who seek a different, or vast road of eastern and western > astrological systems and experience? > > I enjoy all branches of astrology, and I can tell you that there are both > good Jyotishis and good people on the SATVA list, many of who have made > successful predictions. Predictions fail and succeed on any list, and it is > usually a human error in judgment, which all of us who are human are bound > to make from time to time. I find this denigration of other System's of > Jyotish a bit juvenile and disheartening with respect to what the true > spirit of jyotish is actually all about. > > I am Vice-President of the IIPA and not out to "convince" anyone of > anything. Nor do I push or even sell kavaches, of any kind. I don't > "convince" people to buy my services, nor have I ever "cheated" anyone. I > feel that people should be given a bit of respect in all forums that discuss > Jyotish – whether or not you agree with any certain branch. I am not one of > "Choudhry's own people", and not out to "get quick $$$$$". I am "Courier New";color:black"> simply my > own person and an individual who studied System's Approach along with a > large variety of other systems – to include Western – and am very interested > in ALL teachings of Astrology. I am a Westerner, and believe I do have > "patience", otherwise I would have stopped learning and studying 34 years > ago when I began my initial interest in astrology. > > This forum is certainly a very legitimate forum, but you do not have to > eradicate the legitimacy and intent of one forum, to prove the legitimacy > and intent of another. I kindly ask that you show a bit more respect to ALL > who may be present on this list. To each his own… > > > ~Namaste~ "Courier New";color:black"> > Sandy Crowther "Courier New";color:black"> > http://www.jupitersweb.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 22, 2003 Report Share Posted April 22, 2003 Dear Gauranga, You have put in a nutshell the essence of accuracy achieved in predictions.I too believe that when one's predictions come true, the lord uses one as a vehicle to convey message to the Jataka whose time to listen to his Bhagya has arrived. Regards, Chandrashekhar. - Gauranga Das vedic astrology Tuesday, April 22, 2003 9:01 PM Re: [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic? JAYA JAGANNATHA!Dear friends,Namaste.I'm not conversant in detail with the KP system, but as far as I rememberfrom our talks on the Nyderabad SJC conference, they use the Vimsottarilords as lords of Nakshatras. If you look more deeply into BPHS, you willsee that Maharishis Parashara assigns different planets ot the 27 Naksatras,whcih become rulers of the initial Vimsottari Dasa if their Moon is placedthere. However, I would not equate this to rulership of the Nakshatraitself, for which he presents 27 Devatas. You should bear in mind that forAstottari, Sodasottari or for that matter any other Udu dasha, thedistribution of dasha lords linked to nakshatras is utterly different. Soeven if one assumes that nakshatras are lorded by Vimsottari lords, if let'ssay Astottari describes his chart better than this will not work. Alosreffering to Deha and Jiva, for me it is too far stretched, so I cna'treally relate to it. As you may know they use not only nakshatra lords butsublords, sub-sublords etc.This however does not disprove that the KP system may give accuratepredictions. Those who use it may give their experience. In the same vain,Vedic astrologers do not consider western astrology to be sufficientlygrounded, however some western astrologers may still be able to issue properpredictions. This is because the astrological calculations are tools that weuse but intuition or giudance from the Paramatma is actually crucial. If onefdoes not get guidance from God then no amount of astrological tools howeverauthentic will help him to give accurate predictions.Yours,Gauranga Das Vedic Astrologer gauranga (AT) brihaspati (DOT) net Jyotish Remedies:WWW.BRIHASPATI.NET Phone:+36-309-140-839----- Original Message -----"monmuk111" <monmuk111 >To: <vedic astrology>Monday, April 21, 2003 7:05 PMSubject: [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic?> Dear friends:>> Are you guys talking about the KP/Systems approach. I've sincerely> with an open mind tried to study the Systems approach and I geniunely> feels that Systems approach is a big heap of crap. To give you an> example--it says that for a Scorpio ascendant, Saturn in the most> benefic planet. Now, per the PURE vedic astrology, Saturn is a> functional malefic for Scorpio ascendant and this principle applies> in my personal life, every time I go throug the antardasha of Saturn,> my life turns upside down.>> Now, when Systems approach says that Saturn is the MBPF for Scorpio> ascendant, it is just a joke or a lie or just a heap of crap.>> I tried to apply the Sytems approach principles to the charts of my> family and friends and NOTHING applies. Not one prediction made per> Systems Approach coinsides with the lives and events in the life of> my friends and family; whereas, all the PURE vedic principlea and> predictions apply.>> This is just my experience of the KP/Systems approach. I'm not sure> if KP and Systems are one and the same thing, I'm only commenting on> the Systems Approach developed by somebody named Chowdry.>> M.Desai>>> vedic astrology, Punit Pandey> <punitastrologer> wrote:> > Dear Mr. Visti,> > Thanks for your comments.> >> > I have my difference of opinion regarding KP (Even for lal kitab,> but that I don't want to discuss here). It seems that KP has taken> some other path than vedic astrology but if you go through this> system, you will find parahsari jyotish in the heart. I see four> major differences from parashari astrology -> >> > 1. Use of Placidus system of house division (western one)> >> > 2. User of SUB theory> >> > 3. Giving more importance to Naksharta. Saying that planet gives> the result of nakshatra in which it is situated.> >> > 4. Differenct ayanamsa (but no one know which ayanamsa was used by> Parashara himself)> >> > From above you can see the 2,3 and 4 and based more or less on> vedic astrology. SUB theory is devised from Vimshottari Dasha system> as it is. The same division has been used. The same is for Nakshatra,> some nadi author also give importance to nakshatra this way. And as> you said that there is lack of concensus even among vedic astrologers> for ayanamsas. Only the point 1 (i.e. the house division system) does> not match with vedic astrology.> >> > Although I don't say that I have sufficient knowledge for> discussing this topic but in my opinion even KP should be part of> vedic astrology. Even I have no intention to hurt anyone. We must> keep inventing and improving astrology, if it is possible. If we will> oppose KP, It will be just like scientists opposing astrology without> trying to understand it. Even some vedic astrologers are using> principles similar to KP in some way or other to improve predicitons.> In my opinion KP with divisional charts and some more dasas might> become next step in astrology. And it is only possible if we will> first open ourselves for discussion on non-vedic sounding systems of> astrology.> >> > It will be good for discussion if we will get opinion of all Gurus.> I also want to know whether anything build/developed/invented on the> foundation of vedic astrology can be called vedic astrology or not?> >> >> >> > Thanks & Regards,> > Punit Pandey> >> > Visti Larsen <vishnu@l...> wrote:Hare Rama Krishna------------------> -----Dear Punit,It is all vedic astrology, however even within vedic> astrology, the Jyotishis have a mind of their own. Those who follow> Parasari strictly understand that the nodes must always be mean, and> not true, to fulfill the duty assigned to them, hence by implication> of this, one uses mean nodes. But yet some people do not follow this.> As for ayanamsa, the reason for lack of consensus is lack of valid> research. Some oppine an ayanamsa that is more than 10 degrees from> lahiri, but i can assure you that their basis for their readings is> much different from that taught by parasara.. mainly because those> natives don't read scriptures to begin with, and make up their own> rules along the way! This is not Jyotish the way Parasara wanted it> to be. Krishnamurty created the KP system on a similar basis.. namely> that noone would teach him Jyotish! Tajik is incorperated into the> systems we know today and is no doubt an interesting system of> astrology, but i won't comment. Bhrigu-Jyotish is Nadi-Jyotish and> Nadi-Jyotish is the same Jyotish that Parasara taught.. have no doubt> about that. Now to adress your question on acuracy.Once an> astrologer gets a birth chart, his/her prime objective is to confirm> its acuracy. So the question of birthtime acuracy is simply not> relevant, as usually the Astrologer is out to prove its acuracy to> begin with. When the astrologer has done so, the readings may flow> like nectar, so the question is Birth-time rectification. Hope this> helps.Best wishes> > Visti> > ---> > Sri Jagannath Center: http://.org> > Bhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.org> > iTRANS 99 Font: http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org----- Original> Message ----- Punit Pandey vedic astrology> Friday, April 18, 2003 1:16 PMRe: [vedic astrology]> Re: accuracy in time of birth> > Dear Mr. Partha, Sorry for mistake. I used to think that Jaimini,> Tajik, Hora, Nadi, Bhrigu, KP, Lal Kitab etc. all belong to vedic> astrology. Probably some are not as vedic. Seeking experts' comments.> Punit Pandey> >> > "V.partha sarathy" <partvinu5> wrote:hare rama krishna> > dear punit> >> > the group discusses vedic astrology. the name of the group is> written> > in bold letters. i hope you understand> > regards> > partha> >> >> > --- In vedic astrology, Punit Pandey> > <punitastrologer> wrote:> > >> > > Hello All KP Experts,> > >> > > I have a question to ask to all experts of this group. Today we> > utilize sub and sub-sub lords of cusps in nearly all predictions> > based on KP System.> > >> > > We all know that there is no consensus on ayanamsa, no consensus> on> > true rahu and mean rahu, known variations of computer programs,> > unsteady motion of planets, unavailability of atomic clocks at> > hospitals/homes etc., is it OK to use sub-sub (cuspal sub-sub lords> > change in average of 25 seconds) lord or even sub lord (cuspal sub> > lords changes in average of 4 minuts)???> > >> > > I think it is a basic question and good subject to debate. At> least> > lots of people in India don't have accurate timing with them> > (accuracy less than 4 minutes).> > >> > > Thanks in advance.> > >> > > Regards,> > >> > > Punit Pandey> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.> >> >> >> > Archives: vedic astrology> >> > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> >> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > >> > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> >> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||> >> > Your use of is subject to the Terms of> Service.> >> >> >> > > > Do you ?> > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.> >> > Archives: vedic astrology> >> > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> >> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > >> > ........ May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> >> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||> >> > Your use of is subject to the Terms of> Service.> >> > Sponsor> >> > Archives: vedic astrology> >> > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> >> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > >> > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> >> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||> >> > Your use of is subject to the Terms of> Service.> >> >> >> > > > Do you ?> > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.>>>> Archives: vedic astrology>> Group info: vedic astrology/info.html>> To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology->> ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......>> || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||>> Your use of is subject to >>>>> ----> Legyen on is virusmentes!> http://ad.adverticum.net/b/cl,1,4008,20109,25526/click.prm>Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 22, 2003 Report Share Posted April 22, 2003 Dear Mr. Chandrashekhar, If it is the case do we really need to learn astrology???? It is one of the reason the astrology can not be called a science. Punit Pandey vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar" <boxdel> wrote: > Dear Gauranga, > You have put in a nutshell the essence of accuracy achieved in predictions.I too believe that when one's predictions come true, the lord uses one as a vehicle to convey message to the Jataka whose time to listen to his Bhagya has arrived. > Regards, > Chandrashekhar. > - > Gauranga Das > vedic astrology > Tuesday, April 22, 2003 9:01 PM > Re: [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic? > > > JAYA JAGANNATHA! > > Dear friends, > > Namaste. > > I'm not conversant in detail with the KP system, but as far as I remember > from our talks on the Nyderabad SJC conference, they use the Vimsottari > lords as lords of Nakshatras. If you look more deeply into BPHS, you will > see that Maharishis Parashara assigns different planets ot the 27 Naksatras, > whcih become rulers of the initial Vimsottari Dasa if their Moon is placed > there. However, I would not equate this to rulership of the Nakshatra > itself, for which he presents 27 Devatas. You should bear in mind that for > Astottari, Sodasottari or for that matter any other Udu dasha, the > distribution of dasha lords linked to nakshatras is utterly different. So > even if one assumes that nakshatras are lorded by Vimsottari lords, if let's > say Astottari describes his chart better than this will not work. Alos > reffering to Deha and Jiva, for me it is too far stretched, so I cna't > really relate to it. As you may know they use not only nakshatra lords but > sublords, sub-sublords etc. > > This however does not disprove that the KP system may give accurate > predictions. Those who use it may give their experience. In the same vain, > Vedic astrologers do not consider western astrology to be sufficiently > grounded, however some western astrologers may still be able to issue proper > predictions. This is because the astrological calculations are tools that we > use but intuition or giudance from the Paramatma is actually crucial. If one > fdoes not get guidance from God then no amount of astrological tools however > authentic will help him to give accurate predictions. > > Yours, > > Gauranga Das Vedic Astrologer > gauranga@b... > Jyotish Remedies: > WWW.BRIHASPATI.NET > Phone:+36-309-140-839 > > > - > "monmuk111" <monmuk111> > <vedic astrology> > Monday, April 21, 2003 7:05 PM > [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic? > > > > Dear friends: > > > > Are you guys talking about the KP/Systems approach. I've sincerely > > with an open mind tried to study the Systems approach and I geniunely > > feels that Systems approach is a big heap of crap. To give you an > > example--it says that for a Scorpio ascendant, Saturn in the most > > benefic planet. Now, per the PURE vedic astrology, Saturn is a > > functional malefic for Scorpio ascendant and this principle applies > > in my personal life, every time I go throug the antardasha of Saturn, > > my life turns upside down. > > > > Now, when Systems approach says that Saturn is the MBPF for Scorpio > > ascendant, it is just a joke or a lie or just a heap of crap. > > > > I tried to apply the Sytems approach principles to the charts of my > > family and friends and NOTHING applies. Not one prediction made per > > Systems Approach coinsides with the lives and events in the life of > > my friends and family; whereas, all the PURE vedic principlea and > > predictions apply. > > > > This is just my experience of the KP/Systems approach. I'm not sure > > if KP and Systems are one and the same thing, I'm only commenting on > > the Systems Approach developed by somebody named Chowdry. > > > > M.Desai > > > > > > vedic astrology, Punit Pandey > > <punitastrologer> wrote: > > > Dear Mr. Visti, > > > Thanks for your comments. > > > > > > I have my difference of opinion regarding KP (Even for lal kitab, > > but that I don't want to discuss here). It seems that KP has taken > > some other path than vedic astrology but if you go through this > > system, you will find parahsari jyotish in the heart. I see four > > major differences from parashari astrology - > > > > > > 1. Use of Placidus system of house division (western one) > > > > > > 2. User of SUB theory > > > > > > 3. Giving more importance to Naksharta. Saying that planet gives > > the result of nakshatra in which it is situated. > > > > > > 4. Differenct ayanamsa (but no one know which ayanamsa was used by > > Parashara himself) > > > > > > From above you can see the 2,3 and 4 and based more or less on > > vedic astrology. SUB theory is devised from Vimshottari Dasha system > > as it is. The same division has been used. The same is for Nakshatra, > > some nadi author also give importance to nakshatra this way. And as > > you said that there is lack of concensus even among vedic astrologers > > for ayanamsas. Only the point 1 (i.e. the house division system) does > > not match with vedic astrology. > > > > > > Although I don't say that I have sufficient knowledge for > > discussing this topic but in my opinion even KP should be part of > > vedic astrology. Even I have no intention to hurt anyone. We must > > keep inventing and improving astrology, if it is possible. If we will > > oppose KP, It will be just like scientists opposing astrology without > > trying to understand it. Even some vedic astrologers are using > > principles similar to KP in some way or other to improve predicitons. > > In my opinion KP with divisional charts and some more dasas might > > become next step in astrology. And it is only possible if we will > > first open ourselves for discussion on non-vedic sounding systems of > > astrology. > > > > > > It will be good for discussion if we will get opinion of all Gurus. > > I also want to know whether anything build/developed/invented on the > > foundation of vedic astrology can be called vedic astrology or not? > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks & Regards, > > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > Visti Larsen <vishnu@l...> wrote:Hare Rama Krishna------------ ------ > > -----Dear Punit,It is all vedic astrology, however even within vedic > > astrology, the Jyotishis have a mind of their own. Those who follow > > Parasari strictly understand that the nodes must always be mean, and > > not true, to fulfill the duty assigned to them, hence by implication > > of this, one uses mean nodes. But yet some people do not follow this. > > As for ayanamsa, the reason for lack of consensus is lack of valid > > research. Some oppine an ayanamsa that is more than 10 degrees from > > lahiri, but i can assure you that their basis for their readings is > > much different from that taught by parasara.. mainly because those > > natives don't read scriptures to begin with, and make up their own > > rules along the way! This is not Jyotish the way Parasara wanted it > > to be. Krishnamurty created the KP system on a similar basis.. namely > > that noone would teach him Jyotish! Tajik is incorperated into the > > systems we know today and is no doubt an interesting system of > > astrology, but i won't comment. Bhrigu-Jyotish is Nadi-Jyotish and > > Nadi-Jyotish is the same Jyotish that Parasara taught.. have no doubt > > about that. Now to adress your question on acuracy.Once an > > astrologer gets a birth chart, his/her prime objective is to confirm > > its acuracy. So the question of birthtime acuracy is simply not > > relevant, as usually the Astrologer is out to prove its acuracy to > > begin with. When the astrologer has done so, the readings may flow > > like nectar, so the question is Birth-time rectification. Hope this > > helps.Best wishes > > > Visti > > > --- > > > Sri Jagannath Center: http://.org > > > Bhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.org > > > iTRANS 99 Font: http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org----- Original > > Message ----- Punit Pandey vedic- astrology > > Friday, April 18, 2003 1:16 PMRe: [vedic- astrology] > > Re: accuracy in time of birth > > > Dear Mr. Partha, Sorry for mistake. I used to think that Jaimini, > > Tajik, Hora, Nadi, Bhrigu, KP, Lal Kitab etc. all belong to vedic > > astrology. Probably some are not as vedic. Seeking experts' comments. > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > "V.partha sarathy" <partvinu5> wrote:hare rama krishna > > > dear punit > > > > > > the group discusses vedic astrology. the name of the group is > > written > > > in bold letters. i hope you understand > > > regards > > > partha > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Punit Pandey > > > <punitastrologer> wrote: > > > > > > > > Hello All KP Experts, > > > > > > > > I have a question to ask to all experts of this group. Today we > > > utilize sub and sub-sub lords of cusps in nearly all predictions > > > based on KP System. > > > > > > > > We all know that there is no consensus on ayanamsa, no consensus > > on > > > true rahu and mean rahu, known variations of computer programs, > > > unsteady motion of planets, unavailability of atomic clocks at > > > hospitals/homes etc., is it OK to use sub-sub (cuspal sub-sub lords > > > change in average of 25 seconds) lord or even sub lord (cuspal sub > > > lords changes in average of 4 minuts)??? > > > > > > > > I think it is a basic question and good subject to debate. At > > least > > > lots of people in India don't have accurate timing with them > > > (accuracy less than 4 minutes). > > > > > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- astrology/info.html > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- astrology/info.html > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- astrology/info.html > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- astrology/info.html > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > Legyen on is virusmentes! > > http://ad.adverticum.net/b/cl,1,4008,20109,25526/click.prm > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > Terms of Service. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 22, 2003 Report Share Posted April 22, 2003 Dear Punit Pandey, You have missed the import behind the statement. If you happen to read Astrological magazine of Dr.(Late) B.V. Raman, you will find a shloka under the mast head. It states "Phalani Grahacharena Soochayanti manishina . Ko Vakta Taratamasya Tamekam Vedhasam vina." Dr. Raman's contribution to imparting knowledge of Astrology is undisputed. Why do you think he gave the pride of place to this shloka? I would like to have your valuable comments on this aspect. Chandrashekhar. - punitastrologer vedic astrology Wednesday, April 23, 2003 12:54 AM [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic? Dear Mr. Chandrashekhar,If it is the case do we really need to learn astrology???? It is one of the reason the astrology can not be called a science.Punit Pandeyvedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar" <boxdel> wrote:> Dear Gauranga,> You have put in a nutshell the essence of accuracy achieved in predictions.I too believe that when one's predictions come true, the lord uses one as a vehicle to convey message to the Jataka whose time to listen to his Bhagya has arrived.> Regards,> Chandrashekhar.> ----- Original Message ----- > Gauranga Das > To: vedic astrology > Tuesday, April 22, 2003 9:01 PM> Re: [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic?> > > JAYA JAGANNATHA!> > Dear friends,> > Namaste.> > I'm not conversant in detail with the KP system, but as far as I remember> from our talks on the Nyderabad SJC conference, they use the Vimsottari> lords as lords of Nakshatras. If you look more deeply into BPHS, you will> see that Maharishis Parashara assigns different planets ot the 27 Naksatras,> whcih become rulers of the initial Vimsottari Dasa if their Moon is placed> there. However, I would not equate this to rulership of the Nakshatra> itself, for which he presents 27 Devatas. You should bear in mind that for> Astottari, Sodasottari or for that matter any other Udu dasha, the> distribution of dasha lords linked to nakshatras is utterly different. So> even if one assumes that nakshatras are lorded by Vimsottari lords, if let's> say Astottari describes his chart better than this will not work. Alos> reffering to Deha and Jiva, for me it is too far stretched, so I cna't> really relate to it. As you may know they use not only nakshatra lords but> sublords, sub-sublords etc.> > This however does not disprove that the KP system may give accurate> predictions. Those who use it may give their experience. In the same vain,> Vedic astrologers do not consider western astrology to be sufficiently> grounded, however some western astrologers may still be able to issue proper> predictions. This is because the astrological calculations are tools that we> use but intuition or giudance from the Paramatma is actually crucial. If one> fdoes not get guidance from God then no amount of astrological tools however> authentic will help him to give accurate predictions.> > Yours,> > Gauranga Das Vedic Astrologer> gauranga@b...> Jyotish Remedies:> WWW.BRIHASPATI.NET> Phone:+36-309-140-839> > > ----- Original Message -----> "monmuk111" <monmuk111>> To: <vedic astrology>> Monday, April 21, 2003 7:05 PM> [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic?> > > > Dear friends:> >> > Are you guys talking about the KP/Systems approach. I've sincerely> > with an open mind tried to study the Systems approach and I geniunely> > feels that Systems approach is a big heap of crap. To give you an> > example--it says that for a Scorpio ascendant, Saturn in the most> > benefic planet. Now, per the PURE vedic astrology, Saturn is a> > functional malefic for Scorpio ascendant and this principle applies> > in my personal life, every time I go throug the antardasha of Saturn,> > my life turns upside down.> >> > Now, when Systems approach says that Saturn is the MBPF for Scorpio> > ascendant, it is just a joke or a lie or just a heap of crap.> >> > I tried to apply the Sytems approach principles to the charts of my> > family and friends and NOTHING applies. Not one prediction made per> > Systems Approach coinsides with the lives and events in the life of> > my friends and family; whereas, all the PURE vedic principlea and> > predictions apply.> >> > This is just my experience of the KP/Systems approach. I'm not sure> > if KP and Systems are one and the same thing, I'm only commenting on> > the Systems Approach developed by somebody named Chowdry.> >> > M.Desai> >> >> > vedic astrology, Punit Pandey> > <punitastrologer> wrote:> > > Dear Mr. Visti,> > > Thanks for your comments.> > >> > > I have my difference of opinion regarding KP (Even for lal kitab,> > but that I don't want to discuss here). It seems that KP has taken> > some other path than vedic astrology but if you go through this> > system, you will find parahsari jyotish in the heart. I see four> > major differences from parashari astrology -> > >> > > 1. Use of Placidus system of house division (western one)> > >> > > 2. User of SUB theory> > >> > > 3. Giving more importance to Naksharta. Saying that planet gives> > the result of nakshatra in which it is situated.> > >> > > 4. Differenct ayanamsa (but no one know which ayanamsa was used by> > Parashara himself)> > >> > > From above you can see the 2,3 and 4 and based more or less on> > vedic astrology. SUB theory is devised from Vimshottari Dasha system> > as it is. The same division has been used. The same is for Nakshatra,> > some nadi author also give importance to nakshatra this way. And as> > you said that there is lack of concensus even among vedic astrologers> > for ayanamsas. Only the point 1 (i.e. the house division system) does> > not match with vedic astrology.> > >> > > Although I don't say that I have sufficient knowledge for> > discussing this topic but in my opinion even KP should be part of> > vedic astrology. Even I have no intention to hurt anyone. We must> > keep inventing and improving astrology, if it is possible. If we will> > oppose KP, It will be just like scientists opposing astrology without> > trying to understand it. Even some vedic astrologers are using> > principles similar to KP in some way or other to improve predicitons.> > In my opinion KP with divisional charts and some more dasas might> > become next step in astrology. And it is only possible if we will> > first open ourselves for discussion on non-vedic sounding systems of> > astrology.> > >> > > It will be good for discussion if we will get opinion of all Gurus.> > I also want to know whether anything build/developed/invented on the> > foundation of vedic astrology can be called vedic astrology or not?> > >> > >> > >> > > Thanks & Regards,> > > Punit Pandey> > >> > > Visti Larsen <vishnu@l...> wrote:Hare Rama Krishna------------------> > -----Dear Punit,It is all vedic astrology, however even within vedic> > astrology, the Jyotishis have a mind of their own. Those who follow> > Parasari strictly understand that the nodes must always be mean, and> > not true, to fulfill the duty assigned to them, hence by implication> > of this, one uses mean nodes. But yet some people do not follow this.> > As for ayanamsa, the reason for lack of consensus is lack of valid> > research. Some oppine an ayanamsa that is more than 10 degrees from> > lahiri, but i can assure you that their basis for their readings is> > much different from that taught by parasara.. mainly because those> > natives don't read scriptures to begin with, and make up their own> > rules along the way! This is not Jyotish the way Parasara wanted it> > to be. Krishnamurty created the KP system on a similar basis.. namely> > that noone would teach him Jyotish! Tajik is incorperated into the> > systems we know today and is no doubt an interesting system of> > astrology, but i won't comment. Bhrigu-Jyotish is Nadi-Jyotish and> > Nadi-Jyotish is the same Jyotish that Parasara taught.. have no doubt> > about that. Now to adress your question on acuracy.Once an> > astrologer gets a birth chart, his/her prime objective is to confirm> > its acuracy. So the question of birthtime acuracy is simply not> > relevant, as usually the Astrologer is out to prove its acuracy to> > begin with. When the astrologer has done so, the readings may flow> > like nectar, so the question is Birth-time rectification. Hope this> > helps.Best wishes> > > Visti> > > ---> > > Sri Jagannath Center: http://.org> > > Bhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.org> > > iTRANS 99 Font: http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org----- Original> > Message ----- Punit Pandey vedic astrology> > Friday, April 18, 2003 1:16 PMRe: [vedic astrology]> > Re: accuracy in time of birth> > > Dear Mr. Partha, Sorry for mistake. I used to think that Jaimini,> > Tajik, Hora, Nadi, Bhrigu, KP, Lal Kitab etc. all belong to vedic> > astrology. Probably some are not as vedic. Seeking experts' comments.> > Punit Pandey> > >> > > "V.partha sarathy" <partvinu5> wrote:hare rama krishna> > > dear punit> > >> > > the group discusses vedic astrology. the name of the group is> > written> > > in bold letters. i hope you understand> > > regards> > > partha> > >> > >> > > --- In vedic astrology, Punit Pandey> > > <punitastrologer> wrote:> > > >> > > > Hello All KP Experts,> > > >> > > > I have a question to ask to all experts of this group. Today we> > > utilize sub and sub-sub lords of cusps in nearly all predictions> > > based on KP System.> > > >> > > > We all know that there is no consensus on ayanamsa, no consensus> > on> > > true rahu and mean rahu, known variations of computer programs,> > > unsteady motion of planets, unavailability of atomic clocks at> > > hospitals/homes etc., is it OK to use sub-sub (cuspal sub-sub lords> > > change in average of 25 seconds) lord or even sub lord (cuspal sub> > > lords changes in average of 4 minuts)???> > > >> > > > I think it is a basic question and good subject to debate. At> > least> > > lots of people in India don't have accurate timing with them> > > (accuracy less than 4 minutes).> > > >> > > > Thanks in advance.> > > >> > > > Regards,> > > >> > > > Punit Pandey> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.> > >> > >> > >> > > Archives: vedic astrology> > >> > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > >> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > > > >> > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > >> > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||> > >> > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of> > Service.> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.> > >> > > Archives: vedic astrology> > >> > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > >> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > > > >> > > > > >> > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||> > >> > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of> > Service.> > >> > > Sponsor> > >> > > Archives: vedic astrology> > >> > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > >> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > > > >> > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > >> > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||> > >> > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of> > Service.> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.> >> >> >> > Archives: vedic astrology> >> > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> >> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> >> > > >> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||> >> > Your use of is subject to > >> >> >> >> > ----> > Legyen on is virusmentes!> > http://ad.adverticum.net/b/cl,1,4008,20109,25526/click.prm> >> > > Sponsor > > > > > > Archives: vedic astrology> > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > Your use of is subject to the Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... 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Guest guest Posted April 22, 2003 Report Share Posted April 22, 2003 Dear Sandy: Namaste. Wow!!! I am astounded that you can assimilate so much information from multiple sources which most students (life time students, that is)find fathomless. After assimilating, to integrate so much and then to streamline it for benefit of some one else is another feat.) Your birth chart ought to be a fascinating study and a unique learning tool - the one of a kind. Especially so because you claim to coordinate dissimilar thoughts and doctrines. Would you please post your birth details for benefit of us all? Thanks in advance and looking forward to your post. (Please do not look for any input from me on your Birth chart. It has been four months of study and I am still scratchig the surface of astronomical and mathematical aspects of Jyotish) with ragards, Arvind --- Sandy Crowther <sandy wrote: > Dear Rageshwar and Group, > > Thanks very much for your considerate email… > > Please understand I have no axe to grind, and that I > am not d here > to be a watchdog or to sing the praises of any one > system in particular as > being the one and only way to learn either Vedic or > Western astrology. Yes - > I am still a practitioner of System’s Approach, > along with simultaneously > also practicing with the tools of many other > systems. Being certified over > the years with the teachings of ACVA, Third Level > Degree as an Associate > Magi (Western Astrology – which many folks also find > distasteful), and a > Certified Teacher of Mahabote and Founder of an > Email Correspondence Course > on Burmese Birthday Astrology, I employ a variety of > techniques. I have > studied and taken various courses in astrology on > and off for years by > various teachers – some of whose teachings I am in > agreement with, other’s > whose teaching I find very vague and incomplete. I > love astrology of all > kinds, let my intuition guide me, and therefore I > like to implement a > variety of approaches to see how close one system’s > findings back up another > system’s findings, and therefore personally prefer a > multi-system approach – > but I never mix the apples with the oranges, as I > have learned that each > system and Teacher has its own unique gems to offer. > I simply find it not at > all necessary to do an injustice to any system, or > to be blatantly > disrespectful to any specific individual or group of > individuals, be it > System’s Approach list members or ANY other list > members, based on an > incompatibility with the teachings of any given > system, or > dislike/disagreement with any specific system of > astrology. It is one thing > to state an opinion – but quite another to bash the > Founder and the > followers when you do not know them personally, the > level of their > intellect, or their personal capacity to comprehend. > I can respect anyone’s > opinion – as we are all individual’s and have > varying opinions on different > things. But to each his own. What I find hard to > tolerate is disrespect. I > think we all must have the freedom to listen to our > own drummer, as we all > have our own personal opinions and roads to travel. > And if that means that > you must leave one group because you find no benefit > in the teachings of > that group, then you should definitely leave it. I > have nothing to prove to > you or anyone else, and nothing to convince you of, > or anyone else, nor do I > have time for that. I just prefer not to be > badmouthed for deciding to > experience the teachings from a variety of systems > to see what they have to > offer. > > I have been on the SA list since its inception, and > can tell you that the > system cannot be learned in its entirety in a one > month period of time – > perhaps 3 months of intensive study is more > realistic. It appears at first > glance to be extremely simplistic in its basic > teachings, but there are ins > and outs that also must be taken into consideration > to fully and properly > implement the study. As far as accurate predictions > using SA – many have > been made on the SA list by various list members who > are brave enough to > post a prediction. Many very astute predictions have > also been made on this > list by those who are brave enough to post a > prediction. Many predictions > have also failed on both lists. We are human and > prone to experience some > failure. I cannot direct you to those SA posts that > have been right on the > money because one list member took it upon > himself/herself to hack into to > the SATVA archives and permanently delete over > 23,000 archived messages on > that list, just last month. Someone with an attitude > got disgruntled over > there, just as there have been certain disgruntled > individuals from time to > time here also. I have noted over the past few > months a few very insulting > remarks that have been directed at Westerners on > this list, and I find that > both disheartening and disappointing. Should we not > keep in mind that this > is a universal list? I do not believe that > Easterners are by birthright any > more gifted or superior in the department of > astrological intelligence by > those who diligently apply themselves, than are > Westerners…but perhaps we do > not share the same viewpoint on that. > > Lastly, with respect to Professor VKC, I have met > him, and do know him > personally. He is a good and decent human being. His > intentions are > honorable, and he has a true belief in his SA > teachings and in the power of > his kavach. He bases this on the majority of the > feedback and responses he > receives, and I do not for one minute believe that > he is out just to > strictly make a buck. The IIPA is a free > organization, however, he does > charge for his personal one on one email > Correspondence Courses on System’s > Approach. I have never taken his Course so I cannot > intelligently comment on > the content. However, because he charges for that, > does that make him a bad > person? His very active presence on the SATVA list > is heard from daily, he > receives numerous requests for assistance, and his > intent and mission is to > answer each and every request that comes his way – > not an easy task. So he > does put out the effort daily to help and assist > those who sincerely want to > learn SA, and his intentions are quite noble. > Whether or not you agree with > him or his teachings is certainly a personal matter, > and I have no objection > to that, or even any disagreement with anyone as > long as it is done with > respect. He sincerely does believe in his own > system, and for that I cannot > find any fault. There are close to 700 list members > on that list – some of > whom certainly find a great deal of credibility in > his teachings, and many > very good jyotishis who are not, by any stretch of > the imagination, lazy. A > good majority of the SA practitioners are > Easterners. So what rings as > personal truth for one, may not always ring as > personal truth for another. > > So I’ll leave it at that. I just think that the true > spirit of Jyotish > should make us all a bit more tolerant of other’s > individual preferences or > leanings toward any system, and while we can > certainly disagree with any > teachings we encounter, we should also be able to be > fine enough human > beings to do so with a good deal of respect, rather > than name calling. Sorry > for the length of this post. > > ~Namaste~ > Sandy Crowther > http://www.jupitersweb.com/ > <http://www.jupitersweb.com/> > > > rageshwari75 [rageshwari75] > Tuesday, April 22, 2003 9:43 AM > vedic astrology > [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently > vedic? > > Dear Sandyji, > > I apologize for losing my patience. However, I still > am not ready to > change my mind about SA. Like you, I was a student > of SA too. There > have been numerous weekends when I would crawl over > the pages of > www.yournetastrologer.com to understand the various > case studies and > other stuff by Mr. Choudhry. But guess what, I could > not make sense > out of it. I agree that unwarranted bashing is not > constructive. > === message truncated === The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo http://search. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 22, 2003 Report Share Posted April 22, 2003 ~OM~ Dear Deepak, I am not commenting on either the SA system or the business of selling Kavacha yantra of gemstones as I had met V K Chowdhry once with my friend Narinder Sagar who publishes his books. I am concerned about a statement you have made below as "SA tells that Vedic Astrology is only confusing and contradictory." If you have some mail or published material of VKC which says this, please forward to me at srath (AT) srath (DOT) com . If other followers of SA system are saying this, I am not bothered. People can have many opinions and are welcome to theirs. I am only concerned about VKC as he is the teacher of that system. With best wishes, Sanjay Rath ------------------------ H-5 B.J.B Nagar, Bhubaneswar 751014, India +91-674-2436871; Webpages:http://srath.com http://.org ------------------ ---- SA tells that Vedic Astrology is only confusing andcontradictory. Actually the reason for people sayingthis is lack of brain, insight, intellect, patient tounderstand and stick to deep and real vedic astrology. __ IncrediMail - Email has finally evolved - Click Here Attachment: (image/gif) 09_left.gif [not stored] Attachment: (image/gif) 09.gif [not stored] Attachment: (image/gif) IMSTP.gif [not stored] Attachment: (Image/gif) 09_B.gif [not stored] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 23, 2003 Report Share Posted April 23, 2003 Respected ladies and gentlemen, I will narrate a story (source = Kanchi Kamakoti website), which is probably known to all jyotish students and gurus, but which needs mentioning here in the light of the recent debate:- "Eight hundred years ago there lived a great mathematician called Bhaskaracharya. An incident in his life illustrates how relentless destiny is. Bhaskaracharya had a daughter called Lilavati. The great astrologer that he was, he found that she had "mangalya-dosa" in her horoscope, but he felt confident that he could change his daughter's destiny, as foreshadowed by the stars, with his ingenuity and resorcefulness, as an astrologer. He decided to celebrate Lilavati's marriage during a lagna in which all the planets would be in positions favourable to the bride. This should, he thought, ensure that Lilavati would remain a "dirgha-sumangali". In those days there were no clocks as we have today. A water-pot was used to measure time. It consisted of an upper as well as a lower part. The water in the upper receptacle would trickle down through a hole into the lower container. The lower part was graduated according to the unit of time then followed ---nazhikai (nadika), one sixtieth of a day or 24 minutes. So the time of day was calculated by observing the level of the water in the lower container. ("Water- clock" and "hour-glass" are English names for such an apparatus. Since water evaporates quickly sand was used instead. ) According to the custom then prevailing, Lilavati's marriage was to be celebrated when she was still a child. On the appointed day, she sat beside the water--clock and bent over it fascinated by the apparatus. As she fumbled around, a pearl from her nose--stud got loosened and fell into the apparatus lodging itself in its hole. The flow of water into the lower receptacle was reduced. So what the clock indicated as the hour fixed for the marriage was not the right one---the auspicious hour had passed. Nobody including Lilavati, had noticed the pearl dropping into the water-clock. When they came to know about it, it was too late." The point of this whole anecdote is that we cannot circumvent what is destined for us. So also, remedies and wearing of gemstones/metal objects cannot be a foolproof guarantee all the time. Those, at best, can work for some people at some times. To believe in these measures would be tantamount to not understanding the true purpose of Jyotish. The truly great Guru, with acute powers of spiritual insight, can at a glance divine the karma of the suffering person and if it is worth the effort, then the guru can prescribe the appropriate remedy so as to burn off the bad karma. If there is no other recourse, then the person must suffer. Of course the wise person, with recourse to Jyotish, knows that he must mentally prepare himself for hard times and actively seek to find solutions for the problems that are thrown in his path of life. With respect to the actual discussion, there are a couple of ironies here: (1) The discussion was originally about the Krishnamurti Paddati system but was hijacked to discuss about another system. (2)What is the meaning of "sufficiently vedic"? Is "vedic" a quantity to be defined thus? (3)We should accept the wisdom of our sages because they had the power of spiritual insight. Any modification of the original system should be investigated in a scientific manner because the gift of spiritual insight is rare in todays times. We should understand that the true purpose of Jyotish is to illuminate and not confuse our lives. Hope this helps. With apologies and due respect to all, Hari Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 23, 2003 Report Share Posted April 23, 2003 Please note these two excerpts from your posts today: The only places I have come across, which speak of black magic, is Jaimini sutram on Karakamsha. If there is three or more malefics in trines from Karakamsha, the native practices Tantra or black magic. & This is like the yogis, who can fly to any place by their laghima siddhi. The common people cannot do this, so they use vehicles which either const money or you need to know how to construct and drive them. The same is with Jyotish. Ganita or calculations are the knowledge how to construct the vehicle. And Hora or interpretation is the rules by which you learn to drive the vehicle and take part in traffic. But if you have siddhi, less of these tools are necessary. It truly amazes me that you so broadly equate tantra and black magic. Please do more research. The very fact that you refer to siddhi without considering its nexus to kundalini epistemology and praxis -- and overall concepts throughly intertwined with Indian tantric religious history (which itself is the backdrop eventually for more "mainstream" traditions) -- truly baffles. Svoboda should be very helpful here. To the degree that you quote Jaimini, I would really love to have the original Sanskrit for this verse on tantra / black magic (I don't yet own the original text.) Does it actually say "tantra" - and if so, in what context? Best, J.I. Abbot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 23, 2003 Report Share Posted April 23, 2003 JAYA JAGANNATHA! Dear Punit, Namaste. - "punitastrologer" <punitastrologer <vedic astrology> Tuesday, April 22, 2003 9:24 PM [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic? > Dear Mr. Chandrashekhar, > > If it is the case do we really need to learn astrology???? It is one > of the reason the astrology can not be called a science. If you have performed enough austerities to attain siddhi, then no need to learn Jyotish techniques and rules, because the intuition will flow without obstacles. This is how Yogi Karve does. However if you have less siddhi, then a systematic study may give help. But still, sincere prayer should be recited regularly. This is like the yogis, who can fly to any place by their laghima siddhi. The common people cannot do this, so they use vehicles which either const money or you need to know how to construct and drive them. The same is with Jyotish. Ganita or calculations are the knowledge how to construct the vehicle. And Hora or interpretation is the rules by which you learn to drive the vehicle and take part in traffic. But if you have siddhi, less of these tools are necessary. Yours, Gauranga Das Vedic Astrologer gauranga Jyotish Remedies: WWW.BRIHASPATI.NET Phone:+36-309-140-839 > > Punit Pandey > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar" > <boxdel> wrote: > > Dear Gauranga, > > You have put in a nutshell the essence of accuracy achieved in > predictions.I too believe that when one's predictions come true, the > lord uses one as a vehicle to convey message to the Jataka whose time > to listen to his Bhagya has arrived. > > Regards, > > Chandrashekhar. > > - > > Gauranga Das > > vedic astrology > > Tuesday, April 22, 2003 9:01 PM > > Re: [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic? > > > > > > JAYA JAGANNATHA! > > > > Dear friends, > > > > Namaste. > > > > I'm not conversant in detail with the KP system, but as far as I > remember > > from our talks on the Nyderabad SJC conference, they use the > Vimsottari > > lords as lords of Nakshatras. If you look more deeply into BPHS, > you will > > see that Maharishis Parashara assigns different planets ot the 27 > Naksatras, > > whcih become rulers of the initial Vimsottari Dasa if their Moon > is placed > > there. However, I would not equate this to rulership of the > Nakshatra > > itself, for which he presents 27 Devatas. You should bear in mind > that for > > Astottari, Sodasottari or for that matter any other Udu dasha, the > > distribution of dasha lords linked to nakshatras is utterly > different. So > > even if one assumes that nakshatras are lorded by Vimsottari > lords, if let's > > say Astottari describes his chart better than this will not work. > Alos > > reffering to Deha and Jiva, for me it is too far stretched, so I > cna't > > really relate to it. As you may know they use not only nakshatra > lords but > > sublords, sub-sublords etc. > > > > This however does not disprove that the KP system may give > accurate > > predictions. Those who use it may give their experience. In the > same vain, > > Vedic astrologers do not consider western astrology to be > sufficiently > > grounded, however some western astrologers may still be able to > issue proper > > predictions. This is because the astrological calculations are > tools that we > > use but intuition or giudance from the Paramatma is actually > crucial. If one > > fdoes not get guidance from God then no amount of astrological > tools however > > authentic will help him to give accurate predictions. > > > > Yours, > > > > Gauranga Das Vedic Astrologer > > gauranga@b... > > Jyotish Remedies: > > WWW.BRIHASPATI.NET > > Phone:+36-309-140-839 > > > > > > - > > "monmuk111" <monmuk111> > > <vedic astrology> > > Monday, April 21, 2003 7:05 PM > > [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic? > > > > > > > Dear friends: > > > > > > Are you guys talking about the KP/Systems approach. I've > sincerely > > > with an open mind tried to study the Systems approach and I > geniunely > > > feels that Systems approach is a big heap of crap. To give you > an > > > example--it says that for a Scorpio ascendant, Saturn in the > most > > > benefic planet. Now, per the PURE vedic astrology, Saturn is a > > > functional malefic for Scorpio ascendant and this principle > applies > > > in my personal life, every time I go throug the antardasha of > Saturn, > > > my life turns upside down. > > > > > > Now, when Systems approach says that Saturn is the MBPF for > Scorpio > > > ascendant, it is just a joke or a lie or just a heap of crap. > > > > > > I tried to apply the Sytems approach principles to the charts > of my > > > family and friends and NOTHING applies. Not one prediction made > per > > > Systems Approach coinsides with the lives and events in the > life of > > > my friends and family; whereas, all the PURE vedic principlea > and > > > predictions apply. > > > > > > This is just my experience of the KP/Systems approach. I'm not > sure > > > if KP and Systems are one and the same thing, I'm only > commenting on > > > the Systems Approach developed by somebody named Chowdry. > > > > > > M.Desai > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Punit Pandey > > > <punitastrologer> wrote: > > > > Dear Mr. Visti, > > > > Thanks for your comments. > > > > > > > > I have my difference of opinion regarding KP (Even for lal > kitab, > > > but that I don't want to discuss here). It seems that KP has > taken > > > some other path than vedic astrology but if you go through this > > > system, you will find parahsari jyotish in the heart. I see four > > > major differences from parashari astrology - > > > > > > > > 1. Use of Placidus system of house division (western one) > > > > > > > > 2. User of SUB theory > > > > > > > > 3. Giving more importance to Naksharta. Saying that planet > gives > > > the result of nakshatra in which it is situated. > > > > > > > > 4. Differenct ayanamsa (but no one know which ayanamsa was > used by > > > Parashara himself) > > > > > > > > From above you can see the 2,3 and 4 and based more or less on > > > vedic astrology. SUB theory is devised from Vimshottari Dasha > system > > > as it is. The same division has been used. The same is for > Nakshatra, > > > some nadi author also give importance to nakshatra this way. > And as > > > you said that there is lack of concensus even among vedic > astrologers > > > for ayanamsas. Only the point 1 (i.e. the house division > system) does > > > not match with vedic astrology. > > > > > > > > Although I don't say that I have sufficient knowledge for > > > discussing this topic but in my opinion even KP should be part > of > > > vedic astrology. Even I have no intention to hurt anyone. We > must > > > keep inventing and improving astrology, if it is possible. If > we will > > > oppose KP, It will be just like scientists opposing astrology > without > > > trying to understand it. Even some vedic astrologers are using > > > principles similar to KP in some way or other to improve > predicitons. > > > In my opinion KP with divisional charts and some more dasas > might > > > become next step in astrology. And it is only possible if we > will > > > first open ourselves for discussion on non-vedic sounding > systems of > > > astrology. > > > > > > > > It will be good for discussion if we will get opinion of all > Gurus. > > > I also want to know whether anything build/developed/invented > on the > > > foundation of vedic astrology can be called vedic astrology or > not? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks & Regards, > > > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > > > Visti Larsen <vishnu@l...> wrote:Hare Rama Krishna------------ > ------ > > > -----Dear Punit,It is all vedic astrology, however even within > vedic > > > astrology, the Jyotishis have a mind of their own. Those who > follow > > > Parasari strictly understand that the nodes must always be > mean, and > > > not true, to fulfill the duty assigned to them, hence by > implication > > > of this, one uses mean nodes. But yet some people do not follow > this. > > > As for ayanamsa, the reason for lack of consensus is lack of > valid > > > research. Some oppine an ayanamsa that is more than 10 degrees > from > > > lahiri, but i can assure you that their basis for their > readings is > > > much different from that taught by parasara.. mainly because > those > > > natives don't read scriptures to begin with, and make up their > own > > > rules along the way! This is not Jyotish the way Parasara > wanted it > > > to be. Krishnamurty created the KP system on a similar basis.. > namely > > > that noone would teach him Jyotish! Tajik is incorperated into > the > > > systems we know today and is no doubt an interesting system of > > > astrology, but i won't comment. Bhrigu-Jyotish is Nadi-Jyotish > and > > > Nadi-Jyotish is the same Jyotish that Parasara taught.. have no > doubt > > > about that. Now to adress your question on acuracy.Once an > > > astrologer gets a birth chart, his/her prime objective is to > confirm > > > its acuracy. So the question of birthtime acuracy is simply not > > > relevant, as usually the Astrologer is out to prove its acuracy > to > > > begin with. When the astrologer has done so, the readings may > flow > > > like nectar, so the question is Birth-time rectification. Hope > this > > > helps.Best wishes > > > > Visti > > > > --- > > > > Sri Jagannath Center: http://.org > > > > Bhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.org > > > > iTRANS 99 Font: http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org----- > Original > > > Message ----- Punit Pandey vedic- > astrology > > > Friday, April 18, 2003 1:16 PMRe: [vedic- > astrology] > > > Re: accuracy in time of birth > > > > Dear Mr. Partha, Sorry for mistake. I used to think that > Jaimini, > > > Tajik, Hora, Nadi, Bhrigu, KP, Lal Kitab etc. all belong to > vedic > > > astrology. Probably some are not as vedic. Seeking experts' > comments. > > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > > > "V.partha sarathy" <partvinu5> wrote:hare rama krishna > > > > dear punit > > > > > > > > the group discusses vedic astrology. the name of the group is > > > written > > > > in bold letters. i hope you understand > > > > regards > > > > partha > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Punit Pandey > > > > <punitastrologer> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Hello All KP Experts, > > > > > > > > > > I have a question to ask to all experts of this group. > Today we > > > > utilize sub and sub-sub lords of cusps in nearly all > predictions > > > > based on KP System. > > > > > > > > > > We all know that there is no consensus on ayanamsa, no > consensus > > > on > > > > true rahu and mean rahu, known variations of computer > programs, > > > > unsteady motion of planets, unavailability of atomic clocks at > > > > hospitals/homes etc., is it OK to use sub-sub (cuspal sub-sub > lords > > > > change in average of 25 seconds) lord or even sub lord > (cuspal sub > > > > lords changes in average of 4 minuts)??? > > > > > > > > > > I think it is a basic question and good subject to debate. > At > > > least > > > > lots of people in India don't have accurate timing with them > > > > (accuracy less than 4 minutes). > > > > > > > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > Punit Pandey > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > > Service. > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > astrology/info.html > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > Legyen on is virusmentes! > > > http://ad.adverticum.net/b/cl,1,4008,20109,25526/click.prm > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > Terms of > Service. > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > Your use of is subject to > > > > > ---- > Legyen on is virusmentes! > http://ad.adverticum.net/b/cl,1,4008,20109,25526/click.prm > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 24, 2003 Report Share Posted April 24, 2003 Chandrashekar Ji, Dr. Rajiv C. Karekar has given a test in his last mail. I also use that test regularly and found it never failing. For the last few years I am checking it continuously and getting amazing results. For this I don't think any sort of intuition is needed for getting correct results. Even a person with a little knowledge of astrology can know future with the given statistical analysis. It is general principle. Can't we extend the whole astrology this way where logic and knowledge will prevail over intuition? I understand that astrology can help in developing intuition. With this continuous development, an astrologer need not to go through horoscope for predicting. He can observe the environment and the person and predict anything. But quoting "intuition" again and again this way will not help in developing astrology in scientific manner. Waiting for your views. Punit Pandey Chandrashekhar <boxdel (AT) (DOT) co.uk> wrote: Dear Punit Pandey, You have missed the import behind the statement. If you happen to read Astrological magazine of Dr.(Late) B.V. Raman, you will find a shloka under the mast head. It states "Phalani Grahacharena Soochayanti manishina . Ko Vakta Taratamasya Tamekam Vedhasam vina." Dr. Raman's contribution to imparting knowledge of Astrology is undisputed. Why do you think he gave the pride of place to this shloka? I would like to have your valuable comments on this aspect. Chandrashekhar. - punitastrologer vedic astrology Wednesday, April 23, 2003 12:54 AM [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic? Dear Mr. Chandrashekhar,If it is the case do we really need to learn astrology???? It is one of the reason the astrology can not be called a science.Punit Pandeyvedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar" <boxdel> wrote:> Dear Gauranga,> You have put in a nutshell the essence of accuracy achieved in predictions.I too believe that when one's predictions come true, the lord uses one as a vehicle to convey message to the Jataka whose time to listen to his Bhagya has arrived.> Regards,> Chandrashekhar.> ----- Original Message ----- > Gauranga Das > To: vedic astrology > Tuesday, April 22, 2003 9:01 PM> Re: [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic?> > > JAYA JAGANNATHA!> > Dear friends,> > Namaste.> > I'm not conversant in detail with the KP system, but as far as I remember> from our talks on the Nyderabad SJC conference, they use the Vimsottari> lords as lords of Nakshatras. If you look more deeply into BPHS, you will> see that Maharishis Parashara assigns different planets ot the 27 Naksatras,> whcih become rulers of the initial Vimsottari Dasa if their Moon is placed> there. However, I would not equate this to rulership of the Nakshatra> itself, for which he presents 27 Devatas. You should bear in mind that for> Astottari, Sodasottari or for that matter any other Udu dasha, the> distribution of dasha lords linked to nakshatras is utterly different. So> even if one assumes that nakshatras are lorded by Vimsottari lords, if let's> say Astottari describes his chart better than this will not work. Alos> reffering to Deha and Jiva, for me it is too far stretched, so I cna't> really relate to it. As you may know they use not only nakshatra lords but> sublords, sub-sublords etc.> > This however does not disprove that the KP system may give accurate> predictions. Those who use it may give their experience. In the same vain,> Vedic astrologers do not consider western astrology to be sufficiently> grounded, however some western astrologers may still be able to issue proper> predictions. This is because the astrological calculations are tools that we> use but intuition or giudance from the Paramatma is actually crucial. If one> fdoes not get guidance from God then no amount of astrological tools however> authentic will help him to give accurate predictions.> > Yours,> > Gauranga Das Vedic Astrologer> gauranga@b...> Jyotish Remedies:> WWW.BRIHASPATI.NET> Phone:+36-309-140-839> > > ----- Original Message -----> "monmuk111" <monmuk111>> To: <vedic astrology>> Monday, April 21, 2003 7:05 PM> [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic?> > > > Dear friends:> >> > Are you guys talking about the KP/Systems approach. I've sincerely> > with an open mind tried to study the Systems approach and I geniunely> > feels that Systems approach is a big heap of crap. To give you an> > example--it says that for a Scorpio ascendant, Saturn in the most> > benefic planet. Now, per the PURE vedic astrology, Saturn is a> > functional malefic for Scorpio ascendant and this principle applies> > in my personal life, every time I go throug the antardasha of Saturn,> > my life turns upside down.> >> > Now, when Systems approach says that Saturn is the MBPF for Scorpio> > ascendant, it is just a joke or a lie or just a heap of crap.> >> > I tried to apply the Sytems approach principles to the charts of my> > family and friends and NOTHING applies. Not one prediction made per> > Systems Approach coinsides with the lives and events in the life of> > my friends and family; whereas, all the PURE vedic principlea and> > predictions apply.> >> > This is just my experience of the KP/Systems approach. I'm not sure> > if KP and Systems are one and the same thing, I'm only commenting on> > the Systems Approach developed by somebody named Chowdry.> >> > M.Desai> >> >> > vedic astrology, Punit Pandey> > <punitastrologer> wrote:> > > Dear Mr. Visti,> > > Thanks for your comments.> > >> > > I have my difference of opinion regarding KP (Even for lal kitab,> > but that I don't want to discuss here). It seems that KP has taken> > some other path than vedic astrology but if you go through this> > system, you will find parahsari jyotish in the heart. I see four> > major differences from parashari astrology -> > >> > > 1. Use of Placidus system of house division (western one)> > >> > > 2. User of SUB theory> > >> > > 3. Giving more importance to Naksharta. Saying that planet gives> > the result of nakshatra in which it is situated.> > >> > > 4. Differenct ayanamsa (but no one know which ayanamsa was used by> > Parashara himself)> > >> > > From above you can see the 2,3 and 4 and based more or less on> > vedic astrology. SUB theory is devised from Vimshottari Dasha system> > as it is. The same division has been used. The same is for Nakshatra,> > some nadi author also give importance to nakshatra this way. And as> > you said that there is lack of concensus even among vedic astrologers> > for ayanamsas. Only the point 1 (i.e. the house division system) does> > not match with vedic astrology.> > >> > > Although I don't say that I have sufficient knowledge for> > discussing this topic but in my opinion even KP should be part of> > vedic astrology. Even I have no intention to hurt anyone. We must> > keep inventing and improving astrology, if it is possible. If we will> > oppose KP, It will be just like scientists opposing astrology without> > trying to understand it. Even some vedic astrologers are using> > principles similar to KP in some way or other to improve predicitons.> > In my opinion KP with divisional charts and some more dasas might> > become next step in astrology. And it is only possible if we will> > first open ourselves for discussion on non-vedic sounding systems of> > astrology.> > >> > > It will be good for discussion if we will get opinion of all Gurus.> > I also want to know whether anything build/developed/invented on the> > foundation of vedic astrology can be called vedic astrology or not?> > >> > >> > >> > > Thanks & Regards,> > > Punit Pandey> > >> > > Visti Larsen <vishnu@l...> wrote:Hare Rama Krishna------------------> > -----Dear Punit,It is all vedic astrology, however even within vedic> > astrology, the Jyotishis have a mind of their own. Those who follow> > Parasari strictly understand that the nodes must always be mean, and> > not true, to fulfill the duty assigned to them, hence by implication> > of this, one uses mean nodes. But yet some people do not follow this.> > As for ayanamsa, the reason for lack of consensus is lack of valid> > research. Some oppine an ayanamsa that is more than 10 degrees from> > lahiri, but i can assure you that their basis for their readings is> > much different from that taught by parasara.. mainly because those> > natives don't read scriptures to begin with, and make up their own> > rules along the way! This is not Jyotish the way Parasara wanted it> > to be. Krishnamurty created the KP system on a similar basis.. namely> > that noone would teach him Jyotish! Tajik is incorperated into the> > systems we know today and is no doubt an interesting system of> > astrology, but i won't comment. Bhrigu-Jyotish is Nadi-Jyotish and> > Nadi-Jyotish is the same Jyotish that Parasara taught.. have no doubt> > about that. Now to adress your question on acuracy.Once an> > astrologer gets a birth chart, his/her prime objective is to confirm> > its acuracy. So the question of birthtime acuracy is simply not> > relevant, as usually the Astrologer is out to prove its acuracy to> > begin with. When the astrologer has done so, the readings may flow> > like nectar, so the question is Birth-time rectification. Hope this> > helps.Best wishes> > > Visti> > > ---> > > Sri Jagannath Center: http://.org> > > Bhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.org> > > iTRANS 99 Font: http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org----- Original> > Message ----- Punit Pandey vedic astrology> > Friday, April 18, 2003 1:16 PMRe: [vedic astrology]> > Re: accuracy in time of birth> > > Dear Mr. Partha, Sorry for mistake. I used to think that Jaimini,> > Tajik, Hora, Nadi, Bhrigu, KP, Lal Kitab etc. all belong to vedic> > astrology. Probably some are not as vedic. Seeking experts' comments.> > Punit Pandey> > >> > > "V.partha sarathy" <partvinu5> wrote:hare rama krishna> > > dear punit> > >> > > the group discusses vedic astrology. the name of the group is> > written> > > in bold letters. i hope you understand> > > regards> > > partha> > >> > >> > > --- In vedic astrology, Punit Pandey> > > <punitastrologer> wrote:> > > >> > > > Hello All KP Experts,> > > >> > > > I have a question to ask to all experts of this group. Today we> > > utilize sub and sub-sub lords of cusps in nearly all predictions> > > based on KP System.> > > >> > > > We all know that there is no consensus on ayanamsa, no consensus> > on> > > true rahu and mean rahu, known variations of computer programs,> > > unsteady motion of planets, unavailability of atomic clocks at> > > hospitals/homes etc., is it OK to use sub-sub (cuspal sub-sub lords> > > change in average of 25 seconds) lord or even sub lord (cuspal sub> > > lords changes in average of 4 minuts)???> > > >> > > > I think it is a basic question and good subject to debate. At> > least> > > lots of people in India don't have accurate timing with them> > > (accuracy less than 4 minutes).> > > >> > > > Thanks in advance.> > > >> > > > Regards,> > > >> > > > Punit Pandey> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.> > >> > >> > >> > > Archives: vedic astrology> > >> > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > >> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > > > >> > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > >> > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||> > >> > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of> > Service.> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.> > >> > > Archives: vedic astrology> > >> > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > >> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > > > >> > > > > >> > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||> > >> > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of> > Service.> > >> > > Sponsor> > >> > > Archives: vedic astrology> > >> > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > >> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > > > >> > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > >> > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||> > >> > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of> > Service.> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.> >> >> >> > Archives: vedic astrology> >> > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> >> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> >> > > >> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||> >> > Your use of is subject to > >> >> >> >> > ----> > Legyen on is virusmentes!> > http://ad.adverticum.net/b/cl,1,4008,20109,25526/click.prm> >> > > Sponsor > > > > > > Archives: vedic astrology> > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > Your use of is subject to the Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Do you ? The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 24, 2003 Report Share Posted April 24, 2003 Dear punit Pandeyji, It is good that you are able to predict correctly everytime through application of the science. However you have not given your opinion on why the shloka in Astrological Magazine is given by pride of place by an astrologer of the eminence of Dr.(Late) B.V.Raman. Again, how should one explain the yogas given for one to become an astrologer in the very science, the mere application of which gives unfailing results everytime as claimed by you. Would this not be a contradiction? Chandrashekhar. - Punit Pandey vedic astrology Thursday, April 24, 2003 9:11 PM Re: [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic? Chandrashekar Ji, Dr. Rajiv C. Karekar has given a test in his last mail. I also use that test regularly and found it never failing. For the last few years I am checking it continuously and getting amazing results. For this I don't think any sort of intuition is needed for getting correct results. Even a person with a little knowledge of astrology can know future with the given statistical analysis. It is general principle. Can't we extend the whole astrology this way where logic and knowledge will prevail over intuition? I understand that astrology can help in developing intuition. With this continuous development, an astrologer need not to go through horoscope for predicting. He can observe the environment and the person and predict anything. But quoting "intuition" again and again this way will not help in developing astrology in scientific manner. Waiting for your views. Punit Pandey Chandrashekhar <boxdel (AT) (DOT) co.uk> wrote: Dear Punit Pandey, You have missed the import behind the statement. If you happen to read Astrological magazine of Dr.(Late) B.V. Raman, you will find a shloka under the mast head. It states "Phalani Grahacharena Soochayanti manishina . Ko Vakta Taratamasya Tamekam Vedhasam vina." Dr. Raman's contribution to imparting knowledge of Astrology is undisputed. Why do you think he gave the pride of place to this shloka? I would like to have your valuable comments on this aspect. Chandrashekhar. - punitastrologer vedic astrology Wednesday, April 23, 2003 12:54 AM [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic? Dear Mr. Chandrashekhar,If it is the case do we really need to learn astrology???? It is one of the reason the astrology can not be called a science.Punit Pandeyvedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar" <boxdel> wrote:> Dear Gauranga,> You have put in a nutshell the essence of accuracy achieved in predictions.I too believe that when one's predictions come true, the lord uses one as a vehicle to convey message to the Jataka whose time to listen to his Bhagya has arrived.> Regards,> Chandrashekhar.> ----- Original Message ----- > Gauranga Das > To: vedic astrology > Tuesday, April 22, 2003 9:01 PM> Re: [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic?> > > JAYA JAGANNATHA!> > Dear friends,> > Namaste.> > I'm not conversant in detail with the KP system, but as far as I remember> from our talks on the Nyderabad SJC conference, they use the Vimsottari> lords as lords of Nakshatras. If you look more deeply into BPHS, you will> see that Maharishis Parashara assigns different planets ot the 27 Naksatras,> whcih become rulers of the initial Vimsottari Dasa if their Moon is placed> there. However, I would not equate this to rulership of the Nakshatra> itself, for which he presents 27 Devatas. You should bear in mind that for> Astottari, Sodasottari or for that matter any other Udu dasha, the> distribution of dasha lords linked to nakshatras is utterly different. So> even if one assumes that nakshatras are lorded by Vimsottari lords, if let's> say Astottari describes his chart better than this will not work. Alos> reffering to Deha and Jiva, for me it is too far stretched, so I cna't> really relate to it. As you may know they use not only nakshatra lords but> sublords, sub-sublords etc.> > This however does not disprove that the KP system may give accurate> predictions. Those who use it may give their experience. In the same vain,> Vedic astrologers do not consider western astrology to be sufficiently> grounded, however some western astrologers may still be able to issue proper> predictions. This is because the astrological calculations are tools that we> use but intuition or giudance from the Paramatma is actually crucial. If one> fdoes not get guidance from God then no amount of astrological tools however> authentic will help him to give accurate predictions.> > Yours,> > Gauranga Das Vedic Astrologer> gauranga@b...> Jyotish Remedies:> WWW.BRIHASPATI.NET> Phone:+36-309-140-839> > > ----- Original Message -----> "monmuk111" <monmuk111>> To: <vedic astrology>> Monday, April 21, 2003 7:05 PM> [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic?> > > > Dear friends:> >> > Are you guys talking about the KP/Systems approach. I've sincerely> > with an open mind tried to study the Systems approach and I geniunely> > feels that Systems approach is a big heap of crap. To give you an> > example--it says that for a Scorpio ascendant, Saturn in the most> > benefic planet. Now, per the PURE vedic astrology, Saturn is a> > functional malefic for Scorpio ascendant and this principle applies> > in my personal life, every time I go throug the antardasha of Saturn,> > my life turns upside down.> >> > Now, when Systems approach says that Saturn is the MBPF for Scorpio> > ascendant, it is just a joke or a lie or just a heap of crap.> >> > I tried to apply the Sytems approach principles to the charts of my> > family and friends and NOTHING applies. Not one prediction made per> > Systems Approach coinsides with the lives and events in the life of> > my friends and family; whereas, all the PURE vedic principlea and> > predictions apply.> >> > This is just my experience of the KP/Systems approach. I'm not sure> > if KP and Systems are one and the same thing, I'm only commenting on> > the Systems Approach developed by somebody named Chowdry.> >> > M.Desai> >> >> > vedic astrology, Punit Pandey> > <punitastrologer> wrote:> > > Dear Mr. Visti,> > > Thanks for your comments.> > >> > > I have my difference of opinion regarding KP (Even for lal kitab,> > but that I don't want to discuss here). It seems that KP has taken> > some other path than vedic astrology but if you go through this> > system, you will find parahsari jyotish in the heart. I see four> > major differences from parashari astrology -> > >> > > 1. Use of Placidus system of house division (western one)> > >> > > 2. User of SUB theory> > >> > > 3. Giving more importance to Naksharta. Saying that planet gives> > the result of nakshatra in which it is situated.> > >> > > 4. Differenct ayanamsa (but no one know which ayanamsa was used by> > Parashara himself)> > >> > > From above you can see the 2,3 and 4 and based more or less on> > vedic astrology. SUB theory is devised from Vimshottari Dasha system> > as it is. The same division has been used. The same is for Nakshatra,> > some nadi author also give importance to nakshatra this way. And as> > you said that there is lack of concensus even among vedic astrologers> > for ayanamsas. Only the point 1 (i.e. the house division system) does> > not match with vedic astrology.> > >> > > Although I don't say that I have sufficient knowledge for> > discussing this topic but in my opinion even KP should be part of> > vedic astrology. Even I have no intention to hurt anyone. We must> > keep inventing and improving astrology, if it is possible. If we will> > oppose KP, It will be just like scientists opposing astrology without> > trying to understand it. Even some vedic astrologers are using> > principles similar to KP in some way or other to improve predicitons.> > In my opinion KP with divisional charts and some more dasas might> > become next step in astrology. And it is only possible if we will> > first open ourselves for discussion on non-vedic sounding systems of> > astrology.> > >> > > It will be good for discussion if we will get opinion of all Gurus.> > I also want to know whether anything build/developed/invented on the> > foundation of vedic astrology can be called vedic astrology or not?> > >> > >> > >> > > Thanks & Regards,> > > Punit Pandey> > >> > > Visti Larsen <vishnu@l...> wrote:Hare Rama Krishna------------------> > -----Dear Punit,It is all vedic astrology, however even within vedic> > astrology, the Jyotishis have a mind of their own. Those who follow> > Parasari strictly understand that the nodes must always be mean, and> > not true, to fulfill the duty assigned to them, hence by implication> > of this, one uses mean nodes. But yet some people do not follow this.> > As for ayanamsa, the reason for lack of consensus is lack of valid> > research. Some oppine an ayanamsa that is more than 10 degrees from> > lahiri, but i can assure you that their basis for their readings is> > much different from that taught by parasara.. mainly because those> > natives don't read scriptures to begin with, and make up their own> > rules along the way! This is not Jyotish the way Parasara wanted it> > to be. Krishnamurty created the KP system on a similar basis.. namely> > that noone would teach him Jyotish! Tajik is incorperated into the> > systems we know today and is no doubt an interesting system of> > astrology, but i won't comment. Bhrigu-Jyotish is Nadi-Jyotish and> > Nadi-Jyotish is the same Jyotish that Parasara taught.. have no doubt> > about that. Now to adress your question on acuracy.Once an> > astrologer gets a birth chart, his/her prime objective is to confirm> > its acuracy. So the question of birthtime acuracy is simply not> > relevant, as usually the Astrologer is out to prove its acuracy to> > begin with. When the astrologer has done so, the readings may flow> > like nectar, so the question is Birth-time rectification. Hope this> > helps.Best wishes> > > Visti> > > ---> > > Sri Jagannath Center: http://.org> > > Bhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.org> > > iTRANS 99 Font: http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org----- Original> > Message ----- Punit Pandey vedic astrology> > Friday, April 18, 2003 1:16 PMRe: [vedic astrology]> > Re: accuracy in time of birth> > > Dear Mr. Partha, Sorry for mistake. I used to think that Jaimini,> > Tajik, Hora, Nadi, Bhrigu, KP, Lal Kitab etc. all belong to vedic> > astrology. Probably some are not as vedic. Seeking experts' comments.> > Punit Pandey> > >> > > "V.partha sarathy" <partvinu5> wrote:hare rama krishna> > > dear punit> > >> > > the group discusses vedic astrology. the name of the group is> > written> > > in bold letters. i hope you understand> > > regards> > > partha> > >> > >> > > --- In vedic astrology, Punit Pandey> > > <punitastrologer> wrote:> > > >> > > > Hello All KP Experts,> > > >> > > > I have a question to ask to all experts of this group. Today we> > > utilize sub and sub-sub lords of cusps in nearly all predictions> > > based on KP System.> > > >> > > > We all know that there is no consensus on ayanamsa, no consensus> > on> > > true rahu and mean rahu, known variations of computer programs,> > > unsteady motion of planets, unavailability of atomic clocks at> > > hospitals/homes etc., is it OK to use sub-sub (cuspal sub-sub lords> > > change in average of 25 seconds) lord or even sub lord (cuspal sub> > > lords changes in average of 4 minuts)???> > > >> > > > I think it is a basic question and good subject to debate. At> > least> > > lots of people in India don't have accurate timing with them> > > (accuracy less than 4 minutes).> > > >> > > > Thanks in advance.> > > >> > > > Regards,> > > >> > > > Punit Pandey> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.> > >> > >> > >> > > Archives: vedic astrology> > >> > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > >> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > > > >> > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > >> > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||> > >> > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of> > Service.> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.> > >> > > Archives: vedic astrology> > >> > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > >> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > > > >> > > > > >> > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||> > >> > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of> > Service.> > >> > > Sponsor> > >> > > Archives: vedic astrology> > >> > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > >> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > > > >> > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > >> > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||> > >> > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of> > Service.> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.> >> >> >> > Archives: vedic astrology> >> > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> >> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> >> > > >> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||> >> > Your use of is subject to > >> >> >> >> > ----> > Legyen on is virusmentes!> > http://ad.adverticum.net/b/cl,1,4008,20109,25526/click.prm> >> > > Sponsor > > > > > > Archives: vedic astrology> > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > Your use of is subject to the Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 25, 2003 Report Share Posted April 25, 2003 If you go through the test, you will find that it is not for predicting everything but only knowing what sort of event might happen. For example in the star of Venus, I used to receive money. I am checking it for the last few years and it proved correct for me. Whenever sun transit from the star of Venus, it is financially best time in four months for me. Here intuition doesn't play much of the role. Anyone having a little knowledge of astrology can go through this test and check the validity. Again I want to clarify that I have not said anywhere that I can predict everything through application of the science. I was just telling something can be known unfailingly by the application of that test and there are few other tests too. I don't know whether it is written anywhere in vedic astrological books that you need to have intuition to predict anything. But there are few fourmulae / yogas that gives at least 80-90% results. So for those yogas we need not to have any intuition. I understand the value of intuition. But my disagreement is that according to me you can know something unfailingly without the help of intuition. That's what make astrology a science. Punit Pandey Chandrashekhar <boxdel (AT) (DOT) co.uk> wrote: Dear punit Pandeyji, It is good that you are able to predict correctly everytime through application of the science. However you have not given your opinion on why the shloka in Astrological Magazine is given by pride of place by an astrologer of the eminence of Dr.(Late) B.V.Raman. Again, how should one explain the yogas given for one to become an astrologer in the very science, the mere application of which gives unfailing results everytime as claimed by you. Would this not be a contradiction? Chandrashekhar. - Punit Pandey vedic astrology Thursday, April 24, 2003 9:11 PM Re: [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic? Chandrashekar Ji, Dr. Rajiv C. Karekar has given a test in his last mail. I also use that test regularly and found it never failing. For the last few years I am checking it continuously and getting amazing results. For this I don't think any sort of intuition is needed for getting correct results. Even a person with a little knowledge of astrology can know future with the given statistical analysis. It is general principle. Can't we extend the whole astrology this way where logic and knowledge will prevail over intuition? I understand that astrology can help in developing intuition. With this continuous development, an astrologer need not to go through horoscope for predicting. He can observe the environment and the person and predict anything. But quoting "intuition" again and again this way will not help in developing astrology in scientific manner. Waiting for your views. Punit Pandey Chandrashekhar <boxdel (AT) (DOT) co.uk> wrote: Dear Punit Pandey, You have missed the import behind the statement. If you happen to read Astrological magazine of Dr.(Late) B.V. Raman, you will find a shloka under the mast head. It states "Phalani Grahacharena Soochayanti manishina . Ko Vakta Taratamasya Tamekam Vedhasam vina." Dr. Raman's contribution to imparting knowledge of Astrology is undisputed. Why do you think he gave the pride of place to this shloka? I would like to have your valuable comments on this aspect. Chandrashekhar. - punitastrologer vedic astrology Wednesday, April 23, 2003 12:54 AM [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic? Dear Mr. Chandrashekhar,If it is the case do we really need to learn astrology???? It is one of the reason the astrology can not be called a science.Punit Pandeyvedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar" <boxdel> wrote:> Dear Gauranga,> You have put in a nutshell the essence of accuracy achieved in predictions.I too believe that when one's predictions come true, the lord uses one as a vehicle to convey message to the Jataka whose time to listen to his Bhagya has arrived.> Regards,> Chandrashekhar.> ----- Original Message ----- > Gauranga Das > To: vedic astrology > Tuesday, April 22, 2003 9:01 PM> Re: [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic?> > > JAYA JAGANNATHA!> > Dear friends,> > Namaste.> > I'm not conversant in detail with the KP system, but as far as I remember> from our talks on the Nyderabad SJC conference, they use the Vimsottari> lords as lords of Nakshatras. If you look more deeply into BPHS, you will> see that Maharishis Parashara assigns different planets ot the 27 Naksatras,> whcih become rulers of the initial Vimsottari Dasa if their Moon is placed> there. However, I would not equate this to rulership of the Nakshatra> itself, for which he presents 27 Devatas. You should bear in mind that for> Astottari, Sodasottari or for that matter any other Udu dasha, the> distribution of dasha lords linked to nakshatras is utterly different. So> even if one assumes that nakshatras are lorded by Vimsottari lords, if let's> say Astottari describes his chart better than this will not work. Alos> reffering to Deha and Jiva, for me it is too far stretched, so I cna't> really relate to it. As you may know they use not only nakshatra lords but> sublords, sub-sublords etc.> > This however does not disprove that the KP system may give accurate> predictions. Those who use it may give their experience. In the same vain,> Vedic astrologers do not consider western astrology to be sufficiently> grounded, however some western astrologers may still be able to issue proper> predictions. This is because the astrological calculations are tools that we> use but intuition or giudance from the Paramatma is actually crucial. If one> fdoes not get guidance from God then no amount of astrological tools however> authentic will help him to give accurate predictions.> > Yours,> > Gauranga Das Vedic Astrologer> gauranga@b...> Jyotish Remedies:> WWW.BRIHASPATI.NET> Phone:+36-309-140-839> > > ----- Original Message -----> "monmuk111" <monmuk111>> To: <vedic astrology>> Monday, April 21, 2003 7:05 PM> [vedic astrology] Re: Is KP sufficiently vedic?> > > > Dear friends:> >> > Are you guys talking about the KP/Systems approach. I've sincerely> > with an open mind tried to study the Systems approach and I geniunely> > feels that Systems approach is a big heap of crap. To give you an> > example--it says that for a Scorpio ascendant, Saturn in the most> > benefic planet. Now, per the PURE vedic astrology, Saturn is a> > functional malefic for Scorpio ascendant and this principle applies> > in my personal life, every time I go throug the antardasha of Saturn,> > my life turns upside down.> >> > Now, when Systems approach says that Saturn is the MBPF for Scorpio> > ascendant, it is just a joke or a lie or just a heap of crap.> >> > I tried to apply the Sytems approach principles to the charts of my> > family and friends and NOTHING applies. Not one prediction made per> > Systems Approach coinsides with the lives and events in the life of> > my friends and family; whereas, all the PURE vedic principlea and> > predictions apply.> >> > This is just my experience of the KP/Systems approach. I'm not sure> > if KP and Systems are one and the same thing, I'm only commenting on> > the Systems Approach developed by somebody named Chowdry.> >> > M.Desai> >> >> > vedic astrology, Punit Pandey> > <punitastrologer> wrote:> > > Dear Mr. Visti,> > > Thanks for your comments.> > >> > > I have my difference of opinion regarding KP (Even for lal kitab,> > but that I don't want to discuss here). It seems that KP has taken> > some other path than vedic astrology but if you go through this> > system, you will find parahsari jyotish in the heart. I see four> > major differences from parashari astrology -> > >> > > 1. Use of Placidus system of house division (western one)> > >> > > 2. User of SUB theory> > >> > > 3. Giving more importance to Naksharta. Saying that planet gives> > the result of nakshatra in which it is situated.> > >> > > 4. Differenct ayanamsa (but no one know which ayanamsa was used by> > Parashara himself)> > >> > > From above you can see the 2,3 and 4 and based more or less on> > vedic astrology. SUB theory is devised from Vimshottari Dasha system> > as it is. The same division has been used. The same is for Nakshatra,> > some nadi author also give importance to nakshatra this way. And as> > you said that there is lack of concensus even among vedic astrologers> > for ayanamsas. Only the point 1 (i.e. the house division system) does> > not match with vedic astrology.> > >> > > Although I don't say that I have sufficient knowledge for> > discussing this topic but in my opinion even KP should be part of> > vedic astrology. Even I have no intention to hurt anyone. We must> > keep inventing and improving astrology, if it is possible. If we will> > oppose KP, It will be just like scientists opposing astrology without> > trying to understand it. Even some vedic astrologers are using> > principles similar to KP in some way or other to improve predicitons.> > In my opinion KP with divisional charts and some more dasas might> > become next step in astrology. And it is only possible if we will> > first open ourselves for discussion on non-vedic sounding systems of> > astrology.> > >> > > It will be good for discussion if we will get opinion of all Gurus.> > I also want to know whether anything build/developed/invented on the> > foundation of vedic astrology can be called vedic astrology or not?> > >> > >> > >> > > Thanks & Regards,> > > Punit Pandey> > >> > > Visti Larsen <vishnu@l...> wrote:Hare Rama Krishna------------------> > -----Dear Punit,It is all vedic astrology, however even within vedic> > astrology, the Jyotishis have a mind of their own. Those who follow> > Parasari strictly understand that the nodes must always be mean, and> > not true, to fulfill the duty assigned to them, hence by implication> > of this, one uses mean nodes. But yet some people do not follow this.> > As for ayanamsa, the reason for lack of consensus is lack of valid> > research. Some oppine an ayanamsa that is more than 10 degrees from> > lahiri, but i can assure you that their basis for their readings is> > much different from that taught by parasara.. mainly because those> > natives don't read scriptures to begin with, and make up their own> > rules along the way! This is not Jyotish the way Parasara wanted it> > to be. Krishnamurty created the KP system on a similar basis.. namely> > that noone would teach him Jyotish! Tajik is incorperated into the> > systems we know today and is no doubt an interesting system of> > astrology, but i won't comment. Bhrigu-Jyotish is Nadi-Jyotish and> > Nadi-Jyotish is the same Jyotish that Parasara taught.. have no doubt> > about that. Now to adress your question on acuracy.Once an> > astrologer gets a birth chart, his/her prime objective is to confirm> > its acuracy. So the question of birthtime acuracy is simply not> > relevant, as usually the Astrologer is out to prove its acuracy to> > begin with. When the astrologer has done so, the readings may flow> > like nectar, so the question is Birth-time rectification. Hope this> > helps.Best wishes> > > Visti> > > ---> > > Sri Jagannath Center: http://.org> > > Bhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.org> > > iTRANS 99 Font: http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org----- Original> > Message ----- Punit Pandey vedic astrology> > Friday, April 18, 2003 1:16 PMRe: [vedic astrology]> > Re: accuracy in time of birth> > > Dear Mr. Partha, Sorry for mistake. I used to think that Jaimini,> > Tajik, Hora, Nadi, Bhrigu, KP, Lal Kitab etc. all belong to vedic> > astrology. Probably some are not as vedic. Seeking experts' comments.> > Punit Pandey> > >> > > "V.partha sarathy" <partvinu5> wrote:hare rama krishna> > > dear punit> > >> > > the group discusses vedic astrology. the name of the group is> > written> > > in bold letters. i hope you understand> > > regards> > > partha> > >> > >> > > --- In vedic astrology, Punit Pandey> > > <punitastrologer> wrote:> > > >> > > > Hello All KP Experts,> > > >> > > > I have a question to ask to all experts of this group. Today we> > > utilize sub and sub-sub lords of cusps in nearly all predictions> > > based on KP System.> > > >> > > > We all know that there is no consensus on ayanamsa, no consensus> > on> > > true rahu and mean rahu, known variations of computer programs,> > > unsteady motion of planets, unavailability of atomic clocks at> > > hospitals/homes etc., is it OK to use sub-sub (cuspal sub-sub lords> > > change in average of 25 seconds) lord or even sub lord (cuspal sub> > > lords changes in average of 4 minuts)???> > > >> > > > I think it is a basic question and good subject to debate. At> > least> > > lots of people in India don't have accurate timing with them> > > (accuracy less than 4 minutes).> > > >> > > > Thanks in advance.> > > >> > > > Regards,> > > >> > > > Punit Pandey> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.> > >> > >> > >> > > Archives: vedic astrology> > >> > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > >> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > > > >> > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > >> > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||> > >> > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of> > Service.> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.> > >> > > Archives: vedic astrology> > >> > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > >> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > > > >> > > > > >> > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||> > >> > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of> > Service.> > >> > > Sponsor> > >> > > Archives: vedic astrology> > >> > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > >> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > > > >> > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > >> > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||> > >> > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of> > Service.> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.> >> >> >> > Archives: vedic astrology> >> > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> >> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> >> > > >> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||> >> > Your use of is subject to > >> >> >> >> > ----> > Legyen on is virusmentes!> > http://ad.adverticum.net/b/cl,1,4008,20109,25526/click.prm> >> > > Sponsor > > > > > > Archives: vedic astrology> > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > Your use of is subject to the Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Do you ? The New Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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