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Dear Dr. SP Choudhary:

 

Thank you once more for the comprehensive reply. The

central idea of your post is that--both good and bad

karma leads to re-birth.

 

Now, the big question is -- What leads to moksha? Does

god take a unilateral decision in selecting which

souls attain moksha? (moksha I understand to be freed

from the cycle of birth and death and become one with

god as Visti pointed out couple of days back).

 

The human birth itself is suffering, there is no way

to escape suffering then why be born again to reap the

rewards of good deeds from prior life. -- how can one

reap the rewards of past life good karma why the human

life (by default) is suffering?

 

And why would we all be talking about moksha and the

means to achieve it if the cycle of birth and re-birth

is going to continue till infinity? Thanks.

 

M Desai

 

 

 

 

--- Dr Satya Prakash Choudhary

<satyaprakasika wrote:

> AUM NAMAH SHIVAYA

>

> Dear MD,

>

>

> >You say that re-birth occurs due to Karma and also

> your desires. I'm

> >under the impression that ONLY BAD-Karma lead to

> re-birth to suffer

> >for the sins of previous birth.

>

> A GOLDEN CHAIN OR AN IRON CHAIN, BOTH ARE CHAINS. "A

> golden

> chain can shackle you as much as an iron chain" .

> Karma, whether good

> or bad, can bring you back again. The texts and

> commentaries are

> clear on this (not only Hindu, even Jain and

> Buddhist for that

> matter). If you do good karmas, you come back to

> enjoy the results of

> good karma. At the best, you will go to various

> lokas or higher

> worlds and live there for a period till you have

> reaped the results

> of the good karmas. But again you are born to work

> out your

> salvation. The idea that only bad karma results in

> birth is a

> misunderstanding. There is NO such thing

> that the law of karma exists to PUNISH YOU for your

> bad deeds! It is

> a natural law that has no preference for good and

> bad. Put simply,

> you just reap what you sow. Sow good seeds and you

> shall reap good

> results. That is why we are asked to rise beyond

> both good and bad.

>

> >How can one exist in a family life and in society

> without karma?

> >Hey, I have to go to my office and work so that I

> can take care of

> >my family, I just can't run away in the jungle, sit

> under a tree and

> >chant the name of god and expect moksha.

>

> That is a good question. It is impossible to run

> away from the

> society. No human being can ever remain without

> karma. Bound by

> Prakriti (Nature), man is forced to do karma by the

> three gunas

> (Sattva, Rajas, Tamas). Our Prakriti will makes us

> do karma. Karma is

> three fold. First there arises a desire. Then you

> will think of how

> to get it. Then you exert to attain it. Desire,

> thought and action

> always go together. So thought itself is subtle

> karma, the seed of

> karma. Karma can be done through the mind (thought),

> speech

> (words/verbal) and the body (the actual act). These

> are three

> threads, which make the rope of karma that binds all

> men. Hence even

> if a man is inactive and refrains from action, he

> may still be doing

> karma at a thought level. As long as thoughts are

> there, karma is

> being done. A man may be acting, but mentally he may

> not have sense

> of agency, in which case karma cannot bind him. This

> is the essence

> of the Gita sloka, "He who sees action in inaction,

> and inaction

> in

> action, is a `Yogi'". Seeing, hearing, talking,

> thinking,

> etc. are

> all Karmas. We are constantly performing karma

> through the mind,

> speech and body in all the three states of dreaming,

> sleeping and

> walking.

>

> There can be no state in which a man is not

> performing karma. Instead

> of running away from action, one should instead,

> give up all SENSE OF

> AGENCY, the IDENTIFICATION with Karmas. If you write

> a cheque for a

> hundred thousand rupees and do not sign it, is it

> valid? No, because

> your signature is not there. Similarly if you do not

> put your

> signature on the actions, they cannot bind you. In

> other words, you

> can act, but do not be attached to the result. Do it

> without any

> sense of agency, with a Nimita Bhava. Surrendering

> oneself to God, if

> one acts without any attachment to the results, the

> Karmas do not

> bind him. The sense of `I', `mine' and

> self-identification are your

> signature. When you do any karma without your

> signature, it is not

> going to bind you. This again brings us to point D

> of my earlier

> post.

>

> Remember "d.) Attachment and hate arise from Egoism

> (sense of

> `I'

> and `Mine')"? It is this "I" that holds the key

> to all problems.

> Understanding this "I" is the essence of Gnana

> (Ramana

> Maharshi's "Who am I" for instance). In fact that

> loop of

> six points

> that I gave as the cause (process as well) for

> repeated births is the

> distilled essence of a highly acclaimed text "Laghu

> Vasudeva

> Mananam". In my articles/posts I just make a rosary

> of the beads

> collected from the essence of various texts,

> commentaries, or

> teachings of great saints. There is nothing new in

> what I write. My

> originality lies only in how I weave the

> garland/rosary and also the

> choice of the beads. But the beads are all already

> there. But

> normally in such posts I do not give references and

> notes, as it can

> be cumbersome and also spoils the flow. And now back

> to what we were

> discussing…

>

> So can one really go beyond karma? As Swami

> Sivananda said, one can

> go beyond the ***results of karma. "Attaining

> knowledge of

> Brahman or

> the Eternal, destroys the whole lot of Sanchita

> karma. It can be

> greatly modified by entertaining lofty, divine

> thoughts, and doing

> virtuous actions. Agami karma can be destroyed by

> expiatory rites or

> Prayaschitta, and by removing the idea of agency

> through Nimitta

> Bhava (attitude that one is an instrument in the

> hands of God) and

> Sakshi Bhava (attitude that one is silent witness of

> the actions of

> the senses and the mind)". Even Ramana Maharshi

> clearly advocates

> Sakshi bhava. Almost all his conversations directly

> or indirectly

> reflect this. Whether you follow the path of Gnana

> (like Ramana

> Maharshi's "Who am I") or whether you follow the

> Bhakti (

> devotion)

> marga, the essence is the same. Either you surrender

> all sense of

> agency and remain an instrument (Nimitta matra) as

> in the case of a

> devotee (bhakta), or you become a silent witness of

> the action of the

> senses and the mind (sakshi: witness) if you follow

> the Upanisadic

> path of discrimination. While the bhakti path is

> easier and suitable

> to most (at least in Kali yuga), the direct path of

> discrimination

> requires a higher degree of maturity or maybe even a

> specific bent of

> mind. JK's (Jiddu Krishnamurti) work too is similar

> to the

> Upanisadic

> path of Gnana, the path of discrimination. It

> stresses more on

> AWARENESS, which is another way of teaching the

> Sakshi bhava. And so

> do certain schools of Buddhism. Guess I have to stop

> now as

> otherwise, this reply/post too will become more like

> an article! I

> will end it with a few extracts from Swami

> Vivekananda's complete

> works. He interprets Karma yoga in the best manner.

>

> "Be unattached. Let things work; let brain centers

> work; work

> incessantly, but let not a ripple conquer the mind.

> Work

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