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Dear All,

I have a confusion over Using different Ayamansas.

Using different Ayamansas give different Charts.

Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are different.

Please guide me.

Sincerely

Amit

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Ji Amitji,

In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of discussions due to differences it

has been agreed that scietifically prudent to use Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National

Committee constituted has also recommended for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

Infact to add to list I also cite the research of Shri K.N.Rao a renowned

Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

krishnan

 

amit_call <amit_call wrote:

 

Dear All,

I have a confusion over Using different Ayamansas.

Using different Ayamansas give different Charts.

Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are different.

Please guide me.

Sincerely

Amit

 

 

 

 

 

~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

 

 

/

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

All your favorites on one personal page – Try My

 

 

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Share on other sites

Dear amit_call,

 

Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP ayanamsa is used in KP

analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his books. It's up to the

preference of an individual astrologer.

 

Best regards,

 

tw

 

P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa with deg:min:sec is

advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book 2003, pp 1, 88-93)

 

 

, vattem krishnan

<bursar_99> wrote:

> Ji Amitji,

> In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of discussions due to

differences it has been agreed that scietifically prudent to use

Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee constituted has also recommended

for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> Infact to add to list I also cite the research of Shri K.N.Rao a

renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> krishnan

>

> amit_call <amit_call> wrote:

>

> Dear All,

> I have a confusion over Using different Ayamansas.

> Using different Ayamansas give different Charts.

> Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are different.

> Please guide me.

> Sincerely

> Amit

>

>

>

>

>

> ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

>

>

> Sponsor

>

>

>

> Links

>

>

> /

>

>

>

>

> Terms of

Service.

>

>

>

>

>

> All your favorites on one personal page – Try My

>

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Please do not be personally offended but I have a bit of problem

with "mostly" in your statement. Couple of years ago on his newslist,

I had asked Mr. Rao directly about how such a conclusion (he had also

used a statement like "mostly" or 'universally') was derived. Given

that there must be millions of jyotishis in India itself and the

population growing like a family of rabbits all over the globe, how

can one make a statement like that unless a survey was done. It is

his greatness that he eventually responded saying that somewhere (I

think in Delhi or Poona) a group of panchaang makers (I recall less

than 30 but I could be remembering it wrongly) had congregated with

some govt. officials and through their deliberations (details of

which I would be curious to learn but have no clue where to find

those or if those were even published or made avaiable to anyone)had

come to the conclusion that chitra or chaitra ayanamsha is the one to

be adopted. I never got the information as to how many of these fine

individuals were actually jyotishis, or practiced jyotish with any

success during their lifetime.

 

Mr. Rao himself follows and recommends Lahiri ayanamsha which is

pretty close to chitra ayanamsha and I believe he has mentioned that

he got good results with the ayanamsha and that this was close to

what his astrological guru used/recommended and also close to the

values that Mr. Karve the psychic who can tell your time of birth

just by looking/talking to you, produced. Mr. Karve, it seems looked

at you, and gave a lagna degree and the date and with lahiri

ayanamsha this value matched. Mr. Rao's students probably use only

Lahiri ayanamsha but I have only interacted with a few so cannot tell

about the ultimate preferences of all.

 

What we can say that the vocal majority on internet probably uses

lahiri ayanamsha. If this list is a standard reference, then the

vocal 'majority' represents less than 1% of the participants (less

than 26 who discuss jyotish, not counting those that ask for readings

only, OUT of some 2600 members). The same would be the experience in

other list subpopulations (less than 1% talk, express, write). So one

can safely assume that at least 1% or less of the astrologers (sorry

Jyotishis!) claim to use Lahiri ayanamsha or a similar value. This is

a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'!

 

Mind you, I am not saying that Lahiri ayanamsha does not work or does

or that there is necessarily a better ayanamsha. In fact there are

many western astrologers who are considered to have been quite

effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at all and work

with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not just one or two

degrees, and still produce good results!

 

There are a lot of myths and suppositions and claims floating around

in the ocean of astrology about this or that being tge absolute truth

in the field of astrology in general and statements such as jyotish

is good for predicting events and tropical better at describing the

psyche, etc. As I have pointed out in some earlier written articles,

this is more a reflection of the person and his background who then

went on to become an astrologer - the economist drawn to forecasting

the markets, the doctor focussing on astrology of the diseases, the

spiritualist seeing the spiritual map in the horoscope, the

psychologist focusing on the psyche as revealed through the map.

 

The beauty is that the same little map, or maybe a few of these are

capable of giving such a rich description of the human experience,

the full spectrum of which has been beyond the scope of comprehension

of any one individual, whether astrologer, jyotishi, tarotomancer,

scryer or some Guru yogi divine!

 

RR

 

 

 

, "tw853" <tw853> wrote:

>

> Dear amit_call,

>

> Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP ayanamsa is used in KP

> analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his books. It's up to the

> preference of an individual astrologer.

>

> Best regards,

>

> tw

>

> P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa with deg:min:sec is

> advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book 2003, pp 1, 88-93)

>

>

> , vattem krishnan

> <bursar_99> wrote:

> > Ji Amitji,

> > In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of discussions due to

> differences it has been agreed that scietifically prudent to use

> Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee constituted has also

recommended

> for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> > Infact to add to list I also cite the research of Shri K.N.Rao a

> renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> > krishnan

> >

> > amit_call <amit_call> wrote:

> >

> > Dear All,

> > I have a confusion over Using different Ayamansas.

> > Using different Ayamansas give different Charts.

> > Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are different.

> > Please guide me.

> > Sincerely

> > Amit

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

> >

> >

> > Sponsor

> >

> >

> >

> > Links

> >

> >

> > /

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Terms of

> Service.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > All your favorites on one personal page – Try My

> >

> >

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Hello Amitji,

For some time I had the fortune of getting associated with Phalit jyotish

through Rastreeya Sanskrit Vidyapeeth,New Delhi.

In the committee constituted by the Govt of India even late Shri B.V.Raman was

also a member apart from several vedic scholars from Benares,Haridwar and other

places.

Even in these learned institutions research on the subjectof Ayanamsa is being

caaried out.Most of these are guided through Prof Kalyan Dutt Varma,who is now

on the bed.Govt India and several other Govts too have supported the research

and even built mini jantar-mantars to calculate the movements of planets and

study the motion of earth.And these effects through research are getting

published in Sanskrit.Infact even you can try from Tirupati university in India.

As far as relativity and percentage of usage of Lahiri Ayanamsa.I have no

idea.So I go by your statstics.Incase you want to be sure before you infer as :

This is a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'

Let us be sincere to find the relevance of Ayanamsa in Helio Centric Approach

mostly followe by the westren Astrologers.

Infact what little I have understood from Hindu Predictive Astrology through

various approaches of Ganith jyotish,we have three different lagnas for

harmonising the results arising out the study of natal chart in

Astrology.Lagna,Surya as Lagna and mostly Moon as also lagna.This approach has

made us to depend on various mathematical calculations and the relevance of

Ayanmsa as a major factor of study was taken up.

In the case of westren Astrologers and their philosophy in handing over good

results without elaborate rules and the approach of vedic Astrology based on the

tripod(1,5and9) are to serve for different sections of this great universe.We

like or not the basic of our philosophy in Astrology is related to Karma

Siddhantam.

In westren thoughts probably they believe in an approach which is not

deterministic but gives an opportunity for understanding what is not possible

but do not go beyond to say why it is not possible.

I agree with you when you say:

many western astrologers who are considered to have been quite

effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at all and work

with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not just one or two

degrees, and still produce good results

Is it not that Astrology has also an intutional element where some soothe sayers

as pointed out by you can off hand predict any thing?

In India Astrology is making strides with the revival towards Vedic

understanding and to find it's relevance in modern times and in futuristic

studies.

Incidentally I believed late B.V.Raman and Shri K.N Rao as my great Gurus bout

for whose blessing I would not have ventured myself in to these highly sensitive

areas of discussions.

Thanx

krishnan

rohiniranjan <rrgb wrote:

 

Please do not be personally offended but I have a bit of problem

with "mostly" in your statement. Couple of years ago on his newslist,

I had asked Mr. Rao directly about how such a conclusion (he had also

used a statement like "mostly" or 'universally') was derived. Given

that there must be millions of jyotishis in India itself and the

population growing like a family of rabbits all over the globe, how

can one make a statement like that unless a survey was done. It is

his greatness that he eventually responded saying that somewhere (I

think in Delhi or Poona) a group of panchaang makers (I recall less

than 30 but I could be remembering it wrongly) had congregated with

some govt. officials and through their deliberations (details of

which I would be curious to learn but have no clue where to find

those or if those were even published or made avaiable to anyone)had

come to the conclusion that chitra or chaitra ayanamsha is the one to

be adopted. I never got the information as to how many of these fine

individuals were actually jyotishis, or practiced jyotish with any

success during their lifetime.

 

Mr. Rao himself follows and recommends Lahiri ayanamsha which is

pretty close to chitra ayanamsha and I believe he has mentioned that

he got good results with the ayanamsha and that this was close to

what his astrological guru used/recommended and also close to the

values that Mr. Karve the psychic who can tell your time of birth

just by looking/talking to you, produced. Mr. Karve, it seems looked

at you, and gave a lagna degree and the date and with lahiri

ayanamsha this value matched. Mr. Rao's students probably use only

Lahiri ayanamsha but I have only interacted with a few so cannot tell

about the ultimate preferences of all.

 

What we can say that the vocal majority on internet probably uses

lahiri ayanamsha. If this list is a standard reference, then the

vocal 'majority' represents less than 1% of the participants (less

than 26 who discuss jyotish, not counting those that ask for readings

only, OUT of some 2600 members). The same would be the experience in

other list subpopulations (less than 1% talk, express, write). So one

can safely assume that at least 1% or less of the astrologers (sorry

Jyotishis!) claim to use Lahiri ayanamsha or a similar value. This is

a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'!

 

Mind you, I am not saying that Lahiri ayanamsha does not work or does

or that there is necessarily a better ayanamsha. In fact there are

many western astrologers who are considered to have been quite

effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at all and work

with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not just one or two

degrees, and still produce good results!

 

There are a lot of myths and suppositions and claims floating around

in the ocean of astrology about this or that being tge absolute truth

in the field of astrology in general and statements such as jyotish

is good for predicting events and tropical better at describing the

psyche, etc. As I have pointed out in some earlier written articles,

this is more a reflection of the person and his background who then

went on to become an astrologer - the economist drawn to forecasting

the markets, the doctor focussing on astrology of the diseases, the

spiritualist seeing the spiritual map in the horoscope, the

psychologist focusing on the psyche as revealed through the map.

 

The beauty is that the same little map, or maybe a few of these are

capable of giving such a rich description of the human experience,

the full spectrum of which has been beyond the scope of comprehension

of any one individual, whether astrologer, jyotishi, tarotomancer,

scryer or some Guru yogi divine!

 

RR

 

 

 

, "tw853" <tw853> wrote:

>

> Dear amit_call,

>

> Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP ayanamsa is used in KP

> analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his books. It's up to the

> preference of an individual astrologer.

>

> Best regards,

>

> tw

>

> P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa with deg:min:sec is

> advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book 2003, pp 1, 88-93)

>

>

> , vattem krishnan

> <bursar_99> wrote:

> > Ji Amitji,

> > In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of discussions due to

> differences it has been agreed that scietifically prudent to use

> Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee constituted has also

recommended

> for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> > Infact to add to list I also cite the research of Shri K.N.Rao a

> renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> > krishnan

> >

> > amit_call <amit_call> wrote:

> >

> > Dear All,

> > I have a confusion over Using different Ayamansas.

> > Using different Ayamansas give different Charts.

> > Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are different.

> > Please guide me.

> > Sincerely

> > Amit

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

> >

> >

> > Sponsor

> >

> >

> >

> > Links

> >

> >

> > /

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Terms of

> Service.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > All your favorites on one personal page – Try My

> >

> >

 

 

 

 

 

~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

 

 

 

/

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The all-new My – Get yours free!

 

 

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Share on other sites

Dear Rohini Ranjan,

 

I fully agree with Vattem Krishnan not to venture myself into the

highly sensitive controversy of ayanamsa discussion. For myself I use

new KP ayanamsa, while simultaneously respecting the personal

preferences of others.

 

Best wishes,

 

tw

 

 

, vattem krishnan

<bursar_99> wrote:

> Hello Amitji,

> For some time I had the fortune of getting associated with Phalit

jyotish through Rastreeya Sanskrit Vidyapeeth,New Delhi.

> In the committee constituted by the Govt of India even late Shri

B.V.Raman was also a member apart from several vedic scholars from

Benares,Haridwar and other places.

> Even in these learned institutions research on the subjectof

Ayanamsa is being caaried out.Most of these are guided through Prof

Kalyan Dutt Varma,who is now on the bed.Govt India and several other

Govts too have supported the research and even built mini jantar-

mantars to calculate the movements of planets and study the motion of

earth.And these effects through research are getting published in

Sanskrit.Infact even you can try from Tirupati university in India.

> As far as relativity and percentage of usage of Lahiri Ayanamsa.I

have no idea.So I go by your statstics.Incase you want to be sure

before you infer as :

> This is a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'

> Let us be sincere to find the relevance of Ayanamsa in Helio

Centric Approach mostly followe by the westren Astrologers.

> Infact what little I have understood from Hindu Predictive

Astrology through various approaches of Ganith jyotish,we have three

different lagnas for harmonising the results arising out the study of

natal chart in Astrology.Lagna,Surya as Lagna and mostly Moon as also

lagna.This approach has made us to depend on various mathematical

calculations and the relevance of Ayanmsa as a major factor of study

was taken up.

> In the case of westren Astrologers and their philosophy in handing

over good results without elaborate rules and the approach of vedic

Astrology based on the tripod(1,5and9) are to serve for different

sections of this great universe.We like or not the basic of our

philosophy in Astrology is related to Karma Siddhantam.

> In westren thoughts probably they believe in an approach which is

not deterministic but gives an opportunity for understanding what is

not possible but do not go beyond to say why it is not possible.

> I agree with you when you say:

> many western astrologers who are considered to have been quite

> effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at all and work

> with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not just one or

two

> degrees, and still produce good results

> Is it not that Astrology has also an intutional element where some

soothe sayers as pointed out by you can off hand predict any thing?

> In India Astrology is making strides with the revival towards Vedic

understanding and to find it's relevance in modern times and in

futuristic studies.

> Incidentally I believed late B.V.Raman and Shri K.N Rao as my great

Gurus bout for whose blessing I would not have ventured myself in to

these highly sensitive areas of discussions.

> Thanx

> krishnan

> rohiniranjan <rrgb@s...> wrote:

>

> Please do not be personally offended but I have a bit of problem

> with "mostly" in your statement. Couple of years ago on his

newslist,

> I had asked Mr. Rao directly about how such a conclusion (he had

also

> used a statement like "mostly" or 'universally') was derived. Given

> that there must be millions of jyotishis in India itself and the

> population growing like a family of rabbits all over the globe, how

> can one make a statement like that unless a survey was done. It is

> his greatness that he eventually responded saying that somewhere (I

> think in Delhi or Poona) a group of panchaang makers (I recall less

> than 30 but I could be remembering it wrongly) had congregated with

> some govt. officials and through their deliberations (details of

> which I would be curious to learn but have no clue where to find

> those or if those were even published or made avaiable to anyone)

had

> come to the conclusion that chitra or chaitra ayanamsha is the one

to

> be adopted. I never got the information as to how many of these

fine

> individuals were actually jyotishis, or practiced jyotish with any

> success during their lifetime.

>

> Mr. Rao himself follows and recommends Lahiri ayanamsha which is

> pretty close to chitra ayanamsha and I believe he has mentioned

that

> he got good results with the ayanamsha and that this was close to

> what his astrological guru used/recommended and also close to the

> values that Mr. Karve the psychic who can tell your time of birth

> just by looking/talking to you, produced. Mr. Karve, it seems

looked

> at you, and gave a lagna degree and the date and with lahiri

> ayanamsha this value matched. Mr. Rao's students probably use only

> Lahiri ayanamsha but I have only interacted with a few so cannot

tell

> about the ultimate preferences of all.

>

> What we can say that the vocal majority on internet probably uses

> lahiri ayanamsha. If this list is a standard reference, then the

> vocal 'majority' represents less than 1% of the participants (less

> than 26 who discuss jyotish, not counting those that ask for

readings

> only, OUT of some 2600 members). The same would be the experience

in

> other list subpopulations (less than 1% talk, express, write). So

one

> can safely assume that at least 1% or less of the astrologers

(sorry

> Jyotishis!) claim to use Lahiri ayanamsha or a similar value. This

is

> a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'!

>

> Mind you, I am not saying that Lahiri ayanamsha does not work or

does

> or that there is necessarily a better ayanamsha. In fact there are

> many western astrologers who are considered to have been quite

> effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at all and work

> with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not just one or

two

> degrees, and still produce good results!

>

> There are a lot of myths and suppositions and claims floating

around

> in the ocean of astrology about this or that being tge absolute

truth

> in the field of astrology in general and statements such as jyotish

> is good for predicting events and tropical better at describing the

> psyche, etc. As I have pointed out in some earlier written

articles,

> this is more a reflection of the person and his background who then

> went on to become an astrologer - the economist drawn to

forecasting

> the markets, the doctor focussing on astrology of the diseases, the

> spiritualist seeing the spiritual map in the horoscope, the

> psychologist focusing on the psyche as revealed through the map.

>

> The beauty is that the same little map, or maybe a few of these are

> capable of giving such a rich description of the human experience,

> the full spectrum of which has been beyond the scope of

comprehension

> of any one individual, whether astrologer, jyotishi, tarotomancer,

> scryer or some Guru yogi divine!

>

> RR

>

>

>

> , "tw853" <tw853> wrote:

> >

> > Dear amit_call,

> >

> > Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP ayanamsa is used in KP

> > analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his books. It's up to the

> > preference of an individual astrologer.

> >

> > Best regards,

> >

> > tw

> >

> > P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa with deg:min:sec is

> > advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book 2003, pp 1, 88-93)

> >

> >

> > , vattem krishnan

> > <bursar_99> wrote:

> > > Ji Amitji,

> > > In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of discussions due to

> > differences it has been agreed that scietifically prudent to use

> > Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee constituted has also

> recommended

> > for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> > > Infact to add to list I also cite the research of Shri K.N.Rao

a

> > renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> > > krishnan

> > >

> > > amit_call <amit_call> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear All,

> > > I have a confusion over Using different Ayamansas.

> > > Using different Ayamansas give different Charts.

> > > Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are different.

> > > Please guide me.

> > > Sincerely

> > > Amit

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

> > >

> > >

> > > Sponsor

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Links

> > >

> > >

> > > /

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Terms of

> > Service.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > All your favorites on one personal page – Try My

> > >

> > >

>

>

>

>

>

> ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

>

>

>

>

> Links

>

>

> /

>

>

>

>

> Terms of

Service.

>

>

>

>

>

> The all-new My – Get yours free!

>

>

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Share on other sites

Hello Rohiniji,

The Astronomical studies have confirmed ecliptical zodiac and the movements of

the planets along with planets was never found to be unform.So we have all

confusions added to the changes being witnessed in the planet earth due

unpredicatable characterstics of Nature.I do not know whether I can put that

even the science finds it difficult to say in precise nature.May be Ayanamsa

correction is a specific approach from the fixed zodiac of Aries.Westren

Astrology based on accptable solar system too may be able to solve the riddles

of human life and anticipated events.Even we in our Astrology avoid Neptune and

Pluto,westren Astrologers attribute great significance of these two outer

planets.Still i believe that the kind of Shodasamasas we have developed can

bring out comfortably various aspects of life including the nature of old age

through the aid of divisional chart.

Keeping these aspects in mind,probably it is appropriate till such that we are

not able to deny Ayanamsa,particularly Lahiri's Ayanamsa as useful for our

purposes but we do not discount other approaches and certainly not their

efficacy in predictions.

Certainly Astrology,particularly Vedic Astrology to unfold the the future and

past events will always remain to be connected with intution and if not the

sixth sense.

In this we have umpteen examples including a 10year old British who could

recollect from her class rom lessons to say the most unusual and catsrophic

events like Tsunami.

Even Late B.V.raman makes it a point to refer to the accuracy to Brahma as the

creator of universe.

Iam sure our distinguished members may have some more valuble suggestions on the

subject.

Thanx

krishnan

 

tw853 <tw853 wrote:

 

 

 

Dear Rohini Ranjan,

 

I fully agree with Vattem Krishnan not to venture myself into the

highly sensitive controversy of ayanamsa discussion. For myself I use

new KP ayanamsa, while simultaneously respecting the personal

preferences of others.

 

Best wishes,

 

tw

 

 

, vattem krishnan

<bursar_99> wrote:

> Hello Amitji,

> For some time I had the fortune of getting associated with Phalit

jyotish through Rastreeya Sanskrit Vidyapeeth,New Delhi.

> In the committee constituted by the Govt of India even late Shri

B.V.Raman was also a member apart from several vedic scholars from

Benares,Haridwar and other places.

> Even in these learned institutions research on the subjectof

Ayanamsa is being caaried out.Most of these are guided through Prof

Kalyan Dutt Varma,who is now on the bed.Govt India and several other

Govts too have supported the research and even built mini jantar-

mantars to calculate the movements of planets and study the motion of

earth.And these effects through research are getting published in

Sanskrit.Infact even you can try from Tirupati university in India.

> As far as relativity and percentage of usage of Lahiri Ayanamsa.I

have no idea.So I go by your statstics.Incase you want to be sure

before you infer as :

> This is a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'

> Let us be sincere to find the relevance of Ayanamsa in Helio

Centric Approach mostly followe by the westren Astrologers.

> Infact what little I have understood from Hindu Predictive

Astrology through various approaches of Ganith jyotish,we have three

different lagnas for harmonising the results arising out the study of

natal chart in Astrology.Lagna,Surya as Lagna and mostly Moon as also

lagna.This approach has made us to depend on various mathematical

calculations and the relevance of Ayanmsa as a major factor of study

was taken up.

> In the case of westren Astrologers and their philosophy in handing

over good results without elaborate rules and the approach of vedic

Astrology based on the tripod(1,5and9) are to serve for different

sections of this great universe.We like or not the basic of our

philosophy in Astrology is related to Karma Siddhantam.

> In westren thoughts probably they believe in an approach which is

not deterministic but gives an opportunity for understanding what is

not possible but do not go beyond to say why it is not possible.

> I agree with you when you say:

> many western astrologers who are considered to have been quite

> effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at all and work

> with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not just one or

two

> degrees, and still produce good results

> Is it not that Astrology has also an intutional element where some

soothe sayers as pointed out by you can off hand predict any thing?

> In India Astrology is making strides with the revival towards Vedic

understanding and to find it's relevance in modern times and in

futuristic studies.

> Incidentally I believed late B.V.Raman and Shri K.N Rao as my great

Gurus bout for whose blessing I would not have ventured myself in to

these highly sensitive areas of discussions.

> Thanx

> krishnan

> rohiniranjan <rrgb@s...> wrote:

>

> Please do not be personally offended but I have a bit of problem

> with "mostly" in your statement. Couple of years ago on his

newslist,

> I had asked Mr. Rao directly about how such a conclusion (he had

also

> used a statement like "mostly" or 'universally') was derived. Given

> that there must be millions of jyotishis in India itself and the

> population growing like a family of rabbits all over the globe, how

> can one make a statement like that unless a survey was done. It is

> his greatness that he eventually responded saying that somewhere (I

> think in Delhi or Poona) a group of panchaang makers (I recall less

> than 30 but I could be remembering it wrongly) had congregated with

> some govt. officials and through their deliberations (details of

> which I would be curious to learn but have no clue where to find

> those or if those were even published or made avaiable to anyone)

had

> come to the conclusion that chitra or chaitra ayanamsha is the one

to

> be adopted. I never got the information as to how many of these

fine

> individuals were actually jyotishis, or practiced jyotish with any

> success during their lifetime.

>

> Mr. Rao himself follows and recommends Lahiri ayanamsha which is

> pretty close to chitra ayanamsha and I believe he has mentioned

that

> he got good results with the ayanamsha and that this was close to

> what his astrological guru used/recommended and also close to the

> values that Mr. Karve the psychic who can tell your time of birth

> just by looking/talking to you, produced. Mr. Karve, it seems

looked

> at you, and gave a lagna degree and the date and with lahiri

> ayanamsha this value matched. Mr. Rao's students probably use only

> Lahiri ayanamsha but I have only interacted with a few so cannot

tell

> about the ultimate preferences of all.

>

> What we can say that the vocal majority on internet probably uses

> lahiri ayanamsha. If this list is a standard reference, then the

> vocal 'majority' represents less than 1% of the participants (less

> than 26 who discuss jyotish, not counting those that ask for

readings

> only, OUT of some 2600 members). The same would be the experience

in

> other list subpopulations (less than 1% talk, express, write). So

one

> can safely assume that at least 1% or less of the astrologers

(sorry

> Jyotishis!) claim to use Lahiri ayanamsha or a similar value. This

is

> a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'!

>

> Mind you, I am not saying that Lahiri ayanamsha does not work or

does

> or that there is necessarily a better ayanamsha. In fact there are

> many western astrologers who are considered to have been quite

> effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at all and work

> with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not just one or

two

> degrees, and still produce good results!

>

> There are a lot of myths and suppositions and claims floating

around

> in the ocean of astrology about this or that being tge absolute

truth

> in the field of astrology in general and statements such as jyotish

> is good for predicting events and tropical better at describing the

> psyche, etc. As I have pointed out in some earlier written

articles,

> this is more a reflection of the person and his background who then

> went on to become an astrologer - the economist drawn to

forecasting

> the markets, the doctor focussing on astrology of the diseases, the

> spiritualist seeing the spiritual map in the horoscope, the

> psychologist focusing on the psyche as revealed through the map.

>

> The beauty is that the same little map, or maybe a few of these are

> capable of giving such a rich description of the human experience,

> the full spectrum of which has been beyond the scope of

comprehension

> of any one individual, whether astrologer, jyotishi, tarotomancer,

> scryer or some Guru yogi divine!

>

> RR

>

>

>

> , "tw853" <tw853> wrote:

> >

> > Dear amit_call,

> >

> > Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP ayanamsa is used in KP

> > analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his books. It's up to the

> > preference of an individual astrologer.

> >

> > Best regards,

> >

> > tw

> >

> > P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa with deg:min:sec is

> > advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book 2003, pp 1, 88-93)

> >

> >

> > , vattem krishnan

> > <bursar_99> wrote:

> > > Ji Amitji,

> > > In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of discussions due to

> > differences it has been agreed that scietifically prudent to use

> > Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee constituted has also

> recommended

> > for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> > > Infact to add to list I also cite the research of Shri K.N.Rao

a

> > renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> > > krishnan

> > >

> > > amit_call <amit_call> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear All,

> > > I have a confusion over Using different Ayamansas.

> > > Using different Ayamansas give different Charts.

> > > Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are different.

> > > Please guide me.

> > > Sincerely

> > > Amit

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

> > >

> > >

> > > Sponsor

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Links

> > >

> > >

> > > /

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Terms of

> > Service.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > All your favorites on one personal page – Try My

> > >

> > >

>

>

>

>

>

> ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

>

>

>

>

> Links

>

>

> /

>

>

>

>

> Terms of

Service.

>

>

>

>

>

> The all-new My – Get yours free!

>

>

 

 

 

 

 

~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

 

 

 

/

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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I hope I am understanding you correctly, that your position is that

no specific ayanamsha alone can explain all that astrology (as we

know it) explains. That there are more mysteries that lie, Horatio,

between the heaven and earth? If so, then yes that is what I was

saying all along, namely, that there are divinators that successfully

use different ayanamshas, and some that do not even use ayanamshas,

so no point in agonizing over which ayanamsha is the only accurate

one.

 

Pardon my crude and cruel analogy, but the aiming sights on a rifle

while of tremendous help in improving the marksmanship, would alone

not make one an expert marksman! Ayanamsha is like that 'sight' which

definitely is helpful if trained at the target carefully, however,

the marksman still must effectively learn to hold the rifle and

improve their skills.

 

Most practitioners (present company excepted of course!) in astrology

of any kind are at best figuring their way out of this dense forest,

even if they may not be brave enough to admit. Your sage advice to

not make ayanamsha a big deal is well-given and finds accord in my

own personal outlook. I respond only when I notice overt or covert

insinuations that a given ayanamsha is somehow the best without no

direct and ample proof for such, forthcoming.

 

Happy New Year!

 

RR

 

 

, vattem krishnan

<bursar_99> wrote:

> Hello Rohiniji,

> The Astronomical studies have confirmed ecliptical zodiac and the

movements of the planets along with planets was never found to be

unform.So we have all confusions added to the changes being witnessed

in the planet earth due unpredicatable characterstics of Nature.I do

not know whether I can put that even the science finds it difficult

to say in precise nature.May be Ayanamsa correction is a specific

approach from the fixed zodiac of Aries.Westren Astrology based on

accptable solar system too may be able to solve the riddles of human

life and anticipated events.Even we in our Astrology avoid Neptune

and Pluto,westren Astrologers attribute great significance of these

two outer planets.Still i believe that the kind of Shodasamasas we

have developed can bring out comfortably various aspects of life

including the nature of old age through the aid of divisional chart.

> Keeping these aspects in mind,probably it is appropriate till such

that we are not able to deny Ayanamsa,particularly Lahiri's Ayanamsa

as useful for our purposes but we do not discount other approaches

and certainly not their efficacy in predictions.

> Certainly Astrology,particularly Vedic Astrology to unfold the the

future and past events will always remain to be connected with

intution and if not the sixth sense.

> In this we have umpteen examples including a 10year old British who

could recollect from her class rom lessons to say the most unusual

and catsrophic events like Tsunami.

> Even Late B.V.raman makes it a point to refer to the accuracy to

Brahma as the creator of universe.

> Iam sure our distinguished members may have some more valuble

suggestions on the subject.

> Thanx

> krishnan

>

> tw853 <tw853> wrote:

>

>

>

> Dear Rohini Ranjan,

>

> I fully agree with Vattem Krishnan not to venture myself into the

> highly sensitive controversy of ayanamsa discussion. For myself I

use

> new KP ayanamsa, while simultaneously respecting the personal

> preferences of others.

>

> Best wishes,

>

> tw

>

>

> , vattem krishnan

> <bursar_99> wrote:

> > Hello Amitji,

> > For some time I had the fortune of getting associated with

Phalit

> jyotish through Rastreeya Sanskrit Vidyapeeth,New Delhi.

> > In the committee constituted by the Govt of India even late Shri

> B.V.Raman was also a member apart from several vedic scholars from

> Benares,Haridwar and other places.

> > Even in these learned institutions research on the subjectof

> Ayanamsa is being caaried out.Most of these are guided through Prof

> Kalyan Dutt Varma,who is now on the bed.Govt India and several

other

> Govts too have supported the research and even built mini jantar-

> mantars to calculate the movements of planets and study the motion

of

> earth.And these effects through research are getting published in

> Sanskrit.Infact even you can try from Tirupati university in India.

> > As far as relativity and percentage of usage of Lahiri Ayanamsa.I

> have no idea.So I go by your statstics.Incase you want to be sure

> before you infer as :

> > This is a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'

> > Let us be sincere to find the relevance of Ayanamsa in Helio

> Centric Approach mostly followe by the westren Astrologers.

> > Infact what little I have understood from Hindu Predictive

> Astrology through various approaches of Ganith jyotish,we have

three

> different lagnas for harmonising the results arising out the study

of

> natal chart in Astrology.Lagna,Surya as Lagna and mostly Moon as

also

> lagna.This approach has made us to depend on various mathematical

> calculations and the relevance of Ayanmsa as a major factor of

study

> was taken up.

> > In the case of westren Astrologers and their philosophy in

handing

> over good results without elaborate rules and the approach of vedic

> Astrology based on the tripod(1,5and9) are to serve for different

> sections of this great universe.We like or not the basic of our

> philosophy in Astrology is related to Karma Siddhantam.

> > In westren thoughts probably they believe in an approach which is

> not deterministic but gives an opportunity for understanding what

is

> not possible but do not go beyond to say why it is not possible.

> > I agree with you when you say:

> > many western astrologers who are considered to have been quite

> > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at all and

work

> > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not just one or

> two

> > degrees, and still produce good results

> > Is it not that Astrology has also an intutional element where

some

> soothe sayers as pointed out by you can off hand predict any thing?

> > In India Astrology is making strides with the revival towards

Vedic

> understanding and to find it's relevance in modern times and in

> futuristic studies.

> > Incidentally I believed late B.V.Raman and Shri K.N Rao as my

great

> Gurus bout for whose blessing I would not have ventured myself in

to

> these highly sensitive areas of discussions.

> > Thanx

> > krishnan

> > rohiniranjan <rrgb@s...> wrote:

> >

> > Please do not be personally offended but I have a bit of problem

> > with "mostly" in your statement. Couple of years ago on his

> newslist,

> > I had asked Mr. Rao directly about how such a conclusion (he had

> also

> > used a statement like "mostly" or 'universally') was derived.

Given

> > that there must be millions of jyotishis in India itself and the

> > population growing like a family of rabbits all over the globe,

how

> > can one make a statement like that unless a survey was done. It

is

> > his greatness that he eventually responded saying that somewhere

(I

> > think in Delhi or Poona) a group of panchaang makers (I recall

less

> > than 30 but I could be remembering it wrongly) had congregated

with

> > some govt. officials and through their deliberations (details of

> > which I would be curious to learn but have no clue where to find

> > those or if those were even published or made avaiable to anyone)

> had

> > come to the conclusion that chitra or chaitra ayanamsha is the

one

> to

> > be adopted. I never got the information as to how many of these

> fine

> > individuals were actually jyotishis, or practiced jyotish with

any

> > success during their lifetime.

> >

> > Mr. Rao himself follows and recommends Lahiri ayanamsha which is

> > pretty close to chitra ayanamsha and I believe he has mentioned

> that

> > he got good results with the ayanamsha and that this was close to

> > what his astrological guru used/recommended and also close to the

> > values that Mr. Karve the psychic who can tell your time of birth

> > just by looking/talking to you, produced. Mr. Karve, it seems

> looked

> > at you, and gave a lagna degree and the date and with lahiri

> > ayanamsha this value matched. Mr. Rao's students probably use

only

> > Lahiri ayanamsha but I have only interacted with a few so cannot

> tell

> > about the ultimate preferences of all.

> >

> > What we can say that the vocal majority on internet probably uses

> > lahiri ayanamsha. If this list is a standard reference, then the

> > vocal 'majority' represents less than 1% of the participants

(less

> > than 26 who discuss jyotish, not counting those that ask for

> readings

> > only, OUT of some 2600 members). The same would be the experience

> in

> > other list subpopulations (less than 1% talk, express, write). So

> one

> > can safely assume that at least 1% or less of the astrologers

> (sorry

> > Jyotishis!) claim to use Lahiri ayanamsha or a similar value.

This

> is

> > a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'!

> >

> > Mind you, I am not saying that Lahiri ayanamsha does not work or

> does

> > or that there is necessarily a better ayanamsha. In fact there

are

> > many western astrologers who are considered to have been quite

> > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at all and

work

> > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not just one or

> two

> > degrees, and still produce good results!

> >

> > There are a lot of myths and suppositions and claims floating

> around

> > in the ocean of astrology about this or that being tge absolute

> truth

> > in the field of astrology in general and statements such as

jyotish

> > is good for predicting events and tropical better at describing

the

> > psyche, etc. As I have pointed out in some earlier written

> articles,

> > this is more a reflection of the person and his background who

then

> > went on to become an astrologer - the economist drawn to

> forecasting

> > the markets, the doctor focussing on astrology of the diseases,

the

> > spiritualist seeing the spiritual map in the horoscope, the

> > psychologist focusing on the psyche as revealed through the map.

> >

> > The beauty is that the same little map, or maybe a few of these

are

> > capable of giving such a rich description of the human

experience,

> > the full spectrum of which has been beyond the scope of

> comprehension

> > of any one individual, whether astrologer, jyotishi,

tarotomancer,

> > scryer or some Guru yogi divine!

> >

> > RR

> >

> >

> >

> > , "tw853" <tw853>

wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear amit_call,

> > >

> > > Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP ayanamsa is used in KP

> > > analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his books. It's up to

the

> > > preference of an individual astrologer.

> > >

> > > Best regards,

> > >

> > > tw

> > >

> > > P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa with deg:min:sec

is

> > > advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book 2003, pp 1, 88-93)

> > >

> > >

> > > , vattem krishnan

> > > <bursar_99> wrote:

> > > > Ji Amitji,

> > > > In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of discussions due

to

> > > differences it has been agreed that scietifically prudent to

use

> > > Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee constituted has also

> > recommended

> > > for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> > > > Infact to add to list I also cite the research of Shri

K.N.Rao

> a

> > > renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> > > > krishnan

> > > >

> > > > amit_call <amit_call> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear All,

> > > > I have a confusion over Using different Ayamansas.

> > > > Using different Ayamansas give different Charts.

> > > > Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are different.

> > > > Please guide me.

> > > > Sincerely

> > > > Amit

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Sponsor

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Links

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > /

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Terms

of

> > > Service.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > All your favorites on one personal page – Try My

> > > >

> > > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Links

> >

> >

> > /

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Terms of

> Service.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > The all-new My – Get yours free!

> >

> >

>

>

>

>

>

> ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

>

>

>

>

> Links

>

>

> /

>

>

>

>

> Terms of

Service.

>

>

>

>

>

> Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage less.

>

>

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Share on other sites

I hope one can use what WORKS for him as INDIVIDUAL astrologer, while

simultaneously respecting the personal preferences of others.

 

Best regards,

 

tw

 

, "rohiniranjan" <rrgb@s...>

wrote:

>

> I hope I am understanding you correctly, that your position is that

> no specific ayanamsha alone can explain all that astrology (as we

> know it) explains. That there are more mysteries that lie, Horatio,

> between the heaven and earth? If so, then yes that is what I was

> saying all along, namely, that there are divinators that

successfully

> use different ayanamshas, and some that do not even use ayanamshas,

> so no point in agonizing over which ayanamsha is the only accurate

> one.

>

> Pardon my crude and cruel analogy, but the aiming sights on a rifle

> while of tremendous help in improving the marksmanship, would alone

> not make one an expert marksman! Ayanamsha is like that 'sight'

which

> definitely is helpful if trained at the target carefully, however,

> the marksman still must effectively learn to hold the rifle and

> improve their skills.

>

> Most practitioners (present company excepted of course!) in

astrology

> of any kind are at best figuring their way out of this dense

forest,

> even if they may not be brave enough to admit. Your sage advice to

> not make ayanamsha a big deal is well-given and finds accord in my

> own personal outlook. I respond only when I notice overt or covert

> insinuations that a given ayanamsha is somehow the best without no

> direct and ample proof for such, forthcoming.

>

> Happy New Year!

>

> RR

>

>

> , vattem krishnan

> <bursar_99> wrote:

> > Hello Rohiniji,

> > The Astronomical studies have confirmed ecliptical zodiac and the

> movements of the planets along with planets was never found to be

> unform.So we have all confusions added to the changes being

witnessed

> in the planet earth due unpredicatable characterstics of Nature.I

do

> not know whether I can put that even the science finds it difficult

> to say in precise nature.May be Ayanamsa correction is a specific

> approach from the fixed zodiac of Aries.Westren Astrology based on

> accptable solar system too may be able to solve the riddles of

human

> life and anticipated events.Even we in our Astrology avoid Neptune

> and Pluto,westren Astrologers attribute great significance of these

> two outer planets.Still i believe that the kind of Shodasamasas we

> have developed can bring out comfortably various aspects of life

> including the nature of old age through the aid of divisional chart.

> > Keeping these aspects in mind,probably it is appropriate till

such

> that we are not able to deny Ayanamsa,particularly Lahiri's

Ayanamsa

> as useful for our purposes but we do not discount other approaches

> and certainly not their efficacy in predictions.

> > Certainly Astrology,particularly Vedic Astrology to unfold the

the

> future and past events will always remain to be connected with

> intution and if not the sixth sense.

> > In this we have umpteen examples including a 10year old British

who

> could recollect from her class rom lessons to say the most unusual

> and catsrophic events like Tsunami.

> > Even Late B.V.raman makes it a point to refer to the accuracy to

> Brahma as the creator of universe.

> > Iam sure our distinguished members may have some more valuble

> suggestions on the subject.

> > Thanx

> > krishnan

> >

> > tw853 <tw853> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> >

> > I fully agree with Vattem Krishnan not to venture myself into the

> > highly sensitive controversy of ayanamsa discussion. For myself I

> use

> > new KP ayanamsa, while simultaneously respecting the personal

> > preferences of others.

> >

> > Best wishes,

> >

> > tw

> >

> >

> > , vattem krishnan

> > <bursar_99> wrote:

> > > Hello Amitji,

> > > For some time I had the fortune of getting associated with

> Phalit

> > jyotish through Rastreeya Sanskrit Vidyapeeth,New Delhi.

> > > In the committee constituted by the Govt of India even late

Shri

> > B.V.Raman was also a member apart from several vedic scholars

from

> > Benares,Haridwar and other places.

> > > Even in these learned institutions research on the subjectof

> > Ayanamsa is being caaried out.Most of these are guided through

Prof

> > Kalyan Dutt Varma,who is now on the bed.Govt India and several

> other

> > Govts too have supported the research and even built mini jantar-

> > mantars to calculate the movements of planets and study the

motion

> of

> > earth.And these effects through research are getting published in

> > Sanskrit.Infact even you can try from Tirupati university in

India.

> > > As far as relativity and percentage of usage of Lahiri

Ayanamsa.I

> > have no idea.So I go by your statstics.Incase you want to be sure

> > before you infer as :

> > > This is a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'

> > > Let us be sincere to find the relevance of Ayanamsa in Helio

> > Centric Approach mostly followe by the westren Astrologers.

> > > Infact what little I have understood from Hindu Predictive

> > Astrology through various approaches of Ganith jyotish,we have

> three

> > different lagnas for harmonising the results arising out the

study

> of

> > natal chart in Astrology.Lagna,Surya as Lagna and mostly Moon as

> also

> > lagna.This approach has made us to depend on various mathematical

> > calculations and the relevance of Ayanmsa as a major factor of

> study

> > was taken up.

> > > In the case of westren Astrologers and their philosophy in

> handing

> > over good results without elaborate rules and the approach of

vedic

> > Astrology based on the tripod(1,5and9) are to serve for different

> > sections of this great universe.We like or not the basic of our

> > philosophy in Astrology is related to Karma Siddhantam.

> > > In westren thoughts probably they believe in an approach which

is

> > not deterministic but gives an opportunity for understanding what

> is

> > not possible but do not go beyond to say why it is not possible.

> > > I agree with you when you say:

> > > many western astrologers who are considered to have been quite

> > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at all and

> work

> > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not just one

or

> > two

> > > degrees, and still produce good results

> > > Is it not that Astrology has also an intutional element where

> some

> > soothe sayers as pointed out by you can off hand predict any

thing?

> > > In India Astrology is making strides with the revival towards

> Vedic

> > understanding and to find it's relevance in modern times and in

> > futuristic studies.

> > > Incidentally I believed late B.V.Raman and Shri K.N Rao as my

> great

> > Gurus bout for whose blessing I would not have ventured myself in

> to

> > these highly sensitive areas of discussions.

> > > Thanx

> > > krishnan

> > > rohiniranjan <rrgb@s...> wrote:

> > >

> > > Please do not be personally offended but I have a bit of

problem

> > > with "mostly" in your statement. Couple of years ago on his

> > newslist,

> > > I had asked Mr. Rao directly about how such a conclusion (he

had

> > also

> > > used a statement like "mostly" or 'universally') was derived.

> Given

> > > that there must be millions of jyotishis in India itself and

the

> > > population growing like a family of rabbits all over the globe,

> how

> > > can one make a statement like that unless a survey was done. It

> is

> > > his greatness that he eventually responded saying that

somewhere

> (I

> > > think in Delhi or Poona) a group of panchaang makers (I recall

> less

> > > than 30 but I could be remembering it wrongly) had congregated

> with

> > > some govt. officials and through their deliberations (details

of

> > > which I would be curious to learn but have no clue where to

find

> > > those or if those were even published or made avaiable to

anyone)

> > had

> > > come to the conclusion that chitra or chaitra ayanamsha is the

> one

> > to

> > > be adopted. I never got the information as to how many of these

> > fine

> > > individuals were actually jyotishis, or practiced jyotish with

> any

> > > success during their lifetime.

> > >

> > > Mr. Rao himself follows and recommends Lahiri ayanamsha which

is

> > > pretty close to chitra ayanamsha and I believe he has mentioned

> > that

> > > he got good results with the ayanamsha and that this was close

to

> > > what his astrological guru used/recommended and also close to

the

> > > values that Mr. Karve the psychic who can tell your time of

birth

> > > just by looking/talking to you, produced. Mr. Karve, it seems

> > looked

> > > at you, and gave a lagna degree and the date and with lahiri

> > > ayanamsha this value matched. Mr. Rao's students probably use

> only

> > > Lahiri ayanamsha but I have only interacted with a few so

cannot

> > tell

> > > about the ultimate preferences of all.

> > >

> > > What we can say that the vocal majority on internet probably

uses

> > > lahiri ayanamsha. If this list is a standard reference, then

the

> > > vocal 'majority' represents less than 1% of the participants

> (less

> > > than 26 who discuss jyotish, not counting those that ask for

> > readings

> > > only, OUT of some 2600 members). The same would be the

experience

> > in

> > > other list subpopulations (less than 1% talk, express, write).

So

> > one

> > > can safely assume that at least 1% or less of the astrologers

> > (sorry

> > > Jyotishis!) claim to use Lahiri ayanamsha or a similar value.

> This

> > is

> > > a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'!

> > >

> > > Mind you, I am not saying that Lahiri ayanamsha does not work

or

> > does

> > > or that there is necessarily a better ayanamsha. In fact there

> are

> > > many western astrologers who are considered to have been quite

> > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at all and

> work

> > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not just one

or

> > two

> > > degrees, and still produce good results!

> > >

> > > There are a lot of myths and suppositions and claims floating

> > around

> > > in the ocean of astrology about this or that being tge absolute

> > truth

> > > in the field of astrology in general and statements such as

> jyotish

> > > is good for predicting events and tropical better at describing

> the

> > > psyche, etc. As I have pointed out in some earlier written

> > articles,

> > > this is more a reflection of the person and his background who

> then

> > > went on to become an astrologer - the economist drawn to

> > forecasting

> > > the markets, the doctor focussing on astrology of the diseases,

> the

> > > spiritualist seeing the spiritual map in the horoscope, the

> > > psychologist focusing on the psyche as revealed through the map.

> > >

> > > The beauty is that the same little map, or maybe a few of these

> are

> > > capable of giving such a rich description of the human

> experience,

> > > the full spectrum of which has been beyond the scope of

> > comprehension

> > > of any one individual, whether astrologer, jyotishi,

> tarotomancer,

> > > scryer or some Guru yogi divine!

> > >

> > > RR

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > , "tw853" <tw853>

> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear amit_call,

> > > >

> > > > Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP ayanamsa is used in KP

> > > > analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his books. It's up to

> the

> > > > preference of an individual astrologer.

> > > >

> > > > Best regards,

> > > >

> > > > tw

> > > >

> > > > P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa with

deg:min:sec

> is

> > > > advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book 2003, pp 1, 88-93)

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > , vattem krishnan

> > > > <bursar_99> wrote:

> > > > > Ji Amitji,

> > > > > In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of discussions due

> to

> > > > differences it has been agreed that scietifically prudent to

> use

> > > > Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee constituted has also

> > > recommended

> > > > for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> > > > > Infact to add to list I also cite the research of Shri

> K.N.Rao

> > a

> > > > renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> > > > > krishnan

> > > > >

> > > > > amit_call <amit_call> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > I have a confusion over Using different Ayamansas.

> > > > > Using different Ayamansas give different Charts.

> > > > > Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are different.

> > > > > Please guide me.

> > > > > Sincerely

> > > > > Amit

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Sponsor

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Links

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > /

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Terms

> of

> > > > Service.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > All your favorites on one personal page – Try My

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Links

> > >

> > >

> > > /

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Terms of

> > Service.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > The all-new My – Get yours free!

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Links

> >

> >

> > /

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Terms of

> Service.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage less.

> >

> >

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Yes -- that is my view too, fwiw.

 

rr

 

, "tw853" <tw853> wrote:

>

> I hope one can use what WORKS for him as INDIVIDUAL astrologer,

while

> simultaneously respecting the personal preferences of others.

>

> Best regards,

>

> tw

>

> , "rohiniranjan" <rrgb@s...>

> wrote:

> >

> > I hope I am understanding you correctly, that your position is

that

> > no specific ayanamsha alone can explain all that astrology (as we

> > know it) explains. That there are more mysteries that lie,

Horatio,

> > between the heaven and earth? If so, then yes that is what I was

> > saying all along, namely, that there are divinators that

> successfully

> > use different ayanamshas, and some that do not even use

ayanamshas,

> > so no point in agonizing over which ayanamsha is the only

accurate

> > one.

> >

> > Pardon my crude and cruel analogy, but the aiming sights on a

rifle

> > while of tremendous help in improving the marksmanship, would

alone

> > not make one an expert marksman! Ayanamsha is like that 'sight'

> which

> > definitely is helpful if trained at the target carefully,

however,

> > the marksman still must effectively learn to hold the rifle and

> > improve their skills.

> >

> > Most practitioners (present company excepted of course!) in

> astrology

> > of any kind are at best figuring their way out of this dense

> forest,

> > even if they may not be brave enough to admit. Your sage advice

to

> > not make ayanamsha a big deal is well-given and finds accord in

my

> > own personal outlook. I respond only when I notice overt or

covert

> > insinuations that a given ayanamsha is somehow the best without

no

> > direct and ample proof for such, forthcoming.

> >

> > Happy New Year!

> >

> > RR

> >

> >

> > , vattem krishnan

> > <bursar_99> wrote:

> > > Hello Rohiniji,

> > > The Astronomical studies have confirmed ecliptical zodiac and

the

> > movements of the planets along with planets was never found to be

> > unform.So we have all confusions added to the changes being

> witnessed

> > in the planet earth due unpredicatable characterstics of

Nature.I

> do

> > not know whether I can put that even the science finds it

difficult

> > to say in precise nature.May be Ayanamsa correction is a specific

> > approach from the fixed zodiac of Aries.Westren Astrology based

on

> > accptable solar system too may be able to solve the riddles of

> human

> > life and anticipated events.Even we in our Astrology avoid

Neptune

> > and Pluto,westren Astrologers attribute great significance of

these

> > two outer planets.Still i believe that the kind of Shodasamasas

we

> > have developed can bring out comfortably various aspects of life

> > including the nature of old age through the aid of divisional

chart.

> > > Keeping these aspects in mind,probably it is appropriate till

> such

> > that we are not able to deny Ayanamsa,particularly Lahiri's

> Ayanamsa

> > as useful for our purposes but we do not discount other

approaches

> > and certainly not their efficacy in predictions.

> > > Certainly Astrology,particularly Vedic Astrology to unfold the

> the

> > future and past events will always remain to be connected with

> > intution and if not the sixth sense.

> > > In this we have umpteen examples including a 10year old British

> who

> > could recollect from her class rom lessons to say the most

unusual

> > and catsrophic events like Tsunami.

> > > Even Late B.V.raman makes it a point to refer to the accuracy

to

> > Brahma as the creator of universe.

> > > Iam sure our distinguished members may have some more valuble

> > suggestions on the subject.

> > > Thanx

> > > krishnan

> > >

> > > tw853 <tw853> wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > >

> > > I fully agree with Vattem Krishnan not to venture myself into

the

> > > highly sensitive controversy of ayanamsa discussion. For myself

I

> > use

> > > new KP ayanamsa, while simultaneously respecting the personal

> > > preferences of others.

> > >

> > > Best wishes,

> > >

> > > tw

> > >

> > >

> > > , vattem krishnan

> > > <bursar_99> wrote:

> > > > Hello Amitji,

> > > > For some time I had the fortune of getting associated with

> > Phalit

> > > jyotish through Rastreeya Sanskrit Vidyapeeth,New Delhi.

> > > > In the committee constituted by the Govt of India even late

> Shri

> > > B.V.Raman was also a member apart from several vedic scholars

> from

> > > Benares,Haridwar and other places.

> > > > Even in these learned institutions research on the subjectof

> > > Ayanamsa is being caaried out.Most of these are guided through

> Prof

> > > Kalyan Dutt Varma,who is now on the bed.Govt India and several

> > other

> > > Govts too have supported the research and even built mini

jantar-

> > > mantars to calculate the movements of planets and study the

> motion

> > of

> > > earth.And these effects through research are getting published

in

> > > Sanskrit.Infact even you can try from Tirupati university in

> India.

> > > > As far as relativity and percentage of usage of Lahiri

> Ayanamsa.I

> > > have no idea.So I go by your statstics.Incase you want to be

sure

> > > before you infer as :

> > > > This is a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'

> > > > Let us be sincere to find the relevance of Ayanamsa in Helio

> > > Centric Approach mostly followe by the westren Astrologers.

> > > > Infact what little I have understood from Hindu Predictive

> > > Astrology through various approaches of Ganith jyotish,we have

> > three

> > > different lagnas for harmonising the results arising out the

> study

> > of

> > > natal chart in Astrology.Lagna,Surya as Lagna and mostly Moon

as

> > also

> > > lagna.This approach has made us to depend on various

mathematical

> > > calculations and the relevance of Ayanmsa as a major factor of

> > study

> > > was taken up.

> > > > In the case of westren Astrologers and their philosophy in

> > handing

> > > over good results without elaborate rules and the approach of

> vedic

> > > Astrology based on the tripod(1,5and9) are to serve for

different

> > > sections of this great universe.We like or not the basic of our

> > > philosophy in Astrology is related to Karma Siddhantam.

> > > > In westren thoughts probably they believe in an approach

which

> is

> > > not deterministic but gives an opportunity for understanding

what

> > is

> > > not possible but do not go beyond to say why it is not possible.

> > > > I agree with you when you say:

> > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have been

quite

> > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at all and

> > work

> > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not just one

> or

> > > two

> > > > degrees, and still produce good results

> > > > Is it not that Astrology has also an intutional element where

> > some

> > > soothe sayers as pointed out by you can off hand predict any

> thing?

> > > > In India Astrology is making strides with the revival towards

> > Vedic

> > > understanding and to find it's relevance in modern times and in

> > > futuristic studies.

> > > > Incidentally I believed late B.V.Raman and Shri K.N Rao as my

> > great

> > > Gurus bout for whose blessing I would not have ventured myself

in

> > to

> > > these highly sensitive areas of discussions.

> > > > Thanx

> > > > krishnan

> > > > rohiniranjan <rrgb@s...> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Please do not be personally offended but I have a bit of

> problem

> > > > with "mostly" in your statement. Couple of years ago on his

> > > newslist,

> > > > I had asked Mr. Rao directly about how such a conclusion (he

> had

> > > also

> > > > used a statement like "mostly" or 'universally') was derived.

> > Given

> > > > that there must be millions of jyotishis in India itself and

> the

> > > > population growing like a family of rabbits all over the

globe,

> > how

> > > > can one make a statement like that unless a survey was done.

It

> > is

> > > > his greatness that he eventually responded saying that

> somewhere

> > (I

> > > > think in Delhi or Poona) a group of panchaang makers (I

recall

> > less

> > > > than 30 but I could be remembering it wrongly) had

congregated

> > with

> > > > some govt. officials and through their deliberations (details

> of

> > > > which I would be curious to learn but have no clue where to

> find

> > > > those or if those were even published or made avaiable to

> anyone)

> > > had

> > > > come to the conclusion that chitra or chaitra ayanamsha is

the

> > one

> > > to

> > > > be adopted. I never got the information as to how many of

these

> > > fine

> > > > individuals were actually jyotishis, or practiced jyotish

with

> > any

> > > > success during their lifetime.

> > > >

> > > > Mr. Rao himself follows and recommends Lahiri ayanamsha which

> is

> > > > pretty close to chitra ayanamsha and I believe he has

mentioned

> > > that

> > > > he got good results with the ayanamsha and that this was

close

> to

> > > > what his astrological guru used/recommended and also close to

> the

> > > > values that Mr. Karve the psychic who can tell your time of

> birth

> > > > just by looking/talking to you, produced. Mr. Karve, it seems

> > > looked

> > > > at you, and gave a lagna degree and the date and with lahiri

> > > > ayanamsha this value matched. Mr. Rao's students probably use

> > only

> > > > Lahiri ayanamsha but I have only interacted with a few so

> cannot

> > > tell

> > > > about the ultimate preferences of all.

> > > >

> > > > What we can say that the vocal majority on internet probably

> uses

> > > > lahiri ayanamsha. If this list is a standard reference, then

> the

> > > > vocal 'majority' represents less than 1% of the participants

> > (less

> > > > than 26 who discuss jyotish, not counting those that ask for

> > > readings

> > > > only, OUT of some 2600 members). The same would be the

> experience

> > > in

> > > > other list subpopulations (less than 1% talk, express,

write).

> So

> > > one

> > > > can safely assume that at least 1% or less of the astrologers

> > > (sorry

> > > > Jyotishis!) claim to use Lahiri ayanamsha or a similar value.

> > This

> > > is

> > > > a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'!

> > > >

> > > > Mind you, I am not saying that Lahiri ayanamsha does not work

> or

> > > does

> > > > or that there is necessarily a better ayanamsha. In fact

there

> > are

> > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have been

quite

> > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at all and

> > work

> > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not just one

> or

> > > two

> > > > degrees, and still produce good results!

> > > >

> > > > There are a lot of myths and suppositions and claims floating

> > > around

> > > > in the ocean of astrology about this or that being tge

absolute

> > > truth

> > > > in the field of astrology in general and statements such as

> > jyotish

> > > > is good for predicting events and tropical better at

describing

> > the

> > > > psyche, etc. As I have pointed out in some earlier written

> > > articles,

> > > > this is more a reflection of the person and his background

who

> > then

> > > > went on to become an astrologer - the economist drawn to

> > > forecasting

> > > > the markets, the doctor focussing on astrology of the

diseases,

> > the

> > > > spiritualist seeing the spiritual map in the horoscope, the

> > > > psychologist focusing on the psyche as revealed through the

map.

> > > >

> > > > The beauty is that the same little map, or maybe a few of

these

> > are

> > > > capable of giving such a rich description of the human

> > experience,

> > > > the full spectrum of which has been beyond the scope of

> > > comprehension

> > > > of any one individual, whether astrologer, jyotishi,

> > tarotomancer,

> > > > scryer or some Guru yogi divine!

> > > >

> > > > RR

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > , "tw853" <tw853>

> > wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear amit_call,

> > > > >

> > > > > Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP ayanamsa is used in

KP

> > > > > analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his books. It's up

to

> > the

> > > > > preference of an individual astrologer.

> > > > >

> > > > > Best regards,

> > > > >

> > > > > tw

> > > > >

> > > > > P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa with

> deg:min:sec

> > is

> > > > > advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book 2003, pp 1, 88-

93)

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > , vattem krishnan

> > > > > <bursar_99> wrote:

> > > > > > Ji Amitji,

> > > > > > In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of discussions

due

> > to

> > > > > differences it has been agreed that scietifically prudent

to

> > use

> > > > > Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee constituted has also

> > > > recommended

> > > > > for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> > > > > > Infact to add to list I also cite the research of Shri

> > K.N.Rao

> > > a

> > > > > renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > >

> > > > > > amit_call <amit_call> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > > I have a confusion over Using different Ayamansas.

> > > > > > Using different Ayamansas give different Charts.

> > > > > > Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are different.

> > > > > > Please guide me.

> > > > > > Sincerely

> > > > > > Amit

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sponsor

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Links

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > /

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

Terms

> > of

> > > > > Service.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

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> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > All your favorites on one personal page – Try My

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Links

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > /

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Terms

of

> > > Service.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

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Sorry for the delay in response. But you're right. It is the man behind the

weapon who counts. The weapon is just a piece of metal, wood and other

ingredients of which it is composed.

The difference between innimate and animate needs to be understood very clearly.

Best wishes for a happy and prosperous new year.

Amitabh Shastri

rohiniranjan <rrgb wrote:

 

 

Yes -- that is my view too, fwiw.

 

rr

 

, "tw853" wrote:

>

> I hope one can use what WORKS for him as INDIVIDUAL astrologer,

while

> simultaneously respecting the personal preferences of others.

>

> Best regards,

>

> tw

>

> , "rohiniranjan"

> wrote:

> >

> > I hope I am understanding you correctly, that your position is

that

> > no specific ayanamsha alone can explain all that astrology (as we

> > know it) explains. That there are more mysteries that lie,

Horatio,

> > between the heaven and earth? If so, then yes that is what I was

> > saying all along, namely, that there are divinators that

> successfully

> > use different ayanamshas, and some that do not even use

ayanamshas,

> > so no point in agonizing over which ayanamsha is the only

accurate

> > one.

> >

> > Pardon my crude and cruel analogy, but the aiming sights on a

rifle

> > while of tremendous help in improving the marksmanship, would

alone

> > not make one an expert marksman! Ayanamsha is like that 'sight'

> which

> > definitely is helpful if trained at the target carefully,

however,

> > the marksman still must effectively learn to hold the rifle and

> > improve their skills.

> >

> > Most practitioners (present company excepted of course!) in

> astrology

> > of any kind are at best figuring their way out of this dense

> forest,

> > even if they may not be brave enough to admit. Your sage advice

to

> > not make ayanamsha a big deal is well-given and finds accord in

my

> > own personal outlook. I respond only when I notice overt or

covert

> > insinuations that a given ayanamsha is somehow the best without

no

> > direct and ample proof for such, forthcoming.

> >

> > Happy New Year!

> >

> > RR

> >

> >

> > , vattem krishnan

> > wrote:

> > > Hello Rohiniji,

> > > The Astronomical studies have confirmed ecliptical zodiac and

the

> > movements of the planets along with planets was never found to be

> > unform.So we have all confusions added to the changes being

> witnessed

> > in the planet earth due unpredicatable characterstics of

Nature.I

> do

> > not know whether I can put that even the science finds it

difficult

> > to say in precise nature.May be Ayanamsa correction is a specific

> > approach from the fixed zodiac of Aries.Westren Astrology based

on

> > accptable solar system too may be able to solve the riddles of

> human

> > life and anticipated events.Even we in our Astrology avoid

Neptune

> > and Pluto,westren Astrologers attribute great significance of

these

> > two outer planets.Still i believe that the kind of Shodasamasas

we

> > have developed can bring out comfortably various aspects of life

> > including the nature of old age through the aid of divisional

chart.

> > > Keeping these aspects in mind,probably it is appropriate till

> such

> > that we are not able to deny Ayanamsa,particularly Lahiri's

> Ayanamsa

> > as useful for our purposes but we do not discount other

approaches

> > and certainly not their efficacy in predictions.

> > > Certainly Astrology,particularly Vedic Astrology to unfold the

> the

> > future and past events will always remain to be connected with

> > intution and if not the sixth sense.

> > > In this we have umpteen examples including a 10year old British

> who

> > could recollect from her class rom lessons to say the most

unusual

> > and catsrophic events like Tsunami.

> > > Even Late B.V.raman makes it a point to refer to the accuracy

to

> > Brahma as the creator of universe.

> > > Iam sure our distinguished members may have some more valuble

> > suggestions on the subject.

> > > Thanx

> > > krishnan

> > >

> > > tw853 wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > >

> > > I fully agree with Vattem Krishnan not to venture myself into

the

> > > highly sensitive controversy of ayanamsa discussion. For myself

I

> > use

> > > new KP ayanamsa, while simultaneously respecting the personal

> > > preferences of others.

> > >

> > > Best wishes,

> > >

> > > tw

> > >

> > >

> > > , vattem krishnan

> > > wrote:

> > > > Hello Amitji,

> > > > For some time I had the fortune of getting associated with

> > Phalit

> > > jyotish through Rastreeya Sanskrit Vidyapeeth,New Delhi.

> > > > In the committee constituted by the Govt of India even late

> Shri

> > > B.V.Raman was also a member apart from several vedic scholars

> from

> > > Benares,Haridwar and other places.

> > > > Even in these learned institutions research on the subjectof

> > > Ayanamsa is being caaried out.Most of these are guided through

> Prof

> > > Kalyan Dutt Varma,who is now on the bed.Govt India and several

> > other

> > > Govts too have supported the research and even built mini

jantar-

> > > mantars to calculate the movements of planets and study the

> motion

> > of

> > > earth.And these effects through research are getting published

in

> > > Sanskrit.Infact even you can try from Tirupati university in

> India.

> > > > As far as relativity and percentage of usage of Lahiri

> Ayanamsa.I

> > > have no idea.So I go by your statstics.Incase you want to be

sure

> > > before you infer as :

> > > > This is a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'

> > > > Let us be sincere to find the relevance of Ayanamsa in Helio

> > > Centric Approach mostly followe by the westren Astrologers.

> > > > Infact what little I have understood from Hindu Predictive

> > > Astrology through various approaches of Ganith jyotish,we have

> > three

> > > different lagnas for harmonising the results arising out the

> study

> > of

> > > natal chart in Astrology.Lagna,Surya as Lagna and mostly Moon

as

> > also

> > > lagna.This approach has made us to depend on various

mathematical

> > > calculations and the relevance of Ayanmsa as a major factor of

> > study

> > > was taken up.

> > > > In the case of westren Astrologers and their philosophy in

> > handing

> > > over good results without elaborate rules and the approach of

> vedic

> > > Astrology based on the tripod(1,5and9) are to serve for

different

> > > sections of this great universe.We like or not the basic of our

> > > philosophy in Astrology is related to Karma Siddhantam.

> > > > In westren thoughts probably they believe in an approach

which

> is

> > > not deterministic but gives an opportunity for understanding

what

> > is

> > > not possible but do not go beyond to say why it is not possible.

> > > > I agree with you when you say:

> > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have been

quite

> > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at all and

> > work

> > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not just one

> or

> > > two

> > > > degrees, and still produce good results

> > > > Is it not that Astrology has also an intutional element where

> > some

> > > soothe sayers as pointed out by you can off hand predict any

> thing?

> > > > In India Astrology is making strides with the revival towards

> > Vedic

> > > understanding and to find it's relevance in modern times and in

> > > futuristic studies.

> > > > Incidentally I believed late B.V.Raman and Shri K.N Rao as my

> > great

> > > Gurus bout for whose blessing I would not have ventured myself

in

> > to

> > > these highly sensitive areas of discussions.

> > > > Thanx

> > > > krishnan

> > > > rohiniranjan wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Please do not be personally offended but I have a bit of

> problem

> > > > with "mostly" in your statement. Couple of years ago on his

> > > newslist,

> > > > I had asked Mr. Rao directly about how such a conclusion (he

> had

> > > also

> > > > used a statement like "mostly" or 'universally') was derived.

> > Given

> > > > that there must be millions of jyotishis in India itself and

> the

> > > > population growing like a family of rabbits all over the

globe,

> > how

> > > > can one make a statement like that unless a survey was done.

It

> > is

> > > > his greatness that he eventually responded saying that

> somewhere

> > (I

> > > > think in Delhi or Poona) a group of panchaang makers (I

recall

> > less

> > > > than 30 but I could be remembering it wrongly) had

congregated

> > with

> > > > some govt. officials and through their deliberations (details

> of

> > > > which I would be curious to learn but have no clue where to

> find

> > > > those or if those were even published or made avaiable to

> anyone)

> > > had

> > > > come to the conclusion that chitra or chaitra ayanamsha is

the

> > one

> > > to

> > > > be adopted. I never got the information as to how many of

these

> > > fine

> > > > individuals were actually jyotishis, or practiced jyotish

with

> > any

> > > > success during their lifetime.

> > > >

> > > > Mr. Rao himself follows and recommends Lahiri ayanamsha which

> is

> > > > pretty close to chitra ayanamsha and I believe he has

mentioned

> > > that

> > > > he got good results with the ayanamsha and that this was

close

> to

> > > > what his astrological guru used/recommended and also close to

> the

> > > > values that Mr. Karve the psychic who can tell your time of

> birth

> > > > just by looking/talking to you, produced. Mr. Karve, it seems

> > > looked

> > > > at you, and gave a lagna degree and the date and with lahiri

> > > > ayanamsha this value matched. Mr. Rao's students probably use

> > only

> > > > Lahiri ayanamsha but I have only interacted with a few so

> cannot

> > > tell

> > > > about the ultimate preferences of all.

> > > >

> > > > What we can say that the vocal majority on internet probably

> uses

> > > > lahiri ayanamsha. If this list is a standard reference, then

> the

> > > > vocal 'majority' represents less than 1% of the participants

> > (less

> > > > than 26 who discuss jyotish, not counting those that ask for

> > > readings

> > > > only, OUT of some 2600 members). The same would be the

> experience

> > > in

> > > > other list subpopulations (less than 1% talk, express,

write).

> So

> > > one

> > > > can safely assume that at least 1% or less of the astrologers

> > > (sorry

> > > > Jyotishis!) claim to use Lahiri ayanamsha or a similar value.

> > This

> > > is

> > > > a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'!

> > > >

> > > > Mind you, I am not saying that Lahiri ayanamsha does not work

> or

> > > does

> > > > or that there is necessarily a better ayanamsha. In fact

there

> > are

> > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have been

quite

> > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at all and

> > work

> > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not just one

> or

> > > two

> > > > degrees, and still produce good results!

> > > >

> > > > There are a lot of myths and suppositions and claims floating

> > > around

> > > > in the ocean of astrology about this or that being tge

absolute

> > > truth

> > > > in the field of astrology in general and statements such as

> > jyotish

> > > > is good for predicting events and tropical better at

describing

> > the

> > > > psyche, etc. As I have pointed out in some earlier written

> > > articles,

> > > > this is more a reflection of the person and his background

who

> > then

> > > > went on to become an astrologer - the economist drawn to

> > > forecasting

> > > > the markets, the doctor focussing on astrology of the

diseases,

> > the

> > > > spiritualist seeing the spiritual map in the horoscope, the

> > > > psychologist focusing on the psyche as revealed through the

map.

> > > >

> > > > The beauty is that the same little map, or maybe a few of

these

> > are

> > > > capable of giving such a rich description of the human

> > experience,

> > > > the full spectrum of which has been beyond the scope of

> > > comprehension

> > > > of any one individual, whether astrologer, jyotishi,

> > tarotomancer,

> > > > scryer or some Guru yogi divine!

> > > >

> > > > RR

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > , "tw853"

> > wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear amit_call,

> > > > >

> > > > > Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP ayanamsa is used in

KP

> > > > > analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his books. It's up

to

> > the

> > > > > preference of an individual astrologer.

> > > > >

> > > > > Best regards,

> > > > >

> > > > > tw

> > > > >

> > > > > P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa with

> deg:min:sec

> > is

> > > > > advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book 2003, pp 1, 88-

93)

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > , vattem krishnan

> > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > Ji Amitji,

> > > > > > In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of discussions

due

> > to

> > > > > differences it has been agreed that scietifically prudent

to

> > use

> > > > > Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee constituted has also

> > > > recommended

> > > > > for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> > > > > > Infact to add to list I also cite the research of Shri

> > K.N.Rao

> > > a

> > > > > renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > >

> > > > > > amit_call wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > > I have a confusion over Using different Ayamansas.

> > > > > > Using different Ayamansas give different Charts.

> > > > > > Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are different.

> > > > > > Please guide me.

> > > > > > Sincerely

> > > > > > Amit

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

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> > > > > >

> > > > > >

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Dear All,

I thank all the members for postings and throwing light on this

Ayamansa confusion.

This is accepted that Pridiction is one's own ability.

Also in a magazine of astrology i read a sloka which says "In

Kaliyuga only a few will be true astrologers and the best ones'

pridictive power will only manifest to 25%"

I do not remember the exact sloka but the meaning was same.

Also i want to add that some time back i met a Nadi Reader.

in Nadi i was amazed to see that they told my name,my parents

name ,some educational background,present condition and a little more.

also as per Nadi he made a chart and gave to me.

This chart is same as i get using Lahiri and KP Ayamansa.

Also one of my friend got a chance to meet a sidhha Purush in

Bulandshahar(U.P.).He is a young sanyasi.Looking at face he said

something about him..his problems and told that he was having Kaal

Sarpa Dosha.

I was very new to astrology at that time.I started reading abt KSD

and found that there was really KSD in his chart.

Now i see this chart is as per Lahiri Ayamansa.

Other Ayamansa give no KSD.

Well, its a matter of observation......

I have to observe in a time span which chart better explains my life

and which charts Dashas confirms the timing of events.

As i am new to astrology hence i was hesitating to adopt this

approach.

Also i sing with your lines "Intuition is great reliable tool".

Thanks

Sincerely

Amit Kumar

 

 

, Amitabh Shastri

<amitabh_shastri> wrote:

> Sorry for the delay in response. But you're right. It is the man

behind the weapon who counts. The weapon is just a piece of metal,

wood and other ingredients of which it is composed.

> The difference between innimate and animate needs to be understood

very clearly.

> Best wishes for a happy and prosperous new year.

> Amitabh Shastri

> rohiniranjan <rrgb@s...> wrote:

>

>

> Yes -- that is my view too, fwiw.

>

> rr

>

> , "tw853" wrote:

> >

> > I hope one can use what WORKS for him as INDIVIDUAL astrologer,

> while

> > simultaneously respecting the personal preferences of others.

> >

> > Best regards,

> >

> > tw

> >

> > , "rohiniranjan"

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > I hope I am understanding you correctly, that your position is

> that

> > > no specific ayanamsha alone can explain all that astrology (as

we

> > > know it) explains. That there are more mysteries that lie,

> Horatio,

> > > between the heaven and earth? If so, then yes that is what I

was

> > > saying all along, namely, that there are divinators that

> > successfully

> > > use different ayanamshas, and some that do not even use

> ayanamshas,

> > > so no point in agonizing over which ayanamsha is the only

> accurate

> > > one.

> > >

> > > Pardon my crude and cruel analogy, but the aiming sights on a

> rifle

> > > while of tremendous help in improving the marksmanship, would

> alone

> > > not make one an expert marksman! Ayanamsha is like that 'sight'

> > which

> > > definitely is helpful if trained at the target carefully,

> however,

> > > the marksman still must effectively learn to hold the rifle and

> > > improve their skills.

> > >

> > > Most practitioners (present company excepted of course!) in

> > astrology

> > > of any kind are at best figuring their way out of this dense

> > forest,

> > > even if they may not be brave enough to admit. Your sage advice

> to

> > > not make ayanamsha a big deal is well-given and finds accord in

> my

> > > own personal outlook. I respond only when I notice overt or

> covert

> > > insinuations that a given ayanamsha is somehow the best without

> no

> > > direct and ample proof for such, forthcoming.

> > >

> > > Happy New Year!

> > >

> > > RR

> > >

> > >

> > > , vattem krishnan

> > > wrote:

> > > > Hello Rohiniji,

> > > > The Astronomical studies have confirmed ecliptical zodiac and

> the

> > > movements of the planets along with planets was never found to

be

> > > unform.So we have all confusions added to the changes being

> > witnessed

> > > in the planet earth due unpredicatable characterstics of

> Nature.I

> > do

> > > not know whether I can put that even the science finds it

> difficult

> > > to say in precise nature.May be Ayanamsa correction is a

specific

> > > approach from the fixed zodiac of Aries.Westren Astrology based

> on

> > > accptable solar system too may be able to solve the riddles of

> > human

> > > life and anticipated events.Even we in our Astrology avoid

> Neptune

> > > and Pluto,westren Astrologers attribute great significance of

> these

> > > two outer planets.Still i believe that the kind of Shodasamasas

> we

> > > have developed can bring out comfortably various aspects of

life

> > > including the nature of old age through the aid of divisional

> chart.

> > > > Keeping these aspects in mind,probably it is appropriate till

> > such

> > > that we are not able to deny Ayanamsa,particularly Lahiri's

> > Ayanamsa

> > > as useful for our purposes but we do not discount other

> approaches

> > > and certainly not their efficacy in predictions.

> > > > Certainly Astrology,particularly Vedic Astrology to unfold

the

> > the

> > > future and past events will always remain to be connected with

> > > intution and if not the sixth sense.

> > > > In this we have umpteen examples including a 10year old

British

> > who

> > > could recollect from her class rom lessons to say the most

> unusual

> > > and catsrophic events like Tsunami.

> > > > Even Late B.V.raman makes it a point to refer to the accuracy

> to

> > > Brahma as the creator of universe.

> > > > Iam sure our distinguished members may have some more valuble

> > > suggestions on the subject.

> > > > Thanx

> > > > krishnan

> > > >

> > > > tw853 wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > > >

> > > > I fully agree with Vattem Krishnan not to venture myself into

> the

> > > > highly sensitive controversy of ayanamsa discussion. For

myself

> I

> > > use

> > > > new KP ayanamsa, while simultaneously respecting the personal

> > > > preferences of others.

> > > >

> > > > Best wishes,

> > > >

> > > > tw

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > , vattem krishnan

> > > > wrote:

> > > > > Hello Amitji,

> > > > > For some time I had the fortune of getting associated with

> > > Phalit

> > > > jyotish through Rastreeya Sanskrit Vidyapeeth,New Delhi.

> > > > > In the committee constituted by the Govt of India even late

> > Shri

> > > > B.V.Raman was also a member apart from several vedic scholars

> > from

> > > > Benares,Haridwar and other places.

> > > > > Even in these learned institutions research on the

subjectof

> > > > Ayanamsa is being caaried out.Most of these are guided

through

> > Prof

> > > > Kalyan Dutt Varma,who is now on the bed.Govt India and

several

> > > other

> > > > Govts too have supported the research and even built mini

> jantar-

> > > > mantars to calculate the movements of planets and study the

> > motion

> > > of

> > > > earth.And these effects through research are getting

published

> in

> > > > Sanskrit.Infact even you can try from Tirupati university in

> > India.

> > > > > As far as relativity and percentage of usage of Lahiri

> > Ayanamsa.I

> > > > have no idea.So I go by your statstics.Incase you want to be

> sure

> > > > before you infer as :

> > > > > This is a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'

> > > > > Let us be sincere to find the relevance of Ayanamsa in

Helio

> > > > Centric Approach mostly followe by the westren Astrologers.

> > > > > Infact what little I have understood from Hindu Predictive

> > > > Astrology through various approaches of Ganith jyotish,we

have

> > > three

> > > > different lagnas for harmonising the results arising out the

> > study

> > > of

> > > > natal chart in Astrology.Lagna,Surya as Lagna and mostly Moon

> as

> > > also

> > > > lagna.This approach has made us to depend on various

> mathematical

> > > > calculations and the relevance of Ayanmsa as a major factor

of

> > > study

> > > > was taken up.

> > > > > In the case of westren Astrologers and their philosophy in

> > > handing

> > > > over good results without elaborate rules and the approach of

> > vedic

> > > > Astrology based on the tripod(1,5and9) are to serve for

> different

> > > > sections of this great universe.We like or not the basic of

our

> > > > philosophy in Astrology is related to Karma Siddhantam.

> > > > > In westren thoughts probably they believe in an approach

> which

> > is

> > > > not deterministic but gives an opportunity for understanding

> what

> > > is

> > > > not possible but do not go beyond to say why it is not

possible.

> > > > > I agree with you when you say:

> > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have been

> quite

> > > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at all

and

> > > work

> > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not just

one

> > or

> > > > two

> > > > > degrees, and still produce good results

> > > > > Is it not that Astrology has also an intutional element

where

> > > some

> > > > soothe sayers as pointed out by you can off hand predict any

> > thing?

> > > > > In India Astrology is making strides with the revival

towards

> > > Vedic

> > > > understanding and to find it's relevance in modern times and

in

> > > > futuristic studies.

> > > > > Incidentally I believed late B.V.Raman and Shri K.N Rao as

my

> > > great

> > > > Gurus bout for whose blessing I would not have ventured

myself

> in

> > > to

> > > > these highly sensitive areas of discussions.

> > > > > Thanx

> > > > > krishnan

> > > > > rohiniranjan wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Please do not be personally offended but I have a bit of

> > problem

> > > > > with "mostly" in your statement. Couple of years ago on his

> > > > newslist,

> > > > > I had asked Mr. Rao directly about how such a conclusion

(he

> > had

> > > > also

> > > > > used a statement like "mostly" or 'universally') was

derived.

> > > Given

> > > > > that there must be millions of jyotishis in India itself

and

> > the

> > > > > population growing like a family of rabbits all over the

> globe,

> > > how

> > > > > can one make a statement like that unless a survey was

done.

> It

> > > is

> > > > > his greatness that he eventually responded saying that

> > somewhere

> > > (I

> > > > > think in Delhi or Poona) a group of panchaang makers (I

> recall

> > > less

> > > > > than 30 but I could be remembering it wrongly) had

> congregated

> > > with

> > > > > some govt. officials and through their deliberations

(details

> > of

> > > > > which I would be curious to learn but have no clue where to

> > find

> > > > > those or if those were even published or made avaiable to

> > anyone)

> > > > had

> > > > > come to the conclusion that chitra or chaitra ayanamsha is

> the

> > > one

> > > > to

> > > > > be adopted. I never got the information as to how many of

> these

> > > > fine

> > > > > individuals were actually jyotishis, or practiced jyotish

> with

> > > any

> > > > > success during their lifetime.

> > > > >

> > > > > Mr. Rao himself follows and recommends Lahiri ayanamsha

which

> > is

> > > > > pretty close to chitra ayanamsha and I believe he has

> mentioned

> > > > that

> > > > > he got good results with the ayanamsha and that this was

> close

> > to

> > > > > what his astrological guru used/recommended and also close

to

> > the

> > > > > values that Mr. Karve the psychic who can tell your time of

> > birth

> > > > > just by looking/talking to you, produced. Mr. Karve, it

seems

> > > > looked

> > > > > at you, and gave a lagna degree and the date and with

lahiri

> > > > > ayanamsha this value matched. Mr. Rao's students probably

use

> > > only

> > > > > Lahiri ayanamsha but I have only interacted with a few so

> > cannot

> > > > tell

> > > > > about the ultimate preferences of all.

> > > > >

> > > > > What we can say that the vocal majority on internet

probably

> > uses

> > > > > lahiri ayanamsha. If this list is a standard reference,

then

> > the

> > > > > vocal 'majority' represents less than 1% of the

participants

> > > (less

> > > > > than 26 who discuss jyotish, not counting those that ask

for

> > > > readings

> > > > > only, OUT of some 2600 members). The same would be the

> > experience

> > > > in

> > > > > other list subpopulations (less than 1% talk, express,

> write).

> > So

> > > > one

> > > > > can safely assume that at least 1% or less of the

astrologers

> > > > (sorry

> > > > > Jyotishis!) claim to use Lahiri ayanamsha or a similar

value.

> > > This

> > > > is

> > > > > a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'!

> > > > >

> > > > > Mind you, I am not saying that Lahiri ayanamsha does not

work

> > or

> > > > does

> > > > > or that there is necessarily a better ayanamsha. In fact

> there

> > > are

> > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have been

> quite

> > > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at all

and

> > > work

> > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not just

one

> > or

> > > > two

> > > > > degrees, and still produce good results!

> > > > >

> > > > > There are a lot of myths and suppositions and claims

floating

> > > > around

> > > > > in the ocean of astrology about this or that being tge

> absolute

> > > > truth

> > > > > in the field of astrology in general and statements such as

> > > jyotish

> > > > > is good for predicting events and tropical better at

> describing

> > > the

> > > > > psyche, etc. As I have pointed out in some earlier written

> > > > articles,

> > > > > this is more a reflection of the person and his background

> who

> > > then

> > > > > went on to become an astrologer - the economist drawn to

> > > > forecasting

> > > > > the markets, the doctor focussing on astrology of the

> diseases,

> > > the

> > > > > spiritualist seeing the spiritual map in the horoscope, the

> > > > > psychologist focusing on the psyche as revealed through the

> map.

> > > > >

> > > > > The beauty is that the same little map, or maybe a few of

> these

> > > are

> > > > > capable of giving such a rich description of the human

> > > experience,

> > > > > the full spectrum of which has been beyond the scope of

> > > > comprehension

> > > > > of any one individual, whether astrologer, jyotishi,

> > > tarotomancer,

> > > > > scryer or some Guru yogi divine!

> > > > >

> > > > > RR

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > , "tw853"

> > > wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear amit_call,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP ayanamsa is used

in

> KP

> > > > > > analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his books. It's up

> to

> > > the

> > > > > > preference of an individual astrologer.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Best regards,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > tw

> > > > > >

> > > > > > P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa with

> > deg:min:sec

> > > is

> > > > > > advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book 2003, pp 1, 88-

> 93)

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , vattem krishnan

> > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > Ji Amitji,

> > > > > > > In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of discussions

> due

> > > to

> > > > > > differences it has been agreed that scietifically prudent

> to

> > > use

> > > > > > Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee constituted has also

> > > > > recommended

> > > > > > for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> > > > > > > Infact to add to list I also cite the research of Shri

> > > K.N.Rao

> > > > a

> > > > > > renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > amit_call wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > > > I have a confusion over Using different Ayamansas.

> > > > > > > Using different Ayamansas give different Charts.

> > > > > > > Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are different.

> > > > > > > Please guide me.

> > > > > > > Sincerely

> > > > > > > Amit

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

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> > > > > > > /

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> Terms

> > > of

> > > > > > Service.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

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> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Terms

> of

> > > > Service.

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> > > > >

> > > > > The all-new My – Get yours free!

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> > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

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> > > >

> > > > Links

> > > >

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Dear Amitiji,

Apart from technicalities(like ayanamsa,sideral Astrology etc) due to developing

nature of the subject of Astrology, even the users too have increased to such

great numbers in Kaliyuga, as the procedures on timing of events as existing

earlier and in old times have been discontinued.Now a days the importance of

Panchang/Almanac considered as a journal of predictions(for mundane purposes)

lost it's glory with the mushrooming of Astrologers in the present day context

posing a threat to reliabilty and consistency.The interpretation of:

In Kaliyuga only a few will be true astrologers and the best ones'

pridictive power will only manifest to 25%"

I do not remember the exact sloka but the meaning was same.

might be viewed.As a result the Astrologer in the present day context is slowly

substituting for a Psychologist.I can only view this change as the erosion in

value of Astrology.

Members may be having other views.

krishnan

 

amit_call <amit_call wrote:

 

Dear All,

I thank all the members for postings and throwing light on this

Ayamansa confusion.

This is accepted that Pridiction is one's own ability.

Also in a magazine of astrology i read a sloka which says "In

Kaliyuga only a few will be true astrologers and the best ones'

pridictive power will only manifest to 25%"

I do not remember the exact sloka but the meaning was same.

Also i want to add that some time back i met a Nadi Reader.

in Nadi i was amazed to see that they told my name,my parents

name ,some educational background,present condition and a little more.

also as per Nadi he made a chart and gave to me.

This chart is same as i get using Lahiri and KP Ayamansa.

Also one of my friend got a chance to meet a sidhha Purush in

Bulandshahar(U.P.).He is a young sanyasi.Looking at face he said

something about him..his problems and told that he was having Kaal

Sarpa Dosha.

I was very new to astrology at that time.I started reading abt KSD

and found that there was really KSD in his chart.

Now i see this chart is as per Lahiri Ayamansa.

Other Ayamansa give no KSD.

Well, its a matter of observation......

I have to observe in a time span which chart better explains my life

and which charts Dashas confirms the timing of events.

As i am new to astrology hence i was hesitating to adopt this

approach.

Also i sing with your lines "Intuition is great reliable tool".

Thanks

Sincerely

Amit Kumar

 

 

, Amitabh Shastri

<amitabh_shastri> wrote:

> Sorry for the delay in response. But you're right. It is the man

behind the weapon who counts. The weapon is just a piece of metal,

wood and other ingredients of which it is composed.

> The difference between innimate and animate needs to be understood

very clearly.

> Best wishes for a happy and prosperous new year.

> Amitabh Shastri

> rohiniranjan <rrgb@s...> wrote:

>

>

> Yes -- that is my view too, fwiw.

>

> rr

>

> , "tw853" wrote:

> >

> > I hope one can use what WORKS for him as INDIVIDUAL astrologer,

> while

> > simultaneously respecting the personal preferences of others.

> >

> > Best regards,

> >

> > tw

> >

> > , "rohiniranjan"

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > I hope I am understanding you correctly, that your position is

> that

> > > no specific ayanamsha alone can explain all that astrology (as

we

> > > know it) explains. That there are more mysteries that lie,

> Horatio,

> > > between the heaven and earth? If so, then yes that is what I

was

> > > saying all along, namely, that there are divinators that

> > successfully

> > > use different ayanamshas, and some that do not even use

> ayanamshas,

> > > so no point in agonizing over which ayanamsha is the only

> accurate

> > > one.

> > >

> > > Pardon my crude and cruel analogy, but the aiming sights on a

> rifle

> > > while of tremendous help in improving the marksmanship, would

> alone

> > > not make one an expert marksman! Ayanamsha is like that 'sight'

> > which

> > > definitely is helpful if trained at the target carefully,

> however,

> > > the marksman still must effectively learn to hold the rifle and

> > > improve their skills.

> > >

> > > Most practitioners (present company excepted of course!) in

> > astrology

> > > of any kind are at best figuring their way out of this dense

> > forest,

> > > even if they may not be brave enough to admit. Your sage advice

> to

> > > not make ayanamsha a big deal is well-given and finds accord in

> my

> > > own personal outlook. I respond only when I notice overt or

> covert

> > > insinuations that a given ayanamsha is somehow the best without

> no

> > > direct and ample proof for such, forthcoming.

> > >

> > > Happy New Year!

> > >

> > > RR

> > >

> > >

> > > , vattem krishnan

> > > wrote:

> > > > Hello Rohiniji,

> > > > The Astronomical studies have confirmed ecliptical zodiac and

> the

> > > movements of the planets along with planets was never found to

be

> > > unform.So we have all confusions added to the changes being

> > witnessed

> > > in the planet earth due unpredicatable characterstics of

> Nature.I

> > do

> > > not know whether I can put that even the science finds it

> difficult

> > > to say in precise nature.May be Ayanamsa correction is a

specific

> > > approach from the fixed zodiac of Aries.Westren Astrology based

> on

> > > accptable solar system too may be able to solve the riddles of

> > human

> > > life and anticipated events.Even we in our Astrology avoid

> Neptune

> > > and Pluto,westren Astrologers attribute great significance of

> these

> > > two outer planets.Still i believe that the kind of Shodasamasas

> we

> > > have developed can bring out comfortably various aspects of

life

> > > including the nature of old age through the aid of divisional

> chart.

> > > > Keeping these aspects in mind,probably it is appropriate till

> > such

> > > that we are not able to deny Ayanamsa,particularly Lahiri's

> > Ayanamsa

> > > as useful for our purposes but we do not discount other

> approaches

> > > and certainly not their efficacy in predictions.

> > > > Certainly Astrology,particularly Vedic Astrology to unfold

the

> > the

> > > future and past events will always remain to be connected with

> > > intution and if not the sixth sense.

> > > > In this we have umpteen examples including a 10year old

British

> > who

> > > could recollect from her class rom lessons to say the most

> unusual

> > > and catsrophic events like Tsunami.

> > > > Even Late B.V.raman makes it a point to refer to the accuracy

> to

> > > Brahma as the creator of universe.

> > > > Iam sure our distinguished members may have some more valuble

> > > suggestions on the subject.

> > > > Thanx

> > > > krishnan

> > > >

> > > > tw853 wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > > >

> > > > I fully agree with Vattem Krishnan not to venture myself into

> the

> > > > highly sensitive controversy of ayanamsa discussion. For

myself

> I

> > > use

> > > > new KP ayanamsa, while simultaneously respecting the personal

> > > > preferences of others.

> > > >

> > > > Best wishes,

> > > >

> > > > tw

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > , vattem krishnan

> > > > wrote:

> > > > > Hello Amitji,

> > > > > For some time I had the fortune of getting associated with

> > > Phalit

> > > > jyotish through Rastreeya Sanskrit Vidyapeeth,New Delhi.

> > > > > In the committee constituted by the Govt of India even late

> > Shri

> > > > B.V.Raman was also a member apart from several vedic scholars

> > from

> > > > Benares,Haridwar and other places.

> > > > > Even in these learned institutions research on the

subjectof

> > > > Ayanamsa is being caaried out.Most of these are guided

through

> > Prof

> > > > Kalyan Dutt Varma,who is now on the bed.Govt India and

several

> > > other

> > > > Govts too have supported the research and even built mini

> jantar-

> > > > mantars to calculate the movements of planets and study the

> > motion

> > > of

> > > > earth.And these effects through research are getting

published

> in

> > > > Sanskrit.Infact even you can try from Tirupati university in

> > India.

> > > > > As far as relativity and percentage of usage of Lahiri

> > Ayanamsa.I

> > > > have no idea.So I go by your statstics.Incase you want to be

> sure

> > > > before you infer as :

> > > > > This is a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'

> > > > > Let us be sincere to find the relevance of Ayanamsa in

Helio

> > > > Centric Approach mostly followe by the westren Astrologers.

> > > > > Infact what little I have understood from Hindu Predictive

> > > > Astrology through various approaches of Ganith jyotish,we

have

> > > three

> > > > different lagnas for harmonising the results arising out the

> > study

> > > of

> > > > natal chart in Astrology.Lagna,Surya as Lagna and mostly Moon

> as

> > > also

> > > > lagna.This approach has made us to depend on various

> mathematical

> > > > calculations and the relevance of Ayanmsa as a major factor

of

> > > study

> > > > was taken up.

> > > > > In the case of westren Astrologers and their philosophy in

> > > handing

> > > > over good results without elaborate rules and the approach of

> > vedic

> > > > Astrology based on the tripod(1,5and9) are to serve for

> different

> > > > sections of this great universe.We like or not the basic of

our

> > > > philosophy in Astrology is related to Karma Siddhantam.

> > > > > In westren thoughts probably they believe in an approach

> which

> > is

> > > > not deterministic but gives an opportunity for understanding

> what

> > > is

> > > > not possible but do not go beyond to say why it is not

possible.

> > > > > I agree with you when you say:

> > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have been

> quite

> > > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at all

and

> > > work

> > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not just

one

> > or

> > > > two

> > > > > degrees, and still produce good results

> > > > > Is it not that Astrology has also an intutional element

where

> > > some

> > > > soothe sayers as pointed out by you can off hand predict any

> > thing?

> > > > > In India Astrology is making strides with the revival

towards

> > > Vedic

> > > > understanding and to find it's relevance in modern times and

in

> > > > futuristic studies.

> > > > > Incidentally I believed late B.V.Raman and Shri K.N Rao as

my

> > > great

> > > > Gurus bout for whose blessing I would not have ventured

myself

> in

> > > to

> > > > these highly sensitive areas of discussions.

> > > > > Thanx

> > > > > krishnan

> > > > > rohiniranjan wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Please do not be personally offended but I have a bit of

> > problem

> > > > > with "mostly" in your statement. Couple of years ago on his

> > > > newslist,

> > > > > I had asked Mr. Rao directly about how such a conclusion

(he

> > had

> > > > also

> > > > > used a statement like "mostly" or 'universally') was

derived.

> > > Given

> > > > > that there must be millions of jyotishis in India itself

and

> > the

> > > > > population growing like a family of rabbits all over the

> globe,

> > > how

> > > > > can one make a statement like that unless a survey was

done.

> It

> > > is

> > > > > his greatness that he eventually responded saying that

> > somewhere

> > > (I

> > > > > think in Delhi or Poona) a group of panchaang makers (I

> recall

> > > less

> > > > > than 30 but I could be remembering it wrongly) had

> congregated

> > > with

> > > > > some govt. officials and through their deliberations

(details

> > of

> > > > > which I would be curious to learn but have no clue where to

> > find

> > > > > those or if those were even published or made avaiable to

> > anyone)

> > > > had

> > > > > come to the conclusion that chitra or chaitra ayanamsha is

> the

> > > one

> > > > to

> > > > > be adopted. I never got the information as to how many of

> these

> > > > fine

> > > > > individuals were actually jyotishis, or practiced jyotish

> with

> > > any

> > > > > success during their lifetime.

> > > > >

> > > > > Mr. Rao himself follows and recommends Lahiri ayanamsha

which

> > is

> > > > > pretty close to chitra ayanamsha and I believe he has

> mentioned

> > > > that

> > > > > he got good results with the ayanamsha and that this was

> close

> > to

> > > > > what his astrological guru used/recommended and also close

to

> > the

> > > > > values that Mr. Karve the psychic who can tell your time of

> > birth

> > > > > just by looking/talking to you, produced. Mr. Karve, it

seems

> > > > looked

> > > > > at you, and gave a lagna degree and the date and with

lahiri

> > > > > ayanamsha this value matched. Mr. Rao's students probably

use

> > > only

> > > > > Lahiri ayanamsha but I have only interacted with a few so

> > cannot

> > > > tell

> > > > > about the ultimate preferences of all.

> > > > >

> > > > > What we can say that the vocal majority on internet

probably

> > uses

> > > > > lahiri ayanamsha. If this list is a standard reference,

then

> > the

> > > > > vocal 'majority' represents less than 1% of the

participants

> > > (less

> > > > > than 26 who discuss jyotish, not counting those that ask

for

> > > > readings

> > > > > only, OUT of some 2600 members). The same would be the

> > experience

> > > > in

> > > > > other list subpopulations (less than 1% talk, express,

> write).

> > So

> > > > one

> > > > > can safely assume that at least 1% or less of the

astrologers

> > > > (sorry

> > > > > Jyotishis!) claim to use Lahiri ayanamsha or a similar

value.

> > > This

> > > > is

> > > > > a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'!

> > > > >

> > > > > Mind you, I am not saying that Lahiri ayanamsha does not

work

> > or

> > > > does

> > > > > or that there is necessarily a better ayanamsha. In fact

> there

> > > are

> > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have been

> quite

> > > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at all

and

> > > work

> > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not just

one

> > or

> > > > two

> > > > > degrees, and still produce good results!

> > > > >

> > > > > There are a lot of myths and suppositions and claims

floating

> > > > around

> > > > > in the ocean of astrology about this or that being tge

> absolute

> > > > truth

> > > > > in the field of astrology in general and statements such as

> > > jyotish

> > > > > is good for predicting events and tropical better at

> describing

> > > the

> > > > > psyche, etc. As I have pointed out in some earlier written

> > > > articles,

> > > > > this is more a reflection of the person and his background

> who

> > > then

> > > > > went on to become an astrologer - the economist drawn to

> > > > forecasting

> > > > > the markets, the doctor focussing on astrology of the

> diseases,

> > > the

> > > > > spiritualist seeing the spiritual map in the horoscope, the

> > > > > psychologist focusing on the psyche as revealed through the

> map.

> > > > >

> > > > > The beauty is that the same little map, or maybe a few of

> these

> > > are

> > > > > capable of giving such a rich description of the human

> > > experience,

> > > > > the full spectrum of which has been beyond the scope of

> > > > comprehension

> > > > > of any one individual, whether astrologer, jyotishi,

> > > tarotomancer,

> > > > > scryer or some Guru yogi divine!

> > > > >

> > > > > RR

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > , "tw853"

> > > wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear amit_call,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP ayanamsa is used

in

> KP

> > > > > > analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his books. It's up

> to

> > > the

> > > > > > preference of an individual astrologer.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Best regards,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > tw

> > > > > >

> > > > > > P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa with

> > deg:min:sec

> > > is

> > > > > > advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book 2003, pp 1, 88-

> 93)

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , vattem krishnan

> > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > Ji Amitji,

> > > > > > > In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of discussions

> due

> > > to

> > > > > > differences it has been agreed that scietifically prudent

> to

> > > use

> > > > > > Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee constituted has also

> > > > > recommended

> > > > > > for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> > > > > > > Infact to add to list I also cite the research of Shri

> > > K.N.Rao

> > > > a

> > > > > > renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > amit_call wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > > > I have a confusion over Using different Ayamansas.

> > > > > > > Using different Ayamansas give different Charts.

> > > > > > > Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are different.

> > > > > > > Please guide me.

> > > > > > > Sincerely

> > > > > > > Amit

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

> > > > > > >

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> > > > > > > Links

> > > > > > >

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> > > > > > > /

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> Terms

> > > of

> > > > > > Service.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > All your favorites on one personal page – Try My

> > > > > > >

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> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Terms

> of

> > > > Service.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > The all-new My – Get yours free!

> > > > >

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> > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

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Dear Amit,

 

This sounds fascinating! Would you care to share the birthdata for

the nativity that had KSD only with Lahiri ayanamsha?

 

Thanks

 

RR

 

, "amit_call" <amit_call>

wrote:

>

> Dear All,

> I thank all the members for postings and throwing light on this

> Ayamansa confusion.

> This is accepted that Pridiction is one's own ability.

> Also in a magazine of astrology i read a sloka which says "In

> Kaliyuga only a few will be true astrologers and the best ones'

> pridictive power will only manifest to 25%"

> I do not remember the exact sloka but the meaning was same.

> Also i want to add that some time back i met a Nadi Reader.

> in Nadi i was amazed to see that they told my name,my parents

> name ,some educational background,present condition and a little

more.

> also as per Nadi he made a chart and gave to me.

> This chart is same as i get using Lahiri and KP Ayamansa.

> Also one of my friend got a chance to meet a sidhha Purush in

> Bulandshahar(U.P.).He is a young sanyasi.Looking at face he said

> something about him..his problems and told that he was having Kaal

> Sarpa Dosha.

> I was very new to astrology at that time.I started reading abt KSD

> and found that there was really KSD in his chart.

> Now i see this chart is as per Lahiri Ayamansa.

> Other Ayamansa give no KSD.

> Well, its a matter of observation......

> I have to observe in a time span which chart better explains my

life

> and which charts Dashas confirms the timing of events.

> As i am new to astrology hence i was hesitating to adopt this

> approach.

> Also i sing with your lines "Intuition is great reliable tool".

> Thanks

> Sincerely

> Amit Kumar

>

>

> , Amitabh Shastri

> <amitabh_shastri> wrote:

> > Sorry for the delay in response. But you're right. It is the man

> behind the weapon who counts. The weapon is just a piece of metal,

> wood and other ingredients of which it is composed.

> > The difference between innimate and animate needs to be

understood

> very clearly.

> > Best wishes for a happy and prosperous new year.

> > Amitabh Shastri

> > rohiniranjan <rrgb@s...> wrote:

> >

> >

> > Yes -- that is my view too, fwiw.

> >

> > rr

> >

> > , "tw853" wrote:

> > >

> > > I hope one can use what WORKS for him as INDIVIDUAL astrologer,

> > while

> > > simultaneously respecting the personal preferences of others.

> > >

> > > Best regards,

> > >

> > > tw

> > >

> > > , "rohiniranjan"

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > I hope I am understanding you correctly, that your position

is

> > that

> > > > no specific ayanamsha alone can explain all that astrology

(as

> we

> > > > know it) explains. That there are more mysteries that lie,

> > Horatio,

> > > > between the heaven and earth? If so, then yes that is what I

> was

> > > > saying all along, namely, that there are divinators that

> > > successfully

> > > > use different ayanamshas, and some that do not even use

> > ayanamshas,

> > > > so no point in agonizing over which ayanamsha is the only

> > accurate

> > > > one.

> > > >

> > > > Pardon my crude and cruel analogy, but the aiming sights on a

> > rifle

> > > > while of tremendous help in improving the marksmanship, would

> > alone

> > > > not make one an expert marksman! Ayanamsha is like

that 'sight'

> > > which

> > > > definitely is helpful if trained at the target carefully,

> > however,

> > > > the marksman still must effectively learn to hold the rifle

and

> > > > improve their skills.

> > > >

> > > > Most practitioners (present company excepted of course!) in

> > > astrology

> > > > of any kind are at best figuring their way out of this dense

> > > forest,

> > > > even if they may not be brave enough to admit. Your sage

advice

> > to

> > > > not make ayanamsha a big deal is well-given and finds accord

in

> > my

> > > > own personal outlook. I respond only when I notice overt or

> > covert

> > > > insinuations that a given ayanamsha is somehow the best

without

> > no

> > > > direct and ample proof for such, forthcoming.

> > > >

> > > > Happy New Year!

> > > >

> > > > RR

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > , vattem krishnan

> > > > wrote:

> > > > > Hello Rohiniji,

> > > > > The Astronomical studies have confirmed ecliptical zodiac

and

> > the

> > > > movements of the planets along with planets was never found

to

> be

> > > > unform.So we have all confusions added to the changes being

> > > witnessed

> > > > in the planet earth due unpredicatable characterstics of

> > Nature.I

> > > do

> > > > not know whether I can put that even the science finds it

> > difficult

> > > > to say in precise nature.May be Ayanamsa correction is a

> specific

> > > > approach from the fixed zodiac of Aries.Westren Astrology

based

> > on

> > > > accptable solar system too may be able to solve the riddles

of

> > > human

> > > > life and anticipated events.Even we in our Astrology avoid

> > Neptune

> > > > and Pluto,westren Astrologers attribute great significance of

> > these

> > > > two outer planets.Still i believe that the kind of

Shodasamasas

> > we

> > > > have developed can bring out comfortably various aspects of

> life

> > > > including the nature of old age through the aid of divisional

> > chart.

> > > > > Keeping these aspects in mind,probably it is appropriate

till

> > > such

> > > > that we are not able to deny Ayanamsa,particularly Lahiri's

> > > Ayanamsa

> > > > as useful for our purposes but we do not discount other

> > approaches

> > > > and certainly not their efficacy in predictions.

> > > > > Certainly Astrology,particularly Vedic Astrology to unfold

> the

> > > the

> > > > future and past events will always remain to be connected

with

> > > > intution and if not the sixth sense.

> > > > > In this we have umpteen examples including a 10year old

> British

> > > who

> > > > could recollect from her class rom lessons to say the most

> > unusual

> > > > and catsrophic events like Tsunami.

> > > > > Even Late B.V.raman makes it a point to refer to the

accuracy

> > to

> > > > Brahma as the creator of universe.

> > > > > Iam sure our distinguished members may have some more

valuble

> > > > suggestions on the subject.

> > > > > Thanx

> > > > > krishnan

> > > > >

> > > > > tw853 wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > > > >

> > > > > I fully agree with Vattem Krishnan not to venture myself

into

> > the

> > > > > highly sensitive controversy of ayanamsa discussion. For

> myself

> > I

> > > > use

> > > > > new KP ayanamsa, while simultaneously respecting the

personal

> > > > > preferences of others.

> > > > >

> > > > > Best wishes,

> > > > >

> > > > > tw

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > , vattem krishnan

> > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > Hello Amitji,

> > > > > > For some time I had the fortune of getting associated

with

> > > > Phalit

> > > > > jyotish through Rastreeya Sanskrit Vidyapeeth,New Delhi.

> > > > > > In the committee constituted by the Govt of India even

late

> > > Shri

> > > > > B.V.Raman was also a member apart from several vedic

scholars

> > > from

> > > > > Benares,Haridwar and other places.

> > > > > > Even in these learned institutions research on the

> subjectof

> > > > > Ayanamsa is being caaried out.Most of these are guided

> through

> > > Prof

> > > > > Kalyan Dutt Varma,who is now on the bed.Govt India and

> several

> > > > other

> > > > > Govts too have supported the research and even built mini

> > jantar-

> > > > > mantars to calculate the movements of planets and study the

> > > motion

> > > > of

> > > > > earth.And these effects through research are getting

> published

> > in

> > > > > Sanskrit.Infact even you can try from Tirupati university

in

> > > India.

> > > > > > As far as relativity and percentage of usage of Lahiri

> > > Ayanamsa.I

> > > > > have no idea.So I go by your statstics.Incase you want to

be

> > sure

> > > > > before you infer as :

> > > > > > This is a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'

> > > > > > Let us be sincere to find the relevance of Ayanamsa in

> Helio

> > > > > Centric Approach mostly followe by the westren Astrologers.

> > > > > > Infact what little I have understood from Hindu

Predictive

> > > > > Astrology through various approaches of Ganith jyotish,we

> have

> > > > three

> > > > > different lagnas for harmonising the results arising out

the

> > > study

> > > > of

> > > > > natal chart in Astrology.Lagna,Surya as Lagna and mostly

Moon

> > as

> > > > also

> > > > > lagna.This approach has made us to depend on various

> > mathematical

> > > > > calculations and the relevance of Ayanmsa as a major factor

> of

> > > > study

> > > > > was taken up.

> > > > > > In the case of westren Astrologers and their philosophy

in

> > > > handing

> > > > > over good results without elaborate rules and the approach

of

> > > vedic

> > > > > Astrology based on the tripod(1,5and9) are to serve for

> > different

> > > > > sections of this great universe.We like or not the basic of

> our

> > > > > philosophy in Astrology is related to Karma Siddhantam.

> > > > > > In westren thoughts probably they believe in an approach

> > which

> > > is

> > > > > not deterministic but gives an opportunity for

understanding

> > what

> > > > is

> > > > > not possible but do not go beyond to say why it is not

> possible.

> > > > > > I agree with you when you say:

> > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have been

> > quite

> > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at all

> and

> > > > work

> > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not just

> one

> > > or

> > > > > two

> > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results

> > > > > > Is it not that Astrology has also an intutional element

> where

> > > > some

> > > > > soothe sayers as pointed out by you can off hand predict

any

> > > thing?

> > > > > > In India Astrology is making strides with the revival

> towards

> > > > Vedic

> > > > > understanding and to find it's relevance in modern times

and

> in

> > > > > futuristic studies.

> > > > > > Incidentally I believed late B.V.Raman and Shri K.N Rao

as

> my

> > > > great

> > > > > Gurus bout for whose blessing I would not have ventured

> myself

> > in

> > > > to

> > > > > these highly sensitive areas of discussions.

> > > > > > Thanx

> > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > rohiniranjan wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Please do not be personally offended but I have a bit of

> > > problem

> > > > > > with "mostly" in your statement. Couple of years ago on

his

> > > > > newslist,

> > > > > > I had asked Mr. Rao directly about how such a conclusion

> (he

> > > had

> > > > > also

> > > > > > used a statement like "mostly" or 'universally') was

> derived.

> > > > Given

> > > > > > that there must be millions of jyotishis in India itself

> and

> > > the

> > > > > > population growing like a family of rabbits all over the

> > globe,

> > > > how

> > > > > > can one make a statement like that unless a survey was

> done.

> > It

> > > > is

> > > > > > his greatness that he eventually responded saying that

> > > somewhere

> > > > (I

> > > > > > think in Delhi or Poona) a group of panchaang makers (I

> > recall

> > > > less

> > > > > > than 30 but I could be remembering it wrongly) had

> > congregated

> > > > with

> > > > > > some govt. officials and through their deliberations

> (details

> > > of

> > > > > > which I would be curious to learn but have no clue where

to

> > > find

> > > > > > those or if those were even published or made avaiable to

> > > anyone)

> > > > > had

> > > > > > come to the conclusion that chitra or chaitra ayanamsha

is

> > the

> > > > one

> > > > > to

> > > > > > be adopted. I never got the information as to how many of

> > these

> > > > > fine

> > > > > > individuals were actually jyotishis, or practiced jyotish

> > with

> > > > any

> > > > > > success during their lifetime.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Mr. Rao himself follows and recommends Lahiri ayanamsha

> which

> > > is

> > > > > > pretty close to chitra ayanamsha and I believe he has

> > mentioned

> > > > > that

> > > > > > he got good results with the ayanamsha and that this was

> > close

> > > to

> > > > > > what his astrological guru used/recommended and also

close

> to

> > > the

> > > > > > values that Mr. Karve the psychic who can tell your time

of

> > > birth

> > > > > > just by looking/talking to you, produced. Mr. Karve, it

> seems

> > > > > looked

> > > > > > at you, and gave a lagna degree and the date and with

> lahiri

> > > > > > ayanamsha this value matched. Mr. Rao's students probably

> use

> > > > only

> > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsha but I have only interacted with a few so

> > > cannot

> > > > > tell

> > > > > > about the ultimate preferences of all.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > What we can say that the vocal majority on internet

> probably

> > > uses

> > > > > > lahiri ayanamsha. If this list is a standard reference,

> then

> > > the

> > > > > > vocal 'majority' represents less than 1% of the

> participants

> > > > (less

> > > > > > than 26 who discuss jyotish, not counting those that ask

> for

> > > > > readings

> > > > > > only, OUT of some 2600 members). The same would be the

> > > experience

> > > > > in

> > > > > > other list subpopulations (less than 1% talk, express,

> > write).

> > > So

> > > > > one

> > > > > > can safely assume that at least 1% or less of the

> astrologers

> > > > > (sorry

> > > > > > Jyotishis!) claim to use Lahiri ayanamsha or a similar

> value.

> > > > This

> > > > > is

> > > > > > a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Mind you, I am not saying that Lahiri ayanamsha does not

> work

> > > or

> > > > > does

> > > > > > or that there is necessarily a better ayanamsha. In fact

> > there

> > > > are

> > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have been

> > quite

> > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at all

> and

> > > > work

> > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not just

> one

> > > or

> > > > > two

> > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > There are a lot of myths and suppositions and claims

> floating

> > > > > around

> > > > > > in the ocean of astrology about this or that being tge

> > absolute

> > > > > truth

> > > > > > in the field of astrology in general and statements such

as

> > > > jyotish

> > > > > > is good for predicting events and tropical better at

> > describing

> > > > the

> > > > > > psyche, etc. As I have pointed out in some earlier

written

> > > > > articles,

> > > > > > this is more a reflection of the person and his

background

> > who

> > > > then

> > > > > > went on to become an astrologer - the economist drawn to

> > > > > forecasting

> > > > > > the markets, the doctor focussing on astrology of the

> > diseases,

> > > > the

> > > > > > spiritualist seeing the spiritual map in the horoscope,

the

> > > > > > psychologist focusing on the psyche as revealed through

the

> > map.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > The beauty is that the same little map, or maybe a few of

> > these

> > > > are

> > > > > > capable of giving such a rich description of the human

> > > > experience,

> > > > > > the full spectrum of which has been beyond the scope of

> > > > > comprehension

> > > > > > of any one individual, whether astrologer, jyotishi,

> > > > tarotomancer,

> > > > > > scryer or some Guru yogi divine!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > RR

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , "tw853"

> > > > wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear amit_call,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP ayanamsa is used

> in

> > KP

> > > > > > > analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his books. It's

up

> > to

> > > > the

> > > > > > > preference of an individual astrologer.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Best regards,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa with

> > > deg:min:sec

> > > > is

> > > > > > > advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book 2003, pp 1,

88-

> > 93)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > , vattem

krishnan

> > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > Ji Amitji,

> > > > > > > > In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of

discussions

> > due

> > > > to

> > > > > > > differences it has been agreed that scietifically

prudent

> > to

> > > > use

> > > > > > > Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee constituted has

also

> > > > > > recommended

> > > > > > > for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> > > > > > > > Infact to add to list I also cite the research of

Shri

> > > > K.N.Rao

> > > > > a

> > > > > > > renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > amit_call wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > > > > I have a confusion over Using different Ayamansas.

> > > > > > > > Using different Ayamansas give different Charts.

> > > > > > > > Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are different.

> > > > > > > > Please guide me.

> > > > > > > > Sincerely

> > > > > > > > Amit

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

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Rohini ji

The details of native are:

 

DOB:10-Jun-1977

Time:04:00 A.M.

Place:Aligarh,U.P..27N54 78E04

The chart casted using Lahiri/KP ayamansa gives KSD while using Raman

Ayamansa it doesn't.

My Understanding of KSD is when all the Planets are between Rahu and

Ketu.

someWhere i read if Any planet joins Ketu or Rahu ..then it is not

KSD.In that case it will not be KSD.

If wrong pls correct me.

Sincerely

Amit kUmar

 

 

, "rohiniranjan" <rrgb@s...>

wrote:

>

> Dear Amit,

>

> This sounds fascinating! Would you care to share the birthdata for

> the nativity that had KSD only with Lahiri ayanamsha?

>

> Thanks

>

> RR

>

> , "amit_call"

<amit_call>

> wrote:

> >

> > Dear All,

> > I thank all the members for postings and throwing light on this

> > Ayamansa confusion.

> > This is accepted that Pridiction is one's own ability.

> > Also in a magazine of astrology i read a sloka which says "In

> > Kaliyuga only a few will be true astrologers and the best ones'

> > pridictive power will only manifest to 25%"

> > I do not remember the exact sloka but the meaning was same.

> > Also i want to add that some time back i met a Nadi Reader.

> > in Nadi i was amazed to see that they told my name,my parents

> > name ,some educational background,present condition and a little

> more.

> > also as per Nadi he made a chart and gave to me.

> > This chart is same as i get using Lahiri and KP Ayamansa.

> > Also one of my friend got a chance to meet a sidhha Purush in

> > Bulandshahar(U.P.).He is a young sanyasi.Looking at face he said

> > something about him..his problems and told that he was having

Kaal

> > Sarpa Dosha.

> > I was very new to astrology at that time.I started reading abt

KSD

> > and found that there was really KSD in his chart.

> > Now i see this chart is as per Lahiri Ayamansa.

> > Other Ayamansa give no KSD.

> > Well, its a matter of observation......

> > I have to observe in a time span which chart better explains my

> life

> > and which charts Dashas confirms the timing of events.

> > As i am new to astrology hence i was hesitating to adopt this

> > approach.

> > Also i sing with your lines "Intuition is great reliable tool".

> > Thanks

> > Sincerely

> > Amit Kumar

> >

> >

> > , Amitabh Shastri

> > <amitabh_shastri> wrote:

> > > Sorry for the delay in response. But you're right. It is the

man

> > behind the weapon who counts. The weapon is just a piece of

metal,

> > wood and other ingredients of which it is composed.

> > > The difference between innimate and animate needs to be

> understood

> > very clearly.

> > > Best wishes for a happy and prosperous new year.

> > > Amitabh Shastri

> > > rohiniranjan <rrgb@s...> wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > > Yes -- that is my view too, fwiw.

> > >

> > > rr

> > >

> > > , "tw853" wrote:

> > > >

> > > > I hope one can use what WORKS for him as INDIVIDUAL

astrologer,

> > > while

> > > > simultaneously respecting the personal preferences of others.

> > > >

> > > > Best regards,

> > > >

> > > > tw

> > > >

> > > > , "rohiniranjan"

> > > > wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > I hope I am understanding you correctly, that your position

> is

> > > that

> > > > > no specific ayanamsha alone can explain all that astrology

> (as

> > we

> > > > > know it) explains. That there are more mysteries that lie,

> > > Horatio,

> > > > > between the heaven and earth? If so, then yes that is what

I

> > was

> > > > > saying all along, namely, that there are divinators that

> > > > successfully

> > > > > use different ayanamshas, and some that do not even use

> > > ayanamshas,

> > > > > so no point in agonizing over which ayanamsha is the only

> > > accurate

> > > > > one.

> > > > >

> > > > > Pardon my crude and cruel analogy, but the aiming sights on

a

> > > rifle

> > > > > while of tremendous help in improving the marksmanship,

would

> > > alone

> > > > > not make one an expert marksman! Ayanamsha is like

> that 'sight'

> > > > which

> > > > > definitely is helpful if trained at the target carefully,

> > > however,

> > > > > the marksman still must effectively learn to hold the rifle

> and

> > > > > improve their skills.

> > > > >

> > > > > Most practitioners (present company excepted of course!) in

> > > > astrology

> > > > > of any kind are at best figuring their way out of this

dense

> > > > forest,

> > > > > even if they may not be brave enough to admit. Your sage

> advice

> > > to

> > > > > not make ayanamsha a big deal is well-given and finds

accord

> in

> > > my

> > > > > own personal outlook. I respond only when I notice overt or

> > > covert

> > > > > insinuations that a given ayanamsha is somehow the best

> without

> > > no

> > > > > direct and ample proof for such, forthcoming.

> > > > >

> > > > > Happy New Year!

> > > > >

> > > > > RR

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > , vattem krishnan

> > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > Hello Rohiniji,

> > > > > > The Astronomical studies have confirmed ecliptical zodiac

> and

> > > the

> > > > > movements of the planets along with planets was never found

> to

> > be

> > > > > unform.So we have all confusions added to the changes being

> > > > witnessed

> > > > > in the planet earth due unpredicatable characterstics of

> > > Nature.I

> > > > do

> > > > > not know whether I can put that even the science finds it

> > > difficult

> > > > > to say in precise nature.May be Ayanamsa correction is a

> > specific

> > > > > approach from the fixed zodiac of Aries.Westren Astrology

> based

> > > on

> > > > > accptable solar system too may be able to solve the riddles

> of

> > > > human

> > > > > life and anticipated events.Even we in our Astrology avoid

> > > Neptune

> > > > > and Pluto,westren Astrologers attribute great significance

of

> > > these

> > > > > two outer planets.Still i believe that the kind of

> Shodasamasas

> > > we

> > > > > have developed can bring out comfortably various aspects of

> > life

> > > > > including the nature of old age through the aid of

divisional

> > > chart.

> > > > > > Keeping these aspects in mind,probably it is appropriate

> till

> > > > such

> > > > > that we are not able to deny Ayanamsa,particularly Lahiri's

> > > > Ayanamsa

> > > > > as useful for our purposes but we do not discount other

> > > approaches

> > > > > and certainly not their efficacy in predictions.

> > > > > > Certainly Astrology,particularly Vedic Astrology to

unfold

> > the

> > > > the

> > > > > future and past events will always remain to be connected

> with

> > > > > intution and if not the sixth sense.

> > > > > > In this we have umpteen examples including a 10year old

> > British

> > > > who

> > > > > could recollect from her class rom lessons to say the most

> > > unusual

> > > > > and catsrophic events like Tsunami.

> > > > > > Even Late B.V.raman makes it a point to refer to the

> accuracy

> > > to

> > > > > Brahma as the creator of universe.

> > > > > > Iam sure our distinguished members may have some more

> valuble

> > > > > suggestions on the subject.

> > > > > > Thanx

> > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > >

> > > > > > tw853 wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I fully agree with Vattem Krishnan not to venture myself

> into

> > > the

> > > > > > highly sensitive controversy of ayanamsa discussion. For

> > myself

> > > I

> > > > > use

> > > > > > new KP ayanamsa, while simultaneously respecting the

> personal

> > > > > > preferences of others.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Best wishes,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > tw

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , vattem krishnan

> > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > Hello Amitji,

> > > > > > > For some time I had the fortune of getting associated

> with

> > > > > Phalit

> > > > > > jyotish through Rastreeya Sanskrit Vidyapeeth,New Delhi.

> > > > > > > In the committee constituted by the Govt of India even

> late

> > > > Shri

> > > > > > B.V.Raman was also a member apart from several vedic

> scholars

> > > > from

> > > > > > Benares,Haridwar and other places.

> > > > > > > Even in these learned institutions research on the

> > subjectof

> > > > > > Ayanamsa is being caaried out.Most of these are guided

> > through

> > > > Prof

> > > > > > Kalyan Dutt Varma,who is now on the bed.Govt India and

> > several

> > > > > other

> > > > > > Govts too have supported the research and even built mini

> > > jantar-

> > > > > > mantars to calculate the movements of planets and study

the

> > > > motion

> > > > > of

> > > > > > earth.And these effects through research are getting

> > published

> > > in

> > > > > > Sanskrit.Infact even you can try from Tirupati university

> in

> > > > India.

> > > > > > > As far as relativity and percentage of usage of Lahiri

> > > > Ayanamsa.I

> > > > > > have no idea.So I go by your statstics.Incase you want to

> be

> > > sure

> > > > > > before you infer as :

> > > > > > > This is a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'

> > > > > > > Let us be sincere to find the relevance of Ayanamsa in

> > Helio

> > > > > > Centric Approach mostly followe by the westren

Astrologers.

> > > > > > > Infact what little I have understood from Hindu

> Predictive

> > > > > > Astrology through various approaches of Ganith jyotish,we

> > have

> > > > > three

> > > > > > different lagnas for harmonising the results arising out

> the

> > > > study

> > > > > of

> > > > > > natal chart in Astrology.Lagna,Surya as Lagna and mostly

> Moon

> > > as

> > > > > also

> > > > > > lagna.This approach has made us to depend on various

> > > mathematical

> > > > > > calculations and the relevance of Ayanmsa as a major

factor

> > of

> > > > > study

> > > > > > was taken up.

> > > > > > > In the case of westren Astrologers and their philosophy

> in

> > > > > handing

> > > > > > over good results without elaborate rules and the

approach

> of

> > > > vedic

> > > > > > Astrology based on the tripod(1,5and9) are to serve for

> > > different

> > > > > > sections of this great universe.We like or not the basic

of

> > our

> > > > > > philosophy in Astrology is related to Karma Siddhantam.

> > > > > > > In westren thoughts probably they believe in an

approach

> > > which

> > > > is

> > > > > > not deterministic but gives an opportunity for

> understanding

> > > what

> > > > > is

> > > > > > not possible but do not go beyond to say why it is not

> > possible.

> > > > > > > I agree with you when you say:

> > > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have

been

> > > quite

> > > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at

all

> > and

> > > > > work

> > > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not

just

> > one

> > > > or

> > > > > > two

> > > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results

> > > > > > > Is it not that Astrology has also an intutional element

> > where

> > > > > some

> > > > > > soothe sayers as pointed out by you can off hand predict

> any

> > > > thing?

> > > > > > > In India Astrology is making strides with the revival

> > towards

> > > > > Vedic

> > > > > > understanding and to find it's relevance in modern times

> and

> > in

> > > > > > futuristic studies.

> > > > > > > Incidentally I believed late B.V.Raman and Shri K.N Rao

> as

> > my

> > > > > great

> > > > > > Gurus bout for whose blessing I would not have ventured

> > myself

> > > in

> > > > > to

> > > > > > these highly sensitive areas of discussions.

> > > > > > > Thanx

> > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > rohiniranjan wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Please do not be personally offended but I have a bit

of

> > > > problem

> > > > > > > with "mostly" in your statement. Couple of years ago on

> his

> > > > > > newslist,

> > > > > > > I had asked Mr. Rao directly about how such a

conclusion

> > (he

> > > > had

> > > > > > also

> > > > > > > used a statement like "mostly" or 'universally') was

> > derived.

> > > > > Given

> > > > > > > that there must be millions of jyotishis in India

itself

> > and

> > > > the

> > > > > > > population growing like a family of rabbits all over

the

> > > globe,

> > > > > how

> > > > > > > can one make a statement like that unless a survey was

> > done.

> > > It

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > his greatness that he eventually responded saying that

> > > > somewhere

> > > > > (I

> > > > > > > think in Delhi or Poona) a group of panchaang makers (I

> > > recall

> > > > > less

> > > > > > > than 30 but I could be remembering it wrongly) had

> > > congregated

> > > > > with

> > > > > > > some govt. officials and through their deliberations

> > (details

> > > > of

> > > > > > > which I would be curious to learn but have no clue

where

> to

> > > > find

> > > > > > > those or if those were even published or made avaiable

to

> > > > anyone)

> > > > > > had

> > > > > > > come to the conclusion that chitra or chaitra ayanamsha

> is

> > > the

> > > > > one

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > be adopted. I never got the information as to how many

of

> > > these

> > > > > > fine

> > > > > > > individuals were actually jyotishis, or practiced

jyotish

> > > with

> > > > > any

> > > > > > > success during their lifetime.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Mr. Rao himself follows and recommends Lahiri ayanamsha

> > which

> > > > is

> > > > > > > pretty close to chitra ayanamsha and I believe he has

> > > mentioned

> > > > > > that

> > > > > > > he got good results with the ayanamsha and that this

was

> > > close

> > > > to

> > > > > > > what his astrological guru used/recommended and also

> close

> > to

> > > > the

> > > > > > > values that Mr. Karve the psychic who can tell your

time

> of

> > > > birth

> > > > > > > just by looking/talking to you, produced. Mr. Karve, it

> > seems

> > > > > > looked

> > > > > > > at you, and gave a lagna degree and the date and with

> > lahiri

> > > > > > > ayanamsha this value matched. Mr. Rao's students

probably

> > use

> > > > > only

> > > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsha but I have only interacted with a few

so

> > > > cannot

> > > > > > tell

> > > > > > > about the ultimate preferences of all.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > What we can say that the vocal majority on internet

> > probably

> > > > uses

> > > > > > > lahiri ayanamsha. If this list is a standard reference,

> > then

> > > > the

> > > > > > > vocal 'majority' represents less than 1% of the

> > participants

> > > > > (less

> > > > > > > than 26 who discuss jyotish, not counting those that

ask

> > for

> > > > > > readings

> > > > > > > only, OUT of some 2600 members). The same would be the

> > > > experience

> > > > > > in

> > > > > > > other list subpopulations (less than 1% talk, express,

> > > write).

> > > > So

> > > > > > one

> > > > > > > can safely assume that at least 1% or less of the

> > astrologers

> > > > > > (sorry

> > > > > > > Jyotishis!) claim to use Lahiri ayanamsha or a similar

> > value.

> > > > > This

> > > > > > is

> > > > > > > a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Mind you, I am not saying that Lahiri ayanamsha does

not

> > work

> > > > or

> > > > > > does

> > > > > > > or that there is necessarily a better ayanamsha. In

fact

> > > there

> > > > > are

> > > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have

been

> > > quite

> > > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at

all

> > and

> > > > > work

> > > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not

just

> > one

> > > > or

> > > > > > two

> > > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > There are a lot of myths and suppositions and claims

> > floating

> > > > > > around

> > > > > > > in the ocean of astrology about this or that being tge

> > > absolute

> > > > > > truth

> > > > > > > in the field of astrology in general and statements

such

> as

> > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > is good for predicting events and tropical better at

> > > describing

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > psyche, etc. As I have pointed out in some earlier

> written

> > > > > > articles,

> > > > > > > this is more a reflection of the person and his

> background

> > > who

> > > > > then

> > > > > > > went on to become an astrologer - the economist drawn

to

> > > > > > forecasting

> > > > > > > the markets, the doctor focussing on astrology of the

> > > diseases,

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > spiritualist seeing the spiritual map in the horoscope,

> the

> > > > > > > psychologist focusing on the psyche as revealed through

> the

> > > map.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > The beauty is that the same little map, or maybe a few

of

> > > these

> > > > > are

> > > > > > > capable of giving such a rich description of the human

> > > > > experience,

> > > > > > > the full spectrum of which has been beyond the scope of

> > > > > > comprehension

> > > > > > > of any one individual, whether astrologer, jyotishi,

> > > > > tarotomancer,

> > > > > > > scryer or some Guru yogi divine!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > RR

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > , "tw853"

> > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Dear amit_call,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP ayanamsa is

used

> > in

> > > KP

> > > > > > > > analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his books.

It's

> up

> > > to

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > preference of an individual astrologer.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Best regards,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa with

> > > > deg:min:sec

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > > advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book 2003, pp

1,

> 88-

> > > 93)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > , vattem

> krishnan

> > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > Ji Amitji,

> > > > > > > > > In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of

> discussions

> > > due

> > > > > to

> > > > > > > > differences it has been agreed that scietifically

> prudent

> > > to

> > > > > use

> > > > > > > > Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee constituted has

> also

> > > > > > > recommended

> > > > > > > > for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> > > > > > > > > Infact to add to list I also cite the research of

> Shri

> > > > > K.N.Rao

> > > > > > a

> > > > > > > > renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> > > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > amit_call wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > > > > > I have a confusion over Using different Ayamansas.

> > > > > > > > > Using different Ayamansas give different Charts.

> > > > > > > > > Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are different.

> > > > > > > > > Please guide me.

> > > > > > > > > Sincerely

> > > > > > > > > Amit

> > > > > > > > >

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Dear Amit,

For KSD planets must be moving towards Rahu. In reverse case it is said to be

KAD.

With best wishes,

Amitabh Shastri

 

amit_call <amit_call wrote:

 

 

Rohini ji

The details of native are:

 

DOB:10-Jun-1977

Time:04:00 A.M.

Place:Aligarh,U.P..27N54 78E04

The chart casted using Lahiri/KP ayamansa gives KSD while using Raman

Ayamansa it doesn't.

My Understanding of KSD is when all the Planets are between Rahu and

Ketu.

someWhere i read if Any planet joins Ketu or Rahu ..then it is not

KSD.In that case it will not be KSD.

If wrong pls correct me.

Sincerely

Amit kUmar

 

 

, "rohiniranjan"

wrote:

>

> Dear Amit,

>

> This sounds fascinating! Would you care to share the birthdata for

> the nativity that had KSD only with Lahiri ayanamsha?

>

> Thanks

>

> RR

>

> , "amit_call"

 

> wrote:

> >

> > Dear All,

> > I thank all the members for postings and throwing light on this

> > Ayamansa confusion.

> > This is accepted that Pridiction is one's own ability.

> > Also in a magazine of astrology i read a sloka which says "In

> > Kaliyuga only a few will be true astrologers and the best ones'

> > pridictive power will only manifest to 25%"

> > I do not remember the exact sloka but the meaning was same.

> > Also i want to add that some time back i met a Nadi Reader.

> > in Nadi i was amazed to see that they told my name,my parents

> > name ,some educational background,present condition and a little

> more.

> > also as per Nadi he made a chart and gave to me.

> > This chart is same as i get using Lahiri and KP Ayamansa.

> > Also one of my friend got a chance to meet a sidhha Purush in

> > Bulandshahar(U.P.).He is a young sanyasi.Looking at face he said

> > something about him..his problems and told that he was having

Kaal

> > Sarpa Dosha.

> > I was very new to astrology at that time.I started reading abt

KSD

> > and found that there was really KSD in his chart.

> > Now i see this chart is as per Lahiri Ayamansa.

> > Other Ayamansa give no KSD.

> > Well, its a matter of observation......

> > I have to observe in a time span which chart better explains my

> life

> > and which charts Dashas confirms the timing of events.

> > As i am new to astrology hence i was hesitating to adopt this

> > approach.

> > Also i sing with your lines "Intuition is great reliable tool".

> > Thanks

> > Sincerely

> > Amit Kumar

> >

> >

> > , Amitabh Shastri

> > wrote:

> > > Sorry for the delay in response. But you're right. It is the

man

> > behind the weapon who counts. The weapon is just a piece of

metal,

> > wood and other ingredients of which it is composed.

> > > The difference between innimate and animate needs to be

> understood

> > very clearly.

> > > Best wishes for a happy and prosperous new year.

> > > Amitabh Shastri

> > > rohiniranjan wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > > Yes -- that is my view too, fwiw.

> > >

> > > rr

> > >

> > > , "tw853" wrote:

> > > >

> > > > I hope one can use what WORKS for him as INDIVIDUAL

astrologer,

> > > while

> > > > simultaneously respecting the personal preferences of others.

> > > >

> > > > Best regards,

> > > >

> > > > tw

> > > >

> > > > , "rohiniranjan"

> > > > wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > I hope I am understanding you correctly, that your position

> is

> > > that

> > > > > no specific ayanamsha alone can explain all that astrology

> (as

> > we

> > > > > know it) explains. That there are more mysteries that lie,

> > > Horatio,

> > > > > between the heaven and earth? If so, then yes that is what

I

> > was

> > > > > saying all along, namely, that there are divinators that

> > > > successfully

> > > > > use different ayanamshas, and some that do not even use

> > > ayanamshas,

> > > > > so no point in agonizing over which ayanamsha is the only

> > > accurate

> > > > > one.

> > > > >

> > > > > Pardon my crude and cruel analogy, but the aiming sights on

a

> > > rifle

> > > > > while of tremendous help in improving the marksmanship,

would

> > > alone

> > > > > not make one an expert marksman! Ayanamsha is like

> that 'sight'

> > > > which

> > > > > definitely is helpful if trained at the target carefully,

> > > however,

> > > > > the marksman still must effectively learn to hold the rifle

> and

> > > > > improve their skills.

> > > > >

> > > > > Most practitioners (present company excepted of course!) in

> > > > astrology

> > > > > of any kind are at best figuring their way out of this

dense

> > > > forest,

> > > > > even if they may not be brave enough to admit. Your sage

> advice

> > > to

> > > > > not make ayanamsha a big deal is well-given and finds

accord

> in

> > > my

> > > > > own personal outlook. I respond only when I notice overt or

> > > covert

> > > > > insinuations that a given ayanamsha is somehow the best

> without

> > > no

> > > > > direct and ample proof for such, forthcoming.

> > > > >

> > > > > Happy New Year!

> > > > >

> > > > > RR

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > , vattem krishnan

> > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > Hello Rohiniji,

> > > > > > The Astronomical studies have confirmed ecliptical zodiac

> and

> > > the

> > > > > movements of the planets along with planets was never found

> to

> > be

> > > > > unform.So we have all confusions added to the changes being

> > > > witnessed

> > > > > in the planet earth due unpredicatable characterstics of

> > > Nature.I

> > > > do

> > > > > not know whether I can put that even the science finds it

> > > difficult

> > > > > to say in precise nature.May be Ayanamsa correction is a

> > specific

> > > > > approach from the fixed zodiac of Aries.Westren Astrology

> based

> > > on

> > > > > accptable solar system too may be able to solve the riddles

> of

> > > > human

> > > > > life and anticipated events.Even we in our Astrology avoid

> > > Neptune

> > > > > and Pluto,westren Astrologers attribute great significance

of

> > > these

> > > > > two outer planets.Still i believe that the kind of

> Shodasamasas

> > > we

> > > > > have developed can bring out comfortably various aspects of

> > life

> > > > > including the nature of old age through the aid of

divisional

> > > chart.

> > > > > > Keeping these aspects in mind,probably it is appropriate

> till

> > > > such

> > > > > that we are not able to deny Ayanamsa,particularly Lahiri's

> > > > Ayanamsa

> > > > > as useful for our purposes but we do not discount other

> > > approaches

> > > > > and certainly not their efficacy in predictions.

> > > > > > Certainly Astrology,particularly Vedic Astrology to

unfold

> > the

> > > > the

> > > > > future and past events will always remain to be connected

> with

> > > > > intution and if not the sixth sense.

> > > > > > In this we have umpteen examples including a 10year old

> > British

> > > > who

> > > > > could recollect from her class rom lessons to say the most

> > > unusual

> > > > > and catsrophic events like Tsunami.

> > > > > > Even Late B.V.raman makes it a point to refer to the

> accuracy

> > > to

> > > > > Brahma as the creator of universe.

> > > > > > Iam sure our distinguished members may have some more

> valuble

> > > > > suggestions on the subject.

> > > > > > Thanx

> > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > >

> > > > > > tw853 wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I fully agree with Vattem Krishnan not to venture myself

> into

> > > the

> > > > > > highly sensitive controversy of ayanamsa discussion. For

> > myself

> > > I

> > > > > use

> > > > > > new KP ayanamsa, while simultaneously respecting the

> personal

> > > > > > preferences of others.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Best wishes,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > tw

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , vattem krishnan

> > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > Hello Amitji,

> > > > > > > For some time I had the fortune of getting associated

> with

> > > > > Phalit

> > > > > > jyotish through Rastreeya Sanskrit Vidyapeeth,New Delhi.

> > > > > > > In the committee constituted by the Govt of India even

> late

> > > > Shri

> > > > > > B.V.Raman was also a member apart from several vedic

> scholars

> > > > from

> > > > > > Benares,Haridwar and other places.

> > > > > > > Even in these learned institutions research on the

> > subjectof

> > > > > > Ayanamsa is being caaried out.Most of these are guided

> > through

> > > > Prof

> > > > > > Kalyan Dutt Varma,who is now on the bed.Govt India and

> > several

> > > > > other

> > > > > > Govts too have supported the research and even built mini

> > > jantar-

> > > > > > mantars to calculate the movements of planets and study

the

> > > > motion

> > > > > of

> > > > > > earth.And these effects through research are getting

> > published

> > > in

> > > > > > Sanskrit.Infact even you can try from Tirupati university

> in

> > > > India.

> > > > > > > As far as relativity and percentage of usage of Lahiri

> > > > Ayanamsa.I

> > > > > > have no idea.So I go by your statstics.Incase you want to

> be

> > > sure

> > > > > > before you infer as :

> > > > > > > This is a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'

> > > > > > > Let us be sincere to find the relevance of Ayanamsa in

> > Helio

> > > > > > Centric Approach mostly followe by the westren

Astrologers.

> > > > > > > Infact what little I have understood from Hindu

> Predictive

> > > > > > Astrology through various approaches of Ganith jyotish,we

> > have

> > > > > three

> > > > > > different lagnas for harmonising the results arising out

> the

> > > > study

> > > > > of

> > > > > > natal chart in Astrology.Lagna,Surya as Lagna and mostly

> Moon

> > > as

> > > > > also

> > > > > > lagna.This approach has made us to depend on various

> > > mathematical

> > > > > > calculations and the relevance of Ayanmsa as a major

factor

> > of

> > > > > study

> > > > > > was taken up.

> > > > > > > In the case of westren Astrologers and their philosophy

> in

> > > > > handing

> > > > > > over good results without elaborate rules and the

approach

> of

> > > > vedic

> > > > > > Astrology based on the tripod(1,5and9) are to serve for

> > > different

> > > > > > sections of this great universe.We like or not the basic

of

> > our

> > > > > > philosophy in Astrology is related to Karma Siddhantam.

> > > > > > > In westren thoughts probably they believe in an

approach

> > > which

> > > > is

> > > > > > not deterministic but gives an opportunity for

> understanding

> > > what

> > > > > is

> > > > > > not possible but do not go beyond to say why it is not

> > possible.

> > > > > > > I agree with you when you say:

> > > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have

been

> > > quite

> > > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at

all

> > and

> > > > > work

> > > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not

just

> > one

> > > > or

> > > > > > two

> > > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results

> > > > > > > Is it not that Astrology has also an intutional element

> > where

> > > > > some

> > > > > > soothe sayers as pointed out by you can off hand predict

> any

> > > > thing?

> > > > > > > In India Astrology is making strides with the revival

> > towards

> > > > > Vedic

> > > > > > understanding and to find it's relevance in modern times

> and

> > in

> > > > > > futuristic studies.

> > > > > > > Incidentally I believed late B.V.Raman and Shri K.N Rao

> as

> > my

> > > > > great

> > > > > > Gurus bout for whose blessing I would not have ventured

> > myself

> > > in

> > > > > to

> > > > > > these highly sensitive areas of discussions.

> > > > > > > Thanx

> > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > rohiniranjan wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Please do not be personally offended but I have a bit

of

> > > > problem

> > > > > > > with "mostly" in your statement. Couple of years ago on

> his

> > > > > > newslist,

> > > > > > > I had asked Mr. Rao directly about how such a

conclusion

> > (he

> > > > had

> > > > > > also

> > > > > > > used a statement like "mostly" or 'universally') was

> > derived.

> > > > > Given

> > > > > > > that there must be millions of jyotishis in India

itself

> > and

> > > > the

> > > > > > > population growing like a family of rabbits all over

the

> > > globe,

> > > > > how

> > > > > > > can one make a statement like that unless a survey was

> > done.

> > > It

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > his greatness that he eventually responded saying that

> > > > somewhere

> > > > > (I

> > > > > > > think in Delhi or Poona) a group of panchaang makers (I

> > > recall

> > > > > less

> > > > > > > than 30 but I could be remembering it wrongly) had

> > > congregated

> > > > > with

> > > > > > > some govt. officials and through their deliberations

> > (details

> > > > of

> > > > > > > which I would be curious to learn but have no clue

where

> to

> > > > find

> > > > > > > those or if those were even published or made avaiable

to

> > > > anyone)

> > > > > > had

> > > > > > > come to the conclusion that chitra or chaitra ayanamsha

> is

> > > the

> > > > > one

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > be adopted. I never got the information as to how many

of

> > > these

> > > > > > fine

> > > > > > > individuals were actually jyotishis, or practiced

jyotish

> > > with

> > > > > any

> > > > > > > success during their lifetime.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Mr. Rao himself follows and recommends Lahiri ayanamsha

> > which

> > > > is

> > > > > > > pretty close to chitra ayanamsha and I believe he has

> > > mentioned

> > > > > > that

> > > > > > > he got good results with the ayanamsha and that this

was

> > > close

> > > > to

> > > > > > > what his astrological guru used/recommended and also

> close

> > to

> > > > the

> > > > > > > values that Mr. Karve the psychic who can tell your

time

> of

> > > > birth

> > > > > > > just by looking/talking to you, produced. Mr. Karve, it

> > seems

> > > > > > looked

> > > > > > > at you, and gave a lagna degree and the date and with

> > lahiri

> > > > > > > ayanamsha this value matched. Mr. Rao's students

probably

> > use

> > > > > only

> > > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsha but I have only interacted with a few

so

> > > > cannot

> > > > > > tell

> > > > > > > about the ultimate preferences of all.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > What we can say that the vocal majority on internet

> > probably

> > > > uses

> > > > > > > lahiri ayanamsha. If this list is a standard reference,

> > then

> > > > the

> > > > > > > vocal 'majority' represents less than 1% of the

> > participants

> > > > > (less

> > > > > > > than 26 who discuss jyotish, not counting those that

ask

> > for

> > > > > > readings

> > > > > > > only, OUT of some 2600 members). The same would be the

> > > > experience

> > > > > > in

> > > > > > > other list subpopulations (less than 1% talk, express,

> > > write).

> > > > So

> > > > > > one

> > > > > > > can safely assume that at least 1% or less of the

> > astrologers

> > > > > > (sorry

> > > > > > > Jyotishis!) claim to use Lahiri ayanamsha or a similar

> > value.

> > > > > This

> > > > > > is

> > > > > > > a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Mind you, I am not saying that Lahiri ayanamsha does

not

> > work

> > > > or

> > > > > > does

> > > > > > > or that there is necessarily a better ayanamsha. In

fact

> > > there

> > > > > are

> > > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have

been

> > > quite

> > > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at

all

> > and

> > > > > work

> > > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not

just

> > one

> > > > or

> > > > > > two

> > > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > There are a lot of myths and suppositions and claims

> > floating

> > > > > > around

> > > > > > > in the ocean of astrology about this or that being tge

> > > absolute

> > > > > > truth

> > > > > > > in the field of astrology in general and statements

such

> as

> > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > is good for predicting events and tropical better at

> > > describing

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > psyche, etc. As I have pointed out in some earlier

> written

> > > > > > articles,

> > > > > > > this is more a reflection of the person and his

> background

> > > who

> > > > > then

> > > > > > > went on to become an astrologer - the economist drawn

to

> > > > > > forecasting

> > > > > > > the markets, the doctor focussing on astrology of the

> > > diseases,

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > spiritualist seeing the spiritual map in the horoscope,

> the

> > > > > > > psychologist focusing on the psyche as revealed through

> the

> > > map.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > The beauty is that the same little map, or maybe a few

of

> > > these

> > > > > are

> > > > > > > capable of giving such a rich description of the human

> > > > > experience,

> > > > > > > the full spectrum of which has been beyond the scope of

> > > > > > comprehension

> > > > > > > of any one individual, whether astrologer, jyotishi,

> > > > > tarotomancer,

> > > > > > > scryer or some Guru yogi divine!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > RR

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > , "tw853"

> > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Dear amit_call,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP ayanamsa is

used

> > in

> > > KP

> > > > > > > > analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his books.

It's

> up

> > > to

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > preference of an individual astrologer.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Best regards,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa with

> > > > deg:min:sec

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > > advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book 2003, pp

1,

> 88-

> > > 93)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > , vattem

> krishnan

> > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > Ji Amitji,

> > > > > > > > > In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of

> discussions

> > > due

> > > > > to

> > > > > > > > differences it has been agreed that scietifically

> prudent

> > > to

> > > > > use

> > > > > > > > Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee constituted has

> also

> > > > > > > recommended

> > > > > > > > for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> > > > > > > > > Infact to add to list I also cite the research of

> Shri

> > > > > K.N.Rao

> > > > > > a

> > > > > > > > renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> > > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > amit_call wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > > > > > I have a confusion over Using different Ayamansas.

> > > > > > > > > Using different Ayamansas give different Charts.

> > > > > > > > > Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are different.

> > > > > > > > > Please guide me.

> > > > > > > > > Sincerely

> > > > > > > > > Amit

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !

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> > > Terms

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> > > > > > > > Service.

> > > > > > > > >

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> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > All your favorites on one personal page – Try My

>

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

 

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A slight amendment - all planets must be placed between Rahu and Ketu and moving

towards Rahu.

 

Amitabh Shastri <amitabh_shastri wrote:To:

 

Amitabh Shastri

Tue, 4 Jan 2005 15:10:13 +0000 (GMT)

Re: Ayamansa Confusion

 

 

Dear Amit,

For KSD planets must be moving towards Rahu. In reverse case it is said to be

KAD.

With best wishes,

Amitabh Shastri

 

amit_call wrote:

 

 

Rohini ji

The details of native are:

 

DOB:10-Jun-1977

Time:04:00 A.M.

Place:Aligarh,U.P..27N54 78E04

The chart casted using Lahiri/KP ayamansa gives KSD while using Raman

Ayamansa it doesn't.

My Understanding of KSD is when all the Planets are between Rahu and

Ketu.

someWhere i read if Any planet joins Ketu or Rahu ..then it is not

KSD.In that case it will not be KSD.

If wrong pls correct me.

Sincerely

Amit kUmar

 

 

, "rohiniranjan"

wrote:

>

> Dear Amit,

>

> This sounds fascinating! Would you care to share the birthdata for

> the nativity that had KSD only with Lahiri ayanamsha?

>

> Thanks

>

> RR

>

> , "amit_call"

 

> wrote:

> >

> > Dear All,

> > I thank all the members for postings and throwing light on this

> > Ayamansa confusion.

> > This is accepted that Pridiction is one's own ability.

> > Also in a magazine of astrology i read a sloka which says "In

> > Kaliyuga only a few will be true astrologers and the best ones'

> > pridictive power will only manifest to 25%"

> > I do not remember the exact sloka but the meaning was same.

> > Also i want to add that some time back i met a Nadi Reader.

> > in Nadi i was amazed to see that they told my name,my parents

> > name ,some educational background,present condition and a little

> more.

> > also as per Nadi he made a chart and gave to me.

> > This chart is same as i get using Lahiri and KP Ayamansa.

> > Also one of my friend got a chance to meet a sidhha Purush in

> > Bulandshahar(U.P.).He is a young sanyasi.Looking at face he said

> > something about him..his problems and told that he was having

Kaal

> > Sarpa Dosha.

> > I was very new to astrology at that time.I started reading abt

KSD

> > and found that there was really KSD in his chart.

> > Now i see this chart is as per Lahiri Ayamansa.

> > Other Ayamansa give no KSD.

> > Well, its a matter of observation......

> > I have to observe in a time span which chart better explains my

> life

> > and which charts Dashas confirms the timing of events.

> > As i am new to astrology hence i was hesitating to adopt this

> > approach.

> > Also i sing with your lines "Intuition is great reliable tool".

> > Thanks

> > Sincerely

> > Amit Kumar

> >

> >

> > , Amitabh Shastri

> > wrote:

> > > Sorry for the delay in response. But you're right. It is the

man

> > behind the weapon who counts. The weapon is just a piece of

metal,

> > wood and other ingredients of which it is composed.

> > > The difference between innimate and animate needs to be

> understood

> > very clearly.

> > > Best wishes for a happy and prosperous new year.

> > > Amitabh Shastri

> > > rohiniranjan wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > > Yes -- that is my view too, fwiw.

> > >

> > > rr

> > >

> > > , "tw853" wrote:

> > > >

> > > > I hope one can use what WORKS for him as INDIVIDUAL

astrologer,

> > > while

> > > > simultaneously respecting the personal preferences of others.

> > > >

> > > > Best regards,

> > > >

> > > > tw

> > > >

> > > > , "rohiniranjan"

> > > > wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > I hope I am understanding you correctly, that your position

> is

> > > that

> > > > > no specific ayanamsha alone can explain all that astrology

> (as

> > we

> > > > > know it) explains. That there are more mysteries that lie,

> > > Horatio,

> > > > > between the heaven and earth? If so, then yes that is what

I

> > was

> > > > > saying all along, namely, that there are divinators that

> > > > successfully

> > > > > use different ayanamshas, and some that do not even use

> > > ayanamshas,

> > > > > so no point in agonizing over which ayanamsha is the only

> > > accurate

> > > > > one.

> > > > >

> > > > > Pardon my crude and cruel analogy, but the aiming sights on

a

> > > rifle

> > > > > while of tremendous help in improving the marksmanship,

would

> > > alone

> > > > > not make one an expert marksman! Ayanamsha is like

> that 'sight'

> > > > which

> > > > > definitely is helpful if trained at the target carefully,

> > > however,

> > > > > the marksman still must effectively learn to hold the rifle

> and

> > > > > improve their skills.

> > > > >

> > > > > Most practitioners (present company excepted of course!) in

> > > > astrology

> > > > > of any kind are at best figuring their way out of this

dense

> > > > forest,

> > > > > even if they may not be brave enough to admit. Your sage

> advice

> > > to

> > > > > not make ayanamsha a big deal is well-given and finds

accord

> in

> > > my

> > > > > own personal outlook. I respond only when I notice overt or

> > > covert

> > > > > insinuations that a given ayanamsha is somehow the best

> without

> > > no

> > > > > direct and ample proof for such, forthcoming.

> > > > >

> > > > > Happy New Year!

> > > > >

> > > > > RR

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > , vattem krishnan

> > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > Hello Rohiniji,

> > > > > > The Astronomical studies have confirmed ecliptical zodiac

> and

> > > the

> > > > > movements of the planets along with planets was never found

> to

> > be

> > > > > unform.So we have all confusions added to the changes being

> > > > witnessed

> > > > > in the planet earth due unpredicatable characterstics of

> > > Nature.I

> > > > do

> > > > > not know whether I can put that even the science finds it

> > > difficult

> > > > > to say in precise nature.May be Ayanamsa correction is a

> > specific

> > > > > approach from the fixed zodiac of Aries.Westren Astrology

> based

> > > on

> > > > > accptable solar system too may be able to solve the riddles

> of

> > > > human

> > > > > life and anticipated events.Even we in our Astrology avoid

> > > Neptune

> > > > > and Pluto,westren Astrologers attribute great significance

of

> > > these

> > > > > two outer planets.Still i believe that the kind of

> Shodasamasas

> > > we

> > > > > have developed can bring out comfortably various aspects of

> > life

> > > > > including the nature of old age through the aid of

divisional

> > > chart.

> > > > > > Keeping these aspects in mind,probably it is appropriate

> till

> > > > such

> > > > > that we are not able to deny Ayanamsa,particularly Lahiri's

> > > > Ayanamsa

> > > > > as useful for our purposes but we do not discount other

> > > approaches

> > > > > and certainly not their efficacy in predictions.

> > > > > > Certainly Astrology,particularly Vedic Astrology to

unfold

> > the

> > > > the

> > > > > future and past events will always remain to be connected

> with

> > > > > intution and if not the sixth sense.

> > > > > > In this we have umpteen examples including a 10year old

> > British

> > > > who

> > > > > could recollect from her class rom lessons to say the most

> > > unusual

> > > > > and catsrophic events like Tsunami.

> > > > > > Even Late B.V.raman makes it a point to refer to the

> accuracy

> > > to

> > > > > Brahma as the creator of universe.

> > > > > > Iam sure our distinguished members may have some more

> valuble

> > > > > suggestions on the subject.

> > > > > > Thanx

> > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > >

> > > > > > tw853 wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I fully agree with Vattem Krishnan not to venture myself

> into

> > > the

> > > > > > highly sensitive controversy of ayanamsa discussion. For

> > myself

> > > I

> > > > > use

> > > > > > new KP ayanamsa, while simultaneously respecting the

> personal

> > > > > > preferences of others.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Best wishes,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > tw

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , vattem krishnan

> > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > Hello Amitji,

> > > > > > > For some time I had the fortune of getting associated

> with

> > > > > Phalit

> > > > > > jyotish through Rastreeya Sanskrit Vidyapeeth,New Delhi.

> > > > > > > In the committee constituted by the Govt of India even

> late

> > > > Shri

> > > > > > B.V.Raman was also a member apart from several vedic

> scholars

> > > > from

> > > > > > Benares,Haridwar and other places.

> > > > > > > Even in these learned institutions research on the

> > subjectof

> > > > > > Ayanamsa is being caaried out.Most of these are guided

> > through

> > > > Prof

> > > > > > Kalyan Dutt Varma,who is now on the bed.Govt India and

> > several

> > > > > other

> > > > > > Govts too have supported the research and even built mini

> > > jantar-

> > > > > > mantars to calculate the movements of planets and study

the

> > > > motion

> > > > > of

> > > > > > earth.And these effects through research are getting

> > published

> > > in

> > > > > > Sanskrit.Infact even you can try from Tirupati university

> in

> > > > India.

> > > > > > > As far as relativity and percentage of usage of Lahiri

> > > > Ayanamsa.I

> > > > > > have no idea.So I go by your statstics.Incase you want to

> be

> > > sure

> > > > > > before you infer as :

> > > > > > > This is a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'

> > > > > > > Let us be sincere to find the relevance of Ayanamsa in

> > Helio

> > > > > > Centric Approach mostly followe by the westren

Astrologers.

> > > > > > > Infact what little I have understood from Hindu

> Predictive

> > > > > > Astrology through various approaches of Ganith jyotish,we

> > have

> > > > > three

> > > > > > different lagnas for harmonising the results arising out

> the

> > > > study

> > > > > of

> > > > > > natal chart in Astrology.Lagna,Surya as Lagna and mostly

> Moon

> > > as

> > > > > also

> > > > > > lagna.This approach has made us to depend on various

> > > mathematical

> > > > > > calculations and the relevance of Ayanmsa as a major

factor

> > of

> > > > > study

> > > > > > was taken up.

> > > > > > > In the case of westren Astrologers and their philosophy

> in

> > > > > handing

> > > > > > over good results without elaborate rules and the

approach

> of

> > > > vedic

> > > > > > Astrology based on the tripod(1,5and9) are to serve for

> > > different

> > > > > > sections of this great universe.We like or not the basic

of

> > our

> > > > > > philosophy in Astrology is related to Karma Siddhantam.

> > > > > > > In westren thoughts probably they believe in an

approach

> > > which

> > > > is

> > > > > > not deterministic but gives an opportunity for

> understanding

> > > what

> > > > > is

> > > > > > not possible but do not go beyond to say why it is not

> > possible.

> > > > > > > I agree with you when you say:

> > > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have

been

> > > quite

> > > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at

all

> > and

> > > > > work

> > > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not

just

> > one

> > > > or

> > > > > > two

> > > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results

> > > > > > > Is it not that Astrology has also an intutional element

> > where

> > > > > some

> > > > > > soothe sayers as pointed out by you can off hand predict

> any

> > > > thing?

> > > > > > > In India Astrology is making strides with the revival

> > towards

> > > > > Vedic

> > > > > > understanding and to find it's relevance in modern times

> and

> > in

> > > > > > futuristic studies.

> > > > > > > Incidentally I believed late B.V.Raman and Shri K.N Rao

> as

> > my

> > > > > great

> > > > > > Gurus bout for whose blessing I would not have ventured

> > myself

> > > in

> > > > > to

> > > > > > these highly sensitive areas of discussions.

> > > > > > > Thanx

> > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > rohiniranjan wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Please do not be personally offended but I have a bit

of

> > > > problem

> > > > > > > with "mostly" in your statement. Couple of years ago on

> his

> > > > > > newslist,

> > > > > > > I had asked Mr. Rao directly about how such a

conclusion

> > (he

> > > > had

> > > > > > also

> > > > > > > used a statement like "mostly" or 'universally') was

> > derived.

> > > > > Given

> > > > > > > that there must be millions of jyotishis in India

itself

> > and

> > > > the

> > > > > > > population growing like a family of rabbits all over

the

> > > globe,

> > > > > how

> > > > > > > can one make a statement like that unless a survey was

> > done.

> > > It

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > his greatness that he eventually responded saying that

> > > > somewhere

> > > > > (I

> > > > > > > think in Delhi or Poona) a group of panchaang makers (I

> > > recall

> > > > > less

> > > > > > > than 30 but I could be remembering it wrongly) had

> > > congregated

> > > > > with

> > > > > > > some govt. officials and through their deliberations

> > (details

> > > > of

> > > > > > > which I would be curious to learn but have no clue

where

> to

> > > > find

> > > > > > > those or if those were even published or made avaiable

to

> > > > anyone)

> > > > > > had

> > > > > > > come to the conclusion that chitra or chaitra ayanamsha

> is

> > > the

> > > > > one

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > be adopted. I never got the information as to how many

of

> > > these

> > > > > > fine

> > > > > > > individuals were actually jyotishis, or practiced

jyotish

> > > with

> > > > > any

> > > > > > > success during their lifetime.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Mr. Rao himself follows and recommends Lahiri ayanamsha

> > which

> > > > is

> > > > > > > pretty close to chitra ayanamsha and I believe he has

> > > mentioned

> > > > > > that

> > > > > > > he got good results with the ayanamsha and that this

was

> > > close

> > > > to

> > > > > > > what his astrological guru used/recommended and also

> close

> > to

> > > > the

> > > > > > > values that Mr. Karve the psychic who can tell your

time

> of

> > > > birth

> > > > > > > just by looking/talking to you, produced. Mr. Karve, it

> > seems

> > > > > > looked

> > > > > > > at you, and gave a lagna degree and the date and with

> > lahiri

> > > > > > > ayanamsha this value matched. Mr. Rao's students

probably

> > use

> > > > > only

> > > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsha but I have only interacted with a few

so

> > > > cannot

> > > > > > tell

> > > > > > > about the ultimate preferences of all.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > What we can say that the vocal majority on internet

> > probably

> > > > uses

> > > > > > > lahiri ayanamsha. If this list is a standard reference,

> > then

> > > > the

> > > > > > > vocal 'majority' represents less than 1% of the

> > participants

> > > > > (less

> > > > > > > than 26 who discuss jyotish, not counting those that

ask

> > for

> > > > > > readings

> > > > > > > only, OUT of some 2600 members). The same would be the

> > > > experience

> > > > > > in

> > > > > > > other list subpopulations (less than 1% talk, express,

> > > write).

> > > > So

> > > > > > one

> > > > > > > can safely assume that at least 1% or less of the

> > astrologers

> > > > > > (sorry

> > > > > > > Jyotishis!) claim to use Lahiri ayanamsha or a similar

> > value.

> > > > > This

> > > > > > is

> > > > > > > a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Mind you, I am not saying that Lahiri ayanamsha does

not

> > work

> > > > or

> > > > > > does

> > > > > > > or that there is necessarily a better ayanamsha. In

fact

> > > there

> > > > > are

> > > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have

been

> > > quite

> > > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at

all

> > and

> > > > > work

> > > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not

just

> > one

> > > > or

> > > > > > two

> > > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > There are a lot of myths and suppositions and claims

> > floating

> > > > > > around

> > > > > > > in the ocean of astrology about this or that being tge

> > > absolute

> > > > > > truth

> > > > > > > in the field of astrology in general and statements

such

> as

> > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > is good for predicting events and tropical better at

> > > describing

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > psyche, etc. As I have pointed out in some earlier

> written

> > > > > > articles,

> > > > > > > this is more a reflection of the person and his

> background

> > > who

> > > > > then

> > > > > > > went on to become an astrologer - the economist drawn

to

> > > > > > forecasting

> > > > > > > the markets, the doctor focussing on astrology of the

> > > diseases,

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > spiritualist seeing the spiritual map in the horoscope,

> the

> > > > > > > psychologist focusing on the psyche as revealed through

> the

> > > map.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > The beauty is that the same little map, or maybe a few

of

> > > these

> > > > > are

> > > > > > > capable of giving such a rich description of the human

> > > > > experience,

> > > > > > > the full spectrum of which has been beyond the scope of

> > > > > > comprehension

> > > > > > > of any one individual, whether astrologer, jyotishi,

> > > > > tarotomancer,

> > > > > > > scryer or some Guru yogi divine!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > RR

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > , "tw853"

> > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Dear amit_call,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP ayanamsa is

used

> > in

> > > KP

> > > > > > > > analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his books.

It's

> up

> > > to

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > preference of an individual astrologer.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Best regards,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa with

> > > > deg:min:sec

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > > advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book 2003, pp

1,

> 88-

> > > 93)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > , vattem

> krishnan

> > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > Ji Amitji,

> > > > > > > > > In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of

> discussions

> > > due

> > > > > to

> > > > > > > > differences it has been agreed that scietifically

> prudent

> > > to

> > > > > use

> > > > > > > > Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee constituted has

> also

> > > > > > > recommended

> > > > > > > > for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> > > > > > > > > Infact to add to list I also cite the research of

> Shri

> > > > > K.N.Rao

> > > > > > a

> > > > > > > > renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> > > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > amit_call wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > > > > > I have a confusion over Using different Ayamansas.

> > > > > > > > > Using different Ayamansas give different Charts.

> > > > > > > > > Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are different.

> > > > > > > > > Please guide me.

> > > > > > > > > Sincerely

> > > > > > > > > Amit

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !

~

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sponsor

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Links

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > /

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > Terms

> > > > > of

> > > > > > > > Service.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > All your favorites on one personal page – Try My

>

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

 

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With lahiri, moon is in the same rashi as ketu, both whether using

true or mean nodes. KSY does not exist

With Raman nodes change sign, but cancellation exists same way with

other planets.

 

Please be careful when using KSY to explain mishaps or other things.

KSY is not an unconditional jail sentance and all troubles cannot and

should not be explained based on KSY, full or partial, perceived or

manifest.

 

Does the person have a very sensitive nature, lacks strong self-

esteem and around early 2001 began to show somewhat deviation from

his normal personality? Trying new and different things, some not

positive at all?

 

Sexual problems (I realize that is a large net) prior to that, and

problems with 'fitting in' into groups, feeling ill-understood by

others and similar issues?

 

Impulsive and rather grandiose expenditures and extreme restlessness

in spirit and one who would be happier and better performer in wide

open spaces rather than confining situations? Like in a progressive

society, abroad?

 

Restless sleep, dreams of a restless, active, anxious nature?

 

Major issues with or concerning elder siblings if they exist,

particularly an elder sister or cousin sister?

 

, "amit_call" <amit_call>

wrote:

>

> Rohini ji

> The details of native are:

>

> DOB:10-Jun-1977

> Time:04:00 A.M.

> Place:Aligarh,U.P..27N54 78E04

> The chart casted using Lahiri/KP ayamansa gives KSD while using

Raman

> Ayamansa it doesn't.

> My Understanding of KSD is when all the Planets are between Rahu

and

> Ketu.

> someWhere i read if Any planet joins Ketu or Rahu ..then it is not

> KSD.In that case it will not be KSD.

> If wrong pls correct me.

> Sincerely

> Amit kUmar

>

>

> , "rohiniranjan" <rrgb@s...>

> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Amit,

> >

> > This sounds fascinating! Would you care to share the birthdata

for

> > the nativity that had KSD only with Lahiri ayanamsha?

> >

> > Thanks

> >

> > RR

> >

> > , "amit_call"

> <amit_call>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear All,

> > > I thank all the members for postings and throwing light on this

> > > Ayamansa confusion.

> > > This is accepted that Pridiction is one's own ability.

> > > Also in a magazine of astrology i read a sloka which says "In

> > > Kaliyuga only a few will be true astrologers and the best ones'

> > > pridictive power will only manifest to 25%"

> > > I do not remember the exact sloka but the meaning was same.

> > > Also i want to add that some time back i met a Nadi Reader.

> > > in Nadi i was amazed to see that they told my name,my parents

> > > name ,some educational background,present condition and a

little

> > more.

> > > also as per Nadi he made a chart and gave to me.

> > > This chart is same as i get using Lahiri and KP Ayamansa.

> > > Also one of my friend got a chance to meet a sidhha Purush in

> > > Bulandshahar(U.P.).He is a young sanyasi.Looking at face he

said

> > > something about him..his problems and told that he was having

> Kaal

> > > Sarpa Dosha.

> > > I was very new to astrology at that time.I started reading abt

> KSD

> > > and found that there was really KSD in his chart.

> > > Now i see this chart is as per Lahiri Ayamansa.

> > > Other Ayamansa give no KSD.

> > > Well, its a matter of observation......

> > > I have to observe in a time span which chart better explains my

> > life

> > > and which charts Dashas confirms the timing of events.

> > > As i am new to astrology hence i was hesitating to adopt this

> > > approach.

> > > Also i sing with your lines "Intuition is great reliable tool".

> > > Thanks

> > > Sincerely

> > > Amit Kumar

> > >

> > >

> > > , Amitabh Shastri

> > > <amitabh_shastri> wrote:

> > > > Sorry for the delay in response. But you're right. It is the

> man

> > > behind the weapon who counts. The weapon is just a piece of

> metal,

> > > wood and other ingredients of which it is composed.

> > > > The difference between innimate and animate needs to be

> > understood

> > > very clearly.

> > > > Best wishes for a happy and prosperous new year.

> > > > Amitabh Shastri

> > > > rohiniranjan <rrgb@s...> wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Yes -- that is my view too, fwiw.

> > > >

> > > > rr

> > > >

> > > > , "tw853" wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > I hope one can use what WORKS for him as INDIVIDUAL

> astrologer,

> > > > while

> > > > > simultaneously respecting the personal preferences of

others.

> > > > >

> > > > > Best regards,

> > > > >

> > > > > tw

> > > > >

> > > > > , "rohiniranjan"

> > > > > wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I hope I am understanding you correctly, that your

position

> > is

> > > > that

> > > > > > no specific ayanamsha alone can explain all that

astrology

> > (as

> > > we

> > > > > > know it) explains. That there are more mysteries that

lie,

> > > > Horatio,

> > > > > > between the heaven and earth? If so, then yes that is

what

> I

> > > was

> > > > > > saying all along, namely, that there are divinators that

> > > > > successfully

> > > > > > use different ayanamshas, and some that do not even use

> > > > ayanamshas,

> > > > > > so no point in agonizing over which ayanamsha is the only

> > > > accurate

> > > > > > one.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Pardon my crude and cruel analogy, but the aiming sights

on

> a

> > > > rifle

> > > > > > while of tremendous help in improving the marksmanship,

> would

> > > > alone

> > > > > > not make one an expert marksman! Ayanamsha is like

> > that 'sight'

> > > > > which

> > > > > > definitely is helpful if trained at the target carefully,

> > > > however,

> > > > > > the marksman still must effectively learn to hold the

rifle

> > and

> > > > > > improve their skills.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Most practitioners (present company excepted of course!)

in

> > > > > astrology

> > > > > > of any kind are at best figuring their way out of this

> dense

> > > > > forest,

> > > > > > even if they may not be brave enough to admit. Your sage

> > advice

> > > > to

> > > > > > not make ayanamsha a big deal is well-given and finds

> accord

> > in

> > > > my

> > > > > > own personal outlook. I respond only when I notice overt

or

> > > > covert

> > > > > > insinuations that a given ayanamsha is somehow the best

> > without

> > > > no

> > > > > > direct and ample proof for such, forthcoming.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Happy New Year!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > RR

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , vattem krishnan

> > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > Hello Rohiniji,

> > > > > > > The Astronomical studies have confirmed ecliptical

zodiac

> > and

> > > > the

> > > > > > movements of the planets along with planets was never

found

> > to

> > > be

> > > > > > unform.So we have all confusions added to the changes

being

> > > > > witnessed

> > > > > > in the planet earth due unpredicatable characterstics of

> > > > Nature.I

> > > > > do

> > > > > > not know whether I can put that even the science finds it

> > > > difficult

> > > > > > to say in precise nature.May be Ayanamsa correction is a

> > > specific

> > > > > > approach from the fixed zodiac of Aries.Westren Astrology

> > based

> > > > on

> > > > > > accptable solar system too may be able to solve the

riddles

> > of

> > > > > human

> > > > > > life and anticipated events.Even we in our Astrology

avoid

> > > > Neptune

> > > > > > and Pluto,westren Astrologers attribute great

significance

> of

> > > > these

> > > > > > two outer planets.Still i believe that the kind of

> > Shodasamasas

> > > > we

> > > > > > have developed can bring out comfortably various aspects

of

> > > life

> > > > > > including the nature of old age through the aid of

> divisional

> > > > chart.

> > > > > > > Keeping these aspects in mind,probably it is

appropriate

> > till

> > > > > such

> > > > > > that we are not able to deny Ayanamsa,particularly

Lahiri's

> > > > > Ayanamsa

> > > > > > as useful for our purposes but we do not discount other

> > > > approaches

> > > > > > and certainly not their efficacy in predictions.

> > > > > > > Certainly Astrology,particularly Vedic Astrology to

> unfold

> > > the

> > > > > the

> > > > > > future and past events will always remain to be connected

> > with

> > > > > > intution and if not the sixth sense.

> > > > > > > In this we have umpteen examples including a 10year old

> > > British

> > > > > who

> > > > > > could recollect from her class rom lessons to say the

most

> > > > unusual

> > > > > > and catsrophic events like Tsunami.

> > > > > > > Even Late B.V.raman makes it a point to refer to the

> > accuracy

> > > > to

> > > > > > Brahma as the creator of universe.

> > > > > > > Iam sure our distinguished members may have some more

> > valuble

> > > > > > suggestions on the subject.

> > > > > > > Thanx

> > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > tw853 wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I fully agree with Vattem Krishnan not to venture

myself

> > into

> > > > the

> > > > > > > highly sensitive controversy of ayanamsa discussion.

For

> > > myself

> > > > I

> > > > > > use

> > > > > > > new KP ayanamsa, while simultaneously respecting the

> > personal

> > > > > > > preferences of others.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Best wishes,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > , vattem

krishnan

> > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > Hello Amitji,

> > > > > > > > For some time I had the fortune of getting associated

> > with

> > > > > > Phalit

> > > > > > > jyotish through Rastreeya Sanskrit Vidyapeeth,New Delhi.

> > > > > > > > In the committee constituted by the Govt of India

even

> > late

> > > > > Shri

> > > > > > > B.V.Raman was also a member apart from several vedic

> > scholars

> > > > > from

> > > > > > > Benares,Haridwar and other places.

> > > > > > > > Even in these learned institutions research on the

> > > subjectof

> > > > > > > Ayanamsa is being caaried out.Most of these are guided

> > > through

> > > > > Prof

> > > > > > > Kalyan Dutt Varma,who is now on the bed.Govt India and

> > > several

> > > > > > other

> > > > > > > Govts too have supported the research and even built

mini

> > > > jantar-

> > > > > > > mantars to calculate the movements of planets and study

> the

> > > > > motion

> > > > > > of

> > > > > > > earth.And these effects through research are getting

> > > published

> > > > in

> > > > > > > Sanskrit.Infact even you can try from Tirupati

university

> > in

> > > > > India.

> > > > > > > > As far as relativity and percentage of usage of

Lahiri

> > > > > Ayanamsa.I

> > > > > > > have no idea.So I go by your statstics.Incase you want

to

> > be

> > > > sure

> > > > > > > before you infer as :

> > > > > > > > This is a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'

> > > > > > > > Let us be sincere to find the relevance of Ayanamsa

in

> > > Helio

> > > > > > > Centric Approach mostly followe by the westren

> Astrologers.

> > > > > > > > Infact what little I have understood from Hindu

> > Predictive

> > > > > > > Astrology through various approaches of Ganith

jyotish,we

> > > have

> > > > > > three

> > > > > > > different lagnas for harmonising the results arising

out

> > the

> > > > > study

> > > > > > of

> > > > > > > natal chart in Astrology.Lagna,Surya as Lagna and

mostly

> > Moon

> > > > as

> > > > > > also

> > > > > > > lagna.This approach has made us to depend on various

> > > > mathematical

> > > > > > > calculations and the relevance of Ayanmsa as a major

> factor

> > > of

> > > > > > study

> > > > > > > was taken up.

> > > > > > > > In the case of westren Astrologers and their

philosophy

> > in

> > > > > > handing

> > > > > > > over good results without elaborate rules and the

> approach

> > of

> > > > > vedic

> > > > > > > Astrology based on the tripod(1,5and9) are to serve for

> > > > different

> > > > > > > sections of this great universe.We like or not the

basic

> of

> > > our

> > > > > > > philosophy in Astrology is related to Karma Siddhantam.

> > > > > > > > In westren thoughts probably they believe in an

> approach

> > > > which

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > not deterministic but gives an opportunity for

> > understanding

> > > > what

> > > > > > is

> > > > > > > not possible but do not go beyond to say why it is not

> > > possible.

> > > > > > > > I agree with you when you say:

> > > > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have

> been

> > > > quite

> > > > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at

> all

> > > and

> > > > > > work

> > > > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not

> just

> > > one

> > > > > or

> > > > > > > two

> > > > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results

> > > > > > > > Is it not that Astrology has also an intutional

element

> > > where

> > > > > > some

> > > > > > > soothe sayers as pointed out by you can off hand

predict

> > any

> > > > > thing?

> > > > > > > > In India Astrology is making strides with the revival

> > > towards

> > > > > > Vedic

> > > > > > > understanding and to find it's relevance in modern

times

> > and

> > > in

> > > > > > > futuristic studies.

> > > > > > > > Incidentally I believed late B.V.Raman and Shri K.N

Rao

> > as

> > > my

> > > > > > great

> > > > > > > Gurus bout for whose blessing I would not have ventured

> > > myself

> > > > in

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > these highly sensitive areas of discussions.

> > > > > > > > Thanx

> > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > rohiniranjan wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Please do not be personally offended but I have a bit

> of

> > > > > problem

> > > > > > > > with "mostly" in your statement. Couple of years ago

on

> > his

> > > > > > > newslist,

> > > > > > > > I had asked Mr. Rao directly about how such a

> conclusion

> > > (he

> > > > > had

> > > > > > > also

> > > > > > > > used a statement like "mostly" or 'universally') was

> > > derived.

> > > > > > Given

> > > > > > > > that there must be millions of jyotishis in India

> itself

> > > and

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > population growing like a family of rabbits all over

> the

> > > > globe,

> > > > > > how

> > > > > > > > can one make a statement like that unless a survey

was

> > > done.

> > > > It

> > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > his greatness that he eventually responded saying

that

> > > > > somewhere

> > > > > > (I

> > > > > > > > think in Delhi or Poona) a group of panchaang makers

(I

> > > > recall

> > > > > > less

> > > > > > > > than 30 but I could be remembering it wrongly) had

> > > > congregated

> > > > > > with

> > > > > > > > some govt. officials and through their deliberations

> > > (details

> > > > > of

> > > > > > > > which I would be curious to learn but have no clue

> where

> > to

> > > > > find

> > > > > > > > those or if those were even published or made

avaiable

> to

> > > > > anyone)

> > > > > > > had

> > > > > > > > come to the conclusion that chitra or chaitra

ayanamsha

> > is

> > > > the

> > > > > > one

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > be adopted. I never got the information as to how

many

> of

> > > > these

> > > > > > > fine

> > > > > > > > individuals were actually jyotishis, or practiced

> jyotish

> > > > with

> > > > > > any

> > > > > > > > success during their lifetime.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Mr. Rao himself follows and recommends Lahiri

ayanamsha

> > > which

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > > pretty close to chitra ayanamsha and I believe he has

> > > > mentioned

> > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > he got good results with the ayanamsha and that this

> was

> > > > close

> > > > > to

> > > > > > > > what his astrological guru used/recommended and also

> > close

> > > to

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > values that Mr. Karve the psychic who can tell your

> time

> > of

> > > > > birth

> > > > > > > > just by looking/talking to you, produced. Mr. Karve,

it

> > > seems

> > > > > > > looked

> > > > > > > > at you, and gave a lagna degree and the date and with

> > > lahiri

> > > > > > > > ayanamsha this value matched. Mr. Rao's students

> probably

> > > use

> > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsha but I have only interacted with a

few

> so

> > > > > cannot

> > > > > > > tell

> > > > > > > > about the ultimate preferences of all.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > What we can say that the vocal majority on internet

> > > probably

> > > > > uses

> > > > > > > > lahiri ayanamsha. If this list is a standard

reference,

> > > then

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > vocal 'majority' represents less than 1% of the

> > > participants

> > > > > > (less

> > > > > > > > than 26 who discuss jyotish, not counting those that

> ask

> > > for

> > > > > > > readings

> > > > > > > > only, OUT of some 2600 members). The same would be

the

> > > > > experience

> > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > other list subpopulations (less than 1% talk,

express,

> > > > write).

> > > > > So

> > > > > > > one

> > > > > > > > can safely assume that at least 1% or less of the

> > > astrologers

> > > > > > > (sorry

> > > > > > > > Jyotishis!) claim to use Lahiri ayanamsha or a

similar

> > > value.

> > > > > > This

> > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Mind you, I am not saying that Lahiri ayanamsha does

> not

> > > work

> > > > > or

> > > > > > > does

> > > > > > > > or that there is necessarily a better ayanamsha. In

> fact

> > > > there

> > > > > > are

> > > > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have

> been

> > > > quite

> > > > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at

> all

> > > and

> > > > > > work

> > > > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not

> just

> > > one

> > > > > or

> > > > > > > two

> > > > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > There are a lot of myths and suppositions and claims

> > > floating

> > > > > > > around

> > > > > > > > in the ocean of astrology about this or that being

tge

> > > > absolute

> > > > > > > truth

> > > > > > > > in the field of astrology in general and statements

> such

> > as

> > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > is good for predicting events and tropical better at

> > > > describing

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > psyche, etc. As I have pointed out in some earlier

> > written

> > > > > > > articles,

> > > > > > > > this is more a reflection of the person and his

> > background

> > > > who

> > > > > > then

> > > > > > > > went on to become an astrologer - the economist drawn

> to

> > > > > > > forecasting

> > > > > > > > the markets, the doctor focussing on astrology of the

> > > > diseases,

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > spiritualist seeing the spiritual map in the

horoscope,

> > the

> > > > > > > > psychologist focusing on the psyche as revealed

through

> > the

> > > > map.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > The beauty is that the same little map, or maybe a

few

> of

> > > > these

> > > > > > are

> > > > > > > > capable of giving such a rich description of the

human

> > > > > > experience,

> > > > > > > > the full spectrum of which has been beyond the scope

of

> > > > > > > comprehension

> > > > > > > > of any one individual, whether astrologer, jyotishi,

> > > > > > tarotomancer,

> > > > > > > > scryer or some Guru yogi divine!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > RR

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > , "tw853"

> > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Dear amit_call,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP ayanamsa is

> used

> > > in

> > > > KP

> > > > > > > > > analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his books.

> It's

> > up

> > > > to

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > preference of an individual astrologer.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Best regards,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa with

> > > > > deg:min:sec

> > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book 2003, pp

> 1,

> > 88-

> > > > 93)

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > , vattem

> > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > Ji Amitji,

> > > > > > > > > > In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of

> > discussions

> > > > due

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > differences it has been agreed that scietifically

> > prudent

> > > > to

> > > > > > use

> > > > > > > > > Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee constituted

has

> > also

> > > > > > > > recommended

> > > > > > > > > for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> > > > > > > > > > Infact to add to list I also cite the research of

> > Shri

> > > > > > K.N.Rao

> > > > > > > a

> > > > > > > > > renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> > > > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > amit_call wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > > > > > > I have a confusion over Using different Ayamansas.

> > > > > > > > > > Using different Ayamansas give different Charts.

> > > > > > > > > > Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are different.

> > > > > > > > > > Please guide me.

> > > > > > > > > > Sincerely

> > > > > > > > > > Amit

> > > > > > > > > >

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Ji Rohini ji,

I never say anything about which i do not know with certainty.so is

KSY.

The Analysis you gave is almost right.

>Does the person have a very sensitive nature, lacks strong self-

> esteem

This is true.

In 2001 He faced comlpex,degrading situations at his Job.

 

> Sexual problems (I realize that is a large net) prior to that, and

> problems with 'fitting in' into groups, feeling ill-understood by

> others and similar issues?

All is Right.

He has lost his Parents.

Main problem is his social status.He is a fourth class government

servent, the job he got after death of his father while in service.

He is a comlex personality.He is a good critic so much that he

critices himself too always.But he is not enough strong to change his

habits.He doesn't have congenial relations with Relatives(yes with

family of elder sister),Not much good friends,avoid facing things.And

always an unstability,fear kind of thing is felt.

Also his chart needs some rectification.

the data i gave is from the chart made by nearby jyotishi.

Thanks And Regards

Amit

 

 

, "rohiniranjan" <rrgb@s...>

wrote:

>

> With lahiri, moon is in the same rashi as ketu, both whether using

> true or mean nodes. KSY does not exist

> With Raman nodes change sign, but cancellation exists same way with

> other planets.

>

> Please be careful when using KSY to explain mishaps or other

things.

> KSY is not an unconditional jail sentance and all troubles cannot

and

> should not be explained based on KSY, full or partial, perceived or

> manifest.

>

> Does the person have a very sensitive nature, lacks strong self-

> esteem and around early 2001 began to show somewhat deviation from

> his normal personality? Trying new and different things, some not

> positive at all?

>

> Sexual problems (I realize that is a large net) prior to that, and

> problems with 'fitting in' into groups, feeling ill-understood by

> others and similar issues?

>

> Impulsive and rather grandiose expenditures and extreme

restlessness

> in spirit and one who would be happier and better performer in wide

> open spaces rather than confining situations? Like in a progressive

> society, abroad?

>

> Restless sleep, dreams of a restless, active, anxious nature?

>

> Major issues with or concerning elder siblings if they exist,

> particularly an elder sister or cousin sister?

>

> , "amit_call"

<amit_call>

> wrote:

> >

> > Rohini ji

> > The details of native are:

> >

> > DOB:10-Jun-1977

> > Time:04:00 A.M.

> > Place:Aligarh,U.P..27N54 78E04

> > The chart casted using Lahiri/KP ayamansa gives KSD while using

> Raman

> > Ayamansa it doesn't.

> > My Understanding of KSD is when all the Planets are between Rahu

> and

> > Ketu.

> > someWhere i read if Any planet joins Ketu or Rahu ..then it is

not

> > KSD.In that case it will not be KSD.

> > If wrong pls correct me.

> > Sincerely

> > Amit kUmar

> >

> >

> > , "rohiniranjan"

<rrgb@s...>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Amit,

> > >

> > > This sounds fascinating! Would you care to share the birthdata

> for

> > > the nativity that had KSD only with Lahiri ayanamsha?

> > >

> > > Thanks

> > >

> > > RR

> > >

> > > , "amit_call"

> > <amit_call>

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear All,

> > > > I thank all the members for postings and throwing light on

this

> > > > Ayamansa confusion.

> > > > This is accepted that Pridiction is one's own ability.

> > > > Also in a magazine of astrology i read a sloka which says "In

> > > > Kaliyuga only a few will be true astrologers and the best

ones'

> > > > pridictive power will only manifest to 25%"

> > > > I do not remember the exact sloka but the meaning was same.

> > > > Also i want to add that some time back i met a Nadi Reader.

> > > > in Nadi i was amazed to see that they told my name,my parents

> > > > name ,some educational background,present condition and a

> little

> > > more.

> > > > also as per Nadi he made a chart and gave to me.

> > > > This chart is same as i get using Lahiri and KP Ayamansa.

> > > > Also one of my friend got a chance to meet a sidhha Purush in

> > > > Bulandshahar(U.P.).He is a young sanyasi.Looking at face he

> said

> > > > something about him..his problems and told that he was having

> > Kaal

> > > > Sarpa Dosha.

> > > > I was very new to astrology at that time.I started reading

abt

> > KSD

> > > > and found that there was really KSD in his chart.

> > > > Now i see this chart is as per Lahiri Ayamansa.

> > > > Other Ayamansa give no KSD.

> > > > Well, its a matter of observation......

> > > > I have to observe in a time span which chart better explains

my

> > > life

> > > > and which charts Dashas confirms the timing of events.

> > > > As i am new to astrology hence i was hesitating to adopt this

> > > > approach.

> > > > Also i sing with your lines "Intuition is great reliable

tool".

> > > > Thanks

> > > > Sincerely

> > > > Amit Kumar

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > , Amitabh Shastri

> > > > <amitabh_shastri> wrote:

> > > > > Sorry for the delay in response. But you're right. It is

the

> > man

> > > > behind the weapon who counts. The weapon is just a piece of

> > metal,

> > > > wood and other ingredients of which it is composed.

> > > > > The difference between innimate and animate needs to be

> > > understood

> > > > very clearly.

> > > > > Best wishes for a happy and prosperous new year.

> > > > > Amitabh Shastri

> > > > > rohiniranjan <rrgb@s...> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Yes -- that is my view too, fwiw.

> > > > >

> > > > > rr

> > > > >

> > > > > , "tw853" wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I hope one can use what WORKS for him as INDIVIDUAL

> > astrologer,

> > > > > while

> > > > > > simultaneously respecting the personal preferences of

> others.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Best regards,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > tw

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , "rohiniranjan"

> > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I hope I am understanding you correctly, that your

> position

> > > is

> > > > > that

> > > > > > > no specific ayanamsha alone can explain all that

> astrology

> > > (as

> > > > we

> > > > > > > know it) explains. That there are more mysteries that

> lie,

> > > > > Horatio,

> > > > > > > between the heaven and earth? If so, then yes that is

> what

> > I

> > > > was

> > > > > > > saying all along, namely, that there are divinators

that

> > > > > > successfully

> > > > > > > use different ayanamshas, and some that do not even use

> > > > > ayanamshas,

> > > > > > > so no point in agonizing over which ayanamsha is the

only

> > > > > accurate

> > > > > > > one.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Pardon my crude and cruel analogy, but the aiming

sights

> on

> > a

> > > > > rifle

> > > > > > > while of tremendous help in improving the marksmanship,

> > would

> > > > > alone

> > > > > > > not make one an expert marksman! Ayanamsha is like

> > > that 'sight'

> > > > > > which

> > > > > > > definitely is helpful if trained at the target

carefully,

> > > > > however,

> > > > > > > the marksman still must effectively learn to hold the

> rifle

> > > and

> > > > > > > improve their skills.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Most practitioners (present company excepted of

course!)

> in

> > > > > > astrology

> > > > > > > of any kind are at best figuring their way out of this

> > dense

> > > > > > forest,

> > > > > > > even if they may not be brave enough to admit. Your

sage

> > > advice

> > > > > to

> > > > > > > not make ayanamsha a big deal is well-given and finds

> > accord

> > > in

> > > > > my

> > > > > > > own personal outlook. I respond only when I notice

overt

> or

> > > > > covert

> > > > > > > insinuations that a given ayanamsha is somehow the best

> > > without

> > > > > no

> > > > > > > direct and ample proof for such, forthcoming.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Happy New Year!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > RR

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > , vattem

krishnan

> > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > Hello Rohiniji,

> > > > > > > > The Astronomical studies have confirmed ecliptical

> zodiac

> > > and

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > movements of the planets along with planets was never

> found

> > > to

> > > > be

> > > > > > > unform.So we have all confusions added to the changes

> being

> > > > > > witnessed

> > > > > > > in the planet earth due unpredicatable characterstics

of

> > > > > Nature.I

> > > > > > do

> > > > > > > not know whether I can put that even the science finds

it

> > > > > difficult

> > > > > > > to say in precise nature.May be Ayanamsa correction is

a

> > > > specific

> > > > > > > approach from the fixed zodiac of Aries.Westren

Astrology

> > > based

> > > > > on

> > > > > > > accptable solar system too may be able to solve the

> riddles

> > > of

> > > > > > human

> > > > > > > life and anticipated events.Even we in our Astrology

> avoid

> > > > > Neptune

> > > > > > > and Pluto,westren Astrologers attribute great

> significance

> > of

> > > > > these

> > > > > > > two outer planets.Still i believe that the kind of

> > > Shodasamasas

> > > > > we

> > > > > > > have developed can bring out comfortably various

aspects

> of

> > > > life

> > > > > > > including the nature of old age through the aid of

> > divisional

> > > > > chart.

> > > > > > > > Keeping these aspects in mind,probably it is

> appropriate

> > > till

> > > > > > such

> > > > > > > that we are not able to deny Ayanamsa,particularly

> Lahiri's

> > > > > > Ayanamsa

> > > > > > > as useful for our purposes but we do not discount other

> > > > > approaches

> > > > > > > and certainly not their efficacy in predictions.

> > > > > > > > Certainly Astrology,particularly Vedic Astrology to

> > unfold

> > > > the

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > future and past events will always remain to be

connected

> > > with

> > > > > > > intution and if not the sixth sense.

> > > > > > > > In this we have umpteen examples including a 10year

old

> > > > British

> > > > > > who

> > > > > > > could recollect from her class rom lessons to say the

> most

> > > > > unusual

> > > > > > > and catsrophic events like Tsunami.

> > > > > > > > Even Late B.V.raman makes it a point to refer to the

> > > accuracy

> > > > > to

> > > > > > > Brahma as the creator of universe.

> > > > > > > > Iam sure our distinguished members may have some more

> > > valuble

> > > > > > > suggestions on the subject.

> > > > > > > > Thanx

> > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > tw853 wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I fully agree with Vattem Krishnan not to venture

> myself

> > > into

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > highly sensitive controversy of ayanamsa discussion.

> For

> > > > myself

> > > > > I

> > > > > > > use

> > > > > > > > new KP ayanamsa, while simultaneously respecting the

> > > personal

> > > > > > > > preferences of others.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Best wishes,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > , vattem

> krishnan

> > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > Hello Amitji,

> > > > > > > > > For some time I had the fortune of getting

associated

> > > with

> > > > > > > Phalit

> > > > > > > > jyotish through Rastreeya Sanskrit Vidyapeeth,New

Delhi.

> > > > > > > > > In the committee constituted by the Govt of India

> even

> > > late

> > > > > > Shri

> > > > > > > > B.V.Raman was also a member apart from several vedic

> > > scholars

> > > > > > from

> > > > > > > > Benares,Haridwar and other places.

> > > > > > > > > Even in these learned institutions research on the

> > > > subjectof

> > > > > > > > Ayanamsa is being caaried out.Most of these are

guided

> > > > through

> > > > > > Prof

> > > > > > > > Kalyan Dutt Varma,who is now on the bed.Govt India

and

> > > > several

> > > > > > > other

> > > > > > > > Govts too have supported the research and even built

> mini

> > > > > jantar-

> > > > > > > > mantars to calculate the movements of planets and

study

> > the

> > > > > > motion

> > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > earth.And these effects through research are getting

> > > > published

> > > > > in

> > > > > > > > Sanskrit.Infact even you can try from Tirupati

> university

> > > in

> > > > > > India.

> > > > > > > > > As far as relativity and percentage of usage of

> Lahiri

> > > > > > Ayanamsa.I

> > > > > > > > have no idea.So I go by your statstics.Incase you

want

> to

> > > be

> > > > > sure

> > > > > > > > before you infer as :

> > > > > > > > > This is a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'

> > > > > > > > > Let us be sincere to find the relevance of Ayanamsa

> in

> > > > Helio

> > > > > > > > Centric Approach mostly followe by the westren

> > Astrologers.

> > > > > > > > > Infact what little I have understood from Hindu

> > > Predictive

> > > > > > > > Astrology through various approaches of Ganith

> jyotish,we

> > > > have

> > > > > > > three

> > > > > > > > different lagnas for harmonising the results arising

> out

> > > the

> > > > > > study

> > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > natal chart in Astrology.Lagna,Surya as Lagna and

> mostly

> > > Moon

> > > > > as

> > > > > > > also

> > > > > > > > lagna.This approach has made us to depend on various

> > > > > mathematical

> > > > > > > > calculations and the relevance of Ayanmsa as a major

> > factor

> > > > of

> > > > > > > study

> > > > > > > > was taken up.

> > > > > > > > > In the case of westren Astrologers and their

> philosophy

> > > in

> > > > > > > handing

> > > > > > > > over good results without elaborate rules and the

> > approach

> > > of

> > > > > > vedic

> > > > > > > > Astrology based on the tripod(1,5and9) are to serve

for

> > > > > different

> > > > > > > > sections of this great universe.We like or not the

> basic

> > of

> > > > our

> > > > > > > > philosophy in Astrology is related to Karma

Siddhantam.

> > > > > > > > > In westren thoughts probably they believe in an

> > approach

> > > > > which

> > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > not deterministic but gives an opportunity for

> > > understanding

> > > > > what

> > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > not possible but do not go beyond to say why it is

not

> > > > possible.

> > > > > > > > > I agree with you when you say:

> > > > > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have

> > been

> > > > > quite

> > > > > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha

at

> > all

> > > > and

> > > > > > > work

> > > > > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and

not

> > just

> > > > one

> > > > > > or

> > > > > > > > two

> > > > > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results

> > > > > > > > > Is it not that Astrology has also an intutional

> element

> > > > where

> > > > > > > some

> > > > > > > > soothe sayers as pointed out by you can off hand

> predict

> > > any

> > > > > > thing?

> > > > > > > > > In India Astrology is making strides with the

revival

> > > > towards

> > > > > > > Vedic

> > > > > > > > understanding and to find it's relevance in modern

> times

> > > and

> > > > in

> > > > > > > > futuristic studies.

> > > > > > > > > Incidentally I believed late B.V.Raman and Shri K.N

> Rao

> > > as

> > > > my

> > > > > > > great

> > > > > > > > Gurus bout for whose blessing I would not have

ventured

> > > > myself

> > > > > in

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > these highly sensitive areas of discussions.

> > > > > > > > > Thanx

> > > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > rohiniranjan wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Please do not be personally offended but I have a

bit

> > of

> > > > > > problem

> > > > > > > > > with "mostly" in your statement. Couple of years

ago

> on

> > > his

> > > > > > > > newslist,

> > > > > > > > > I had asked Mr. Rao directly about how such a

> > conclusion

> > > > (he

> > > > > > had

> > > > > > > > also

> > > > > > > > > used a statement like "mostly" or 'universally')

was

> > > > derived.

> > > > > > > Given

> > > > > > > > > that there must be millions of jyotishis in India

> > itself

> > > > and

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > population growing like a family of rabbits all

over

> > the

> > > > > globe,

> > > > > > > how

> > > > > > > > > can one make a statement like that unless a survey

> was

> > > > done.

> > > > > It

> > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > his greatness that he eventually responded saying

> that

> > > > > > somewhere

> > > > > > > (I

> > > > > > > > > think in Delhi or Poona) a group of panchaang

makers

> (I

> > > > > recall

> > > > > > > less

> > > > > > > > > than 30 but I could be remembering it wrongly) had

> > > > > congregated

> > > > > > > with

> > > > > > > > > some govt. officials and through their

deliberations

> > > > (details

> > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > which I would be curious to learn but have no clue

> > where

> > > to

> > > > > > find

> > > > > > > > > those or if those were even published or made

> avaiable

> > to

> > > > > > anyone)

> > > > > > > > had

> > > > > > > > > come to the conclusion that chitra or chaitra

> ayanamsha

> > > is

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > one

> > > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > be adopted. I never got the information as to how

> many

> > of

> > > > > these

> > > > > > > > fine

> > > > > > > > > individuals were actually jyotishis, or practiced

> > jyotish

> > > > > with

> > > > > > > any

> > > > > > > > > success during their lifetime.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Mr. Rao himself follows and recommends Lahiri

> ayanamsha

> > > > which

> > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > pretty close to chitra ayanamsha and I believe he

has

> > > > > mentioned

> > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > he got good results with the ayanamsha and that

this

> > was

> > > > > close

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > what his astrological guru used/recommended and

also

> > > close

> > > > to

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > values that Mr. Karve the psychic who can tell your

> > time

> > > of

> > > > > > birth

> > > > > > > > > just by looking/talking to you, produced. Mr.

Karve,

> it

> > > > seems

> > > > > > > > looked

> > > > > > > > > at you, and gave a lagna degree and the date and

with

> > > > lahiri

> > > > > > > > > ayanamsha this value matched. Mr. Rao's students

> > probably

> > > > use

> > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsha but I have only interacted with a

> few

> > so

> > > > > > cannot

> > > > > > > > tell

> > > > > > > > > about the ultimate preferences of all.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > What we can say that the vocal majority on internet

> > > > probably

> > > > > > uses

> > > > > > > > > lahiri ayanamsha. If this list is a standard

> reference,

> > > > then

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > vocal 'majority' represents less than 1% of the

> > > > participants

> > > > > > > (less

> > > > > > > > > than 26 who discuss jyotish, not counting those

that

> > ask

> > > > for

> > > > > > > > readings

> > > > > > > > > only, OUT of some 2600 members). The same would be

> the

> > > > > > experience

> > > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > other list subpopulations (less than 1% talk,

> express,

> > > > > write).

> > > > > > So

> > > > > > > > one

> > > > > > > > > can safely assume that at least 1% or less of the

> > > > astrologers

> > > > > > > > (sorry

> > > > > > > > > Jyotishis!) claim to use Lahiri ayanamsha or a

> similar

> > > > value.

> > > > > > > This

> > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'!

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Mind you, I am not saying that Lahiri ayanamsha

does

> > not

> > > > work

> > > > > > or

> > > > > > > > does

> > > > > > > > > or that there is necessarily a better ayanamsha. In

> > fact

> > > > > there

> > > > > > > are

> > > > > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have

> > been

> > > > > quite

> > > > > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha

at

> > all

> > > > and

> > > > > > > work

> > > > > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and

not

> > just

> > > > one

> > > > > > or

> > > > > > > > two

> > > > > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results!

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > There are a lot of myths and suppositions and

claims

> > > > floating

> > > > > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > in the ocean of astrology about this or that being

> tge

> > > > > absolute

> > > > > > > > truth

> > > > > > > > > in the field of astrology in general and statements

> > such

> > > as

> > > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > > is good for predicting events and tropical better

at

> > > > > describing

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > psyche, etc. As I have pointed out in some earlier

> > > written

> > > > > > > > articles,

> > > > > > > > > this is more a reflection of the person and his

> > > background

> > > > > who

> > > > > > > then

> > > > > > > > > went on to become an astrologer - the economist

drawn

> > to

> > > > > > > > forecasting

> > > > > > > > > the markets, the doctor focussing on astrology of

the

> > > > > diseases,

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > spiritualist seeing the spiritual map in the

> horoscope,

> > > the

> > > > > > > > > psychologist focusing on the psyche as revealed

> through

> > > the

> > > > > map.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > The beauty is that the same little map, or maybe a

> few

> > of

> > > > > these

> > > > > > > are

> > > > > > > > > capable of giving such a rich description of the

> human

> > > > > > > experience,

> > > > > > > > > the full spectrum of which has been beyond the

scope

> of

> > > > > > > > comprehension

> > > > > > > > > of any one individual, whether astrologer,

jyotishi,

> > > > > > > tarotomancer,

> > > > > > > > > scryer or some Guru yogi divine!

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > RR

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > , "tw853"

> > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Dear amit_call,

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP ayanamsa

is

> > used

> > > > in

> > > > > KP

> > > > > > > > > > analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his books.

> > It's

> > > up

> > > > > to

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > preference of an individual astrologer.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Best regards,

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa

with

> > > > > > deg:min:sec

> > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book 2003,

pp

> > 1,

> > > 88-

> > > > > 93)

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > , vattem

> > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > Ji Amitji,

> > > > > > > > > > > In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of

> > > discussions

> > > > > due

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > differences it has been agreed that scietifically

> > > prudent

> > > > > to

> > > > > > > use

> > > > > > > > > > Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee constituted

> has

> > > also

> > > > > > > > > recommended

> > > > > > > > > > for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> > > > > > > > > > > Infact to add to list I also cite the research

of

> > > Shri

> > > > > > > K.N.Rao

> > > > > > > > a

> > > > > > > > > > renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> > > > > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > amit_call wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > > > > > > > I have a confusion over Using different

Ayamansas.

> > > > > > > > > > > Using different Ayamansas give different Charts.

> > > > > > > > > > > Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are different.

> > > > > > > > > > > Please guide me.

> > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely

> > > > > > > > > > > Amit

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS

> SURVIVAL !

> > ~

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Links

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > /

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > To from this group, send an email

to:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the

>

> > > > > Terms

> > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > > Service.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > All your favorites on one personal page – Try

My

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !

~

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Links

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > /

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > Terms

> > > > > of

> > > > > > > > Service.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > The all-new My – Get yours free!

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

removed]

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Links

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > /

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> Terms

> > of

> > > > > > > Service.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage

less.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

> > > > > Links

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > ALL-NEW Messenger - all new features - even more

> fun!

> > > > >

> > > > >

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Thanks Amitabh ji,

I got a mail of sreelatha ji in the list archive that explains KSY.

Now i am more clear.

thanks for your guidance.

Regards

AMit

 

, Amitabh Shastri

<amitabh_shastri> wrote:

> Dear Amit,

> For KSD planets must be moving towards Rahu. In reverse case it is

said to be KAD.

> With best wishes,

> Amitabh Shastri

>

> amit_call <amit_call> wrote:

>

>

> Rohini ji

> The details of native are:

>

> DOB:10-Jun-1977

> Time:04:00 A.M.

> Place:Aligarh,U.P..27N54 78E04

> The chart casted using Lahiri/KP ayamansa gives KSD while using

Raman

> Ayamansa it doesn't.

> My Understanding of KSD is when all the Planets are between Rahu

and

> Ketu.

> someWhere i read if Any planet joins Ketu or Rahu ..then it is not

> KSD.In that case it will not be KSD.

> If wrong pls correct me.

> Sincerely

> Amit kUmar

>

>

> , "rohiniranjan"

> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Amit,

> >

> > This sounds fascinating! Would you care to share the birthdata

for

> > the nativity that had KSD only with Lahiri ayanamsha?

> >

> > Thanks

> >

> > RR

> >

> > , "amit_call"

>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear All,

> > > I thank all the members for postings and throwing light on this

> > > Ayamansa confusion.

> > > This is accepted that Pridiction is one's own ability.

> > > Also in a magazine of astrology i read a sloka which says "In

> > > Kaliyuga only a few will be true astrologers and the best ones'

> > > pridictive power will only manifest to 25%"

> > > I do not remember the exact sloka but the meaning was same.

> > > Also i want to add that some time back i met a Nadi Reader.

> > > in Nadi i was amazed to see that they told my name,my parents

> > > name ,some educational background,present condition and a

little

> > more.

> > > also as per Nadi he made a chart and gave to me.

> > > This chart is same as i get using Lahiri and KP Ayamansa.

> > > Also one of my friend got a chance to meet a sidhha Purush in

> > > Bulandshahar(U.P.).He is a young sanyasi.Looking at face he

said

> > > something about him..his problems and told that he was having

> Kaal

> > > Sarpa Dosha.

> > > I was very new to astrology at that time.I started reading abt

> KSD

> > > and found that there was really KSD in his chart.

> > > Now i see this chart is as per Lahiri Ayamansa.

> > > Other Ayamansa give no KSD.

> > > Well, its a matter of observation......

> > > I have to observe in a time span which chart better explains my

> > life

> > > and which charts Dashas confirms the timing of events.

> > > As i am new to astrology hence i was hesitating to adopt this

> > > approach.

> > > Also i sing with your lines "Intuition is great reliable tool".

> > > Thanks

> > > Sincerely

> > > Amit Kumar

> > >

> > >

> > > , Amitabh Shastri

> > > wrote:

> > > > Sorry for the delay in response. But you're right. It is the

> man

> > > behind the weapon who counts. The weapon is just a piece of

> metal,

> > > wood and other ingredients of which it is composed.

> > > > The difference between innimate and animate needs to be

> > understood

> > > very clearly.

> > > > Best wishes for a happy and prosperous new year.

> > > > Amitabh Shastri

> > > > rohiniranjan wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Yes -- that is my view too, fwiw.

> > > >

> > > > rr

> > > >

> > > > , "tw853" wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > I hope one can use what WORKS for him as INDIVIDUAL

> astrologer,

> > > > while

> > > > > simultaneously respecting the personal preferences of

others.

> > > > >

> > > > > Best regards,

> > > > >

> > > > > tw

> > > > >

> > > > > , "rohiniranjan"

> > > > > wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I hope I am understanding you correctly, that your

position

> > is

> > > > that

> > > > > > no specific ayanamsha alone can explain all that

astrology

> > (as

> > > we

> > > > > > know it) explains. That there are more mysteries that

lie,

> > > > Horatio,

> > > > > > between the heaven and earth? If so, then yes that is

what

> I

> > > was

> > > > > > saying all along, namely, that there are divinators that

> > > > > successfully

> > > > > > use different ayanamshas, and some that do not even use

> > > > ayanamshas,

> > > > > > so no point in agonizing over which ayanamsha is the only

> > > > accurate

> > > > > > one.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Pardon my crude and cruel analogy, but the aiming sights

on

> a

> > > > rifle

> > > > > > while of tremendous help in improving the marksmanship,

> would

> > > > alone

> > > > > > not make one an expert marksman! Ayanamsha is like

> > that 'sight'

> > > > > which

> > > > > > definitely is helpful if trained at the target carefully,

> > > > however,

> > > > > > the marksman still must effectively learn to hold the

rifle

> > and

> > > > > > improve their skills.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Most practitioners (present company excepted of course!)

in

> > > > > astrology

> > > > > > of any kind are at best figuring their way out of this

> dense

> > > > > forest,

> > > > > > even if they may not be brave enough to admit. Your sage

> > advice

> > > > to

> > > > > > not make ayanamsha a big deal is well-given and finds

> accord

> > in

> > > > my

> > > > > > own personal outlook. I respond only when I notice overt

or

> > > > covert

> > > > > > insinuations that a given ayanamsha is somehow the best

> > without

> > > > no

> > > > > > direct and ample proof for such, forthcoming.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Happy New Year!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > RR

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , vattem krishnan

> > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > Hello Rohiniji,

> > > > > > > The Astronomical studies have confirmed ecliptical

zodiac

> > and

> > > > the

> > > > > > movements of the planets along with planets was never

found

> > to

> > > be

> > > > > > unform.So we have all confusions added to the changes

being

> > > > > witnessed

> > > > > > in the planet earth due unpredicatable characterstics of

> > > > Nature.I

> > > > > do

> > > > > > not know whether I can put that even the science finds it

> > > > difficult

> > > > > > to say in precise nature.May be Ayanamsa correction is a

> > > specific

> > > > > > approach from the fixed zodiac of Aries.Westren Astrology

> > based

> > > > on

> > > > > > accptable solar system too may be able to solve the

riddles

> > of

> > > > > human

> > > > > > life and anticipated events.Even we in our Astrology

avoid

> > > > Neptune

> > > > > > and Pluto,westren Astrologers attribute great

significance

> of

> > > > these

> > > > > > two outer planets.Still i believe that the kind of

> > Shodasamasas

> > > > we

> > > > > > have developed can bring out comfortably various aspects

of

> > > life

> > > > > > including the nature of old age through the aid of

> divisional

> > > > chart.

> > > > > > > Keeping these aspects in mind,probably it is

appropriate

> > till

> > > > > such

> > > > > > that we are not able to deny Ayanamsa,particularly

Lahiri's

> > > > > Ayanamsa

> > > > > > as useful for our purposes but we do not discount other

> > > > approaches

> > > > > > and certainly not their efficacy in predictions.

> > > > > > > Certainly Astrology,particularly Vedic Astrology to

> unfold

> > > the

> > > > > the

> > > > > > future and past events will always remain to be connected

> > with

> > > > > > intution and if not the sixth sense.

> > > > > > > In this we have umpteen examples including a 10year old

> > > British

> > > > > who

> > > > > > could recollect from her class rom lessons to say the

most

> > > > unusual

> > > > > > and catsrophic events like Tsunami.

> > > > > > > Even Late B.V.raman makes it a point to refer to the

> > accuracy

> > > > to

> > > > > > Brahma as the creator of universe.

> > > > > > > Iam sure our distinguished members may have some more

> > valuble

> > > > > > suggestions on the subject.

> > > > > > > Thanx

> > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > tw853 wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I fully agree with Vattem Krishnan not to venture

myself

> > into

> > > > the

> > > > > > > highly sensitive controversy of ayanamsa discussion.

For

> > > myself

> > > > I

> > > > > > use

> > > > > > > new KP ayanamsa, while simultaneously respecting the

> > personal

> > > > > > > preferences of others.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Best wishes,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > , vattem

krishnan

> > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > Hello Amitji,

> > > > > > > > For some time I had the fortune of getting associated

> > with

> > > > > > Phalit

> > > > > > > jyotish through Rastreeya Sanskrit Vidyapeeth,New Delhi.

> > > > > > > > In the committee constituted by the Govt of India

even

> > late

> > > > > Shri

> > > > > > > B.V.Raman was also a member apart from several vedic

> > scholars

> > > > > from

> > > > > > > Benares,Haridwar and other places.

> > > > > > > > Even in these learned institutions research on the

> > > subjectof

> > > > > > > Ayanamsa is being caaried out.Most of these are guided

> > > through

> > > > > Prof

> > > > > > > Kalyan Dutt Varma,who is now on the bed.Govt India and

> > > several

> > > > > > other

> > > > > > > Govts too have supported the research and even built

mini

> > > > jantar-

> > > > > > > mantars to calculate the movements of planets and study

> the

> > > > > motion

> > > > > > of

> > > > > > > earth.And these effects through research are getting

> > > published

> > > > in

> > > > > > > Sanskrit.Infact even you can try from Tirupati

university

> > in

> > > > > India.

> > > > > > > > As far as relativity and percentage of usage of

Lahiri

> > > > > Ayanamsa.I

> > > > > > > have no idea.So I go by your statstics.Incase you want

to

> > be

> > > > sure

> > > > > > > before you infer as :

> > > > > > > > This is a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'

> > > > > > > > Let us be sincere to find the relevance of Ayanamsa

in

> > > Helio

> > > > > > > Centric Approach mostly followe by the westren

> Astrologers.

> > > > > > > > Infact what little I have understood from Hindu

> > Predictive

> > > > > > > Astrology through various approaches of Ganith

jyotish,we

> > > have

> > > > > > three

> > > > > > > different lagnas for harmonising the results arising

out

> > the

> > > > > study

> > > > > > of

> > > > > > > natal chart in Astrology.Lagna,Surya as Lagna and

mostly

> > Moon

> > > > as

> > > > > > also

> > > > > > > lagna.This approach has made us to depend on various

> > > > mathematical

> > > > > > > calculations and the relevance of Ayanmsa as a major

> factor

> > > of

> > > > > > study

> > > > > > > was taken up.

> > > > > > > > In the case of westren Astrologers and their

philosophy

> > in

> > > > > > handing

> > > > > > > over good results without elaborate rules and the

> approach

> > of

> > > > > vedic

> > > > > > > Astrology based on the tripod(1,5and9) are to serve for

> > > > different

> > > > > > > sections of this great universe.We like or not the

basic

> of

> > > our

> > > > > > > philosophy in Astrology is related to Karma Siddhantam.

> > > > > > > > In westren thoughts probably they believe in an

> approach

> > > > which

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > not deterministic but gives an opportunity for

> > understanding

> > > > what

> > > > > > is

> > > > > > > not possible but do not go beyond to say why it is not

> > > possible.

> > > > > > > > I agree with you when you say:

> > > > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have

> been

> > > > quite

> > > > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at

> all

> > > and

> > > > > > work

> > > > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not

> just

> > > one

> > > > > or

> > > > > > > two

> > > > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results

> > > > > > > > Is it not that Astrology has also an intutional

element

> > > where

> > > > > > some

> > > > > > > soothe sayers as pointed out by you can off hand

predict

> > any

> > > > > thing?

> > > > > > > > In India Astrology is making strides with the revival

> > > towards

> > > > > > Vedic

> > > > > > > understanding and to find it's relevance in modern

times

> > and

> > > in

> > > > > > > futuristic studies.

> > > > > > > > Incidentally I believed late B.V.Raman and Shri K.N

Rao

> > as

> > > my

> > > > > > great

> > > > > > > Gurus bout for whose blessing I would not have ventured

> > > myself

> > > > in

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > these highly sensitive areas of discussions.

> > > > > > > > Thanx

> > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > rohiniranjan wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Please do not be personally offended but I have a bit

> of

> > > > > problem

> > > > > > > > with "mostly" in your statement. Couple of years ago

on

> > his

> > > > > > > newslist,

> > > > > > > > I had asked Mr. Rao directly about how such a

> conclusion

> > > (he

> > > > > had

> > > > > > > also

> > > > > > > > used a statement like "mostly" or 'universally') was

> > > derived.

> > > > > > Given

> > > > > > > > that there must be millions of jyotishis in India

> itself

> > > and

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > population growing like a family of rabbits all over

> the

> > > > globe,

> > > > > > how

> > > > > > > > can one make a statement like that unless a survey

was

> > > done.

> > > > It

> > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > his greatness that he eventually responded saying

that

> > > > > somewhere

> > > > > > (I

> > > > > > > > think in Delhi or Poona) a group of panchaang makers

(I

> > > > recall

> > > > > > less

> > > > > > > > than 30 but I could be remembering it wrongly) had

> > > > congregated

> > > > > > with

> > > > > > > > some govt. officials and through their deliberations

> > > (details

> > > > > of

> > > > > > > > which I would be curious to learn but have no clue

> where

> > to

> > > > > find

> > > > > > > > those or if those were even published or made

avaiable

> to

> > > > > anyone)

> > > > > > > had

> > > > > > > > come to the conclusion that chitra or chaitra

ayanamsha

> > is

> > > > the

> > > > > > one

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > be adopted. I never got the information as to how

many

> of

> > > > these

> > > > > > > fine

> > > > > > > > individuals were actually jyotishis, or practiced

> jyotish

> > > > with

> > > > > > any

> > > > > > > > success during their lifetime.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Mr. Rao himself follows and recommends Lahiri

ayanamsha

> > > which

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > > pretty close to chitra ayanamsha and I believe he has

> > > > mentioned

> > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > he got good results with the ayanamsha and that this

> was

> > > > close

> > > > > to

> > > > > > > > what his astrological guru used/recommended and also

> > close

> > > to

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > values that Mr. Karve the psychic who can tell your

> time

> > of

> > > > > birth

> > > > > > > > just by looking/talking to you, produced. Mr. Karve,

it

> > > seems

> > > > > > > looked

> > > > > > > > at you, and gave a lagna degree and the date and with

> > > lahiri

> > > > > > > > ayanamsha this value matched. Mr. Rao's students

> probably

> > > use

> > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsha but I have only interacted with a

few

> so

> > > > > cannot

> > > > > > > tell

> > > > > > > > about the ultimate preferences of all.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > What we can say that the vocal majority on internet

> > > probably

> > > > > uses

> > > > > > > > lahiri ayanamsha. If this list is a standard

reference,

> > > then

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > vocal 'majority' represents less than 1% of the

> > > participants

> > > > > > (less

> > > > > > > > than 26 who discuss jyotish, not counting those that

> ask

> > > for

> > > > > > > readings

> > > > > > > > only, OUT of some 2600 members). The same would be

the

> > > > > experience

> > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > other list subpopulations (less than 1% talk,

express,

> > > > write).

> > > > > So

> > > > > > > one

> > > > > > > > can safely assume that at least 1% or less of the

> > > astrologers

> > > > > > > (sorry

> > > > > > > > Jyotishis!) claim to use Lahiri ayanamsha or a

similar

> > > value.

> > > > > > This

> > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Mind you, I am not saying that Lahiri ayanamsha does

> not

> > > work

> > > > > or

> > > > > > > does

> > > > > > > > or that there is necessarily a better ayanamsha. In

> fact

> > > > there

> > > > > > are

> > > > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to have

> been

> > > > quite

> > > > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no ayanamsha at

> all

> > > and

> > > > > > work

> > > > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and not

> just

> > > one

> > > > > or

> > > > > > > two

> > > > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > There are a lot of myths and suppositions and claims

> > > floating

> > > > > > > around

> > > > > > > > in the ocean of astrology about this or that being

tge

> > > > absolute

> > > > > > > truth

> > > > > > > > in the field of astrology in general and statements

> such

> > as

> > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > is good for predicting events and tropical better at

> > > > describing

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > psyche, etc. As I have pointed out in some earlier

> > written

> > > > > > > articles,

> > > > > > > > this is more a reflection of the person and his

> > background

> > > > who

> > > > > > then

> > > > > > > > went on to become an astrologer - the economist drawn

> to

> > > > > > > forecasting

> > > > > > > > the markets, the doctor focussing on astrology of the

> > > > diseases,

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > spiritualist seeing the spiritual map in the

horoscope,

> > the

> > > > > > > > psychologist focusing on the psyche as revealed

through

> > the

> > > > map.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > The beauty is that the same little map, or maybe a

few

> of

> > > > these

> > > > > > are

> > > > > > > > capable of giving such a rich description of the

human

> > > > > > experience,

> > > > > > > > the full spectrum of which has been beyond the scope

of

> > > > > > > comprehension

> > > > > > > > of any one individual, whether astrologer, jyotishi,

> > > > > > tarotomancer,

> > > > > > > > scryer or some Guru yogi divine!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > RR

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > , "tw853"

> > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Dear amit_call,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP ayanamsa is

> used

> > > in

> > > > KP

> > > > > > > > > analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his books.

> It's

> > up

> > > > to

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > preference of an individual astrologer.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Best regards,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa with

> > > > > deg:min:sec

> > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book 2003, pp

> 1,

> > 88-

> > > > 93)

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > , vattem

> > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > Ji Amitji,

> > > > > > > > > > In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of

> > discussions

> > > > due

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > differences it has been agreed that scietifically

> > prudent

> > > > to

> > > > > > use

> > > > > > > > > Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee constituted

has

> > also

> > > > > > > > recommended

> > > > > > > > > for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> > > > > > > > > > Infact to add to list I also cite the research of

> > Shri

> > > > > > K.N.Rao

> > > > > > > a

> > > > > > > > > renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> > > > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > amit_call wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > > > > > > I have a confusion over Using different Ayamansas.

> > > > > > > > > > Using different Ayamansas give different Charts.

> > > > > > > > > > Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are different.

> > > > > > > > > > Please guide me.

> > > > > > > > > > Sincerely

> > > > > > > > > > Amit

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS

SURVIVAL !

> ~

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Sponsor

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Links

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > /

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the

 

> > > > Terms

> > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > Service.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > All your favorites on one personal page – Try My

> >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

>

> === message truncated ===

>

>

> ALL-NEW Messenger - all new features - even more fun!

>

>

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Daer Amit,

I checked the chart with KP.

The birth data are absolutely correct. No correction required.

Saturn is his key planet. Saturn is rising in so many cusps sub.[KP]

So many planets are in sub of Saturn. Saturn in Cacer in Mercury

star shows his personality.Mer in 1st house Taraus.

Unfortunate, despodent,fear complex, gathers information/knowlegge,

severe critical of every thing, not much hope for rise in future.

May go for spritual persuits later in life.

Inder

 

, "amit_call"

<amit_call> wrote:

>

> Ji Rohini ji,

> I never say anything about which i do not know with certainty.so

is

> KSY.

> The Analysis you gave is almost right.

> >Does the person have a very sensitive nature, lacks strong self-

> > esteem

> This is true.

> In 2001 He faced comlpex,degrading situations at his Job.

>

> > Sexual problems (I realize that is a large net) prior to that,

and

> > problems with 'fitting in' into groups, feeling ill-understood

by

> > others and similar issues?

> All is Right.

> He has lost his Parents.

> Main problem is his social status.He is a fourth class government

> servent, the job he got after death of his father while in service.

> He is a comlex personality.He is a good critic so much that he

> critices himself too always.But he is not enough strong to change

his

> habits.He doesn't have congenial relations with Relatives(yes with

> family of elder sister),Not much good friends,avoid facing

things.And

> always an unstability,fear kind of thing is felt.

> Also his chart needs some rectification.

> the data i gave is from the chart made by nearby jyotishi.

> Thanks And Regards

> Amit

>

>

> , "rohiniranjan"

<rrgb@s...>

> wrote:

> >

> > With lahiri, moon is in the same rashi as ketu, both whether

using

> > true or mean nodes. KSY does not exist

> > With Raman nodes change sign, but cancellation exists same way

with

> > other planets.

> >

> > Please be careful when using KSY to explain mishaps or other

> things.

> > KSY is not an unconditional jail sentance and all troubles

cannot

> and

> > should not be explained based on KSY, full or partial, perceived

or

> > manifest.

> >

> > Does the person have a very sensitive nature, lacks strong self-

> > esteem and around early 2001 began to show somewhat deviation

from

> > his normal personality? Trying new and different things, some

not

> > positive at all?

> >

> > Sexual problems (I realize that is a large net) prior to that,

and

> > problems with 'fitting in' into groups, feeling ill-understood

by

> > others and similar issues?

> >

> > Impulsive and rather grandiose expenditures and extreme

> restlessness

> > in spirit and one who would be happier and better performer in

wide

> > open spaces rather than confining situations? Like in a

progressive

> > society, abroad?

> >

> > Restless sleep, dreams of a restless, active, anxious nature?

> >

> > Major issues with or concerning elder siblings if they exist,

> > particularly an elder sister or cousin sister?

> >

> > , "amit_call"

> <amit_call>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Rohini ji

> > > The details of native are:

> > >

> > > DOB:10-Jun-1977

> > > Time:04:00 A.M.

> > > Place:Aligarh,U.P..27N54 78E04

> > > The chart casted using Lahiri/KP ayamansa gives KSD while

using

> > Raman

> > > Ayamansa it doesn't.

> > > My Understanding of KSD is when all the Planets are between

Rahu

> > and

> > > Ketu.

> > > someWhere i read if Any planet joins Ketu or Rahu ..then it is

> not

> > > KSD.In that case it will not be KSD.

> > > If wrong pls correct me.

> > > Sincerely

> > > Amit kUmar

> > >

> > >

> > > , "rohiniranjan"

> <rrgb@s...>

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Amit,

> > > >

> > > > This sounds fascinating! Would you care to share the

birthdata

> > for

> > > > the nativity that had KSD only with Lahiri ayanamsha?

> > > >

> > > > Thanks

> > > >

> > > > RR

> > > >

> > > > , "amit_call"

> > > <amit_call>

> > > > wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > I thank all the members for postings and throwing light on

> this

> > > > > Ayamansa confusion.

> > > > > This is accepted that Pridiction is one's own ability.

> > > > > Also in a magazine of astrology i read a sloka which

says "In

> > > > > Kaliyuga only a few will be true astrologers and the best

> ones'

> > > > > pridictive power will only manifest to 25%"

> > > > > I do not remember the exact sloka but the meaning was same.

> > > > > Also i want to add that some time back i met a Nadi Reader.

> > > > > in Nadi i was amazed to see that they told my name,my

parents

> > > > > name ,some educational background,present condition and a

> > little

> > > > more.

> > > > > also as per Nadi he made a chart and gave to me.

> > > > > This chart is same as i get using Lahiri and KP Ayamansa.

> > > > > Also one of my friend got a chance to meet a sidhha Purush

in

> > > > > Bulandshahar(U.P.).He is a young sanyasi.Looking at face

he

> > said

> > > > > something about him..his problems and told that he was

having

> > > Kaal

> > > > > Sarpa Dosha.

> > > > > I was very new to astrology at that time.I started reading

> abt

> > > KSD

> > > > > and found that there was really KSD in his chart.

> > > > > Now i see this chart is as per Lahiri Ayamansa.

> > > > > Other Ayamansa give no KSD.

> > > > > Well, its a matter of observation......

> > > > > I have to observe in a time span which chart better

explains

> my

> > > > life

> > > > > and which charts Dashas confirms the timing of events.

> > > > > As i am new to astrology hence i was hesitating to adopt

this

> > > > > approach.

> > > > > Also i sing with your lines "Intuition is great reliable

> tool".

> > > > > Thanks

> > > > > Sincerely

> > > > > Amit Kumar

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > , Amitabh Shastri

> > > > > <amitabh_shastri> wrote:

> > > > > > Sorry for the delay in response. But you're right. It is

> the

> > > man

> > > > > behind the weapon who counts. The weapon is just a piece

of

> > > metal,

> > > > > wood and other ingredients of which it is composed.

> > > > > > The difference between innimate and animate needs to be

> > > > understood

> > > > > very clearly.

> > > > > > Best wishes for a happy and prosperous new year.

> > > > > > Amitabh Shastri

> > > > > > rohiniranjan <rrgb@s...> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Yes -- that is my view too, fwiw.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > rr

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , "tw853" wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I hope one can use what WORKS for him as INDIVIDUAL

> > > astrologer,

> > > > > > while

> > > > > > > simultaneously respecting the personal preferences of

> > others.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Best regards,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > --- In

, "rohiniranjan"

> > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I hope I am understanding you correctly, that your

> > position

> > > > is

> > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > no specific ayanamsha alone can explain all that

> > astrology

> > > > (as

> > > > > we

> > > > > > > > know it) explains. That there are more mysteries

that

> > lie,

> > > > > > Horatio,

> > > > > > > > between the heaven and earth? If so, then yes that

is

> > what

> > > I

> > > > > was

> > > > > > > > saying all along, namely, that there are divinators

> that

> > > > > > > successfully

> > > > > > > > use different ayanamshas, and some that do not even

use

> > > > > > ayanamshas,

> > > > > > > > so no point in agonizing over which ayanamsha is the

> only

> > > > > > accurate

> > > > > > > > one.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Pardon my crude and cruel analogy, but the aiming

> sights

> > on

> > > a

> > > > > > rifle

> > > > > > > > while of tremendous help in improving the

marksmanship,

> > > would

> > > > > > alone

> > > > > > > > not make one an expert marksman! Ayanamsha is like

> > > > that 'sight'

> > > > > > > which

> > > > > > > > definitely is helpful if trained at the target

> carefully,

> > > > > > however,

> > > > > > > > the marksman still must effectively learn to hold

the

> > rifle

> > > > and

> > > > > > > > improve their skills.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Most practitioners (present company excepted of

> course!)

> > in

> > > > > > > astrology

> > > > > > > > of any kind are at best figuring their way out of

this

> > > dense

> > > > > > > forest,

> > > > > > > > even if they may not be brave enough to admit. Your

> sage

> > > > advice

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > not make ayanamsha a big deal is well-given and

finds

> > > accord

> > > > in

> > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > own personal outlook. I respond only when I notice

> overt

> > or

> > > > > > covert

> > > > > > > > insinuations that a given ayanamsha is somehow the

best

> > > > without

> > > > > > no

> > > > > > > > direct and ample proof for such, forthcoming.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Happy New Year!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > RR

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > , vattem

> krishnan

> > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > Hello Rohiniji,

> > > > > > > > > The Astronomical studies have confirmed ecliptical

> > zodiac

> > > > and

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > movements of the planets along with planets was

never

> > found

> > > > to

> > > > > be

> > > > > > > > unform.So we have all confusions added to the

changes

> > being

> > > > > > > witnessed

> > > > > > > > in the planet earth due unpredicatable

characterstics

> of

> > > > > > Nature.I

> > > > > > > do

> > > > > > > > not know whether I can put that even the science

finds

> it

> > > > > > difficult

> > > > > > > > to say in precise nature.May be Ayanamsa correction

is

> a

> > > > > specific

> > > > > > > > approach from the fixed zodiac of Aries.Westren

> Astrology

> > > > based

> > > > > > on

> > > > > > > > accptable solar system too may be able to solve the

> > riddles

> > > > of

> > > > > > > human

> > > > > > > > life and anticipated events.Even we in our Astrology

> > avoid

> > > > > > Neptune

> > > > > > > > and Pluto,westren Astrologers attribute great

> > significance

> > > of

> > > > > > these

> > > > > > > > two outer planets.Still i believe that the kind of

> > > > Shodasamasas

> > > > > > we

> > > > > > > > have developed can bring out comfortably various

> aspects

> > of

> > > > > life

> > > > > > > > including the nature of old age through the aid of

> > > divisional

> > > > > > chart.

> > > > > > > > > Keeping these aspects in mind,probably it is

> > appropriate

> > > > till

> > > > > > > such

> > > > > > > > that we are not able to deny Ayanamsa,particularly

> > Lahiri's

> > > > > > > Ayanamsa

> > > > > > > > as useful for our purposes but we do not discount

other

> > > > > > approaches

> > > > > > > > and certainly not their efficacy in predictions.

> > > > > > > > > Certainly Astrology,particularly Vedic Astrology

to

> > > unfold

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > future and past events will always remain to be

> connected

> > > > with

> > > > > > > > intution and if not the sixth sense.

> > > > > > > > > In this we have umpteen examples including a

10year

> old

> > > > > British

> > > > > > > who

> > > > > > > > could recollect from her class rom lessons to say

the

> > most

> > > > > > unusual

> > > > > > > > and catsrophic events like Tsunami.

> > > > > > > > > Even Late B.V.raman makes it a point to refer to

the

> > > > accuracy

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > Brahma as the creator of universe.

> > > > > > > > > Iam sure our distinguished members may have some

more

> > > > valuble

> > > > > > > > suggestions on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > Thanx

> > > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > tw853 wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I fully agree with Vattem Krishnan not to venture

> > myself

> > > > into

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > highly sensitive controversy of ayanamsa

discussion.

> > For

> > > > > myself

> > > > > > I

> > > > > > > > use

> > > > > > > > > new KP ayanamsa, while simultaneously respecting

the

> > > > personal

> > > > > > > > > preferences of others.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Best wishes,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > , vattem

> > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > Hello Amitji,

> > > > > > > > > > For some time I had the fortune of getting

> associated

> > > > with

> > > > > > > > Phalit

> > > > > > > > > jyotish through Rastreeya Sanskrit Vidyapeeth,New

> Delhi.

> > > > > > > > > > In the committee constituted by the Govt of

India

> > even

> > > > late

> > > > > > > Shri

> > > > > > > > > B.V.Raman was also a member apart from several

vedic

> > > > scholars

> > > > > > > from

> > > > > > > > > Benares,Haridwar and other places.

> > > > > > > > > > Even in these learned institutions research on

the

> > > > > subjectof

> > > > > > > > > Ayanamsa is being caaried out.Most of these are

> guided

> > > > > through

> > > > > > > Prof

> > > > > > > > > Kalyan Dutt Varma,who is now on the bed.Govt India

> and

> > > > > several

> > > > > > > > other

> > > > > > > > > Govts too have supported the research and even

built

> > mini

> > > > > > jantar-

> > > > > > > > > mantars to calculate the movements of planets and

> study

> > > the

> > > > > > > motion

> > > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > earth.And these effects through research are

getting

> > > > > published

> > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > Sanskrit.Infact even you can try from Tirupati

> > university

> > > > in

> > > > > > > India.

> > > > > > > > > > As far as relativity and percentage of usage of

> > Lahiri

> > > > > > > Ayanamsa.I

> > > > > > > > > have no idea.So I go by your statstics.Incase you

> want

> > to

> > > > be

> > > > > > sure

> > > > > > > > > before you infer as :

> > > > > > > > > > This is a *far cry* from "mostly"

or 'universally'

> > > > > > > > > > Let us be sincere to find the relevance of

Ayanamsa

> > in

> > > > > Helio

> > > > > > > > > Centric Approach mostly followe by the westren

> > > Astrologers.

> > > > > > > > > > Infact what little I have understood from Hindu

> > > > Predictive

> > > > > > > > > Astrology through various approaches of Ganith

> > jyotish,we

> > > > > have

> > > > > > > > three

> > > > > > > > > different lagnas for harmonising the results

arising

> > out

> > > > the

> > > > > > > study

> > > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > natal chart in Astrology.Lagna,Surya as Lagna and

> > mostly

> > > > Moon

> > > > > > as

> > > > > > > > also

> > > > > > > > > lagna.This approach has made us to depend on

various

> > > > > > mathematical

> > > > > > > > > calculations and the relevance of Ayanmsa as a

major

> > > factor

> > > > > of

> > > > > > > > study

> > > > > > > > > was taken up.

> > > > > > > > > > In the case of westren Astrologers and their

> > philosophy

> > > > in

> > > > > > > > handing

> > > > > > > > > over good results without elaborate rules and the

> > > approach

> > > > of

> > > > > > > vedic

> > > > > > > > > Astrology based on the tripod(1,5and9) are to

serve

> for

> > > > > > different

> > > > > > > > > sections of this great universe.We like or not the

> > basic

> > > of

> > > > > our

> > > > > > > > > philosophy in Astrology is related to Karma

> Siddhantam.

> > > > > > > > > > In westren thoughts probably they believe in an

> > > approach

> > > > > > which

> > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > not deterministic but gives an opportunity for

> > > > understanding

> > > > > > what

> > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > not possible but do not go beyond to say why it is

> not

> > > > > possible.

> > > > > > > > > > I agree with you when you say:

> > > > > > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to

have

> > > been

> > > > > > quite

> > > > > > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no

ayanamsha

> at

> > > all

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > > work

> > > > > > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and

> not

> > > just

> > > > > one

> > > > > > > or

> > > > > > > > > two

> > > > > > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results

> > > > > > > > > > Is it not that Astrology has also an intutional

> > element

> > > > > where

> > > > > > > > some

> > > > > > > > > soothe sayers as pointed out by you can off hand

> > predict

> > > > any

> > > > > > > thing?

> > > > > > > > > > In India Astrology is making strides with the

> revival

> > > > > towards

> > > > > > > > Vedic

> > > > > > > > > understanding and to find it's relevance in modern

> > times

> > > > and

> > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > futuristic studies.

> > > > > > > > > > Incidentally I believed late B.V.Raman and Shri

K.N

> > Rao

> > > > as

> > > > > my

> > > > > > > > great

> > > > > > > > > Gurus bout for whose blessing I would not have

> ventured

> > > > > myself

> > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > these highly sensitive areas of discussions.

> > > > > > > > > > Thanx

> > > > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > > rohiniranjan wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Please do not be personally offended but I have

a

> bit

> > > of

> > > > > > > problem

> > > > > > > > > > with "mostly" in your statement. Couple of years

> ago

> > on

> > > > his

> > > > > > > > > newslist,

> > > > > > > > > > I had asked Mr. Rao directly about how such a

> > > conclusion

> > > > > (he

> > > > > > > had

> > > > > > > > > also

> > > > > > > > > > used a statement like "mostly" or 'universally')

> was

> > > > > derived.

> > > > > > > > Given

> > > > > > > > > > that there must be millions of jyotishis in

India

> > > itself

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > population growing like a family of rabbits all

> over

> > > the

> > > > > > globe,

> > > > > > > > how

> > > > > > > > > > can one make a statement like that unless a

survey

> > was

> > > > > done.

> > > > > > It

> > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > his greatness that he eventually responded

saying

> > that

> > > > > > > somewhere

> > > > > > > > (I

> > > > > > > > > > think in Delhi or Poona) a group of panchaang

> makers

> > (I

> > > > > > recall

> > > > > > > > less

> > > > > > > > > > than 30 but I could be remembering it wrongly)

had

> > > > > > congregated

> > > > > > > > with

> > > > > > > > > > some govt. officials and through their

> deliberations

> > > > > (details

> > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > > which I would be curious to learn but have no

clue

> > > where

> > > > to

> > > > > > > find

> > > > > > > > > > those or if those were even published or made

> > avaiable

> > > to

> > > > > > > anyone)

> > > > > > > > > had

> > > > > > > > > > come to the conclusion that chitra or chaitra

> > ayanamsha

> > > > is

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > one

> > > > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > be adopted. I never got the information as to

how

> > many

> > > of

> > > > > > these

> > > > > > > > > fine

> > > > > > > > > > individuals were actually jyotishis, or

practiced

> > > jyotish

> > > > > > with

> > > > > > > > any

> > > > > > > > > > success during their lifetime.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Mr. Rao himself follows and recommends Lahiri

> > ayanamsha

> > > > > which

> > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > pretty close to chitra ayanamsha and I believe

he

> has

> > > > > > mentioned

> > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > he got good results with the ayanamsha and that

> this

> > > was

> > > > > > close

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > what his astrological guru used/recommended and

> also

> > > > close

> > > > > to

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > values that Mr. Karve the psychic who can tell

your

> > > time

> > > > of

> > > > > > > birth

> > > > > > > > > > just by looking/talking to you, produced. Mr.

> Karve,

> > it

> > > > > seems

> > > > > > > > > looked

> > > > > > > > > > at you, and gave a lagna degree and the date and

> with

> > > > > lahiri

> > > > > > > > > > ayanamsha this value matched. Mr. Rao's students

> > > probably

> > > > > use

> > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsha but I have only interacted with

a

> > few

> > > so

> > > > > > > cannot

> > > > > > > > > tell

> > > > > > > > > > about the ultimate preferences of all.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > What we can say that the vocal majority on

internet

> > > > > probably

> > > > > > > uses

> > > > > > > > > > lahiri ayanamsha. If this list is a standard

> > reference,

> > > > > then

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > vocal 'majority' represents less than 1% of the

> > > > > participants

> > > > > > > > (less

> > > > > > > > > > than 26 who discuss jyotish, not counting those

> that

> > > ask

> > > > > for

> > > > > > > > > readings

> > > > > > > > > > only, OUT of some 2600 members). The same would

be

> > the

> > > > > > > experience

> > > > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > > other list subpopulations (less than 1% talk,

> > express,

> > > > > > write).

> > > > > > > So

> > > > > > > > > one

> > > > > > > > > > can safely assume that at least 1% or less of

the

> > > > > astrologers

> > > > > > > > > (sorry

> > > > > > > > > > Jyotishis!) claim to use Lahiri ayanamsha or a

> > similar

> > > > > value.

> > > > > > > > This

> > > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'!

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Mind you, I am not saying that Lahiri ayanamsha

> does

> > > not

> > > > > work

> > > > > > > or

> > > > > > > > > does

> > > > > > > > > > or that there is necessarily a better ayanamsha.

In

> > > fact

> > > > > > there

> > > > > > > > are

> > > > > > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to

have

> > > been

> > > > > > quite

> > > > > > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no

ayanamsha

> at

> > > all

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > > work

> > > > > > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and

> not

> > > just

> > > > > one

> > > > > > > or

> > > > > > > > > two

> > > > > > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results!

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > There are a lot of myths and suppositions and

> claims

> > > > > floating

> > > > > > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > > in the ocean of astrology about this or that

being

> > tge

> > > > > > absolute

> > > > > > > > > truth

> > > > > > > > > > in the field of astrology in general and

statements

> > > such

> > > > as

> > > > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > > > is good for predicting events and tropical

better

> at

> > > > > > describing

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > psyche, etc. As I have pointed out in some

earlier

> > > > written

> > > > > > > > > articles,

> > > > > > > > > > this is more a reflection of the person and his

> > > > background

> > > > > > who

> > > > > > > > then

> > > > > > > > > > went on to become an astrologer - the economist

> drawn

> > > to

> > > > > > > > > forecasting

> > > > > > > > > > the markets, the doctor focussing on astrology

of

> the

> > > > > > diseases,

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > spiritualist seeing the spiritual map in the

> > horoscope,

> > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > psychologist focusing on the psyche as revealed

> > through

> > > > the

> > > > > > map.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > The beauty is that the same little map, or maybe

a

> > few

> > > of

> > > > > > these

> > > > > > > > are

> > > > > > > > > > capable of giving such a rich description of the

> > human

> > > > > > > > experience,

> > > > > > > > > > the full spectrum of which has been beyond the

> scope

> > of

> > > > > > > > > comprehension

> > > > > > > > > > of any one individual, whether astrologer,

> jyotishi,

> > > > > > > > tarotomancer,

> > > > > > > > > > scryer or some Guru yogi divine!

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > RR

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > , "tw853"

> > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Dear amit_call,

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP

ayanamsa

> is

> > > used

> > > > > in

> > > > > > KP

> > > > > > > > > > > analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his

books.

> > > It's

> > > > up

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > preference of an individual astrologer.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Best regards,

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa

> with

> > > > > > > deg:min:sec

> > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > > advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book

2003,

> pp

> > > 1,

> > > > 88-

> > > > > > 93)

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > ,

vattem

> > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > Ji Amitji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of

> > > > discussions

> > > > > > due

> > > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > > differences it has been agreed that

scietifically

> > > > prudent

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > use

> > > > > > > > > > > Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee

constituted

> > has

> > > > also

> > > > > > > > > > recommended

> > > > > > > > > > > for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Infact to add to list I also cite the

research

> of

> > > > Shri

> > > > > > > > K.N.Rao

> > > > > > > > > a

> > > > > > > > > > > renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> > > > > > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > amit_call wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > > > > > > > > I have a confusion over Using different

> Ayamansas.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Using different Ayamansas give different

Charts.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are

different.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Please guide me.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely

> > > > > > > > > > > > Amit

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS

> > SURVIVAL !

> > > ~

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Links

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

/

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > To from this group, send an

email

> to:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the

> >

> > > > > > Terms

> > > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > > > Service.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > All your favorites on one personal page –

Try

> My

> > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > > removed]

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS

SURVIVAL !

> ~

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Links

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > /

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the

 

> > > Terms

> > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > Service.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > The all-new My – Get yours free!

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !

~

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Links

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > /

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > Terms

> > > of

> > > > > > > > Service.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage

> less.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

removed]

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

> > > > > > Links

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > ALL-NEW Messenger - all new features - even more

> > fun!

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

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Thanks Inder Ji.

Thats What his tendencies also say.

Regards

Amit

 

, "Inder"

<indervohra2001> wrote:

>

> Daer Amit,

> I checked the chart with KP.

> The birth data are absolutely correct. No correction required.

> Saturn is his key planet. Saturn is rising in so many cusps sub.[KP]

> So many planets are in sub of Saturn. Saturn in Cacer in Mercury

> star shows his personality.Mer in 1st house Taraus.

> Unfortunate, despodent,fear complex, gathers information/knowlegge,

> severe critical of every thing, not much hope for rise in future.

> May go for spritual persuits later in life.

> Inder

>

> , "amit_call"

> <amit_call> wrote:

> >

> > Ji Rohini ji,

> > I never say anything about which i do not know with certainty.so

> is

> > KSY.

> > The Analysis you gave is almost right.

> > >Does the person have a very sensitive nature, lacks strong self-

> > > esteem

> > This is true.

> > In 2001 He faced comlpex,degrading situations at his Job.

> >

> > > Sexual problems (I realize that is a large net) prior to that,

> and

> > > problems with 'fitting in' into groups, feeling ill-understood

> by

> > > others and similar issues?

> > All is Right.

> > He has lost his Parents.

> > Main problem is his social status.He is a fourth class government

> > servent, the job he got after death of his father while in

service.

> > He is a comlex personality.He is a good critic so much that he

> > critices himself too always.But he is not enough strong to change

> his

> > habits.He doesn't have congenial relations with Relatives(yes

with

> > family of elder sister),Not much good friends,avoid facing

> things.And

> > always an unstability,fear kind of thing is felt.

> > Also his chart needs some rectification.

> > the data i gave is from the chart made by nearby jyotishi.

> > Thanks And Regards

> > Amit

> >

> >

> > , "rohiniranjan"

> <rrgb@s...>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > With lahiri, moon is in the same rashi as ketu, both whether

> using

> > > true or mean nodes. KSY does not exist

> > > With Raman nodes change sign, but cancellation exists same way

> with

> > > other planets.

> > >

> > > Please be careful when using KSY to explain mishaps or other

> > things.

> > > KSY is not an unconditional jail sentance and all troubles

> cannot

> > and

> > > should not be explained based on KSY, full or partial,

perceived

> or

> > > manifest.

> > >

> > > Does the person have a very sensitive nature, lacks strong self-

> > > esteem and around early 2001 began to show somewhat deviation

> from

> > > his normal personality? Trying new and different things, some

> not

> > > positive at all?

> > >

> > > Sexual problems (I realize that is a large net) prior to that,

> and

> > > problems with 'fitting in' into groups, feeling ill-understood

> by

> > > others and similar issues?

> > >

> > > Impulsive and rather grandiose expenditures and extreme

> > restlessness

> > > in spirit and one who would be happier and better performer in

> wide

> > > open spaces rather than confining situations? Like in a

> progressive

> > > society, abroad?

> > >

> > > Restless sleep, dreams of a restless, active, anxious nature?

> > >

> > > Major issues with or concerning elder siblings if they exist,

> > > particularly an elder sister or cousin sister?

> > >

> > > , "amit_call"

> > <amit_call>

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Rohini ji

> > > > The details of native are:

> > > >

> > > > DOB:10-Jun-1977

> > > > Time:04:00 A.M.

> > > > Place:Aligarh,U.P..27N54 78E04

> > > > The chart casted using Lahiri/KP ayamansa gives KSD while

> using

> > > Raman

> > > > Ayamansa it doesn't.

> > > > My Understanding of KSD is when all the Planets are between

> Rahu

> > > and

> > > > Ketu.

> > > > someWhere i read if Any planet joins Ketu or Rahu ..then it

is

> > not

> > > > KSD.In that case it will not be KSD.

> > > > If wrong pls correct me.

> > > > Sincerely

> > > > Amit kUmar

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > , "rohiniranjan"

> > <rrgb@s...>

> > > > wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Amit,

> > > > >

> > > > > This sounds fascinating! Would you care to share the

> birthdata

> > > for

> > > > > the nativity that had KSD only with Lahiri ayanamsha?

> > > > >

> > > > > Thanks

> > > > >

> > > > > RR

> > > > >

> > > > > , "amit_call"

> > > > <amit_call>

> > > > > wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > > I thank all the members for postings and throwing light

on

> > this

> > > > > > Ayamansa confusion.

> > > > > > This is accepted that Pridiction is one's own ability.

> > > > > > Also in a magazine of astrology i read a sloka which

> says "In

> > > > > > Kaliyuga only a few will be true astrologers and the best

> > ones'

> > > > > > pridictive power will only manifest to 25%"

> > > > > > I do not remember the exact sloka but the meaning was

same.

> > > > > > Also i want to add that some time back i met a Nadi

Reader.

> > > > > > in Nadi i was amazed to see that they told my name,my

> parents

> > > > > > name ,some educational background,present condition and a

> > > little

> > > > > more.

> > > > > > also as per Nadi he made a chart and gave to me.

> > > > > > This chart is same as i get using Lahiri and KP Ayamansa.

> > > > > > Also one of my friend got a chance to meet a sidhha

Purush

> in

> > > > > > Bulandshahar(U.P.).He is a young sanyasi.Looking at face

> he

> > > said

> > > > > > something about him..his problems and told that he was

> having

> > > > Kaal

> > > > > > Sarpa Dosha.

> > > > > > I was very new to astrology at that time.I started

reading

> > abt

> > > > KSD

> > > > > > and found that there was really KSD in his chart.

> > > > > > Now i see this chart is as per Lahiri Ayamansa.

> > > > > > Other Ayamansa give no KSD.

> > > > > > Well, its a matter of observation......

> > > > > > I have to observe in a time span which chart better

> explains

> > my

> > > > > life

> > > > > > and which charts Dashas confirms the timing of events.

> > > > > > As i am new to astrology hence i was hesitating to adopt

> this

> > > > > > approach.

> > > > > > Also i sing with your lines "Intuition is great reliable

> > tool".

> > > > > > Thanks

> > > > > > Sincerely

> > > > > > Amit Kumar

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , Amitabh Shastri

> > > > > > <amitabh_shastri> wrote:

> > > > > > > Sorry for the delay in response. But you're right. It

is

> > the

> > > > man

> > > > > > behind the weapon who counts. The weapon is just a piece

> of

> > > > metal,

> > > > > > wood and other ingredients of which it is composed.

> > > > > > > The difference between innimate and animate needs to be

> > > > > understood

> > > > > > very clearly.

> > > > > > > Best wishes for a happy and prosperous new year.

> > > > > > > Amitabh Shastri

> > > > > > > rohiniranjan <rrgb@s...> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Yes -- that is my view too, fwiw.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > rr

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > , "tw853" wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I hope one can use what WORKS for him as INDIVIDUAL

> > > > astrologer,

> > > > > > > while

> > > > > > > > simultaneously respecting the personal preferences of

> > > others.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Best regards,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > --- In

> , "rohiniranjan"

> > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I hope I am understanding you correctly, that your

> > > position

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > no specific ayanamsha alone can explain all that

> > > astrology

> > > > > (as

> > > > > > we

> > > > > > > > > know it) explains. That there are more mysteries

> that

> > > lie,

> > > > > > > Horatio,

> > > > > > > > > between the heaven and earth? If so, then yes that

> is

> > > what

> > > > I

> > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > saying all along, namely, that there are divinators

> > that

> > > > > > > > successfully

> > > > > > > > > use different ayanamshas, and some that do not even

> use

> > > > > > > ayanamshas,

> > > > > > > > > so no point in agonizing over which ayanamsha is

the

> > only

> > > > > > > accurate

> > > > > > > > > one.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Pardon my crude and cruel analogy, but the aiming

> > sights

> > > on

> > > > a

> > > > > > > rifle

> > > > > > > > > while of tremendous help in improving the

> marksmanship,

> > > > would

> > > > > > > alone

> > > > > > > > > not make one an expert marksman! Ayanamsha is like

> > > > > that 'sight'

> > > > > > > > which

> > > > > > > > > definitely is helpful if trained at the target

> > carefully,

> > > > > > > however,

> > > > > > > > > the marksman still must effectively learn to hold

> the

> > > rifle

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > improve their skills.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Most practitioners (present company excepted of

> > course!)

> > > in

> > > > > > > > astrology

> > > > > > > > > of any kind are at best figuring their way out of

> this

> > > > dense

> > > > > > > > forest,

> > > > > > > > > even if they may not be brave enough to admit. Your

> > sage

> > > > > advice

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > not make ayanamsha a big deal is well-given and

> finds

> > > > accord

> > > > > in

> > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > own personal outlook. I respond only when I notice

> > overt

> > > or

> > > > > > > covert

> > > > > > > > > insinuations that a given ayanamsha is somehow the

> best

> > > > > without

> > > > > > > no

> > > > > > > > > direct and ample proof for such, forthcoming.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Happy New Year!

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > RR

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > , vattem

> > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > Hello Rohiniji,

> > > > > > > > > > The Astronomical studies have confirmed

ecliptical

> > > zodiac

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > movements of the planets along with planets was

> never

> > > found

> > > > > to

> > > > > > be

> > > > > > > > > unform.So we have all confusions added to the

> changes

> > > being

> > > > > > > > witnessed

> > > > > > > > > in the planet earth due unpredicatable

> characterstics

> > of

> > > > > > > Nature.I

> > > > > > > > do

> > > > > > > > > not know whether I can put that even the science

> finds

> > it

> > > > > > > difficult

> > > > > > > > > to say in precise nature.May be Ayanamsa correction

> is

> > a

> > > > > > specific

> > > > > > > > > approach from the fixed zodiac of Aries.Westren

> > Astrology

> > > > > based

> > > > > > > on

> > > > > > > > > accptable solar system too may be able to solve the

> > > riddles

> > > > > of

> > > > > > > > human

> > > > > > > > > life and anticipated events.Even we in our

Astrology

> > > avoid

> > > > > > > Neptune

> > > > > > > > > and Pluto,westren Astrologers attribute great

> > > significance

> > > > of

> > > > > > > these

> > > > > > > > > two outer planets.Still i believe that the kind of

> > > > > Shodasamasas

> > > > > > > we

> > > > > > > > > have developed can bring out comfortably various

> > aspects

> > > of

> > > > > > life

> > > > > > > > > including the nature of old age through the aid of

> > > > divisional

> > > > > > > chart.

> > > > > > > > > > Keeping these aspects in mind,probably it is

> > > appropriate

> > > > > till

> > > > > > > > such

> > > > > > > > > that we are not able to deny Ayanamsa,particularly

> > > Lahiri's

> > > > > > > > Ayanamsa

> > > > > > > > > as useful for our purposes but we do not discount

> other

> > > > > > > approaches

> > > > > > > > > and certainly not their efficacy in predictions.

> > > > > > > > > > Certainly Astrology,particularly Vedic Astrology

> to

> > > > unfold

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > future and past events will always remain to be

> > connected

> > > > > with

> > > > > > > > > intution and if not the sixth sense.

> > > > > > > > > > In this we have umpteen examples including a

> 10year

> > old

> > > > > > British

> > > > > > > > who

> > > > > > > > > could recollect from her class rom lessons to say

> the

> > > most

> > > > > > > unusual

> > > > > > > > > and catsrophic events like Tsunami.

> > > > > > > > > > Even Late B.V.raman makes it a point to refer to

> the

> > > > > accuracy

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > Brahma as the creator of universe.

> > > > > > > > > > Iam sure our distinguished members may have some

> more

> > > > > valuble

> > > > > > > > > suggestions on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > Thanx

> > > > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > tw853 wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I fully agree with Vattem Krishnan not to venture

> > > myself

> > > > > into

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > highly sensitive controversy of ayanamsa

> discussion.

> > > For

> > > > > > myself

> > > > > > > I

> > > > > > > > > use

> > > > > > > > > > new KP ayanamsa, while simultaneously respecting

> the

> > > > > personal

> > > > > > > > > > preferences of others.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Best wishes,

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > , vattem

> > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > Hello Amitji,

> > > > > > > > > > > For some time I had the fortune of getting

> > associated

> > > > > with

> > > > > > > > > Phalit

> > > > > > > > > > jyotish through Rastreeya Sanskrit Vidyapeeth,New

> > Delhi.

> > > > > > > > > > > In the committee constituted by the Govt of

> India

> > > even

> > > > > late

> > > > > > > > Shri

> > > > > > > > > > B.V.Raman was also a member apart from several

> vedic

> > > > > scholars

> > > > > > > > from

> > > > > > > > > > Benares,Haridwar and other places.

> > > > > > > > > > > Even in these learned institutions research on

> the

> > > > > > subjectof

> > > > > > > > > > Ayanamsa is being caaried out.Most of these are

> > guided

> > > > > > through

> > > > > > > > Prof

> > > > > > > > > > Kalyan Dutt Varma,who is now on the bed.Govt

India

> > and

> > > > > > several

> > > > > > > > > other

> > > > > > > > > > Govts too have supported the research and even

> built

> > > mini

> > > > > > > jantar-

> > > > > > > > > > mantars to calculate the movements of planets and

> > study

> > > > the

> > > > > > > > motion

> > > > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > > earth.And these effects through research are

> getting

> > > > > > published

> > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > > Sanskrit.Infact even you can try from Tirupati

> > > university

> > > > > in

> > > > > > > > India.

> > > > > > > > > > > As far as relativity and percentage of usage of

> > > Lahiri

> > > > > > > > Ayanamsa.I

> > > > > > > > > > have no idea.So I go by your statstics.Incase you

> > want

> > > to

> > > > > be

> > > > > > > sure

> > > > > > > > > > before you infer as :

> > > > > > > > > > > This is a *far cry* from "mostly"

> or 'universally'

> > > > > > > > > > > Let us be sincere to find the relevance of

> Ayanamsa

> > > in

> > > > > > Helio

> > > > > > > > > > Centric Approach mostly followe by the westren

> > > > Astrologers.

> > > > > > > > > > > Infact what little I have understood from Hindu

> > > > > Predictive

> > > > > > > > > > Astrology through various approaches of Ganith

> > > jyotish,we

> > > > > > have

> > > > > > > > > three

> > > > > > > > > > different lagnas for harmonising the results

> arising

> > > out

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > study

> > > > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > > natal chart in Astrology.Lagna,Surya as Lagna and

> > > mostly

> > > > > Moon

> > > > > > > as

> > > > > > > > > also

> > > > > > > > > > lagna.This approach has made us to depend on

> various

> > > > > > > mathematical

> > > > > > > > > > calculations and the relevance of Ayanmsa as a

> major

> > > > factor

> > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > study

> > > > > > > > > > was taken up.

> > > > > > > > > > > In the case of westren Astrologers and their

> > > philosophy

> > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > handing

> > > > > > > > > > over good results without elaborate rules and the

> > > > approach

> > > > > of

> > > > > > > > vedic

> > > > > > > > > > Astrology based on the tripod(1,5and9) are to

> serve

> > for

> > > > > > > different

> > > > > > > > > > sections of this great universe.We like or not

the

> > > basic

> > > > of

> > > > > > our

> > > > > > > > > > philosophy in Astrology is related to Karma

> > Siddhantam.

> > > > > > > > > > > In westren thoughts probably they believe in an

> > > > approach

> > > > > > > which

> > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > not deterministic but gives an opportunity for

> > > > > understanding

> > > > > > > what

> > > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > not possible but do not go beyond to say why it

is

> > not

> > > > > > possible.

> > > > > > > > > > > I agree with you when you say:

> > > > > > > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to

> have

> > > > been

> > > > > > > quite

> > > > > > > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no

> ayanamsha

> > at

> > > > all

> > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > work

> > > > > > > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees

and

> > not

> > > > just

> > > > > > one

> > > > > > > > or

> > > > > > > > > > two

> > > > > > > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results

> > > > > > > > > > > Is it not that Astrology has also an intutional

> > > element

> > > > > > where

> > > > > > > > > some

> > > > > > > > > > soothe sayers as pointed out by you can off hand

> > > predict

> > > > > any

> > > > > > > > thing?

> > > > > > > > > > > In India Astrology is making strides with the

> > revival

> > > > > > towards

> > > > > > > > > Vedic

> > > > > > > > > > understanding and to find it's relevance in

modern

> > > times

> > > > > and

> > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > > futuristic studies.

> > > > > > > > > > > Incidentally I believed late B.V.Raman and Shri

> K.N

> > > Rao

> > > > > as

> > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > great

> > > > > > > > > > Gurus bout for whose blessing I would not have

> > ventured

> > > > > > myself

> > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > these highly sensitive areas of discussions.

> > > > > > > > > > > Thanx

> > > > > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > > > rohiniranjan wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Please do not be personally offended but I have

> a

> > bit

> > > > of

> > > > > > > > problem

> > > > > > > > > > > with "mostly" in your statement. Couple of

years

> > ago

> > > on

> > > > > his

> > > > > > > > > > newslist,

> > > > > > > > > > > I had asked Mr. Rao directly about how such a

> > > > conclusion

> > > > > > (he

> > > > > > > > had

> > > > > > > > > > also

> > > > > > > > > > > used a statement like "mostly"

or 'universally')

> > was

> > > > > > derived.

> > > > > > > > > Given

> > > > > > > > > > > that there must be millions of jyotishis in

> India

> > > > itself

> > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > population growing like a family of rabbits all

> > over

> > > > the

> > > > > > > globe,

> > > > > > > > > how

> > > > > > > > > > > can one make a statement like that unless a

> survey

> > > was

> > > > > > done.

> > > > > > > It

> > > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > > his greatness that he eventually responded

> saying

> > > that

> > > > > > > > somewhere

> > > > > > > > > (I

> > > > > > > > > > > think in Delhi or Poona) a group of panchaang

> > makers

> > > (I

> > > > > > > recall

> > > > > > > > > less

> > > > > > > > > > > than 30 but I could be remembering it wrongly)

> had

> > > > > > > congregated

> > > > > > > > > with

> > > > > > > > > > > some govt. officials and through their

> > deliberations

> > > > > > (details

> > > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > > > which I would be curious to learn but have no

> clue

> > > > where

> > > > > to

> > > > > > > > find

> > > > > > > > > > > those or if those were even published or made

> > > avaiable

> > > > to

> > > > > > > > anyone)

> > > > > > > > > > had

> > > > > > > > > > > come to the conclusion that chitra or chaitra

> > > ayanamsha

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > one

> > > > > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > > be adopted. I never got the information as to

> how

> > > many

> > > > of

> > > > > > > these

> > > > > > > > > > fine

> > > > > > > > > > > individuals were actually jyotishis, or

> practiced

> > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > with

> > > > > > > > > any

> > > > > > > > > > > success during their lifetime.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Mr. Rao himself follows and recommends Lahiri

> > > ayanamsha

> > > > > > which

> > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > > pretty close to chitra ayanamsha and I believe

> he

> > has

> > > > > > > mentioned

> > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > he got good results with the ayanamsha and that

> > this

> > > > was

> > > > > > > close

> > > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > > what his astrological guru used/recommended and

> > also

> > > > > close

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > values that Mr. Karve the psychic who can tell

> your

> > > > time

> > > > > of

> > > > > > > > birth

> > > > > > > > > > > just by looking/talking to you, produced. Mr.

> > Karve,

> > > it

> > > > > > seems

> > > > > > > > > > looked

> > > > > > > > > > > at you, and gave a lagna degree and the date

and

> > with

> > > > > > lahiri

> > > > > > > > > > > ayanamsha this value matched. Mr. Rao's

students

> > > > probably

> > > > > > use

> > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsha but I have only interacted

with

> a

> > > few

> > > > so

> > > > > > > > cannot

> > > > > > > > > > tell

> > > > > > > > > > > about the ultimate preferences of all.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > What we can say that the vocal majority on

> internet

> > > > > > probably

> > > > > > > > uses

> > > > > > > > > > > lahiri ayanamsha. If this list is a standard

> > > reference,

> > > > > > then

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > vocal 'majority' represents less than 1% of the

> > > > > > participants

> > > > > > > > > (less

> > > > > > > > > > > than 26 who discuss jyotish, not counting those

> > that

> > > > ask

> > > > > > for

> > > > > > > > > > readings

> > > > > > > > > > > only, OUT of some 2600 members). The same would

> be

> > > the

> > > > > > > > experience

> > > > > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > > > other list subpopulations (less than 1% talk,

> > > express,

> > > > > > > write).

> > > > > > > > So

> > > > > > > > > > one

> > > > > > > > > > > can safely assume that at least 1% or less of

> the

> > > > > > astrologers

> > > > > > > > > > (sorry

> > > > > > > > > > > Jyotishis!) claim to use Lahiri ayanamsha or a

> > > similar

> > > > > > value.

> > > > > > > > > This

> > > > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > > a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Mind you, I am not saying that Lahiri ayanamsha

> > does

> > > > not

> > > > > > work

> > > > > > > > or

> > > > > > > > > > does

> > > > > > > > > > > or that there is necessarily a better

ayanamsha.

> In

> > > > fact

> > > > > > > there

> > > > > > > > > are

> > > > > > > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to

> have

> > > > been

> > > > > > > quite

> > > > > > > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no

> ayanamsha

> > at

> > > > all

> > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > work

> > > > > > > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees

and

> > not

> > > > just

> > > > > > one

> > > > > > > > or

> > > > > > > > > > two

> > > > > > > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > There are a lot of myths and suppositions and

> > claims

> > > > > > floating

> > > > > > > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > > > in the ocean of astrology about this or that

> being

> > > tge

> > > > > > > absolute

> > > > > > > > > > truth

> > > > > > > > > > > in the field of astrology in general and

> statements

> > > > such

> > > > > as

> > > > > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > > > > is good for predicting events and tropical

> better

> > at

> > > > > > > describing

> > > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > psyche, etc. As I have pointed out in some

> earlier

> > > > > written

> > > > > > > > > > articles,

> > > > > > > > > > > this is more a reflection of the person and his

> > > > > background

> > > > > > > who

> > > > > > > > > then

> > > > > > > > > > > went on to become an astrologer - the economist

> > drawn

> > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > forecasting

> > > > > > > > > > > the markets, the doctor focussing on astrology

> of

> > the

> > > > > > > diseases,

> > > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > spiritualist seeing the spiritual map in the

> > > horoscope,

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > psychologist focusing on the psyche as revealed

> > > through

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > map.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > The beauty is that the same little map, or

maybe

> a

> > > few

> > > > of

> > > > > > > these

> > > > > > > > > are

> > > > > > > > > > > capable of giving such a rich description of

the

> > > human

> > > > > > > > > experience,

> > > > > > > > > > > the full spectrum of which has been beyond the

> > scope

> > > of

> > > > > > > > > > comprehension

> > > > > > > > > > > of any one individual, whether astrologer,

> > jyotishi,

> > > > > > > > > tarotomancer,

> > > > > > > > > > > scryer or some Guru yogi divine!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > RR

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > --- In

, "tw853"

> > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear amit_call,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP

> ayanamsa

> > is

> > > > used

> > > > > > in

> > > > > > > KP

> > > > > > > > > > > > analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his

> books.

> > > > It's

> > > > > up

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > > preference of an individual astrologer.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa

> > with

> > > > > > > > deg:min:sec

> > > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > > > advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book

> 2003,

> > pp

> > > > 1,

> > > > > 88-

> > > > > > > 93)

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > ,

> vattem

> > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Ji Amitji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of

> > > > > discussions

> > > > > > > due

> > > > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > > > differences it has been agreed that

> scietifically

> > > > > prudent

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > use

> > > > > > > > > > > > Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee

> constituted

> > > has

> > > > > also

> > > > > > > > > > > recommended

> > > > > > > > > > > > for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Infact to add to list I also cite the

> research

> > of

> > > > > Shri

> > > > > > > > > K.N.Rao

> > > > > > > > > > a

> > > > > > > > > > > > renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > amit_call wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > I have a confusion over Using different

> > Ayamansas.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Using different Ayamansas give different

> Charts.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are

> different.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Please guide me.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Amit

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS

> > > SURVIVAL !

> > > > ~

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Links

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> /

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > To from this group, send an

> email

> > to:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the

> > >

> > > > > > > Terms

> > > > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > > > > Service.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > All your favorites on one personal page –

> Try

> > My

> > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have

been

> > > > removed]

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS

> SURVIVAL !

> > ~

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Links

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > /

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > To from this group, send an email

to:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the

>

> > > > Terms

> > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > > Service.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > The all-new My – Get yours free!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS

SURVIVAL !

> ~

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Links

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > /

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the

 

> > > Terms

> > > > of

> > > > > > > > > Service.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage

> > less.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

> > > > > > > Links

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > ALL-NEW Messenger - all new features - even

more

> > > fun!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

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So, do you still think it is KSY that explains any negative things he

is experiencing? And, if not, then how sure are you about this fact

proving this or that way which ayanamsha is true ;-)

 

RR

 

, "amit_call" <amit_call>

wrote:

>

> Ji Rohini ji,

> I never say anything about which i do not know with certainty.so is

> KSY.

> The Analysis you gave is almost right.

> >Does the person have a very sensitive nature, lacks strong self-

> > esteem

> This is true.

> In 2001 He faced comlpex,degrading situations at his Job.

>

> > Sexual problems (I realize that is a large net) prior to that,

and

> > problems with 'fitting in' into groups, feeling ill-understood by

> > others and similar issues?

> All is Right.

> He has lost his Parents.

> Main problem is his social status.He is a fourth class government

> servent, the job he got after death of his father while in service.

> He is a comlex personality.He is a good critic so much that he

> critices himself too always.But he is not enough strong to change

his

> habits.He doesn't have congenial relations with Relatives(yes with

> family of elder sister),Not much good friends,avoid facing

things.And

> always an unstability,fear kind of thing is felt.

> Also his chart needs some rectification.

> the data i gave is from the chart made by nearby jyotishi.

> Thanks And Regards

> Amit

>

>

> , "rohiniranjan" <rrgb@s...>

> wrote:

> >

> > With lahiri, moon is in the same rashi as ketu, both whether

using

> > true or mean nodes. KSY does not exist

> > With Raman nodes change sign, but cancellation exists same way

with

> > other planets.

> >

> > Please be careful when using KSY to explain mishaps or other

> things.

> > KSY is not an unconditional jail sentance and all troubles cannot

> and

> > should not be explained based on KSY, full or partial, perceived

or

> > manifest.

> >

> > Does the person have a very sensitive nature, lacks strong self-

> > esteem and around early 2001 began to show somewhat deviation

from

> > his normal personality? Trying new and different things, some not

> > positive at all?

> >

> > Sexual problems (I realize that is a large net) prior to that,

and

> > problems with 'fitting in' into groups, feeling ill-understood by

> > others and similar issues?

> >

> > Impulsive and rather grandiose expenditures and extreme

> restlessness

> > in spirit and one who would be happier and better performer in

wide

> > open spaces rather than confining situations? Like in a

progressive

> > society, abroad?

> >

> > Restless sleep, dreams of a restless, active, anxious nature?

> >

> > Major issues with or concerning elder siblings if they exist,

> > particularly an elder sister or cousin sister?

> >

> > , "amit_call"

> <amit_call>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Rohini ji

> > > The details of native are:

> > >

> > > DOB:10-Jun-1977

> > > Time:04:00 A.M.

> > > Place:Aligarh,U.P..27N54 78E04

> > > The chart casted using Lahiri/KP ayamansa gives KSD while using

> > Raman

> > > Ayamansa it doesn't.

> > > My Understanding of KSD is when all the Planets are between

Rahu

> > and

> > > Ketu.

> > > someWhere i read if Any planet joins Ketu or Rahu ..then it is

> not

> > > KSD.In that case it will not be KSD.

> > > If wrong pls correct me.

> > > Sincerely

> > > Amit kUmar

> > >

> > >

> > > , "rohiniranjan"

> <rrgb@s...>

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Amit,

> > > >

> > > > This sounds fascinating! Would you care to share the

birthdata

> > for

> > > > the nativity that had KSD only with Lahiri ayanamsha?

> > > >

> > > > Thanks

> > > >

> > > > RR

> > > >

> > > > , "amit_call"

> > > <amit_call>

> > > > wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > I thank all the members for postings and throwing light on

> this

> > > > > Ayamansa confusion.

> > > > > This is accepted that Pridiction is one's own ability.

> > > > > Also in a magazine of astrology i read a sloka which

says "In

> > > > > Kaliyuga only a few will be true astrologers and the best

> ones'

> > > > > pridictive power will only manifest to 25%"

> > > > > I do not remember the exact sloka but the meaning was same.

> > > > > Also i want to add that some time back i met a Nadi Reader.

> > > > > in Nadi i was amazed to see that they told my name,my

parents

> > > > > name ,some educational background,present condition and a

> > little

> > > > more.

> > > > > also as per Nadi he made a chart and gave to me.

> > > > > This chart is same as i get using Lahiri and KP Ayamansa.

> > > > > Also one of my friend got a chance to meet a sidhha Purush

in

> > > > > Bulandshahar(U.P.).He is a young sanyasi.Looking at face he

> > said

> > > > > something about him..his problems and told that he was

having

> > > Kaal

> > > > > Sarpa Dosha.

> > > > > I was very new to astrology at that time.I started reading

> abt

> > > KSD

> > > > > and found that there was really KSD in his chart.

> > > > > Now i see this chart is as per Lahiri Ayamansa.

> > > > > Other Ayamansa give no KSD.

> > > > > Well, its a matter of observation......

> > > > > I have to observe in a time span which chart better

explains

> my

> > > > life

> > > > > and which charts Dashas confirms the timing of events.

> > > > > As i am new to astrology hence i was hesitating to adopt

this

> > > > > approach.

> > > > > Also i sing with your lines "Intuition is great reliable

> tool".

> > > > > Thanks

> > > > > Sincerely

> > > > > Amit Kumar

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > , Amitabh Shastri

> > > > > <amitabh_shastri> wrote:

> > > > > > Sorry for the delay in response. But you're right. It is

> the

> > > man

> > > > > behind the weapon who counts. The weapon is just a piece of

> > > metal,

> > > > > wood and other ingredients of which it is composed.

> > > > > > The difference between innimate and animate needs to be

> > > > understood

> > > > > very clearly.

> > > > > > Best wishes for a happy and prosperous new year.

> > > > > > Amitabh Shastri

> > > > > > rohiniranjan <rrgb@s...> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Yes -- that is my view too, fwiw.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > rr

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , "tw853" wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I hope one can use what WORKS for him as INDIVIDUAL

> > > astrologer,

> > > > > > while

> > > > > > > simultaneously respecting the personal preferences of

> > others.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Best regards,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > , "rohiniranjan"

> > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I hope I am understanding you correctly, that your

> > position

> > > > is

> > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > no specific ayanamsha alone can explain all that

> > astrology

> > > > (as

> > > > > we

> > > > > > > > know it) explains. That there are more mysteries that

> > lie,

> > > > > > Horatio,

> > > > > > > > between the heaven and earth? If so, then yes that is

> > what

> > > I

> > > > > was

> > > > > > > > saying all along, namely, that there are divinators

> that

> > > > > > > successfully

> > > > > > > > use different ayanamshas, and some that do not even

use

> > > > > > ayanamshas,

> > > > > > > > so no point in agonizing over which ayanamsha is the

> only

> > > > > > accurate

> > > > > > > > one.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Pardon my crude and cruel analogy, but the aiming

> sights

> > on

> > > a

> > > > > > rifle

> > > > > > > > while of tremendous help in improving the

marksmanship,

> > > would

> > > > > > alone

> > > > > > > > not make one an expert marksman! Ayanamsha is like

> > > > that 'sight'

> > > > > > > which

> > > > > > > > definitely is helpful if trained at the target

> carefully,

> > > > > > however,

> > > > > > > > the marksman still must effectively learn to hold the

> > rifle

> > > > and

> > > > > > > > improve their skills.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Most practitioners (present company excepted of

> course!)

> > in

> > > > > > > astrology

> > > > > > > > of any kind are at best figuring their way out of

this

> > > dense

> > > > > > > forest,

> > > > > > > > even if they may not be brave enough to admit. Your

> sage

> > > > advice

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > not make ayanamsha a big deal is well-given and finds

> > > accord

> > > > in

> > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > own personal outlook. I respond only when I notice

> overt

> > or

> > > > > > covert

> > > > > > > > insinuations that a given ayanamsha is somehow the

best

> > > > without

> > > > > > no

> > > > > > > > direct and ample proof for such, forthcoming.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Happy New Year!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > RR

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > , vattem

> krishnan

> > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > Hello Rohiniji,

> > > > > > > > > The Astronomical studies have confirmed ecliptical

> > zodiac

> > > > and

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > movements of the planets along with planets was never

> > found

> > > > to

> > > > > be

> > > > > > > > unform.So we have all confusions added to the changes

> > being

> > > > > > > witnessed

> > > > > > > > in the planet earth due unpredicatable characterstics

> of

> > > > > > Nature.I

> > > > > > > do

> > > > > > > > not know whether I can put that even the science

finds

> it

> > > > > > difficult

> > > > > > > > to say in precise nature.May be Ayanamsa correction

is

> a

> > > > > specific

> > > > > > > > approach from the fixed zodiac of Aries.Westren

> Astrology

> > > > based

> > > > > > on

> > > > > > > > accptable solar system too may be able to solve the

> > riddles

> > > > of

> > > > > > > human

> > > > > > > > life and anticipated events.Even we in our Astrology

> > avoid

> > > > > > Neptune

> > > > > > > > and Pluto,westren Astrologers attribute great

> > significance

> > > of

> > > > > > these

> > > > > > > > two outer planets.Still i believe that the kind of

> > > > Shodasamasas

> > > > > > we

> > > > > > > > have developed can bring out comfortably various

> aspects

> > of

> > > > > life

> > > > > > > > including the nature of old age through the aid of

> > > divisional

> > > > > > chart.

> > > > > > > > > Keeping these aspects in mind,probably it is

> > appropriate

> > > > till

> > > > > > > such

> > > > > > > > that we are not able to deny Ayanamsa,particularly

> > Lahiri's

> > > > > > > Ayanamsa

> > > > > > > > as useful for our purposes but we do not discount

other

> > > > > > approaches

> > > > > > > > and certainly not their efficacy in predictions.

> > > > > > > > > Certainly Astrology,particularly Vedic Astrology to

> > > unfold

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > future and past events will always remain to be

> connected

> > > > with

> > > > > > > > intution and if not the sixth sense.

> > > > > > > > > In this we have umpteen examples including a 10year

> old

> > > > > British

> > > > > > > who

> > > > > > > > could recollect from her class rom lessons to say the

> > most

> > > > > > unusual

> > > > > > > > and catsrophic events like Tsunami.

> > > > > > > > > Even Late B.V.raman makes it a point to refer to

the

> > > > accuracy

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > Brahma as the creator of universe.

> > > > > > > > > Iam sure our distinguished members may have some

more

> > > > valuble

> > > > > > > > suggestions on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > Thanx

> > > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > tw853 wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I fully agree with Vattem Krishnan not to venture

> > myself

> > > > into

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > highly sensitive controversy of ayanamsa

discussion.

> > For

> > > > > myself

> > > > > > I

> > > > > > > > use

> > > > > > > > > new KP ayanamsa, while simultaneously respecting

the

> > > > personal

> > > > > > > > > preferences of others.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Best wishes,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > , vattem

> > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > Hello Amitji,

> > > > > > > > > > For some time I had the fortune of getting

> associated

> > > > with

> > > > > > > > Phalit

> > > > > > > > > jyotish through Rastreeya Sanskrit Vidyapeeth,New

> Delhi.

> > > > > > > > > > In the committee constituted by the Govt of India

> > even

> > > > late

> > > > > > > Shri

> > > > > > > > > B.V.Raman was also a member apart from several

vedic

> > > > scholars

> > > > > > > from

> > > > > > > > > Benares,Haridwar and other places.

> > > > > > > > > > Even in these learned institutions research on

the

> > > > > subjectof

> > > > > > > > > Ayanamsa is being caaried out.Most of these are

> guided

> > > > > through

> > > > > > > Prof

> > > > > > > > > Kalyan Dutt Varma,who is now on the bed.Govt India

> and

> > > > > several

> > > > > > > > other

> > > > > > > > > Govts too have supported the research and even

built

> > mini

> > > > > > jantar-

> > > > > > > > > mantars to calculate the movements of planets and

> study

> > > the

> > > > > > > motion

> > > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > earth.And these effects through research are

getting

> > > > > published

> > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > Sanskrit.Infact even you can try from Tirupati

> > university

> > > > in

> > > > > > > India.

> > > > > > > > > > As far as relativity and percentage of usage of

> > Lahiri

> > > > > > > Ayanamsa.I

> > > > > > > > > have no idea.So I go by your statstics.Incase you

> want

> > to

> > > > be

> > > > > > sure

> > > > > > > > > before you infer as :

> > > > > > > > > > This is a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'

> > > > > > > > > > Let us be sincere to find the relevance of

Ayanamsa

> > in

> > > > > Helio

> > > > > > > > > Centric Approach mostly followe by the westren

> > > Astrologers.

> > > > > > > > > > Infact what little I have understood from Hindu

> > > > Predictive

> > > > > > > > > Astrology through various approaches of Ganith

> > jyotish,we

> > > > > have

> > > > > > > > three

> > > > > > > > > different lagnas for harmonising the results

arising

> > out

> > > > the

> > > > > > > study

> > > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > natal chart in Astrology.Lagna,Surya as Lagna and

> > mostly

> > > > Moon

> > > > > > as

> > > > > > > > also

> > > > > > > > > lagna.This approach has made us to depend on

various

> > > > > > mathematical

> > > > > > > > > calculations and the relevance of Ayanmsa as a

major

> > > factor

> > > > > of

> > > > > > > > study

> > > > > > > > > was taken up.

> > > > > > > > > > In the case of westren Astrologers and their

> > philosophy

> > > > in

> > > > > > > > handing

> > > > > > > > > over good results without elaborate rules and the

> > > approach

> > > > of

> > > > > > > vedic

> > > > > > > > > Astrology based on the tripod(1,5and9) are to serve

> for

> > > > > > different

> > > > > > > > > sections of this great universe.We like or not the

> > basic

> > > of

> > > > > our

> > > > > > > > > philosophy in Astrology is related to Karma

> Siddhantam.

> > > > > > > > > > In westren thoughts probably they believe in an

> > > approach

> > > > > > which

> > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > not deterministic but gives an opportunity for

> > > > understanding

> > > > > > what

> > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > not possible but do not go beyond to say why it is

> not

> > > > > possible.

> > > > > > > > > > I agree with you when you say:

> > > > > > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to

have

> > > been

> > > > > > quite

> > > > > > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no

ayanamsha

> at

> > > all

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > > work

> > > > > > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and

> not

> > > just

> > > > > one

> > > > > > > or

> > > > > > > > > two

> > > > > > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results

> > > > > > > > > > Is it not that Astrology has also an intutional

> > element

> > > > > where

> > > > > > > > some

> > > > > > > > > soothe sayers as pointed out by you can off hand

> > predict

> > > > any

> > > > > > > thing?

> > > > > > > > > > In India Astrology is making strides with the

> revival

> > > > > towards

> > > > > > > > Vedic

> > > > > > > > > understanding and to find it's relevance in modern

> > times

> > > > and

> > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > futuristic studies.

> > > > > > > > > > Incidentally I believed late B.V.Raman and Shri

K.N

> > Rao

> > > > as

> > > > > my

> > > > > > > > great

> > > > > > > > > Gurus bout for whose blessing I would not have

> ventured

> > > > > myself

> > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > these highly sensitive areas of discussions.

> > > > > > > > > > Thanx

> > > > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > > rohiniranjan wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Please do not be personally offended but I have a

> bit

> > > of

> > > > > > > problem

> > > > > > > > > > with "mostly" in your statement. Couple of years

> ago

> > on

> > > > his

> > > > > > > > > newslist,

> > > > > > > > > > I had asked Mr. Rao directly about how such a

> > > conclusion

> > > > > (he

> > > > > > > had

> > > > > > > > > also

> > > > > > > > > > used a statement like "mostly" or 'universally')

> was

> > > > > derived.

> > > > > > > > Given

> > > > > > > > > > that there must be millions of jyotishis in India

> > > itself

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > population growing like a family of rabbits all

> over

> > > the

> > > > > > globe,

> > > > > > > > how

> > > > > > > > > > can one make a statement like that unless a

survey

> > was

> > > > > done.

> > > > > > It

> > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > his greatness that he eventually responded saying

> > that

> > > > > > > somewhere

> > > > > > > > (I

> > > > > > > > > > think in Delhi or Poona) a group of panchaang

> makers

> > (I

> > > > > > recall

> > > > > > > > less

> > > > > > > > > > than 30 but I could be remembering it wrongly)

had

> > > > > > congregated

> > > > > > > > with

> > > > > > > > > > some govt. officials and through their

> deliberations

> > > > > (details

> > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > > which I would be curious to learn but have no

clue

> > > where

> > > > to

> > > > > > > find

> > > > > > > > > > those or if those were even published or made

> > avaiable

> > > to

> > > > > > > anyone)

> > > > > > > > > had

> > > > > > > > > > come to the conclusion that chitra or chaitra

> > ayanamsha

> > > > is

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > one

> > > > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > be adopted. I never got the information as to how

> > many

> > > of

> > > > > > these

> > > > > > > > > fine

> > > > > > > > > > individuals were actually jyotishis, or practiced

> > > jyotish

> > > > > > with

> > > > > > > > any

> > > > > > > > > > success during their lifetime.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Mr. Rao himself follows and recommends Lahiri

> > ayanamsha

> > > > > which

> > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > pretty close to chitra ayanamsha and I believe he

> has

> > > > > > mentioned

> > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > he got good results with the ayanamsha and that

> this

> > > was

> > > > > > close

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > what his astrological guru used/recommended and

> also

> > > > close

> > > > > to

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > values that Mr. Karve the psychic who can tell

your

> > > time

> > > > of

> > > > > > > birth

> > > > > > > > > > just by looking/talking to you, produced. Mr.

> Karve,

> > it

> > > > > seems

> > > > > > > > > looked

> > > > > > > > > > at you, and gave a lagna degree and the date and

> with

> > > > > lahiri

> > > > > > > > > > ayanamsha this value matched. Mr. Rao's students

> > > probably

> > > > > use

> > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsha but I have only interacted with

a

> > few

> > > so

> > > > > > > cannot

> > > > > > > > > tell

> > > > > > > > > > about the ultimate preferences of all.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > What we can say that the vocal majority on

internet

> > > > > probably

> > > > > > > uses

> > > > > > > > > > lahiri ayanamsha. If this list is a standard

> > reference,

> > > > > then

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > vocal 'majority' represents less than 1% of the

> > > > > participants

> > > > > > > > (less

> > > > > > > > > > than 26 who discuss jyotish, not counting those

> that

> > > ask

> > > > > for

> > > > > > > > > readings

> > > > > > > > > > only, OUT of some 2600 members). The same would

be

> > the

> > > > > > > experience

> > > > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > > other list subpopulations (less than 1% talk,

> > express,

> > > > > > write).

> > > > > > > So

> > > > > > > > > one

> > > > > > > > > > can safely assume that at least 1% or less of the

> > > > > astrologers

> > > > > > > > > (sorry

> > > > > > > > > > Jyotishis!) claim to use Lahiri ayanamsha or a

> > similar

> > > > > value.

> > > > > > > > This

> > > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'!

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Mind you, I am not saying that Lahiri ayanamsha

> does

> > > not

> > > > > work

> > > > > > > or

> > > > > > > > > does

> > > > > > > > > > or that there is necessarily a better ayanamsha.

In

> > > fact

> > > > > > there

> > > > > > > > are

> > > > > > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to

have

> > > been

> > > > > > quite

> > > > > > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no

ayanamsha

> at

> > > all

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > > work

> > > > > > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees and

> not

> > > just

> > > > > one

> > > > > > > or

> > > > > > > > > two

> > > > > > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results!

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > There are a lot of myths and suppositions and

> claims

> > > > > floating

> > > > > > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > > in the ocean of astrology about this or that

being

> > tge

> > > > > > absolute

> > > > > > > > > truth

> > > > > > > > > > in the field of astrology in general and

statements

> > > such

> > > > as

> > > > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > > > is good for predicting events and tropical better

> at

> > > > > > describing

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > psyche, etc. As I have pointed out in some

earlier

> > > > written

> > > > > > > > > articles,

> > > > > > > > > > this is more a reflection of the person and his

> > > > background

> > > > > > who

> > > > > > > > then

> > > > > > > > > > went on to become an astrologer - the economist

> drawn

> > > to

> > > > > > > > > forecasting

> > > > > > > > > > the markets, the doctor focussing on astrology of

> the

> > > > > > diseases,

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > spiritualist seeing the spiritual map in the

> > horoscope,

> > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > psychologist focusing on the psyche as revealed

> > through

> > > > the

> > > > > > map.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > The beauty is that the same little map, or maybe

a

> > few

> > > of

> > > > > > these

> > > > > > > > are

> > > > > > > > > > capable of giving such a rich description of the

> > human

> > > > > > > > experience,

> > > > > > > > > > the full spectrum of which has been beyond the

> scope

> > of

> > > > > > > > > comprehension

> > > > > > > > > > of any one individual, whether astrologer,

> jyotishi,

> > > > > > > > tarotomancer,

> > > > > > > > > > scryer or some Guru yogi divine!

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > RR

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > , "tw853"

> > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Dear amit_call,

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP ayanamsa

> is

> > > used

> > > > > in

> > > > > > KP

> > > > > > > > > > > analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his

books.

> > > It's

> > > > up

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > preference of an individual astrologer.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Best regards,

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa

> with

> > > > > > > deg:min:sec

> > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > > advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book

2003,

> pp

> > > 1,

> > > > 88-

> > > > > > 93)

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > , vattem

> > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > Ji Amitji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of

> > > > discussions

> > > > > > due

> > > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > > differences it has been agreed that

scietifically

> > > > prudent

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > use

> > > > > > > > > > > Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee

constituted

> > has

> > > > also

> > > > > > > > > > recommended

> > > > > > > > > > > for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Infact to add to list I also cite the

research

> of

> > > > Shri

> > > > > > > > K.N.Rao

> > > > > > > > > a

> > > > > > > > > > > renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> > > > > > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > amit_call wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > > > > > > > > I have a confusion over Using different

> Ayamansas.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Using different Ayamansas give different

Charts.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are different.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Please guide me.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely

> > > > > > > > > > > > Amit

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS

> > SURVIVAL !

> > > ~

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Links

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

/

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > To from this group, send an email

> to:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the

> >

> > > > > > Terms

> > > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > > > Service.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > All your favorites on one personal page – Try

> My

> > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > > removed]

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS

SURVIVAL !

> ~

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Links

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > /

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the

 

> > > Terms

> > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > Service.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > The all-new My – Get yours free!

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !

~

> > > > > > > > >

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Rohini ji,

I am very novice to astrology......so was confused with Ayamansas.

Some I raed an article explaining that many celebrities had/have KSY.

that article intended that KSY is not always responsible for mishaps.

This Ayamansa confusion will take time ....as i grow in understadings

of astrology i will keep observing ........

Thanks for all your guidance.

Regards

Amit

 

, "rohiniranjan" <rrgb@s...>

wrote:

>

> So, do you still think it is KSY that explains any negative things

he

> is experiencing? And, if not, then how sure are you about this fact

> proving this or that way which ayanamsha is true ;-)

>

> RR

>

> , "amit_call"

<amit_call>

> wrote:

> >

> > Ji Rohini ji,

> > I never say anything about which i do not know with certainty.so

is

> > KSY.

> > The Analysis you gave is almost right.

> > >Does the person have a very sensitive nature, lacks strong self-

> > > esteem

> > This is true.

> > In 2001 He faced comlpex,degrading situations at his Job.

> >

> > > Sexual problems (I realize that is a large net) prior to that,

> and

> > > problems with 'fitting in' into groups, feeling ill-understood

by

> > > others and similar issues?

> > All is Right.

> > He has lost his Parents.

> > Main problem is his social status.He is a fourth class government

> > servent, the job he got after death of his father while in

service.

> > He is a comlex personality.He is a good critic so much that he

> > critices himself too always.But he is not enough strong to change

> his

> > habits.He doesn't have congenial relations with Relatives(yes

with

> > family of elder sister),Not much good friends,avoid facing

> things.And

> > always an unstability,fear kind of thing is felt.

> > Also his chart needs some rectification.

> > the data i gave is from the chart made by nearby jyotishi.

> > Thanks And Regards

> > Amit

> >

> >

> > , "rohiniranjan"

<rrgb@s...>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > With lahiri, moon is in the same rashi as ketu, both whether

> using

> > > true or mean nodes. KSY does not exist

> > > With Raman nodes change sign, but cancellation exists same way

> with

> > > other planets.

> > >

> > > Please be careful when using KSY to explain mishaps or other

> > things.

> > > KSY is not an unconditional jail sentance and all troubles

cannot

> > and

> > > should not be explained based on KSY, full or partial,

perceived

> or

> > > manifest.

> > >

> > > Does the person have a very sensitive nature, lacks strong self-

> > > esteem and around early 2001 began to show somewhat deviation

> from

> > > his normal personality? Trying new and different things, some

not

> > > positive at all?

> > >

> > > Sexual problems (I realize that is a large net) prior to that,

> and

> > > problems with 'fitting in' into groups, feeling ill-understood

by

> > > others and similar issues?

> > >

> > > Impulsive and rather grandiose expenditures and extreme

> > restlessness

> > > in spirit and one who would be happier and better performer in

> wide

> > > open spaces rather than confining situations? Like in a

> progressive

> > > society, abroad?

> > >

> > > Restless sleep, dreams of a restless, active, anxious nature?

> > >

> > > Major issues with or concerning elder siblings if they exist,

> > > particularly an elder sister or cousin sister?

> > >

> > > , "amit_call"

> > <amit_call>

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Rohini ji

> > > > The details of native are:

> > > >

> > > > DOB:10-Jun-1977

> > > > Time:04:00 A.M.

> > > > Place:Aligarh,U.P..27N54 78E04

> > > > The chart casted using Lahiri/KP ayamansa gives KSD while

using

> > > Raman

> > > > Ayamansa it doesn't.

> > > > My Understanding of KSD is when all the Planets are between

> Rahu

> > > and

> > > > Ketu.

> > > > someWhere i read if Any planet joins Ketu or Rahu ..then it

is

> > not

> > > > KSD.In that case it will not be KSD.

> > > > If wrong pls correct me.

> > > > Sincerely

> > > > Amit kUmar

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > , "rohiniranjan"

> > <rrgb@s...>

> > > > wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Amit,

> > > > >

> > > > > This sounds fascinating! Would you care to share the

> birthdata

> > > for

> > > > > the nativity that had KSD only with Lahiri ayanamsha?

> > > > >

> > > > > Thanks

> > > > >

> > > > > RR

> > > > >

> > > > > , "amit_call"

> > > > <amit_call>

> > > > > wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > > I thank all the members for postings and throwing light

on

> > this

> > > > > > Ayamansa confusion.

> > > > > > This is accepted that Pridiction is one's own ability.

> > > > > > Also in a magazine of astrology i read a sloka which

> says "In

> > > > > > Kaliyuga only a few will be true astrologers and the best

> > ones'

> > > > > > pridictive power will only manifest to 25%"

> > > > > > I do not remember the exact sloka but the meaning was

same.

> > > > > > Also i want to add that some time back i met a Nadi

Reader.

> > > > > > in Nadi i was amazed to see that they told my name,my

> parents

> > > > > > name ,some educational background,present condition and a

> > > little

> > > > > more.

> > > > > > also as per Nadi he made a chart and gave to me.

> > > > > > This chart is same as i get using Lahiri and KP Ayamansa.

> > > > > > Also one of my friend got a chance to meet a sidhha

Purush

> in

> > > > > > Bulandshahar(U.P.).He is a young sanyasi.Looking at face

he

> > > said

> > > > > > something about him..his problems and told that he was

> having

> > > > Kaal

> > > > > > Sarpa Dosha.

> > > > > > I was very new to astrology at that time.I started

reading

> > abt

> > > > KSD

> > > > > > and found that there was really KSD in his chart.

> > > > > > Now i see this chart is as per Lahiri Ayamansa.

> > > > > > Other Ayamansa give no KSD.

> > > > > > Well, its a matter of observation......

> > > > > > I have to observe in a time span which chart better

> explains

> > my

> > > > > life

> > > > > > and which charts Dashas confirms the timing of events.

> > > > > > As i am new to astrology hence i was hesitating to adopt

> this

> > > > > > approach.

> > > > > > Also i sing with your lines "Intuition is great reliable

> > tool".

> > > > > > Thanks

> > > > > > Sincerely

> > > > > > Amit Kumar

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , Amitabh Shastri

> > > > > > <amitabh_shastri> wrote:

> > > > > > > Sorry for the delay in response. But you're right. It

is

> > the

> > > > man

> > > > > > behind the weapon who counts. The weapon is just a piece

of

> > > > metal,

> > > > > > wood and other ingredients of which it is composed.

> > > > > > > The difference between innimate and animate needs to be

> > > > > understood

> > > > > > very clearly.

> > > > > > > Best wishes for a happy and prosperous new year.

> > > > > > > Amitabh Shastri

> > > > > > > rohiniranjan <rrgb@s...> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Yes -- that is my view too, fwiw.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > rr

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > , "tw853" wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I hope one can use what WORKS for him as INDIVIDUAL

> > > > astrologer,

> > > > > > > while

> > > > > > > > simultaneously respecting the personal preferences of

> > > others.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Best regards,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > --- In

, "rohiniranjan"

> > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I hope I am understanding you correctly, that your

> > > position

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > no specific ayanamsha alone can explain all that

> > > astrology

> > > > > (as

> > > > > > we

> > > > > > > > > know it) explains. That there are more mysteries

that

> > > lie,

> > > > > > > Horatio,

> > > > > > > > > between the heaven and earth? If so, then yes that

is

> > > what

> > > > I

> > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > saying all along, namely, that there are divinators

> > that

> > > > > > > > successfully

> > > > > > > > > use different ayanamshas, and some that do not even

> use

> > > > > > > ayanamshas,

> > > > > > > > > so no point in agonizing over which ayanamsha is

the

> > only

> > > > > > > accurate

> > > > > > > > > one.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Pardon my crude and cruel analogy, but the aiming

> > sights

> > > on

> > > > a

> > > > > > > rifle

> > > > > > > > > while of tremendous help in improving the

> marksmanship,

> > > > would

> > > > > > > alone

> > > > > > > > > not make one an expert marksman! Ayanamsha is like

> > > > > that 'sight'

> > > > > > > > which

> > > > > > > > > definitely is helpful if trained at the target

> > carefully,

> > > > > > > however,

> > > > > > > > > the marksman still must effectively learn to hold

the

> > > rifle

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > improve their skills.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Most practitioners (present company excepted of

> > course!)

> > > in

> > > > > > > > astrology

> > > > > > > > > of any kind are at best figuring their way out of

> this

> > > > dense

> > > > > > > > forest,

> > > > > > > > > even if they may not be brave enough to admit. Your

> > sage

> > > > > advice

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > not make ayanamsha a big deal is well-given and

finds

> > > > accord

> > > > > in

> > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > own personal outlook. I respond only when I notice

> > overt

> > > or

> > > > > > > covert

> > > > > > > > > insinuations that a given ayanamsha is somehow the

> best

> > > > > without

> > > > > > > no

> > > > > > > > > direct and ample proof for such, forthcoming.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Happy New Year!

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > RR

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > , vattem

> > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > Hello Rohiniji,

> > > > > > > > > > The Astronomical studies have confirmed

ecliptical

> > > zodiac

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > movements of the planets along with planets was

never

> > > found

> > > > > to

> > > > > > be

> > > > > > > > > unform.So we have all confusions added to the

changes

> > > being

> > > > > > > > witnessed

> > > > > > > > > in the planet earth due unpredicatable

characterstics

> > of

> > > > > > > Nature.I

> > > > > > > > do

> > > > > > > > > not know whether I can put that even the science

> finds

> > it

> > > > > > > difficult

> > > > > > > > > to say in precise nature.May be Ayanamsa correction

> is

> > a

> > > > > > specific

> > > > > > > > > approach from the fixed zodiac of Aries.Westren

> > Astrology

> > > > > based

> > > > > > > on

> > > > > > > > > accptable solar system too may be able to solve the

> > > riddles

> > > > > of

> > > > > > > > human

> > > > > > > > > life and anticipated events.Even we in our

Astrology

> > > avoid

> > > > > > > Neptune

> > > > > > > > > and Pluto,westren Astrologers attribute great

> > > significance

> > > > of

> > > > > > > these

> > > > > > > > > two outer planets.Still i believe that the kind of

> > > > > Shodasamasas

> > > > > > > we

> > > > > > > > > have developed can bring out comfortably various

> > aspects

> > > of

> > > > > > life

> > > > > > > > > including the nature of old age through the aid of

> > > > divisional

> > > > > > > chart.

> > > > > > > > > > Keeping these aspects in mind,probably it is

> > > appropriate

> > > > > till

> > > > > > > > such

> > > > > > > > > that we are not able to deny Ayanamsa,particularly

> > > Lahiri's

> > > > > > > > Ayanamsa

> > > > > > > > > as useful for our purposes but we do not discount

> other

> > > > > > > approaches

> > > > > > > > > and certainly not their efficacy in predictions.

> > > > > > > > > > Certainly Astrology,particularly Vedic Astrology

to

> > > > unfold

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > future and past events will always remain to be

> > connected

> > > > > with

> > > > > > > > > intution and if not the sixth sense.

> > > > > > > > > > In this we have umpteen examples including a

10year

> > old

> > > > > > British

> > > > > > > > who

> > > > > > > > > could recollect from her class rom lessons to say

the

> > > most

> > > > > > > unusual

> > > > > > > > > and catsrophic events like Tsunami.

> > > > > > > > > > Even Late B.V.raman makes it a point to refer to

> the

> > > > > accuracy

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > Brahma as the creator of universe.

> > > > > > > > > > Iam sure our distinguished members may have some

> more

> > > > > valuble

> > > > > > > > > suggestions on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > Thanx

> > > > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > tw853 wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I fully agree with Vattem Krishnan not to venture

> > > myself

> > > > > into

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > highly sensitive controversy of ayanamsa

> discussion.

> > > For

> > > > > > myself

> > > > > > > I

> > > > > > > > > use

> > > > > > > > > > new KP ayanamsa, while simultaneously respecting

> the

> > > > > personal

> > > > > > > > > > preferences of others.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Best wishes,

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > , vattem

> > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > Hello Amitji,

> > > > > > > > > > > For some time I had the fortune of getting

> > associated

> > > > > with

> > > > > > > > > Phalit

> > > > > > > > > > jyotish through Rastreeya Sanskrit Vidyapeeth,New

> > Delhi.

> > > > > > > > > > > In the committee constituted by the Govt of

India

> > > even

> > > > > late

> > > > > > > > Shri

> > > > > > > > > > B.V.Raman was also a member apart from several

> vedic

> > > > > scholars

> > > > > > > > from

> > > > > > > > > > Benares,Haridwar and other places.

> > > > > > > > > > > Even in these learned institutions research on

> the

> > > > > > subjectof

> > > > > > > > > > Ayanamsa is being caaried out.Most of these are

> > guided

> > > > > > through

> > > > > > > > Prof

> > > > > > > > > > Kalyan Dutt Varma,who is now on the bed.Govt

India

> > and

> > > > > > several

> > > > > > > > > other

> > > > > > > > > > Govts too have supported the research and even

> built

> > > mini

> > > > > > > jantar-

> > > > > > > > > > mantars to calculate the movements of planets and

> > study

> > > > the

> > > > > > > > motion

> > > > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > > earth.And these effects through research are

> getting

> > > > > > published

> > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > > Sanskrit.Infact even you can try from Tirupati

> > > university

> > > > > in

> > > > > > > > India.

> > > > > > > > > > > As far as relativity and percentage of usage of

> > > Lahiri

> > > > > > > > Ayanamsa.I

> > > > > > > > > > have no idea.So I go by your statstics.Incase you

> > want

> > > to

> > > > > be

> > > > > > > sure

> > > > > > > > > > before you infer as :

> > > > > > > > > > > This is a *far cry* from "mostly"

or 'universally'

> > > > > > > > > > > Let us be sincere to find the relevance of

> Ayanamsa

> > > in

> > > > > > Helio

> > > > > > > > > > Centric Approach mostly followe by the westren

> > > > Astrologers.

> > > > > > > > > > > Infact what little I have understood from Hindu

> > > > > Predictive

> > > > > > > > > > Astrology through various approaches of Ganith

> > > jyotish,we

> > > > > > have

> > > > > > > > > three

> > > > > > > > > > different lagnas for harmonising the results

> arising

> > > out

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > study

> > > > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > > natal chart in Astrology.Lagna,Surya as Lagna and

> > > mostly

> > > > > Moon

> > > > > > > as

> > > > > > > > > also

> > > > > > > > > > lagna.This approach has made us to depend on

> various

> > > > > > > mathematical

> > > > > > > > > > calculations and the relevance of Ayanmsa as a

> major

> > > > factor

> > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > study

> > > > > > > > > > was taken up.

> > > > > > > > > > > In the case of westren Astrologers and their

> > > philosophy

> > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > handing

> > > > > > > > > > over good results without elaborate rules and the

> > > > approach

> > > > > of

> > > > > > > > vedic

> > > > > > > > > > Astrology based on the tripod(1,5and9) are to

serve

> > for

> > > > > > > different

> > > > > > > > > > sections of this great universe.We like or not

the

> > > basic

> > > > of

> > > > > > our

> > > > > > > > > > philosophy in Astrology is related to Karma

> > Siddhantam.

> > > > > > > > > > > In westren thoughts probably they believe in an

> > > > approach

> > > > > > > which

> > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > not deterministic but gives an opportunity for

> > > > > understanding

> > > > > > > what

> > > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > not possible but do not go beyond to say why it

is

> > not

> > > > > > possible.

> > > > > > > > > > > I agree with you when you say:

> > > > > > > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to

> have

> > > > been

> > > > > > > quite

> > > > > > > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no

> ayanamsha

> > at

> > > > all

> > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > work

> > > > > > > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees

and

> > not

> > > > just

> > > > > > one

> > > > > > > > or

> > > > > > > > > > two

> > > > > > > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results

> > > > > > > > > > > Is it not that Astrology has also an intutional

> > > element

> > > > > > where

> > > > > > > > > some

> > > > > > > > > > soothe sayers as pointed out by you can off hand

> > > predict

> > > > > any

> > > > > > > > thing?

> > > > > > > > > > > In India Astrology is making strides with the

> > revival

> > > > > > towards

> > > > > > > > > Vedic

> > > > > > > > > > understanding and to find it's relevance in

modern

> > > times

> > > > > and

> > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > > futuristic studies.

> > > > > > > > > > > Incidentally I believed late B.V.Raman and Shri

> K.N

> > > Rao

> > > > > as

> > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > great

> > > > > > > > > > Gurus bout for whose blessing I would not have

> > ventured

> > > > > > myself

> > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > these highly sensitive areas of discussions.

> > > > > > > > > > > Thanx

> > > > > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > > > rohiniranjan wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Please do not be personally offended but I have

a

> > bit

> > > > of

> > > > > > > > problem

> > > > > > > > > > > with "mostly" in your statement. Couple of

years

> > ago

> > > on

> > > > > his

> > > > > > > > > > newslist,

> > > > > > > > > > > I had asked Mr. Rao directly about how such a

> > > > conclusion

> > > > > > (he

> > > > > > > > had

> > > > > > > > > > also

> > > > > > > > > > > used a statement like "mostly"

or 'universally')

> > was

> > > > > > derived.

> > > > > > > > > Given

> > > > > > > > > > > that there must be millions of jyotishis in

India

> > > > itself

> > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > population growing like a family of rabbits all

> > over

> > > > the

> > > > > > > globe,

> > > > > > > > > how

> > > > > > > > > > > can one make a statement like that unless a

> survey

> > > was

> > > > > > done.

> > > > > > > It

> > > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > > his greatness that he eventually responded

saying

> > > that

> > > > > > > > somewhere

> > > > > > > > > (I

> > > > > > > > > > > think in Delhi or Poona) a group of panchaang

> > makers

> > > (I

> > > > > > > recall

> > > > > > > > > less

> > > > > > > > > > > than 30 but I could be remembering it wrongly)

> had

> > > > > > > congregated

> > > > > > > > > with

> > > > > > > > > > > some govt. officials and through their

> > deliberations

> > > > > > (details

> > > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > > > which I would be curious to learn but have no

> clue

> > > > where

> > > > > to

> > > > > > > > find

> > > > > > > > > > > those or if those were even published or made

> > > avaiable

> > > > to

> > > > > > > > anyone)

> > > > > > > > > > had

> > > > > > > > > > > come to the conclusion that chitra or chaitra

> > > ayanamsha

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > one

> > > > > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > > be adopted. I never got the information as to

how

> > > many

> > > > of

> > > > > > > these

> > > > > > > > > > fine

> > > > > > > > > > > individuals were actually jyotishis, or

practiced

> > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > with

> > > > > > > > > any

> > > > > > > > > > > success during their lifetime.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Mr. Rao himself follows and recommends Lahiri

> > > ayanamsha

> > > > > > which

> > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > > pretty close to chitra ayanamsha and I believe

he

> > has

> > > > > > > mentioned

> > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > he got good results with the ayanamsha and that

> > this

> > > > was

> > > > > > > close

> > > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > > what his astrological guru used/recommended and

> > also

> > > > > close

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > values that Mr. Karve the psychic who can tell

> your

> > > > time

> > > > > of

> > > > > > > > birth

> > > > > > > > > > > just by looking/talking to you, produced. Mr.

> > Karve,

> > > it

> > > > > > seems

> > > > > > > > > > looked

> > > > > > > > > > > at you, and gave a lagna degree and the date

and

> > with

> > > > > > lahiri

> > > > > > > > > > > ayanamsha this value matched. Mr. Rao's

students

> > > > probably

> > > > > > use

> > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsha but I have only interacted

with

> a

> > > few

> > > > so

> > > > > > > > cannot

> > > > > > > > > > tell

> > > > > > > > > > > about the ultimate preferences of all.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > What we can say that the vocal majority on

> internet

> > > > > > probably

> > > > > > > > uses

> > > > > > > > > > > lahiri ayanamsha. If this list is a standard

> > > reference,

> > > > > > then

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > vocal 'majority' represents less than 1% of the

> > > > > > participants

> > > > > > > > > (less

> > > > > > > > > > > than 26 who discuss jyotish, not counting those

> > that

> > > > ask

> > > > > > for

> > > > > > > > > > readings

> > > > > > > > > > > only, OUT of some 2600 members). The same would

> be

> > > the

> > > > > > > > experience

> > > > > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > > > other list subpopulations (less than 1% talk,

> > > express,

> > > > > > > write).

> > > > > > > > So

> > > > > > > > > > one

> > > > > > > > > > > can safely assume that at least 1% or less of

the

> > > > > > astrologers

> > > > > > > > > > (sorry

> > > > > > > > > > > Jyotishis!) claim to use Lahiri ayanamsha or a

> > > similar

> > > > > > value.

> > > > > > > > > This

> > > > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > > a *far cry* from "mostly" or 'universally'!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Mind you, I am not saying that Lahiri ayanamsha

> > does

> > > > not

> > > > > > work

> > > > > > > > or

> > > > > > > > > > does

> > > > > > > > > > > or that there is necessarily a better

ayanamsha.

> In

> > > > fact

> > > > > > > there

> > > > > > > > > are

> > > > > > > > > > > many western astrologers who are considered to

> have

> > > > been

> > > > > > > quite

> > > > > > > > > > > effective at their craft and they use no

> ayanamsha

> > at

> > > > all

> > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > work

> > > > > > > > > > > with a zodiac that is off by 23 some degrees

and

> > not

> > > > just

> > > > > > one

> > > > > > > > or

> > > > > > > > > > two

> > > > > > > > > > > degrees, and still produce good results!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > There are a lot of myths and suppositions and

> > claims

> > > > > > floating

> > > > > > > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > > > in the ocean of astrology about this or that

> being

> > > tge

> > > > > > > absolute

> > > > > > > > > > truth

> > > > > > > > > > > in the field of astrology in general and

> statements

> > > > such

> > > > > as

> > > > > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > > > > is good for predicting events and tropical

better

> > at

> > > > > > > describing

> > > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > psyche, etc. As I have pointed out in some

> earlier

> > > > > written

> > > > > > > > > > articles,

> > > > > > > > > > > this is more a reflection of the person and his

> > > > > background

> > > > > > > who

> > > > > > > > > then

> > > > > > > > > > > went on to become an astrologer - the economist

> > drawn

> > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > forecasting

> > > > > > > > > > > the markets, the doctor focussing on astrology

of

> > the

> > > > > > > diseases,

> > > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > spiritualist seeing the spiritual map in the

> > > horoscope,

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > psychologist focusing on the psyche as revealed

> > > through

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > map.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > The beauty is that the same little map, or

maybe

> a

> > > few

> > > > of

> > > > > > > these

> > > > > > > > > are

> > > > > > > > > > > capable of giving such a rich description of

the

> > > human

> > > > > > > > > experience,

> > > > > > > > > > > the full spectrum of which has been beyond the

> > scope

> > > of

> > > > > > > > > > comprehension

> > > > > > > > > > > of any one individual, whether astrologer,

> > jyotishi,

> > > > > > > > > tarotomancer,

> > > > > > > > > > > scryer or some Guru yogi divine!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > RR

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > --- In

, "tw853"

> > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear amit_call,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Lahiri ayanamsa is mostly used. But KP

ayanamsa

> > is

> > > > used

> > > > > > in

> > > > > > > KP

> > > > > > > > > > > > analysis and Raman ayanamsa is used in his

> books.

> > > > It's

> > > > > up

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > > preference of an individual astrologer.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > tw

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > P.S. In KP a little bit higher new KP aynamsa

> > with

> > > > > > > > deg:min:sec

> > > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > > > advised to use. (KP & Astrology< Year Book

> 2003,

> > pp

> > > > 1,

> > > > > 88-

> > > > > > > 93)

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > ,

vattem

> > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Ji Amitji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > In Ayanamsa calculations after some kind of

> > > > > discussions

> > > > > > > due

> > > > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > > > differences it has been agreed that

> scietifically

> > > > > prudent

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > use

> > > > > > > > > > > > Lahiri Ayanamsa.A National Committee

> constituted

> > > has

> > > > > also

> > > > > > > > > > > recommended

> > > > > > > > > > > > for adoptation of Lahiri Ayanamsa.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Infact to add to list I also cite the

> research

> > of

> > > > > Shri

> > > > > > > > > K.N.Rao

> > > > > > > > > > a

> > > > > > > > > > > > renowned Astrologer in Mundane Astrolgy.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > krishnan

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > amit_call wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > I have a confusion over Using different

> > Ayamansas.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Using different Ayamansas give different

> Charts.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Lahiri,K.P.,Raman,Krushna...all are

different.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Please guide me.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Amit

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS

> > > SURVIVAL !

> > > > ~

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Links

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> /

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > To from this group, send an

email

> > to:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the

> > >

> > > > > > > Terms

> > > > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > > > > Service.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > All your favorites on one personal page –

Try

> > My

> > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have

been

> > > > removed]

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS

> SURVIVAL !

> > ~

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Links

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > /

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > To from this group, send an email

to:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the

>

> > > > Terms

> > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > > Service.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > The all-new My – Get yours free!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS

SURVIVAL !

> ~

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Links

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > /

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the

 

> > > Terms

> > > > of

> > > > > > > > > Service.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage

> > less.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~

> > > > > > > Links

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > ALL-NEW Messenger - all new features - even

more

> > > fun!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

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