Fate(Advaita) VS Free Will(Dvaita) -East VS West Approach!

[Guest guest]

The discussion abt fate & freewill never ends,anyone who is serious

in learning astrology eventually has to grapple with questions

regarding fate and free will. Is our fate linked adamantly to our

moment of birth or is there some wiggle room for free will? If so,

how much?

 

Obviously, astrologers can predict events, which proves there is some

element of fate at work. But at other times predictions fail. This

may either be

1.a reflection on the astrologer's skill level,

2.the accuracy of the predictive system itself

3.there really is the elusive power of free will at play

 

the West, feel very uncomfortable with the idea of fate or destiny

and relish with free will. However, in India it's much

different,it's not uncommon to hear someone resign themselves to a

situation by simply saying "this is just my fate."

 

However, while on the surface it may appear that Western attitude is

the wiser of the two, After all, how "free" really is our free will

 

when we're limited by our past conditioning? Usually, we're such

creatures of habit that we can't even follow through with our new

year's resolutions of past . Our habits are often so difficult to

change. On the other hand, the attitude of resigning ourselves to our

fate could reflect a level of acceptance and trust that could be

considered very wise.

 

Due to the differences of cultural conditioning, generally the

astrologers of India tend towards a fate orientation, while the

astrologers in the West tends toward a free will orientation. And

it's very easy to err on one side or the other

 

However, there may be exceptions like, In some cases, telling a

client honestly that they're entering a difficult period could help

them "surrender" and come to acceptance of their situation, which

could be a positive relief if they've made continued effort to

improve their situation to no avail,Like if u try hard for material

fullfillments in effected(bad) saturn period ,that much hard saturn

will come at u?

 

 

The path of action, represents "Dvaita" or dualism and is generally a

proponent of a free will orientation followed by modern seer and

proponent of dvaita Paramahansa Yogananda.

 

The path of surrender or non-action, represents "Advaita" or non-

dualism and is generally a proponent of fate orientation followed by

modern seer and proponent of advaita Ramana Maharshi

 

Both of the above conviction command respect in their respective

schools of thought

 

Hope the disussion continues?

Rahul

[Guest guest]

Om.

Rahul ji,

You very nicely put the thought on free will and destiny.

I once read an article on predeterminism....

which says Predeterminism is a higher concept leading to complete

devotion to God's Will.

Also ved says "Aham Brahamasmi"...hence Free will emanates from my

self...

Can not we characterise both free will and destiny at two levels......

1. Lower concept of free will

2. Higher concept of Free will

as well

1. Lower concept of Predeterminism

2. Higher concept of Predeterminism

we see that at lower concept of free will person cultivates arrogance

and false ego. definitely he loses a lot. He gets self

centered.Narrowness of concious being etc.

Here Destiny is there to teach him a lesson he needs to be......

And at lower concept of predeterminism a person dives into "TAMAS".

Totally ignorant ...superstitions....Lack of creativity......

Stagnant .... No Innovations...

He should be taught free will.......

well,here we know whether he is destined to move to free will concept

ensures his learning process.

SO there can be different levels of belief/practices on free will and

destiny.Lessons goes like....Free will...Destiny.....free will......

destiny.....so on..

what we are concerned with are the higher ones....

Now at every level of free will a person suffers from a different

level/kind of Ahamkara and other negative qualities which pulls him

away from God.

And same way at different levels of faith in Predeterminism person

suffers from different kind of ignorance.

 

 

As you mentioned of one concept which says abundant free will of

self..

But That free will is applicable to one who has realised himself.

Also we see the reaction of 'Karma'... every Karma has some good and

some bad effects essentially...

This realized soul will not allow committing something wrong....

or we can say He will know the outcome and will be ready to receive

after-effects.....

Hence we come to Infinite free will of God by complete surrender to

Him.......

Thus can we say

Free will is essentially a source of Destiny.And Predeterminism is

essentially a manner of free will to organise.

 

Words may be a limit......

Pls correct me........

 

Sincerely

Amit

 

 

 

, "rahul_10uday"

<rahul_10uday> wrote:

>

> The discussion abt fate & freewill never ends,anyone who is serious

> in learning astrology eventually has to grapple with questions

> regarding fate and free will. Is our fate linked adamantly to our

> moment of birth or is there some wiggle room for free will? If so,

> how much?

>

> Obviously, astrologers can predict events, which proves there is

some

> element of fate at work. But at other times predictions fail. This

> may either be

> 1.a reflection on the astrologer's skill level,

> 2.the accuracy of the predictive system itself

> 3.there really is the elusive power of free will at play

>

> the West, feel very uncomfortable with the idea of fate or destiny

> and relish with free will. However, in India it's much

> different,it's not uncommon to hear someone resign themselves to a

> situation by simply saying "this is just my fate."

>

> However, while on the surface it may appear that Western attitude

is

> the wiser of the two, After all, how "free" really is our free

will

>

> when we're limited by our past conditioning? Usually, we're such

> creatures of habit that we can't even follow through with our new

> year's resolutions of past . Our habits are often so difficult to

> change. On the other hand, the attitude of resigning ourselves to

our

> fate could reflect a level of acceptance and trust that could be

> considered very wise.

>

> Due to the differences of cultural conditioning, generally the

> astrologers of India tend towards a fate orientation, while the

> astrologers in the West tends toward a free will orientation. And

> it's very easy to err on one side or the other

>

> However, there may be exceptions like, In some cases, telling a

> client honestly that they're entering a difficult period could help

> them "surrender" and come to acceptance of their situation, which

> could be a positive relief if they've made continued effort to

> improve their situation to no avail,Like if u try hard for material

> fullfillments in effected(bad) saturn period ,that much hard saturn

> will come at u?

>

>

> The path of action, represents "Dvaita" or dualism and is generally

a

> proponent of a free will orientation followed by modern seer and

> proponent of dvaita Paramahansa Yogananda.

>

> The path of surrender or non-action, represents "Advaita" or non-

> dualism and is generally a proponent of fate orientation followed

by

> modern seer and proponent of advaita Ramana Maharshi

>

> Both of the above conviction command respect in their respective

> schools of thought

>

> Hope the disussion continues?

> Rahul