Guest guest Posted May 26, 2004 Report Share Posted May 26, 2004 Dear Amita, I am sorry , but I dont support your view. I feel Parents are God. I think we are no one to JUDGE them or can never have that much of capability to ever forgive them. If we doubt our parent's love, it's the biggest sin. I dont think anyone would be ever born to love us as much as our parents do...whether selfless or not ...I dont care. Manoshi , Amita Shukla <shuklaamita> wrote: > -"I strongly beleive that 'Selfless Love' would lead > to 'Selfess Service', concluding in 'Nishkama Karma'" > -"first one has to > EXPERIENCE THE PAIN and then when you UNDERSTAND that PAIN , > automatically flows that selfless LOVE when you serve" > > After reading the above lines i could not resist sharing my experience: > > Once i fell very ill and was on complete bed rest more than a month.I called my mother for help from India. > > My mother who is very religious and pious women came for my help all the way from india. > > She did so much for me which i can not repay it by any means. > > I really luv and respect her a lot. > > But once while both me and her were talking she told me > > "When i serve you i think i am serving god and see god in you" > > I know for sure she luvs me a lot but when she said the above line i was so much hurt 'coz i felt i had called my mother for help but in turn it was a social worker who is working selflessly.I felt as if i had lost my mother. > > Some how till now i can not forget her words. > > > > Thx > > Amita > > > khallopapa <khallopapa> wrote: > Dear RG, > > No, you are not the only one who has this 'technical' problem. I > have too, but more important is to try to develop that selfless > love. I, from my experience, can say that, first one has to > EXPERIENCE THE PAIN and then when you UNDERSTAND that PAIN , > automatically flows that selfless LOVE when you serve. There is a > big difference between sympathize and empathize. Put yourself in > that position if you have not experienced the pain...and then you > realize how it hurts when one is doing a favour( out of pity) or so- > called serving you for some fulfilment of his/her desires. > > I hope I made sense. > > regards > > Manoshi > > > > , Ravinder Grover > <astrology@c...> wrote: > > Dear Manoshi > > > > Its very nice of you to bring the issue of 'Selfless Love'. Many > thanks. I strongly beleive that 'Selfless Love' would lead > to 'Selfess Service', concluding in 'Nishkama Karma', the path way > to Liberation. > > > > But I have a technical question & problem, probablly it only > applies to me and nobody else. > > 1.. How do I develop 'Selfless Love' ? > > 2.. I have tried serving selflessly, technical speaking, but at > later stage I realised that I was NOT serving or loving Selflessly. > I always had some elements of EGO and DESIRE behind it. May be, I > was always desiting for the Fruit of the Action. What do I do now? > I know my problem but I have not been able to come out of this for > ages. > > Can anybody help me? > > > > Love > > > > RG > > 1.. > > 2.. - > > khallopapa > > > > Wednesday, May 26, 2004 11:03 AM > > Experiece the Love > > > > > > Dear friends, > > In another group, this was told once ...Don't have that EGO that > we > > are helping others. we should not pity any one but serve > selflessly. > > This is so true. I was travelling today with a mentally and > > physically handicapped person. The first feeling was...pity. I > felt > > ashamed of myself later. This brought up some thoughts..... > > > > To be genuine is very important. The LOVE has to be > experienced . > > If you dont experience that selfless love, you can never > understand > > what it is. Those who preach but dont practice may influence > people > > but they themselves remain in deep darkness. > > I remember when I had appeared for my Visharad exams, I was just > > sixteen and I was asked to sing ' Babul mora naihar chhooto hi > > jaaye'. Technically I had sung it very correct but the examiner > told > > me "Sing it the way you would if you really have to leave your > > parents and go far away. Feel it and then sing". > > To feel genuinely is very important to do anything in the right > > manner. One must have devotion and PURE feelings. So, love > whatever > > you do, be sincere and devoted and have faith in YOURSELF. Serve > > people like you are serving God(I learnt it in this group)... > You > > will reach your goal. > > > > Manoshi > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~ > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------------------------- -- > ----------- > > Links > > > > > > / > > > > b.. > > > > > > c.. Terms > of Service. > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~ > > > Sponsor > > > > Links > > > / > > > > > Terms of Service. > > > > > > Friends. Fun. Try the all-new Messenger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 26, 2004 Report Share Posted May 26, 2004 Ideally, we should not be judging anyone (let he who has never sinned cast the first stone, as the holy messiah of Christians said), but here is the judicial problem. There are parents who abuse their own children and can be proved to be so, without doubt. One may say that from a karmic big picture they may have a useful purpose for the abused incarnated soul, etc., but perhaps succumbing in to the impulse to abuse their own child and then experiencing the outcome (jail, guilt, counter-abuse by the child, etc) might be their own karmic lesson of choosing. You can see how it can quickly become a string of karmic gobbledy-gook much coveted by the sellers of gemstones, amulets and potions. The fact is -- most of us would judge and have value-based opinions almost instantaneously and natureally. What we then do with that position is where free-will really step in and separates the mortals from the mahatmas! In fact, one need not be in a hurry to decide which course to take, today, tomorrow or during this lifetime! Now, is that an insurance, guarantee, waranty or simply mind-candy? You be the *judge*, Manoshi! Rohiniranjan , "khallopapa" <khallopapa> wrote: > Dear Amita, > > I am sorry , but I dont support your view. I feel Parents are God. I > think we are no one to JUDGE them or can never have that much of > capability to ever forgive them. If we doubt our parent's love, it's > the biggest sin. I dont think anyone would be ever born to love us > as much as our parents do...whether selfless or not ...I dont care. > > Manoshi > > > > > , Amita Shukla > <shuklaamita> wrote: > > -"I strongly beleive that 'Selfless Love' would lead > > to 'Selfess Service', concluding in 'Nishkama Karma'" > > -"first one has to > > EXPERIENCE THE PAIN and then when you UNDERSTAND that PAIN , > > automatically flows that selfless LOVE when you serve" > > > > After reading the above lines i could not resist sharing my > experience: > > > > Once i fell very ill and was on complete bed rest more than a > month.I called my mother for help from India. > > > > My mother who is very religious and pious women came for my help > all the way from india. > > > > She did so much for me which i can not repay it by any means. > > > > I really luv and respect her a lot. > > > > But once while both me and her were talking she told me > > > > "When i serve you i think i am serving god and see god in you" > > > > I know for sure she luvs me a lot but when she said the above line > i was so much hurt 'coz i felt i had called my mother for help but > in turn it was a social worker who is working selflessly.I felt as > if i had lost my mother. > > > > Some how till now i can not forget her words. > > > > > > > > Thx > > > > Amita > > > > > > khallopapa <khallopapa> wrote: > > Dear RG, > > > > No, you are not the only one who has this 'technical' problem. I > > have too, but more important is to try to develop that selfless > > love. I, from my experience, can say that, first one has to > > EXPERIENCE THE PAIN and then when you UNDERSTAND that PAIN , > > automatically flows that selfless LOVE when you serve. There is a > > big difference between sympathize and empathize. Put yourself in > > that position if you have not experienced the pain...and then you > > realize how it hurts when one is doing a favour( out of pity) or > so- > > called serving you for some fulfilment of his/her desires. > > > > I hope I made sense. > > > > regards > > > > Manoshi > > > > > > > > , Ravinder Grover > > <astrology@c...> wrote: > > > Dear Manoshi > > > > > > Its very nice of you to bring the issue of 'Selfless Love'. > Many > > thanks. I strongly beleive that 'Selfless Love' would lead > > to 'Selfess Service', concluding in 'Nishkama Karma', the path way > > to Liberation. > > > > > > But I have a technical question & problem, probablly it only > > applies to me and nobody else. > > > 1.. How do I develop 'Selfless Love' ? > > > 2.. I have tried serving selflessly, technical speaking, but > at > > later stage I realised that I was NOT serving or loving > Selflessly. > > I always had some elements of EGO and DESIRE behind it. May be, > I > > was always desiting for the Fruit of the Action. What do I do > now? > > I know my problem but I have not been able to come out of this for > > ages. > > > Can anybody help me? > > > > > > Love > > > > > > RG > > > 1.. > > > 2.. - > > > khallopapa > > > > > > Wednesday, May 26, 2004 11:03 AM > > > Experiece the Love > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > In another group, this was told once ...Don't have that EGO > that > > we > > > are helping others. we should not pity any one but serve > > selflessly. > > > This is so true. I was travelling today with a mentally and > > > physically handicapped person. The first feeling was...pity. I > > felt > > > ashamed of myself later. This brought up some thoughts..... > > > > > > To be genuine is very important. The LOVE has to be > > experienced . > > > If you dont experience that selfless love, you can never > > understand > > > what it is. Those who preach but dont practice may influence > > people > > > but they themselves remain in deep darkness. > > > I remember when I had appeared for my Visharad exams, I was > just > > > sixteen and I was asked to sing ' Babul mora naihar chhooto hi > > > jaaye'. Technically I had sung it very correct but the > examiner > > told > > > me "Sing it the way you would if you really have to leave your > > > parents and go far away. Feel it and then sing". > > > To feel genuinely is very important to do anything in the > right > > > manner. One must have devotion and PURE feelings. So, love > > whatever > > > you do, be sincere and devoted and have faith in YOURSELF. > Serve > > > people like you are serving God(I learnt it in this group)... > > You > > > will reach your goal. > > > > > > Manoshi > > > > > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~ > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ -- > -- > > ----------- > > > Links > > > > > > > > > / > > > > > > b.. > > > > > > > > > c.. Terms > > of Service. > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~ > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > Links > > > > > > / > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > Friends. Fun. Try the all-new Messenger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 26, 2004 Report Share Posted May 26, 2004 Dear Rohini, Whatever you say, I dont want to comment on this...and dont want to change my opinion about parents.....please. May be I have got the best parents in the world...?:-) regards Manoshi , "rohiniranjan" <rrgb@s...> wrote: > Ideally, we should not be judging anyone (let he who has never > sinned cast the first stone, as the holy messiah of Christians > said), but here is the judicial problem. There are parents who abuse > their own children and can be proved to be so, without doubt. One > may say that from a karmic big picture they may have a useful > purpose for the abused incarnated soul, etc., but perhaps succumbing > in to the impulse to abuse their own child and then experiencing the > outcome (jail, guilt, counter-abuse by the child, etc) might be > their own karmic lesson of choosing. You can see how it can quickly > become a string of karmic gobbledy-gook much coveted by the sellers > of gemstones, amulets and potions. The fact is -- most of us would > judge and have value-based opinions almost instantaneously and > natureally. What we then do with that position is where free-will > really step in and separates the mortals from the mahatmas! In fact, > one need not be in a hurry to decide which course to take, today, > tomorrow or during this lifetime! Now, is that an insurance, > guarantee, waranty or simply mind-candy? > > You be the *judge*, Manoshi! > > Rohiniranjan > > > > , "khallopapa" > <khallopapa> wrote: > > Dear Amita, > > > > I am sorry , but I dont support your view. I feel Parents are God. > I > > think we are no one to JUDGE them or can never have that much of > > capability to ever forgive them. If we doubt our parent's love, > it's > > the biggest sin. I dont think anyone would be ever born to love us > > as much as our parents do...whether selfless or not ...I dont care. > > > > Manoshi > > > > > > > > > > , Amita Shukla > > <shuklaamita> wrote: > > > -"I strongly beleive that 'Selfless Love' would lead > > > to 'Selfess Service', concluding in 'Nishkama Karma'" > > > -"first one has to > > > EXPERIENCE THE PAIN and then when you UNDERSTAND that PAIN , > > > automatically flows that selfless LOVE when you serve" > > > > > > After reading the above lines i could not resist sharing my > > experience: > > > > > > Once i fell very ill and was on complete bed rest more than a > > month.I called my mother for help from India. > > > > > > My mother who is very religious and pious women came for my help > > all the way from india. > > > > > > She did so much for me which i can not repay it by any means. > > > > > > I really luv and respect her a lot. > > > > > > But once while both me and her were talking she told me > > > > > > "When i serve you i think i am serving god and see god in you" > > > > > > I know for sure she luvs me a lot but when she said the above > line > > i was so much hurt 'coz i felt i had called my mother for help > but > > in turn it was a social worker who is working selflessly.I felt as > > if i had lost my mother. > > > > > > Some how till now i can not forget her words. > > > > > > > > > > > > Thx > > > > > > Amita > > > > > > > > > khallopapa <khallopapa> wrote: > > > Dear RG, > > > > > > No, you are not the only one who has this 'technical' problem. I > > > have too, but more important is to try to develop that selfless > > > love. I, from my experience, can say that, first one has to > > > EXPERIENCE THE PAIN and then when you UNDERSTAND that PAIN , > > > automatically flows that selfless LOVE when you serve. There is > a > > > big difference between sympathize and empathize. Put yourself in > > > that position if you have not experienced the pain...and then > you > > > realize how it hurts when one is doing a favour( out of pity) or > > so- > > > called serving you for some fulfilment of his/her desires. > > > > > > I hope I made sense. > > > > > > regards > > > > > > Manoshi > > > > > > > > > > > > , Ravinder Grover > > > <astrology@c...> wrote: > > > > Dear Manoshi > > > > > > > > Its very nice of you to bring the issue of 'Selfless Love'. > > Many > > > thanks. I strongly beleive that 'Selfless Love' would lead > > > to 'Selfess Service', concluding in 'Nishkama Karma', the path > way > > > to Liberation. > > > > > > > > But I have a technical question & problem, probablly it only > > > applies to me and nobody else. > > > > 1.. How do I develop 'Selfless Love' ? > > > > 2.. I have tried serving selflessly, technical speaking, but > > at > > > later stage I realised that I was NOT serving or loving > > Selflessly. > > > I always had some elements of EGO and DESIRE behind it. May > be, > > I > > > was always desiting for the Fruit of the Action. What do I do > > now? > > > I know my problem but I have not been able to come out of this > for > > > ages. > > > > Can anybody help me? > > > > > > > > Love > > > > > > > > RG > > > > 1.. > > > > 2.. - > > > > khallopapa > > > > > > > > Wednesday, May 26, 2004 11:03 AM > > > > Experiece the Love > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > In another group, this was told once ...Don't have that EGO > > that > > > we > > > > are helping others. we should not pity any one but serve > > > selflessly. > > > > This is so true. I was travelling today with a mentally and > > > > physically handicapped person. The first feeling was...pity. > I > > > felt > > > > ashamed of myself later. This brought up some thoughts..... > > > > > > > > To be genuine is very important. The LOVE has to be > > > experienced . > > > > If you dont experience that selfless love, you can never > > > understand > > > > what it is. Those who preach but dont practice may influence > > > people > > > > but they themselves remain in deep darkness. > > > > I remember when I had appeared for my Visharad exams, I was > > just > > > > sixteen and I was asked to sing ' Babul mora naihar chhooto > hi > > > > jaaye'. Technically I had sung it very correct but the > > examiner > > > told > > > > me "Sing it the way you would if you really have to leave > your > > > > parents and go far away. Feel it and then sing". > > > > To feel genuinely is very important to do anything in the > > right > > > > manner. One must have devotion and PURE feelings. So, love > > > whatever > > > > you do, be sincere and devoted and have faith in YOURSELF. > > Serve > > > > people like you are serving God(I learnt it in this > group)... > > > You > > > > will reach your goal. > > > > > > > > Manoshi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~ > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------- -- > -- > > -- > > > ----------- > > > > Links > > > > > > > > > > > > / > > > > > > > > b.. > > > > > > > > > > > > c.. > Terms > > > of Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~ > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > Links > > > > > > > > > / > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Friends. Fun. Try the all-new Messenger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 26, 2004 Report Share Posted May 26, 2004 Dear Manoshi, Assuming that you will follow and use jyotish for others, you will gain an appreciation for the variations of karmic roles being played around us all. I was not contradicting your view or playing down your personal experience, nor even trying to judge what you said, though it might have come across that way, but simply adding a layer of complexity, yet another bit-plane if you will to the discussion. You are fortunate, as many of us are I hope, to have experienced a positive experience in the 4th and 9th house zone, but how do I forget the multitude of individuals whose personal and painful experiences match the malefic influences -- they have actually experienced in life -- just as indicated in their rashi, arudha and dwadashamsha charts? Please understand, that this is not a black and white negation, or contradiction, but just a reflection on the variability that makes us all human in perception and execution of our karmic energies. I do not write this to press any point, but just to clarify my position, lest I was not quite forthcoming as I intended to be in the first place. Trust me, no one is more painfully aware than I of my communicative limitations and similar karmic challenges. I will now exercise restraint in my posting to this thread as I do not wish to aggravate you or others any more than I unintentionally might have already ... Peace -- Rohiniranjan , "khallopapa" <khallopapa> wrote: > Dear Rohini, > Whatever you say, I dont want to comment on this...and dont want to > change my opinion about parents.....please. May be I have got the > best parents in the world...?:-) > > regards > > Manoshi > > > > , "rohiniranjan" <rrgb@s...> > wrote: > > Ideally, we should not be judging anyone (let he who has never > > sinned cast the first stone, as the holy messiah of Christians > > said), but here is the judicial problem. There are parents who > abuse > > their own children and can be proved to be so, without doubt. One > > may say that from a karmic big picture they may have a useful > > purpose for the abused incarnated soul, etc., but perhaps > succumbing > > in to the impulse to abuse their own child and then experiencing > the > > outcome (jail, guilt, counter-abuse by the child, etc) might be > > their own karmic lesson of choosing. You can see how it can > quickly > > become a string of karmic gobbledy-gook much coveted by the > sellers > > of gemstones, amulets and potions. The fact is -- most of us would > > judge and have value-based opinions almost instantaneously and > > natureally. What we then do with that position is where free- will > > really step in and separates the mortals from the mahatmas! In > fact, > > one need not be in a hurry to decide which course to take, today, > > tomorrow or during this lifetime! Now, is that an insurance, > > guarantee, waranty or simply mind-candy? > > > > You be the *judge*, Manoshi! > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > , "khallopapa" > > <khallopapa> wrote: > > > Dear Amita, > > > > > > I am sorry , but I dont support your view. I feel Parents are > God. > > I > > > think we are no one to JUDGE them or can never have that much of > > > capability to ever forgive them. If we doubt our parent's love, > > it's > > > the biggest sin. I dont think anyone would be ever born to love > us > > > as much as our parents do...whether selfless or not ...I dont > care. > > > > > > Manoshi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , Amita Shukla > > > <shuklaamita> wrote: > > > > -"I strongly beleive that 'Selfless Love' would lead > > > > to 'Selfess Service', concluding in 'Nishkama Karma'" > > > > -"first one has to > > > > EXPERIENCE THE PAIN and then when you UNDERSTAND that PAIN , > > > > automatically flows that selfless LOVE when you serve" > > > > > > > > After reading the above lines i could not resist sharing my > > > experience: > > > > > > > > Once i fell very ill and was on complete bed rest more than a > > > month.I called my mother for help from India. > > > > > > > > My mother who is very religious and pious women came for my > help > > > all the way from india. > > > > > > > > She did so much for me which i can not repay it by any means. > > > > > > > > I really luv and respect her a lot. > > > > > > > > But once while both me and her were talking she told me > > > > > > > > "When i serve you i think i am serving god and see god in you" > > > > > > > > I know for sure she luvs me a lot but when she said the above > > line > > > i was so much hurt 'coz i felt i had called my mother for help > > but > > > in turn it was a social worker who is working selflessly.I felt > as > > > if i had lost my mother. > > > > > > > > Some how till now i can not forget her words. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thx > > > > > > > > Amita > > > > > > > > > > > > khallopapa <khallopapa> wrote: > > > > Dear RG, > > > > > > > > No, you are not the only one who has this 'technical' problem. > I > > > > have too, but more important is to try to develop that > selfless > > > > love. I, from my experience, can say that, first one has to > > > > EXPERIENCE THE PAIN and then when you UNDERSTAND that PAIN , > > > > automatically flows that selfless LOVE when you serve. There > is > > a > > > > big difference between sympathize and empathize. Put yourself > in > > > > that position if you have not experienced the pain...and then > > you > > > > realize how it hurts when one is doing a favour( out of pity) > or > > > so- > > > > called serving you for some fulfilment of his/her desires. > > > > > > > > I hope I made sense. > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > Manoshi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , Ravinder Grover > > > > <astrology@c...> wrote: > > > > > Dear Manoshi > > > > > > > > > > Its very nice of you to bring the issue of 'Selfless Love'. > > > Many > > > > thanks. I strongly beleive that 'Selfless Love' would lead > > > > to 'Selfess Service', concluding in 'Nishkama Karma', the path > > way > > > > to Liberation. > > > > > > > > > > But I have a technical question & problem, probablly it > only > > > > applies to me and nobody else. > > > > > 1.. How do I develop 'Selfless Love' ? > > > > > 2.. I have tried serving selflessly, technical speaking, > but > > > at > > > > later stage I realised that I was NOT serving or loving > > > Selflessly. > > > > I always had some elements of EGO and DESIRE behind it. May > > be, > > > I > > > > was always desiting for the Fruit of the Action. What do I do > > > now? > > > > I know my problem but I have not been able to come out of this > > for > > > > ages. > > > > > Can anybody help me? > > > > > > > > > > Love > > > > > > > > > > RG > > > > > 1.. > > > > > 2.. - > > > > > khallopapa > > > > > > > > > > Wednesday, May 26, 2004 11:03 AM > > > > > Experiece the Love > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > In another group, this was told once ...Don't have that > EGO > > > that > > > > we > > > > > are helping others. we should not pity any one but serve > > > > selflessly. > > > > > This is so true. I was travelling today with a mentally > and > > > > > physically handicapped person. The first feeling > was...pity. > > I > > > > felt > > > > > ashamed of myself later. This brought up some thoughts..... > > > > > > > > > > To be genuine is very important. The LOVE has to be > > > > experienced . > > > > > If you dont experience that selfless love, you can never > > > > understand > > > > > what it is. Those who preach but dont practice may > influence > > > > people > > > > > but they themselves remain in deep darkness. > > > > > I remember when I had appeared for my Visharad exams, I > was > > > just > > > > > sixteen and I was asked to sing ' Babul mora naihar > chhooto > > hi > > > > > jaaye'. Technically I had sung it very correct but the > > > examiner > > > > told > > > > > me "Sing it the way you would if you really have to leave > > your > > > > > parents and go far away. Feel it and then sing". > > > > > To feel genuinely is very important to do anything in the > > > right > > > > > manner. One must have devotion and PURE feelings. So, love > > > > whatever > > > > > you do, be sincere and devoted and have faith in YOURSELF. > > > Serve > > > > > people like you are serving God(I learnt it in this > > group)... > > > > You > > > > > will reach your goal. > > > > > > > > > > Manoshi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------------------- -- > -- > > -- > > > -- > > > > ----------- > > > > > Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > / > > > > > > > > > > b.. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > c.. > > Terms > > > > of Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~ > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Links > > > > > > > > > > > > / > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Friends. Fun. Try the all-new Messenger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 26, 2004 Report Share Posted May 26, 2004 Dear Rohini, That was a good churning actually....I enjoyed it. To always have praises and appreciation doesn't really make our grey cells work. Please keep posting...I enjoy what you write. There was never any 'jhagda'....;-)so be happy. Manoshi , "rohiniranjan" <rrgb@s...> wrote: > Dear Manoshi, > > Assuming that you will follow and use jyotish for others, you will > gain an appreciation for the variations of karmic roles being played > around us all. I was not contradicting your view or playing down > your personal experience, nor even trying to judge what you said, > though it might have come across that way, but simply adding a layer > of complexity, yet another bit-plane if you will to the discussion. > > You are fortunate, as many of us are I hope, to have experienced a > positive experience in the 4th and 9th house zone, but how do I > forget the multitude of individuals whose personal and painful > experiences match the malefic influences -- they have actually > experienced in life -- just as indicated in their rashi, arudha and > dwadashamsha charts? > > Please understand, that this is not a black and white negation, or > contradiction, but just a reflection on the variability that makes > us all human in perception and execution of our karmic energies. > > I do not write this to press any point, but just to clarify my > position, lest I was not quite forthcoming as I intended to be in > the first place. Trust me, no one is more painfully aware than I of > my communicative limitations and similar karmic challenges. > > I will now exercise restraint in my posting to this thread as I do > not wish to aggravate you or others any more than I unintentionally > might have already ... > > Peace -- > > Rohiniranjan > > > > , "khallopapa" > <khallopapa> wrote: > > Dear Rohini, > > Whatever you say, I dont want to comment on this...and dont want > to > > change my opinion about parents.....please. May be I have got the > > best parents in the world...?:-) > > > > regards > > > > Manoshi > > > > > > > > , "rohiniranjan" > <rrgb@s...> > > wrote: > > > Ideally, we should not be judging anyone (let he who has never > > > sinned cast the first stone, as the holy messiah of Christians > > > said), but here is the judicial problem. There are parents who > > abuse > > > their own children and can be proved to be so, without doubt. > One > > > may say that from a karmic big picture they may have a useful > > > purpose for the abused incarnated soul, etc., but perhaps > > succumbing > > > in to the impulse to abuse their own child and then experiencing > > the > > > outcome (jail, guilt, counter-abuse by the child, etc) might be > > > their own karmic lesson of choosing. You can see how it can > > quickly > > > become a string of karmic gobbledy-gook much coveted by the > > sellers > > > of gemstones, amulets and potions. The fact is -- most of us > would > > > judge and have value-based opinions almost instantaneously and > > > natureally. What we then do with that position is where free- > will > > > really step in and separates the mortals from the mahatmas! In > > fact, > > > one need not be in a hurry to decide which course to take, > today, > > > tomorrow or during this lifetime! Now, is that an insurance, > > > guarantee, waranty or simply mind-candy? > > > > > > You be the *judge*, Manoshi! > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > , "khallopapa" > > > <khallopapa> wrote: > > > > Dear Amita, > > > > > > > > I am sorry , but I dont support your view. I feel Parents are > > God. > > > I > > > > think we are no one to JUDGE them or can never have that much > of > > > > capability to ever forgive them. If we doubt our parent's > love, > > > it's > > > > the biggest sin. I dont think anyone would be ever born to > love > > us > > > > as much as our parents do...whether selfless or not ...I dont > > care. > > > > > > > > Manoshi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , Amita Shukla > > > > <shuklaamita> wrote: > > > > > -"I strongly beleive that 'Selfless Love' would lead > > > > > to 'Selfess Service', concluding in 'Nishkama Karma'" > > > > > -"first one has to > > > > > EXPERIENCE THE PAIN and then when you UNDERSTAND that PAIN , > > > > > automatically flows that selfless LOVE when you serve" > > > > > > > > > > After reading the above lines i could not resist sharing my > > > > experience: > > > > > > > > > > Once i fell very ill and was on complete bed rest more than > a > > > > month.I called my mother for help from India. > > > > > > > > > > My mother who is very religious and pious women came for my > > help > > > > all the way from india. > > > > > > > > > > She did so much for me which i can not repay it by any means. > > > > > > > > > > I really luv and respect her a lot. > > > > > > > > > > But once while both me and her were talking she told me > > > > > > > > > > "When i serve you i think i am serving god and see god in > you" > > > > > > > > > > I know for sure she luvs me a lot but when she said the > above > > > line > > > > i was so much hurt 'coz i felt i had called my mother for > help > > > but > > > > in turn it was a social worker who is working selflessly.I > felt > > as > > > > if i had lost my mother. > > > > > > > > > > Some how till now i can not forget her words. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thx > > > > > > > > > > Amita > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > khallopapa <khallopapa> wrote: > > > > > Dear RG, > > > > > > > > > > No, you are not the only one who has this 'technical' > problem. > > I > > > > > have too, but more important is to try to develop that > > selfless > > > > > love. I, from my experience, can say that, first one has to > > > > > EXPERIENCE THE PAIN and then when you UNDERSTAND that PAIN , > > > > > automatically flows that selfless LOVE when you serve. There > > is > > > a > > > > > big difference between sympathize and empathize. Put > yourself > > in > > > > > that position if you have not experienced the pain...and > then > > > you > > > > > realize how it hurts when one is doing a favour( out of > pity) > > or > > > > so- > > > > > called serving you for some fulfilment of his/her desires. > > > > > > > > > > I hope I made sense. > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > Manoshi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , Ravinder Grover > > > > > <astrology@c...> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Manoshi > > > > > > > > > > > > Its very nice of you to bring the issue of 'Selfless > Love'. > > > > Many > > > > > thanks. I strongly beleive that 'Selfless Love' would lead > > > > > to 'Selfess Service', concluding in 'Nishkama Karma', the > path > > > way > > > > > to Liberation. > > > > > > > > > > > > But I have a technical question & problem, probablly it > > only > > > > > applies to me and nobody else. > > > > > > 1.. How do I develop 'Selfless Love' ? > > > > > > 2.. I have tried serving selflessly, technical speaking, > > but > > > > at > > > > > later stage I realised that I was NOT serving or loving > > > > Selflessly. > > > > > I always had some elements of EGO and DESIRE behind it. > May > > > be, > > > > I > > > > > was always desiting for the Fruit of the Action. What do I > do > > > > now? > > > > > I know my problem but I have not been able to come out of > this > > > for > > > > > ages. > > > > > > Can anybody help me? > > > > > > > > > > > > Love > > > > > > > > > > > > RG > > > > > > 1.. > > > > > > 2.. - > > > > > > khallopapa > > > > > > > > > > > > Wednesday, May 26, 2004 11:03 AM > > > > > > Experiece the Love > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > In another group, this was told once ...Don't have that > > EGO > > > > that > > > > > we > > > > > > are helping others. we should not pity any one but serve > > > > > selflessly. > > > > > > This is so true. I was travelling today with a mentally > > and > > > > > > physically handicapped person. The first feeling > > was...pity. > > > I > > > > > felt > > > > > > ashamed of myself later. This brought up some > thoughts..... > > > > > > > > > > > > To be genuine is very important. The LOVE has to be > > > > > experienced . > > > > > > If you dont experience that selfless love, you can never > > > > > understand > > > > > > what it is. Those who preach but dont practice may > > influence > > > > > people > > > > > > but they themselves remain in deep darkness. > > > > > > I remember when I had appeared for my Visharad exams, I > > was > > > > just > > > > > > sixteen and I was asked to sing ' Babul mora naihar > > chhooto > > > hi > > > > > > jaaye'. Technically I had sung it very correct but the > > > > examiner > > > > > told > > > > > > me "Sing it the way you would if you really have to > leave > > > your > > > > > > parents and go far away. Feel it and then sing". > > > > > > To feel genuinely is very important to do anything in > the > > > > right > > > > > > manner. One must have devotion and PURE feelings. So, > love > > > > > whatever > > > > > > you do, be sincere and devoted and have faith in > YOURSELF. > > > > Serve > > > > > > people like you are serving God(I learnt it in this > > > group)... > > > > > You > > > > > > will reach your goal. > > > > > > > > > > > > Manoshi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------ -- > -- > > -- > > > -- > > > > -- > > > > > ----------- > > > > > > Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > / > > > > > > > > > > > > b.. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > c.. Your use of is subject to the > > > Terms > > > > > of Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > / > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms > of > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Friends. Fun. Try the all-new Messenger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 26, 2004 Report Share Posted May 26, 2004 Thanks Rohini and others, Actually Rohini, I did not have the time to write what I wanted to, but you have expressed very well with more insight of JR. If we can take out our own personal relationship of parents and children and see it in the light of what happens in general we can appreciate this insight more. Though many of us have wonderful parents, if you are mature enough to see the world around you will see Parents who abs love their children, are loved in return, Parents who sacrificed everything for their children, but in return have received only hatred and disrespect Parents who have abused their children on no end, but the children have no where else to go but have loved their parents in return and then understood the limitations of their parents lack of emotional control to the extreme cases of parents and children hating one another so much that they even end up killing one. Daughters who hate their mother-in-law but cannot for a moment understand why their brother's wife cannot get along with their mother .. the list is endless and it is not that it is rare, each and any variation of the combination is there even in a small circle of your family or a small town. To equate our love for parents or children as God IRRESPECTIVE of what the emotional experience is, is what we seek guidance from JR. It is not easy. Karthik. --- khallopapa <khallopapa wrote: > Dear Rohini, > That was a good churning actually....I enjoyed it. > To always have > praises and appreciation doesn't really make our > grey cells work. > Please keep posting...I enjoy what you write. There > was never > any 'jhagda'....;-)so be happy. > > Manoshi > > > , > "rohiniranjan" <rrgb@s...> > wrote: > > Dear Manoshi, > > > > Assuming that you will follow and use jyotish for > others, you will > > gain an appreciation for the variations of karmic > roles being > played > > around us all. I was not contradicting your view > or playing down > > your personal experience, nor even trying to judge > what you said, > > though it might have come across that way, but > simply adding a > layer > > of complexity, yet another bit-plane if you will > to the discussion. > > > > You are fortunate, as many of us are I hope, to > have experienced a > > positive experience in the 4th and 9th house zone, > but how do I > > forget the multitude of individuals whose personal > and painful > > experiences match the malefic influences -- they > have actually > > experienced in life -- just as indicated in their > rashi, arudha > and > > dwadashamsha charts? > > > > Please understand, that this is not a black and > white negation, or > > contradiction, but just a reflection on the > variability that makes > > us all human in perception and execution of our > karmic energies. > > > > I do not write this to press any point, but just > to clarify my > > position, lest I was not quite forthcoming as I > intended to be in > > the first place. Trust me, no one is more > painfully aware than I > of > > my communicative limitations and similar karmic > challenges. > > > > I will now exercise restraint in my posting to > this thread as I do > > not wish to aggravate you or others any more than > I > unintentionally > > might have already ... > > > > Peace -- > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > , > "khallopapa" > > <khallopapa> wrote: > > > Dear Rohini, > > > Whatever you say, I dont want to comment on > this...and dont want > > to > > > change my opinion about parents.....please. May > be I have got > the > > > best parents in the world...?:-) > > > > > > regards > > > > > > Manoshi > > > > > > > > > > > > , > "rohiniranjan" > > <rrgb@s...> > > > wrote: > > > > Ideally, we should not be judging anyone (let > he who has never > > > > sinned cast the first stone, as the holy > messiah of Christians > > > > said), but here is the judicial problem. There > are parents who > > > abuse > > > > their own children and can be proved to be so, > without doubt. > > One > > > > may say that from a karmic big picture they > may have a useful > > > > purpose for the abused incarnated soul, etc., > but perhaps > > > succumbing > > > > in to the impulse to abuse their own child and > then > experiencing > > > the > > > > outcome (jail, guilt, counter-abuse by the > child, etc) might > be > > > > their own karmic lesson of choosing. You can > see how it can > > > quickly > > > > become a string of karmic gobbledy-gook much > coveted by the > > > sellers > > > > of gemstones, amulets and potions. The fact is > -- most of us > > would > > > > judge and have value-based opinions almost > instantaneously and > > > > natureally. What we then do with that position > is where free- > > will > > > > really step in and separates the mortals from > the mahatmas! In > > > fact, > > > > one need not be in a hurry to decide which > course to take, > > today, > > > > tomorrow or during this lifetime! Now, is that > an insurance, > > > > guarantee, waranty or simply mind-candy? > > > > > > > > You be the *judge*, Manoshi! > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > "khallopapa" > > > > <khallopapa> wrote: > > > > > Dear Amita, > > > > > > > > > > I am sorry , but I dont support your view. I > feel Parents > are > > > God. > > > > I > > > > > think we are no one to JUDGE them or can > never have that > much > > of > > > > > capability to ever forgive them. If we doubt > our parent's > > love, > > > > it's > > > > > the biggest sin. I dont think anyone would > be ever born to > > love > > > us > > > > > as much as our parents do...whether selfless > or not ...I > dont > > > care. > > > > > > > > > > Manoshi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > Amita Shukla > > > > > <shuklaamita> wrote: > > > > > > -"I strongly beleive that 'Selfless Love' > would lead > > > > > > to 'Selfess Service', concluding in > 'Nishkama Karma'" > > > > > > -"first one has to > > > > > > EXPERIENCE THE PAIN and then when you > UNDERSTAND that > PAIN , > > > > > > automatically flows that selfless LOVE > when you serve" > > > > > > > > > > > > After reading the above lines i could not > resist sharing > my > > > > > experience: > > > > > > > > > > > > Once i fell very ill and was on complete > bed rest more > than > > a > > > > > month.I called my mother for help from > India. > > > > > > > > > > > > My mother who is very religious and pious > women came for > my > > > help > > > > > all the way from india. > > > > > > > > > > > > She did so much for me which i can not > repay it by any > means. > > > > > > > > > > > > I really luv and respect her a lot. > > > > > > > > > > > > But once while both me and her were > talking she told me > > > > > > > > > > > > "When i serve you i think i am serving god > and see god in > > you" > > > > > > > > > > > > I know for sure she luvs me a lot but when > she said the > > above > > > > line > > > > > i was so much hurt 'coz i felt i had called > my mother for > > help > > > > but > > > > > in turn it was a social worker who is > working selflessly.I > > felt > > > as > > > > > if i had lost my mother. > > > > > > > > > > > > Some how till now i can not forget her > words. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thx > > > > > > > > > > > > Amita > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > khallopapa <khallopapa> wrote: > > > > > > Dear RG, > > > > > > > > > > > > No, you are not the only one who has this > 'technical' > > problem. > > > I > > > > > > have too, but more important is to try to > develop that > > > selfless > > > > > > love. I, from my experience, can say that, > first one has > to > > > > > > EXPERIENCE THE PAIN and then when you > UNDERSTAND that > PAIN , > > > > > > automatically flows that selfless LOVE > when you serve. > There > > > is > > > > a > > > > > > big difference between sympathize and > empathize. Put > > yourself > > > in > > > > > > that position if you have not experienced > the pain...and > > then > > > > you > > > > > > realize how it hurts when one is doing a > favour( out of > > pity) > > > or > > > > > so- > > > > > > called serving you for some fulfilment of > his/her desires. > > > > > > > > > > > > I hope I made sense. > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > > > Manoshi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > Ravinder Grover > > > > > > <astrology@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > Dear Manoshi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Its very nice of you to bring the issue > of 'Selfless > > Love'. > > > > > Many > > > > > > thanks. I strongly beleive that 'Selfless > Love' would > lead > > > > > > to 'Selfess Service', concluding in > 'Nishkama Karma', the > > path > > > > way > > > > > > to Liberation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But I have a technical question & > problem, probablly > it > > > only > > > > > > applies to me and nobody else. > > > > > > > 1.. How do I develop 'Selfless Love' > ? > > > > > > > 2.. I have tried serving selflessly, > technical > speaking, > > > but > > > > > at > > > > > > later stage I realised that I was NOT > serving or loving > > > > > Selflessly. > > > > > > I always had some elements of EGO and > DESIRE behind it. > > May > > > > be, > > > > > I > > > > > > was always desiting for the Fruit of the > Action. What do > I > > do > > > > > now? > > > > > > I know my problem but I have not been able > to come out of > > this > > > > for > > > > > > ages. > > > > > > > Can anybody help me? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Love > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RG > > > > > > > 1.. > > > > > > > 2.. - > > > > > > > khallopapa > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Wednesday, May 26, 2004 11:03 AM > > > > > > > Experiece the Love > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > > In another group, this was told once > ...Don't have > that > > > EGO > > > > > that > > > > > > we > > > > > > > are helping others. we should not pity > any one but > serve > > > > > > selflessly. > > > > > > > This is so true. I was travelling > today with a > mentally > > > and > > > > > > > physically handicapped person. The > first feeling > > > was...pity. > > > > I > > > > > > felt > > > > > > > ashamed of myself later. This brought > up some > > thoughts..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To be genuine is very important. The > LOVE has to be > > > > > > experienced . > > > > > > > If you dont experience that selfless > love, you can > never > > > > > > understand > > > > > > > what it is. Those who preach but dont > practice may > > > influence > > > > > > people > > > > > > > but they themselves remain in deep > darkness. > > > > > > > I remember when I had appeared for my > Visharad exams, > I > > > was > > > > > just > > > > > > > sixteen and I was asked to sing ' > Babul mora naihar > > > chhooto > > > > hi > > > > > > > jaaye'. Technically I had sung it very > correct but the > > > > > examiner > > > > > > told > > > > > > > me "Sing it the way you would if you > really have to > > leave > > > > your > > > > > > > parents and go far away. Feel it and > then sing". > > > > > > > To feel genuinely is very important to > do anything in > > the > > > > > right > > > > > > > manner. One must have devotion and > PURE feelings. So, > > love > > > > > > whatever > > > > > > > you do, be sincere and devoted and > have faith in > > YOURSELF. > > > > > Serve > > > > > > > people like you are serving God(I > learnt it in this > > > > group)... > > > > > > You > > > > > > > will reach your goal. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Manoshi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST > WINS SURVIVAL !~ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------ > -- > > -- > > > -- > > > > -- > > > > > -- > > > > > > ----------- > > > > > > > Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a.. To visit your group on the web, > go to: > > > > > > > > / > > > > > > > > > > > > > > b.. To from this group, > send an email to: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > c.. Your use of is > subject to the > > > > > Terms > > > > > > of Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS > SURVIVAL !~ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > / > > > > > > > > > > > > To from this group, send an > email to: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to > the > Terms > > of > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Friends. Fun. Try the all-new > Messenger > > Friends. Fun. Try the all-new Messenger. http://messenger./ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 27, 2004 Report Share Posted May 27, 2004 Just to digress a little .. every know religion or civilization has it;s accepted code of conduct/justice simply because it's impossible to accomodate all views and yet be correct !! Moral code of conduct says "respect and love your parents/children" .. however the extent in any situation always rests on justice karmic or otherwise ....! --- n karthik <nkarthik99 wrote: > Thanks Rohini and others, > > Actually Rohini, I did not have the time to write > what > I wanted to, but you have expressed very well with > more insight of JR. > > If we can take out our own personal relationship of > parents and children and see it in the light of what > happens in general we can appreciate this insight > more. > > Though many of us have wonderful parents, if you are > mature enough to see the world around you will see > > Parents who abs love their children, are loved in > return, > > Parents who sacrificed everything for their > children, > but in return have received only hatred and > disrespect > > Parents who have abused their children on no end, > but > the children have no where else to go but have loved > their parents in return and then understood the > limitations of their parents lack of emotional > control > > > to the extreme cases of parents and children hating > one another so much that they even end up killing > one. > > Daughters who hate their mother-in-law but cannot > for > a moment understand why their brother's wife cannot > get along with their mother .. the list is endless > > and it is not that it is rare, each and any > variation > of the combination is there even in a small circle > of > your family or a small town. > > To equate our love for parents or children as God > IRRESPECTIVE of what the emotional experience is, is > what we seek guidance from JR. It is not easy. > > Karthik. > > > --- khallopapa <khallopapa wrote: > > Dear Rohini, > > That was a good churning actually....I enjoyed it. > > To always have > > praises and appreciation doesn't really make our > > grey cells work. > > Please keep posting...I enjoy what you write. > There > > was never > > any 'jhagda'....;-)so be happy. > > > > Manoshi > > > > > > , > > "rohiniranjan" <rrgb@s...> > > wrote: > > > Dear Manoshi, > > > > > > Assuming that you will follow and use jyotish > for > > others, you will > > > gain an appreciation for the variations of > karmic > > roles being > > played > > > around us all. I was not contradicting your view > > or playing down > > > your personal experience, nor even trying to > judge > > what you said, > > > though it might have come across that way, but > > simply adding a > > layer > > > of complexity, yet another bit-plane if you will > > to the discussion. > > > > > > You are fortunate, as many of us are I hope, to > > have experienced a > > > positive experience in the 4th and 9th house > zone, > > but how do I > > > forget the multitude of individuals whose > personal > > and painful > > > experiences match the malefic influences -- they > > have actually > > > experienced in life -- just as indicated in > their > > rashi, arudha > > and > > > dwadashamsha charts? > > > > > > Please understand, that this is not a black and > > white negation, or > > > contradiction, but just a reflection on the > > variability that makes > > > us all human in perception and execution of our > > karmic energies. > > > > > > I do not write this to press any point, but just > > to clarify my > > > position, lest I was not quite forthcoming as I > > intended to be in > > > the first place. Trust me, no one is more > > painfully aware than I > > of > > > my communicative limitations and similar karmic > > challenges. > > > > > > I will now exercise restraint in my posting to > > this thread as I do > > > not wish to aggravate you or others any more > than > > I > > unintentionally > > > might have already ... > > > > > > Peace -- > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > "khallopapa" > > > <khallopapa> wrote: > > > > Dear Rohini, > > > > Whatever you say, I dont want to comment on > > this...and dont want > > > to > > > > change my opinion about parents.....please. > May > > be I have got > > the > > > > best parents in the world...?:-) > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > Manoshi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > "rohiniranjan" > > > <rrgb@s...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > Ideally, we should not be judging anyone > (let > > he who has never > > > > > sinned cast the first stone, as the holy > > messiah of Christians > > > > > said), but here is the judicial problem. > There > > are parents who > > > > abuse > > > > > their own children and can be proved to be > so, > > without doubt. > > > One > > > > > may say that from a karmic big picture they > > may have a useful > > > > > purpose for the abused incarnated soul, > etc., > > but perhaps > > > > succumbing > > > > > in to the impulse to abuse their own child > and > > then > > experiencing > > > > the > > > > > outcome (jail, guilt, counter-abuse by the > > child, etc) might > > be > > > > > their own karmic lesson of choosing. You can > > see how it can > > > > quickly > > > > > become a string of karmic gobbledy-gook much > > coveted by the > > > > sellers > > > > > of gemstones, amulets and potions. The fact > is > > -- most of us > > > would > > > > > judge and have value-based opinions almost > > instantaneously and > > > > > natureally. What we then do with that > position > === message truncated === Friends. Fun. Try the all-new Messenger. http://messenger./ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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