Guest guest Posted January 17, 2004 Report Share Posted January 17, 2004 Dear All, While on the topic of Bhagavad Gita there are two other works which are really worh reading. One is the translation by the great Paramahamsa Shivananda Saraswati, published by the Divine Life Society. You can read it at http://www.astrojyoti.com/bhagavadgeeta.htm The other is a brief but beautiful translation titled, The Song of God, by Swami Prabhavananda and Christopher Isherwood, with an introduction by Aldos Huxly, published by Advaita Ashram Publications. With best wishes S.P.Tata - <> <> Sunday, January 18, 2004 4:45 AM Digest Number 285 > There are 6 messages in this issue. > > Topics in this digest: > > 1. 2-& Chandra...from Mark K. 1/17....re... Understanding Brahman. > Mark Kincaid <m.kincaid > 2. 2-& Chandra....from MarkK....1/17..... Re. Translations of Bhagavad Gita > Mark Kincaid <m.kincaid > 3. 2-& Stephanie...from MarkK. 1/17....re... Understanding Brahman. > Mark Kincaid <m.kincaid > 4. Bhagavad Gita - commentaries and interpretations > <saketbarve > 5. 2-, from Mark,....1/17....re... Spirituality & Jyotish.... > Mark Kincaid <m.kincaid > 6. Re: Re..Teachings of Bhagavad Gita--> Chandra > "sanjaytechnology" <sanjaytechnology > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 1 > Sat, 17 Jan 2004 13:41:18 -0600 > Mark Kincaid <m.kincaid > 2-& Chandra...from Mark K. 1/17....re... Understanding Brahman. > > Dear Chandra: > > I understand what you're saying... And even my teacher Maharishi Mahesh > Yogi, says...that you can't really tell the ultimate authenticity of any > experience...until it becomes permanent... > > But, I call it a brahman experience....because it has all the > characteristics of Brahman...consciousness...where you experience...every > aspect, every part, every bit...of the reality....for example..every bit and > piece...of 'that' which was in my awareness.... I knew...was myself.. > > I have had more, since then...which are even more clear... > > Jai Guru! > > > Mark K. > > > > > > Chandrashekhar Joglekar <cjoglekar2002 > > > > Sat, 17 Jan 2004 11:04:09 -0800 (PST) > > > > Re: 2- & Stephanie...from Mark K. 1/17....re... Understanding > > Brahman. > > > > --- Mark Kincaid <m.kincaid wrote: > >> Dear Stephanie: > > > >> > >> I'll just list one of my first > >> Brahman........experiences.... > >> > >> I had gone back to school,...later in life...in > >> about 1989.... and was > >> attending a college, > >> that emphasized...meditation.... > >> > >> And one night after group meditation...and coming > >> back from dinner... I was > >> passing one > >> the little dorms...when as I looked up... at the > >> building... I watched as my > >> awareness, > >> quietly, gently....lifted up and entered into the > >> builiding.. > >> > >> And for a few moments...my awareness became the > >> being ...and ground of > >> literally every > >> aspect of the building. And I saw and felt...every > >> fabric of the > >> building...to all the nuts, bolts > >> and screws...to all the coaches...people...and even > >> pictures on the walls... > >> > >> And after a short while, my awareness came back to > >> 'normal'... > >> > >> And then, later upon reflecting...I realized I had > >> had a brahman > >> experience... > >> > >> Brahman can be characterized...as Unity.... spread > >> out.... For most, people > >> on the > >> transcendental path.... experiences...of Unity come > >> first... > >> where you're looking at something...and or thinking > >> about something... and > >> for a few moments > >> you realize...that you and that primary object of > >> attention...are literally > >> one! > >> > >> And it's a great experience...too.... and very > >> significant...along the > >> path...of enlightenment... > >> > >> Wow...it's sooo fun....talking about this! > >> > >> > >> Sincerely, > >> > >> > >> Mark Kincaid > > > > > > Dear Mark, > > > > I think what you experienced was a Trans state of > > mind. Your spirit got temporarity detatched from your > > body. > > > > There are cases where people go very near to death > > only to retun back and they also note same pattern of > > experience. But I feel that being Brahman is a > > permanant state and can not be temporary. > > > > > > Sincerely, > > chandra > > > > > > > > > > Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes > > http://hotjobs.sweepstakes./signingbonus > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~ > > > > > > Links > > > > > > / > > > > > > > > > > Your > > > > > > > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 2 > Sat, 17 Jan 2004 13:42:59 -0600 > Mark Kincaid <m.kincaid > 2-& Chandra....from MarkK....1/17..... Re. Translations of Bhagavad Gita > > Dear Chandra: > > Cool.... I love it.... It's very deep....but still easy to understand... > > > ciao > > > Mark K. > > > > > Chandrashekhar Joglekar <cjoglekar2002 > > > > Sat, 17 Jan 2004 11:10:26 -0800 (PST) > > > > Re..Teachings of Bhagavad Gita > > > > --- Mark Kincaid <m.kincaid wrote: > >> Dear All: > >> > >> Speaking of Bhadavad Gita.... > >> > >> One of the best translations I ever read was the one > >> by Maharishi Mahesh > >> Yogi, which is...oh...can't remember the > >> publisher... > >> (few mins later) Here's an amazon.com.. webpage I > >> found that has it.. > > > > Dera sanjayji, > > > > I would definately like to read the traslation by > > Maharshi mahesh Yogi. Thanks for providing the link. > > > > So far I read only one translation of Bhagwat geeta. > > That is from Swami Chinmayananda. > > > > Published by :Central Chinmaya Mission Trust, powai, > > India. > > > > Sincerely, > > chandra > > > > > > > > Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes > > http://hotjobs.sweepstakes./signingbonus > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~ > > > > > > Links > > > > > > / > > > > > > > > > > Your > > > > > > > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 3 > Sat, 17 Jan 2004 13:57:45 -0600 > Mark Kincaid <m.kincaid > 2-& Stephanie...from MarkK. 1/17....re... Understanding Brahman. > > Dear Stephanie: > > I particularly like the quote from below: > > " HAVING ATTAINED ME, > > Because I believe the key....is in becoming enlightened... > > You put attention...on meditation, especially....developing your > consciounsess... > transcending...and experiencing the self... > > and all actions, all pujas, rituals...yaguas...everything.... is easy... > from that vantage... > > > Jai Guru > > > Mark K. Stephanie Marie <chotoprajapati > > Sat, 17 Jan 2004 11:10:33 -0800 (PST) > > Re: Difficulties in Understanding Brahman. > > > There is no doubt that I need to study the Gita much more dilligently. But > if I am to understand Chandrashekhar's post correctly there is both a beauty > and a fault to ritualistic worship? On the one hand is the path to > enlightenment but it is not THE way in which one can achieve enlightenment? > > I'm learning a form hinduism through the Bengali tradition. I do morning > pujas, Shiva on Monday, Lokenath in Tuesday, Loki on Thursday, Satynarayan > on Full Moons, and of course the major celebrations for Kali, Loki, Ma > Durga, Shiva, Krishna, etc. My hands are full just trying to master these > rituals. The dilemma I fear is that I sometimes find myself focusing more > on the mundane elements of life rather than enlightenment. But according > the four paths of life, it seems I'm walking the right path. > > Ultimately, my question is... (sorry for the rambling) what are the > intersections between the larger quests for enlightenment with the day to > day routines of pujas? More importantly, I would also like to know what > some of your thoughts (meaning anyone who would like to chime in) on the > role of women within this space? There sometimes appears to be a > contradiction. If enlightenment means moving through and beyond these more > ritualistic modes but the woman's role within this tradition is to maintain > them, then how is she set free? Especially when so many of the rituals are > based on the importance of marriage? > > Thank you all so much for your indepth and poignant responses. This is a > tremendous help. > > Best, Stephanie > > Chandrashekhar Joglekar <cjoglekar2002 wrote: > Dear Sanjayji and all others, > > > Bhagwat Geeta classifies a person at 4 different > levels. These are brahman, shatriya, vaishya and > shudra. > > At same time it is said that people are of 3 natures > or Gunas. The three natures are satwik, Rajsik and > tamsik. The chapter 8 of Bhagwat Geeta explains the > Term "Brahman". The chapter opens with Arjunas > question to krisna "What is Brahman? What is Adhyatma? > What is Action? What is declared to be Adhibhuta? And > what is AdhiDaiva said to be?" > > And Lord krisna answers these questions in the Chapter > 8. > > stanza 3. > > " BRAHMAN is immperishable and the Adhibhutas > constitute my perishable nature" > > What Bhagwat Geeta says is the aim of our life is to > become desireless. And Being Brahman is Being > desireless and the desireless never return to earth > plane. > > Geeta chapter 8:stanza 11, 12 AND 13 LORD KRISNHA SAYS > > "THAT WHICH IS DEECLARED IMPERISHABLE BY THE VEDA > KNOWERS; THAT INTO WHICH THE SELF CONTROLLED AND > DESIRE-FREED ENTER; THAT DESIRING WHICH BRAHMCHARYA IS > PRACTISED- THAT GOAL I WILL DECLARE TO THEE IN BRIEF" > > "HVAING CLOSED ALL THE GATES, HAVING CONFINED THE MIND > IN THE HEART, HAVING FIXED THE LIFE-BREATH IN THE > "HEAD" ENGAGED IN THE PRACTICE OF CONCENTRATION, > > UTTERING THE ONY SYLLABLED 'OM- (THE SYMBOL OF) THE > BRAHMAN- AND REMEMBERING ME, HE WHO DEPARTS, LEAVING > THE BODY, ATTAINS THE SUPREME GOAL" > > Geeta chapter 8 , stanza 15. > > " HAVING ATTAINED ME, THESE MAHATMAS (GREAT SOULS) DO > NOT TAKE BIRTH AGAIN, WHICH IS HOUSE OF PAIN AND IS > NON ITERNAL, THEY HAVING REACHED THE HIGHEST > PERFECTION, MOKSHA" > > Stanza 16. > > WORLDS UPTO THE "WORLD OF BRAHMAJI", ARE SUBJECT TO > REBIRTH, O ARJUNA, BUT WHO REACHES ME , O KAUNTEYA, > HAS NO BIRTH. > > Stanza 21. > > "THAT WHICH IS CALLED THE UNMANIFEST AND THE > IMPERISHABLE, THAT, THEY SAY IS THE HIGHEST GOAL. THEY > WHO REACH IT NEVER AGAIN RETURN. THIS IS MY HIGHEST > ABODE." > > Stanza 23 > > "NOW AT WHAT TIME (PATH) DEAPRTING, YOGINS GO, NEVER > TO RETURN, AS ALSO TO RETURN, THAT TIME (PATH), I WILL > TELL YOU, O CHIEF OF BHARTAS" > > Geeta chapter 8, STANZA 24 > > "FIRE, LIGHT, DAY TIME, THE BRIGHT FORTNIGHT, THE SIX > MONTHS OF NORTHEN SOLSTICE; FOLOWING THIS PATH , men > who know Brahman go to Brahman" > > According to Upnishdic traditions > > "He who lived a life of rituals (karmas) and worship > (Upasna), will walk the path of the gods and entering > through the sun will go beyond it to Brahmloka. There > he enjoys the supersensous Bliss till the end of the > "cycle", when along with the creator, he gets total > liberation. " > > Geeta Chapter 8:25 > > " SMOKE , NIGHT TIME, THE DARK FORTNIGHT, ASLO SIX > MONTHS OF THE SOUTHERN SOLDICE, ATTAINING BY THESE TO > THE MOON, THE LUNAR LIGHT, THE YOGI RETURNS" > > Those who leave the world after spending there life > time in doing good and performing rituals (karmas) > without worship (Upasna), are those who go to the > world of Ancestors (pitrus, world of heavens). On > having exhausted their merits, they return into > deserved embodiments ordered by individual Vasna > (desire) balance. > > So these two stanzas make it clear that Brahman is > essentially one which is desireless. Because only > desireless spirit is liberated permanantly from the > perishable (the elements) and so never return to earth > plane. > > So any one BORN is born with DESIRES and there for is > not a Brahmin. The way we attain these desires are the > three Gunas (satwik, rajsik nad tamsik) and only > satwik guna can lead us to become Brahmin. > > OM..... > > > --- sanjaytechnology <sanjaytechnology > wrote: > > All: > > > > The knowledge of Brahman and the desire to fell > > Brahman is the > > beginning of understanding of the "SELF". However, > > the statements > > below are very powerful especiall the one "The Isa > > Upanishad warns > > the students of Brahman not to take sides while > > approaching Brahman. > > Those who worship the unmanifest (asambhutim) enter > > blinding > > darkness and those who worship the manifest only > > (sambhutim) enter > > into greater darkness. The right approach is to > > worship both and > > realize one through the other." This is a very very > > powerful > > statement. > > > > Read the statement below, and then the article > > below. > > > > A man knocked on the God's door. "Who's is there?" > > asked God from > > within. "It's me," said the man. "Go away then. > > There is no room for > > two," said God. The man departed and wandered in the > > arid desert > > until he realized his error. Returning to the door, > > he knocked once > > again. "Who's is there?" asked God as before. "You," > > answered the > > man. "Then come in," God replied. > > > > > > Aum Shanti Shanti Shanti. > > > > --Sanjay Aggarwal > > > > Difficulties in Understanding Brahman > > Any attempt to explain Brahman to the satisfaction > > of a mind that is > > driven by reason and familiar with the > > concretization thought is > > fraught with enormous difficulties, because that > > which is > > inexplicable cannot be explained by any amount of > > reasoning and > > logic. Brahman is beyond the senses, beyond the > > mind, beyond our > > intelligence and dreams. Then how can It be > > explained to the > > satisfaction of an intellectual and curious mind? > > The Rigvedic seers > > themselves had this problem in their mind when they > > called Him > > vaguely as "IT" or "This" or "That" > > > > The difficulty in understanding and knowing Brahman > > is well > > explained in the Kena Upanishad. Even gods are not > > free from their > > ignorance of Brahman (II.2.1). All that we can > > understand about > > Brahman is that we cannot understand It. Even after > > prolonged > > spiritual practice and meditation, one cannot even > > conclude whether > > one knows it or not. If a person thinks that he > > knows It, he does > > not know that he does not know. To whomsoever It is > > not known, It is > > known to him. But to whomsoever it is known, is not > > known to him. It > > is not understood by those who understand it and > > understood by those > > who do not understand it. It can be known only when > > one experiences > > directly at all levels of consciousness. (II. 2. > > 2-4). > > > > Trying to worship Brahman incorrectly and ignorantly > > without knowing > > the right approach can also result in great > > difficulties for a > > person who is on the path to salvation. The Isa > > Upanishad warns the > > students of Brahman not to take sides while > > approaching Brahman. > > Those who worship the unmanifest (asambhutim) enter > > blinding > > darkness and those who worship the manifest only > > (sambhutim) enter > > into greater darkness. The right approach is to > > worship both and > > realize one through the other. > > > > Even an enlightened seer like Yagnavalkya had > > difficulties in > > explaining the nature of Brahman and his creation. > > While speaking to > > Sakalya in Brihadaranyaka Upanishad, he declares, " > > That Self is not > > this, not this. It is incomprehensible for it is not > > comprehended." > > When Gargi Vacaknavi asks him too many questions, in > > the same > > Upanishad he expresses his irritation saying, " > > Gargi, do not > > question too much. Otherwise your head may fall off. > > You are asking > > so many questions about a divinity about whom we are > > not expected to > > ask many questions." > > > > Else where in the same Upanishad he resorts to > > negative terminology > > to explain the inexplicable using such words as > > aksaram > > (imperishable), asthulam (not gross), ananu (not > > subtle), ahrasvam > > (nor short), adirgham (not long), achchayam (not > > shadow), atamah > > (not tamasic) and so on (Brihadaranyaka III.8.8). > > > > What is the original state of Brahman? Even the > > seers do not seem to > > have an answer. Uddalaka Aruni tells Svetaketu in > > Chandogya > > Upanishad, that in the beginning the Being was > > alone, one only, one > > without a second and in the next moment changes his > > statement > > stating that according to some in the beginning the > > non-Being was > > alone, without a second and that from that non-Being > > being was > > produced. (VI.2.1) > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes > http://hotjobs.sweepstakes./signingbonus > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~ > > > > > > Links > > / > > > > <?subject=Un> > > Terms of Service > <> . > > > > "WHEN LIFE HANDS YOU LEMONS, DEMAND A CORONA TO GO WITH IT." > > "I'M NOT CRAZY, JUST INTELLECTUALLY INDEPENDENT." > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~ > > > > > > Links > > / > > > > <?subject=Un> > > Terms of Service > <> . > > > > > > [This message contained attachments] > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 4 > Sat, 17 Jan 2004 12:53:19 -0800 (PST) > <saketbarve > Bhagavad Gita - commentaries and interpretations > > Several eminent personalities have commented on > Shrimad Bhavad Gita. For the absolute scholar, the > basic difference between the commentaries has been of > advaita (non-dualism) and dvaita (dualism) which > further branch out. > > For a beginner and learner esoteric concepts do not > matter. Indeed, one'd have to really get a taste of > all - slowly and gradually - before really knowing > which interpretation sounds most appropriate and > convincing. > > Adi Shankaracharya's commentary is among the oldest > which is also readily available. Then there have been > Ramanuja, Vallabha, Madhava though I do not know how > and where their works can be obtained. > > The 13th century Maratha saint Dnyaneshwar translated > the Bhagavad Gita into Marathi language so that the > common man could easily get a grasp of the same > (Sanskrit then was meant only for the learned and > so-called "upper" classes). > Filled with beautiful similies from day to day life, > it is titled "Bhavartha Deepika" with bhakti to the > Lord forming its crux. > > In modern times, Bal Gangadhar Tilak has given his > treatise on the Gita called "Gita Rahasya" (Secrets of > the Gita). It is a huge intellectual, > research-oriented work carried out with great spirit > by the Lokamanya in the prison during the British > tenure. > > Shri Aurobindo's work is quite famous. Then Mahatma > Gandhi had his own views. > > Nobel Laurate Dr. Radhakrishnan has complied his > translation filled with potent commentary on the lines > of Adi Shankaracharya. His introduction to to the > Gita, comprising of about seventy pages though > difficult to grasp, provides the solid foundation > necessary for tackling the actual GITA content. > > The late Bharat Ratna Acharya Vinoba Bhave gave his > touching "Talks on the Gita" whilst he was imprisoned > by the British in Dhule (Nashik district, Mahasashtra) > in 1934. > For a total beginner, this "Talks on the Gita" gives > an excellent, simple insight into the great epic. Shri > Vinoba, avoiding all esoteric language and jargon of > any sort has given in sweet, touching and often moving > words the meaning of each chapter. > With occassional references from Upanishads, Bible, > Quran and importantly from our routine activities one > finds it very easy to relate with the content. > > --- Chandrashekhar Joglekar <cjoglekar2002 > wrote: > > --- Mark Kincaid <m.kincaid wrote: > > > Dear All: > > > > > > Speaking of Bhadavad Gita.... > > > > > > One of the best translations I ever read was the > > one > > > by Maharishi Mahesh > > > Yogi, which is...oh...can't remember the > > > publisher... > > > (few mins later) Here's an amazon.com.. webpage I > > > found that has it.. > > > > Dera sanjayji, > > > > I would definately like to read the traslation by > > Maharshi mahesh Yogi. Thanks for providing the link. > > > > So far I read only one translation of Bhagwat geeta. > > That is from Swami Chinmayananda. > > > > Published by :Central Chinmaya Mission Trust, powai, > > India. > > > > Sincerely, > > chandra > > > > > > > > Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" > > Sweepstakes > > http://hotjobs.sweepstakes./signingbonus > > > > > > > Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes > http://hotjobs.sweepstakes./signingbonus > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 5 > Sat, 17 Jan 2004 14:13:17 -0600 > Mark Kincaid <m.kincaid > 2-, from Mark,....1/17....re... Spirituality & Jyotish.... > > I have an interesting idea. I think it would be fun to look at our Jyotish > charts....in regards > to our interests in spirituality and especially...in terms of being able to > understand what our paths...should be .... ? > > For example...I can see why I was so philosophical...and inquisitive when I > was young, when later I read about my chart. Having Jupiter in Pisces in > the 6th... and aspecting my Moon in the 12th.... helped me understand...why > I have a spiritual interest...anyway. > > But, also Jyotiish, really helped me, on my path, to understand, why I > experienced so many losses...and why I had a kind of reclusive side to > me....even though I always thought of myself as a householder kind of > person. > > Moon & Saturn, both in the 12th house...for a libra rising...says it all! > hehhe > > But, after learning my chart, I realized...not only why I had this reclusive > side...but also realized... that I was supposed to bring my Moon and Saturn > out of the 12th...house of shiva.... and integrate myself...with the > world.... > > Jyotish helped me realize...not only my path...but how....to traverse...it > more efficiently. > > > Jai Guru! > > > > Mark Kincaid.... > > I'd love to hear of others...who are on the 'spiritual path'...and find in > our charts.... the Signs, > of that...spiritualness.... > Stephanie Marie <chotoprajapati > > Sat, 17 Jan 2004 11:19:31 -0800 (PST) > > Re: Diksha > > > I'm also eager to have some of my more technical questions answered because > this summer I will receive diksha from my in-laws guru. I am very versed in > the day to day elements of hinduism but I want to know more about the > broader philosophical modes and I want to understand more deeply different > thoughts about women and Hinduism. I, like Siddhartha, practiced several > paths very dilligently before finding myself on the path of hindu philosophy > and I have no regrets. I just want a greater understanding that is > sometimes difficult to attain due to language barriers. > > Stephanie Marie <chotoprajapati wrote: > There is no doubt that I need to study the Gita much more dilligently. But > if I am to understand Chandrashekhar's post correctly there is both a beauty > and a fault to ritualistic worship? On the one hand is the path to > enlightenment but it is not THE way in which one can achieve enlightenment? > > I'm learning a form hinduism through the Bengali tradition. I do morning > pujas, Shiva on Monday, Lokenath in Tuesday, Loki on Thursday, Satynarayan > on Full Moons, and of course the major celebrations for Kali, Loki, Ma > Durga, Shiva, Krishna, etc. My hands are full just trying to master these > rituals. The dilemma I fear is that I sometimes find myself focusing more > on the mundane elements of life rather than enlightenment. But according > the four paths of life, it seems I'm walking the right path. > > Ultimately, my question is... (sorry for the rambling) what are the > intersections between the larger quests for enlightenment with the day to > day routines of pujas? More importantly, I would also like to know what > some of your thoughts (meaning anyone who would like to chime in) on the > role of women within this space? There sometimes appears to be a > contradiction. If enlightenment means moving through and beyond these more > ritualistic modes but the woman's role within this tradition is to maintain > them, then how is she set free? Especially when so many of the rituals are > based on the importance of marriage? > > Thank you all so much for your indepth and poignant responses. This is a > tremendous help. > > Best, Stephanie > > Chandrashekhar Joglekar <cjoglekar2002 wrote: > Dear Sanjayji and all others, > > > Bhagwat Geeta classifies a person at 4 different > levels. These are brahman, shatriya, vaishya and > shudra. > > At same time it is said that people are of 3 natures > or Gunas. The three natures are satwik, Rajsik and > tamsik. The chapter 8 of Bhagwat Geeta explains the > Term "Brahman". The chapter opens with Arjunas > question to krisna "What is Brahman? What is Adhyatma? > What is Action? What is declared to be Adhibhuta? And > what is AdhiDaiva said to be?" > > And Lord krisna answers these questions in the Chapter > 8. > > stanza 3. > > " BRAHMAN is immperishable and the Adhibhutas > constitute my perishable nature" > > What Bhagwat Geeta says is the aim of our life is to > become desireless. And Being Brahman is Being > desireless and the desireless never return to earth > plane. > > Geeta chapter 8:stanza 11, 12 AND 13 LORD KRISNHA SAYS > > "THAT WHICH IS DEECLARED IMPERISHABLE BY THE VEDA > KNOWERS; THAT INTO WHICH THE SELF CONTROLLED AND > DESIRE-FREED ENTER; THAT DESIRING WHICH BRAHMCHARYA IS > PRACTISED- THAT GOAL I WILL DECLARE TO THEE IN BRIEF" > > "HVAING CLOSED ALL THE GATES, HAVING CONFINED THE MIND > IN THE HEART, HAVING FIXED THE LIFE-BREATH IN THE > "HEAD" ENGAGED IN THE PRACTICE OF CONCENTRATION, > > UTTERING THE ONY SYLLABLED 'OM- (THE SYMBOL OF) THE > BRAHMAN- AND REMEMBERING ME, HE WHO DEPARTS, LEAVING > THE BODY, ATTAINS THE SUPREME GOAL" > > Geeta chapter 8 , stanza 15. > > " HAVING ATTAINED ME, THESE MAHATMAS (GREAT SOULS) DO > NOT TAKE BIRTH AGAIN, WHICH IS HOUSE OF PAIN AND IS > NON ITERNAL, THEY HAVING REACHED THE HIGHEST > PERFECTION, MOKSHA" > > Stanza 16. > > WORLDS UPTO THE "WORLD OF BRAHMAJI", ARE SUBJECT TO > REBIRTH, O ARJUNA, BUT WHO REACHES ME , O KAUNTEYA, > HAS NO BIRTH. > > Stanza 21. > > "THAT WHICH IS CALLED THE UNMANIFEST AND THE > IMPERISHABLE, THAT, THEY SAY IS THE HIGHEST GOAL. THEY > WHO REACH IT NEVER AGAIN RETURN. THIS IS MY HIGHEST > ABODE." > > Stanza 23 > > "NOW AT WHAT TIME (PATH) DEAPRTING, YOGINS GO, NEVER > TO RETURN, AS ALSO TO RETURN, THAT TIME (PATH), I WILL > TELL YOU, O CHIEF OF BHARTAS" > > Geeta chapter 8, STANZA 24 > > "FIRE, LIGHT, DAY TIME, THE BRIGHT FORTNIGHT, THE SIX > MONTHS OF NORTHEN SOLSTICE; FOLOWING THIS PATH , men > who know Brahman go to Brahman" > > According to Upnishdic traditions > > "He who lived a life of rituals (karmas) and worship > (Upasna), will walk the path of the gods and entering > through the sun will go beyond it to Brahmloka. There > he enjoys the supersensous Bliss till the end of the > "cycle", when along with the creator, he gets total > liberation. " > > Geeta Chapter 8:25 > > " SMOKE , NIGHT TIME, THE DARK FORTNIGHT, ASLO SIX > MONTHS OF THE SOUTHERN SOLDICE, ATTAINING BY THESE TO > THE MOON, THE LUNAR LIGHT, THE YOGI RETURNS" > > Those who leave the world after spending there life > time in doing good and performing rituals (karmas) > without worship (Upasna), are those who go to the > world of Ancestors (pitrus, world of heavens). On > having exhausted their merits, they return into > deserved embodiments ordered by individual Vasna > (desire) balance. > > So these two stanzas make it clear that Brahman is > essentially one which is desireless. Because only > desireless spirit is liberated permanantly from the > perishable (the elements) and so never return to earth > plane. > > So any one BORN is born with DESIRES and there for is > not a Brahmin. The way we attain these desires are the > three Gunas (satwik, rajsik nad tamsik) and only > satwik guna can lead us to become Brahmin. > > OM..... > > > --- sanjaytechnology <sanjaytechnology > wrote: > > All: > > > > The knowledge of Brahman and the desire to fell > > Brahman is the > > beginning of understanding of the "SELF". However, > > the statements > > below are very powerful especiall the one "The Isa > > Upanishad warns > > the students of Brahman not to take sides while > > approaching Brahman. > > Those who worship the unmanifest (asambhutim) enter > > blinding > > darkness and those who worship the manifest only > > (sambhutim) enter > > into greater darkness. The right approach is to > > worship both and > > realize one through the other." This is a very very > > powerful > > statement. > > > > Read the statement below, and then the article > > below. > > > > A man knocked on the God's door. "Who's is there?" > > asked God from > > within. "It's me," said the man. "Go away then. > > There is no room for > > two," said God. The man departed and wandered in the > > arid desert > > until he realized his error. Returning to the door, > > he knocked once > > again. "Who's is there?" asked God as before. "You," > > answered the > > man. "Then come in," God replied. > > > > > > Aum Shanti Shanti Shanti. > > > > --Sanjay Aggarwal > > > > Difficulties in Understanding Brahman > > Any attempt to explain Brahman to the satisfaction > > of a mind that is > > driven by reason and familiar with the > > concretization thought is > > fraught with enormous difficulties, because that > > which is > > inexplicable cannot be explained by any amount of > > reasoning and > > logic. Brahman is beyond the senses, beyond the > > mind, beyond our > > intelligence and dreams. Then how can It be > > explained to the > > satisfaction of an intellectual and curious mind? > > The Rigvedic seers > > themselves had this problem in their mind when they > > called Him > > vaguely as "IT" or "This" or "That" > > > > The difficulty in understanding and knowing Brahman > > is well > > explained in the Kena Upanishad. Even gods are not > > free from their > > ignorance of Brahman (II.2.1). All that we can > > understand about > > Brahman is that we cannot understand It. Even after > > prolonged > > spiritual practice and meditation, one cannot even > > conclude whether > > one knows it or not. If a person thinks that he > > knows It, he does > > not know that he does not know. To whomsoever It is > > not known, It is > > known to him. But to whomsoever it is known, is not > > known to him. It > > is not understood by those who understand it and > > understood by those > > who do not understand it. It can be known only when > > one experiences > > directly at all levels of consciousness. (II. 2. > > 2-4). > > > > Trying to worship Brahman incorrectly and ignorantly > > without knowing > > the right approach can also result in great > > difficulties for a > > person who is on the path to salvation. The Isa > > Upanishad warns the > > students of Brahman not to take sides while > > approaching Brahman. > > Those who worship the unmanifest (asambhutim) enter > > blinding > > darkness and those who worship the manifest only > > (sambhutim) enter > > into greater darkness. The right approach is to > > worship both and > > realize one through the other. > > > > Even an enlightened seer like Yagnavalkya had > > difficulties in > > explaining the nature of Brahman and his creation. > > While speaking to > > Sakalya in Brihadaranyaka Upanishad, he declares, " > > That Self is not > > this, not this. It is incomprehensible for it is not > > comprehended." > > When Gargi Vacaknavi asks him too many questions, in > > the same > > Upanishad he expresses his irritation saying, " > > Gargi, do not > > question too much. Otherwise your head may fall off. > > You are asking > > so many questions about a divinity about whom we are > > not expected to > > ask many questions." > > > > Else where in the same Upanishad he resorts to > > negative terminology > > to explain the inexplicable using such words as > > aksaram > > (imperishable), asthulam (not gross), ananu (not > > subtle), ahrasvam > > (nor short), adirgham (not long), achchayam (not > > shadow), atamah > > (not tamasic) and so on (Brihadaranyaka III.8.8). > > > > What is the original state of Brahman? Even the > > seers do not seem to > > have an answer. Uddalaka Aruni tells Svetaketu in > > Chandogya > > Upanishad, that in the beginning the Being was > > alone, one only, one > > without a second and in the next moment changes his > > statement > > stating that according to some in the beginning the > > non-Being was > > alone, without a second and that from that non-Being > > being was > > produced. (VI.2.1) > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes > http://hotjobs.sweepstakes./signingbonus > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~ > > > > > > Links > > / > > > > <?subject=Un> > > Terms of Service > <> . > > > > "WHEN LIFE HANDS YOU LEMONS, DEMAND A CORONA TO GO WITH IT." > > "I'M NOT CRAZY, JUST INTELLECTUALLY INDEPENDENT." > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~ > > > > > > Links > > / > > > > <?subject=Un> > > Terms of Service > <> . > > > > "WHEN LIFE HANDS YOU LEMONS, DEMAND A CORONA TO GO WITH IT." > > "I'M NOT CRAZY, JUST INTELLECTUALLY INDEPENDENT." > > > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~ > > > Sponsor > > > > > Links > > / > > > > <?subject=Un> > > Terms of Service > <> . > > > > > > [This message contained attachments] > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 6 > Sat, 17 Jan 2004 21:45:40 -0000 > "sanjaytechnology" <sanjaytechnology > Re: Re..Teachings of Bhagavad Gita--> Chandra > > Chandra ji: > > I will provide all the information very soon. > > Kind Regards. > > --Sanjay Aggarwal > > > , Chandrashekhar Joglekar > <cjoglekar2002> wrote: > > --- Mark Kincaid <m.kincaid@m...> wrote: > > > Dear All: > > > > > > Speaking of Bhadavad Gita.... > > > > > > One of the best translations I ever read was the one > > > by Maharishi Mahesh > > > Yogi, which is...oh...can't remember the > > > publisher... > > > (few mins later) Here's an amazon.com.. webpage I > > > found that has it.. > > > > Dera sanjayji, > > > > I would definately like to read the traslation by > > Maharshi mahesh Yogi. Thanks for providing the link. > > > > So far I read only one translation of Bhagwat geeta. > > That is from Swami Chinmayananda. > > > > Published by :Central Chinmaya Mission Trust, powai, > > India. > > > > Sincerely, > > chandra > > > > > > > > Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes > > http://hotjobs.sweepstakes./signingbonus > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > > ~! LIFE MEANS STRUGGLE, THE FITTEST WINS SURVIVAL !~ > > ------ > Links > > > / > > > > > Your > > ------ > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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