natural vs. functional malefics & benefics, which to propitiate ...

[Guest guest]

Hi, greetings...

 

> Ve is dare malefic for you.

> Propi both Sat and Ve and you will get good results from Ve.

> Su is benefic.

> Ju benefic.

> Mars mixed. (NOT NEUTRAL, there can be NO neutral planet in astrology)

> Moon malefic.

 

Regards,

Tanvir

 

 

 

What can not happen, can never happen.

Which is mine, is forever mine.

 

Tanvir Chowdhury

Mail tanvir

Personal site http://www.geocities.com/king_tanvir

Jyotish site http://www.geocities.com/planetaryastro

Jyotish discussion

 

-

kellym

Monday, September 08, 2003 6:12 AM

natural vs. functional malefics & benefics, which to propitiate

....

 

 

Greetings everyone, this is my first posting to thsi sight and I'm looking

forward to

sharing what I've learned and learning, too..

 

I've done a chart for myself and had it read by an astrologer(vedic) but I

still have

questins about it, particulary in regards to which planets need remedies the

most and

which I should clearly not remedy.

 

This may jump around some, but here goes. I would really appreciate your veiws

on

these matters. First, I thought venus was always a benefic but venus is shown

as a

malefic for my chart. Is this because it rules the 6th and 11th houses? If it

is a

malefic, should I not strengthen it at all even though it is only 1 degree

away from

saturn in the first house and therefore in terrible shape? I'm aware that I

really need

more venus energy (pleasure, joy) in my life. I assume I should propitiate

saturn as

much as possible to relieve te effect on venus. mars i thought was malefic but

is

shown as benfic for me; is this because because it rules the 5th(and 12th)

should i

strenghen mars, even though it is in opposition to jupiter in the 11th? I

clearly don't

want to hurt jupiter at all. The moon is also shown as malefic, is this

because it is

lord of the 8th? The sun, ruler of the 9th, is shown as benefic but i thought

it was

always malefic. are these confusions due to "natural vs functional" status of

the

planets as malefic/benefic? The books I've read have not presented answers to

these

questions in a way I understand. My concern is clearly understanding which

really

need strenghtening and which need propitiating.

 

another issue: what is the significance of the ascendent being in the first or

last

degree of a sign?

I rad the article on loneliness, and how saturn affects this and can really

relate. thank

you for posting that. Another issue: what is the effect of retrograde

planets? I haven't

found a clear agreement about this.

 

i know this is just a smattering and doesn't give the picture of the whole

chart, but I

would be grateful for your input. I expect I'l have more ?s later.

 

thank you in advance for your help, kelly

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

~ Om Namah Shivaya ~

 

Hello Kelly,

 

As per my understanding, Retrograde planets generally

give mixed effects (sometime highly good or bad),

which are difficult to predict.

 

If 7th lord or venus is ill placed, it can give

loneliness. Also Aspect of Saturn on 7th house, 7L can

give loneliness.

 

Kind regards,

 

Neeraj Gupta

--- Tanvir <tanvir wrote:

> Hi, greetings...

>

> > Ve is dare malefic for you.

> > Propi both Sat and Ve and you will get good

> results from Ve.

> > Su is benefic.

> > Ju benefic.

> > Mars mixed. (NOT NEUTRAL, there can be NO neutral

> planet in astrology)

> > Moon malefic.

>

> Regards,

> Tanvir

>

>

>

> What can not happen, can never happen.

> Which is mine, is forever mine.

>

> Tanvir Chowdhury

> Mail tanvir

> Personal site http://www.geocities.com/king_tanvir

> Jyotish site http://www.geocities.com/planetaryastro

> Jyotish discussion

>

>

> -

> kellym

>

> Monday, September 08, 2003 6:12 AM

> natural vs. functional malefics &

> benefics, which to propitiate ...

>

>

> Greetings everyone, this is my first posting to

> thsi sight and I'm looking forward to

> sharing what I've learned and learning, too..

>

> I've done a chart for myself and had it read by an

> astrologer(vedic) but I still have

> questins about it, particulary in regards to which

> planets need remedies the most and

> which I should clearly not remedy.

>

> This may jump around some, but here goes. I would

> really appreciate your veiws on

> these matters. First, I thought venus was always a

> benefic but venus is shown as a

> malefic for my chart. Is this because it rules the

> 6th and 11th houses? If it is a

> malefic, should I not strengthen it at all even

> though it is only 1 degree away from

> saturn in the first house and therefore in

> terrible shape? I'm aware that I really need

> more venus energy (pleasure, joy) in my life. I

> assume I should propitiate saturn as

> much as possible to relieve te effect on venus.

> mars i thought was malefic but is

> shown as benfic for me; is this because because it

> rules the 5th(and 12th) should i

> strenghen mars, even though it is in opposition to

> jupiter in the 11th? I clearly don't

> want to hurt jupiter at all. The moon is also

> shown as malefic, is this because it is

> lord of the 8th? The sun, ruler of the 9th, is

> shown as benefic but i thought it was

> always malefic. are these confusions due to

> "natural vs functional" status of the

> planets as malefic/benefic? The books I've read

> have not presented answers to these

> questions in a way I understand. My concern is

> clearly understanding which really

> need strenghtening and which need propitiating.

>

> another issue: what is the significance of the

> ascendent being in the first or last

> degree of a sign?

> I rad the article on loneliness, and how saturn

> affects this and can really relate. thank

> you for posting that. Another issue: what is the

> effect of retrograde planets? I haven't

> found a clear agreement about this.

>

> i know this is just a smattering and doesn't give

> the picture of the whole chart, but I

> would be grateful for your input. I expect I'l

> have more ?s later.

>

> thank you in advance for your help, kelly

>

>

> [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

>

>

 

 

=====

http://www.geocities.com/master_minds_india/

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

tanvir .. thanks so much for your response. I stiil feel confused because

someone once

told me venus should defeinitely be srenghtened(not propitiated) because of its

conjunction with saturn, and you've suggested propitiating it instead. I

realize i don't

understand jyotish too well yet, but this is confusing. also, what does "dare

malefic"

mean? i've not heard that term before. Is that the same as a functional

malefic?

 

thanks again for your advice, kelly

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

, "Tanvir" <tanvir@s...> wrote:

> Hi, greetings...

>

> > Ve is dare malefic for you.

> > Propi both Sat and Ve and you will get good results from Ve.

> > Su is benefic.

> > Ju benefic.

> > Mars mixed. (NOT NEUTRAL, there can be NO neutral planet in astrology)

> > Moon malefic.

>

> Regards,

> Tanvir

>

>

>

> What can not happen, can never happen.

> Which is mine, is forever mine.

>

> Tanvir Chowdhury

> Mail tanvir@s...

> Personal site http://www.geocities.com/king_tanvir

> Jyotish site http://www.geocities.com/planetaryastro

> Jyotish discussion

>

> -

> kellym

>

> Monday, September 08, 2003 6:12 AM

> natural vs. functional malefics & benefics, which to

propitiate ...

>

>

> Greetings everyone, this is my first posting to thsi sight and I'm looking

forward to

> sharing what I've learned and learning, too..

>

> I've done a chart for myself and had it read by an astrologer(vedic) but I

still have

> questins about it, particulary in regards to which planets need remedies the

most

and

> which I should clearly not remedy.

>

> This may jump around some, but here goes. I would really appreciate your

veiws on

> these matters. First, I thought venus was always a benefic but venus is

shown as a

> malefic for my chart. Is this because it rules the 6th and 11th houses? If

it is a

> malefic, should I not strengthen it at all even though it is only 1 degree

away from

> saturn in the first house and therefore in terrible shape? I'm aware that I

really need

> more venus energy (pleasure, joy) in my life. I assume I should propitiate

saturn as

> much as possible to relieve te effect on venus. mars i thought was malefic

but is

> shown as benfic for me; is this because because it rules the 5th(and 12th)

should i

> strenghen mars, even though it is in opposition to jupiter in the 11th? I

clearly don't

> want to hurt jupiter at all. The moon is also shown as malefic, is this

because it is

> lord of the 8th? The sun, ruler of the 9th, is shown as benefic but i

thought it was

> always malefic. are these confusions due to "natural vs functional" status

of the

> planets as malefic/benefic? The books I've read have not presented answers

to

these

> questions in a way I understand. My concern is clearly understanding which

really

> need strenghtening and which need propitiating.

>

> another issue: what is the significance of the ascendent being in the first

or last

> degree of a sign?

> I rad the article on loneliness, and how saturn affects this and can really

relate.

thank

> you for posting that. Another issue: what is the effect of retrograde

planets? I

haven't

> found a clear agreement about this.

>

> i know this is just a smattering and doesn't give the picture of the whole

chart, but I

> would be grateful for your input. I expect I'l have more ?s later.

>

> thank you in advance for your help, kelly

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Neeraj ... thanks for your reply. I'll definitely be doing somethings to

propitiate

saturn.

 

Namaste, kelly

 

 

 

 

, Neeraj Gupta <gupta_neeraj_2000>

wrote:

> ~ Om Namah Shivaya ~

>

> Hello Kelly,

>

> As per my understanding, Retrograde planets generally

> give mixed effects (sometime highly good or bad),

> which are difficult to predict.

>

> If 7th lord or venus is ill placed, it can give

> loneliness. Also Aspect of Saturn on 7th house, 7L can

> give loneliness.

>

> Kind regards,

>

> Neeraj Gupta

> --- Tanvir <tanvir@s...> wrote:

> > Hi, greetings...

> >

> > > Ve is dare malefic for you.

> > > Propi both Sat and Ve and you will get good

> > results from Ve.

> > > Su is benefic.

> > > Ju benefic.

> > > Mars mixed. (NOT NEUTRAL, there can be NO neutral

> > planet in astrology)

> > > Moon malefic.

> >

> > Regards,

> > Tanvir

> >

> >

> >

> > What can not happen, can never happen.

> > Which is mine, is forever mine.

> >

> > Tanvir Chowdhury

> > Mail tanvir@s...

> > Personal site http://www.geocities.com/king_tanvir

> > Jyotish site http://www.geocities.com/planetaryastro

> > Jyotish discussion

> >

> >

> > -

> > kellym

> >

> > Monday, September 08, 2003 6:12 AM

> > natural vs. functional malefics &

> > benefics, which to propitiate ...

> >

> >

> > Greetings everyone, this is my first posting to

> > thsi sight and I'm looking forward to

> > sharing what I've learned and learning, too..

> >

> > I've done a chart for myself and had it read by an

> > astrologer(vedic) but I still have

> > questins about it, particulary in regards to which

> > planets need remedies the most and

> > which I should clearly not remedy.

> >

> > This may jump around some, but here goes. I would

> > really appreciate your veiws on

> > these matters. First, I thought venus was always a

> > benefic but venus is shown as a

> > malefic for my chart. Is this because it rules the

> > 6th and 11th houses? If it is a

> > malefic, should I not strengthen it at all even

> > though it is only 1 degree away from

> > saturn in the first house and therefore in

> > terrible shape? I'm aware that I really need

> > more venus energy (pleasure, joy) in my life. I

> > assume I should propitiate saturn as

> > much as possible to relieve te effect on venus.

> > mars i thought was malefic but is

> > shown as benfic for me; is this because because it

> > rules the 5th(and 12th) should i

> > strenghen mars, even though it is in opposition to

> > jupiter in the 11th? I clearly don't

> > want to hurt jupiter at all. The moon is also

> > shown as malefic, is this because it is

> > lord of the 8th? The sun, ruler of the 9th, is

> > shown as benefic but i thought it was

> > always malefic. are these confusions due to

> > "natural vs functional" status of the

> > planets as malefic/benefic? The books I've read

> > have not presented answers to these

> > questions in a way I understand. My concern is

> > clearly understanding which really

> > need strenghtening and which need propitiating.

> >

> > another issue: what is the significance of the

> > ascendent being in the first or last

> > degree of a sign?

> > I rad the article on loneliness, and how saturn

> > affects this and can really relate. thank

> > you for posting that. Another issue: what is the

> > effect of retrograde planets? I haven't

> > found a clear agreement about this.

> >

> > i know this is just a smattering and doesn't give

> > the picture of the whole chart, but I

> > would be grateful for your input. I expect I'l

> > have more ?s later.

> >

> > thank you in advance for your help, kelly

> >

> >

> > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> >

> >

>

>

> =====

> http://www.geocities.com/master_minds_india/

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Well actually 'dare malefic' isnt an astro-term but a 'tanvir-term' you can call

;-) I use it to mean 'Too much malefic' since it rules both malefic houses (6 &

11).

 

Regards,

Tanvir

 

 

 

What can not happen, can never happen.

Which is mine, is forever mine.

 

Tanvir Chowdhury

Mail tanvir

Personal site http://www.geocities.com/king_tanvir

Jyotish site http://www.geocities.com/planetaryastro

Jyotish discussion

 

-

kellym

Thursday, September 11, 2003 8:05 PM

Re: natural vs. functional malefics & benefics, which to

propitiate ...

 

 

tanvir .. thanks so much for your response. I stiil feel confused because

someone once

told me venus should defeinitely be srenghtened(not propitiated) because of

its

conjunction with saturn, and you've suggested propitiating it instead. I

realize i don't

understand jyotish too well yet, but this is confusing. also, what does "dare

malefic"

mean? i've not heard that term before. Is that the same as a functional

malefic?

 

thanks again for your advice, kelly

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

>From your post it seems that your ascending sign is sagittarius,

jupiter in 5th, mars in 11th, saturn and venus in 1st.

1st of all let me tell you that your lord of ascendant is very

strong. Saturn and Venus have a trine aspect with your lord of

ascendant. Your lord of ascendant has full aspect on your ascendant

itself (jupiter has 100% aspect on 5th and 9th houses from the house

it is placed, therefore, its fully aspecting the 9th house and the

1st house).

So you need not worry about it. Pleasures will come to you easily as

venus is in the ascendant. Saturn's influence will most likely make

you mature early in your age. Note that saturn is exalted in venus'

sign libra, so saturn's conjunction with venus is making it strong.

For venus the full aspect of the planet Jupiter, which owns pisces-

the sign where venus is exalted, is very helpful.

I must say that you have a strong horoscope. Any astrologers that

tell you that you need to improve your horoscope are wrong. Its very

strong indeed. (I don't know the position of mercury, sun and moon.

Hopefully they don't put a square or opposition aspect on any planet.)

 

Saturn's influence gives loneliness but due to the presence of venus,

you won't have this effect in its most intense form. There will be a

balance. You'll most probably be a person who 'can' be very social

but tends to stay alone.

 

So don't worry.

and remember, there is nothing stronger than free will! (even if you

think your horoscope is weak, your will power can nullify all evils.

Don't lose hope!)

 

Regards,

A student of astrology (vedic+western+myownobservations)

[Guest guest]

One more thing on malefic and benefic nature. When a planet is in the

ascendant and is under the full aspect of the lord of ascendant (as

in your case), its malefic effects are minimized since the lord of

ascendant 'controls' it.

Saturn and venus aren't good planets for sagittareans but in your

case due to the strong lord of ascendant and its full aspect on

ascendant, they can't do any harm.

 

In general, malefic and benefic nature isn't that easy to determine

as the traditional texts claim. Sometimes strange relations between

planets arise which unite them despite their natural enmity and

malefic nature.

As in your case, saturn and venus are sharing a 'strange'

relationship with your lord of ascendant jupiter. This is because

they are placed in his house. Since, he's guarding his house fully

(i.e. fully aspecting), they can't do any harm. Instead, they'll have

to follow Jupiter's(your) rules of the game. If jupiter hadn't been

casting the full aspect, saturn and venus may well have given you

their full malefic effects!

 

I hope it helps.

 

 

Regards,

A student of astrology (vedic+western+myownobservations)

 

, "msgfromhell"

<msgfromhell> wrote:

> From your post it seems that your ascending sign is sagittarius,

> jupiter in 5th, mars in 11th, saturn and venus in 1st.

> 1st of all let me tell you that your lord of ascendant is very

> strong. Saturn and Venus have a trine aspect with your lord of

> ascendant. Your lord of ascendant has full aspect on your ascendant

> itself (jupiter has 100% aspect on 5th and 9th houses from the

house

> it is placed, therefore, its fully aspecting the 9th house and the

> 1st house).

> So you need not worry about it. Pleasures will come to you easily

as

> venus is in the ascendant. Saturn's influence will most likely make

> you mature early in your age. Note that saturn is exalted in venus'

> sign libra, so saturn's conjunction with venus is making it strong.

> For venus the full aspect of the planet Jupiter, which owns pisces-

> the sign where venus is exalted, is very helpful.

> I must say that you have a strong horoscope. Any astrologers that

> tell you that you need to improve your horoscope are wrong. Its

very

> strong indeed. (I don't know the position of mercury, sun and moon.

> Hopefully they don't put a square or opposition aspect on any

planet.)

>

> Saturn's influence gives loneliness but due to the presence of

venus,

> you won't have this effect in its most intense form. There will be

a

> balance. You'll most probably be a person who 'can' be very social

> but tends to stay alone.

>

> So don't worry.

> and remember, there is nothing stronger than free will! (even if

you

> think your horoscope is weak, your will power can nullify all

evils.

> Don't lose hope!)

>

> Regards,

> A student of astrology (vedic+western+myownobservations)