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very sorry to jump in. this was very interesting tanvirji. would you

also say that 12th L in 6th would give debts too? what about in 8th?

what are the remedies? and what placement would give wealth?

 

rani.

 

 

, "Tanvir" <tanvir@s...> wrote:

> Hello,

> I am glad that you liked my views :-))) Actually predictions based

on a rashi chart is strictly unscienctific since many thousand people

are born in the same two hours with same rashi charts. In that logic

there should be many copies of this 'Tanvir' who are doing exactly

same in Jyotish with same skill and same class website and groups,

since all other people born in my two hours have the same Rashi

charts. There should be many other Bill Gates owning same big

companies like Microsoft and owning same huge wealth.

>

> Rashi chart is not logical (Only D charts are) and the real Jyotish

is working with D charts. However, most of the time Rashi charts

match exactly and that is a DIVINITY just like a 'Prashna' Chart. (A

prashna chart has no visible logic so far.) To my mind the divinity

is that, "Only people who's Rashi chart will tell about them

correctly have their charts done" or something like this.

>

> This is just a divinity...

>

> Atma Karaka does not mean 'Soul-indicator' but does mean 'Self-

indicator'. The word 'Atma' has different meanings like soul, self

etc. Here it means self. Like Atma-hatya does not mean soul-killing

but means self-killing, ie suicide.

>

> It has been said that the AK (Atma karaka) shows the cause of

birth. To me, it does not always give sufferings but if it is ill

placed, it will give suffering like other planets.

>

> A lagna lord (self indicator) will cause much suffering if

afflicted, since he deals with 'self' or 'overall life' and the same

rule applies to AK since the effects will be directly on 'self'

and 'life'. And like any other planets the effects will be related to

the lordship and placement etc.

>

> I hope this is clear now. Learned members might correct me if I am

wrong...

>

> About karakas, both natural and particular karakas are important.

After the mail I wil paste a portion of my article on loneliness to

make it even more clear how natural and particular karakas work.

>

> 12th L in 12th house gives debts, I saw two charts like this. When

I got the third chart, I said he must have debts, and it was true.

You are the fourth person with this :-) I was startting to believe

that 12H tules debts but then I could see it correctly that the 12L

from 12H aspects the 6H (debts) fully. Since he is strong giver of

losses and expenditure from 12H, aspecting debts, he gives debts.

>

> Both your cases the debts are from your children and that is for

the Sat (5L) being there in 12H joining 12L.

>

> I think removing sapphire will lessen the prob to some degree.

>

> Telling again, removing emerald will stop giving you some benefit

related to health and career. But for happiness from marital life and

kids it's extremely important.

>

> A part is copied below, you can read the full article by going to

my site > Articles > Loneliness. Focus on my hart in the article, you

would get more examples how planets work as per their own nature and

lordships.

>

> Best wishes,

> Tanvir

>

>

>

> What can not happen, can never happen.

> Which is mine, is forever mine.

>

> Tanvir Chowdhury

> tanvir@s...

> http://www.geocities.com/king_tanvir

> http://www.geocities.com/planetaryastro

>

>

> ===================

>

> Example for Karaka

>

> 8L gives loneliness most among other lords. My Mars (3,8 lord) and

Saturn both are exalted. Both natural and particular significators of

loneliness are very strong.

>

> I first felt loneliness during whole of my Me-Mars. Right after

starting of Mars AD, loneliness started, and right after the AD was

over, loneliness was gone, too. Mars did not cause accidents being

non afflicted and strong, but gave me loneliness. A major part of the

day I used to pass in lonely places sitting alone for hours. I was

lonely even in home for all the day and time. Had almost no one to

talk to. Well, I had people to "talk to", but talks only related to

work, studies etc.

>

> The only people I had to share my feelings were the servatns we

had, i.e., the driver of our car and the cook of our home. Also, a

great help were the private tutors I had. I used to gossip them to

some extent and share my feelings and have a little better time.

>

> Now when we see the chart carefully, help from servants and

teachers against loneliness becomes clear.

>

> There is a well placed Jupiter in my chart in the 3rd house.

Jupiter is the most benefic planet in nature, and is a mild malefic

for my ascendant. Again, for being well placed and virtuous in

nature, he will work good for me most of the times.

>

> This Jupiter exchanges mutual aspect with Mars, the 8th lord of

loneliness. That is why he lessens some of the pains Mars gives me.

>

> Jupiter is from the 3rd house, the house ruling servants. And, he

is the natural ruler of teachers. So in my case, he rules servants

and teachers. That is why, Jupiter cooling down Mars (loneliness) did

that from the servants (3rd house) and teachers (Jupiter itself).

>

> ================================

>

> -

> Clara

>

> Sunday, July 27, 2003 5:31 PM

> Re: Married Life

>

>

> Dear Tanvir,

>

> Thank you very much for this eye-opener. It greatly contributes

to my jyotish knowledge.

>

> See for my comments below.

>

> kind regards,

>

> Clara

>

>

> -

> Tanvir

>

> Friday, July 25, 2003 6:24 PM

> Re: Married Life

>

>

> || Salam ||

>

> First of all, difficulties in your married life and more than

one marriage is not anything surprising since your 7th house has Rahu

(This again means first house has Ketu, twin problems) and First

house has total 3 planets who all aspect the 7th house. Including a

fallen Venus (Natural karaka of love and marriage) who gets Neecha

Bhanga but even then there would be trouble regarding being in fall.

>

> 3 planets in first house and Rahu in 7th very clearly tells the

problems.

>

> If we look it from another side then we find that Venus is

again afflicted by Rahu and Ketu.

>

> On the other hand your 7th lord Jupiter is troubled for being

on the 29th degree of the sign. Again, it is retro and your

atmakaraka, so it will teach you important lessons in life. Jupiter

being 4th and 7th lord, the lessons wil be related to family life and

marriage, spouse etc.

>

> Q. Is that what an atmakaraka does? Teaching you the most

important lessons in your life? The word soul-indicator did not tell

me that.

>

> All Rahu, Ketu etc. also influence this Jupiter by sign aspect.

>

> Can you see something? You have mentioned that both the

marriages were ruined by your child. Now tell me who rules the child

in natural significations? Jupiter!!! Now this should be more clear.

>

> Most clear indication, the child ruined your married lives were

born in your Jupiter PD !!!

>

> So now see the things clearly.

>

> You made it very clear to me. I thank you very much for that. I

never considered Jupiter, I just looked at the fifth lord Saturn.

> I am not yet very familiar with karakas, but now I can see how

they work.

>

> And with due repstect to all, I do not know what is the reason

of prescribing blue sapphire here? Saturn is your 6th lord which

strictly opposes married life. No wonder a strong 6th lord would

oppose marital harmony esp. if anyhoe it influience 7H / 7L / Venus

etc... so why strengthening it?

>

> Again, you should also be very careful wearing an emerald.

Remember Mercury is an neuter planet, his influence will generally

make unhappiness from children and spouse. Virgos should be careful

about romance and children while wearing emerald, though for other

matters it would do good. And in your chart Mercury is enough strong

who aspects the 7th house and joins Venus, the planet of love and

marriage.

>

> Q. Do you have / ever had any debt problem?

>

> 1] My son, 2nd child, (born in my Ra/Ju) choose to live with

his father when he remarried in 1987. But this marriage divorced 3

years later en left his father bankrupt. Lives of father and son went

downhill.

>

> I could not face this any longer so I travelled there and we

agreed I would take our son home with me for a short period, (but he

still lives with me up till now). He came home with me on 26 october

1993 (Ju/Me/Me) and in the months following, the bills came in, and

it became clear that he had a large debt, no job, was mentally ill,

so I had to pay for it. It took me a couple of years to get him back

on his feet again, but he paid me back multifold in the years after

my divorce by supporting me with extra money until we could move from

the expensive house to a cheaper one.

>

> 2] The second debt problem is very recent and is caused by

my 'problem' son, 3rd child. I do not exactly remember when it

started, somewhere in 2002 he received by mistake two payments of

salary, which he spend, had to pay back, had no money, so I paid for

it and wrote it down for him to pay back in the future.

> He quit his job end of december 2002 and had no new job, no

money, but he could spend much more money than was on his bankaccount

till a certain limit, which he indeed did. So his debt kept on

growing and than came out there was another mistake made with taxes

so he had to pay back a large some of money. High bills from the

dentist, and so on and on....It seemed endless. No fun in the house.

>

> But then his father died in march 2003 and it turned out he had

good insurence.

> So my son receives money every month untill he is 21 years old

and when the house is sold there will come more money.

> He went back to his old job, spend very little money on drugs

and worked really hard for payback. Last week he paid me back the

last portion of his debt to me.

>

> Unwanted pregnancy can be indicated by Moon in 5th house. Moon

is your 11th lord (desire and wish) and she being veeeeeery weak and

troubled in 5th can very clearly indicated unwanted pregnancy.

(Pregnancy against of desire / wish.)

>

> Notive that your first marriage broke in Ve AD (fallen) and 2nd

marriage broke in Merc AD (Neuter one influencing 7L, 7H and Ve.) The

PDs were Sat (6L) and Ra/Ju respectively...

>

> So if it was me I would leave the emerald and sapphire.

(Leaving emerald would stop giving good on health and career but for

marriage it's extremely important.) I would only wear the diamond.

>

> I highly respect your opinion on this, so I removed emerald and

saphire.

>

> I might be asking you some questions later (about the exact

dates etc. to know the PDs) if it is okay for you. May be I'd ask in

private mail so that you feel more comfortable in answering.

>

> Best wishes,

> Tanvir

>

>

>

> What can not happen, can never happen.

> Which is mine, is forever mine.

>

> Tanvir Chowdhury

> tanvir@s...

> http://www.geocities.com/king_tanvir

> http://www.geocities.com/planetaryastro

>

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Dear Rani Jee,

Never forget to jump in, discussion is all about this. I will try to answer if I

know the answer in my knowledge, or have enough time. Other memebers also would

if they get enough time...

 

As per the question, I think understanding the basic would answer it the best.

12L rules expenditure and losses, in own house he is powerful to giev much

expenditure, and since he aspects 6H, he will give debts. So if we think, we

can understand that a 12L exalted in 6H will give debt same way.

 

But will this happen to all? 2L, 11L are opposite of 12L, so an own

house/exalted 2L/11L aspecting 6H will not give debt rather work against

getting into debt. Not so?

 

Same way a weak 6L afflicted by 12L can give debts.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Best wishes,

Tanvir

 

 

 

What can not happen, can never happen.Which is mine, is forever mine. Tanvir

Chowdhurytanvir (AT) siriusbb (DOT) comhttp://www.geocities.com/king_tanvirhttp://www.geocities.com/planetaryastro

 

 

-

raindancer_1998

 

Wednesday, July 30, 2003 12:38 PM

debts

very sorry to jump in. this was very interesting tanvirji. would you also say

that 12th L in 6th would give debts too? what about in 8th? what are the

remedies? and what placement would give wealth? rani.

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