Being non-vegiterian creates problem in MoKsha....

[Guest guest]

Jai Jinendra,

 

Who said they have attended Moksha andwhen and How do

you know.It is nature of mother earth not to give

salvation to flesh eaters.as humans or animals of

panch tattwa are the highest form ever existing on

earth and killing them is a biggest evil deed,that any

one can do.

 

Give me an answer for this,a person who knows and do

evil is more bad,but he doesn't want to do that or a

person who can study and know everything,But doesn't

do studies and understand a concept of our existence

and does malignant deeds is more bad.Only difference

b/w an Animal of five senses and human is

intelligence.

 

Animal killing is understable,but human beings

behaviour like animal,do you think nature will accept

it.

 

Jainism believes Indra,others and Grahas haven't got

Moksha yet,the rulership of they are enjoying is

always changing.Like PM of evey country changes.

 

As before saturn came,still physical form of it was

existing,But there was no ruler.Because of good deeds

of soem human Being,he became a devata and got a

rulership of planet saturn.He is too doing his Karma

as we know and have powers very much greter than

us.Saturn by planet will not die,But ruler of that

will definately get ended and new one will come.

 

You don't need to judge a past Life,see your

currentLif and you will know your past very well.and

accepting a truth of current Life,will make your

future and future Life more easier.

 

more than deeds,it is a feeling,thinking or as we say

"Bhav" or"expression" is more important and that

decides our paap and punya.

 

As a cop is also a killer and a criminal is, it is a

thought that is going in there mind,while doing such a

deeds that decides there future.but as act is

performed,so Nature will definatley revert back.As you

know violence,reply is violence and cops are also

getting killed,as you saw,so shall you reap.Nature is

a power bowl or a mirror or our soul.

 

Think about it.................

 

--- ~ Tarun ~ <tarun_vst wrote:

 

> Dear Members,

>

> I would like to add one thing more ..that jupiter in

> 12 is considered

> good for moksha but on the sameplace the person is

> said to be

> characterless. may be ...is it possible..

>

> There are many parameters like the past karmas

> ....abt which i asked

> in the forum but no one was able to reply abt that

> question..(how can

> we judge abt pastlife) this is a question which is

> verry typical to

> answer by any astrologer ...may be.

>

> Thanks and regards

>

> Tarun...

>

>

> ,

> "natalcharts_biz"

> <natalcharts_biz> wrote:

> > What you do in the dream should have no

> consequence to your waking.

> > Brahmarsi Vishwamitra not only ate flesh but

> killed many human

> beings

> > and yet attained moksha.

> >

> > Like one sage said : "It may take a lifetime to

> open one's eyes but

> > sight happens in a flash".

> >

> > When the desire for moksha comes all other desires

> burn away.

> >

> > This does not mean that everyone starts killing

> everyone!! Immature

> > minds can think that I am sanctioning killings. If

> we explain the

> > above, despite all involvements with the ragas and

> dweshas, when the

> > desire for Moksha comes...all else just drops

> away.

> >

> > After that you do not have a choice. Killing

> anything would

> > mean...harming oneself. The entirety seems to be

> Shakti. Like a

> > nurturing mother. How can you harm it? How can you

> hate it? Such

> > feelings dissolve away.

> >

> > Therefore, Moksha is not dependent upon killings

> or non killings.

> > Killings and non killing is dependent upon in

> whose heart the desire

> > for Moksha has arisen.

> >

> > These are my views. I leave the group to share

> their views too.

> >

> > Hari Om Tat Sat

> >

> >

> > , "rama r"

> <rr62555@h...>

> wrote:

> > > Dear Members,

> > > This is an interesting topic to research. In the

> present world

> being

> > > vegetarian or non-vegetarian has become

> relative. To prolong shelf

> > life or

> > > to enhance the flavor, manufacturers do use

> enzymes derived from

> animal

> > > source or animal organs. This can be found in

> vegetarian items

> like

> > cheese,

> > > canned food, processed ready made dishes.

> Vegetarians who consume

> multi

> > > vitamins and minerals, if they read the label,

> some name brands

> use

> > gelatin

> > > which is made from animal source. Some of the

> presciption

> > medications are

> > > derived from animal source.

> > > My point is even if we become vegetarians to

> attain moksha, we end

> > up eating

> > > food that contains ingredients derived from

> animal source.

> > >

> > > RR

> > >

> > > >"natalcharts_biz" <natalcharts_biz>

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Re: Being non-vegiterian creates

> problem in

> Mosha....

> > > >Wed, 27 Apr 2005 15:10:32 -0000

> > > >MIME-Version: 1.0

> > > >X-Originating-IP: 66.94.237.16

> > > >X-Sender: natalcharts_biz

> > > >Received: from n11a.bulk.scd.

> ([66.94.237.16]) by

> > > >MC6-F15.hotmail.com with Microsoft

> SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Wed, 27

> > Apr 2005

> > > >08:12:10 -0700

> > > >Received: from [66.218.69.3] by

> n11.bulk.scd. with

> NNFMP;

> > 27 Apr

> > > >2005 15:10:44 -0000

> > > >Received: from [66.218.66.31] by

> mailer3.bulk.scd. with

> > NNFMP; 27

> > > >Apr 2005 15:10:44 -0000

> > > >Received: (qmail 6894 invoked from network); 27

> Apr 2005

> 15:10:43 -0000

> > > >Received: from unknown (66.218.66.167) by

> m25.grp.scd.

> > with QMQP;

> > > >27 Apr 2005 15:10:43 -0000

> > > >Received: from unknown (HELO

> n11a.bulk.scd.)

> > (66.94.237.16) by

> > > >mta6.grp.scd. with SMTP; 27 Apr 2005

> 15:10:43 -0000

> > > >Received: from [66.218.69.3] by

> n11.bulk.scd. with

> NNFMP;

> > 27 Apr

> > > >2005 15:10:34 -0000

> > > >Received: from [66.218.66.91] by

> mailer3.bulk.scd. with

> > NNFMP; 27

> > > >Apr 2005 15:10:34 -0000

> > > >X-Message-Info:

> JGTYoYF78jEado6EKjefkPkYp87F69VmUHDbuhhjJso=

> > > >DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns;

> c=nofws; s=lima;

> > d=;

> > >

> >

>

>b=JchPsy9yo4K6DG+OsmfHh0eIH1VLIn3JrQs90gXXBTC608V8ipJi2YgkVZpbiQoEYch

>

TOdNJCxyBxs7Fwaz15EHKc+zG3gqE56/pFfuG7OPOgKApTxP5NKcUFsiPuGkP;

> > > >X--Newman-Property: groups-email

> > > >X-Apparently-To:

>

> > > >User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82

> > > >X-Mailer: Message Poster

> > > >X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:12:0

> > > >X--Post-IP: 219.64.72.62

> > > >X--Profile: natalcharts_biz

> > > >Mailing-List: list

> ; contact

> > > >-owner

> > > >Delivered-mailing list

>

> > > >List-Id: <.>

> > > >Precedence: bulk

> > > >List-Un: <-

> >

> > > >Return-Path:

> > >

>

>sentto-9699862-16252-1114614644-rr62555=hotmail.com@r...

> > > >X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Apr 2005

> 15:12:10.0902 (UTC)

> > > >FILETIME=[7C366360:01C54B3B]

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >Tarun

> > > >You have raised a nice topic. I will not

> comment upon the curses

> or

> > > >the results of any person's actions as they are

> in the hands of

> the

> > God.

> > > >

> > > >To sustain our bodies we need nourishment. In

> gaining this

> nourishment

> > > >we should try and disturb the least of the

> nature. Therefore,

> many

> > > >rishis prefer only fruits. As by taking the

> fruit, and throwing

> the

> > > >seed they help in propogation of the species of

> that plant while

> > > >nourishing themselves

> > > >

> > > >Next level of destruction are leaves. It is now

> known

> through "Primary

> > > >Cell Perception" that plants feel "hurt" and

> respond to pain when

> > > >their leaves are snatched away. However the

> expression of pain

> is less

> > > >than that of an animal when it is killed.

> Moreover the plant can

> grow

> > > >leaves again.

> > > >

> > > >In this way, we do harm each time when we take

> nourishment but

> try to

> > > >contain it.

> > > >

> > > >By killing animals we kill something that is

> more conscious of

> its

> > > >pain and hence it should be avoided.

> > > >

> > > >Regards

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >, "~

> Tarun ~"

> <tarun_vst>

> > > >wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > hello members..

> > > > >

> > > > > since a topic of moksha is been discussed i

> would like to ask

> that

> > > > > being a non-vegiterian person.

> > > > > killing animals and having eggs.meat.beef

> etc..gives a next

> birth to

> > > > > pay for the curse of killing animal.

> > > > >

> > > > > I think killing of animals creates a biggest

> curse and will

> > never lead

> > > > > to moksha..

> > > > > since these are included in some religion

> also.

> > > > >

> > > > > Enlighten this topic.

> > > > >

> > > > > Thanks

> > > > >

> > > > > Tarun............

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

>

>

>

 

 

Love is the beauty of the soul

 

 

 

Mail

Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour:

http://tour.mail./mailtour.html

[Guest guest]

Respected Learned members

 

Interesting topic started by Tarun. Allow me to add my two cents to this

discussion. Since we are on the subject of Moksha, the theme also relates to

Karma. Only when we pay for all our karma's, is then Moksha obtained. By

Karma I mean all types of Karma's - Kathni, Karni and Vichaar. Loosely

translated it means "what we speak", "what we do" and lastly "what we

think".

 

The theory of Karma is so deep rooted, it leaves nothing to guess or chance.

 

For example if we use harsh words, or we speak sweet words - we either hurt

the listener's feelings or make him happy. In each case one has gained

Karma's be it good or bad.

 

If we commit a crime or do good deed - again we gain karma's.

 

If we think ill of other people, or we think positive - still it is a latent

karma. In each case we have gained karmas.

 

Honestly the accumulation of karmas is so great, nobody knows when are we

paying for the good or bad karmas? For example a person eating meat, may

have been food for the animal being eaten today.

 

All saints and mystics, propagate the theory of eating vegetarian food. As

rightly pointed out by Shripal, eating vegetable carries the least possible

karmic load - because vegetables have predominantly only one tatwa - mainly

water. As the number of tatwa's increase, higher is the sin committed.

 

We do commit sin even while eating vegetables, but we are also taught the

process of meditation and ask for forgiveness. The miniscule amount of

karma's accumulated by eating vegetables is easier to pay by meditation. The

higher level of karma's brings us back to the creation to pay in equal

amount of pain and anguish.

 

So everyone sitting on this planet, each with his/her own load of karma's

cannot sit in judgement over others and decide when a person gets Moksha,

only the Lord knows when the story will end.

 

It is rightly pointed by "Rama R", in today's world the line between

vegetarianism and non vegetarianism is easily transgressed. The food that

you eat, always contains some form of animal matter in it. For the sake of

all those on this forum, I must apprise all that, the vegetables that we eat

are already genetically manipulated to yield higher output in terms of

volume. For example a Tomato is a very slow growing fruit and always small

in size, the ones you see in the market today - plump and large, are in fact

genetically modified with fish gene for quick growth. Some species of fish

have extremely fast rate of growth. So from the cell of a tomato, the gene

responsible for growth has been replaced with the growth gene from the fish.

I dare say that 15 years from now whatever vegetable or grains that you may

eat, will HAVE an animal content - genetic - in it.

 

All things considered, a person is always advised to eat vegetarian food to

lessen the karmic burden, whether the person attains Moksha or not. It also

goes means that a person eating non vegetarian food can ever hope to lessen

his/her karmic burden, let alone moksha.

 

Hope I have given enough justice to the teaching of Saints and Mystics. My

humble regards

 

Virendra

 

 

[] On

Behalf Of Shripal

06 May 2005 11:38

 

[Om Krishna Guru] Re: Being non-vegiterian creates problem in

MoKsha....

 

 

Jai Jinendra,

 

Who said they have attended Moksha andwhen and How do

you know.It is nature of mother earth not to give

salvation to flesh eaters.as humans or animals of

panch tattwa are the highest form ever existing on

earth and killing them is a biggest evil deed,that any

one can do.

 

Give me an answer for this,a person who knows and do

evil is more bad,but he doesn't want to do that or a

person who can study and know everything,But doesn't

do studies and understand a concept of our existence

and does malignant deeds is more bad.Only difference

b/w an Animal of five senses and human is

intelligence.

 

Animal killing is understable,but human beings

behaviour like animal,do you think nature will accept

it.

 

Jainism believes Indra,others and Grahas haven't got

Moksha yet,the rulership of they are enjoying is

always changing.Like PM of evey country changes.

 

As before saturn came,still physical form of it was

existing,But there was no ruler.Because of good deeds

of soem human Being,he became a devata and got a

rulership of planet saturn.He is too doing his Karma

as we know and have powers very much greter than

us.Saturn by planet will not die,But ruler of that

will definately get ended and new one will come.

 

You don't need to judge a past Life,see your

currentLif and you will know your past very well.and

accepting a truth of current Life,will make your

future and future Life more easier.

 

more than deeds,it is a feeling,thinking or as we say

"Bhav" or"expression" is more important and that

decides our paap and punya.

 

As a cop is also a killer and a criminal is, it is a

thought that is going in there mind,while doing such a

deeds that decides there future.but as act is

performed,so Nature will definatley revert back.As you

know violence,reply is violence and cops are also

getting killed,as you saw,so shall you reap.Nature is

a power bowl or a mirror or our soul.

 

Think about it.................

 

--- ~ Tarun ~ <tarun_vst wrote:

 

> Dear Members,

>

> I would like to add one thing more ..that jupiter in

> 12 is considered

> good for moksha but on the sameplace the person is

> said to be

> characterless. may be ...is it possible..

>

> There are many parameters like the past karmas

> ....abt which i asked

> in the forum but no one was able to reply abt that

> question..(how can

> we judge abt pastlife) this is a question which is

> verry typical to

> answer by any astrologer ...may be.

>

> Thanks and regards

>

> Tarun...

>

>

> ,

> "natalcharts_biz"

> <natalcharts_biz> wrote:

> > What you do in the dream should have no

> consequence to your waking.

> > Brahmarsi Vishwamitra not only ate flesh but

> killed many human

> beings

> > and yet attained moksha.

> >

> > Like one sage said : "It may take a lifetime to

> open one's eyes but

> > sight happens in a flash".

> >

> > When the desire for moksha comes all other desires

> burn away.

> >

> > This does not mean that everyone starts killing

> everyone!! Immature

> > minds can think that I am sanctioning killings. If

> we explain the

> > above, despite all involvements with the ragas and

> dweshas, when the

> > desire for Moksha comes...all else just drops

> away.

> >

> > After that you do not have a choice. Killing

> anything would

> > mean...harming oneself. The entirety seems to be

> Shakti. Like a

> > nurturing mother. How can you harm it? How can you

> hate it? Such

> > feelings dissolve away.

> >

> > Therefore, Moksha is not dependent upon killings

> or non killings.

> > Killings and non killing is dependent upon in

> whose heart the desire

> > for Moksha has arisen.

> >

> > These are my views. I leave the group to share

> their views too.

> >

> > Hari Om Tat Sat

> >

> >

> > , "rama r"

> <rr62555@h...>

> wrote:

> > > Dear Members,

> > > This is an interesting topic to research. In the

> present world

> being

> > > vegetarian or non-vegetarian has become

> relative. To prolong shelf

> > life or

> > > to enhance the flavor, manufacturers do use

> enzymes derived from

> animal

> > > source or animal organs. This can be found in

> vegetarian items

> like

> > cheese,

> > > canned food, processed ready made dishes.

> Vegetarians who consume

> multi

> > > vitamins and minerals, if they read the label,

> some name brands

> use

> > gelatin

> > > which is made from animal source. Some of the

> presciption

> > medications are

> > > derived from animal source.

> > > My point is even if we become vegetarians to

> attain moksha, we end

> > up eating

> > > food that contains ingredients derived from

> animal source.

> > >

> > > RR

> > >

> > > >"natalcharts_biz" <natalcharts_biz>

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Re: Being non-vegiterian creates

> problem in

> Mosha....

> > > >Wed, 27 Apr 2005 15:10:32 -0000

> > > >MIME-Version: 1.0

> > > >X-Originating-IP: 66.94.237.16

> > > >X-Sender: natalcharts_biz

> > > >Received: from n11a.bulk.scd.

> ([66.94.237.16]) by

> > > >MC6-F15.hotmail.com with Microsoft

> SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Wed, 27

> > Apr 2005

> > > >08:12:10 -0700

> > > >Received: from [66.218.69.3] by

> n11.bulk.scd. with

> NNFMP;

> > 27 Apr

> > > >2005 15:10:44 -0000

> > > >Received: from [66.218.66.31] by

> mailer3.bulk.scd. with

> > NNFMP; 27

> > > >Apr 2005 15:10:44 -0000

> > > >Received: (qmail 6894 invoked from network); 27

> Apr 2005

> 15:10:43 -0000

> > > >Received: from unknown (66.218.66.167) by

> m25.grp.scd.

> > with QMQP;

> > > >27 Apr 2005 15:10:43 -0000

> > > >Received: from unknown (HELO

> n11a.bulk.scd.)

> > (66.94.237.16) by

> > > >mta6.grp.scd. with SMTP; 27 Apr 2005

> 15:10:43 -0000

> > > >Received: from [66.218.69.3] by

> n11.bulk.scd. with

> NNFMP;

> > 27 Apr

> > > >2005 15:10:34 -0000

> > > >Received: from [66.218.66.91] by

> mailer3.bulk.scd. with

> > NNFMP; 27

> > > >Apr 2005 15:10:34 -0000

> > > >X-Message-Info:

> JGTYoYF78jEado6EKjefkPkYp87F69VmUHDbuhhjJso=

> > > >DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns;

> c=nofws; s=lima;

> > d=;

> > >

> >

>

>b=JchPsy9yo4K6DG+OsmfHh0eIH1VLIn3JrQs90gXXBTC608V8ipJi2YgkVZpbiQoEYch

>

TOdNJCxyBxs7Fwaz15EHKc+zG3gqE56/pFfuG7OPOgKApTxP5NKcUFsiPuGkP;

> > > >X--Newman-Property: groups-email

> > > >X-Apparently-To:

>

> > > >User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82

> > > >X-Mailer: Message Poster

> > > >X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:12:0

> > > >X--Post-IP: 219.64.72.62

> > > >X--Profile: natalcharts_biz

> > > >Mailing-List: list

> ; contact

> > > >-owner

> > > >Delivered-mailing list

>

> > > >List-Id: <.>

> > > >Precedence: bulk

> > > >List-Un: <-

> >

> > > >Return-Path:

> > >

>

>sentto-9699862-16252-1114614644-rr62555=hotmail.com@r...

> > > >X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Apr 2005

> 15:12:10.0902 (UTC)

> > > >FILETIME=[7C366360:01C54B3B]

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >Tarun

> > > >You have raised a nice topic. I will not

> comment upon the curses

> or

> > > >the results of any person's actions as they are

> in the hands of

> the

> > God.

> > > >

> > > >To sustain our bodies we need nourishment. In

> gaining this

> nourishment

> > > >we should try and disturb the least of the

> nature. Therefore,

> many

> > > >rishis prefer only fruits. As by taking the

> fruit, and throwing

> the

> > > >seed they help in propogation of the species of

> that plant while

> > > >nourishing themselves

> > > >

> > > >Next level of destruction are leaves. It is now

> known

> through "Primary

> > > >Cell Perception" that plants feel "hurt" and

> respond to pain when

> > > >their leaves are snatched away. However the

> expression of pain

> is less

> > > >than that of an animal when it is killed.

> Moreover the plant can

> grow

> > > >leaves again.

> > > >

> > > >In this way, we do harm each time when we take

> nourishment but

> try to

> > > >contain it.

> > > >

> > > >By killing animals we kill something that is

> more conscious of

> its

> > > >pain and hence it should be avoided.

> > > >

> > > >Regards

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >, "~

> Tarun ~"

> <tarun_vst>

> > > >wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > hello members..

> > > > >

> > > > > since a topic of moksha is been discussed i

> would like to ask

> that

> > > > > being a non-vegiterian person.

> > > > > killing animals and having eggs.meat.beef

> etc..gives a next

> birth to

> > > > > pay for the curse of killing animal.

> > > > >

> > > > > I think killing of animals creates a biggest

> curse and will

> > never lead

> > > > > to moksha..

> > > > > since these are included in some religion

> also.

> > > > >

> > > > > Enlighten this topic.

> > > > >

> > > > > Thanks

> > > > >

> > > > > Tarun............

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

>

>

>

 

 

Love is the beauty of the soul

 

 

 

Mail

Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour:

http://tour.mail./mailtour.html

 

 

 

 

~ om tat sat ~

Thank you for maintaining the decorum of the Achyuta Ashram.

Reminders: (1) Recite the Shadakshari Mantra 'Hare Rama Krishna'

(2) Try to become Vegetarian - remember Akbar the Great who said that the

human stomach should not become a graveyard for animals.

(3) Practise charity in thought and deed - do one free chart reading today

 

 

 

 

 

--

 

 

Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.5 - Release 04/05/2005

 

 

--

 

 

Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.6 - Release 06/05/2005

[Guest guest]

Hello Virendra ji and all,

 

You have told a nice thing abt hurting even a person's feelings or

using abusive words which hurts the person mentally and give pain to

him also contributes to PAAP,

 

Even my father tell sometimes abt Jain Dharma that even in Jain

Dharma it is said that hurting someone's feelings contributes to paap.

 

But in the present era we have to look arond our selves ...means

SURVIAL OF THE FITTEST, now how much this thing is applicable to

moksha.

 

I had also heard many person who died for few minutes and then get

back who tell us the happenings with them in the meanwhile they

returned back. some one says YAMA was there. etc...etc..

 

what to say more...

 

Tarun...

 

 

, Virendra Battu

<virendrabattu@m...> wrote:

> Respected Learned members

>

> Interesting topic started by Tarun. Allow me to add my two cents to

this

> discussion. Since we are on the subject of Moksha, the theme also

relates to

> Karma. Only when we pay for all our karma's, is then Moksha

obtained. By

> Karma I mean all types of Karma's - Kathni, Karni and Vichaar.

Loosely

> translated it means "what we speak", "what we do" and lastly "what

we

> think".

>

> The theory of Karma is so deep rooted, it leaves nothing to guess

or chance.

>

> For example if we use harsh words, or we speak sweet words - we

either hurt

> the listener's feelings or make him happy. In each case one has

gained

> Karma's be it good or bad.

>

> If we commit a crime or do good deed - again we gain karma's.

>

> If we think ill of other people, or we think positive - still it is

a latent

> karma. In each case we have gained karmas.

>

> Honestly the accumulation of karmas is so great, nobody knows when

are we

> paying for the good or bad karmas? For example a person eating

meat, may

> have been food for the animal being eaten today.

>

> All saints and mystics, propagate the theory of eating vegetarian

food. As

> rightly pointed out by Shripal, eating vegetable carries the least

possible

> karmic load - because vegetables have predominantly only one tatwa -

mainly

> water. As the number of tatwa's increase, higher is the sin

committed.

>

> We do commit sin even while eating vegetables, but we are also

taught the

> process of meditation and ask for forgiveness. The miniscule amount

of

> karma's accumulated by eating vegetables is easier to pay by

meditation. The

> higher level of karma's brings us back to the creation to pay in

equal

> amount of pain and anguish.

>

> So everyone sitting on this planet, each with his/her own load of

karma's

> cannot sit in judgement over others and decide when a person gets

Moksha,

> only the Lord knows when the story will end.

>

> It is rightly pointed by "Rama R", in today's world the line between

> vegetarianism and non vegetarianism is easily transgressed. The

food that

> you eat, always contains some form of animal matter in it. For the

sake of

> all those on this forum, I must apprise all that, the vegetables

that we eat

> are already genetically manipulated to yield higher output in terms

of

> volume. For example a Tomato is a very slow growing fruit and

always small

> in size, the ones you see in the market today - plump and large,

are in fact

> genetically modified with fish gene for quick growth. Some species

of fish

> have extremely fast rate of growth. So from the cell of a tomato,

the gene

> responsible for growth has been replaced with the growth gene from

the fish.

> I dare say that 15 years from now whatever vegetable or grains that

you may

> eat, will HAVE an animal content - genetic - in it.

>

> All things considered, a person is always advised to eat vegetarian

food to

> lessen the karmic burden, whether the person attains Moksha or not.

It also

> goes means that a person eating non vegetarian food can ever hope

to lessen

> his/her karmic burden, let alone moksha.

>

> Hope I have given enough justice to the teaching of Saints and

Mystics. My

> humble regards

>

> Virendra

>

>

>

[] On

> Behalf Of Shripal

> 06 May 2005 11:38

>

> [Om Krishna Guru] Re: Being non-vegiterian creates problem

in

> MoKsha....

>

>

> Jai Jinendra,

>

> Who said they have attended Moksha andwhen and How do

> you know.It is nature of mother earth not to give

> salvation to flesh eaters.as humans or animals of

> panch tattwa are the highest form ever existing on

> earth and killing them is a biggest evil deed,that any

> one can do.

>

> Give me an answer for this,a person who knows and do

> evil is more bad,but he doesn't want to do that or a

> person who can study and know everything,But doesn't

> do studies and understand a concept of our existence

> and does malignant deeds is more bad.Only difference

> b/w an Animal of five senses and human is

> intelligence.

>

> Animal killing is understable,but human beings

> behaviour like animal,do you think nature will accept

> it.

>

> Jainism believes Indra,others and Grahas haven't got

> Moksha yet,the rulership of they are enjoying is

> always changing.Like PM of evey country changes.

>

> As before saturn came,still physical form of it was

> existing,But there was no ruler.Because of good deeds

> of soem human Being,he became a devata and got a

> rulership of planet saturn.He is too doing his Karma

> as we know and have powers very much greter than

> us.Saturn by planet will not die,But ruler of that

> will definately get ended and new one will come.

>

> You don't need to judge a past Life,see your

> currentLif and you will know your past very well.and

> accepting a truth of current Life,will make your

> future and future Life more easier.

>

> more than deeds,it is a feeling,thinking or as we say

> "Bhav" or"expression" is more important and that

> decides our paap and punya.

>

> As a cop is also a killer and a criminal is, it is a

> thought that is going in there mind,while doing such a

> deeds that decides there future.but as act is

> performed,so Nature will definatley revert back.As you

> know violence,reply is violence and cops are also

> getting killed,as you saw,so shall you reap.Nature is

> a power bowl or a mirror or our soul.

>

> Think about it.................

>

> --- ~ Tarun ~ <tarun_vst> wrote:

>

> > Dear Members,

> >

> > I would like to add one thing more ..that jupiter in

> > 12 is considered

> > good for moksha but on the sameplace the person is

> > said to be

> > characterless. may be ...is it possible..

> >

> > There are many parameters like the past karmas

> > ....abt which i asked

> > in the forum but no one was able to reply abt that

> > question..(how can

> > we judge abt pastlife) this is a question which is

> > verry typical to

> > answer by any astrologer ...may be.

> >

> > Thanks and regards

> >

> > Tarun...

> >

> >

> > ,

> > "natalcharts_biz"

> > <natalcharts_biz> wrote:

> > > What you do in the dream should have no

> > consequence to your waking.

> > > Brahmarsi Vishwamitra not only ate flesh but

> > killed many human

> > beings

> > > and yet attained moksha.

> > >

> > > Like one sage said : "It may take a lifetime to

> > open one's eyes but

> > > sight happens in a flash".

> > >

> > > When the desire for moksha comes all other desires

> > burn away.

> > >

> > > This does not mean that everyone starts killing

> > everyone!! Immature

> > > minds can think that I am sanctioning killings. If

> > we explain the

> > > above, despite all involvements with the ragas and

> > dweshas, when the

> > > desire for Moksha comes...all else just drops

> > away.

> > >

> > > After that you do not have a choice. Killing

> > anything would

> > > mean...harming oneself. The entirety seems to be

> > Shakti. Like a

> > > nurturing mother. How can you harm it? How can you

> > hate it? Such

> > > feelings dissolve away.

> > >

> > > Therefore, Moksha is not dependent upon killings

> > or non killings.

> > > Killings and non killing is dependent upon in

> > whose heart the desire

> > > for Moksha has arisen.

> > >

> > > These are my views. I leave the group to share

> > their views too.

> > >

> > > Hari Om Tat Sat

> > >

> > >

> > > , "rama r"

> > <rr62555@h...>

> > wrote:

> > > > Dear Members,

> > > > This is an interesting topic to research. In the

> > present world

> > being

> > > > vegetarian or non-vegetarian has become

> > relative. To prolong shelf

> > > life or

> > > > to enhance the flavor, manufacturers do use

> > enzymes derived from

> > animal

> > > > source or animal organs. This can be found in

> > vegetarian items

> > like

> > > cheese,

> > > > canned food, processed ready made dishes.

> > Vegetarians who consume

> > multi

> > > > vitamins and minerals, if they read the label,

> > some name brands

> > use

> > > gelatin

> > > > which is made from animal source. Some of the

> > presciption

> > > medications are

> > > > derived from animal source.

> > > > My point is even if we become vegetarians to

> > attain moksha, we end

> > > up eating

> > > > food that contains ingredients derived from

> > animal source.

> > > >

> > > > RR

> > > >

> > > > >"natalcharts_biz" <natalcharts_biz>

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Re: Being non-vegiterian creates

> > problem in

> > Mosha....

> > > > >Wed, 27 Apr 2005 15:10:32 -0000

> > > > >MIME-Version: 1.0

> > > > >X-Originating-IP: 66.94.237.16

> > > > >X-Sender: natalcharts_biz

> > > > >Received: from n11a.bulk.scd.

> > ([66.94.237.16]) by

> > > > >MC6-F15.hotmail.com with Microsoft

> > SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Wed, 27

> > > Apr 2005

> > > > >08:12:10 -0700

> > > > >Received: from [66.218.69.3] by

> > n11.bulk.scd. with

> > NNFMP;

> > > 27 Apr

> > > > >2005 15:10:44 -0000

> > > > >Received: from [66.218.66.31] by

> > mailer3.bulk.scd. with

> > > NNFMP; 27

> > > > >Apr 2005 15:10:44 -0000

> > > > >Received: (qmail 6894 invoked from network); 27

> > Apr 2005

> > 15:10:43 -0000

> > > > >Received: from unknown (66.218.66.167) by

> > m25.grp.scd.

> > > with QMQP;

> > > > >27 Apr 2005 15:10:43 -0000

> > > > >Received: from unknown (HELO

> > n11a.bulk.scd.)

> > > (66.94.237.16) by

> > > > >mta6.grp.scd. with SMTP; 27 Apr 2005

> > 15:10:43 -0000

> > > > >Received: from [66.218.69.3] by

> > n11.bulk.scd. with

> > NNFMP;

> > > 27 Apr

> > > > >2005 15:10:34 -0000

> > > > >Received: from [66.218.66.91] by

> > mailer3.bulk.scd. with

> > > NNFMP; 27

> > > > >Apr 2005 15:10:34 -0000

> > > > >X-Message-Info:

> > JGTYoYF78jEado6EKjefkPkYp87F69VmUHDbuhhjJso=

> > > > >DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns;

> > c=nofws; s=lima;

> > > d=;

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

>b=JchPsy9yo4K6DG+OsmfHh0eIH1VLIn3JrQs90gXXBTC608V8ipJi2YgkVZpbiQoEYch

> >

> TOdNJCxyBxs7Fwaz15EHKc+zG3gqE56/pFfuG7OPOgKApTxP5NKcUFsiPuGkP;

> > > > >X--Newman-Property: groups-email

> > > > >X-Apparently-To:

> >

> > > > >User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82

> > > > >X-Mailer: Message Poster

> > > > >X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:12:0

> > > > >X--Post-IP: 219.64.72.62

> > > > >X--Profile: natalcharts_biz

> > > > >Mailing-List: list

> > ; contact

> > > > >-owner

> > > > >Delivered-mailing list

> >

> > > > >List-Id: <.>

> > > > >Precedence: bulk

> > > > >List-Un: <-

> > >

> > > > >Return-Path:

> > > >

> >

> >sentto-9699862-16252-1114614644-rr62555=hotmail.com@r...

> > > > >X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Apr 2005

> > 15:12:10.0902 (UTC)

> > > > >FILETIME=[7C366360:01C54B3B]

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >Tarun

> > > > >You have raised a nice topic. I will not

> > comment upon the curses

> > or

> > > > >the results of any person's actions as they are

> > in the hands of

> > the

> > > God.

> > > > >

> > > > >To sustain our bodies we need nourishment. In

> > gaining this

> > nourishment

> > > > >we should try and disturb the least of the

> > nature. Therefore,

> > many

> > > > >rishis prefer only fruits. As by taking the

> > fruit, and throwing

> > the

> > > > >seed they help in propogation of the species of

> > that plant while

> > > > >nourishing themselves

> > > > >

> > > > >Next level of destruction are leaves. It is now

> > known

> > through "Primary

> > > > >Cell Perception" that plants feel "hurt" and

> > respond to pain when

> > > > >their leaves are snatched away. However the

> > expression of pain

> > is less

> > > > >than that of an animal when it is killed.

> > Moreover the plant can

> > grow

> > > > >leaves again.

> > > > >

> > > > >In this way, we do harm each time when we take

> > nourishment but

> > try to

> > > > >contain it.

> > > > >

> > > > >By killing animals we kill something that is

> > more conscious of

> > its

> > > > >pain and hence it should be avoided.

> > > > >

> > > > >Regards

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >, "~

> > Tarun ~"

> > <tarun_vst>

> > > > >wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > hello members..

> > > > > >

> > > > > > since a topic of moksha is been discussed i

> > would like to ask

> > that

> > > > > > being a non-vegiterian person.

> > > > > > killing animals and having eggs.meat.beef

> > etc..gives a next

> > birth to

> > > > > > pay for the curse of killing animal.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I think killing of animals creates a biggest

> > curse and will

> > > never lead

> > > > > > to moksha..

> > > > > > since these are included in some religion

> > also.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Enlighten this topic.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Thanks

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Tarun............

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

> Love is the beauty of the soul

>

>

>

> Mail

> Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour:

> http://tour.mail./mailtour.html

>

>

>

>

> ~ om tat sat ~

> Thank you for maintaining the decorum of the Achyuta Ashram.

> Reminders: (1) Recite the Shadakshari Mantra 'Hare Rama Krishna'

> (2) Try to become Vegetarian - remember Akbar the Great who said

that the

> human stomach should not become a graveyard for animals.

> (3) Practise charity in thought and deed - do one free chart

reading today

> Links

--

>

>

> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.5 - Release Date:

04/05/2005

>

>

> --

>

>

> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.6 - Release Date:

06/05/2005