Guest guest Posted May 1, 2006 Report Share Posted May 1, 2006 To all learned members, I can offer the charts from our Jyotish-Vidya database "Astro Charts" section, where one will find 4 charts relating to suicide. They are the musician/Hard Rock Band Player - Kurt Cobain Antonin Artaud - codes Sylvia Plath - poet and essay author Virginia Woolf - poet and author As Always, Uttara p.s. I have lots more charts to up load (from a variety of backgrounds)but it will take time. lst to verify all data, to the best of my knwledge and research, then to offer it to Jyotish-Vidya for others to apprive and study Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 1, 2006 Report Share Posted May 1, 2006 Dear Uttara, Many thanks for reminding me of those charts...they'd completely slipped my mind, I'm afraid :-( Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com ______________________________ - "muttaraphalguni" <muttaraphalguni <jyotish-vidya> Monday, May 01, 2006 2:43 PM Factors for Suicide To all learned members, I can offer the charts from our Jyotish-Vidya database "Astro Charts" section, where one will find 4 charts relating to suicide. They are the musician/Hard Rock Band Player - Kurt Cobain Antonin Artaud - codes Sylvia Plath - poet and essay author Virginia Woolf - poet and author As Always, Uttara p.s. I have lots more charts to up load (from a variety of backgrounds)but it will take time. lst to verify all data, to the best of my knwledge and research, then to offer it to Jyotish-Vidya for others to apprive and study Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 1, 2006 Report Share Posted May 1, 2006 Dear Wendy, Quite alright. Time has a way of slipping by. This past month has been monumental in responsibility and affect. And..... Glad I could be of some help. Each of these charts are quite compelling in of themselves! Wouldn't you agree?! In the meantime, mother is holding her own after such a terrible scare (x3). Hope all is going well with you and your family. Always a pleasure to stay in touch And, learn from Jyotish Vidya and all its members! As always, Uttara Wendy Vasicek <jyotish wrote: Dear Uttara, Many thanks for reminding me of those charts...they'd completely slipped my mind, I'm afraid :-( Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com ______________________________ - "muttaraphalguni" <muttaraphalguni <jyotish-vidya> Monday, May 01, 2006 2:43 PM Factors for Suicide To all learned members, I can offer the charts from our Jyotish-Vidya database "Astro Charts" section, where one will find 4 charts relating to suicide. They are the musician/Hard Rock Band Player - Kurt Cobain Antonin Artaud - codes Sylvia Plath - poet and essay author Virginia Woolf - poet and author As Always, Uttara p.s. I have lots more charts to up load (from a variety of backgrounds)but it will take time. lst to verify all data, to the best of my knwledge and research, then to offer it to Jyotish-Vidya for others to apprive and study Astrology chart Vedic astrology Personal reading Visit your group "jyotish-vidya" on the web. jyotish-vidya "Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate, our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness, that most frightens us. There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you...As we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others." from A Return To Love: by Marianne Williamson Get amazing travel prices for air and hotel in one click on FareChase Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 2, 2006 Report Share Posted May 2, 2006 Dear Uttara, //In the meantime, mother is holding her own after such a terrible scare (x3).// That's certainly good to hear:-) Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com ______________________________ - "Uttara" <muttaraphalguni <jyotish-vidya> Tuesday, May 02, 2006 12:43 PM Re: Factors for Suicide Dear Wendy, Quite alright. Time has a way of slipping by. This past month has been monumental in responsibility and affect. And..... Glad I could be of some help. Each of these charts are quite compelling in of themselves! Wouldn't you agree?! In the meantime, mother is holding her own after such a terrible scare (x3). Hope all is going well with you and your family. Always a pleasure to stay in touch And, learn from Jyotish Vidya and all its members! As always, Uttara Wendy Vasicek <jyotish wrote: Dear Uttara, Many thanks for reminding me of those charts...they'd completely slipped my mind, I'm afraid :-( Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com ______________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 5, 2006 Report Share Posted May 5, 2006 Dear Patrice and All, I have an added commentary to my last post. It is a social science theory but I think adds to the astrological reasoning behind some charts we encounter. Especially our families. Like your mother who is a Gemini, My mother has a Gemini Sun. I often say she talks out of both sides of her mouth. She is also very autocratic and opinionated. She too grew up in an era where people just got on with things and didn't talk or dwell on them openly. I have often found this to be a direct reaction to the severity of the depression era of the 30's and then the atrocities of World War 11. Actually, Alcoholic Anonymous grew out of this depression era, teaching men how to cope better with events and things in their lives that were bigger than them. That’s where the 12-step program came to say that one was "powerless over" and taught fraternity of likeness and support. It was a kind of new religion to help pull men from the depths of despair. Unfortunately, your Grandfather never experienced this or his stoic Denmark ancestry lead him to be his own person. Then the war came and life changed. Young Men left home and often didn’t return. Or, men returned never to be the same again. Those that did survive the hell came back with a new outlook on life and the majority got on with life. Never to develop fraternity again. Women during the war came out of the house and into the factory to work – to help supply the goods needed for war. That is where women wearing pants developed and was allowed. Every thing was rationed, so material for clothing was harder and sturdier – so pants came into being and were cheaper. Also in factory work, pants were need for safety and endurance rather than dresses. Pants became the uniform of the War. Once the war ended there was a backlash on the concept of “being powerless”. All of a sudden being in control of ones life became an obsession in self-help advice and personal stories of people overcoming adversity for peace and contentment. Personal prosperity was touted everywhere. Women went back to their kitchens, dresses, and deferring roles. However, do you remember growing up how we the baby boomers were raised and what expectations were required? There were four themes going on. One to have a more relaxed permissive society, (this is where entitlement was bred – don’t you just love Dr Spock) two, the sky’s the limit, three, gratefulness was instilled instead of apathy. And, four, mothers were quietly behind closed doors raising their daughters to be more of their own person and equal to men. The fifty’s believed it. The sixty’s teenagers rebelled against the fifties restrictions, the seventies; married Women were screaming for their autonomy and the eighties saw young college degreed women in the workplace. The nineties reaped the backlash and the 21-century so far in America is entitled happy and throwing all the common sense rules for civility out the window. So, when we look at out mothers and hear their stories it really was a different time of living and thinking and believing. I think the more adversity and sacrifice they encountered and the more deferment required, the more they built their own reservoirs for survival. There are some who were able to keep their capacity to nurture and empathize, but all too often like my mother their stoicness, severe expectation, and rule has kept them safe and protected. And like my mother and some others I know, they became very narcissistic. My mother could have been a better mother to my adopted sister, but in reality, my mother’s thinking and feeling was and is one where she provided this child with a better life and gave her opportunities and education and a roof over her head that my sister has never been able to return in kindness to my mother. As far as having any empathy for a broken soul theory – there is none. That and my mother’s intolerance of my sister’s chaotic inner soul is written off as complete belligerence and added to that, she is not connected to my mother in any depth because as my mother says, this child is not of her blood. Gad, what a mess and a terrible fall out for two lives with completely different experiences. I am looking forward to 2012. I think the current tide will change, as it ultimately will. In the meantime, we have to slop through another six years. I hope my mother isn’t living then. She like my mother in law need to go their graves to find peace and happiness. As Always, Uttara "Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate, our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness, that most frightens us. There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you...As we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others." from A Return To Love: by Marianne Williamson Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 7, 2006 Report Share Posted May 7, 2006 Dear friend, I am yet to cast and read the charts provided by you. But let me tell two general points with regard to the suicides: The first one is to do with the natal chart of the native. Generally, the Lagna Lord will be a malefic for the native. This happens to tarus and the four 'corner' lagnas. Also, the Moon must be severely afflicted. If moon is severly afflicted, it can also indicate a possibility of Balarishta, though in Balarishta, the connection of Mars with certain Houses is compulsory. In other words, the Moons position will be alike in both Balarishta and suicide cases. The second point is to do with the transits. The Tr Lagna lord should be cruelly aspecting himself in the natal chart. Sometimes, this position can be taken by AK but then, AK should be AK for the transit chart also. Hope this helps, Kishore patnaik jyotish-vidya, Uttara <muttaraphalguni wrote: > > Dear Patrice and All, > > I have an added commentary to my last post. It is a social science theory but I think adds to the astrological reasoning behind some charts we encounter. Especially our families. > > Like your mother who is a Gemini, My mother has a Gemini Sun. I often say she talks out of both sides of her mouth. She is also very autocratic and opinionated. She too grew up in an era where people just got on with things and didn't talk or dwell on them openly. I have often found this to be a direct reaction to the severity of the depression era of the 30's and then the atrocities of World War 11. Actually, Alcoholic Anonymous grew out of this depression era, teaching men how to cope better with events and things in their lives that were bigger than them. That's where the 12-step program came to say that one was "powerless over" and taught fraternity of likeness and support. It was a kind of new religion to help pull men from the depths of despair. > > Unfortunately, your Grandfather never experienced this or his stoic Denmark ancestry lead him to be his own person. > > Then the war came and life changed. Young Men left home and often didn't return. Or, men returned never to be the same again. Those that did survive the hell came back with a new outlook on life and the majority got on with life. Never to develop fraternity again. > > Women during the war came out of the house and into the factory to work – to help supply the goods needed for war. That is where women wearing pants developed and was allowed. Every thing was rationed, so material for clothing was harder and sturdier – so pants came into being and were cheaper. Also in factory work, pants were need for safety and endurance rather than dresses. Pants became the uniform of the War. > > Once the war ended there was a backlash on the concept of "being powerless". All of a sudden being in control of ones life became an obsession in self-help advice and personal stories of people overcoming adversity for peace and contentment. Personal prosperity was touted everywhere. Women went back to their kitchens, dresses, and deferring roles. > > However, do you remember growing up how we the baby boomers were raised and what expectations were required? There were four themes going on. One to have a more relaxed permissive society, (this is where entitlement was bred – don't you just love Dr Spock) two, the sky's the limit, three, gratefulness was instilled instead of apathy. And, four, mothers were quietly behind closed doors raising their daughters to be more of their own person and equal to men. The fifty's believed it. The sixty's teenagers rebelled against the fifties restrictions, the seventies; married Women were screaming for their autonomy and the eighties saw young college degreed women in the workplace. The nineties reaped the backlash and the 21-century so far in America is entitled happy and throwing all the common sense rules for civility out the window. > > So, when we look at out mothers and hear their stories it really was a different time of living and thinking and believing. I think the more adversity and sacrifice they encountered and the more deferment required, the more they built their own reservoirs for survival. There are some who were able to keep their capacity to nurture and empathize, but all too often like my mother their stoicness, severe expectation, and rule has kept them safe and protected. And like my mother and some others I know, they became very narcissistic. > > My mother could have been a better mother to my adopted sister, but in reality, my mother's thinking and feeling was and is one where she provided this child with a better life and gave her opportunities and education and a roof over her head that my sister has never been able to return in kindness to my mother. As far as having any empathy for a broken soul theory – there is none. That and my mother's intolerance of my sister's chaotic inner soul is written off as complete belligerence and added to that, she is not connected to my mother in any depth because as my mother says, this child is not of her blood. Gad, what a mess and a terrible fall out for two lives with completely different experiences. > > I am looking forward to 2012. I think the current tide will change, as it ultimately will. In the meantime, we have to slop through another six years. I hope my mother isn't living then. She like my mother in law need to go their graves to find peace and happiness. > > As Always, > Uttara > > > > "Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate, our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness, that most frightens us. There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you...As we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others." from A Return To Love: by Marianne Williamson > > > > > Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 7, 2006 Report Share Posted May 7, 2006 Dear Sh. Kishore Patnaik, Thanks for these valuable points on suicides. I will study the same with reference to the charts too, and get back to you on this. Just now I checked these with reference to Sylvia Plath's chart and things fall into place. Need to study other charts as well. Regards, Neena jyotish-vidya, "kishore mohan" <kishore_future wrote: > > Dear friend, > > > I am yet to cast and read the charts provided by you. But let me tell > two general points with regard to the suicides: > > > The first one is to do with the natal chart of the native. Generally, > the Lagna Lord will be a malefic for the native. This happens to > tarus and the four 'corner' lagnas. Also, the Moon must be severely > afflicted. If moon is severly afflicted, it can also indicate a > possibility of Balarishta, though in Balarishta, the connection of > Mars with certain Houses is compulsory. In other words, the Moons > position will be alike in both Balarishta and suicide cases. > > The second point is to do with the transits. The Tr Lagna lord should > be cruelly aspecting himself in the natal chart. Sometimes, this > position can be taken by AK but then, AK should be AK for the transit > chart also. > > Hope this helps, > > Kishore patnaik > > > jyotish-vidya, Uttara <muttaraphalguni@> wrote: > > > > Dear Patrice and All, > > > > I have an added commentary to my last post. It is a social > science theory but I think adds to the astrological reasoning behind > some charts we encounter. Especially our families. > > > > Like your mother who is a Gemini, My mother has a Gemini Sun. I > often say she talks out of both sides of her mouth. She is also very > autocratic and opinionated. She too grew up in an era where people > just got on with things and didn't talk or dwell on them openly. I > have often found this to be a direct reaction to the severity of the > depression era of the 30's and then the atrocities of World War 11. > Actually, Alcoholic Anonymous grew out of this depression era, > teaching men how to cope better with events and things in their lives > that were bigger than them. That's where the 12-step program came to > say that one was "powerless over" and taught fraternity of likeness > and support. It was a kind of new religion to help pull men from the > depths of despair. > > > > Unfortunately, your Grandfather never experienced this or his > stoic Denmark ancestry lead him to be his own person. > > > > Then the war came and life changed. Young Men left home and often > didn't return. Or, men returned never to be the same again. Those > that did survive the hell came back with a new outlook on life and the > majority got on with life. Never to develop fraternity again. > > > > Women during the war came out of the house and into the factory to > work – to help supply the goods needed for war. That is where women > wearing pants developed and was allowed. Every thing was rationed, so > material for clothing was harder and sturdier – so pants came into > being and were cheaper. Also in factory work, pants were need for > safety and endurance rather than dresses. Pants became the uniform of > the War. > > > > Once the war ended there was a backlash on the concept of "being > powerless". All of a sudden being in control of ones life became an > obsession in self-help advice and personal stories of people > overcoming adversity for peace and contentment. Personal prosperity > was touted everywhere. Women went back to their kitchens, dresses, > and deferring roles. > > > > However, do you remember growing up how we the baby boomers were > raised and what expectations were required? There were four themes > going on. One to have a more relaxed permissive society, (this is > where entitlement was bred – don't you just love Dr Spock) two, the > sky's the limit, three, gratefulness was instilled instead of apathy. > And, four, mothers were quietly behind closed doors raising their > daughters to be more of their own person and equal to men. The > fifty's believed it. The sixty's teenagers rebelled against the > fifties restrictions, the seventies; married Women were screaming for > their autonomy and the eighties saw young college degreed women in the > workplace. The nineties reaped the backlash and the 21-century so > far in America is entitled happy and throwing all the common sense > rules for civility out the window. > > > > So, when we look at out mothers and hear their stories it really > was a different time of living and thinking and believing. I think > the more adversity and sacrifice they encountered and the more > deferment required, the more they built their own reservoirs for > survival. There are some who were able to keep their capacity to > nurture and empathize, but all too often like my mother their > stoicness, severe expectation, and rule has kept them safe and > protected. And like my mother and some others I know, they became > very narcissistic. > > > > My mother could have been a better mother to my adopted sister, > but in reality, my mother's thinking and feeling was and is one where > she provided this child with a better life and gave her opportunities > and education and a roof over her head that my sister has never been > able to return in kindness to my mother. As far as having any empathy > for a broken soul theory – there is none. That and my mother's > intolerance of my sister's chaotic inner soul is written off as > complete belligerence and added to that, she is not connected to my > mother in any depth because as my mother says, this child is not of > her blood. Gad, what a mess and a terrible fall out for two lives > with completely different experiences. > > > > I am looking forward to 2012. I think the current tide will > change, as it ultimately will. In the meantime, we have to slop > through another six years. I hope my mother isn't living then. She > like my mother in law need to go their graves to find peace and happiness. > > > > As Always, > > Uttara > > > > > > > > "Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate, our > deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, > not our darkness, that most frightens us. There is nothing enlightened > about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around > you...As we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other > people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our own > fear, our presence automatically liberates others." from A Return To > Love: by Marianne Williamson > > > > > > > > > > Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. > Great rates starting at 1¢/min. > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 9, 2006 Report Share Posted May 9, 2006 Dear Uttara and List, Quite a powerful post Uttara, along with the view of our parents history and time here in the US. Thanks for sharing this. Kindest regards, Patrice notify [notify] On Behalf Of patricecurry Tuesday, May 09, 2006 11:54 AM patricecurry Fwd: Re: Factors for Suicide jyotish-vidya, Uttara <muttaraphalguni wrote: Dear Patrice and All, I have an added commentary to my last post. It is a social science theory but I think adds to the astrological reasoning behind some charts we encounter. Especially our families. Like your mother who is a Gemini, My mother has a Gemini Sun. I often say she talks out of both sides of her mouth. She is also very autocratic and opinionated. She too grew up in an era where people just got on with things and didn't talk or dwell on them openly. I have often found this to be a direct reaction to the severity of the depression era of the 30's and then the atrocities of World War 11. Actually, Alcoholic Anonymous grew out of this depression era, teaching men how to cope better with events and things in their lives that were bigger than them. That's where the 12-step program came to say that one was "powerless over" and taught fraternity of likeness and support. It was a kind of new religion to help pull men from the depths of despair. Unfortunately, your Grandfather never experienced this or his stoic Denmark ancestry lead him to be his own person. Then the war came and life changed. Young Men left home and often didn't return. Or, men returned never to be the same again. Those that did survive the hell came back with a new outlook on life and the majority got on with life. Never to develop fraternity again. Women during the war came out of the house and into the factory to work - to help supply the goods needed for war. That is where women wearing pants developed and was allowed. Every thing was rationed, so material for clothing was harder and sturdier - so pants came into being and were cheaper. Also in factory work, pants were need for safety and endurance rather than dresses. Pants became the uniform of the War. Once the war ended there was a backlash on the concept of "being powerless". All of a sudden being in control of ones life became an obsession in self-help advice and personal stories of people overcoming adversity for peace and contentment. Personal prosperity was touted everywhere. Women went back to their kitchens, dresses, and deferring roles. However, do you remember growing up how we the baby boomers were raised and what expectations were required? There were four themes going on. One to have a more relaxed permissive society, (this is where entitlement was bred - don't you just love Dr Spock) two, the sky's the limit, three, gratefulness was instilled instead of apathy. And, four, mothers were quietly behind closed doors raising their daughters to be more of their own person and equal to men. The fifty's believed it. The sixty's teenagers rebelled against the fifties restrictions, the seventies; married Women were screaming for their autonomy and the eighties saw young college degreed women in the workplace. The nineties reaped the backlash and the 21- century so far in America is entitled happy and throwing all the common sense rules for civility out the window. So, when we look at out mothers and hear their stories it really was a different time of living and thinking and believing. I think the more adversity and sacrifice they encountered and the more deferment required, the more they built their own reservoirs for survival. There are some who were able to keep their capacity to nurture and empathize, but all too often like my mother their stoicness, severe expectation, and rule has kept them safe and protected. And like my mother and some others I know, they became very narcissistic. My mother could have been a better mother to my adopted sister, but in reality, my mother's thinking and feeling was and is one where she provided this child with a better life and gave her opportunities and education and a roof over her head that my sister has never been able to return in kindness to my mother. As far as having any empathy for a broken soul theory - there is none. That and my mother's intolerance of my sister's chaotic inner soul is written off as complete belligerence and added to that, she is not connected to my mother in any depth because as my mother says, this child is not of her blood. Gad, what a mess and a terrible fall out for two lives with completely different experiences. I am looking forward to 2012. I think the current tide will change, as it ultimately will. In the meantime, we have to slop through another six years. I hope my mother isn't living then. She like my mother in law need to go their graves to find peace and happiness. As Always, Uttara "Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate, our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness, that most frightens us. There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you...As we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others." from A Return To Love: by Marianne Williamson Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min. --- End forwarded message --- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 9, 2006 Report Share Posted May 9, 2006 Dear Kishore, Thank you for your information and post, very interesting. Will check this out as well. Kindest regards, Patrice _____ jyotish-vidya [jyotish-vidya] On Behalf Of kishore mohan Sunday, May 07, 2006 11:49 AM jyotish-vidya Re: Factors for Suicide Dear friend, I am yet to cast and read the charts provided by you. But let me tell two general points with regard to the suicides: The first one is to do with the natal chart of the native. Generally, the Lagna Lord will be a malefic for the native. This happens to tarus and the four 'corner' lagnas. Also, the Moon must be severely afflicted. If moon is severly afflicted, it can also indicate a possibility of Balarishta, though in Balarishta, the connection of Mars with certain Houses is compulsory. In other words, the Moons position will be alike in both Balarishta and suicide cases. The second point is to do with the transits. The Tr Lagna lord should be cruelly aspecting himself in the natal chart. Sometimes, this position can be taken by AK but then, AK should be AK for the transit chart also. Hope this helps, Kishore patnaik jyotish-vidya, Uttara <muttaraphalguni wrote: > > Dear Patrice and All, > > I have an added commentary to my last post. It is a social science theory but I think adds to the astrological reasoning behind some charts we encounter. Especially our families. > > Like your mother who is a Gemini, My mother has a Gemini Sun. I often say she talks out of both sides of her mouth. She is also very autocratic and opinionated. She too grew up in an era where people just got on with things and didn't talk or dwell on them openly. I have often found this to be a direct reaction to the severity of the depression era of the 30's and then the atrocities of World War 11. Actually, Alcoholic Anonymous grew out of this depression era, teaching men how to cope better with events and things in their lives that were bigger than them. That's where the 12-step program came to say that one was "powerless over" and taught fraternity of likeness and support. It was a kind of new religion to help pull men from the depths of despair. > > Unfortunately, your Grandfather never experienced this or his stoic Denmark ancestry lead him to be his own person. > > Then the war came and life changed. Young Men left home and often didn't return. Or, men returned never to be the same again. Those that did survive the hell came back with a new outlook on life and the majority got on with life. Never to develop fraternity again. > > Women during the war came out of the house and into the factory to work - to help supply the goods needed for war. That is where women wearing pants developed and was allowed. Every thing was rationed, so material for clothing was harder and sturdier - so pants came into being and were cheaper. Also in factory work, pants were need for safety and endurance rather than dresses. Pants became the uniform of the War. > > Once the war ended there was a backlash on the concept of "being powerless". All of a sudden being in control of ones life became an obsession in self-help advice and personal stories of people overcoming adversity for peace and contentment. Personal prosperity was touted everywhere. Women went back to their kitchens, dresses, and deferring roles. > > However, do you remember growing up how we the baby boomers were raised and what expectations were required? There were four themes going on. One to have a more relaxed permissive society, (this is where entitlement was bred - don't you just love Dr Spock) two, the sky's the limit, three, gratefulness was instilled instead of apathy. And, four, mothers were quietly behind closed doors raising their daughters to be more of their own person and equal to men. The fifty's believed it. The sixty's teenagers rebelled against the fifties restrictions, the seventies; married Women were screaming for their autonomy and the eighties saw young college degreed women in the workplace. The nineties reaped the backlash and the 21-century so far in America is entitled happy and throwing all the common sense rules for civility out the window. > > So, when we look at out mothers and hear their stories it really was a different time of living and thinking and believing. I think the more adversity and sacrifice they encountered and the more deferment required, the more they built their own reservoirs for survival. There are some who were able to keep their capacity to nurture and empathize, but all too often like my mother their stoicness, severe expectation, and rule has kept them safe and protected. And like my mother and some others I know, they became very narcissistic. > > My mother could have been a better mother to my adopted sister, but in reality, my mother's thinking and feeling was and is one where she provided this child with a better life and gave her opportunities and education and a roof over her head that my sister has never been able to return in kindness to my mother. As far as having any empathy for a broken soul theory - there is none. That and my mother's intolerance of my sister's chaotic inner soul is written off as complete belligerence and added to that, she is not connected to my mother in any depth because as my mother says, this child is not of her blood. Gad, what a mess and a terrible fall out for two lives with completely different experiences. > > I am looking forward to 2012. I think the current tide will change, as it ultimately will. In the meantime, we have to slop through another six years. I hope my mother isn't living then. She like my mother in law need to go their graves to find peace and happiness. > > As Always, > Uttara > > > > "Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate, our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness, that most frightens us. There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you...As we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others." from A Return To Love: by Marianne Williamson > > > > > Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min. > > > Astrology </gads?t=ms&k=Astrology+chart&w1=Astrology+chart&w2=V edic+astrology&w3=Personal+reading&c=3&s=64&.sig=yoswT0XE-vB9llMiB1sT1Q> chart Vedic </gads?t=ms&k=Vedic+astrology&w1=Astrology+chart&w2=V edic+astrology&w3=Personal+reading&c=3&s=64&.sig=_51dCbxdai4uLT_0QkDkQQ> astrology Personal </gads?t=ms&k=Personal+reading&w1=Astrology+chart&w2= Vedic+astrology&w3=Personal+reading&c=3&s=64&.sig=tMlZMzSPyuffO0tEMLYpFg> reading _____ * Visit your group "jyotish-vidya <jyotish-vidya> " on the web. * jyotish-vidya <jyotish-vidya?subject=Un> * <> Terms of Service. _____ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 10, 2006 Report Share Posted May 10, 2006 Dear ms neena and patrice, My pleasure to be of help. please check for all the charts and please let me know whether I points I have enumerated here hold good in all the cases. regards, Kishore patnaik -- In jyotish-vidya, "neenako" <neenako wrote: > > > Dear Sh. Kishore Patnaik, > > Thanks for these valuable points on suicides. > I will study the same with reference to the charts too, and get back > to you on this. > > Just now I checked these with reference to Sylvia Plath's chart and > things fall into place. Need to study other charts as well. > > Regards, > > Neena > jyotish-vidya, "kishore mohan" > <kishore_future@> wrote: > > > > Dear friend, > > > > > > I am yet to cast and read the charts provided by you. But let me > tell > > two general points with regard to the suicides: > > > > > > The first one is to do with the natal chart of the native. > Generally, > > the Lagna Lord will be a malefic for the native. This happens to > > tarus and the four 'corner' lagnas. Also, the Moon must be > severely > > afflicted. If moon is severly afflicted, it can also indicate a > > possibility of Balarishta, though in Balarishta, the connection of > > Mars with certain Houses is compulsory. In other words, the Moons > > position will be alike in both Balarishta and suicide cases. > > > > The second point is to do with the transits. The Tr Lagna lord > should > > be cruelly aspecting himself in the natal chart. Sometimes, this > > position can be taken by AK but then, AK should be AK for the > transit > > chart also. > > > > Hope this helps, > > > > Kishore patnaik > > > > > > jyotish-vidya, Uttara <muttaraphalguni@> > wrote: > > > > > > Dear Patrice and All, > > > > > > I have an added commentary to my last post. It is a social > > science theory but I think adds to the astrological reasoning > behind > > some charts we encounter. Especially our families. > > > > > > Like your mother who is a Gemini, My mother has a Gemini > Sun. I > > often say she talks out of both sides of her mouth. She is also > very > > autocratic and opinionated. She too grew up in an era where people > > just got on with things and didn't talk or dwell on them openly. I > > have often found this to be a direct reaction to the severity of > the > > depression era of the 30's and then the atrocities of World War 11. > > Actually, Alcoholic Anonymous grew out of this depression era, > > teaching men how to cope better with events and things in their > lives > > that were bigger than them. That's where the 12-step program came > to > > say that one was "powerless over" and taught fraternity of likeness > > and support. It was a kind of new religion to help pull men from > the > > depths of despair. > > > > > > Unfortunately, your Grandfather never experienced this or his > > stoic Denmark ancestry lead him to be his own person. > > > > > > Then the war came and life changed. Young Men left home and > often > > didn't return. Or, men returned never to be the same again. Those > > that did survive the hell came back with a new outlook on life and > the > > majority got on with life. Never to develop fraternity again. > > > > > > Women during the war came out of the house and into the > factory to > > work – to help supply the goods needed for war. That is where > women > > wearing pants developed and was allowed. Every thing was > rationed, so > > material for clothing was harder and sturdier – so pants came into > > being and were cheaper. Also in factory work, pants were need for > > safety and endurance rather than dresses. Pants became the > uniform of > > the War. > > > > > > Once the war ended there was a backlash on the concept > of "being > > powerless". All of a sudden being in control of ones life became an > > obsession in self-help advice and personal stories of people > > overcoming adversity for peace and contentment. Personal prosperity > > was touted everywhere. Women went back to their kitchens, dresses, > > and deferring roles. > > > > > > However, do you remember growing up how we the baby boomers > were > > raised and what expectations were required? There were four themes > > going on. One to have a more relaxed permissive society, (this is > > where entitlement was bred – don't you just love Dr Spock) two, the > > sky's the limit, three, gratefulness was instilled instead of > apathy. > > And, four, mothers were quietly behind closed doors raising their > > daughters to be more of their own person and equal to men. The > > fifty's believed it. The sixty's teenagers rebelled against the > > fifties restrictions, the seventies; married Women were screaming > for > > their autonomy and the eighties saw young college degreed women in > the > > workplace. The nineties reaped the backlash and the 21-century so > > far in America is entitled happy and throwing all the common sense > > rules for civility out the window. > > > > > > So, when we look at out mothers and hear their stories it > really > > was a different time of living and thinking and believing. I think > > the more adversity and sacrifice they encountered and the more > > deferment required, the more they built their own reservoirs for > > survival. There are some who were able to keep their capacity to > > nurture and empathize, but all too often like my mother their > > stoicness, severe expectation, and rule has kept them safe and > > protected. And like my mother and some others I know, they became > > very narcissistic. > > > > > > My mother could have been a better mother to my adopted > sister, > > but in reality, my mother's thinking and feeling was and is one > where > > she provided this child with a better life and gave her > opportunities > > and education and a roof over her head that my sister has never > been > > able to return in kindness to my mother. As far as having any > empathy > > for a broken soul theory – there is none. That and my mother's > > intolerance of my sister's chaotic inner soul is written off as > > complete belligerence and added to that, she is not connected to my > > mother in any depth because as my mother says, this child is not of > > her blood. Gad, what a mess and a terrible fall out for two lives > > with completely different experiences. > > > > > > I am looking forward to 2012. I think the current tide will > > change, as it ultimately will. In the meantime, we have to slop > > through another six years. I hope my mother isn't living then. > She > > like my mother in law need to go their graves to find peace and > happiness. > > > > > > As Always, > > > Uttara > > > > > > > > > > > > "Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate, our > > deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our > light, > > not our darkness, that most frightens us. There is nothing > enlightened > > about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around > > you...As we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other > > people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our own > > fear, our presence automatically liberates others." from A Return > To > > Love: by Marianne Williamson > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. > > Great rates starting at 1¢/min. > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 26, 2007 Report Share Posted February 26, 2007 Dear neena and patrice, I think you have taken up an assingment in finding out the factors for suicide. Please do some exercise on my comments and post here. It will be very helpful, regards Kishore patnaik jyotish-vidya, "neenako" <neenako wrote: > > > Dear Sh. Kishore Patnaik, > > Thanks for these valuable points on suicides. > I will study the same with reference to the charts too, and get back > to you on this. > > Just now I checked these with reference to Sylvia Plath's chart and > things fall into place. Need to study other charts as well. > > Regards, > > Neena > jyotish-vidya, "kishore mohan" > <kishore_future@> wrote: > > > > Dear friend, > > > > > > I am yet to cast and read the charts provided by you. But let me > tell > > two general points with regard to the suicides: > > > > > > The first one is to do with the natal chart of the native. > Generally, > > the Lagna Lord will be a malefic for the native. This happens to > > tarus and the four 'corner' lagnas. Also, the Moon must be > severely > > afflicted. If moon is severly afflicted, it can also indicate a > > possibility of Balarishta, though in Balarishta, the connection of > > Mars with certain Houses is compulsory. In other words, the Moons > > position will be alike in both Balarishta and suicide cases. > > > > The second point is to do with the transits. The Tr Lagna lord > should > > be cruelly aspecting himself in the natal chart. Sometimes, this > > position can be taken by AK but then, AK should be AK for the > transit > > chart also. > > > > Hope this helps, > > > > Kishore patnaik > > > > > > jyotish-vidya, Uttara <muttaraphalguni@> > wrote: > > > > > > Dear Patrice and All, > > > > > > I have an added commentary to my last post. It is a social > > science theory but I think adds to the astrological reasoning > behind > > some charts we encounter. Especially our families. > > > > > > Like your mother who is a Gemini, My mother has a Gemini > Sun. I > > often say she talks out of both sides of her mouth. She is also > very > > autocratic and opinionated. She too grew up in an era where people > > just got on with things and didn't talk or dwell on them openly. I > > have often found this to be a direct reaction to the severity of > the > > depression era of the 30's and then the atrocities of World War 11. > > Actually, Alcoholic Anonymous grew out of this depression era, > > teaching men how to cope better with events and things in their > lives > > that were bigger than them. That's where the 12-step program came > to > > say that one was "powerless over" and taught fraternity of likeness > > and support. It was a kind of new religion to help pull men from > the > > depths of despair. > > > > > > Unfortunately, your Grandfather never experienced this or his > > stoic Denmark ancestry lead him to be his own person. > > > > > > Then the war came and life changed. Young Men left home and > often > > didn't return. Or, men returned never to be the same again. Those > > that did survive the hell came back with a new outlook on life and > the > > majority got on with life. Never to develop fraternity again. > > > > > > Women during the war came out of the house and into the > factory to > > work – to help supply the goods needed for war. That is where > women > > wearing pants developed and was allowed. Every thing was > rationed, so > > material for clothing was harder and sturdier – so pants came into > > being and were cheaper. Also in factory work, pants were need for > > safety and endurance rather than dresses. Pants became the > uniform of > > the War. > > > > > > Once the war ended there was a backlash on the concept > of "being > > powerless". All of a sudden being in control of ones life became an > > obsession in self-help advice and personal stories of people > > overcoming adversity for peace and contentment. Personal prosperity > > was touted everywhere. Women went back to their kitchens, dresses, > > and deferring roles. > > > > > > However, do you remember growing up how we the baby boomers > were > > raised and what expectations were required? There were four themes > > going on. One to have a more relaxed permissive society, (this is > > where entitlement was bred – don't you just love Dr Spock) two, the > > sky's the limit, three, gratefulness was instilled instead of > apathy. > > And, four, mothers were quietly behind closed doors raising their > > daughters to be more of their own person and equal to men. The > > fifty's believed it. The sixty's teenagers rebelled against the > > fifties restrictions, the seventies; married Women were screaming > for > > their autonomy and the eighties saw young college degreed women in > the > > workplace. The nineties reaped the backlash and the 21-century so > > far in America is entitled happy and throwing all the common sense > > rules for civility out the window. > > > > > > So, when we look at out mothers and hear their stories it > really > > was a different time of living and thinking and believing. I think > > the more adversity and sacrifice they encountered and the more > > deferment required, the more they built their own reservoirs for > > survival. There are some who were able to keep their capacity to > > nurture and empathize, but all too often like my mother their > > stoicness, severe expectation, and rule has kept them safe and > > protected. And like my mother and some others I know, they became > > very narcissistic. > > > > > > My mother could have been a better mother to my adopted > sister, > > but in reality, my mother's thinking and feeling was and is one > where > > she provided this child with a better life and gave her > opportunities > > and education and a roof over her head that my sister has never > been > > able to return in kindness to my mother. As far as having any > empathy > > for a broken soul theory – there is none. That and my mother's > > intolerance of my sister's chaotic inner soul is written off as > > complete belligerence and added to that, she is not connected to my > > mother in any depth because as my mother says, this child is not of > > her blood. Gad, what a mess and a terrible fall out for two lives > > with completely different experiences. > > > > > > I am looking forward to 2012. I think the current tide will > > change, as it ultimately will. In the meantime, we have to slop > > through another six years. I hope my mother isn't living then. > She > > like my mother in law need to go their graves to find peace and > happiness. > > > > > > As Always, > > > Uttara > > > > > > > > > > > > "Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate, our > > deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our > light, > > not our darkness, that most frightens us. There is nothing > enlightened > > about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around > > you...As we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other > > people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our own > > fear, our presence automatically liberates others." from A Return > To > > Love: by Marianne Williamson > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. > > Great rates starting at 1¢/min. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 27, 2007 Report Share Posted February 27, 2007 Dear Kishore, Just to add to the list of factors: fourth house seems to be important- house of happiness obstructed, as well as its Lord. In addition to aflicted Moon. Cheers, Anna kishore mohan <kishorepatnaik09 > wrote: Dear neena and patrice, I think you have taken up an assingment in finding out the factors for suicide. Please do some exercise on my comments and post here. It will be very helpful, regards Kishore patnaik jyotish-vidya, "neenako" <neenako wrote: > > > Dear Sh. Kishore Patnaik, > > Thanks for these valuable points on suicides. > I will study the same with reference to the charts too, and get back > to you on this. > > Just now I checked these with reference to Sylvia Plath's chart and > things fall into place. Need to study other charts as well. > > Regards, > > Neena > jyotish-vidya, "kishore mohan" > <kishore_future@> wrote: > > > > Dear friend, > > > > > > I am yet to cast and read the charts provided by you. But let me > tell > > two general points with regard to the suicides: > > > > > > The first one is to do with the natal chart of the native. > Generally, > > the Lagna Lord will be a malefic for the native. This happens to > > tarus and the four 'corner' lagnas. Also, the Moon must be > severely > > afflicted. If moon is severly afflicted, it can also indicate a > > possibility of Balarishta, though in Balarishta, the connection of > > Mars with certain Houses is compulsory. In other words, the Moons > > position will be alike in both Balarishta and suicide cases. > > > > The second point is to do with the transits. The Tr Lagna lord > should > > be cruelly aspecting himself in the natal chart. Sometimes, this > > position can be taken by AK but then, AK should be AK for the > transit > > chart also. > > > > Hope this helps, > > > > Kishore patnaik > > > > > > jyotish-vidya, Uttara <muttaraphalguni@> > wrote: > > > > > > Dear Patrice and All, > > > > > > I have an added commentary to my last post. It is a social > > science theory but I think adds to the astrological reasoning > behind > > some charts we encounter. Especially our families. > > > > > > Like your mother who is a Gemini, My mother has a Gemini > Sun. I > > often say she talks out of both sides of her mouth. She is also > very > > autocratic and opinionated. She too grew up in an era where people > > just got on with things and didn't talk or dwell on them openly. I > > have often found this to be a direct reaction to the severity of > the > > depression era of the 30's and then the atrocities of World War 11. > > Actually, Alcoholic Anonymous grew out of this depression era, > > teaching men how to cope better with events and things in their > lives > > that were bigger than them. That's where the 12-step program came > to > > say that one was "powerless over" and taught fraternity of likeness > > and support. It was a kind of new religion to help pull men from > the > > depths of despair. > > > > > > Unfortunately, your Grandfather never experienced this or his > > stoic Denmark ancestry lead him to be his own person. > > > > > > Then the war came and life changed. Young Men left home and > often > > didn't return. Or, men returned never to be the same again. Those > > that did survive the hell came back with a new outlook on life and > the > > majority got on with life. Never to develop fraternity again. > > > > > > Women during the war came out of the house and into the > factory to > > work – to help supply the goods needed for war. That is where > women > > wearing pants developed and was allowed. Every thing was > rationed, so > > material for clothing was harder and sturdier – so pants came into > > being and were cheaper. Also in factory work, pants were need for > > safety and endurance rather than dresses. Pants became the > uniform of > > the War. > > > > > > Once the war ended there was a backlash on the concept > of "being > > powerless". All of a sudden being in control of ones life became an > > obsession in self-help advice and personal stories of people > > overcoming adversity for peace and contentment. Personal prosperity > > was touted everywhere. Women went back to their kitchens, dresses, > > and deferring roles. > > > > > > However, do you remember growing up how we the baby boomers > were > > raised and what expectations were required? There were four themes > > going on. One to have a more relaxed permissive society, (this is > > where entitlement was bred – don't you just love Dr Spock) two, the > > sky's the limit, three, gratefulness was instilled instead of > apathy. > > And, four, mothers were quietly behind closed doors raising their > > daughters to be more of their own person and equal to men. The > > fifty's believed it. The sixty's teenagers rebelled against the > > fifties restrictions, the seventies; married Women were screaming > for > > their autonomy and the eighties saw young college degreed women in > the > > workplace. The nineties reaped the backlash and the 21-century so > > far in America is entitled happy and throwing all the common sense > > rules for civility out the window. > > > > > > So, when we look at out mothers and hear their stories it > really > > was a different time of living and thinking and believing. I think > > the more adversity and sacrifice they encountered and the more > > deferment required, the more they built their own reservoirs for > > survival. There are some who were able to keep their capacity to > > nurture and empathize, but all too often like my mother their > > stoicness, severe expectation, and rule has kept them safe and > > protected. And like my mother and some others I know, they became > > very narcissistic. > > > > > > My mother could have been a better mother to my adopted > sister, > > but in reality, my mother's thinking and feeling was and is one > where > > she provided this child with a better life and gave her > opportunities > > and education and a roof over her head that my sister has never > been > > able to return in kindness to my mother. As far as having any > empathy > > for a broken soul theory – there is none. That and my mother's > > intolerance of my sister's chaotic inner soul is written off as > > complete belligerence and added to that, she is not connected to my > > mother in any depth because as my mother says, this child is not of > > her blood. Gad, what a mess and a terrible fall out for two lives > > with completely different experiences. > > > > > > I am looking forward to 2012. I think the current tide will > > change, as it ultimately will. In the meantime, we have to slop > > through another six years. I hope my mother isn't living then. > She > > like my mother in law need to go their graves to find peace and > happiness. > > > > > > As Always, > > > Uttara > > > > > > > > > > > > "Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate, our > > deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our > light, > > not our darkness, that most frightens us. There is nothing > enlightened > > about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around > > you...As we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other > > people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our own > > fear, our presence automatically liberates others." from A Return > To > > Love: by Marianne Williamson > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. > > Great rates starting at 1¢/min. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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