Kalachakra dasa chat

[Guest guest]

Jaya Jaya Jagannath

Dear Robert,

At the outset let me thank you for this most brilliant and honest

reply to the questions. The best I have seen in more than a decade or so. My

Guru's always considered me the most difficult student because of these

tough questions...My views as well as what is taught is as under:-

 

YOU WROTE:-

>Some questions on the KCD:

>1. How do you calculate the balance of Dasa? Is it the balance of the first

>dasa or the balance of entire cycle?

 

Both. Each cycle has a set length of Paramayus. The years are as follows:

For the groups of Savya (forward-counting) naksatras, 100 years is allotted

for birth Moon in the first pada; 85 in the 2nd pada; 83 in the third pada;

and 86 in the fourth. It is reversed for the Apasavya naksatras.

 

Then, the method is to first find which dasa, within the entire cycle, will

open at birth. This is done by finding the proportionate numbers of years

of Paramayu, that is left (balance of years) considering the distance

already passed by the Moon in the quarter (pada) naksatra that it is in.

Then, once the opening dasa is found, the balance of the first dasa can be

known, because you will know exactly how many years, going into the dasa,

that have already passed. Sumeet Chugh's book on KCD gives some handy

tables that make this kind of reckoning easy.

SANJAY: THIS IS THE MOST LOGICAL METHOD OF RECKONING THE DASA BALANCE AT

BIRTH ALTHOUGH SANTHANAM TOOK THE BALANCE OF THE FIRST DASA LIKE A LOT OF

OTHER TRADITIONAL JYOTISH. I FULLY AGREE WITH THIS VIEW OF YOURS.

 

YOU WROTE:

>2. Does the Jiva and Deha change if you go into another cycle of another

>pada?After all every pada has its own Deha and Jiva. If YES, then is this

>possible as the Deha (Physical Body) and the Jivatma of the person cannot

>change during one life-time?? If NO, then do we have the prescription of

the

>texts to go into another pada which has already predefined Deha and Jiva?

 

This is a very good question, and to which there is no easy answer. My

impression, from studying several classics, is that the Deha and Jiva from

birth are imprinted for life, and thus are of primary importance in KCD.

Thus, even if the dasas move to the next cycle, which would be their

logical sequence if one dasa cycle is finished, then the "new" Deha and

Jiva Rasis, which are assigned for the new cycle, may only have peripheral

meaning. It is a good question, however, and I would like to hear other

opinions on this matter. What do you say?

SANJAY: THERE IS THIS VITAL LINK BETWEEN THIS QUESTION AND THE NEXT. WE BOTH

AGREE IN TOTO THAT THE DEHA AND THE JIVA CANNOT CHANGE..A PHYSICAL

IMPOSSIBILITY. HENCE, THE ONLY REMAINING OPTION IS TO JUMP TO ANOTHER DASA

SEQUENCE IN WHICH THESE DEHA AND JEEVA REMAIN THE SAME. SECONDLY, AS ALSO

FELT BY YOU, THIS JUMP SHOULD BE WITHIN THE SAVYA/ APASAVYA GROUP TO WHICH

THE ORIGINAL PADA PERTAINS.

THUS, FOR EXAMPLE, IF ONE IS BORN IN THE FIRST PADA OF ASVINI, THE

DEHA IS RULED BY MARS AND THE JEEVA BY JUPITER, AND IF THE DASAS FINISH, THE

NEXT CYCLE WILL BE GIVEN BY THE FIRST QUARTER OF BHARINI WHERE THE DEHA AND

JEEVA ARE ALSO RULED BY MARS AND JUPITER.

 

YOU WROTE:

>3. Again, for example, if one is born in an Apasavya Pada, is it possible

to

>go into another Pada which is savya or is there any other possible gati

into

>another Apasavya Pada?

 

Again, my understanding: You should only move, in the above instance, to

another Apasavya Pada, or to the next Apasavya group. In other words, if

one is born in the fourth pada of an Apasavya naksatra, in the Rohini

group, and the cycle of dasa for birth completes at some point, then the

logical sequence is to move to the first pada (cycle) of the Mrigashira

group of Apasavya naksatras. Completing the last dasa in the Mrigashira

group, would bring you to the first pada in the Rohini group. One cannot

move from an Apasavya group to a Savya group, or vice versa. Each group

consists of four groups of nine dasas each, which represent a natural flow,

or sequence of Navamsas. With Savya naksatras, these begin with Aries, and

end in Pisces; then there is a jump to Scorpio, where the Navamsas move

backward to Sagittarius; then, they move again (third time around) to

Aries, and culminate finally with Pisces. The second group starts with

Scorpio, and finally culminates in Sagittarius following the same sequence.

The Apasavya group Navamsas go exactly in the reverse of this, starting

with Sagittarius. Now, to move from Savya to Apasavya interrupts this

natural sequence, and thus should not be done.

SANJAY: WE ARE OF THE SAME VIEW THEN. I WOULD LIKE TO ADD THAT THE KCD IS

BASED ON SOME VERY NICE PRINCIPLES :-

(a) ONLY JUPITER AND MERCURY OWNING THE DWISBHAVA RASI CAN RULE THE JEEVATMA

AS THE PRIMARY DIVISION OF THE SIGNS INTO DHATU, MOOLA & JEEVA GIVES THE

RULERSHIP OF JEEVA TO THE DUAL SIGNS THAT ARE OWNED BY JUPITER AND MERCURY.

(b) THE SECOND POINT IS THAT ONLY MOON, VENUS, SATURN & MARS CAN HAVE

RULERSHIP OVER THE BODY (deha). NOTE THAT THE SUN AS THE NATURAL ATMAKARAK

HAS BEEN LEFT OUT OF THIS SCHEME. WHENEVER IN DOUBT AS TO WHICH SIGN SHOULD

RULE THE BODY, WHETHER JUMPING FROM ONE CYCLE TO ANOTHER, USE THE DHATU

(Metal/ Inanimate body) and MOOLA (Animate body) PRINCIPLE FOR PREDICTIVE

PURPOSES.

 

YOU WROTE:

>4. What is the sequence behind the KCD, if at all it is there? For I am

>inclined to believe that the Maharishi's had a divine Key for this and it

>cannot be haphazard.

 

You can easily see the pattern, or sequence of dasas as above, but exactly

why it is done in this way, is mysterious to me. Exactly why there should

be a jump from Pisces (end of first group of Savya naksatra dasas) to

Scorpio going backwards, is unknown, as so many things in Jyotish are

unknowns. If this is done, however, there is a logical and consistent

sequence of dasas. As to why particular naksatras should be grouped in

particular categories, as Savya or Apasavya, is another mystery.

SANJAY: YOUR FAITH IN THE MAHARISHI'S SHOWS THAT YOUR LEARNING IS VERY PURE.

NO DOUBT THAT YOU MUST BE A VERY GOOD JYOTISH. THERE ARE DEFINITE REASONS

FOR THE JUMPING:-

 

(A) THERE ARE THREE NABHI OR NAVEL AT ZERO DEGREES OF ARIES, LEO AND

SAGITTARIUS CALLED THE BRAHMA NABHI BETWEEN THE FIRE AND WATER SIGNS AND

DIVIDING THE ZODIAC INTO TRINES. THIS SHOWS THE END OR THE NEW BEGINING.

THUS, THE NAVAMSA ADJOINING THESE BRAHMA NABHI ARE CALLED "GANDANTA" OR THE

ULTIMATE END. NOW, WHEN THE DASA ARRIVES AT PISCES IN DIRECT MOTION, IT

CANNOT CROSS OVER TO ARIES AND UNDERGOES THE SIMHAVALOKANA OR THE LIONS JUMP

TO SCORPIO THE OTHER GANDANTA BEHIND IT AND PROCEEDS IN THE REVERSE.

SIMILARLY, THE OTHER CAN BE UNDERSTOOD. THE GANDANTA AT LEO IS VERY WEAK AND

IS NOT MALIFIC. HENCE, THE PERIOD FOLLOWING SIMHAVALOKANA IS LIKE GANDANTA

AND THE REMEDIAL MEASURES ARE THE SAME AS PRESCRIBED FOR GANDANTA BIRTH.

 

(B) THE SAVYA AND APASAVYA DIVISION IS ALSO VERY LOGICAL..LATER ON WHEN I AM

OUT OF THIS VIRUS FEVER.

 

>5. Why have all the Cycles periods less than 100 years when the ParamAyus

>given by the Maharishi elsewhere is 120 Years? Does it mean that the effect

>of the dasa continues throughout 120 years by interpolation in some method

>or does it cease after the prescribed period of the Cycle as implying some

>sort of an AFTER EFFECT OF THE PAST BIRTH ON THIS BIRTH OF THE NATIVE?

>.....I have so many questions and hope that a logical discussion on this

>will ensue bringing out the truth about KCD.

 

I can only speculate here, but the above theory sounds very interesting.

 

SANJAY: THIS IS MERELY ANOTHER DEEP PHILOSOPHY THAT MY MIND SINKS INTO TIME

AND AGAIN. THE JUMP TO ANOTHER CYCLE IS A MUST TO COVER THE 120 YEARS GIVEN

BY PARASARA. IN THE SLOKA 85-86, PARASARA EXPLAINS THAT THE PERSON BORN AT

THE END OF THE PADA WILL HAVE DEATH LIKE SUFFERING I.E. THE JUMP FROM ONE

CYCLE TO ANOTHER IS PAINFUL. THIS ALSO CONFIRMS OUR INTERPRETATION OF THE

DASA BALANCE ON THE BASIS OF PROPORTION OF COMPLETE DASA INSTEAD OF FIRST

DASA.

HOWEVER, PARASARA GIVES THE VIEWS OF OTHER ASTROLOGERS ON THE

QUESTION OF LONGEVITY ON THE BASIS OF BIRTH IN THE BEGINING , MIDDLE OR END

OF THE PADA...HE DOES NOT CLEARLY AGREE WITH THIS, BUT STATES IT FOR

INFORMATION TYPES (I ALSO FAIL TO AGREE WITH THIS).

 

MY QUESTION: Sanjay, can you explain to me why, if we assign sub-periods to

each dasa, following one after the other beginning with the same sign of

the dasa itself, that it will be found that there are two sub-periods of

the same sign, within the same dasa in some cases? This does not seem

logical to me, but how else can you do it? For example, in the case of the

Moon in the second pada of an Apasavya naksatra, in the Mrigashira group,

you would have two sub-periods of Aries, and two sub-periods of Taurus, in

any dasa in that cycle. How do you interpret two sub-periods of the same

sign, within the same dasa?

SANJAY: THIS CONCEPT OF PUNARGAMANA OR RETURN OF THE ANTARDASA HAS BEEN

STATED BY MANY..INFACT ALL JYOTISHA I HAVE MET SO FAR, YET THEY FAIL TO

QUOTE THE RELEVANT SLOKA FROM BPHS. FOR THE ANTARDASA.

TAKE ANOTHER TRANSLATION OF SLOKA 123-128: " IF DEHA AND JEEVA ARE

OCCUPIED BY SUN, MARS, RAHU AND OTHER MALEFICS, DEATH CAN OCCUR". NOW, IF IT

IS THE NATAL POSITIONS IMPLIED, THEN THESE REMAIN THE SAME FOR EVERY DASA

WITHIN THE CYCLE..HENCE, IT MUST BE RELATED TO TRANSITS OR THE SPECIFIC

DASAS OF DEHA OR JEEVA...THIS SHOULD HAVE BEEN ADDED. THE BPHS NEEDS A GOOD

TRANSLATION.

 

Hare Krishna,

Sanjay Rath

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