Relationship when?

April 27, 2006

necessary to live only for ouselves. One should not be selfish in life. One

should be useful in life. We may be useful to our ownselves, others in the

environment we are living. We have to execute our karma's. Don't try and wait

or be patient. Just execute your own karma. You will find your life more

blissfull and free of illusions. HarryDas Goravani <das (AT) goravani (DOT) com> wrote:

Dear ListI have a good life. I have many blessings.But the one thing I've

always wanted is a relationship, a woman that stays, isn't married to someone

else, isn't distant or unavailable. My own relationship, and her own.I have

tried and hoped and waited for so long. The depression and pain cuts deep

now.When, oh when.May 18th 1960

4:42 AM Oakland CA USASincerely,Das Goravani (Richard

Vuerst-MachAeoidh)das (AT) goravani (DOT) com(Please use email to communicate with me)For

online ordering and all information see our

website:http://www.Goravani.comAstrology Software, Training Videos, Chart

Printoutsand paintings by Das Goravani2852 Willamette St

#353Eugene OR 97405

banner|**| --> Visit your group "valist" on the web.

valist Your use of is subject to

the

Messenger with Voice. PC-to-Phone calls for ridiculously low rates.

April 27, 2006

Das,

Hope the following post helps and you see some reason

now.

I wish you all the best.

MS

--- "Haresh (Harry) Nathani" <haresh1405

wrote:

> Dear Goravani Dasa Pr.

>

> We all are living in stone age(Kalyug). No

> relation in this era is permanent. Everything is

> temporary. This is a materialistic society. We all

> live our lives based on our karma's which are

> reflected in our horoscope at the time of our birth.

>

> Life with a women is adorned and liked by

> everyone. Man always looks upto the woman in all

> states of mind, good, happy, bad, sorrow states

> etc., Man always looks for a permanent relationship

> with a woman, but God has defined that relationship

> as marriage.

>

> One should always go by what has been defined and

> authenticated in order to have a smooth living. One

> has to honour what God has defined for all of us and

> that is the Universal Truth.

>

> To overcome lonliness and live a life without

> being secluded, get into the act what God has

> defined for all. Get married. Live for each other.

> Not necessary to live only for ouselves. One should

> not be selfish in life.

>

> One should be useful in life. We may be useful to

> our ownselves, others in the environment we are

> living. We have to execute our karma's. Don't try

> and wait or be patient. Just execute your own karma.

> You will find your life more blissfull and free of

> illusions.

>

> Harry

>

> Das Goravani <> wrote:

>

> Dear List

>

> I have a good life. I have many blessings.

>

> But the one thing I've always wanted is a

> relationship, a woman that stays, isn't married to

> someone else, isn't distant or unavailable. My own

> relationship, and her own.

>

> I have tried and hoped and waited for so long. The

> depression and pain cuts deep now.

>

> When, oh when.

>

> May 18th 1960 4:42 AM Oakland CA USA

>

> Sincerely,

>

> Das Goravani (Richard Vuerst-MachAeoidh)

>

> (Please use email to communicate with me)

>

> For online ordering and all information see our

> website:

>

> http://www.Goravani.com

>

> Astrology Software, Training Videos, Chart Printouts

> and paintings by Das Goravani

>

> Eugene OR 97405

>

> :

>

> Visit your group "valist" on the web.

>

> To from this group, send an email

> to:

> valist

>

> Your use of is subject to the

>

> Messenger with Voice. PC-to-Phone calls for

> ridiculously low rates.

April 27, 2006

Hello Manoj and Hari

The essence of Hari's article is "God has defined...". The rest is

expanding on that. It also assumes that I meant something other than

marriage.

Actually, I'm fine with marriage. That's one thing. I'm not against it.

It's just in modern English we say "Relationship". It doesn't mean "anti

marriage".

But "God" hasn't defined anything because "God" isn't around. I don't

personally believe "God" is writing any books or saying anything. I don't

see him, I see men starting religions, and customs like marriage.

The Ancient Roman Historian Tacitus, in his book "Germania" describes how

the early tribal Germans believed in "one wife". Their system is what is

followed today by Christians for example- one wife, life long.

The Gaels on the other hand, who were wiped out of Europe but remained in

Ireland and Scotland, Whales, Cornwall, Manx and Britany on the coast of

France, followed their own culture which was that there could be multiple

wives perhaps, or multiple husbands, like Draupadi had with the Pandavas in

the Mahabharat, and their was also very easy divorce, by either partner.

When the "Christians" came to the Gael lands after the fall of Rome and at

the end of Rome's dominion, they again tried and succeeded in wiping out

Gaelic culture and replacing it with their own more "tidy" culture.

In Indian books like Mahabharat, we find the King's had multiple wives, as

did the main Kshatriyas like the Pandavas. Indeed, Arjuna got woman

pregnant while travelling, and hardly went back to see them even. So you

could say he set a pretty "loose" example there. His brothers did similar

things, and they are considered great. Krishna is said to have tens of

thousands of wives and 10 times that many children.

Personally, I would be happy with one devoted wife, as I don't have enough

energy for two. The problem is finding that one devoted wife, or, one that

I like as much as she likes me. I think being blessed makes it hard to find

a partner you like. Perhaps I'm just a narcicist as many have called me.

But believe me guys, if I could find a woman I liked who also liked me, I

would be glad to marry her. I don't have to worry about prenuptial

agreements or getting ripped off by her in divorce, because my life of

service hasn't built a pile of gold I need to protect. Therefore, gold

diggers just walk on by.

In other words, this lecture wasn't necessary, and I know too much to be

preached at, but I'm glad you had fun writing your post.

Personally I miss Gaelic culture, I miss the village and all the friends and

relatives. I miss the fires at night, the dancing and music. In the 1826

census there was 26,000 MacAeoihd's living in the upper left corner of the

Highlands of Scotland. Now that sounds like family. If that was still

going on, I'm sure I'd be a somebody, and I'm sure I'd be married. But as

it stands, I live in a melting pot called America, where everybody is afraid

of everybody else, and everybody locks their doors and hardly talks. I do

not know my neighbors, and nobody wants to know each other. We are all

displaced, alone, and going crazy.

I cannot and will not embrace Christianity or Catholicism. If I did, I

would have no problems like I have. There are about 40 MacKay families in

Eugene and even a MacKay lodge, but for sure it's Catholic or Christian. I

just cannot say Jesus is my savior. I think the whole philosophy stinks.

And they don't want to embrace anything about being Gaels, which is what I

like- our ancient roots. So I'm an anomoly.

So be it. If it were like American Indians say...I'm the one who likes

keeping some of the traditions alive, dressing up now and then, beating on

the old drums and singing the old songs in the old language, standing in a

society of American Natives in suits trying to forget the old ways. It

would be like that.

Marriage? The meer word kindof bothers me as it sounds like "Mary", mother

of Jesus, and again goes back to "Us white people from Europe need the Jews

and their Prophet and their convert Rome to teach us how to behave and be

non-heathens"

Sorry. Not true. We had our own advanced cultures before all those things

came North to enslave, tax, and kill us and make us "religious".

If you read "Germania", you'll hear Tacitus, son of the first governor of

Celtic Britain under Rome, highly informed person, praising the early

Germans for being the most civilized with the least government, behaving the

most correctly and morally without anyone telling them to, simply because

they believed strongly in their culture. He said they were the most free,

but yet the most well behaved and kind, good, righteous, fair.

So why did Rome conquer them? Money. That's ALL. Why did Christianity go

there? Control. That's all.

Why do white boys and girls have to wear Sari's and Dhotis? What is it that

missionaries are REALLY up to?

I'm just looking for a woman. I really don't need a lecture from another

religion or culture on how to handle the relationship between a man and a

woman. I have been married, I have been a monk in two religions, I have had

a slew of non-marriage female relations and suffered accordingly, I have had

two kids, and now a grand child. I'm pretty learned. Why am I being told

to "get married" in order to avoid unhappiness?

Actually it is me who should be telling you things...because I bet I've had

more life experience than both of you put together, since I am in a free

land, and well, you are in India where it's really hard for men and woman to

get together without a whole bunch of meddling from their parents and

relatives.

Peace,

Sincerely,

Das Goravani (Richard Vuerst-MachAeoidh)

(Please use email to communicate with me)

For online ordering and all information see our website:

http://www.Goravani.com

Astrology Software, Training Videos, Chart Printouts

and paintings by Das Goravani

Eugene OR 97405

April 27, 2006

"Actually it is me who should be telling you

things...because I bet I've had more life experience

than both of you put together, since I am in a

free land, and well, you are in India where it's

really hard for men and woman to get together without

a whole bunch of meddling from their parents and

relatives."

Dear Das,

I have absolutely no qualms about you having your own

deviant philosophy about life. However, I have a grave

problem when you not only harbour streotypical

impressions about other culture, but also take the

liberty to propogate your impressions after casting a

pervert spin on them through the net. Now, just merely

having more experience in terms of number of years

spent on this planet doesnot qualify you in any way to

dole out advice, particularly to a person who may be

younger in age, but more spritually evolved than you

. If experience was everything, then you would have

been the head of the state by now, right?

As regards your following point that "you are in India

where it's a whole bunch of meddling from their

partents and relatives", I would only say that you are

being highly presumptious. Just by reading few Indian

scriptures here and there doesn't entitle you to pass

judgement in a manner you have done it in your post.

None of all those I know have ever experienced any

kind of meddling from parents in their marital life.

If taking care of old parents and seeking their

guidance, in your opinion is meddling, then so be it.

Actually speaking a guy like you who has been

grappling with bouts of insanity his entire life would

not even understand an iota of what the Indian

philosophy is.

You are in a need of desperate help. I pray to my God

that he grant some amount of sanity to you otherwise

you would drive everyone around insane.

Cheers.

Manoj

>

> Hello Manoj and Hari

>

> The essence of Hari's article is "God has

> defined...". The rest is

> expanding on that. It also assumes that I meant

> something other than

> marriage.

>

> Actually, I'm fine with marriage. That's one thing.

> I'm not against it.

> It's just in modern English we say "Relationship".

> It doesn't mean "anti

> marriage".

>

> But "God" hasn't defined anything because "God"

> isn't around. I don't

> personally believe "God" is writing any books or

> saying anything. I don't

> see him, I see men starting religions, and customs

> like marriage.

>

> The Ancient Roman Historian Tacitus, in his book

> "Germania" describes how

> the early tribal Germans believed in "one wife".

> Their system is what is

> followed today by Christians for example- one wife,

> life long.

>

> The Gaels on the other hand, who were wiped out of

> Europe but remained in

> Ireland and Scotland, Whales, Cornwall, Manx and

> Britany on the coast of

> France, followed their own culture which was that

> there could be multiple

> wives perhaps, or multiple husbands, like Draupadi

> had with the Pandavas in

> the Mahabharat, and their was also very easy

> divorce, by either partner.

> When the "Christians" came to the Gael lands after

> the fall of Rome and at

> the end of Rome's dominion, they again tried and

> succeeded in wiping out

> Gaelic culture and replacing it with their own more

> "tidy" culture.

>

> In Indian books like Mahabharat, we find the King's

> had multiple wives, as

> did the main Kshatriyas like the Pandavas. Indeed,

> Arjuna got woman

> pregnant while travelling, and hardly went back to

> see them even. So you

> could say he set a pretty "loose" example there.

> His brothers did similar

> things, and they are considered great. Krishna is

> said to have tens of

> thousands of wives and 10 times that many children.

>

> Personally, I would be happy with one devoted wife,

> as I don't have enough

> energy for two. The problem is finding that one

> devoted wife, or, one that

> I like as much as she likes me. I think being

> blessed makes it hard to find

> a partner you like. Perhaps I'm just a narcicist as

> many have called me.

>

> But believe me guys, if I could find a woman I liked

> who also liked me, I

> would be glad to marry her. I don't have to worry

> about prenuptial

> agreements or getting ripped off by her in divorce,

> because my life of

> service hasn't built a pile of gold I need to

> protect. Therefore, gold

> diggers just walk on by.

>

> In other words, this lecture wasn't necessary, and I

> know too much to be

> preached at, but I'm glad you had fun writing your

> post.

>

> Personally I miss Gaelic culture, I miss the village

> and all the friends and

> relatives. I miss the fires at night, the dancing

> and music. In the 1826

> census there was 26,000 MacAeoihd's living in the

> upper left corner of the

> Highlands of Scotland. Now that sounds like family.

> If that was still

> going on, I'm sure I'd be a somebody, and I'm sure

> I'd be married. But as

> it stands, I live in a melting pot called America,

> where everybody is afraid

> of everybody else, and everybody locks their doors

> and hardly talks. I do

> not know my neighbors, and nobody wants to know each

> other. We are all

> displaced, alone, and going crazy.

>

> I cannot and will not embrace Christianity or

> Catholicism. If I did, I

> would have no problems like I have. There are about

> 40 MacKay families in

> Eugene and even a MacKay lodge, but for sure it's

> Catholic or Christian. I

> just cannot say Jesus is my savior. I think the

> whole philosophy stinks.

> And they don't want to embrace anything about being

> Gaels, which is what I

> like- our ancient roots. So I'm an anomoly.

>

> So be it. If it were like American Indians

> say...I'm the one who likes

> keeping some of the traditions alive, dressing up

> now and then, beating on

> the old drums and singing the old songs in the old

> language, standing in a

> society of American Natives in suits trying to

> forget the old ways. It

> would be like that.

>

> Marriage? The meer word kindof bothers me as it

> sounds like "Mary", mother

> of Jesus, and again goes back to "Us white people

> from Europe need the Jews

> and their Prophet and their convert Rome to teach us

> how to behave and be

> non-heathens"

>

> Sorry. Not true. We had our own advanced cultures

> before all those things

> came North to enslave, tax, and kill us and make us

> "religious".

>

> If you read "Germania", you'll hear Tacitus, son of

> the first governor of

> Celtic Britain under Rome, highly informed person,

> praising the early

> Germans for being the most civilized with the least

> government, behaving the

> most correctly and morally without anyone telling

> them to, simply because

> they believed strongly in their culture. He said

> they were the most free,

> but yet the most well behaved and kind, good,

> righteous, fair.

>

> So why did Rome conquer them? Money. That's ALL.

> Why did Christianity go

> there? Control. That's all.

>

> Why do white boys and girls have to wear Sari's and

> Dhotis? What is it that

> missionaries are REALLY up to?

>

> I'm just looking for a woman. I really don't need a

> lecture from another

> religion or culture on how to handle the

> relationship between a man and a

> woman. I have been married, I have been a monk in

> two religions, I have had

> a slew of non-marriage female relations and suffered

> accordingly, I have had

> two kids, and now a grand child. I'm pretty

> learned. Why am I being told

> to "get married" in order to avoid unhappiness?

>

> Actually it is me who should be telling you

> things...because I bet I've had

> more life experience than both of you put together,

> since I am in a free

> land, and well, you are in India where it's really

> hard for men and woman to

> get together without a whole bunch of meddling from

> their parents and

> relatives.

>

> Peace,

>

> Sincerely,

>

> Das Goravani (Richard Vuerst-MachAeoidh)

>

> (Please use email to communicate with me)

>

> For online ordering and all information see our

> website:

>

> http://www.Goravani.com

>

> Astrology Software, Training Videos, Chart Printouts

> and paintings by Das Goravani

>

> Eugene OR 97405

>

=== message truncated ===

April 28, 2006

{Om Namo Narayanaya}

Dear Das,

Wish you would'nt take potshots at India and its culture at every

conceivable juncture. Like Manoj ji said, merely knowing something

about a culture does not make one qualified to comment. If there is

meddling, it is well meaning, just to ensure that marriages,

considered sacred, yes, still,stay intact and dont fall apart and

leave people huddled and lonely and yelling for companinonship.You

are welcome to your own philosophy of life but dont belittle

others'.It has got nothing to do with God or religion. It is

the 'Spirit". Being in a free land does not promise you happiness,

does it? It can at best allow you your raves and rants.

Nalini

(OM Namah Shivaya Namah Mallikarjunaya}

valist, Manoj Sharma <manojsharma662000

wrote:

>

> "Actually it is me who should be telling you

> things...because I bet I've had more life experience

> than both of you put together, since I am in a

> free land, and well, you are in India where it's

> really hard for men and woman to get together without

> a whole bunch of meddling from their parents and

> relatives."

>

> Dear Das,

> I have absolutely no qualms about you having your own

> deviant philosophy about life. However, I have a grave

> problem when you not only harbour streotypical

> impressions about other culture, but also take the

> liberty to propogate your impressions after casting a

> pervert spin on them through the net. Now, just merely

> having more experience in terms of number of years

> spent on this planet doesnot qualify you in any way to

> dole out advice, particularly to a person who may be

> younger in age, but more spritually evolved than you

> . If experience was everything, then you would have

> been the head of the state by now, right?

>

> As regards your following point that "you are in India

> where it's a whole bunch of meddling from their

> partents and relatives", I would only say that you are

> being highly presumptious. Just by reading few Indian

> scriptures here and there doesn't entitle you to pass

> judgement in a manner you have done it in your post.

> None of all those I know have ever experienced any

> kind of meddling from parents in their marital life.

> If taking care of old parents and seeking their

> guidance, in your opinion is meddling, then so be it.

> Actually speaking a guy like you who has been

> grappling with bouts of insanity his entire life would

> not even understand an iota of what the Indian

> philosophy is.

> You are in a need of desperate help. I pray to my God

> that he grant some amount of sanity to you otherwise

> you would drive everyone around insane.

>

> Cheers.

>

> Manoj

>

> >

> > Hello Manoj and Hari

> >

> > The essence of Hari's article is "God has

> > defined...". The rest is

> > expanding on that. It also assumes that I meant

> > something other than

> > marriage.

> >

> > Actually, I'm fine with marriage. That's one thing.

> > I'm not against it.

> > It's just in modern English we say "Relationship".

> > It doesn't mean "anti

> > marriage".

> >

> > But "God" hasn't defined anything because "God"

> > isn't around. I don't

> > personally believe "God" is writing any books or

> > saying anything. I don't

> > see him, I see men starting religions, and customs

> > like marriage.

> >

> > The Ancient Roman Historian Tacitus, in his book

> > "Germania" describes how

> > the early tribal Germans believed in "one wife".

> > Their system is what is

> > followed today by Christians for example- one wife,

> > life long.

> >

> > The Gaels on the other hand, who were wiped out of

> > Europe but remained in

> > Ireland and Scotland, Whales, Cornwall, Manx and

> > Britany on the coast of

> > France, followed their own culture which was that

> > there could be multiple

> > wives perhaps, or multiple husbands, like Draupadi

> > had with the Pandavas in

> > the Mahabharat, and their was also very easy

> > divorce, by either partner.

> > When the "Christians" came to the Gael lands after

> > the fall of Rome and at

> > the end of Rome's dominion, they again tried and

> > succeeded in wiping out

> > Gaelic culture and replacing it with their own more

> > "tidy" culture.

> >

> > In Indian books like Mahabharat, we find the King's

> > had multiple wives, as

> > did the main Kshatriyas like the Pandavas. Indeed,

> > Arjuna got woman

> > pregnant while travelling, and hardly went back to

> > see them even. So you

> > could say he set a pretty "loose" example there.

> > His brothers did similar

> > things, and they are considered great. Krishna is

> > said to have tens of

> > thousands of wives and 10 times that many children.

> >

> > Personally, I would be happy with one devoted wife,

> > as I don't have enough

> > energy for two. The problem is finding that one

> > devoted wife, or, one that

> > I like as much as she likes me. I think being

> > blessed makes it hard to find

> > a partner you like. Perhaps I'm just a narcicist as

> > many have called me.

> >

> > But believe me guys, if I could find a woman I liked

> > who also liked me, I

> > would be glad to marry her. I don't have to worry

> > about prenuptial

> > agreements or getting ripped off by her in divorce,

> > because my life of

> > service hasn't built a pile of gold I need to

> > protect. Therefore, gold

> > diggers just walk on by.

> >

> > In other words, this lecture wasn't necessary, and I

> > know too much to be

> > preached at, but I'm glad you had fun writing your

> > post.

> >

> > Personally I miss Gaelic culture, I miss the village

> > and all the friends and

> > relatives. I miss the fires at night, the dancing

> > and music. In the 1826

> > census there was 26,000 MacAeoihd's living in the

> > upper left corner of the

> > Highlands of Scotland. Now that sounds like family.

> > If that was still

> > going on, I'm sure I'd be a somebody, and I'm sure

> > I'd be married. But as

> > it stands, I live in a melting pot called America,

> > where everybody is afraid

> > of everybody else, and everybody locks their doors

> > and hardly talks. I do

> > not know my neighbors, and nobody wants to know each

> > other. We are all

> > displaced, alone, and going crazy.

> >

> > I cannot and will not embrace Christianity or

> > Catholicism. If I did, I

> > would have no problems like I have. There are about

> > 40 MacKay families in

> > Eugene and even a MacKay lodge, but for sure it's

> > Catholic or Christian. I

> > just cannot say Jesus is my savior. I think the

> > whole philosophy stinks.

> > And they don't want to embrace anything about being

> > Gaels, which is what I

> > like- our ancient roots. So I'm an anomoly.

> >

> > So be it. If it were like American Indians

> > say...I'm the one who likes

> > keeping some of the traditions alive, dressing up

> > now and then, beating on

> > the old drums and singing the old songs in the old

> > language, standing in a

> > society of American Natives in suits trying to

> > forget the old ways. It

> > would be like that.

> >

> > Marriage? The meer word kindof bothers me as it

> > sounds like "Mary", mother

> > of Jesus, and again goes back to "Us white people

> > from Europe need the Jews

> > and their Prophet and their convert Rome to teach us

> > how to behave and be

> > non-heathens"

> >

> > Sorry. Not true. We had our own advanced cultures

> > before all those things

> > came North to enslave, tax, and kill us and make us

> > "religious".

> >

> > If you read "Germania", you'll hear Tacitus, son of

> > the first governor of

> > Celtic Britain under Rome, highly informed person,

> > praising the early

> > Germans for being the most civilized with the least

> > government, behaving the

> > most correctly and morally without anyone telling

> > them to, simply because

> > they believed strongly in their culture. He said

> > they were the most free,

> > but yet the most well behaved and kind, good,

> > righteous, fair.

> >

> > So why did Rome conquer them? Money. That's ALL.

> > Why did Christianity go

> > there? Control. That's all.

> >

> > Why do white boys and girls have to wear Sari's and

> > Dhotis? What is it that

> > missionaries are REALLY up to?

> >

> > I'm just looking for a woman. I really don't need a

> > lecture from another

> > religion or culture on how to handle the

> > relationship between a man and a

> > woman. I have been married, I have been a monk in

> > two religions, I have had

> > a slew of non-marriage female relations and suffered

> > accordingly, I have had

> > two kids, and now a grand child. I'm pretty

> > learned. Why am I being told

> > to "get married" in order to avoid unhappiness?

> >

> > Actually it is me who should be telling you

> > things...because I bet I've had

> > more life experience than both of you put together,

> > since I am in a free

> > land, and well, you are in India where it's really

> > hard for men and woman to

> > get together without a whole bunch of meddling from

> > their parents and

> > relatives.

> >

> > Peace,

> >

> > Sincerely,

> >

> > Das Goravani (Richard Vuerst-MachAeoidh)

> >

> > (Please use email to communicate with me)

> >

> > For online ordering and all information see our

> > website:

> >

> > http://www.Goravani.com

> >

> > Astrology Software, Training Videos, Chart Printouts

> > and paintings by Das Goravani

> >

> > Eugene OR 97405

> >

> === message truncated ===

>

April 29, 2006

what ur stars indicate. If ur stars indicate a very strong and adurable

relantionship u are looking for, why not go ahead & develop one. Why

unnecessaryly create a debate and friction on ones understanding & knowledge.

LIVE LIFE UR STYLE. HarryDas Goravani <das (AT) goravani (DOT) com> wrote: Hello Manoj

and HariThe essence of Hari's article is "God has defined...". The rest

isexpanding on that. It also assumes that I meant something other

thanmarriage.Actually, I'm fine with marriage. That's one thing. I'm not

against it.It's just in modern English we say "Relationship". It doesn't mean

"antimarriage". But "God" hasn't defined anything because "God" isn't around. I

don'tpersonally believe "God" is writing any books or saying anything. I

don'tsee him, I see

men starting religions, and customs like marriage.The Ancient Roman Historian

Tacitus, in his book "Germania" describes howthe early tribal Germans believed

in "one wife". Their system is what isfollowed today by Christians for example-

one wife, life long.The Gaels on the other hand, who were wiped out of Europe

but remained inIreland and Scotland, Whales, Cornwall, Manx and Britany on the

coast ofFrance, followed their own culture which was that there could be

multiplewives perhaps, or multiple husbands, like Draupadi had with the

Pandavas inthe Mahabharat, and their was also very easy divorce, by either

partner.When the "Christians" came to the Gael lands after the fall of Rome and

atthe end of Rome's dominion, they again tried and succeeded in wiping outGaelic

culture and replacing it with their own more "tidy" culture.In Indian books like

Mahabharat, we find the King's had multiple wives, asdid the main

Kshatriyas like the Pandavas. Indeed, Arjuna got womanpregnant while travelling,

and hardly went back to see them even. So youcould say he set a pretty "loose"

example there. His brothers did similarthings, and they are considered great.

Krishna is said to have tens ofthousands of wives and 10 times that many

children.Personally, I would be happy with one devoted wife, as I don't have

enoughenergy for two. The problem is finding that one devoted wife, or, one

thatI like as much as she likes me. I think being blessed makes it hard to

finda partner you like. Perhaps I'm just a narcicist as many have called me.But

believe me guys, if I could find a woman I liked who also liked me, Iwould be

glad to marry her. I don't have to worry about prenuptialagreements or getting

ripped off by her in divorce, because my life ofservice hasn't built a pile of

gold I need to protect. Therefore, golddiggers just walk on

by.In other words, this lecture wasn't necessary, and I know too much to

bepreached at, but I'm glad you had fun writing your post.Personally I miss

Gaelic culture, I miss the village and all the friends andrelatives. I miss the

fires at night, the dancing and music. In the 1826census there was 26,000

MacAeoihd's living in the upper left corner of theHighlands of Scotland. Now

that sounds like family. If that was stillgoing on, I'm sure I'd be a somebody,

and I'm sure I'd be married. But asit stands, I live in a melting pot called

America, where everybody is afraidof everybody else, and everybody locks their

doors and hardly talks. I donot know my neighbors, and nobody wants to know

each other. We are alldisplaced, alone, and going crazy.I cannot and will not

embrace Christianity or Catholicism. If I did, Iwould have no problems like I

have. There are about 40 MacKay families inEugene and even a MacKay

lodge, but for sure it's Catholic or Christian. Ijust cannot say Jesus is my

savior. I think the whole philosophy stinks.And they don't want to embrace

anything about being Gaels, which is what Ilike- our ancient roots. So I'm an

anomoly.So be it. If it were like American Indians say...I'm the one who

likeskeeping some of the traditions alive, dressing up now and then, beating

onthe old drums and singing the old songs in the old language, standing in

asociety of American Natives in suits trying to forget the old ways. Itwould be

like that.Marriage? The meer word kindof bothers me as it sounds like "Mary",

motherof Jesus, and again goes back to "Us white people from Europe need the

Jewsand their Prophet and their convert Rome to teach us how to behave and

benon-heathens"Sorry. Not true. We had our own advanced cultures before all

those thingscame North to enslave, tax, and kill us and make us

"religious".If you read "Germania", you'll hear Tacitus, son of the first

governor ofCeltic Britain under Rome, highly informed person, praising the

earlyGermans for being the most civilized with the least government, behaving

themost correctly and morally without anyone telling them to, simply

becausethey believed strongly in their culture. He said they were the most

free,but yet the most well behaved and kind, good, righteous, fair.So why did

Rome conquer them? Money. That's ALL. Why did Christianity gothere? Control.

That's all.Why do white boys and girls have to wear Sari's and Dhotis? What is

it thatmissionaries are REALLY up to?I'm just looking for a woman. I really

don't need a lecture from anotherreligion or culture on how to handle the

relationship between a man and awoman. I have been married, I have been a monk

in two religions, I have hada slew of non-marriage female relations and

suffered

accordingly, I have hadtwo kids, and now a grand child. I'm pretty learned. Why

am I being toldto "get married" in order to avoid unhappiness?Actually it is me

who should be telling you things...because I bet I've hadmore life experience

than both of you put together, since I am in a freeland, and well, you are in

India where it's really hard for men and woman toget together without a whole

bunch of meddling from their parents andrelatives. Peace,Sincerely,Das Goravani

(Richard Vuerst-MachAeoidh)das (AT) goravani (DOT) com(Please use email to communicate with

me)For online ordering and all information see our

website:http://www.Goravani.comAstrology Software, Training Videos, Chart

Printoutsand paintings by Das Goravani2852 Willamette St

#353Eugene OR 97405:

For software visit:

Groups Links<*> To visit your group on the web, go

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send an email to:valist<*> Your use of

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April 29, 2006

Manoj,

""Actually speaking a guy like you who has been grappling with bouts of insanity

his entire life would not even understand an iota of what the Indian philosophy

is.""

This is a disgusting statement. If you cannot understand someone's pain and

their cry for help, it is fine. But please do not make it worse for them by

calling them insane.

""Just by reading few Indian scriptures here and there doesn't entitle you to

pass judgement in a manner you have done it in your post.""

What makes you think that he has never lived in India, and all he has done is to

read 'a few indian scriptures here and there ?' I do not understand why you are

taking all this so personally. I am an Indian too, and I did not find anything

offensive in Das's post. Everyone is entitled to voice their opinion, that

doesn't prove anyone or anything right, or wrong.

This is all none of my business, but is is very difficult to keep quiet when you

see someone call someone else on the list insane, and then make patronizing

statements. Please do not spoil the atmosphere in this list. I do not post

anything, but whenever I go through difficult times in my life, i lurk here to

read some good posts and find solace. I have been doing that for 9 years,

please do not take that away from me now.

Thanks.

Regards, Sunita.

Manoj Sharma <manojsharma662000 >

valistTo: valistSubject: Re: [VA]

Relationship when? Thu, 27 Apr 2006 10:44:02 -0400 (EDT)>"Actually it is

me who should be telling you>things...because I bet I've had more life

experience>than both of you put together, since I am in a>free land, and well,

you are in India where it's>really hard for men and woman to get together

without>a whole bunch of meddling from their parents and>relatives.">>Dear

Das,>I have absolutely no qualms about you having your own>deviant philosophy

about life. However, I have a grave>problem when you not only harbour

streotypical>impressions about other culture, but also take the>liberty to

propogate your impressions after casting a>pervert spin on them through the

net. Now, just merely>having more experience in terms of number of years>spent

on this planet doesnot qualify you in any way to>dole out advice, particularly

to a person who may be>younger in age, but more spritually evolved than you>.

If experience was everything, then you would have>been the head of the state by

now, right?>>As regards your following point that "you are in India>where it's

a whole bunch of meddling from their>partents and relatives", I would only say

that you are>being highly presumptious. Just by reading few Indian>scriptures

here and there doesn't entitle you to pass>judgement in a manner you have done

it in your post.>None of all those I know have ever experienced any>kind of

meddling from parents in their marital life.>If taking care of old parents and

seeking their>guidance, in your opinion is meddling, then so be it.>Actually

speaking a guy like you who has been>grappling with bouts of insanity his

entire life would>not even understand an iota of what the Indian>philosophy

is.>You are in a need of desperate help. I pray to my God>that he grant some

amount of sanity to you otherwise>you would drive everyone around

insane.>>Cheers.>>Manoj>> >> > Hello Manoj and Hari> >> > The essence of Hari's

article is "God has> > defined...". The rest is> > expanding on that. It also

assumes that I meant> > something other than> > marriage.> >> > Actually, I'm

fine with marriage. That's one thing.> > I'm not against it.> > It's just in

modern English we say "Relationship".> > It doesn't mean "anti> > marriage".>

>> > But "God" hasn't defined anything because "God"> > isn't around. I don't>

> personally believe "God" is writing any books or> > saying anything. I don't>

> see him, I see men starting religions, and customs> > like marriage.> >> > The

Ancient Roman Historian Tacitus, in his book> > "Germania" describes how> > the

early tribal Germans believed in "one wife".> > Their system is what is> >

followed today by Christians for example- one wife,> > life long.> >> > The

Gaels on the other hand, who were wiped out of> > Europe but remained in> >

Ireland and Scotland, Whales, Cornwall, Manx and> > Britany on the coast of> >

France, followed their own culture which was that> > there could be multiple> >

wives perhaps, or multiple husbands, like Draupadi> > had with the Pandavas in>

> the Mahabharat, and their was also very easy> > divorce, by either partner.>

> When the "Christians" came to the Gael lands after> > the fall of Rome and

at> > the end of Rome's dominion, they again tried and> > succeeded in wiping

out> > Gaelic culture and replacing it with their own more> > "tidy" culture.>

>> > In Indian books like Mahabharat, we find the King's> > had multiple wives,

as> > did the main Kshatriyas like the Pandavas. Indeed,> > Arjuna got woman> >

pregnant while travelling, and hardly went back to> > see them even. So you> >

could say he set a pretty "loose" example there.> > His brothers did similar> >

things, and they are considered great. Krishna is> > said to have tens of> >

thousands of wives and 10 times that many children.> >> > Personally, I would

be happy with one devoted wife,> > as I don't have enough> > energy for two.

The problem is finding that one> > devoted wife, or, one that> > I like as much

as she likes me. I think being> > blessed makes it hard to find> > a partner

you like. Perhaps I'm just a narcicist as> > many have called me.> >> > But

believe me guys, if I could find a woman I liked> > who also liked me, I> >

would be glad to marry her. I don't have to worry> > about prenuptial> >

agreements or getting ripped off by her in divorce,> > because my life of> >

service hasn't built a pile of gold I need to> > protect. Therefore, gold> >

diggers just walk on by.> >> > In other words, this lecture wasn't necessary,

and I> > know too much to be> > preached at, but I'm glad you had fun writing

your> > post.> >> > Personally I miss Gaelic culture, I miss the village> > and

all the friends and> > relatives. I miss the fires at night, the dancing> > and

music. In the 1826> > census there was 26,000 MacAeoihd's living in the> >

upper left corner of the> > Highlands of Scotland. Now that sounds like

family.> > If that was still> > going on, I'm sure I'd be a somebody, and I'm

sure> > I'd be married. But as> > it stands, I live in a melting pot called

America,> > where everybody is afraid> > of everybody else, and everybody locks

their doors> > and hardly talks. I do> > not know my neighbors, and nobody

wants to know each> > other. We are all> > displaced, alone, and going crazy.>

>> > I cannot and will not embrace Christianity or> > Catholicism. If I did, I>

> would have no problems like I have. There are about> > 40 MacKay families in>

> Eugene and even a MacKay lodge, but for sure it's> > Catholic or Christian.

I> > just cannot say Jesus is my savior. I think the> > whole philosophy

stinks.> > And they don't want to embrace anything about being> > Gaels, which

is what I> > like- our ancient roots. So I'm an anomoly.> >> > So be it. If

it were like American Indians> > say...I'm the one who likes> > keeping some of

the traditions alive, dressing up> > now and then, beating on> > the old drums

and singing the old songs in the old> > language, standing in a> > society of

American Natives in suits trying to> > forget the old ways. It> > would be

like that.> >> > Marriage? The meer word kindof bothers me as it> > sounds

like "Mary", mother> > of Jesus, and again goes back to "Us white people> >

from Europe need the Jews> > and their Prophet and their convert Rome to teach

us> > how to behave and be> > non-heathens"> >> > Sorry. Not true. We had our

own advanced cultures> > before all those things> > came North to enslave, tax,

and kill us and make us> > "religious".> >> > If you read "Germania", you'll

hear Tacitus, son of> > the first governor of> > Celtic Britain under Rome,

highly informed person,> > praising the early> > Germans for being the most

civilized with the least> > government, behaving the> > most correctly and

morally without anyone telling> > them to, simply because> > they believed

strongly in their culture. He said> > they were the most free,> > but yet the

most well behaved and kind, good,> > righteous, fair.> >> > So why did Rome

conquer them? Money. That's ALL.> > Why did Christianity go> > there?

Control. That's all.> >> > Why do white boys and girls have to wear Sari's and>

> Dhotis? What is it that> > missionaries are REALLY up to?> >> > I'm just

looking for a woman. I really don't need a> > lecture from another> > religion

or culture on how to handle the> > relationship between a man and a> > woman. I

have been married, I have been a monk in> > two religions, I have had> > a slew

of non-marriage female relations and suffered> > accordingly, I have had> > two

kids, and now a grand child. I'm pretty> > learned. Why am I being told> > to

"get married" in order to avoid unhappiness?> >> > Actually it is me who should

be telling you> > things...because I bet I've had> > more life experience than

both of you put together,> > since I am in a free> > land, and well, you are in

India where it's really> > hard for men and woman to> > get together without a

whole bunch of meddling from> > their parents and> > relatives.> >> > Peace,>

>> > Sincerely,> >> > Das Goravani (Richard Vuerst-MachAeoidh)> >> >

das (AT) goravani (DOT) com> >> > (Please use email to communicate with me)> >> > For

online ordering and all information see our> > website:> >> >

http://www.Goravani.com> >> > Astrology Software, Training Videos, Chart

Printouts> > and paintings by Das Goravani> >> > > > 2852

Willamette St #353> > Eugene OR 97405> >> > > >>=== message

truncated ===>>>>:

>

http://www.goravani.com> Links>><*> To visit your group on the

web, go to:> valist/>><*> To from

this group, send an email to:> valist>><*> Your

> >>>

April 30, 2006

So why not get drunk tonight, so why not get drunk tomorrow night,

too...if a Kaliyuga lasts 432,000 years? 432 --especially counting

backwards = 9, so is surely a metaphor. The Nakshatras starting with

Ketu wouldn't do violence. The world resting on an elephant, resting on

a tortoise, resting on a snake might take a little longer, but the

Nakshatras starting with Ketu wouldn't do violation there either.

________________________________

Manoj Sharma wrote:

> >

> > We all are living in stone age(Kalyug). No

> > relation in this era is permanent. Everything is

> > temporary. This is a materialistic society. We all

> > live our lives based on our karma's which are

> > reflected in our horoscope at the time of our birth.

> >

April 30, 2006

Well Sunita,

OIn what basis you say that I can't understand

anyone's pain. I definitely understand Das's pain. I

did not take anything in Das's posts as any slight. I

was just trying to understand his standpoint and was

making him understand my point of view.

I know Das as much as you claim to be knowing him.

Lastly, please don't call any of my statements as

"disgusting". You being a lady, I am being polite

here. Otherwise I am a guy not known for diplomacy.

Take care

Manoj

--- Sunita Menon <sunita_menon wrote:

Manoj,

""Actually speaking a guy like you who has been

grappling with bouts of insanity his entire life would

not even understand an iota of what the Indian

philosophy is.""

This is a disgusting statement. If you cannot

understand someone's pain and their cry for help, it

is fine. But please do not make it worse for them by

calling them insane.

""Just by reading few Indian scriptures here and there

doesn't entitle you to pass judgement in a manner you

have done it in your post.""

What makes you think that he has never lived in India,

and all he has done is to read 'a few indian

scriptures here and there ?' I do not understand why

you are taking all this so personally. I am an Indian

too, and I did not find anything offensive in Das's

post. Everyone is entitled to voice their opinion,

that doesn't prove anyone or anything right, or wrong.

This is all none of my business, but is is very

difficult to keep quiet when you see someone call

someone else on the list insane, and then make

patronizing statements. Please do not spoil the

atmosphere in this list. I do not post anything, but

whenever I go through difficult times in my life, i

lurk here to read some good posts and find solace. I

have been doing that for 9 years, please do not take

that away from me now.