Guest guest Posted October 14, 2001 Report Share Posted October 14, 2001 Hello Phyl, Nice to hear from you! At 09:08 PM 10/13/01 -0700, you wrote: >Dear Robert, > >Please take the time to share your knowledge. > >Thanks, Phyl I will indeed. It seems that there has been a lot of desire and encouragement around the subject of rectifying Prabhupada's chart through Rasi dasas, and that will be a great venture to embark upon. In the past, unfortunately, this level of Jyotish has felt intimidating for certain members, and thus I have felt reluctant to engage in it. Those inimical to expanding the horizons of Jyotish, in seems, became hostile and combative when these matters came up in the past, and that is why I left the list for a period of time. Now it seems those persons have been withdrawn from the list due to their inability to exercise proper respect and gentleness while participating in a public forum. So, now that I do not have to duck, hide, and dodge bullets every time I want to speak on these subjects, there will be a much easier and productive flow of knowledge from here on (from my participation anyway). RASI DASAS: WHAT THEY ARE When we are talking about Rasi dasas, we are implying a progression of the ascendant by certain numbers of years, based upon certain formulas. Rasi dasas, like Chara and Narayana, are in fact easier and often more direct in explaining the movements or unfolding of physical karmas, than naksatra dasas like the popular Vimsottari. When we say a "progression of the ascendant", it means that the potentials of imbedded in time, and shown from the lagna and position of planets therefrom at birth, move to the different signs/houses of the chart, wherefrom they are viewed and analyzed for the period of time encompassing the dasas of those houses/signs. For example, if someone has Aries rising, and Venus in Libra in the 7th house, there is potential (barring other interfering factors), marriage shown for that person in life. But when, is the question. Progressing the ascendant forward to the sign Libra, according to the methods of determining lengths of rasi dasas, will thus give the timings of the marriage broadly, and then specifically when the appropriate sub-periods come into operation. Now, certainly if the dasas are thus determined based on the lagna of a chart, we should be able to find out, through an analysis of the rasi dasas based on the two proposed lagnas, and given events, which is the correct lagna for Prabhupada. This will be a great study, and I think should enable us to objectively identify the correct chart. I have thus found Rasi dasas to be invaluable in the matter of rectification, when the decision is between two lagnas of the rasi chart. Once the correct lagna is achieved, then other methods of fine-tuning can be used to hone the time even closer. So, early this coming week, I will post the Chara dasas (based on Parasara, not K.N. Rao) for both of the proposed Capricorn or Sagittarius lagnas for Srila Prabhupada. I personally prefer Narayana dasa, as taught by Sanjay Rath, yet since most are not yet familiar with that dasa, I will post the more familiar Chara dasa instead. Some life events on Prabhupada were posted earlier, and we can cross-reference those to whichever lagna and chart thus seems more appropriate. So stay tuned, and next week I will present some findings. Thanks to all for listening. Best wishes, Robert ===================================== Robert A. Koch, Vedic Astrologer Faculty Member, SJVC and ACVA Phone: 541-318-0248 visit <http://www.robertkoch.com> or e-mail rk. rk and rkoch rkoch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 15, 2001 Report Share Posted October 15, 2001 Robert: >Now, certainly if the dasas are thus determined based on the lagna of a >chart, we should be able to find out, through an analysis of the rasi dasas >based on the two proposed lagnas, and given events, which is the correct >lagna for Prabhupada. This will be a great study, and I think should >enable us to objectively identify the correct chart. I find your use of the word "objectively" to be incorrect here. Only those who were present at his birth have access to objective information. Everything else is speculation, however informed. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 16, 2001 Report Share Posted October 16, 2001 Hare Rama Krsna Dear Chris! Objectivity is defined as anything which is observed / measured as the same, irrespective of who is the observer. So objectivity can be there, if irrespective of who is interpreting / analysing the event, come to the same conclusion independently... All the best Sarajit - "Christopher Kevill" <ckevill <gjlist> Tuesday, October 16, 2001 5:32 AM Re: [GJ] Rasi dasas: Easy lagna resolution > Robert: > > >Now, certainly if the dasas are thus determined based on the lagna of a > >chart, we should be able to find out, through an analysis of the rasi dasas > >based on the two proposed lagnas, and given events, which is the correct > >lagna for Prabhupada. This will be a great study, and I think should > >enable us to objectively identify the correct chart. > > I find your use of the word "objectively" to be incorrect here. Only those > who were present at his birth have access to objective information. > Everything else is speculation, however informed. > > Chris > > > > > > Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya; Hare Krishna; Om Tat Sat > : gjlist- > > > > Your use of is subject to > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 16, 2001 Report Share Posted October 16, 2001 Dear Sarajit: At 11:55 AM 10/16/01 +0530, you wrote: >Hare Rama Krsna >Dear Chris! > >Objectivity is defined as anything which is observed / measured as the same, >irrespective of who is the observer. So objectivity can be there, if >irrespective of who is interpreting / analysing the event, come to the same >conclusion independently... > Yes, if there is a consensus, then that becomes objective. However, astrology rarely agree on something as contentious as rectification, as this debate has shown. Perhaps if many astrologers using different techniques and parameters, all agreed on the same birth time, then that would be equivalent to being present at the birth itself. But that never(?) happens in astrology, hence it is almost impossible to talk about "objective" rectified birth times where they are either unknown or approximate, and even those that are recorded on birth certificates are rightly subjected to scrutiny and debate. They are all speculative to some extent. One can only judge their accuracy on the basis of the future predictions made with them. regards, Chris >All the best >Sarajit > > >- >"Christopher Kevill" <ckevill ><gjlist> >Tuesday, October 16, 2001 5:32 AM >Re: [GJ] Rasi dasas: Easy lagna resolution > > >> Robert: >> >> >Now, certainly if the dasas are thus determined based on the lagna of a >> >chart, we should be able to find out, through an analysis of the rasi >dasas >> >based on the two proposed lagnas, and given events, which is the correct >> >lagna for Prabhupada. This will be a great study, and I think should >> >enable us to objectively identify the correct chart. >> >> I find your use of the word "objectively" to be incorrect here. Only >those >> who were present at his birth have access to objective information. >> Everything else is speculation, however informed. >> >> Chris >> >> >> >> >> >> Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya; Hare Krishna; Om Tat Sat >> : gjlist- >> >> >> >> Your use of is subject to >> >> > > > > >Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya; Hare Krishna; Om Tat Sat >: gjlist- > > > >Your use of is subject to > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 16, 2001 Report Share Posted October 16, 2001 Dear Christopher You made an excellent point One can only judge their accuracy on the basis of the future predictions made with them. And this is the point you can keep back rectifying till the cows come home, but the person who made the astounding prediction that Srila Prabhupada would travel overseas and open 100 temples used Capricorn Lagna . Nicholas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 16, 2001 Report Share Posted October 16, 2001 Nicholas wrote: At 06:04 AM 10/17/01 +1000, you wrote: >And this is the point you can keep back rectifying till the cows come home, >but the person who made the astounding prediction that Srila Prabhupada >would travel overseas and open 100 temples used Capricorn Lagna . Are you sure, Nicholas? That prediction was made in 1896. You'd have a hard time verifying that with any satisfying certainty. Best wishes, Robert ===================================== Robert A. Koch, Vedic Astrologer Faculty Member, SJVC and ACVA Phone: 541-318-0248 visit <http://www.robertkoch.com> or e-mail rk. rk and rkoch rkoch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 16, 2001 Report Share Posted October 16, 2001 Dear Robert The authority for this story is the same authority as for the 4 o'clock birth time . Hope this clarifies things Best Wishes Nicholas - "Robert A. Koch" <rkoch <gjlist> Wednesday, October 17, 2001 6:55 AM Re: [GJ] Rasi dasas: Easy lagna resolution > Nicholas wrote: > > At 06:04 AM 10/17/01 +1000, you wrote: > >And this is the point you can keep back rectifying till the cows come home, > >but the person who made the astounding prediction that Srila Prabhupada > >would travel overseas and open 100 temples used Capricorn Lagna . > > Are you sure, Nicholas? That prediction was made in 1896. You'd have a > hard time verifying that with any satisfying certainty. > > Best wishes, > Robert > > ===================================== > Robert A. Koch, Vedic Astrologer > Faculty Member, SJVC and ACVA > Phone: 541-318-0248 > visit <http://www.robertkoch.com> or e-mail > rk. rk and > rkoch rkoch > > > > > Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya; Hare Krishna; Om Tat Sat > : gjlist- > > > > Your use of is subject to > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 17, 2001 Report Share Posted October 17, 2001 Nicholas, How do you know that this is so? I've been hearing things like " The Capricorn chart is the one that Shrila Prabhupada used all his life." Is this a matter of asumptions coming to us by way of second-hand? Again, Shrila Prabhupada never told us. There was doubt. When shown three horoscopes, he had to get reading on all three to try and decide. Did he say " Excuse me, but my lagna is Capricorn. How did you get Sagittarius?" That proves that he didn't know which one was being used when he was little. I mean, the one thing that a person learns and takes with them is their rising sign. And since His Divine Grace wasn't an astrologer, how could he tell? What gets me is that the Capricorn chart fits badly, and it's obvious. The confusion has been perpetuated by that Shyamasundara. If it weren't for his say-so, nobody would have the daring to say that it is Capricorn. He got called on it by his arch enemy, Nalini Kantha, and so the two camps got polarized. Nalini became the most popular astrologer in ISKCON, for whatever reason. Syamasundara doesn't have a personality which allows him to be popular, so even though he got trained up in India, Nalini up- staged him- stole the bread and ran- and that is the origin of the lagna squabble,IMHO. Dharmapada gjlist, "Nicholas" <costa@A...> wrote: > Dear Christopher > You made an excellent point > One can only judge their accuracy on the basis of the future > predictions made with them. > > And this is the point you can keep back rectifying till the cows come home, > but the person who made the astounding prediction that Srila Prabhupada > would travel overseas and open 100 temples used Capricorn Lagna . > > Nicholas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 17, 2001 Report Share Posted October 17, 2001 Dear Dharmapada I'm not sure what purpose it serves to launch a personal attack on Shyamasundara Prabhu who is not present on the list .He was asked to study Vedic astrology by His Divine Grace . I'm not sure also what puprposes it serves those persons who attack K.N.Rao who is also not present on the list ..Nonetheless in reply to your point the Capricorn Lagna was satisfactory for both Pandit Ojha and Sri Rao both who have excellent repuatations as predictive astrologers .If I am wrong about the Lagna then there are better astrologers than me who made the same mistake . I am the one who from the start suggested that this topic be dropped and the wisdom of my position is now verified . Hare Krsna Nicholas - <0108 <gjlist> Thursday, October 18, 2001 8:22 AM Re: [GJ] Rasi dasas: Easy lagna resolution > > Nicholas, > > How do you know that this is so? I've been hearing things like " The > Capricorn chart is the one that Shrila Prabhupada used all his life." > Is this a matter of asumptions coming to us by way of second-hand? > > Again, Shrila Prabhupada never told us. There was doubt. When shown > three horoscopes, he had to get reading on all three to try and > decide. Did he say " Excuse me, but my lagna is Capricorn. How did > you get Sagittarius?" That proves that he didn't know which one was > being used when he was little. I mean, the one thing that a person > learns and takes with them is their rising sign. And since His Divine > Grace wasn't an astrologer, how could he tell? > > What gets me is that the Capricorn chart fits badly, and it's > obvious. The confusion has been perpetuated by that Shyamasundara. If > it weren't for his say-so, nobody would have the daring to say that > it is Capricorn. He got called on it by his arch enemy, Nalini > Kantha, and so the two camps got polarized. > > Nalini became the most popular astrologer in ISKCON, for whatever > reason. Syamasundara doesn't have a personality which allows him to > be popular, so even though he got trained up in India, Nalini up- > staged him- stole the bread and ran- and that is the origin of the > lagna squabble,IMHO. > > Dharmapada > > > > > gjlist, "Nicholas" <costa@A...> wrote: > > Dear Christopher > > You made an excellent point > > One can only judge their accuracy on the basis of the future > > predictions made with them. > > > > And this is the point you can keep back rectifying till the cows > come home, > > but the person who made the astounding prediction that Srila > Prabhupada > > would travel overseas and open 100 temples used Capricorn Lagna . > > > > Nicholas > > > > > Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya; Hare Krishna; Om Tat Sat > : gjlist- > > > > Your use of is subject to > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 17, 2001 Report Share Posted October 17, 2001 Drop this tit for tat stuff please. No more. -- Das Goravani Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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