No bombing zealots here please

[Guest guest]

Folks, please don't talk about bombing with zerlousness on this list.

 

If you talk about it, please at least do not show zeal.

 

There are no mighty all-good countries or players here, especially these

days, especially in this issue. This current issue is not only

materially very complex, but so also spiritually.

 

I recommend great caution when taking sides here, as well as when

speaking about killing.

 

I spent all day responding to the words "deliver the angel of

death"...that whole post, the mood of it. I've spent the whole day

festering on that. I wrote 3 long emails and deleted them, all about the

economic and political realities that the non-mainstream media is

already finding out and circulating, but you won't see it on TV.

 

Anyway, I deleted them, cuzz it's not a political/economic/conspiracy

list, this one.

 

But I do want to say, that I think it's a little insensitive to jump on

the bombing bandwagon on this, an international and borderless list.

There are people on this list in all of the free Arab countries. Please

respect them by not talking like that. It's a bit close to home.

 

That's just one of many reasons. Believe me.

 

 

Thank you,

 

das goravani

[Guest guest]

>But I do want to say, that I think it's a little insensitive to jump on

>the bombing bandwagon on this, an international and borderless list. There

>are people on this list in all of the free Arab countries. Please

>respect them by not talking like that. It's a bit close to home.

 

 

Thank you dear brother Das!

 

Namaste'

 

with love,

 

[Guest guest]

Visvanath:

 

In your post you call the US a "fascist blight on the world." How dare you?

 

Max

[Guest guest]

gjlist, Das Goravani <das@g...> wrote:

>

> Folks, please don't talk about bombing with zerlousness on this list.

>

> If you talk about it, please at least do not show zeal.

>

> There are no mighty all-good countries or players here.........

> That's just one of many reasons. Believe me.

>

>

> Thank you,

>

> das goravani

 

Om Amrtesvaryai Namah!

 

Namaste all!

 

thank you so much Dasji for that posting re bombing....even in our

pain, we do not have the right to long for the punishment of innocent

people in other countries....you have expressed my feelings exactly in

this!!! i'm in Canada as you know...but was just as appalled by the

strange events a couple weeks ago as America has been...and equally

appalled at the jingoistic "patriotic" Nationalist approach by many of

the media, and too, many of the ordinary folks....we need to exercise

EXTREME dispassion, and Discernment...VIVEKA...to see the rights and

wrongs here...it is not so cut and dried as the politicians would like

us to believe...and when i see Americans just Buying all that

nationalistic fervour...and demanding such a violent reaction i am

pained and sorrowed by their insensitivity....

 

it is not appropriate to respond in kind to such insane attacks...it

is more appropriate to discover WHY such people feel the overwhelming

"need" to "punish" the US....as was said by others...it was NOT

Canada, or the UK, or France, or... who were chosen to be the

"victims" of this terrorist attack...and there are many very GOOD

reasons why the US has been chosen...mostly due to their capitalists,

their World Bank, their WTO...their uncaring industrialists, who abuse

and mistreat all the peoples of the world, in the US as well as in the

Third World...as well as in Canada and the UK....there is a very

strong anger from much of the world at the US's apparent uncaring

approach to world politics...at their constant attempts to run the

entire world according to their version of reality....a version of

reality which ONLY the US and some other WESTERN countries can even

share...

 

The rest of the world is left out...victims of our capitalistic,

aggressive policies....

 

Instead of punishing the world for not appreciating us, we should

rather ask ourselves "WHY" we are regarded in such a hated

manner...and REALLY attempt to get to the bottom of this...by treating

the rest of the world in a fair, democratic, and equal way....

 

When the tragedy in New York and Washington happened...when i saw the

news about it...even though i was feeling very shocked and sad for the

victims of the suicide attacks...at the same time i couldn't HELP BUT

FEEL that the US has DESERVED Exactly what it got!!!! (and i STILL

feel that way...and i am a FRIEND to the US!!!)

 

i don't mean the individual people, who are in most cases

innocent...but the Government, and the Corporate world are in all

senses ENTIRELY GUILTY...and have indeed gotten off VERY LIGHTLY...if

this is all that happens to remind them that they are NOT appreciated

everywhere in the world....

 

Canadians, even, have many bones to pick with the US over trade, and

Politics, and aggressive controlling of our economy....the IMF

directions to our Country (which is largely US controlled) has

resulted in many unnecessary hardships to Canadians (and many other

world peoples..) to use the power of credit to control others is

despiccable!!! to use the power of credit to advance your own

political ideas, even at the expense of the poorest people in the

world is so disgusting that no words will suffice to describe my

feelings!!!

 

the US has gone from a Great nation promoting Freedom and Democracy to

a great fascist blight upon the earth...so feel many people ALL OVER

THE WORLD...and until this fascism, this multinational corporate

fascism is addressed in a MEANINGFUL way...terrorists will continue to

be a threat....Only when the Nation has purified itself of all the

negative, evil thinking politicians and plutocrats, will the

ammunition for the terrorists be exhausted...until that day, the US

can expect opposition and violence to be the orders of the day from

the dissatisfied, unhappy, and abused nations of the world....the US

will find itself alone...surrounded by enemies if the present policies

of self-aggrandisement, and exploitation of the world's peoples

continues.....Even Canada will NOT be your friend if you continue your

fascist abusive policies....

 

Self-examination rather than revenge is the order of the day!

i implore my American friends to get off the band wagon of revenge and

violence...the Buck has to stop somewhere....let it be with the

self-examination and repair of American world policies...let the world

of Peace and Love begin with each one of us...if we wish to have a

world of Peace, we MUST REALLY start with our own hearts!!!!

 

in the Divine Mother's Love

and in Her Service

 

as ever

your own Self,

 

visvanathan

 

 

Om Amrtesvaryai Namah!!

[Guest guest]

Om Amrtesvaryai Namah!!

 

Namaste all!

 

further to my posting above re bombing...i am copying and pasting a

wonderful post that appeared on the Ammachi e list which i thought was

exactly the right approach...see below:

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Bomb them with butter, bribe them with hope.

 

 

This idea was taken directly from the Story Teller class on World Events

 

2001 and expanded by Jay Wilder. Thanks, Jay - Bix Blankeship

 

 

 

Bomb them with butter, bribe them with hope.

 

 

 

A military response, particularly an attack on Afghanistan, is exactly

 

what the terrorists want. It will strengthen and swell their small but

 

fanatical ranks.

 

Instead, bomb Afghanistan with butter, with rice, bread, clothing and

 

medicine. It will cost less than conventional arms, poses no threat of

 

US casualties and just might get the populace thinking that maybe the

 

Taliban don't have the answers. After three years of drought and with

 

starvation looming, let's offer the Afghani people the vision of a new

 

future. One that includes full stomachs.

 

Bomb them with information. Video players and cassettes of world

 

leaders, particularly Islamic leaders, condemning terrorism. Carpet the

 

country with magazines and newspapers showing the horror of terrorism

 

committed by their "guest". Blitz them with laptop computers and DVD

 

players filled with a perspective that is denied them by their

 

government. Saturation bombing with hope will mean that some of it gets

 

through. Send so much that the Taliban can't collect and hide it all.

 

The Taliban are telling their people to prepare for Jihad. Instead,

 

let's give the Afghani people their first good meal in years. Seeing

 

your family fully fed and the prospect of stability in terms of food and

 

a future is a powerful deterrent to martyrdom. All we ask in return is

 

that they, as a people, agree to enter the civilized world. That

 

includes handing over terrorists in their midst.

 

In responding to terrorism we need to do something different. Something

 

unexpected..something that addresses the root of the problem. We need

 

to take away the well of despair, ignorance and brutality from which the

 

Osama bin Laden's of the world water their gardens of terror.

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

i hope that this is of some use to all of you!!

 

In the Divine Mother's Love,

and in Her Service,

 

as ever,

your own self,

 

visvanathan

 

Om Amrtesvaryai Namah!!!

[Guest guest]

gjlist, Vogueshots@a... wrote:

>

> Visvanath:

>

> In your post you call the US a "fascist blight on the world." How

dare you?

>

> Max

 

Om Amrtesvaryai Namah!!

 

Namaste Max!!

 

how dare i tell the truth????????? easily!!!!!!!!!!!

 

the truth shall set us free...but violence and oppression which are

daily used by your government and corporations to oppress the peoples

of the world, just so that you may eat your MacDonald's burgers in

peace shall only perpetuate the struggles of all peoples who feel

abused by those policies....

 

instead of reacting blindly to my statements, perhaps dear brother,

you might look a little MORE DEEPLY into US policies which promote

such terrorist attacks upon your country!!!!!!!

 

if you look a little more deeply, you will see most clearly that the

US IS a fascist blight upon the world....look past TIME, and

NEWSWEEK.....look into the eyes of the starving and abused peoples all

over the world...and ask yourself if more could be done in a peaceful

and loving way to help to raise them up from the poverty which US

Capitalists have forced them into....use your heart and see what is

the truth in this matter dear brother!!!!

 

i do not LIGHTLY use such names...but the truth remains that at the

current time the US is increasingly a POLICE state...a Fascist

Corporate Criminal in world politics...instead of asking how i dare to

criticise your beloved fascist country, just examine WHY i have said

it....ask WHO is really running your and my countries...it is NOT

government by the people, of the people, and for the people...it is

government by the corporations, for the corporations, and of the

corporations and may God have mercy upon you if you question the state

of affairs.....

 

Your jingoistic attitude re violence and revenge is EXACTLY WHAT I WAS

REFERRING TO!!!!

 

Try to look deeper into your own heart to see the pain therein...and

rather than reacting in anger and violence, just try to see WHY People

all over the world hold the US in such hatred and disdain....it is NOT

for NO REASON that the US is so universally hated all around the

world....examine just WHY this is so, and you will see a chain of

illegal, and unconscionable acts by the elected and unelected people

of power in your country...you will then see that there is a GOOD

REASON why the US is feared and hated the world over!!!

 

this said, i am a friend to the US people....and as a friend am

warning you that you have to look deeper within...and correct the

actual imbalances and abuses of the world which your country is

engaging in daily, in the name of "business"....

 

so in all conscience i have NO OTHER responsibility BUT to warn you of

your unloving and abusive policies...and suggest that until the

multinationals are NO LONGER controlling the world economy, until the

US ceases its undercover destruction of legitimately elected

governments with which it might disagree, until the elected and

unelected officials of your country actually ATTEMPT to address and

repair their world image through meaningful dialogues and realistic,

compassionate actions, so long will the US remain the fascist enemy of

all free thinking peoples in the world....it's up to you to change the

course of history in your own country...i can only suggest....that

self-examination is absolutely necessary here...not finger pointing

and bombing of innocent civilians!!! Enough is ENOUGH!!!

 

 

it's time to wake up and smell the napalm.....

 

in the Divine Mother's Love,

and in Her Service,

 

as ever

your own self,

 

visvanathan

 

Om Amrtesvaryai Namah!

[Guest guest]

Dear Dasji and List

Well said . In the great Vedic classic Srimad Bhagavatam it is mentioned

that one of the children of irreligion was harsh speech .The positive

injunction id "Satyam bhuyat priyam bhuyat " the truth should be spoken

palatably .

Kind regards

Nicholas

[Guest guest]

Dear Nicholas,

 

And the timing is right on, with Rahu trining Mercury :-) .

 

Sateesh.

 

========

 

 

-

"Nicholas" <costa

<gjlist>

28 September 2001 21:25

Re: [gjlist] Re: No bombing zealots here please

 

 

: that one of the children of irreligion was harsh speech .

[Guest guest]

Dear Sateesh

As you know I have Mercury with Mars in the 1st so when I quote S.B as

saying harsh speech is the child of irreligion well I have such a strong

impulse to speak that way myself .So thanks for the guidance .

Nicholas

-

"Sateesh Batas" <makara

<gjlist>

Saturday, September 29, 2001 7:12 AM

Re: [gjlist] Re: No bombing zealots here please

 

 

> Dear Nicholas,

>

> And the timing is right on, with Rahu trining Mercury :-) .

>

> Sateesh.

>

> ========

>

>

> -

> "Nicholas" <costa

> <gjlist>

> 28 September 2001 21:25

> Re: [gjlist] Re: No bombing zealots here please

>

>

> : that one of the children of irreligion was harsh speech .

>

>

>

> gjlist-

>

>

>

> Your use of is subject to

>

>

[Guest guest]

MacDonalds (Scottish) is spelled McDonalds (Irish)and nobody should feel

that hamburgs and fish fillets oppressive. I just drove to Walgreens,

outside of Chicago and as I looked around, I really couldn't see anything

worth hating except maybe the jerk that cut me off just before the traffic

light.

The US won't bomb anyone unless they can do it surgically and no one

in this country supports harming innocent people. Think ahead, we are all

going to move to the next plane where none of this is going to matter any

way. Why get so upset over what goes on in the physical. It really isn't

worth all the emotion that you are putting into it.

If people in other countries hate me, my kids and grandkids, I can't prevent

it. But I can refuse to hate them back. I don't understand why my life is

in danger every day from terrorist attacks when, until now, I haven't had any

enemies. But so be it, they are threatening me with 'only death.' That is

inevitable and I don't fear it.

There is but one God and we all speak to him in our own way. None of us are

wrong. Bin Laden is merely following his inner voice, but I can't believe

that what he is doing is useful to humanity or even the Arab nations. He

hates, many over there hate and whether it is me that they hate or my country

or my Government, hating and killing is not a way to praise God in anybody's

belief. Please pray for him. (Bin Laden)

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Hmm Max, u imposing ur federalism on2 others..

Defend, if u want.. Dont attack peronalities..Get a life

dude..Again ur showing ur imperialism in this list

See the article posted by CS Das

Featured Views

Published on Wednesday, September 12, 2001

The War Comes Home

by Rahul Mahajan

 

Lesley Stahl, speaking of US sanctions against Iraq:

"We have heard that a half million children have died. I mean, that's

more children than died in Hiroshima. And -- and you know, is the

price worth it?"......

 

Madeline Albright: "I think this is a very hard choice, but--WE THINK

THE PRICE IS WORTH IT"

 

No Offese, Regards, Venkat

 

> Visvanath:

>

> In your post you call the US a "fascist blight on the world." How

dare you?

>

> Max

[Guest guest]

Hi Don:

 

You said "Americans don't know the truth."

 

And you do?

 

Max

[Guest guest]

You said" America is getting bombed by terrorists because they eat meat."

 

Do you really believe that? New Zealand has lots of meat eaters, and

Australia, and , and , and (the list is quite long). These countries aren't

getting bombed by Terrorists. Do you see the error of your thinking?

 

Max

[Guest guest]

Your emotional response does nothing to answer the question that I have put

forth to you. "If meat eating (as you have stated) is the reason the US is

attacked by terrorists, why aren't all those other meat eating countries

being attacked?"

Please try and reply with logic rather than emotion.

 

Max

[Guest guest]

They hate the US because (even with our flaws) we are the light of freedom

and goodness in the world.

 

Max

[Guest guest]

I just returned to this list so that I could see what everyone was saying

about the latest events. I am not seeing alot of astrological data just more

opinions and arguments (you know what they say about opinions). Why don't we

just pray for the best and let God handle everything, do not judge or

criticize. OK? God works in mysterious ways, let us hope all this is for the

better of the world and someday maybe peace on EArth.More jyotish please.

 

my 2 cents,

Peace, Gobind

[Guest guest]

"More Jyotish please". Happy to comply. I will discuss the chart of President

Bush or the chart of the US with anyone. Charts tell the truth.

 

Max

[Guest guest]

I words have great passion and are imbued with knowledge and are the genuine

reflections of many people around the world as well as in Canada. I to live

in Canada and have mentioned my views about American foreign policy. It is

unfortunate that the media is such a powerful tool in the US, it really has

the ability to distort the truth, and the people of America have been lied

to so much how can they know what the truth is any more....

The only blame I can point to in the people is there lack of vigilance in

holding there government accountable for its policy making decisions, they

are suppose to reflect the views of the people, but instead they and their

corporate Masters manufacture consent as Noam Chompsky calls it.

It am 100 % in agreement with your assessment and how things must really

change, and if the people of America allow themselves to be manipulated by

their leaders, instead of making an effort to look for views that come from

other parts of the world, and forming their own opinions...then all we can

do is watch the show go on....

Another point I want to mention is the fact that it is not only the US who

is subject to lies, and pressures to be enslaved by Globalization, we have

our own sovereignty and media to deal with, the Globalists are working in

the shadows of many countries.

The people have to matter, we have to make the right decisions in the face

of those who have the power but choose wrongly.......

I think allot of the anti US sentiment is not at the people other than for

being ignorant of anything outside her borders....but it is directly at the

elite who are taking us all for a ride if we allow them ....

Love to all..

Don

 

-

<kasi_visvanath

<gjlist>

Friday, September 28, 2001 11:58 AM

[gjlist] Re: No bombing zealots here please

 

 

> gjlist, Das Goravani <das@g...> wrote:

> >

> > Folks, please don't talk about bombing with zerlousness on this list.

> >

> > If you talk about it, please at least do not show zeal.

> >

> > There are no mighty all-good countries or players here.........

> > That's just one of many reasons. Believe me.

> >

> >

> > Thank you,

> >

> > das goravani

>

> Om Amrtesvaryai Namah!

>

> Namaste all!

>

> thank you so much Dasji for that posting re bombing....even in our

> pain, we do not have the right to long for the punishment of innocent

> people in other countries....you have expressed my feelings exactly in

> this!!! i'm in Canada as you know...but was just as appalled by the

> strange events a couple weeks ago as America has been...and equally

> appalled at the jingoistic "patriotic" Nationalist approach by many of

> the media, and too, many of the ordinary folks....we need to exercise

> EXTREME dispassion, and Discernment...VIVEKA...to see the rights and

> wrongs here...it is not so cut and dried as the politicians would like

> us to believe...and when i see Americans just Buying all that

> nationalistic fervour...and demanding such a violent reaction i am

> pained and sorrowed by their insensitivity....

>

> it is not appropriate to respond in kind to such insane attacks...it

> is more appropriate to discover WHY such people feel the overwhelming

> "need" to "punish" the US....as was said by others...it was NOT

> Canada, or the UK, or France, or... who were chosen to be the

> "victims" of this terrorist attack...and there are many very GOOD

> reasons why the US has been chosen...mostly due to their capitalists,

> their World Bank, their WTO...their uncaring industrialists, who abuse

> and mistreat all the peoples of the world, in the US as well as in the

> Third World...as well as in Canada and the UK....there is a very

> strong anger from much of the world at the US's apparent uncaring

> approach to world politics...at their constant attempts to run the

> entire world according to their version of reality....a version of

> reality which ONLY the US and some other WESTERN countries can even

> share...

>

> The rest of the world is left out...victims of our capitalistic,

> aggressive policies....

>

> Instead of punishing the world for not appreciating us, we should

> rather ask ourselves "WHY" we are regarded in such a hated

> manner...and REALLY attempt to get to the bottom of this...by treating

> the rest of the world in a fair, democratic, and equal way....

>

> When the tragedy in New York and Washington happened...when i saw the

> news about it...even though i was feeling very shocked and sad for the

> victims of the suicide attacks...at the same time i couldn't HELP BUT

> FEEL that the US has DESERVED Exactly what it got!!!! (and i STILL

> feel that way...and i am a FRIEND to the US!!!)

>

> i don't mean the individual people, who are in most cases

> innocent...but the Government, and the Corporate world are in all

> senses ENTIRELY GUILTY...and have indeed gotten off VERY LIGHTLY...if

> this is all that happens to remind them that they are NOT appreciated

> everywhere in the world....

>

> Canadians, even, have many bones to pick with the US over trade, and

> Politics, and aggressive controlling of our economy....the IMF

> directions to our Country (which is largely US controlled) has

> resulted in many unnecessary hardships to Canadians (and many other

> world peoples..) to use the power of credit to control others is

> despiccable!!! to use the power of credit to advance your own

> political ideas, even at the expense of the poorest people in the

> world is so disgusting that no words will suffice to describe my

> feelings!!!

>

> the US has gone from a Great nation promoting Freedom and Democracy to

> a great fascist blight upon the earth...so feel many people ALL OVER

> THE WORLD...and until this fascism, this multinational corporate

> fascism is addressed in a MEANINGFUL way...terrorists will continue to

> be a threat....Only when the Nation has purified itself of all the

> negative, evil thinking politicians and plutocrats, will the

> ammunition for the terrorists be exhausted...until that day, the US

> can expect opposition and violence to be the orders of the day from

> the dissatisfied, unhappy, and abused nations of the world....the US

> will find itself alone...surrounded by enemies if the present policies

> of self-aggrandisement, and exploitation of the world's peoples

> continues.....Even Canada will NOT be your friend if you continue your

> fascist abusive policies....

>

> Self-examination rather than revenge is the order of the day!

> i implore my American friends to get off the band wagon of revenge and

> violence...the Buck has to stop somewhere....let it be with the

> self-examination and repair of American world policies...let the world

> of Peace and Love begin with each one of us...if we wish to have a

> world of Peace, we MUST REALLY start with our own hearts!!!!

>

> in the Divine Mother's Love

> and in Her Service

>

> as ever

> your own Self,

>

> visvanathan

>

>

> Om Amrtesvaryai Namah!!

>

>

>

> gjlist-

>

>

>

> Your use of is subject to

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

McDonalds not oppressive? Doesn't the slogan read over 12

million killed??? What kind of gov would condone this. If you want a

burger you should go kill it yourself. The Gov should not go to organize

slaughterhouse for you. These things are going on in the name of

"liberty & justice for all", my friend. It's no wonder we are getting

this group karma & dieing in explosions like the WTC or Hijackings when

you support animal slaughter by eating meat, serving it, transporting it

or selling it (Manu Samita) you are supporting group butchering. This

kind of activity is for the primitive aborigines who live naked in the

forest with a bow & arrow & can't make cloth or grow food grains etc., &

make a meal in a civilized manner w/o killing. This animal slaughter in

itself is a form of terrorism going on being preformed by Americans &

everyone else in the world. As they sew, so shall they reap was the

saying of Christ. If we want to stop terrorism I think we need look in

the mirror start with ourselves and clean up our own backyard.

On the other hand I don't think terrorists who bombed the WTC

should not be found and punished. In Vedic society there are military

who are supposed to protect & punish the wicked & protect the innocent

from such attacks & see that all citizens including are little friends

the animals are protected. It's better that terrorists are punished now

because in there next life they will have to suffer much greater

otherwise and will have to take birth as a worm in stool or some other

horrific kind of Karma.

It's all controlled by the Supreme Will of the Divine Father

Sri Krsna. You can't beat the house as they say.

 

 

 

Yours truly,

manvantara

[Guest guest]

Everyone's going to get what they've got coming to them! One way

or the other. Fate/Karma can manifest in many different ways & forms.

Who can fully understand such intricate laws? Only God knows. Perhaps it

will be a train or car accident for them. Any good Vedic Astrologer can

understand this and read a chart to give us some insight why this is

going on. This is for simpletons my friend. That's my point. If you

don't think it's a crime you probably haven't visited a slaughter house

lately my friend.

 

 

With Regards,

manvantara

 

You said" America is getting bombed by terrorists because they eat

meat."

 

Do you really believe that? New Zealand has lots of meat eaters, and

Australia, and , and , and (the list is quite long). These countries

aren't

getting bombed by Terrorists. Do you see the error of your thinking?

[Guest guest]

I know enough of the truth Max.... I am sure there are Americans that also

know the truth. I concede my error of speaking in general terms.... What I

am trying to address is the fact that most Americans are so bombarded by the

media that they are seldom able to get information that is not contaminated

by agendas ...vs. ..receiving unbiased reports of events.

One's perception is one's karma, one's ability to grasp truth is to some

degree dependant one the evolution of that particular soul, whether speaking

in terms of relative truth or TRUTH is its ultimate sense. The truth I was

referring to was the relative truth of what may be America karma or

perception. What I know Max is that the perception of the average American

is different from most others in the world, and their interests are not

Divinely imbued to be resistant to consequences...

If you or others are not able to see the connection of the events to

anything America may done done in the past by its foreign policies, then

perhaps that is your karma. Sometimes only something as powerful as Grace

can lift us up to the point where we can detach enough from our vested and

cherished opinions and see a deeper and more meaningful connection to

things. I unfortunately am not a Guru and cannot dispense such shakti, but

I do see it as my duty in as far as I am able to show the path as

recommended by such great sources as the Gita...etc..

Whether you are aware of it or not Max there are a few that hold most of the

cards, and they are playing not only with the lives of thousands in other

countries, but millions in your own... and they do NOT have the interest of

the people at heart. We are in dark times, and what you are being led into

is what I am pointing out as being opposed to truth.

The truth is they allow this to happen, I wounds even dare to suggest that

they encouraged it as a pretext to further they own agenda of increasing

their power, and doing so with the approval of the masses. Just as they

encouraged Saddam to invade the British puppet government of Kuwait, so that

it could further its interests in the gulf, since the Russians were still

licking there wounds from Afghanistan. Funded primarily by the CIA, and

various US fund raisers.

Max the truth is, you probably don't want to know the truth...

With all due respect I don't blame you....

Regards

 

 

-

<Vogueshots

<gjlist>

Saturday, September 29, 2001 11:09 AM

Re: [gjlist] Re: No bombing zealots here please

 

 

>

> Hi Don:

>

> You said "Americans don't know the truth."

>

> And you do?

>

> Max

>

>

> gjlist-

>

>

>

> Your use of is subject to

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

OK, here we go. It is all right to blow 7,000 people to bits but not

cows? And as for the rumor mongering. No one in America has any idea what

is actually going on in Afghanistan, nor do you. It is all rumors and

emotions, but I can tell you this much. They have sent in Delta Force. If

you have never heard of Delta Force, you should research it. It is a

'terrorist group" who DO NOT kill women or children. They target their prey

and eliminate them quickly and quietly, then the disappear into the night

like cats. I have met one of them in my life and he scared the hell out of

me, psycho.

The US government and the people of this great country do not want war, more

then that, they do not want any more innocent people killed by terrorists

attacks. How can we prevent that? What is your suggestion? The people in

this country are already praying in every religion known to mankind, do you

have any other suggestions? You seem to be very emotional about this, but so

are lots of other people. The difference with this country is that the

government will take steps to protect its people. If they don't, they simply

don't get reelected. It is that simple. The country that houses Hiroshima

and Nagasaki are assisting us, what is your take on that? I don't know how

many Americans you know, but I can assure you that we are just average human

beings with no hidden agendas. We marry, work to have food for our families,

work in our gardens, take care of our old, worship God, or not, it is an

individual choice (we can do that in this great country), we can choose to

eat meat, or not, again, it is the choice of each person. Many of us DO NOT

eat meat, but we don't judge or condemn those who do. It is a country of

choices, not dictatorship.

If McDonalds offends you, consider this: If no one ate meat, they

would go out of business. It is a persons free will that allows them to walk

into McDonald and order a hamburger. You don't do it and I don't do it, but

you can't blame the US for all the people in every country of the world that

buy hamburgers, or steaks or pork chops or sausage.

Bin Laden has sworn a holy war against America, which holds every

religion in the world including his own. Doesn't that strike you as odd?

What is your explanation of that?

We can't return to the 13th century like Afghanistan did. The human

race will never again be content with letting people starve, subjugating

women or being deprived of our rights as humans. The United Nations was in

Afghanistan helping the starving people. Explain to me what happened to

them. I am refraining from bashing the religion of the terrorist extremists

because I am an American and we believe that all people have a right to

worship God in their own way. Killing innocents under the guise of religion?

It is bad enough that people are killed in a war but extreme when they are

killed because of where they were born

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

First of all, please consider that Americans are not brainless infants. Do

we know what is going on? Yes, we do. Those of us who do not spend our time

in front of the boob tube and actually read have a good idea of what is going

on. First of all, the people who were in power during the Gulf War have

pretty much been put out to pasture and we have many new people running the

Government. Whereas, the countries you are referring to pretty much have the

same people in power as they had 10 or 11 year ago. You are blaming people

who aren't there any more. You can't change the world, and isn't it better

for our karma to meditate and leave worldly things behind. Just us and God.

There isn't anything else and getting involved in worldly things doesn't help

us much.

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Dear HGirl,

As far as I know, in this group, eveybody posted his reasons

to the ROOT cause for Terrorism. Again US = {politicians,

Corporate world, Law Makers} Here we need to distinguish

US from normal Americans. Nobody is disliking Americans,

nor hating them too.

 

What is the Root cause of Terrorism. Some People has asked

us to think about that. How many of us can drive on US roads,

if they remove the traffic symbols/marks. I can say "Most

of the people would meet an accident" It is not the case

in the developing countries/3rd word countries

What is the lesson we have to learn from this story.

Lesson: Thats America

 

 

>OK, here we go. It is all right to blow 7,000 people to

>bits but not cows?

 

well, of 7000, 45% are from non-US countries. Of course, my

undergrad friend was missing in WTC.

 

Regarding Cow Slaughtering aka Himsa:

 

What are the minimum ethical qualifications to become astrologer?

Again, we have to recall Dharma, Artha, Kama, Moksha, as somebody

mentioned about these 4 things to answer to some provocative Guy.

 

Moksha based Kama, not on the foundations of DHARMA (cf: Somebody

wrote this in previous mails) is Adharma.

 

This is a Vedic astrology list.

 

DHARMA: Dont kill creatures "wantedly". like slaughtering

cows/chickens et al

 

Learning Astrology with no Dharmic Foundations does not make

sense to me.

 

Look at Prasna Marga, translated by BV Raman, on first few pages,

the authorexplains the qualifications of astrologers.

 

One more Question: How many of Indians are REALLY hindus..I can

say the real hindus are very small amount. How many of Indians

are invoking the fire deity every day. Again Adharma

 

So, We need to learn Divine Sciences based on the foundations

of DHARMA

 

Hence, slaughtering COWS/Chicken/Pigs/Goat etc is Adharma/

 

 

 

> And as for the rumor mongering. No one in America has any

> idea what is actually going on in Afghanistan, nor do you.

 

Media, money, politics.. Is Media Fair? Let us recall last

presidential elections

 

 

> It is all rumors and

> emotions, but I can tell you this much. They have sent in

> Delta Force. If you have never heard of Delta Force, you

> should research it. It is a ''terrorist group" who DO NOT

> kill women or children. They target their prey and eliminate

> them quickly and quietly, then the disappear into the night

> like cats. I have met one of them in my life and he scared

> the hell out of

> me, psycho.

 

 

Terrorist adj : characteristic of someone who employs

terrorism (especially as a political weapon);

"terrorist activity" n : a radical who employs terror

as a political weapon cf: www.dictionary.com

 

See, There is the required term Political Motive.

 

Just sending delta forces solves the ROOT problem.

It is just revenge. Mani Karma already posted few messaged

regarding this. He also wrote a poem. You can recollect

the same. Thanks to Mani

 

 

 

 

> The US government and the people of this great country do

> not want war, more then that, they do not want any more

> innocent people killed by terrorists attacks.

 

Recall, CS Das Post: Featured Views by Rahul Mahajan.

You can hv some idea.1 million innocent people died

in Iraq. Did CNN/BBC reported on this?

The fault is with Iraq regime, not with Iraqi innocents.

Amen

 

 

These terrorists were Freedom Figheters, when they were

fighting agnst USSR.Bin Laden was freedom fighter. Again

we hv to apply the common astrology principle Desa-Kala

-Pathra

 

context: Afgan civil war

for americans: Bin Laden and the mujaheddens were freedom

fighters.

for USSR: Terrorists

 

Now:

for americans: the same bin laden is terrorist

 

Where is wrong. What went wrong.

 

Answer: Adaptive fellows, Avakasavada

 

 

US did not want Gulf war? What are the root causes for GULF

war..due to puppet goverments.

 

Again, today I happened to see in some south asian news paper

saying that "UK dont like to disclose the papers related to

the disappearance of Subhas Chandra Bose". It is claiming

that it will loose friends, if they wanna disclose. Is it

fair?

 

 

Everybody on the earth wants to be lead peaceful life.

Everybody wants to be prosperous. Nobody would like to kill

themselves. But what is the reason to sacrifice themselves.

Some may claim that it is due to Negative/fundamentalistic

transliterattion of few things. Well, Why they are

misinterpreting. What is the reason to produce such fallacies.

Let us look at the ROOT cause

 

 

 

> How can we prevent that? What is your suggestion?

> The people in this country are already praying in every

> religion known to mankind, do you have any other suggestions?

 

See Mani posts regarding this. He advised some nice ideas.

But u want asprin.

 

 

> You seem to be very emotional about this, but so are

> lots of other people.

 

hmm, Moon effect.

 

 

> The difference with this country is that the government

> will take steps to protect its people.

 

Friends, dont consider it as racist question:

How many whites in US consider non-whites as Americans.

A Honest answer is the solution. Killed one sikh in Arizona

 

 

> If they don't, they simply don't get reelected. It is that

> simple.

 

I dont know about this. I am not from Florida:-)

 

 

> The country that houses Hiroshima and Nagasaki are assisting

> us, what is your take on that?

 

Here, nobody is against Americans. They expressed the opinions

abt the ROOT cause of Terror

 

>I don't know how many Americans you know, but I can assure

> you that we are just average human beings with no hidden agendas.

 

hmm, We dont have hidden agendas. Everybody wants to be prosperous.

 

 

> We marry, work to have food for our families, work in our gardens,

> take care of our old, worship God, or not, it is an individual

> choice (we can do that in this great country), we can choose to

> eat meat, or not, again, it is the choice of each person.

 

hmm, Again, Axiom of Choice = Unfair in International Politics

 

Regarding, Meat eating: The principle applies to everybody on the

earth. Nobody is singled out USA. They are trying to give Karmic

reasoning.There are Brahmins, who cant live with out pork in India.

The principle applies to everybody. Dont worry about this.

 

>Many of us DO NOT eat meat, but we don't judge or condemn those

> who do. It is a country of choices, not dictatorship.

 

Group Karma, Hell of Shoola

 

> If McDonalds offends you, consider this: If no one ate meat

> they would go out of business. It is a persons free will that

> allows them to walk into McDonald and order a hamburger.

> You don't do it and I don't do it, but you can't blame the US

> for all the people in every country of the world that

> buy hamburgers, or steaks or pork chops or sausage.

 

Apply your principle on Iraq people.(not meat eating)

Iraq politicians shud be punished, but 1 million innocents died

Who got punished in that war. Innocents in Iraq.

 

hence CONTRADICTION. You r contradicting your self.

 

Contradiction: A and Not(A) = VOID

 

 

> Bin Laden has sworn a holy war against America, which

> holds every religion in the world including his own.

 

mujahediins agnst USSR was also Holy War. What happened to ur

thinking.

US wanna benifit outta this situation at that time

Oh Thinking! Where is thy Sincerity:-)

 

> Doesn't that strike you as odd?

> What is your explanation of that?

 

 

> We can't return to the 13th century like Afghanistan did.

> The human race will never again be content with letting people

> starve, subjugating women or being deprived of our rights as humans.

 

hey, all the religious principles are same.

1. Thou shalt not look at thy neighbours Wife, What happened to

DHARMA.

free sex = free world

alt.lifestyles/BDSM/Swinging/gay/lesbo/transexuals = Human rights

Oh Dharma! Where is thy Adharma

Free to what extent

 

 

 

 

> The United Nations was in Afghanistan helping the starving people.

 

Good. Help Iraq too(in unbiased way).

 

> Explain to me what happened to them.

> I am refraining from bashing the religion of the terrorist

extremists

> because I am an American and we believe that all people have a

right to

> worship God in their own way. Killing innocents under the guise of

> religion?

 

killed innocents under the name of War. ex: Iraq, Panama city

Killed innocents under the name of CRUSADE(origin from CROSS:

in the name of Jesus)

 

 

> It is bad enough that people are killed in a war but extreme

> when they are killed because of where they were born

 

With Occult Wishes,

Pazuzu.