Depression

[Guest guest]

Hello Andrew,

 

Though the post is addressed to Wendy but still some of the issues you

raised in the instant mail were really worthy and need to be appreciated.

 

There is absolutely no doubt that in a group like what we have here, we have

beginners, intermediates, advanced category of astrologers amidst us. The

problem arises when people start reciting a text theoretically without

understanding it practically.

 

I am not commenting on the study of Wendy's Chart because it is for Wendy to

answer you on that. What I want to stress here is that every combination can

be understood with a positive attitude, finding out positivities and

negativities too. But why not stress on positivities, whcih is the ultimate

goal, one wants to attain, if he pursues astrology seriously.

 

with best regards and good wishes,

 

manoj

 

 

>" Andrew Lynn" <skinbags

>gjlist

><gjlist>

>Re: [gjlist] Depression

>Thu, 10 May 2001 19:45:54 +1000

>

>Dear Wendy

>

>Some of the misleading comments I have seen written about your chart would

>be funny if the people making them didn't consider themselves serious

>astrologers. It is clear many people do not know the ABC of astrology and

>should not post comments on a chart unless they are sure they know what

>they

>are talking about. To simply quote a sloka or a yoga from an ancient text

>and then apply it simplistically to a chart shows extreme ignorance.

>

>Your chart shows the 10th sign of Capricorn rising with the lagna lord

>located in the intellectual sign of Gemini in the growing 6th house of work

>and service. The lagna lord is excellently placed in the 9th house from

>natal Moon in the nakshatra of birth yogi planet Mars in the sign of both a

>friend and an exalted 9th lord Mercury. Mars in the 5th house gives a

>piercing and sharp intellect and Mars is in close trine to exalted Mercury

>who is also well placed in the 9th house from lagna and 12th house of

>moksha

>from the Moon. The 9th lord is in the 9th house exalted giving Lakshmi

>yoga.

>

>The Moon is excellently placed in the 10th house in good aspect to the

>lagna

>lord and Jupiter is exalted in the 7th house and 10th house from the Moon

>once again forming an excellent Raja yoga. This association of Jupiter and

>Rahu is a brilliant combination as their dispositor is in the 10th house

>and

>both fall in the nakshatra of Mercury the 9th lord who is exalted. The

>dispositors of the nodes are in good aspect and the nakshatra lords are

>also

>in good aspect. The Moon in the 10th house is excellent in the nakshatra of

>Rahu as Rahu forms a powerful raja yoga in the 10th house from Moon with

>exalted Jupiter.

>

>Once again the navamsha is very strong with the lagna lord Mercury in the

>9th house in good aspect to Jupiter and Rahu. The rashi lagna lord is

>exalted in the navamsha with the karaka planet Venus which is in its own

>navamsha. Your atmakaraka is Jupiter and is exalted in the nakshatra of the

>9th lord Mercury and placed in the 10th house from the Moon associated with

>Rahu. This is a great Raja Yoga. Jupiter is neecha in the navamsha but

>placed in the navamsha of Saturn who is a strong planet for you so will do

>no harm. Neecha planets are often the best planets in a chart and cannot be

>interpreted in a simplistic fashion like I see people doing. The nature of

>every planet must be considered before making any comments on what its

>effects will be in a chart.

>

>Transit Saturn is now exactly on your 8th house cusp from natal Moon and

>Jupiter is also in the 8th house from the Moon. This is hard for you as

>Saturn is also lagna lord. Mars is now 1 day away from being stationary so

>you should have known better not to pick arguments at this time as you were

>always going to get a pounding. I have you in Mercury/ Sun period and the

>Sun is 8th lord afflicted by the aspects of the argumentative Mars and the

>planet of depression Saturn. As great enemy of the Sun this transit of

>Saturn is a hard one in the Sun's sub period. Saturn is in bad aspect to

>both the Moon and Sun and also transiting the nakshatra ruled by the Sun. A

>lot of 8th house influences on your mind in the 5th house of enjoyments

>from

>the lagna.

>

>You are under some malefic influence and we all should feel for you rather

>than standing in judgement. I am also concerned with people using and

>teaching the use of the divisional charts which require such a small margin

>of time to be actually correct. Even if there is six people at a birth you

>will get six different birthtimes unless they have synchronised their

>watches exactly to GMT. Then you must decide what constitutes a birth-

>first

>breath, cutting of the umbilical cord, the appearence of the head ?? Often

>many minutes pass between these things and if not present at the birth we

>must hope the nurse wrote down the time accurately and was not rushing out

>to tell the waiting father of his new child or washing her hands etc.

>

>Then there is the question of the ayanamsha which is still not 100% clear

>no

>matter what we think. For example, Sri Yukteswar gives a 1 degree

>difference

>from Lahiri and Krishnamurti and he was an enlightened man. Who can say he

>was wrong ? I have recently seen reference to D60 and even D108 on the list

>which I think other than an intellectual concept is silly to try to

>interpret. Many beginners and newcomers to Vedic astrology read the list

>and

>I often wonder what they think when they see such petty bickerings from

>people who claim to be religious and on the spiritual path.

>

>I have a large collection of ancient texts on astrology and find them

>helpful but also confusing. I think we must learn to differ between a

>principal and the manifestation of a principal. The ancient texts should be

>seen in terms of principals and not apply each sloka or yoga literally and

>dogmatically to every chart we come across. A part is not the whole and no

>planet, yoga or sloka should be taken in isolation as there may be an

>aspect

>that will completely change the manifestation of the basic principal given

>in the text.

>

>Then there is the point that we do not really know what any old sage

>actually said because we were not there ourselves to hear it. We only have

>second and third hand texts of what they were suppossed to have said. I

>recently read "The Kama Sutra" by Richard Burton who was responsible for

>many translations of the old texts from Sanskrit to English. It gives a

>good

>idea of just how difficult a job this was. Firstly, he had to search India

>for a number of the same text he was to translate. He found they were

>always

>different and often incomplete. He then hired a number of Pundits skilled

>in

>Sanskrit to translate the text into English and there was always many

>disagreements on what the author meant to say. Once translated by the

>Pundits the text then had to be rewritten by a native speaker of English

>for

>clarity. Finally, Burton would once again rewrite the text to stamp his own

>thoughts on it and give it his style and color.

>

>If you look at the translations of Parashara's work, we get many different

>versions which often differ on certain aspects of interpretation. To say

>Parashara said this or that is wrong. It would be more correct to say

>"Parashara allegedly said................." We do not apply the laws found

>in ancient law books until we have carefully checked them to see if they

>are

>still relevent. We would certainly not apply them unless relevent to the

>case before the court. Astrology laws should be treated the same way and be

>put under careful scrutiny until proved correct.

>

>Misunderstandings have seen two of the most experienced astrologers leave

>the list which can only have a negative result for all of those who depend

>on it for reliable information. We all should remember each and every

>horoscope has the capacity for good or bad depending on many factors. To

>see

>people applying principals recklessly worries me as Vedic astrology is the

>real loser in the end. We must endevour to set aside our own prejudices and

>communicate in a humble environment free of egos. We are all babies to

>astrology and must remember the ancient Rishis said it takes many lifetimes

>to become competent in this divine science. This is the one thing I believe

>is 100% correct.................................

>

>

>Andrew

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>gjlist-

>

>

>

>Your use of is subject to

>

>

 

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[Guest guest]

Namaste Listmembers,

Dopamine is a chemical that carries electrical

impulses across the great divide of synapses. Serotonin is manufactured in

the small bowel and carried by a vitamin(which I forget off hand)to be

stored in the pineal gland. It has many functions other than 'feel good'. It

is secreted in tune with the bodies needs under stress and also plays a role

similar to dopamine. Both are neuro-transmiters.

Astrologically, of course we look to the Moon as mind, but I think

Mercury and maybe even Sun need to be considered.

***Das, did your Father die from Parkinson's or Huntington's Chlorea?.

I have read the 'genetic defect' theory as it applies to the Irish and

Australian Aborigines...quaint coincidence that these races have been the

most systematically oppressed and cruelly treated for centuries. Both have

bordered on genocide. So that would have to get you down after

awhile!..ancestoral karma?

Also, I am glad you are feeling well,(Sun exalted in the first, yeah!!).I

don't want to rain on your parade BUT beware the 'drop' that should visit

within 2 to 3 weeks. Don't beat yourself up. Of course I am bias through

experience, but 'alternative' remedies need to be slowly eased into your regime.

Best Wishes,

Ann.

[Guest guest]

Wendy:

 

I think you've encapsulated it well. If you throw in the 4th and 5th house

afflictions (pick your favourite to rule the mind), then we have a good

common sense approach to depression that typifies the 80:20 rule. a few

simple things in the rashi chart will reveal about 80% of the "reality" of

depression. Vargas and other auxiliary techniques (Jaimini or otherwise!)

will only likely add the final 20% to the analysis. In fact, the planetary

afflictions themselves may account for 80% of what's going on even without

the houses.

 

Chris

 

At 11:11 AM 5/10/01 +0800, you wrote:

>For all those who suffer depression. Look to see if Moon is afflicted by

>Malefics. Saturn in particular will bring depression. Ketu too will swallow

>up our emotions (difficult to diagnose causes, difficult to treat). Rahu can

>lead to obsessive mental tendencies (obsessed with a cause, like Gandhi).

>Mars can lead to mental conflicts such as, rage, volatility, etc...rather

>than depression.

>

>Wendy

>

>

>

>gjlist-

>

>

>

>Your use of is subject to

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Namaste list members,

Here are the birth data of a friend of mine who was seriously depressive

from Sun/Rahu to Sun/Ketu and also in Moon/Moon Dasha/Bhukti periods.

Actually she only recently stopped taking anti-depressiva. Besides

Depression, her life is quite unusual and exceptional in several other ways

as well!

 

Martina, March 20, 1969 Düsseldorf, Germany, at 19:10 pm (51N12, 6E47)

 

Looking forward to your opinions,

love,

Liliana

 

 

>Christopher Kevill <ckevill

>gjlist

>gjlist

>Re: [gjlist] Depression

>Thu, 10 May 2001 10:55:34 -0400

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>Wendy:

>

>I think you've encapsulated it well. If you throw in the 4th and 5th house

>afflictions (pick your favourite to rule the mind), then we have a good

>common sense approach to depression that typifies the 80:20 rule. a few

>simple things in the rashi chart will reveal about 80% of the "reality" of

>depression. Vargas and other auxiliary techniques (Jaimini or otherwise!)

>will only likely add the final 20% to the analysis. In fact, the planetary

>afflictions themselves may account for 80% of what's going on even without

>the houses.

>

>Chris

>

>At 11:11 AM 5/10/01 +0800, you wrote:

> >For all those who suffer depression. Look to see if Moon is afflicted by

> >Malefics. Saturn in particular will bring depression. Ketu too will

>swallow

> >up our emotions (difficult to diagnose causes, difficult to treat). Rahu

>can

> >lead to obsessive mental tendencies (obsessed with a cause, like Gandhi).

> >Mars can lead to mental conflicts such as, rage, volatility, etc...rather

> >than depression.

> >

> >Wendy

> >

> >

> >

> >gjlist-

> >

> >

> >

> >Your use of is subject to

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>gjlist-

>

>

>

>Your use of is subject to

>

>

 

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[Guest guest]

Dear Liliana, dear listmembers,

oh, what a chart! One could already become depressive oneself while working

at it.

Hoping, that other members of the list will also work for it, let me give

you some unusual looks to Martina`s horoscope, hence I believe, that the

purists beyond you will give the other part. So I won`t have to repeat it

though of course I`m aware of it.

 

Lagna is the very delicate virgo, a mercury ruled sign, like in our cases of

Baby Grossberg, Lena Amelie and Leonard, ( whose gemini lagna is quite sure,

even birth was possibly 1 or 2 minutes earlier, because doctors had first to

get over the shock yet of Leonards outlook and then regarded his birthtime).

 

Martina`s Dasa/bhukti : ketu/rahu giving some bad omen.

 

The first house has been visited by some special guests, one would not like

to meet in the night..., as there are retro pluto, retro jupiter, retro

uranus - and ketu also came to this midnight special party. Imagine that

tugging: scaremonger pluto, exentric uranus (coruler in aquarius, Martina`s

6th house. The other ruler, saturn is debilitated in her 8th ), jovial

jupiter, though a bit weakend here and mysterious ketu. This alone would

make us sick!

So, mercury prefered to move into another house, but his choice was not a

good one, as he took the 6th, creating a Rogagrastha yoga, you already know

from Leonard and the others. Perhaps he did not take care of mars, hurting

him here. Otherwise this 6th house in the rasi has also some certain

strength, as it holds 39! asthakavarga points ( please compare this with

Lena Amelie) , which is highly above average, being 28 bindus and so might

give her some resistance. Also mercury here collected really outstanding 8

bindus. (moon gets 5: good) For my opinion this must lead to a very

passionate, unusual, creative and clever mind. Even mars, who got 6 bindus

here, could perhaps support the mental power and give a fiery strike to it.

 

So, mercury`s transit through Martina`s 6th house for my opinion will give

her a very passionate, engaged and creative behaviour, though there might of

course be some danger of overreaction.

 

But now we are going to find the clue for her depression, which I would call

manic- depressive:

Please follow transit mercury, which, you know, moves very fast and so can

make this breakdown nearly monthly: On his way he will now reach pisces.

Remember this is the natural 12th house, so ruling the soul and you will

find this confirmed, when looking in Martina`s Navamsa chart, where you will

see debilitated mercury, jupiter in his own sign but also restraining ketu

and restless uranus!

 

What us really has to alert however is this catastrohic ashtakavarga point

status: reaching only 14! bindus. This is the deepest number in all the

charts, I have seen until now! And now guess the bindus, mercury gained

here: zero! Catastrophic! ( moon here only has 2 bindus: bad)

So, please imagine the emotional trouble, Martina has to undergo nearly

monthly! Beeing overactive, when mercury transits aquarius and then this

endless deeply falling down into the darkness of depression. This must be

horrible!

I don`t want to discuss the other consequences of her 7th house, having this

alarming bindu status, as I am sure, you can imagine it: Marriage life also

will be catastrophic. It will be quite impossible for Martina, to lead a

lasting partnership. The sun and rahu here also are indicators for death of

partner. Remember, the 7th is a maraka house. Moon, saturn and venus, who

was stationary two days before birth could draw men`s sexual interests to

her, as she might be rather attractive. But also I would fear some danger of

suicide in this chart, regarding two Mathibramana yogas, leading to

insanity!

 

My suggestion in this case would be, carefully to regard mercury`s transit

and to adapt this abruptly emotional changing by calmly " sitting out" these

dangerous days.

Furtheron I would instead of anti depressive pills recommend her some

homeopathic treatment, because virgos may react very sensitive to chemical

products. In this case perhaps IGNATIA LM 12 (one drop in water dayly for

some time) could be an accaptable remedy, because the nature of Ignatia is

also very abruptly and contradictorily, though very intelligent, delicate

and capricious and even easily to frustrate, regarding partnership in this

case.

 

Waiting for some feedback, even of Pro`s and beginners,

best wishes, Ilona

[Guest guest]

DEAR ANDREW,

You wrote,

<We are all babies to

> astrology and must remember the ancient Rishis said it takes many

lifetimes

> to become competent in this divine science. This is the one thing I

believe

> is 100% correct.................................>

Very true, Andrew and very well said,

A birth chart indicate tendencies of Moksha and not Moksha or liberation its

self . Because an horoscope speaks about the karmas one has acquired and

destined to do with Rajsik , Tamsik and Satvik variti . these three are the

traits of Nature. Ones chart will work and speak about one's souls

involvement with this Nature and to acquire various qualities of Nature.

When involvement with the nature has gone i.e. you are liberated , horoscope

will not work. Liberation is within this body , it is not after death. A

chart with all the negative may also get liberation , but only that who

himself is at much higher plane can speak and tell about this.

But no liberated soul will come and Join Gjlist . Only those will join and

post who themselves have some defects in them. Once one is complete , why he

should speak ?

For giving predictions and guiding others there are certain rules set by

the Sages, an astrologer shall never give predictions in open, never guide a

person who does not believe you or is a student of other teacher . Guide

those who submit you to enquire , but that also in private and a

respectful manner.

I don't think that we should discuss anybody chart without his or her

permission. Even, if we should , we must not disclose his name.

 

I am late to comment due to other things making my life busy , but I am

posting this.

Regards,

Inder Jit Sahni

 

 

 

_______

 

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[Guest guest]

Inder Jit wrote:

================

When involvement with the nature has gone i.e. you are liberated , horoscope

will not work. Liberation is within this body , it is not after death. A

chart with all the negative may also get liberation , but only that who

himself is at much higher plane can speak and tell about this.

But no liberated soul will come and Join Gjlist . Only those will join and

post who themselves have some defects in them. Once one is complete , why he

should speak ?

=================================

 

Dear Inder Jit,

 

Whilst I'm not suggesting that anyone on this list is liberated

(enlightened), I do hold the view that a liberated soul will speak most

loudly of all...wherever he happens to find himself! Christ spoke to anyone

who would listen...he preached to the multitudes, as was his karma to do so.

He was persecuted and he died on the cross, as was his karma to do so.

Buddha also did not remain silent after he achieved enlightenment, but

preached to all that would listen...he also suffered bodily infirmities as

per his karma (after enlightenment). The list is endless......

 

An enlightened soul prefers to remain mute rather than speak of the blissful

truth he has found?? On the contrary, he speaks his truth to all who will

listen. I believe that as long as the soul is in this body (enlightened or

not) the body will reap the karma that is due. I am of the belief that it's

not what happens to us that causes our suffering, but rather the way we

react to it that brings us pain. To my mind an enlightened soul is not free

from karma, simply free from suffering.

 

Best Regards

Wendy

[Guest guest]

Dear Wendy,

It looks our definition of liberation varies , to my mind a liberated soul

is that soul which has attained its origin, that is it has no involvement

with three qualities of nature , these qualities of nature are working on

their own , and our pains ,karma , sufferings and happiness are due to our

involvements in these three qualities of nature(Satvik Rajsik and Tamsik)

Any soul which has attained the enlighten and is at the verge of

liberation will guide other souls preach and may become Guru to many souls.

You may put Christ, Buddha, Vivekanand and many others in it. But once it

has

complete liberation , there is no work as work is the quality of nature due

to its three qualities. A liberated soul will witness, all the work done by

nature and will be fix in the Supreme Soul and as such has nothing to

do.Liberation is within this body , but a complete liberated soul will not

remain in body for long. It will guide ,speak and will involve just before

that state.How one is involved in the three qualities of nature could be

seen

from Trinshasha chart .

By the way your Sun is in the trinshasha of Jupiter, so your soul has

emerged from Satvik quality. This trinshasha lord is exalted in your birth

chart. So your Sun has more inherent quality of Jupiter than the person in

whose chart Jupiter is in fall.

Moon is in the trinshash of Saturn , who is in the Gemini in rasi , as such

your mind is having rajsik qualities.

Though your base is quite strong but Sun being in the star of Venus kept you

involved in the worldly affairs , I imagine that you do too much love to

your near and dear ones.

These qualities of Soul and mind will play till your involvement in the

worldly affairs.But if luck is such that you become liberated, then you are

away from the bonds of all the three qualities of nature, so astrology will

not work on this account. Physical sufferings are no pains for a liberated

soul. NO doubt chart will work on this account till one's end.

With Regards,

Inder jit Sahni

 

 

 

 

 

_______

 

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[Guest guest]

Oh! Lord, that darn old mind...do you think a lobotomy would help?

 

.......kidding, Dear Inder!

 

Best Wishes

Wendy

 

 

Inder Jit Wrote:

================

By the way your Sun is in the trinshasha of Jupiter, so your soul has

emerged from Satvik quality. This trinshasha lord is exalted in your birth

chart. So your Sun has more inherent quality of Jupiter than the person in

whose chart Jupiter is in fall.

Moon is in the trinshash of Saturn , who is in the Gemini in rasi , as such

your mind is having rajsik qualities.