a test case

[Guest guest]

Dear Mani,

as I mainly look at charts diagnostically, I would say, that this man

suffers from some kind of disease connected with his reproductive organs.

For me there might be also the possibility of AIDS.

Here I give you my thoughts:

 

He has scorpio rising and the retromars is with his ascendant. Also

retroneptune, who has a tendency to create some cellulary chaos, is in his

first house. You know, that scorpio rules the reproductive organs.

His ascendant is aspected from the sun and and retrmercury, who is a maraka

because he rules the 8. house.

Sun and mercury are in 7, a marakahouse.

The man is in saturndasa.

Saturn is deleted and unaspected in the 6. house of diseases. Though it

could be good to have a malefic in the 6. house, it might be possible that

saturn lacks even this strength to help the mans´ immunity.

Saturn in aries in 6: your lascivious nature is so much excited, that you

may incur venereal disease or become a social outcaste (GJ - readings).

Saturn aspects the 8. house, the house of death together with mars.

In the 8. we find the moon in gemini, a great friend. But because of these

evil aspects, the moon is very afflicted and will not feel too happy.

An afflicted moon the 8. house could lead to sexual extremes, reproductive

and elimination ailments, chronic watery diseases, in this case (moon in

gemini) I would say that the lungs may be afflicted. ( antimonium tartaricum

must be thought for homeopatically).

Afflicted ruler of 9 in 8: feels abandoned or unsupported by the father;

ailments in the hips and lower back region. Levacy: illness might be

improved by spirituel methods.

 

Venus, his bhuktiruler is exalted in the 5. but conjoint with rahu, who

likes to destroy happiness. Sexual aberrations.

Rahu in 5: blocked tubes, veins and arteries.

For scorpions venus is a maraka as she rules their 7. and 12. house.

Becuse of venus rules the 12, there is danger of infectous diseases.

Also mercury, the ruler of 8 possibly makes prone to contagious diseases.

Venus is connected with rahu and is aspected from Ketu, who is in virgo with

jupiter, an very strong enemy for jupiter. So, jupiter will not give to much

support. Additionally jupiter is retro and gives adverse results and for

scorpions he might be a maraka.

 

So long, there is much more, but I am sure: this man is not very healthy and

for my opinion there is danger of death in the summer, when rahu, jupiter,

sun and mercury are in his 8. house, saturn in his 7. ; mars and pluto with

the ascendant and ketu in his 2. house.

His 7. house only got 19 bindus and also the 12. is weak with 22.

His sideral point of sickness is about 18° gemini just 30° away fom mercury

in his 8. with 18°30.

Ceres is just waiting in his third making a quincunx to this point of

sickness.

His point of fortune is directly on the middle of the 2. house.

The point of death is directly on neptune aspecting exactly the degrees of

rahu and ketu.

The ascendant is nearly exactly connected with the degrees of uranus, a

prenatal eclipse, the sun and the middle of his 1. and 7. house.

 

Hoping, I went not too far out of the window, Ilona

[Guest guest]

am 15.03.2001 20:20 Uhr schrieb subra unter subra:

 

> HellmannC200 wrote:

>> Dear Mani,

>> as I mainly look at charts diagnostically, I would say, that this man

>> suffers from some kind of disease connected with his reproductive organs.

>> For me there might be also the possibility of AIDS.

>> Here I give you my thoughts:

>>

>> He has scorpio rising and the retromars is with his ascendant.

>

> Dear Ilona,

>

> Sorry, you have goofed it and wasted time. The TOB is 8:25 PM NOT AM!The lagna

> is taurus. Luckily the reading is totally out, or I´ll have one more case of

> perfect reading based on totally wrong tob, which happens and always amazes

> me!

>

> I´ve checked my mail and at least at my end the details are correct! I could

> have said 20:25, but thought US people would be more happy with their way of

> expressing time. In germany we TALK in 12 hour period, but WRITE in 24!

>

> I am storing the twin case for future deeper study. I´m not a professional

> astrologer, do charts only if approached by friend or through friends, free of

> fees. I don´t have many cases, but I have two for child abuse, one actual, the

> other more "sensed" than actually experienced traumatically: the girl found

> that

> her father "tried" to get physical contact with her in a very "casual" manner,

> but it did not lead to anything physically - but she had an emotional problem

> despising her father!

>

> These things make me wish to die soon, so I can ask the Creator,"Why does all

> this have to happen?"! Very gradually I am getting closer to the Jewish

> concept

> of God: an equal mixture of love and non-love. Perhaps this is necessary, for

> we

> cannot see the day if there were no night. And knowing this, with the

> intention

> of giving absolute freedom to his children, He wants them to go through the

> mill

> and learn what to avoid! That too is love. The mint is the same, the clichee

> the

> same, but no two coins are absolutely identical. The slot-machine accepts

> some,

> rejects others! Some learn the lessons quickly and complain about the

> unnecessary length of the semester, others don´t make the grade.

>

> Abuse is abuse, but Marilyn Monroe at least "voiced" a bit of wisdom: if the

> rape is inevitable, lie back and try to enjoy it! Children are raped in many

> ways, every ad that sells them junk, every attempt to make them consumers, is

> rape. Every attempt to ram ever-increasing information into their heads is

> rape.

> To hold "courses" for children 0f six to browse in internet is rape! Every

> attempt to make miniature grown-ups out of them - practised over centuries! -

> was and is rape. Everything that robs of them of their innocence, their inner

> contact with God, their child(ish)(like) fantasies, illusions and trust in the

> goodness of Mother Earth is rape! To teach them to WIN,WIN,WIN is rape.

>

> regards

> Mani

>

>

>

> gjlist-

>

>

>

> Your use of is subject to

>

>

Sorry Mani, so things can go. What a luck for the person. I had the right

time but the wrong month! I filled in may instead of october. so I´ll try it

again, hoping with better results.

Best wishes, Ilona

[Guest guest]

HellmannC200 wrote:

> Dear Mani,

> as I mainly look at charts diagnostically, I would say, that this man

> suffers from some kind of disease connected with his reproductive organs.

> For me there might be also the possibility of AIDS.

> Here I give you my thoughts:

>

> He has scorpio rising and the retromars is with his ascendant.

 

Dear Ilona,

 

Sorry, you have goofed it and wasted time. The TOB is 8:25 PM NOT AM!The lagna

is taurus. Luckily the reading is totally out, or I´ll have one more case of

perfect reading based on totally wrong tob, which happens and always amazes me!

 

I´ve checked my mail and at least at my end the details are correct! I could

have said 20:25, but thought US people would be more happy with their way of

expressing time. In germany we TALK in 12 hour period, but WRITE in 24!

 

I am storing the twin case for future deeper study. I´m not a professional

astrologer, do charts only if approached by friend or through friends, free of

fees. I don´t have many cases, but I have two for child abuse, one actual, the

other more "sensed" than actually experienced traumatically: the girl found that

her father "tried" to get physical contact with her in a very "casual" manner,

but it did not lead to anything physically - but she had an emotional problem

despising her father!

 

These things make me wish to die soon, so I can ask the Creator,"Why does all

this have to happen?"! Very gradually I am getting closer to the Jewish concept

of God: an equal mixture of love and non-love. Perhaps this is necessary, for we

cannot see the day if there were no night. And knowing this, with the intention

of giving absolute freedom to his children, He wants them to go through the mill

and learn what to avoid! That too is love. The mint is the same, the clichee the

same, but no two coins are absolutely identical. The slot-machine accepts some,

rejects others! Some learn the lessons quickly and complain about the

unnecessary length of the semester, others don´t make the grade.

 

Abuse is abuse, but Marilyn Monroe at least "voiced" a bit of wisdom: if the

rape is inevitable, lie back and try to enjoy it! Children are raped in many

ways, every ad that sells them junk, every attempt to make them consumers, is

rape. Every attempt to ram ever-increasing information into their heads is rape.

To hold "courses" for children 0f six to browse in internet is rape! Every

attempt to make miniature grown-ups out of them - practised over centuries! -

was and is rape. Everything that robs of them of their innocence, their inner

contact with God, their child(ish)(like) fantasies, illusions and trust in the

goodness of Mother Earth is rape! To teach them to WIN,WIN,WIN is rape.

 

regards

Mani

[Guest guest]

Hi ALL!

 

The mention of meat provoked prolific response. But a truly interesting jyothish

experiment has evoked hardly any response! I got chewed up for meat, but only

two beginners have "bitten" into the case.

 

I could have given more details about the person, specified the problem. There

would have been any number of teleological investigations, dozens of

explanations for the circumstances would been given, a number of remedies

offered - of which I wouldn´t know which to recommend to the person! And a lot

of cross correspondence, with "cross" in both senses, amongst the experts!

 

I personally did not see the most important thing in this case and wanted to

know how good the experts were at the game.

 

What do I expect? Say I give my data I´d say the jyothishi should see the

following things:

 

1. Born in a respected and orthodox family, not millionaires but very well off

financially. Last child, number of older siblings (7).

2. Childhood not happy, gentle mother, tyrannical father, bad relationship with

him.

3. Good student, very good education.

4. Left home early, went to sea and had a steep career.

5. Emigrated to a western country, had initial problems but again had a very

good career.

6. Got married relatively late to a foreigner. Marriage a failure. Three

children. For many years very bad relationship with the children. Highly sexed

but totally celibate except for 12 years. Incapable of sex without love.

7. Despite very high earnings, persistent loss and finally early retirement and

a state of "living from hand to mouth".

8. Very devoted to God, but in a very unorthodox manner. Interested in all

religions and philosophies. Not afraid to question scriptures, teachings and

authority.

9. Interested in all things, sciences and humanities, logical thinker. High

sense of humour, Very tolerant and gentle by nature, but can be scathing with

the tongue. Won´t hurt a fly (literally, catch them one by one and throw them

out of the window!) but capable of eating meat. Smoker, not averse to alcohol.

Good talker and writer.

10. Skilful with the hands, inventive*, artistic and lover of music.

11. Lover of nature in all forms.

12. A natural coward, but capable of "brave" deeds to help others - not myself!

At such times I am "transformed", forget myself completely! Don´t realize that I

am in danger, concentrate only on what has to be done! It cannot be considered

as bravery, which means realizing the danger and "sacrificing" oneself, like

Horatio jumping into the Tiber to save Rome.

 

This kind of reading is what an astrologer should be able to produce. The

prediction and timing of events is secondary. Now I am forced to add the next

item to the list:

 

13. Will be disappointed by jyothishis.

 

regards

Mani

 

* I have invented many things as an engineer, including programmes for computers

before the time if PCs. All in the service of others, who got the advantage,

without remunerating me: not because of meanness, but they could not understand

what I had achieved!

 

Everybody plays CDs today. It came out of my brain! As a lover of music I was

looking for a way to record and replay music without the noises created by the

needle even in the best of record-players. I got the idea it could be done

magnetically and perhaps by laser reflection. Discussed it with a brilliant

electronic engineer I knew. But we had no money to experiment and produce a

prototype. We wrote to Philips. They thanked us for the idea, but "the present

technology cannot put your ideas into practice." Some time later my electronic

acquaintance - with whom I discussed frequently - applied for a job with Philips

and got it. Within 1 year Philips (denon) brought out the first Compact Disc,

with laser technique. I was, of course, never thought of!

 

J.C. Bose invented the radio, gave the details to Marconi "free of all cost, for

such a discovery is the inheritance of mankind, not to be sold to it!" as Bose

put it. Marconi got the Nobel Prize, Bose was not even mentioned! It is perhaps

this that ties me to Bose and defend plant-life!

[Guest guest]

Om Krishnaaya Namah,

 

Hi Mani,

 

> meat, but only

> two beginners have "bitten" into the case.

 

I think to a large extent the main problem is that nobody has enough time to

go through a chart thoroughly, and to then take the trouble to type it all

up etc. Days just fly past. I just wanted to state one thing that really

struck me about this chart, and that is the combination of Mercury, Sun and

Jupiter in the fifth forming a pretty flawless Budhaditya Yoga, and a rather

nice Dharma-Karma Adhipati Yoga. Putting it together, suggests that the

native is extremely intelligent, and in fact God absolutely packed his skull

full of brain :-) Did the native ever go to prestigious centres of

education, and has he ever had his IQ measured? If so, do you know what it

is?

 

Thanks,

 

Pursottam

[Guest guest]

Hi Mani,

 

At the risk of encouraging rebuttal from over exposure~too vociferous :-),

can I just say that (in agreement with Pursottam) it's a lot of work to

systematically go through a horoscope and tell the "whole story"...however

if a particular problem is presented then one can "zero in" on that area of

the chart...workload is reduced and the seat of the problem is uncovered

rather quickly.

 

We don't like to do more work than we have to and for me particularly (with

slow Saturn in 6th house of work) I'd respond more readily to a specific

problem than to a general chart reading...this is due solely to laziness on

my part :-)

 

Furthermore Mani, one wouldn't go to a doctor and refuse to tell him what

(in particular) was bothering him.

"You're the doctor, you tell me" is an uncooperative attitude that just

makes the doctor's task harder...doctor's would shudder at the sight of such

uncooperative patients.

 

Why should the astrologers task be any different?

If someone goes to an astrologer with a specific problem, is it unreasonable

for the astrologer to expect some cooperation, some feedback??

 

Take Care Mani,

Wendy

 

 

 

Mani wrote

===========

The mention of meat provoked prolific response. But a truly interesting

jyothish

experiment has evoked hardly any response! I got chewed up for meat, but

only

two beginners have "bitten" into the case.

 

I could have given more details about the person, specified the problem.

There

would have been any number of teleological investigations, dozens of

explanations for the circumstances would been given, a number of remedies

offered - of which I wouldn´t know which to recommend to the person! And a

lot

of cross correspondence, with "cross" in both senses, amongst the experts!

 

I personally did not see the most important thing in this case and wanted to

know how good the experts were at the game.

 

What do I expect? Say I give my data I´d say the jyothishi should see the

following things:

 

1. Born in a respected and orthodox family, not millionaires but very well

off

financially. Last child, number of older siblings (7).

2. Childhood not happy, gentle mother, tyrannical father, bad relationship

with

him.

3. Good student, very good education.

4. Left home early, went to sea and had a steep career.

5. Emigrated to a western country, had initial problems but again had a very

good career.

6. Got married relatively late to a foreigner. Marriage a failure. Three

children. For many years very bad relationship with the children. Highly

sexed

but totally celibate except for 12 years. Incapable of sex without love.

7. Despite very high earnings, persistent loss and finally early retirement

and

a state of "living from hand to mouth".

8. Very devoted to God, but in a very unorthodox manner. Interested in all

religions and philosophies. Not afraid to question scriptures, teachings and

authority.

9. Interested in all things, sciences and humanities, logical thinker. High

sense of humour, Very tolerant and gentle by nature, but can be scathing

with

the tongue. Won´t hurt a fly (literally, catch them one by one and throw

them

out of the window!) but capable of eating meat. Smoker, not averse to

alcohol.

Good talker and writer.

10. Skilful with the hands, inventive*, artistic and lover of music.

11. Lover of nature in all forms.

12. A natural coward, but capable of "brave" deeds to help others - not

myself!

At such times I am "transformed", forget myself completely! Don´t realize

that I

am in danger, concentrate only on what has to be done! It cannot be

considered

as bravery, which means realizing the danger and "sacrificing" oneself, like

Horatio jumping into the Tiber to save Rome.

 

This kind of reading is what an astrologer should be able to produce. The

prediction and timing of events is secondary. Now I am forced to add the

next

item to the list:

 

13. Will be disappointed by jyothishis.

 

regards

Mani

[Guest guest]

Dear Mani,

 

You wrote:"The mention of meat provoked prolific response. But a truly

interesting jyothish

experiment has evoked hardly any response! I got chewed up for meat, but only

two beginners have "bitten" into the case."

1) As usuall your observation is perfect. Meat-eating concept attracted more

responses because

the issue is not only of rational nature, but with strong emotion(s)

attached, and we know that the strongest power of any issue, beleif system,etc..

that gives energy - is emotional. However interesting or important certain think

maybe, by itself, without it's conneection with emotions, has litle power.

 

2)Funny, this challenge is coming from you, who are very inclined to this type

of reaction. That's good, really.

"Even eagle needs a push", doesn't it?

 

What do I expect?....1-12

 

You are right- that way we can learn more. And the list od exceptional,

giving, knowledgeable people and astrolers cntributed so much, so far, to the

List. Yes, nor many have responded to your "homework", but they did show their

expertize in the cases that they were chosen. Individualistic brats..

 

13. Will be disappointed by jyothishis.

It's OK if you decide so. Pesonally I don't see the reason: is the reason that

y. cannot give all the answers?

You can start being dissapointed right away- you put so high and picky

standards- neither jyotish nor any reading would be able to meet them. There

will always be something transcendental that no reading can cover. Should we

stop learning since we won't find all answers-ever?

 

* I have invented many things as an engineer, including programmes for

computers

before the time if PCs. All in the service of others, who got the advantage,

without remunerating me: not because of meanness, but they could not

understand

what I had achieved!- Why didn't you help them understand?

 

....... CDs today.

Innovators, artists, etc, are like children: they do have passion, do have

innovative mind, bur an adult is necessary to "give them the form" And, as

history teaches us, they would cheat the child...

They feel rightfully, because the "child" didn't have enough persistence and

conviction (to patent the invitation, at least). This is fairly masochistic

pattern, we seen from your other letters, as well.. But, there is a

gratification there- who says that there is no pleasure in masochism?

 

You kind of exhausted your action by talking about it- and the very fact that

you DID invent, seems to satisfied

you enough, to the extent that you DIDN'T have a drive to make a concept live.

You even didn't let it stay in your head- so big your desire to show the world

what you invented was! And market is immoral- we know that..

Don't be frustrated by that, dear Mani. You did get somehow compensated- as

much as you needed, I guess.

Mani, "I" was selling my paintings- in facts, somebody else did that for me: I

was able to produce, funny, but not sell..That requires different ingredients..

My uncle is one of most talented painters today- he lives mostly on family

support. And great Van Gog, he earned just $20 during his short life, supported

by brother.. Millions dollars came after his death...

 

"It came out of my brain!

I want to believe that I felt a pride in your accomplishments, not resentment.

 

Respect and love,

Anna

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Dear Wendy and Anna - and Pursottan too,

 

Thanks for answers, but as usual a certain misunderstanding has crept in. I did

NOT present the case as a request for help at all. Neil´s "problem" is certainly

the most important thing in his life, but it need not be solved at all! he can

live with it. like wanting to marry but not finding a right partner - but it is

not having cancer!

 

The list I gave was only an example of points a jyothishi should remark about.

If one consults an astrologer in India he quickly goes house by house and makes

short comments. It takes about half an hour. If many points are okay a deeper

study is made, if not, info is given and more asked.

 

All the points I listed need not be answered, only whatever is outstanding. a

short reading like: "Intelligent or dumb, good or poor career, rich or poor,

healthy or danger of some kind of illness - like you are talking about

diabetes."

 

i hoped you would just cast the chart, look at it for 10 to 15 minutes and say

whatever strikes you first. That is all, no detailed analysis. One could say

"orphan, very famous, criminal, millionaire, yogi" etc. if this is very

prominent. Pusottam has given one point. I shall not comment about its

correctness or incorrectness at present, but that is the approach I wish: what

strikes you most - and is it supported by a second evidence.

 

This is a test, not a consultation. I goofed it and want to see how the experts

fare. Giving any background will ruin the purpose.

 

BTW I did not mention my inventions to crib about lack of recognition or

remuneration. Don´t really care, that is why I did not fight for recognition.

Explaining some of the things was also not possible, for those concerned were

too "lay" to understand. I put it in as a possible point of reading, perhaps

for the 12th house: success will not bring benefit or some such thing.

 

If no one wants to play the game, okay.

 

regards

Mani

[Guest guest]

PRIVATE POST NOT INTENDED FOR LIST

==================================

 

Hi Mani,

 

A very quick shot at your test case (as I'm feeling a bit guilty for not

having a go). first this person exhibits the qualities of Venus, but in a

very unusual, or eccentric way. Unusual home environment, difficulties in

close relationships etc. Interest in enlightenment, may have unusual sexual

partners or may be celibate.

 

I focus on Venus as this is his current dasa period and I need something to

focus on. This person is interested in spiritual practices (enlightenment

etc). I think this area of his life will be very prominent at the moment,

particularly with the current transit of JU/SA/MA influencing his ascendant.

 

So, on a spiritual level, this period may be quite positive, but on a

personal, physical and emotional level I see a lot of struggle, health

issues etc. I'll tell you what else I see, and this may be why people are

not drawn to do this chart (I know I wasn't)...9th lord Saturn in 12th with

his dispositor Mars in 8th, whilst 8th lord Jupiter aspects (9th), shows

someone not tied to conventional religion...has his own (unconventional)

views.

 

Relationship with both parents is harmed.

Enough for now Mani, I'm more than a little tired.

 

Regards

Wendy

[Guest guest]

Hello Mani!

 

The problem of combust jupiter may give an unorthodox slant

to Neil's creative genius. The profession assumed by him with ketu

afflicted Venus (Lagnadhipathi) in the forth house may drive him to

activities and efforts to serve the world in the most "unacceptable

(for the orthodox)" rebellious (Moon aspected by Mars) ways. The

current incarnation seems to be solely for this learning and

experience.

 

Regards,

Arun

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 3/17/2001 10:04:01 AM Eastern Standard Time,

subra writes:

 

<<

* I have invented many things as an engineer, including programmes for

computers

before the time if PCs. All in the service of others, who got the advantage,

without remunerating me: not because of meanness, but they could not

understand

what I had achieved!

 

Everybody plays CDs today. It came out of my brain! As a lover of music I

was

looking for a way to record and replay music without the noises created by

the

needle even in the best of record-players. I got the idea it could be done

magnetically and perhaps by laser reflection. Discussed it with a brilliant

electronic engineer I knew. But we had no money to experiment and produce a

prototype. We wrote to Philips. They thanked us for the idea, but "the

present

technology cannot put your ideas into practice." Some time later my

electronic

acquaintance - with whom I discussed frequently - applied for a job with

Philips

and got it. Within 1 year Philips (denon) brought out the first Compact

Disc,

with laser technique. I was, of course, never thought of!

>>

Dear Mani,

Thank you for inventing the CD! I wish you receive much acclaim for

your idea, even if belatedly. In my job at an engineering firm, I receive

architect drawings on CD, that cannot be erased or easily lost; they are

there when I need them. I listen to CD's of beautiful music and do not worry

that the listening will wear out the tracks, as it did on vinyl records and

bakelite 78's and wax cylinders...

The CD is like a fire opal, pretty to look at. It records data as well as

music. It records videos and photographs. It is a wonderful storage medium.

And as you said, it does not produce the hissing noises that the old records

and tapes produced--just clean, clear sound.

I salute you for your idea, Mani, even if someone else made good on

it--I dreamed once, of a newspaper written by all the people in the

neighborhood, each one encouraged to contribute a story or poem or something

of interest---but instead of a paper format, I'd imagined it as a picture

under glass, that was on the wall in our living room... Years afterwards,

the Internet was born!

Best wishes,

Carol Hook

[Guest guest]

Carolhook wrote:

> Dear Mani,

> Thank you for inventing the CD! I wish you receive much acclaim for

> your idea, even if belatedly. ...... I salute you for your idea, Mani,

 

Dear Carol,

 

Thanks. To be honest: I assume that the cds came out of my head by deduction and

circumstantial evidence. But there is the possibility that another inventor got

the idea too at about the same time. This happens often. When a thing is meant

to be discovered or invented there is a "Zeitgeist" that puts the idea into

various heads! In the case of great inventions like the airplane etc there are

often two or three inventors involved who get the idea independently. Sometimes

all get recogntion, sometimes only one - or like Marconi, one who did not invent

but demonstrated to a large public.

 

My "tragedy" is thai I am sitting on an idea for 10 years, which if put into

practice will "revoltionize" homoeopathy and be of benefit to millions - but I

am unable to get a sponsor to put it to test and get it recognized in practice!

Perhaps the time has not come!

 

regards

Mani

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 3/20/2001 3:18:36 AM Eastern Standard Time,

subra writes:

 

<< Sometimes

all get recogntion, sometimes only one - or like Marconi, one who did not

invent

but demonstrated to a large public.

 

My "tragedy" is thai I am sitting on an idea for 10 years, which if put into

practice will "revoltionize" homoeopathy and be of benefit to millions - but

I

am unable to get a sponsor to put it to test and get it recognized in

practice!

Perhaps the time has not come!

 

regards

Mani

>>

Dear Mani,

Please don't revolt homeopathy, but please feel free to add to it! Edgar

Cayce is called Father of Wholistic medicine....and he did no better than you

or I at becoming wealthy from unique inventions....however he did give

assistance to ill persons. His secretary Gladys Davis painstakingly wrote in

shorthand, over 14,000 readings as he was giving them for seekers....Those

written records are now a national treasure....and have been preserved on

your creative idea's grandchild (CD's), no less, as well as in books.

My point is, please distribute your homeopathic idea somehow, so that

the world may make more money--I mean, be benefitted. Thanks, Mani!

Best to you,

Carol Hook

[Guest guest]

Hi those who answered. I am just waiting to see if there is more response, so

far only 5 answers. Shall answer a bit later.

 

regards

Mani

[Guest guest]

Hallo Mani, hallo list members,

I've been thinking about Neil, so I decided to mail my thoughts rather than

keep them for myself, allthough it does take courage, since I'm a new member

of the list.

Neil was born in Saturn/Rahu, which means that the debilitated retrograde

Saturn in 12 was doubly activated at the beginning of his life, which

doesn't promise anything good.

As far as I can see, there is confluence of factors indicating that Neil

hasn't had much parental happiness. I mean the following:

His Saturn is 9th lord; the Sun, indicator of father, is hemmed in between

8th lord Jupiter (a malefic for Torus Lagna) and Uranus;

In Navamsha the Sun is in 12 and 9th house is occupied by debilitated

retrograde Marcury, lord of 3+12 (functional malefic)

In the Moon Chart the 9th lord Jupiter is combust and together with the Sun

conjunct a retrograde Mercury, again lord of 3+12

The Moon receives an aspect from 12th+7th lord Mars from 8.

4th house is occupied by 6th lord Venus and Ketu, 4th lord is the Sun hemmed

in between 8th lord and Uranus

In Navamsha, the Moon is conjunct Ketu, debilitated in Scorpio, and receives

an aspect from Mars; 4th house receives an aspect from the retrograde 7th

and 8th lord Saturn, from 2, a maraka house.

In the Moon Chart the Moon receives an aspect from Mars in 6, 4th lord Venus

is conjunct Ketu, 4th house receives an aspect from the debilitated

retrograde 7th and 8th lord Saturn.

 

I quote from "Brihat Parasara Hora Sastra":

"If the 4th, the 10th, and the 12th house are all occupied by malefics, both

the parents will leave the child to his own fate and wander from place to

place."

 

Childhood is a 1st house matter. Neil's 1st house is occupied by Gulika, 1st

house lord Venus is in rather close conjunction with Ketu (weird things

happening in his childhood)

Indicator of childhood is Mercury, which, allthough in Virgo, his exaltation

sign, also has to be concidered afflicted since combust and conjunct 8th

lord. His position between Uranus und Pluto gives Neil an extraordinary

intellect, but I doubt that this combination ment anything good for his

childhood.

 

Concidering all these factors, and since the 12th house matters (among other

things: confinement) were activated immediately after his birth, it is

possible that his parents abandoned him, or died, or were for other reasons

uncapable of taking care of him, and that he was in an orphanage.

 

Neil is not an ordinary person. Indications for this are: 1st lord conjunct

Ketu, which makes him unusual; 5th lord Mercury in 5 conj. 4th lord Sun,

which makes him extreemly intelligent; but this gets amplified by the fact,

that Mercury is conj. Pluto on his left and Uranus on his right; which means

that Neil's thinking is "independent and original", that his "deep and

penetrating mind wants to get to the core of all matters" and "works at

lightning speed" (James Braha). If the Mercury is functioning as a link

between Pluto and Uranus, so if Pluto and Uranus can be concidered conjunct,

J.Braha says "the person feels compulsive independence in the depths of his

soul. He is on earth to break down existing conditions and bring about a new

social order." Combined with the meaning of Sun conjunct Uranus ( an

independent and individualistic person), I can imagine that another quote

aplies to Neil: "...his independence is so extreme that he does not feel

connected or bonded to others of his era...he feels alien, alone, and unable

to influence the situation."

 

Such a child would have been extreemly unhappy in an orphanage and such

childhood would leave a mark on his life.

 

OK, dear Mani, I'm looking forward to feed back .

Greetings, alles Liebe,

Liliana

 

 

 

>subra gjlist To:

>gjlist Re: [gjlist] a test case/ homoeopathy Date:

>Thu, 22 Mar 2001 09:32:50 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: from

>[64.211.240.234] by hotmail.com (3.2) with ESMTP id

>MHotMailBC830C090013D82197EF40D3F0EA38B059; Thu Mar 22 01:10:57 2001

>Received: from [10.1.4.52] by f19. with NNFMP; 22 Mar 2001

>09:09:23 -0000 Received: (EGP: mail-7_0_4); 22 Mar 2001 09:09:22 -0000

>Received: (qmail 62735 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2001 09:09:22 -0000

>Received: from unknown (10.1.10.27) by m8.onelist.org with QMQP; 22 Mar

>2001 09:09:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO

>mailout06.sul.t-online.com) (194.25.134.19) by mta2 with SMTP; 22 Mar 2001

>09:09:22 -0000 Received: from fwd01.sul.t-online.com by

>mailout06.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 14g15t-0007tf-01; Thu, 22 Mar 2001

>10:09:21 +0100 Received: from (0209349698-0001@[217.1.161.85]) by

>fwd01.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 14g0WY-21lOojx; Thu, 22 Mar 2001

>09:32:50 +0100 From sentto-490438-3810-985252163-astrolila Thu Mar 22

>01:11:32 2001 X-eGroups-Return:

>sentto-490438-3810-985252163-astrolila=hotmail.com (AT) returns (DOT)

>X-Sender: subra X-Apparently-gjlist

>References: X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.33 Message-ID:

><14g0WY-21lOojx X-Sender:

>0209349698-0001 X-eGroups-subra (mani)

>Mailing-List: list gjlist; contact

>gjlist-owner Delivered-mailing list

>gjlist Precedence: bulk List-Un:

>

>Sunita Menon wrote: > Dear Mani, > Patents are applicable not only to a

>specific product, but also for the > process that is used to manufacture

>the product. In fact most of the patents > in the area of medicine are for

>the process. Please note this impportant > fact, so please don't let your

>ideas get into the hands of unscruplous > individuals - >

>

>Dear Sunita,

>

>Thanks for the tip. But German patent laws are a bit different. I may be

>able to get something thru though. But that is not my aim at all! I´d

>rejoice if the Mafia picked up the idea and sold the stuff instead of drugs

>to kids!

>

>I don´t need "big" money for myself. Enough to buy a car and a computer

>which don´t fail every other day, enough to be able to eat out instead of

>having to cook every day*** , to have a couple of holidays with my

>children, to visit my sister in Canada and my brother in India. I´d perhaps

>buy myself a few items of clothing of quality.

>

>If I had millions I´d build a meeting centre in my village for young and

>old to have innocent fun, a centre for people to practice alternative

>medicine, establish a lab to find ways of making "meat" or equivalent in

>retorts,

>

>** You may ask why I don´t cook for a few days ahead. My autistic son eats

>enormous amounts and if I cook for 3 days he eats it in one day, Can´t lock

>my kitchen or fridge! He eats and eats, gets a belly like a woman pregnant

>in the 9th month, can´t buy clothes to fit!

>

>regards Mani

>

>

>

>gjlist-

>

>

>

>Your use of is subject to

>

>

_______________________

Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

[Guest guest]

Dear those who took up the challenge!

 

I must confess that I was not quite fair! The data I gave were for my son. The

TOB I gave was as in the birth certificate, 08:25 pm, but the midwife had given

me a time 08:10 pm! I can´t explain this discrepancy.

 

But this does not seem to have had much influence on the readings. In principle,

all were correct, but in the synthesis all were off.

 

The test case was my autistic son.

 

I don´t want to load the list with discussions on this case and will give more

details to those who answered - por on the list if requested!

regards

Mani

[Guest guest]

Hi those who tried my test case:

 

I am using the best reading I got to answer:

 

Liliana Sucur Perisic wrote:

 

 

> I quote from "Brihat Parasara Hora Sastra":

> "If the 4th, the 10th, and the 12th house are all occupied by malefics, both

> the parents will leave the child to his own fate and wander from place to

> place."

>

> Childhood is a 1st house matter. Neil's 1st house is occupied by Gulika, 1st

> house lord Venus is in rather close conjunction with Ketu (weird things

> happening in his childhood)

 

Nothing very weird happened, except that we went to live in Nigeria for a

perjiod.

 

 

> Indicator of childhood is Mercury, which, allthough in Virgo, his exaltation

> sign, also has to be concidered afflicted since combust and conjunct 8th

> lord. His position between Uranus und Pluto gives Neil an extraordinary

> intellect, but I doubt that this combination ment anything good for his

> childhood.

 

He is very intelligent in some ways, but childish in other things. He cannot use

his intelligence to earn or be useful to himself. He stagnates at childhood.

 

>

> Concidering all these factors, and since the 12th house matters (among other

> things: confinement) were activated immediately after his birth, it is

> possible that his parents abandoned him, or died, or were for other reasons

> uncapable of taking care of him, and that he was in an orphanage.

 

NO, we did not abandon him in that sense. He was born normal and for 8 months

was a very charming baby, very quick to learn. Suddenly overnight he became

different. Slowly he stopped reacting to affection. It looks as if our affection

did not reacg him.

 

When the autism became more pronounced his mother could not accept it, was a bit

cold to him, but did not neglect him. He hardly bothered about me, so that I

could not show much affection for him. Later on he regarded me more as a sort of

servant of the family, not father!

 

My wife and I were divorced when he was 13. The mother could not cope with him

and sent him awayto psychiatric institutions, where he felt miserable. I

was allowed to see him only rarely. When he was 21 he rebelled against the

situation and came to live with me. By then we hardly had any father-son

relationshi, but I was prepared to help him.

 

But his subjective feeling is that he had been let down by his parents, vaguely

blames us for his condition.

 

 

> Neil is not an ordinary person.......which means

> that Neil's thinking is "independent and original", that his "deep and

> penetrating mind wants to get to the core of all matters" and "works at

> lightning speed" (James Braha).

 

This is true in limited fields. Can solve brain-twisters. But in a story

or in life cannot differentiate between what is important what not.

 

 

> If the Mercury is functioning as a link

> between Pluto and Uranus, so if Pluto and Uranus can be concidered conjunct,

> J.Braha says "the person feels compulsive independence in the depths of his

> soul. He is on earth to break down existing conditions and bring about a new

> social order."

 

He is shocked by the evil in the world, cannot accept it. His logic is different

from ours - all cut and dry, no grey zones. Remarkable memory for the distant

past, but can forget what happened yesterday.

 

> Combined with the meaning of Sun conjunct Uranus ( an

> independent and individualistic person), I can imagine that another quote

> aplies to Neil: "...his independence is so extreme that he does not feel

> connected or bonded to others of his era...he feels alien, alone, and unable

> to influence the situation."

 

Yes, autist!

 

 

It is interesting to note: in 1988, from april till early june he was absolutely

non-autistic. He was not in any institution, had been discharged. An unfortunate

incident with the mother led to his running away to the psychiatric clinic.

Within days he sank into autism again!

 

Others spoke about health. He is okay, except for a nervous bladder. looks much

younger than his age.

 

He speaks very hastily, swallows enormous quantities of food, which he

practically never chews.

 

He has no sense of time. Finds it very difficult to learn by association. He can

concentrate only on some things which interest him - such things are very few -

but otherwise cannot follow a thought, a story etc.for more than say 10 minutes.

Basically he thinks in pictures and the spoken or written matter is only

partially understood. His vocabulary is large, but the usage of words is often

with a false nuance, exaggerated or insufficient to describe the actual

situation. Can see details much better than others at times, such as in solving

puzzles, but in ordinary life misses them, can draw a horse with a lio´s tail!

Can play a tune on the piano, but not recognize it played on the violin.

 

The 10 commandments are in the blood, he cannot tell a lie etc. He is clumsy

with his hands, butter-fingers.

 

His attitude to life is that of an 8 year-old kid. Shopping means buying

chocolate, jello and coke!

Very aware of his condition, but unable to get out of it.

 

 

The warp is okay, but the woof is broken in many places, leaves holes in the

fabric.

Any questions?

 

regards

Mani