Guest guest Posted April 28, 2006 Report Share Posted April 28, 2006 Dear Kirkji: I had a similar experience to yours. Many years ago I left the Ashram I considered my home. The Guru had taken mahasamadhi and there become a terrible distortion of the Shakti, a greed and a desire to attract "celebraties", etc. It was devasting, In fact I left Shaivite Practices all together and stayed with the Tibetan Buddhist Sangha for many, many years.. Now in retrospect, I see how everything was perfect and in Divine Order. Even within the Tibetan Buddhist Community there have manifested "questionable" teachers, false Gurus, if you will, and I remember reading one time this very question was put before HH The Dalai Lama. His response was to be grateful for the Truth that you were taught and leave the rest behind. But also to have compassion for the teacher and to pray for the teacher. Very simple. But very profound. It helped me a great deal and has especially opened my heart now that I have come home to Lord Shiva. I realize the solid foundation of Maha Vidya that did come to me and I can release all of the garbage. To hold on and remember the awfulness..I was literally thrown out (as we others) of the organization..Only causes me to become contracted and too lose my boundless vision. If I let it go and try not to analyze of feel bitter or judge the organization and everything..I contribute to my own freedom.. Because in these kinds of situations the karma is immense when such control and negativity come into play. People become trapped with these distortions out of karma ..The teacher misuing the power will suffer terrible karmic repercussions. We don't need to figure it out. We can just walk away with the good that we found. That is something , that you know can not be taken away. And we can pray that all of the souls trapped in this mire ..as you say..wake up. Don't let this situation sour you on Gurus. True Gurus are still very much on the planet in bodies. The Shiva Sutras say that "The Guru is the means and The Guru is not a person, but the Grace bestowing power of God" That Grace touches us and guides us. We find the form in a teacher. We find the form in the scriptures and we find the form in the Rudrakshas, most certainly. We also become Gurus to each other. Om Namah Shivaya Kanti In a message dated 11/25/2002 11:31:57 AM Central Standard Time, kirk_bernhardt writes: > Ken, and All, I don't really know how to point fingers at Maharishi exactly. > It seems everywhere I point I could connect with something that bothers > me. I guess it's similar to a bad break up where the previously loved > person takes on the mien of a demon. > > I do appreciate that Maharishi came to the US and taught TM. I really do > appreciate it. It was my first steps towards yes, understanding Hinduism. > But first love isn't necessary the truest, though it may be most > passionate. Higher love stems from greater maturity, which I am only > starting to develop. Maharishi's hold on his followers is very possesive > and jealous, and bound to destroy its own bonds. I can't tell you how many > times I've seen jealous, possesive relationships destroy what both parties > though of as "the ultimate love." Where there are too many constraints > then life itself breaks the boundaries. Life knows no boundaries. Where > transcendence is the goal then any movement will be outgrown. Even the > guru will be outgrown. > > And like when kids grow and rebel, and some parents don't undertand that > it's nature's way of cutting the emotional umbilical, so also people will > fight against Maharishi's hold on them. Mainly because that's the only way > for the movement to really integrate. By movement, I think I mean movement > of pure consciousness, not TM movement. Because the former is supposed to > be the latter though each gets the other confused with itself sometimes. > > Again, I still do TM. Though I have long ago disabused myself of the notion > that Movement knows best. I meditate for as long as I desire, whenever. > And since TMO wouldn't let me be a teacher, I have made myself one. I > went back to the roots, back to the interested devata, and asked them > personally if I could teach and they said yes. Siva, and Lakshmi both have > an interest in bringing all spiritual people to fruition as enlightened > beings. I think in Buddhism they would have the names Samantabhadra and > Tara. > > My foremeost gripe with Maharishi is that on the one hand what he says is > true, the world is overheating emotionally and is ripe to self destruct > through war. But on the other hand, this tells me that Maharishi should be > expending his influence not for creating pundit groups and rich > synchophants, but instead bringing his individual followers to > enlightenment asap. Each person in TMO should be practicing Rudrabhisheka > with lingam, and wearing rudraksha, and performing pujas. The force of the > real TMO was always the true believers. And it is they who have been > pushed away, irreplaceably with the schenanagans. Only the most > incredulous are left, or will be soon. > > I see this as a great waste at a very bad time. This lack of wisdom goes > hand in hand with creation of a cult of sheep, who aren't being led to > enlightenment but are treated as cash cows and servants for a new priestly > caste undertaking. The hostility towards Maharishi is not to him as a > human, because I still love him some ways, but it's towards him as the iron > fisted demogogue, usurping people of the world from their rightful > inheritance of full blown enlightenment. > > Yes groups of perpetual pundits would be good for Hindus, for devas, for > divodasas. However it may not be good for democracy and human rights. The > solution is not abuse of rights of the weak to benefit the whole, but > placing the means into the hands of the weak to make them responsible for > the beneficience of the divine. Which is what is happening anyway, which > is what Siva and Lakshmi want me to tell you, which is that again, we all > are individually responsible for enlightenment, to the degree to which we > want it. If you haven't gotten on your knees and begged the creator for it > then do you really want it? If you have then prepare to receive it as the > time is at hand for all the people on earth to meet their goal, higher or > lower. > > It's the greatness of the moment beyond all other mental constructs that is > telling me always to make haste to become enlightened, make haste, because > tomorrow chemical warfare will rot our bodies and minds and we wont be able > to make further progress. Nuclear armegeddon will waste the earth and > travel and we won't be able to visit saints any more, or get holy items > like rudraksha from India. The Lamas and Swamis will be landlocked in the > Himalayas, and the herbs will stop flowing. > > I am therefore always fighting against people that are saying that > Maharishi is the source of their enlightement when in fact he represents > some of it, but we are responsible for our enlightenment. Maharishi is an > expression of our collective desire to enlighten the world, nothing more. > For real enlightenment we only need BE. And our senses will develop until > we see the divine everywhere, within and without. It is incumbent upon us > all to wake up. And for this Maharishi could help more if he would keep > people focusing on the here and now and not the then and there. > > The devata realm cannot stop human destruction. They can persuade and > inspire but the ultimate choice is ours uniquely. Therefore pundit camps > are beneficial but they are no substitute for individual enlightenment. > For this reason I get tired on Maharishi's carrot and stick routine. It > just seems wrong. Because the time is now to arise. (Feels good to say > these things, after waiting so many lifetimes.) > > All of you, you may be much more important than you presently know. Look > within. Pray. Arise. The time is now. (People have said this for thousands > of years, right? The time is now. The time is still now. The benefit of > Kali yuga is to make us realize this one thing.) > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 28, 2006 Report Share Posted April 28, 2006 Sometimes the worst experiences/people are our best gurus. Maybe you folks had that experience to heighten your ability to see truth/falseness? Or as the old saying goes, "Once you've smelled skunk, you never fail to recognize the scent." , thunderheals@a... wrote: > Dear Kirkji: > > I had a similar experience to yours. > Many years ago I left the Ashram I considered my home. > The Guru had taken mahasamadhi and there become a terrible distortion of the > Shakti, a greed and a desire to attract "celebraties", etc. > > It was devasting, In fact I left Shaivite Practices all together and stayed > with the Tibetan Buddhist Sangha for many, many years.. Now in retrospect, I > see how everything was perfect and in Divine Order. > > Even within the Tibetan Buddhist Community there have manifested > "questionable" teachers, false Gurus, if you will, > and I remember reading one time this very question was put before HH The > Dalai Lama. > > His response was to be grateful for the Truth that you were taught and leave > the rest behind. But also to have compassion for the teacher and to pray for > the teacher. > Very simple. But very profound. It helped me a great deal and has especially > opened my heart now that I have come home to Lord Shiva. I realize the solid > foundation of Maha Vidya that did come to me and I can release all of the > garbage. > > To hold on and remember the awfulness..I was literally thrown out (as we > others) of the organization..Only causes me to become contracted and too lose > my boundless vision. > > If I let it go and try not to analyze of feel bitter or judge the > organization and everything..I contribute to my own freedom.. > Because in these kinds of situations the karma is immense when such control > and negativity come into play. People become trapped with these distortions > out of karma ..The teacher misuing the power will suffer terrible karmic > repercussions. > > We don't need to figure it out. We can just walk away with the good that we > found. That is something , that you know can not be taken away. And we can > pray that all of the souls trapped in this mire ..as you say..wake up. > > Don't let this situation sour you on Gurus. True Gurus are still very much on > the planet in bodies. > The Shiva Sutras say that "The Guru is the means and The Guru is not a > person, but the Grace bestowing power of God" > > That Grace touches us and guides us. We find the form in a teacher. We find > the form in the scriptures and we find the > form in the Rudrakshas, most certainly. We also become Gurus to each other. > > Om Namah Shivaya > Kanti > > In a message dated 11/25/2002 11:31:57 AM Central Standard Time, > kirk_bernhardt@c... writes: > > > > Ken, and All, I don't really know how to point fingers at Maharishi exactly. > > It seems everywhere I point I could connect with something that bothers > > me. I guess it's similar to a bad break up where the previously loved > > person takes on the mien of a demon. > > > > I do appreciate that Maharishi came to the US and taught TM. I really do > > appreciate it. It was my first steps towards yes, understanding Hinduism. > > But first love isn't necessary the truest, though it may be most > > passionate. Higher love stems from greater maturity, which I am only > > starting to develop. Maharishi's hold on his followers is very possesive > > and jealous, and bound to destroy its own bonds. I can't tell you how many > > times I've seen jealous, possesive relationships destroy what both parties > > though of as "the ultimate love." Where there are too many constraints > > then life itself breaks the boundaries. Life knows no boundaries. Where > > transcendence is the goal then any movement will be outgrown. Even the > > guru will be outgrown. > > > > And like when kids grow and rebel, and some parents don't undertand that > > it's nature's way of cutting the emotional umbilical, so also people will > > fight against Maharishi's hold on them. Mainly because that's the only way > > for the movement to really integrate. By movement, I think I mean movement > > of pure consciousness, not TM movement. Because the former is supposed to > > be the latter though each gets the other confused with itself sometimes. > > > > Again, I still do TM. Though I have long ago disabused myself of the notion > > that Movement knows best. I meditate for as long as I desire, whenever. > > And since TMO wouldn't let me be a teacher, I have made myself one. I > > went back to the roots, back to the interested devata, and asked them > > personally if I could teach and they said yes. Siva, and Lakshmi both have > > an interest in bringing all spiritual people to fruition as enlightened > > beings. I think in Buddhism they would have the names Samantabhadra and > > Tara. > > > > My foremeost gripe with Maharishi is that on the one hand what he says is > > true, the world is overheating emotionally and is ripe to self destruct > > through war. But on the other hand, this tells me that Maharishi should be > > expending his influence not for creating pundit groups and rich > > synchophants, but instead bringing his individual followers to > > enlightenment asap. Each person in TMO should be practicing Rudrabhisheka > > with lingam, and wearing rudraksha, and performing pujas. The force of the > > real TMO was always the true believers. And it is they who have been > > pushed away, irreplaceably with the schenanagans. Only the most > > incredulous are left, or will be soon. > > > > I see this as a great waste at a very bad time. This lack of wisdom goes > > hand in hand with creation of a cult of sheep, who aren't being led to > > enlightenment but are treated as cash cows and servants for a new priestly > > caste undertaking. The hostility towards Maharishi is not to him as a > > human, because I still love him some ways, but it's towards him as the iron > > fisted demogogue, usurping people of the world from their rightful > > inheritance of full blown enlightenment. > > > > Yes groups of perpetual pundits would be good for Hindus, for devas, for > > divodasas. However it may not be good for democracy and human rights. The > > solution is not abuse of rights of the weak to benefit the whole, but > > placing the means into the hands of the weak to make them responsible for > > the beneficience of the divine. Which is what is happening anyway, which > > is what Siva and Lakshmi want me to tell you, which is that again, we all > > are individually responsible for enlightenment, to the degree to which we > > want it. If you haven't gotten on your knees and begged the creator for it > > then do you really want it? If you have then prepare to receive it as the > > time is at hand for all the people on earth to meet their goal, higher or > > lower. > > > > It's the greatness of the moment beyond all other mental constructs that is > > telling me always to make haste to become enlightened, make haste, because > > tomorrow chemical warfare will rot our bodies and minds and we wont be able > > to make further progress. Nuclear armegeddon will waste the earth and > > travel and we won't be able to visit saints any more, or get holy items > > like rudraksha from India. The Lamas and Swamis will be landlocked in the > > Himalayas, and the herbs will stop flowing. > > > > I am therefore always fighting against people that are saying that > > Maharishi is the source of their enlightement when in fact he represents > > some of it, but we are responsible for our enlightenment. Maharishi is an > > expression of our collective desire to enlighten the world, nothing more. > > For real enlightenment we only need BE. And our senses will develop until > > we see the divine everywhere, within and without. It is incumbent upon us > > all to wake up. And for this Maharishi could help more if he would keep > > people focusing on the here and now and not the then and there. > > > > The devata realm cannot stop human destruction. They can persuade and > > inspire but the ultimate choice is ours uniquely. Therefore pundit camps > > are beneficial but they are no substitute for individual enlightenment. > > For this reason I get tired on Maharishi's carrot and stick routine. It > > just seems wrong. Because the time is now to arise. (Feels good to say > > these things, after waiting so many lifetimes.) > > > > All of you, you may be much more important than you presently know. Look > > within. Pray. Arise. The time is now. (People have said this for thousands > > of years, right? The time is now. The time is still now. The benefit of > > Kali yuga is to make us realize this o Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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