Guest guest Posted September 23, 2005 Report Share Posted September 23, 2005 Hello members, I was wondering if you can help with one of the issues that is bothering me. I am baffled to read in Shiv puran that women are considered subservient to men and their there are references where they are advised of their duties towards their husbands and men more like a servant than as their equal .Also references of women being cunning, low in status baffles me. I wonder if these are really the words of Shiva or these contexts were additions made intentionally by the mind manipulating elements of society for their own benefit. FOr example, at the time of Parvati's wedding,she is advised to serve her husband and not get upset with him even she is physically harmed by him. Not talk to her own husband till spoken to by him, Not to demand any explanations of his activites etc. Also later on, there are refernces of Shivji and Vishnuji are discussing that women have cunning minds and are inferior human. Also all GODs and demi gods seem to have many wives, why? Are these true? I am not wise but I want your advise and clarifiation so that my love for Shiva remains steadfast / Afterall he is Shiv and Shakti combined then how come in the Holy text if Shiva puran i read all these. Hoping to get some advise soon. were these added by other Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 24, 2005 Report Share Posted September 24, 2005 if you look at people as souls (gods immortal children) then these differences wont occur. I as a soul respect your soul. there is no difference in gender or status etc. All these scriptures have passed from humans form a long long time and people have added and changed some of these parts to suit their convenience. To control people and become leaders scholars were doing these kind of things in the past and in present. --- rinkugandhi <rinkugandhi wrote: > Hello members, > I was wondering if you can help with one of the > issues that is > bothering me. I am baffled to read in Shiv puran > that women are > considered subservient to men and their there are > references where > they are advised of their duties towards their > husbands and men more > like a servant than as their equal .Also references > of women being > cunning, low in status baffles me. I wonder if these > are really the > words of Shiva or these contexts were additions made > intentionally by > the mind manipulating elements of society for their > own benefit. FOr > example, at the time of Parvati's wedding,she is > advised to serve her > husband and not get upset with him even she is > physically harmed by > him. Not talk to her own husband till spoken to by > him, Not to demand > any explanations of his activites etc. > Also later on, there are refernces of Shivji and > Vishnuji are > discussing that women have cunning minds and are > inferior human. Also > all GODs and demi gods seem to have many wives, why? > Are these true? I am not wise but I want your advise > and clarifiation > so that my love for Shiva remains steadfast / > Afterall he is Shiv and > Shakti combined then how come in the Holy text if > Shiva puran i read > all these. > > > Hoping to get some advise soon. > > > were these added by other > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 25, 2005 Report Share Posted September 25, 2005 The Hindu culture and its tradition started with Vedas. These were unwritten and were passed to the succeeding generation by Gurus before they transformed in to the written Scriptures. The basic knowledge contained by these four holy scripts is in the form of Brahmanas and Aranyakas. Rig Veda gives the descriptions of prayers and descriptions of the glory of almighty. Sama Veda on similar lines Prayers on God and goddesses in rhythmic and lyrical style (Naada based). Yajur Veda consists of various methods of performing Yagnas and Kratus. Atharva Veda comprises of warfare, and the knowledge of material world. It is important to note that there was no restriction for studying these scriptures by either men or Women. Gargi and Maitray were renowned women scholars of these scriptures in Vedic period. Women Scholars used to participate in performing Yagnas and were wearing Janevu or Yagnopaveet. The eminent Rishis or Munis after Veda Adhyan (studying) Vedas transformed the knowledge of Vedas in to Upanishads by punching their own understanding and interpretation along with the original text. There are about 108 known Upanishads. IN all Upanishads the reputation of women was maintained and kept in tact. Before the onset of Kali Yug, honourable Vyasa maharshi, son of esteemed Parasara Maharshi had written 18 Puranas excluding Mahabharat. These Epics were translated in to various languages at a later date. While translating these epics the writers incorporated their own thoughts and interpretations in them including the original transcript. This includes moral code, conduct, duties and responsibilities of both men and women. Instead of communicating these ideas directly, were presented in merged form as discussions or advices. Depending on the understanding and conformist nature of the writers some excruciating scripts crept in to the volumes. Similar way duties of a host are described in the form of Shodasopacharas in Pooja procedures. It is construed and obvious that these are mere interpretations of the writers invariably not the words spoken by God and Goddesses. It is an observed contradiction that Vedas propagate the view that there is one Para Brahman and the endeavour shall be to unite Atman (Soul) with Para Brahman as an ultimate objective. Women are respected in India since ages. In India every respected object is classified as feminine gender, for Example Bharat Mata (India), Rivers (Gang, Krishna, Kavery e.t.c , Bhudevi (Earth). In wedding invitations it is customary to start the request with title of wife followed by husband's as Mrs. and Mr. invites….. Even the father of nation Mahatma Gandhi said" the country flourishes where women are respected". Finally Puranas, Poojas are the starting exercises for imparting training to the mind for meditation or atonement. Final objective is to seek the way to unite Atman with Paramatman. One should go ahead and do not linger long at the stages of beginning. Aum Namah Shivay , "rinkugandhi" <rinkugandhi> wrote: > Hello members, > I was wondering if you can help with one of the issues that is > bothering me. I am baffled to read in Shiv puran that women are > considered subservient to men and their there are references where > they are advised of their duties towards their husbands and men more > like a servant than as their equal .Also references of women being > cunning, low in status baffles me. I wonder if these are really the > words of Shiva or these contexts were additions made intentionally by > the mind manipulating elements of society for their own benefit. FOr > example, at the time of Parvati's wedding,she is advised to serve her > husband and not get upset with him even she is physically harmed by > him. Not talk to her own husband till spoken to by him, Not to demand > any explanations of his activites etc. > Also later on, there are refernces of Shivji and Vishnuji are > discussing that women have cunning minds and are inferior human. Also > all GODs and demi gods seem to have many wives, why? > Are these true? I am not wise but I want your advise and clarifiation > so that my love for Shiva remains steadfast / Afterall he is Shiv and > Shakti combined then how come in the Holy text if Shiva puran i read > all these. > > > Hoping to get some advise soon. > > > were these added by other Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 25, 2005 Report Share Posted September 25, 2005 We are in the age of Kaliyuga, anything that you read in this time will look that the people who have done and lived in the Other YUGAS will look bad and unethical. I heard this story before Kaliyuga started the men and women of those age thought process were different. Yama's daughter used to come to meet him (let not know what she came for) So one day Yama had to say to her "Kaliyuga is starting so stop coming" People will start to thinkg wrongly. This is just one of the incident. But take all the incidents in those Puranas, you will find somehing or the other wrong (WE ARE THINKING WITH CORRUPTED or MIXED MIND) in this age, which is bad. So don't analyze the stories. THEY ARE RIGHT TO THAT AGE. I am sorry if I have told something wrong or hurt you. Unintentional AnandOn 9/23/05, rinkugandhi <rinkugandhi > wrote: Hello members, I was wondering if you can help with one of the issues that is bothering me. I am baffled to read in Shiv puran that women are considered subservient to men and their there are references where they are advised of their duties towards their husbands and men more like a servant than as their equal .Also references of women being cunning, low in status baffles me. I wonder if these are really the words of Shiva or these contexts were additions made intentionally by the mind manipulating elements of society for their own benefit. FOr example, at the time of Parvati's wedding,she is advised to serve her husband and not get upset with him even she is physically harmed by him. Not talk to her own husband till spoken to by him, Not to demand any explanations of his activites etc. Also later on, there are refernces of Shivji and Vishnuji are discussing that women have cunning minds and are inferior human. Also all GODs and demi gods seem to have many wives, why? Are these true? I am not wise but I want your advise and clarifiation so that my love for Shiva remains steadfast / Afterall he is Shiv and Shakti combined then how come in the Holy text if Shiva puran i read all these. Hoping to get some advise soon. were these added by other Visit your group "" on the web. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 26, 2005 Report Share Posted September 26, 2005 I dont know about kaliyuga, but not only in hinduism but also in other religions also the weeker people (including women) were always supressed by stronger ones, one of the ways is using the scriptures so that no one can questions it. if you look at it with conscious and with open mind, there should not be any supression based on gender, caste, religion .. etc. --- Anendd Srivvetsa <tejaswi2 wrote: > Hi , > > We are in the age of Kaliyuga, anything that you > read in this time will look > that the people who have done and lived in the Other > YUGAS will look bad and > unethical. > > I heard this story before Kaliyuga started the men > and women of those age > thought process were different. Yama's daughter used > to come to meet him > (let not know what she came for) So one day Yama had > to say to her "Kaliyuga > is starting so stop coming" People will start to > thinkg wrongly. > > This is just one of the incident. > > But take all the incidents in those Puranas, you > will find somehing or the > other wrong (WE ARE THINKING WITH CORRUPTED or MIXED > MIND) in this age, > which is bad. > > So don't analyze the stories. THEY ARE RIGHT TO THAT > AGE. > > I am sorry if I have told something wrong or hurt > you. > Unintentional > > Anand > > On 9/23/05, rinkugandhi <rinkugandhi > wrote: > > > > Hello members, > > I was wondering if you can help with one of the > issues that is > > bothering me. I am baffled to read in Shiv puran > that women are > > considered subservient to men and their there are > references where > > they are advised of their duties towards their > husbands and men more > > like a servant than as their equal .Also > references of women being > > cunning, low in status baffles me. I wonder if > these are really the > > words of Shiva or these contexts were additions > made intentionally by > > the mind manipulating elements of society for > their own benefit. FOr > > example, at the time of Parvati's wedding,she is > advised to serve her > > husband and not get upset with him even she is > physically harmed by > > him. Not talk to her own husband till spoken to by > him, Not to demand > > any explanations of his activites etc. > > Also later on, there are refernces of Shivji and > Vishnuji are > > discussing that women have cunning minds and are > inferior human. Also > > all GODs and demi gods seem to have many wives, > why? > > Are these true? I am not wise but I want your > advise and clarifiation > > so that my love for Shiva remains steadfast / > Afterall he is Shiv and > > Shakti combined then how come in the Holy text if > Shiva puran i read > > all these. > > > > > > Hoping to get some advise soon. > > > > > > were these added by other > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > > > > > - Visit your group > "<>" > > on the web. > > - To from this group, send an > email to: > > > <-unsubs\ cribe?subject=Un> > > - Your use of is subject to the > Terms of > > Service <>. > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 27, 2005 Report Share Posted September 27, 2005 In a message dated 9/28/2005 2:01:37 AM Central Standard Time, rinkugandhi writes: Hence no man or woman, no shudra or Kshatriya exists amongst us. All paramparas that are related to subduing an individual or which causes grief are not from God , i was so happy to see this.....if I may humbly suggest it, you might like reading about the life of sri basavanna. he was a great egalitarian shaivite who fought against caste system and sexism in 12th century. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 27, 2005 Report Share Posted September 27, 2005 Thank you to everyone who helped me reassure my faith in Shiva and the holy text of Shiv Puraan. I always knew that the hindu religious philosophy was always to love and respect each and every individual may it be a human or an animal because we all have that microcosmic Shiva element in each of us which is our souls. Hence no man or woman, no shudra or Kshatriya exists amongst us. All paramparas that are related to subduing an individual or which causes grief are not from God , they may be from books related to religion but could not be from Shiva (GOD). I truely believe in it now even though stories in puraans may suggest other thoughts and ideas sometimes we need to filter out the elements that are man manipulated. I have renewed faith in my personal diety Shiva and thats only due to the reassurance from all of you. Thanks you so much . , Divakara Tanjore <div_tan> wrote: > if you look at people as souls (gods immortal > children) then these differences wont occur. I as a > soul respect your soul. there is no difference in > gender or status etc. > > All these scriptures have passed from humans form a > long long time and people have added and changed some > of these parts to suit their convenience. > > To control people and become leaders scholars were > doing these kind of things in the past and in present. > > --- rinkugandhi <rinkugandhi> wrote: > > > Hello members, > > I was wondering if you can help with one of the > > issues that is > > bothering me. I am baffled to read in Shiv puran > > that women are > > considered subservient to men and their there are > > references where > > they are advised of their duties towards their > > husbands and men more > > like a servant than as their equal .Also references > > of women being > > cunning, low in status baffles me. I wonder if these > > are really the > > words of Shiva or these contexts were additions made > > intentionally by > > the mind manipulating elements of society for their > > own benefit. FOr > > example, at the time of Parvati's wedding,she is > > advised to serve her > > husband and not get upset with him even she is > > physically harmed by > > him. Not talk to her own husband till spoken to by > > him, Not to demand > > any explanations of his activites etc. > > Also later on, there are refernces of Shivji and > > Vishnuji are > > discussing that women have cunning minds and are > > inferior human. Also > > all GODs and demi gods seem to have many wives, why? > > Are these true? I am not wise but I want your advise > > and clarifiation > > so that my love for Shiva remains steadfast / > > Afterall he is Shiv and > > Shakti combined then how come in the Holy text if > > Shiva puran i read > > all these. > > > > > > Hoping to get some advise soon. > > > > > > were these added by other > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 28, 2005 Report Share Posted September 28, 2005 For me bhakti started even before I read some of the religious scripts and books. When I faced innumerable hurdles as a youngster I looked upto god and I got the response of compassion and love. I believe we do not have to read scriptures to seek God, ofcourse reading scriptures help in more understranding, but if you look through your conscious and in truth all are equal. What I feel is human ego is very strong, consciously of sub-consciously it makes people to show them they are better than others, this leads to all the differences. The best way to seek God is to dissolve ego and become humble, humble by heart not for the sake of becoming humble. --- rinkugandhi <rinkugandhi wrote: > Thank you to everyone who helped me reassure my > faith in Shiva and > the holy text of Shiv Puraan. > I always knew that the hindu religious philosophy > was always to love > and respect each and every individual may it be a > human or an > animal because we all have that microcosmic Shiva > element in each > of us which is our souls. Hence no man or woman, no > shudra or > Kshatriya exists amongst us. All paramparas that are > related to > subduing an individual or which causes grief are not > from God , they > may be from books related to religion but could not > be from Shiva > (GOD). I truely believe in it now even though > stories in puraans may > suggest other thoughts and ideas sometimes we need > to filter out the > elements that are man manipulated. > I have renewed faith in my personal diety Shiva and > thats only due > to the reassurance from all of you. > Thanks you so much . > > , > Divakara Tanjore > <div_tan> wrote: > > if you look at people as souls (gods immortal > > children) then these differences wont occur. I as > a > > soul respect your soul. there is no difference in > > gender or status etc. > > > > All these scriptures have passed from humans form > a > > long long time and people have added and changed > some > > of these parts to suit their convenience. > > > > To control people and become leaders scholars were > > doing these kind of things in the past and in > present. > > > > --- rinkugandhi <rinkugandhi> wrote: > > > > > Hello members, > > > I was wondering if you can help with one of the > > > issues that is > > > bothering me. I am baffled to read in Shiv puran > > > that women are > > > considered subservient to men and their there > are > > > references where > > > they are advised of their duties towards their > > > husbands and men more > > > like a servant than as their equal .Also > references > > > of women being > > > cunning, low in status baffles me. I wonder if > these > > > are really the > > > words of Shiva or these contexts were additions > made > > > intentionally by > > > the mind manipulating elements of society for > their > > > own benefit. FOr > > > example, at the time of Parvati's wedding,she is > > > advised to serve her > > > husband and not get upset with him even she is > > > physically harmed by > > > him. Not talk to her own husband till spoken to > by > > > him, Not to demand > > > any explanations of his activites etc. > > > Also later on, there are refernces of Shivji > and > > > Vishnuji are > > > discussing that women have cunning minds and are > > > inferior human. Also > > > all GODs and demi gods seem to have many wives, > why? > > > Are these true? I am not wise but I want your > advise > > > and clarifiation > > > so that my love for Shiva remains steadfast / > > > Afterall he is Shiv and > > > Shakti combined then how come in the Holy text > if > > > Shiva puran i read > > > all these. > > > > > > > > > Hoping to get some advise soon. > > > > > > > > > were these added by other > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam > protection around > > > > > > > Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 u are having real bhakti - bhakti = ReaL BHAKTIDivakara Tanjore <div_tan > wrote: For me bhakti started even before I read some of thereligious scripts and books. When I faced innumerablehurdles as a youngster I looked upto god and I got theresponse of compassion and love. I believe we do nothave to read scriptures to seek God, ofcourse readingscriptures help in more understranding, but if youlook through your conscious and in truth all areequal.What I feel is human ego is very strong, consciouslyof sub-consciously it makes people to show them theyare better than others, this leads to all thedifferences. The best way to seek God is to dissolveego and become humble, humble by heart not for thesake of becoming humble.--- rinkugandhi wrote:> Thank you to everyone who helped me reassure my> faith in Shiva and > the holy text of Shiv Puraan. > I always knew that the hindu religious philosophy> was always to love > and respect each and every individual may it be a> human or an > animal because we all have that microcosmic Shiva> element in each > of us which is our souls. Hence no man or woman, no> shudra or > Kshatriya exists amongst us. All paramparas that are> related to > subduing an individual or which causes grief are not> from God , they > may be from books related to religion but could not> be from Shiva> (GOD). I truely believe in it now even though> stories in puraans may > suggest other thoughts and ideas sometimes we need> to filter out the > elements that are man manipulated.> I have renewed faith in my personal diety Shiva and> thats only due > to the reassurance from all of you.> Thanks you so much .> > --- In ,> Divakara Tanjore > wrote:> > if you look at people as souls (gods immortal> > children) then these differences wont occur. I as> a> > soul respect your soul. there is no difference in> > gender or status etc.> > > > All these scriptures have passed from humans form> a> > long long time and people have added and changed> some> > of these parts to suit their convenience.> > > > To control people and become leaders scholars were> > doing these kind of things in the past and in> present.> > > > --- rinkugandhi wrote:> > > > > Hello members,> > > I was wondering if you can help with one of the> > > issues that is > > > bothering me. I am baffled to read in Shiv puran> > > that women are > > > considered subservient to men and their there> are> > > references where > > > they are advised of their duties towards their> > > husbands and men more > > > like a servant than as their equal .Also> references> > > of women being > > > cunning, low in status baffles me. I wonder if> these> > > are really the > > > words of Shiva or these contexts were additions> made> > > intentionally by > > > the mind manipulating elements of society for> their> > > own benefit. FOr > > > example, at the time of Parvati's wedding,she is> > > advised to serve her > > > husband and not get upset with him even she is> > > physically harmed by > > > him. Not talk to her own husband till spoken to> by> > > him, Not to demand > > > any explanations of his activites etc.> > > Also later on, there are refernces of Shivji> and> > > Vishnuji are > > > discussing that women have cunning minds and are> > > inferior human. Also > > > all GODs and demi gods seem to have many wives,> why?> > > Are these true? I am not wise but I want your> advise> > > and clarifiation > > > so that my love for Shiva remains steadfast /> > > Afterall he is Shiv and > > > Shakti combined then how come in the Holy text> if> > > Shiva puran i read > > > all these.> > > > > > > > > Hoping to get some advise soon.> > > > > > > > > were these added by other> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Do You ?> > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam> protection around > > > > > > > Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 ------------------------ Sponsor --------------------~--> Get fast access to your favorite . Make your home pagehttp://us.click./dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/CSdplB/TM--~-> Links<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:/<*> To from this group, send an email to:<*> Your use of Groups is subject to: India Matrimony: Find your partner now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 Thank you Sujata Krishna, I am just an normal soul trying to gain spiritual consciousness with the satsang of people like you in this group. regds, Om namah shivaya, Divakar. --- Sujata Krishna <sujatakrishna2010 wrote: > NICE REPLY > u are having real bhakti - bhakti = ReaL BHAKTI > > Divakara Tanjore <div_tan wrote: > For me bhakti started even before I read some of the > religious scripts and books. When I faced > innumerable > hurdles as a youngster I looked upto god and I got > the > response of compassion and love. I believe we do not > have to read scriptures to seek God, ofcourse > reading > scriptures help in more understranding, but if you > look through your conscious and in truth all are > equal. > > What I feel is human ego is very strong, consciously > of sub-consciously it makes people to show them they > are better than others, this leads to all the > differences. The best way to seek God is to dissolve > ego and become humble, humble by heart not for the > sake of becoming humble. > > --- rinkugandhi wrote: > > > Thank you to everyone who helped me reassure my > > faith in Shiva and > > the holy text of Shiv Puraan. > > I always knew that the hindu religious philosophy > > was always to love > > and respect each and every individual may it be a > > human or an > > animal because we all have that microcosmic Shiva > > element in each > > of us which is our souls. Hence no man or woman, > no > > shudra or > > Kshatriya exists amongst us. All paramparas that > are > > related to > > subduing an individual or which causes grief are > not > > from God , they > > may be from books related to religion but could > not > > be from Shiva > > (GOD). I truely believe in it now even though > > stories in puraans may > > suggest other thoughts and ideas sometimes we need > > to filter out the > > elements that are man manipulated. > > I have renewed faith in my personal diety Shiva > and > > thats only due > > to the reassurance from all of you. > > Thanks you so much . > > > > , > > Divakara Tanjore > > wrote: > > > if you look at people as souls (gods immortal > > > children) then these differences wont occur. I > as > > a > > > soul respect your soul. there is no difference > in > > > gender or status etc. > > > > > > All these scriptures have passed from humans > form > > a > > > long long time and people have added and changed > > some > > > of these parts to suit their convenience. > > > > > > To control people and become leaders scholars > were > > > doing these kind of things in the past and in > > present. > > > > > > --- rinkugandhi wrote: > > > > > > > Hello members, > > > > I was wondering if you can help with one of > the > > > > issues that is > > > > bothering me. I am baffled to read in Shiv > puran > > > > that women are > > > > considered subservient to men and their there > > are > > > > references where > > > > they are advised of their duties towards their > > > > husbands and men more > > > > like a servant than as their equal .Also > > references > > > > of women being > > > > cunning, low in status baffles me. I wonder if > > these > > > > are really the > > > > words of Shiva or these contexts were > additions > > made > > > > intentionally by > > > > the mind manipulating elements of society for > > their > > > > own benefit. FOr > > > > example, at the time of Parvati's wedding,she > is > > > > advised to serve her > > > > husband and not get upset with him even she is > > > > physically harmed by > > > > him. Not talk to her own husband till spoken > to > > by > > > > him, Not to demand > > > > any explanations of his activites etc. > > > > Also later on, there are refernces of Shivji > > and > > > > Vishnuji are > > > > discussing that women have cunning minds and > are > > > > inferior human. Also > > > > all GODs and demi gods seem to have many > wives, > > why? > > > > Are these true? I am not wise but I want your > > advise > > > > and clarifiation > > > > so that my love for Shiva remains steadfast / > > > > Afterall he is Shiv and > > > > Shakti combined then how come in the Holy text > > if > > > > Shiva puran i read > > > > all these. > > > > > > > > > > > > Hoping to get some advise soon. > > > > > > > > > > > > were these added by other > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam > > protection around > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 > > > > > > Links > > > India Matrimony: Find your partner now. Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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