Multi metabolic types

[Guest guest]

There are perhaps some Indian participants here that do not

understand the context in which this dialog between Todd and me is

framed. Many may wonder what this has to do with Ayurveda. It

actually is a very important issue and one that those who want to

understand some parts of the western cultural experience as it

relates to Ayurveda.

 

Many Indians are not very aware of the modern western culture and

many parts of the west seem mysterious to them. I will use a case

history to illustrate an aspect of the west and its foray into the

yogachara school.

 

A young American woman 36yrs old – vata pitta prakruti. Had for past

many years been going to India – she was a devotee of Muktananda and

lived several years at the ashram at Ganeshpuri – she had come from a

traditional American Jewish family and had been a heavy meat eater

for her whole life – at the ashram she learned to eat in a

vegetarian way – the diet at the ashram was typical of such places,

not very healthy – under the influence of others she started

experimenting with various dietary theories – Vegan – raw food –

fasting (she had done many long fasts) – juice diet – maybe more –

eventually she came in contact with Ayurveda and started doing

treatments with some Bombay bogus vaidyas – during a two year period

she had done 9 Panchakarma courses many of them very long – example

she had done two courses with only a few months gap of heavy

veerachana followed by 36 vasti's – during the breaks between these

courses she often ended up in a compulsive phase where she satisfied

as many of the voracious hungers she could – she smoked ganja – drank

beer – ate meat – ate sweets and fried foods - indulged in sex -

until she went back for more treatments – she was becoming weaker and

more desperate with each passing month – she had lost an important

hold on reality and spent hours sleeping every day – in fact it was

impossible for her to stay out of bed more than a few hours out of

the day.

 

She started paying attention to the new American diet fad – low

carbohydrate – high protein – this diet theory is completely

researched and scientifically valid – it basically is a treatment

for neurasthenia, obesity, and or insulin resistance. Many are

following this diet to reduce weight. It is based on meat and animal

fat with little or no grains products or sugars and little if any

starchy vegetables. Many tens of thousands of Americans are

following this diet to great benefit. But slowly the weak points in

this diet are beginning to show up – and it showed up in this woman

relatively quickly as she began to suffer toxemia from poorly

balanced nutrients for her type and excess protein for her type.

 

This diet works well for many in the short term but actually only a

small percentage have a prakruti that will allow them to be healthy

on such a `heavy ` diet. Natural meateaters need two indispensable

substances – purines and animal (saturated ) fats – it is difficult

to impossible to get these substances from vegetable diet – but for

people of a vegetarian nature these two items can be toxic. There is

a new theory coming out of these new studies which I believe explains

all of these contradictions - that is the theory of metabolic

typing. This concept postulates that we should discover our own

metabolic type and eat according to that types needs. They propose

three metabolic types – sound familiar? The concept is one that I

hope many students of Ayurveda will investigate. It is something

familiar to us in India and actually clarifies in a nice way many

confusing problems. By the bye – the protein type does not have to

eat meat to be healthy – but it is easier for many to regain their

health quickly eating animal foods. But after balancing the weakness

many will do better if they lighten (sattvic) their diet somewhat.

There is a great range in this and everyone will have to find their

own balance or find a master physician (something difficult to find)

to help them.

 

The lady in our case found a balance between the extremes and

discovered that she does very well on a moderate diet of medium

proteins and frequent meals.

 

The terminology for these systems has not been standardized yet and

many call the same things by slightly different names. One leader is

William Wolcott who wrote a book `The Metabolic Typing Diet' his

concept is based on the theory of the fast Metaboliser versus the

slow Metaboliser – the autonomic nervous system driven individuals –

sympathetic nervous system types and the parasympathetic types – he

calls these types as protein type – carbohydrate types – mixed types.

Another thinker in this area with a slightly different orientation –

Robert Mc Ferran uses different terminology calling the protein type -

huntergatherers – and the carbohydrate type is called as -

agriculturist – then there is the mixed type. He can be read at this

link at Dietnet -

 

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/rwgully/theories/diets.htm

 

Notice especially his articles on the different metabolic types. None

of these ideas are in any way contradictory to Ayurveda.

 

Such ideas are coming close to the understanding of the Rishis that

there is not one diet that will be correct for everyone. Many of

those who found that meat eating strengthened them up and gave

them `substance' – losing their super vata state – when they went to

this direction most of them were so weak they naturally responded

well to the diet and now they have made it into a religion and want

to force everyone to follow their path. These people have even tried

to pass laws to feed school children high protein low carbohydrate

diets. Such a movement was attempted in San Diego California. You

will find these converts from vegetarianism to meat eating throughout

the internet trying to convince vegetarians to give up their style of

eating and start eating plenty of flesh and fat. It is like a

conversion to a new religion – it breeds fanaticism and contention.

These people (reformed vegetarians) have web sites attacking

vegetarians viciously – one site calls vegetarians mentally ill. They

are like many reformists and converts – fanatic and irrational – they

can not settle in the middle or find balance. They approach their new

religion with the same excess that they did their old religion with

the same consequences. If you will notice these people have no

rationality and will attack your intellectual capacity - your family

traditions - the teachings of your Guru - your culture - your

religion - your motivations. But if you object to this narrow

viewpoint they demand an apolgy. Nothing means anything to them but

that they are seen to be correct. Common sense is never as important

to fanatics as their 'references'. Ordinary observational skills mean

nothing to fanatics. The facts must fit the theory - forget the fact

that the theory changes constantly. What ever it is that these people

think they have achieved is not something most would envy.

 

For the serious students of natural law an even casual examination of

human nature reveals that there are many metabolic types and what is

appropriate for one is not appropriate for another. Rishis knew this

through direct observation thousands of years ago. Any student of

Ayurveda will not be confounded by these different metabolic types

and will never develop a fanatic attitude about biological

individuality – they take it for granted as one of their basic

understandings of human nature that there is a great variety of

metabolic types..

[Guest guest]

Dear Vinod:

 

I want to thank you for this brilliant post.

 

chai nitai

[Guest guest]

> arted paying attention to the new American diet fad – low

> carbohydrate – high protein – this diet theory is completely

> researched and scientifically valid – it basically is a treatment

> for neurasthenia, obesity, and or insulin resistance. Many are

> following this diet to reduce weight. It is based on meat and animal

> fat with little or no grains products or sugars and little if any

> starchy vegetables. Many tens of thousands of Americans are

> following this diet to great benefit. But slowly the weak points in

> this diet are beginning to show up – and it showed up in this woman

> relatively quickly as she began to suffer toxemia from poorly

> balanced nutrients for her type and excess protein for her type.

 

the case history (actually anecdote) you have presented is far from

being an anything remotely appropriate for an unbiased assessment. It

is evidence of nothing, except perhaps, your own biased conclusions.

If you really want to make your point, instead of bludgeoning us with

yet more of your rhetoric, why not adopt a professional and

comprehensive manner is presenting your case history. Then maybe we

might learn something.

 

>

> This diet works well for many in the short term but actually only a

> small percentage have a prakruti that will allow them to be healthy

> on such a `heavy ` diet.

 

yet more opinion.

Are you even a practitioner Vinod? do you see patients, take case

histories and do some kind of analysis to determine if your conclusions

are valid?

 

> Natural meateaters need two indispensable

> substances – purines and animal (saturated ) fats – it is difficult

> to impossible to get these substances from vegetable diet – but for

> people of a vegetarian nature these two items can be toxic.

 

what do you mean "vegetarian" nature? In your previous posts you admit

that the wide-spread adoption of vegetarianism in India is fairly

recent. Our human genome was 99.9% formed before the advent of the

agricultural revolution, i.e. during the paleolithic. The diet of the

paleolithic peoples, and thus ALL humans (unless you also claim

extra-terrestrial heritage), was based in a hunter-gatherer diet rich

in animal proteins and fats, and a myriad of plants foods, none of

which even remotely resemble their modern, hybridized versions.

 

for more information check out the extensive research of Loren Cordain:

http://www.thepaleodiet.com/

 

> There is

> a new theory coming out of these new studies which I believe explains

> all of these contradictions - that is the theory of metabolic

> typing. This concept postulates that we should discover our own

> metabolic type and eat according to that types needs. They propose

> three metabolic types – sound familiar?

 

this is not all that recent, but I agree with you, it seems remarkably

similar to Ayurveda typing

although the authors don't claim so, it appears much has been lifted

from Ayurvedic medicine

but there are some problems, namely, traditional Ayurvedic medicine

doesn't actually prescribe specific diets, but rather, a knowledge of

which foods are best (e.g. according to Madanaphala, grapes for fruit,

venison for meat, etc.), and how they affect the body

having people adopt such and such a diet is actually a fairly myopic

approach to diet, and is an artifact modern Ayurveda

 

> The concept is one that I

> hope many students of Ayurveda will investigate. It is something

> familiar to us in India and actually clarifies in a nice way many

> confusing problems. By the bye – the protein type does not have to

> eat meat to be healthy – but it is easier for many to regain their

> health quickly eating animal foods.

 

your statements are misleading and contradict the view of William

Wolcott, who promulgates this theory

people on the list can read the book for themselves

have you even read it???

 

http://www.amazon.ca/exec/obidos/ASIN/0767905644/qid=1081630915/sr=1-1/

ref=sr_1_0_1/701-1690997-7560307

 

> Such ideas are coming close to the understanding of the Rishis that

> there is not one diet that will be correct for everyone. Many of

> those who found that meat eating strengthened them up and gave

> them `substance' – losing their super vata state – when they went to

> this direction most of them were so weak they naturally responded

> well to the diet and now they have made it into a religion and want

> to force everyone to follow their path.

 

who on tis list has said diet is religion?

the only people that have, have been the vegetarians advocates -

otherwise, its just food

 

> These people have even tried

> to pass laws to feed school children high protein low carbohydrate

> diets. Such a movement was attempted in San Diego California. You

> will find these converts from vegetarianism to meat eating throughout

> the internet trying to convince vegetarians to give up their style of

> eating and start eating plenty of flesh and fat. It is like a

> conversion to a new religion – it breeds fanaticism and contention.

 

nothing i have stated has anything other than to do with:

a) our human ancestry

b) the emerging scientific evidence

c) a thorough review of traditional Ayurvedic medicine

 

for presenting my thoughts and ideas I have been personally attacked by

you and now am essentially being called a fanatic

the thing is, you haven't overturned a single argument I have made

except with you own opinions

 

> These people (reformed vegetarians) have web sites attacking

> vegetarians viciously – one site calls vegetarians mentally ill. They

> are like many reformists and converts – fanatic and irrational – they

> can not settle in the middle or find balance. They approach their new

 

how is this unlike calling people that eat meat spiritually dull and

tamasic?

 

 

>

> that they are seen to be correct. Common sense is never as important

> to fanatics as their 'references'.

 

so we are to take your word simply as truth, just because you tells us?

and you insinuate _my_ fanaticism

 

btw Vinod, you say you haven't seen insulin resistance in your

vegetarian peer group

tell me, how do you determine this? what clinical tests and

examinations do you perform to determine this?

Caldecott

www.wrc.net/phyto

phyto