Reacting to appeals

[Guest guest]

Sai ram dear all,

 

The people quoted below have raised valid points to ponder about.

Regardless of the enthusiasm and good intentions with which we might

start a contingent fund, it might lose steam in the course of time,

for as many people have pointed out, keeping it up will entail

continuous fund collection which Baba has warned against. Another

point is that we're an amorphous group spread out all over the

world, and have come together in this group for the purpose of

sharing information about Baba's teachings and to get inspiration

and bliss. The huge endeavour and organisational input needed to

form a committee of directors, formulate ground rules, and to direct

the distribution of funds will likely take the focus away from

the "core competency" of the group, as CS Rao put it.

 

On the other hand, we cannot ignore the appeals for help that are

addressed directly to us as a group, like the one from student

Kumuda in Australia. If an appeal touches our heart, it is best that

we react to it on an individual basis but with group co-operation.

For eg, sister Shivathmika too stays in Australia, as per her

previous post. If she would be so kind as to take responsibility of

helping the devotees who want to help Kumuda, maybe we can all

contact her at her email address individually and send her funds

which she can then transfer over to Kumuda. This way, the focus of

the group will remain on the initial purpose of Satsang, and at the

same time people who feel so moved can also do their bit for

contributing to appeals on an individual basis through group

contacts. If we keep it on a one-to-one level we will probably be

more effective in quenching the immediate distress of the appealer.

I humbly beg the group to consider this, as it may reconcile the

people who are in favour of setting up a fund, and the people who

are disposed against the idea of fund collection.

 

Warm regards,

Mangala

 

*******************************************************************

 

> "SAIpapu" <saipapu>

> Fri Aug 5, 2005 11:02pm

> Re: [saibabanews] Re: Collecting fund and the Sai Prayer

> Group

>

> I feel best way to contribute is to contribut Swami's Trust and

> Trust may be requested to take up the individual issues who can

also

> verify the genuinity of the case.

>

> Sairam and Regards

> papu

>

> ----------

>

> "csrao" <mrcsrao>

> Fri Aug 5, 2005 11:09pm

> Collecting monies

>

> Sai Sisters and brothers,

> The group had been doing fine, what with the exchange of thoughts

> centering around Swami. This is as it should be. Let the Group not

> drift in to collecting and distributing monies. This is not the

main

> objective nor is the core competence of the group. Let individuals

> decide when and to who to donate. Let this Group confine its

> activities to Swami and his teachings,and try to live life as he

> directs us to live.

> Sai Ram,

> csrao.

>

> ----------

>

> "sundaram" <sundaram_6@s...>

> Fri Aug 5, 2005 11:54pm

> Re: [saibabanews] Re: Collecting fund and the Sai Prayer

> Group

>

> Sairam:

> I agree with Sai sister Sonya Tomlinson Burke. Our beloved Baba

> advises us to give food and not money to anybody. As a Sai

Devotee,

> Swami in me does not agree to the idea of collecting funds. as

true devotees, we should follow Baba's advices in

> letter and spirit.

> We may collect funds and donate to anyone for a specific cause,

like

> medical expenses, education expenses etc. But to collect funds

and

> maintain as a contingent fund.....I am afraid our Sai Ma may not

> approve.

> This is my personal opinion. I leave it to our other Sai Brothers

> and sisters to decide.

> sairam

>

> ----------

>

>

> "SAI KAVI" <niraakaaram>

> Sat Aug 6, 2005 2:19am

> ABOUT DONATIONS by SWAMI

 

> "...EVEN BEFORE YOUR DEVOTION RIPENS YOU STRIVE TO LEAD OTHERS.

YOU

> COLLECT DONATIONS AND SUBSCRIPTIONS AND PLAN TEMPLES AND

SOCIETIES;

> ALL THIS IS MERE SHOW, WHICH BRINGS SPIRITUAL LOSS, RATHER THAN

> SPIRITUAL GAIN. WHEN YOU START PUBLICITY, YOU DESCEND TO THE LEVEL

> OF

> THOSE WHO COMPETE IN COLLECTING CLIENTELE, DECRYING OTHERS AND

> EXTOLLING THEMSELVES. WHERE MONEY IS CALCULATED AND GARNERED, AND

> EXHIBITED TO DEMONSTRATE ONE'S ACHIEVEMENTS, I WILL NOT BE

PRESENT.

> I

> COME ONLY WHERE SINCERITY, FAITH AND SURRENDER ARE VALUED. SO

SPEND

> THE SILENT HOURS IN MEDITATION AND REPETION OF THE NAME OF GOD IN

> YOUR

> OWN HOMES AND DEEPEN FAITH."

> (BTPOS P 329)

>

> LET EACH ONE GIVE OUT OF THE FULLNESS OF HIS HEART, ON HIS

> OWN

> INITIATIVE, WHATEVER HE CAN GIVE GLADLY, AFTER STUDYING WELL THE

> PRESENT WORK AND THE FUTURE POSSIBILITIES OF THE INSTITUTION.

> YOUR DUTY IS ONLY TO INFORM; DO NOT TRY EVEN TO PERSUADE; BEGGING

> FOR

> THE SAKE OF WORK WHICH IS INHERENTLY GOOD IS AN INSULT TO HUMAN

> NATURE; THE MAN WHO ASKS AND THE MAN WHO IS ASKED ARE BOTH

DEMEANED."

> (SSS VOL III CHAP. 24 P 124)

>

> TAKEN FROM THE BOOK:

> "A COMPENDIUM OF THE TEACHINGS OF SATHYA SAI BABA"

> COMPILED BY

> CHARLENE LESLIE-CHADEN

>

> LOVE TO ALL ~ KAVI ~ JAI SAI RAM

[Guest guest]

"Thara Balaji" <tharabalaji

Sat Aug 6, 2005 11:19pm

Re:Reacting to appeals

 

Sai Ram.

I agree totally with Mangala. Somehow I was not feeling at home on

noticing the discussions going on about funding, collection etc.,

Mangala's suggestion of responding to any call for help on an

individual basis - probably through another group member in the

locality - sounds very good and practical too; this way, the service

to others is also achieved and at the same time, there is no room

for any misgivings.

Jai Sai Ram.

Balajees

 

----------

 

nayanika jayaram romanyuk <galaxyandromeda22

Sun Aug 7, 2005 0:21am

Re: [saibabanews] Reacting to appeals

 

Sai Ram dear all

 

I have been following and reading all the letters of distress , help

needed and prayers wanted from numerous letters. They are on the

increase. It is indeed very honourable and noble to make this

contingency fund and start of being there for the individual who

needs the help.

 

I have got down to penning down my thoughts since i have been in

this for a major part of my work in India and with Gubernational

organizations and for charity work...

 

It makes a lot of practical sense to have a trustee who can be

entrusted with meteing justice at selected ports where individuals

and their pain and distress needs to be alleiviated. Sister Mangala

has really put it very succinctly. With a wondrous and a ligthning

transport through a medium such as a computer we can reach succour

within a twinkling of the eye metaphorically speaking.

 

Being with Swami and in his benevolence and with his

munificence...we must clean and shine our mirrors[read transport

sans interference]to project swami to the individual...in this we

would be his sahodaras . In a book the manuscript of which i read

and now printed " India the motherland of all humanity", by Yaa

Owousa..Baba singualarly spells out the need for the need of

individuals who have honed in his teachings and his sparshan to the

t and the dots on the i, to be where the individual in distress is

and address the problem. Sammartha Sadguru Shirdi Saibaba says deen

dhukhi ke dukh ko jo mittatha hai , usko Baba ke aashish aur jeevan

ashirwaad se bhar dhungha....Furthermore the use of the ash of the

incense, or mother earth and sand when applied in complete and total

faith and with intent is indeed niraculous in its cure...this is a

personal experience when oft there is no vibhuti or mother

earth..the ash from the incense stick has done the needful...

 

Money in hard currency may also not be necessary it could be in kind

and in terms of accountables like medicines, clothes warm if the

area is cold ....and we can do an oxfam in our neighborhood

collecting books and usable old clothes shoes and a host of

reusables which will keep these individuals from undue

sufferance...transferring the money collected to the areas or

individuals...sai centres can be the venues for this oxfam like

venture and it needs the will and the motivation and Swami in our

hearts

 

Noble work and needs to be begun now

In Swami's light and his grace

Nayanika

 

----------

 

Jatindar Shad <egreatindia

Sun Aug 7, 2005 3:19am

SHOULD WE COLLECT MONEY OR NOT?

 

Sai Ram

 

A debate is going on in the forum to the proposed extension of SPG

in a FUNDS division which can be used to provide succor and relief

to our brohers and sisters who are victims of calamities.

 

For the funds - accepting donation was suggested, which has got many

responses, but the confusion persists - Whether Swami permits

collecting of money. Well this what Swami says at different

occassions:

 

Discourse of Sathya Sai Baba, Dhaarwar, 14 May 1971

 

The Sathya Sai Organisation and its units must not collect money or

material from those outside the membership. Fund collection is as

much opposed to this movement as fire is to water. If you yield on

this point, spiritual advance will perish. Let only members

contribute; do not ask all and sundry, or anyone who is not a member

of the Samithi (unit).

 

In Mysore State there are some who distribute Amrith, Vibhuthi (holy

ash) and other articles announcing that they are showering from my

pictures at their places; they do this free for some weeks, and

later, they start begging for money, like any common mendicant! This

is sin, to ask so and also to give so. Devotees should keep far away

from such places and persons.

 

Discourse of Sathya Sai Baba, Meeting of the Trustees, Mysore, 15

September 1963

 

I must tell you, however, that for such good causes as this, you

should not collect money in devious ways. Help should come from

pious hearts, from well-earned money, from persons who know and

appreciate the purpose for which they give. That is why I oppose all

benefit shows, where you tempt people with a dance, or a drama or a

film and collect money for your pet plan. I am also against

lotteries, where the lure of getting a big prize, for which one does

not do anything, a prize collected out of other people's earnings,

is used for the collection of funds.

 

Let each one give, out of the fullness of his heart, on his own

initiative, whatever he can give gladly, after studying well the

present work and the future possibilities of the institution. Your

duty is only to inform; do not try even to persuade; begging for the

sake of work which is inherently good is an insult to human nature;

the man who asks and the man who is asked, both are demeaned.

 

Discourse of Sathya Sai Baba, Simla, 17 Mar 1973

 

Money comes and goes, Morality comes and grows

 

Man is the synthesis of all the feelings, emotions and reactions

that arise in his mind. The mind is the seat of all urges, desires

and thoughts. When the mind is clean, the world cognised by it will

also be clean. When the mind is turbid and riddled with fear, the

world will appear miserable and depressing. Many people blame the

world, without knowing that the fault lies in themselves. Their

thinking is crooked; their thoughts are not wholesome; their minds

are restless, because they are too full of unfulfilled desires. Rich

or poor, educated or uneducated, high or low, they see the world

through the glasses of their own prejudices and predilections and

they condemn or extol it in order to please themselves!

 

The proper study of mankind is man. For, man is the centre of

things. And, in man, the mind has to studied and controlled and

regulated. His thoughts originate in the mind, they express

themselves through words and are materialised through deeds. These

three have to be properly co-ordinated by the intellect; or else,

life becomes a tragedy. The mind has to be trained to develop a

taste for the good and the godly; not, for money and material gains.

Money comes and goes; but, morality comes and grows.

 

Swami has never condemed fund collection, like some devotees have

even called it a sin. Yes, He has limited it to devotees who are

part of a Samithi and who are giving whole heartedly after fully

understanding the program. Importantly we never ask for money - we

just inform devotees and leave it to them to descide.

 

Regarding SIN, this is what Swami says,"There is no sin when the act

is done for the promotion of Dharma and removal of Adharma."

 

Sai Ram - Be Happy

 

JP

[Guest guest]

I can see the fear, confusion and hesitation about mega seva projects as a

combined force with a focus on serving Swamy in many through a seperate trust.

We have Swami's Trust and Swami is showing the Royal Path to serve Humanity

without borders or religious affiliation.

When I responded and offered a collective plan, I made it very clear that this

is not a plea to collect funds and create a seperate trust.

It is a dream that can become a reality, where the Unity, Love and Life

Application of Swami's teachings and his love can be expressed anywhere in the

World without a moment of hesitation when there is a place where people can

come for sharing with no constraints or barriers or controls.

I do feel the hesitation of teh brothers and sisters in this group, and concur

with the fears of violating the rules of spirituality and the core of Swami's

teachings, about fund collection. However Self less and Noble the cause might

be, Please let us put a stop to this discussion of fund collection and appelas

and do the needful through the Indivduals in their respective Satya Sai

Organizations and the voluntary contributions. It is not good to force anyone

to come together on monetary issues.

I do not think it is advisable to seek guidance on something like money matters

from Bhagawan and the core of his teachings is detached service and rise to the

occassion. However the enthusiastic individuals who want to serve they will

always take their purse and open their hearts and will serve.

At this point of time, I want to keep THE S.A.I. out of this confusion and we

will continue to dedicate ourselves at the individual level taking Swami's

teachings into the communities at all levels of Health, Education and Social

Welfare. I do feel that SAI had dedicated itself and had been successful in the

endeavors as SWAMY is the DOER for SAI.

I humbly request an apology from all the group members to have caused a massive

stir in the spiritual pespective of this discussion group, as a result of my

suggestions and offering. Please letus not waste any momemnt of our seeking of

the Lord within us through this discussion. It is Swami expressing himself

through so many and it is healthy and wise to not to discuss anymore about

this.

I am someone who travels to spread Educare at my own cost and do not take any

remuneration although I do this as an invited Guest Speaker. That is my

commitment to spread Bhagawan's teachings into the local Western World and I

seek Swami's forgiveness in all of you.

In his service with love

Meena Chintapalli

[Guest guest]

Dear sister Meena,

 

It is a privilege for us to have in this group an

accomplished, socially aware, generous and warm

hearted person like youself who is above all

completely committed to service at His Lotus Feet.

Please do not apologize for your thought-provoking and

dynamic inputs to the group on this matter. Regardless

of the mixed reception to the suggestion for a prayer

group trust fund, I'm sure it did everyone good by

expanding the limits of their current thinking and in

inspiring people to come up with proactive ideas for

living out the Sai ideal. It is invaluable to have

someone whose life is already actively committed to

service give suggestions and ideas to the rest of the

group - it is the catalyst for a gradual expansion in

our perspective of what is possible.

 

Please do continue to provide your guidance and unique

perspective at every junction, I for one am immensely

appreciative of the wisdom born out of your rich

experience and the inspiration with which you provide

us.

 

Warm regards,

Mangala

[Guest guest]

Thank you very much for the confidence and I will participate in the satsangs

and most of teh people are invaluable in their reseach, reading and timely

advises. I am very happy that I belong to this divine group and it is learning

all the way for all ofusthrough our experiences

In his service with love

Meena ChintapalliMangala Ramprakash <gamsetmach (AT) (DOT) co.uk> wrote:

Dear sister Meena,It is a privilege for us to have in this group anaccomplished,

socially aware, generous and warmhearted person like youself .....

[Guest guest]

I think that you all are right in stating that we should not think about fund

collection anymore from now. Let us remove this negativity that was all started

by me. Yesterday a strange and painful incident took place(something personal)

and i think Swami has rightly punished me for thinking about fund collection.

My ego had grown like a huge ballon and Swami has punctured it at the right

moment. With tears in my eyes and deep respect andd gratitude fr all members i

apologise for all the inconviniece caused to the members. I promise that from

on i will not be involved in any money matters whatever may be the case. Pls

forgive me.

With respect and love,

 

Sairam.

[Guest guest]

"Melody McClarty" <blngs2sai

Mon Aug 8, 2005 1:42pm

Re: [saibabanews] Re: Reacting to appeals

 

Dearest Arvind,

 

I have not to date gotten involved in the discussion of money

collecting and funds. I have actually been pondering it deeply and I

am happy to see that it has resolved itself with

Swami's aide and will.

 

Your apology and your punishment??

 

Dearest Arvind ...

EVERYTHING that Swami does .. whether we view it as

good or bad .. is done through LOVE .. and ONLY LOVE.

 

Swami does not punish .. he corrects when it is needed.

You have ..to my knowledge .. offended no one. We are all

adults here and spiritually minded. It would be small and petty for

any of us to be offended by an open discussion between brothers and

sisters about trying to more seva for

others.

 

Unfortunately though .. this is the Kali Yuga age ... and as soon as

money is even mentioned .. it is enough to corrupt even the best of

friends.

 

Please .. think nothing of this..

there is no need in my mind that you should feel the

need to apologize for anything but I understand and deeply

respect the intention of your action.

 

We are Sai Family ... and your good intentions on all

accounts is all that I see.

 

Sai Ram

Your sister in Sai always

Melody

 

----------

 

Angelicpassage

Mon Aug 8, 2005 1:48pm

Re: [saibabanews] Re: Reacting to appeals

 

Im sorry to hear about your painful experience, Swami is all love

and he will help you.

Sai Ram

 

"Always look at the positive side of things" Sri Sathya Sai

 

----------

 

"csrao" <mrcsrao

Mon Aug 8, 2005 1:54pm

Reacting to appeals

 

Respected Sai Bakth "Arvind Sherigar",

we are sorry for the bad incident and hope with Swami's blessings,

every thing is now smooth. I am sure it is not the way or is in the

nature of Swami to punish his Bakthas. It is, I believe more due to

fate and destiny. Swami will only bless us with strength and wisdom

to

face it.We all pray for you. We all do things in good faith. Swami

will never punish his children. I am sure about it.

Sairam

csrao

 

 

 

 

 

 

saibabanews, Arvind Sherigar

<arvind1180> wrote:

> Dear Sai Family,

> I think that you all are right in stating that we should not think

about fund collection anymore from now.....

[Guest guest]

You meant well by rising to the calling of teh Lord within. When we openly put

forth htis kind of proposal, there are a lot of concerns and every human being

has their own way of processinmg the information. Swami is LOVE and he works

out of love. He does not cause harm or injury, rather he takes physical injury

and hurts himself for the sins of Humanity ( all the fractures, of his

extremities and the leg broken inot 3 pieces is secondary to the loss of Dharma

and it's 3 feet, one for each YUGA, ).

I want to plead you to think above the physical 'I" which is the reaction,

reflection and not to worry & apologize.

Love and blessings

Meena ChintapalliArvind Sherigar <arvind1180 > wrote:

Dear Sai Family,

I think that you all are right in stating that we should not think about fund

collection anymore from now. .....

[Guest guest]

Dear Brother

Sairam, I do not know what happened with u, Buthave faith in bhagwan what

ever he does he does for our good. Yes there is no need to collect the fund and

make it a project, Do what ever little seva you can do at your

level(Money&physical) and do not expect any thing in return. We cannot raise

our hand and close our eyes If we met someone we meet needy because once we

are cheated by a fool.( a person who has cheated u or hurt you he is adding bad

karama himself in his account)

A small incident recently happend with me, I just want to tell my brother and

sister that we should do whatever little we can do we must do ( iam not saying

to set a project do it at personal level)

I reached prasanti on sunday 7th my both the sons are supposed to be there from

madras school for bhagwan darshan with school.

I reached prashanti by karnatka exp. few buses were standing to pickup the

volunteers, Some elderly volunteer suggested me to go by there bus so i have to

walk less. U know all the buses stopped at the volunteers building and bus in

which i was travelling took us up to the shed, Because the driver was new all

the volunteers start arguing with him, i though better i get down because i was

there for day darshan not for seva. Bus dropped me in from of Shed # 18 the door

was closed i was not aware who is in this shed i asked to the opposite shed

volunteer , Any children arriveds from cheenai today morning he said yes but

there bus met with the accident and some of the students are at the super

speciallity hospital, I was shocked to hear this ! before i could respond

Shed # 18 door opened and few children came out side i rushed to them to check

they are from which school , Yes they were from cheenai and in the same bus and

my younger son was also in the same

bus. Immediatly children realise i am mother of Shayshank Rathore they said

your son is taking bath he was in the same bus and with the blessings of baba

all the children are safe and only few children are at hospital for their Ist

aid and one sir hand is factured It was not a small accidend it took place in

night bus fell down near the river and after two full round it stood upuside

down next day the picture appear in the local language newspaper. When next day

i saw the pict. in the news paper tears roll out from my eyes, how much swami

take care of us.

He has arranged the bus and dropped me axactly in front of that shed only.

Other wise i would have taken the auto and enquired about the children at the

accomodation counter. I would have got this news at the counter. As i was all

alone the distance between accomodation counter and shed is not very small.

I feel swami has answered someone prayer or some one good act. I feel very

strongly we all should do whatever little we can do in our surrounding to help

someone to stand.

We keep on doing doing mistake did any one of us heard that swami will not come

for darshan because we are not following his very simple message Love all Serve

all.

>From last many years he is trying to explain this simple messages only. How

many of us following his words. Its is very simple to stop any good work ,

yes difficult to continue but not impossible dear brother and sister .

Wish you all the best

Sairam

Vijay Laxmi

ranawatvl

New Delhi

[Guest guest]

Sai Ram to everyone ...

 

This email truly touched my heart .. I am so happy for you

Vijay that Swami took such good CARE of you and your children. His grace is so

profuse sometimes we are unaware

of just HOW MUCH grace he does give us all the time is

little things.

 

The prayer group has truly brought home to me not to give

up working on Swami's most simpliest of messages - which

Vijay herself mentions here ....

 

*** LOVE ALL, SERVE ALL ***

 

In light of this .. I have reflected greatly of late about this.

Just this morning .. a friend of mine who loves Swami in her

heart but who is part of the Hari Krishna movement called

me to tell me about 7 young men who were driving togeather

in a Van to go to some Hari Krishna function.

 

Thier car went over a cliff yesterday and the one was killed

instantly and the rest are in ICU and not expected to live.

All of them are very young men .. in thier 20's.

 

I am endeavoring to get thier names to include them in the

prayer list. But my friends first response was ... could she

put them on the prayer list as they were Hari Krishna devotees ...??

 

I assurred her that we must begin to see GOD in EVERYONE ... as Swami teaches

.... LOVE ALL, SERVE ALL.

 

Vijay's email here .. just seemed such an affirmation of

this .. It is a feeling that I hope we all strive for ...

 

Vijay ... I am so happy that Swami took such good care of

you and your children .. Wonderful blessings.

 

Sai Ram

Your sister in Sai always

Melody

 

 

-

vijay laxmi

Tuesday, August 09, 2005 3:26 AM

[saibabanews] Re: Reacting to appeals