Guest guest Posted December 26, 2005 Report Share Posted December 26, 2005 thetranslation. -- Interview with Nawabzadaa Nabiullah Khan Interviewed by Jalil Amir --- Q:Please tell us about your stay with Qazi Hussain Ahmed A:Qazi has two bungalows in Peshawar. We spent lot of timein both the houses. The first house is where his familylived and the second house was his office and rest house. But he used to meet all his friends and relatives andpolitical workers only in his family house. He made sure atleast for 3 days in a week, Qazi and his close friends usedto spend time in his rest house. Unlike his family house,the rest house had all the amenities that one can think of.It had 36-inch television. 2 satellite dishes to receiveall kinds of telecasts from all over the world. He had madeextensive notes on all the telecasts. We used to discussall the things under the sun in his rest house. I had a habit of drinking small amounts of wine. Qazi neverdrank or smoked. Qazi knew about my weakness for wine. Headvised me not to drink and asked me to follow the steps ofProphet Mohammad (PBUH) . Though I had a habit of drinkingonly in very small amounts of fine wine just before dinner,on Qazi's insistence, I left that habit. When I wasstudying in engineering college, I had started the habit ofsmoking too. I left that habit after Qazi's advice onsmoking. I stayed with Qazi for almost 6 years in Peshawar. I didnot agree to some of the strategies used by JI during theafter Zia years. Qazi is a very practical man while I wasmore of an idealist at that time. I was insisting that theJI should not rely on ballot as the only route to power.Qazi was insisting that ballot is the only way for JI tocome to power in Pakistan. This introduced a sense ofalienation between Qazi and me. Hence when I went toBaluchistan to meet my parents, I stayed back rather thangoing back to Peshawar. Even though almost weekly once wetalk over phone, Qazi never called me back to stay with himand I found my work as the Jamaat teacher in Quetta where Istay now with my parents and family. Yet, my years with Qazi in Peshawar and around the worldwith him were the most satisfying years in my lifeintellectually. Q: What are Qazi's views on Islam and Prophet Mohammad(PBUH) A: Qazi was a great admirer and student of Prophet Mohammad(PBUH) . He modeled his whole thoughts and life on the lifeand teachings of Mohammad (PBUH). I was astounded manytimes by Qazi when he does a small thing, he willimmediately compare that incident with an incident in Al-Hadith and explain that he did what Prophet Mohammad (PBUH)did 10 centuries ago. I had never seen a person who hadmodeled his whole life on sayings and teachings of ProphetMohammad (PBUH) like Qazi. Q: The women issue is very controversial nowadays. Talibanand some fundamentalist organizations restrict the freedomof women. While some progressive Muslim intellectuals areinsisting that the women are equal to men in all spheres.What are Qazi's views on women? A: As I said earlier, the Prophet Mohammad (PBUH)'s viewson women are the exact views of Qazi. Equality of men andwomen is stupidity. What men can do, women cannot do andwhat women can do, men cannot do. Women are weak physicallyand mentally compared to men. For this we do not need anyproof other than to just look at men and women. Men have totake care of women all the time. If some women do not haveany male relatives, then they have to find a man and marryhim so that he will take care of her. Women should not havelife outside the family. Education can be provided to thembut not to compete with men in public. Neither they canfight in war nor they can be of use in peacetime politics.Qazi had said once that JI comes to power in Pakistan, hewill abolish the voting rights of women and minorities. Only the Muslim men can participate in voting or standingfor elections. When I asked the proof from Hadiths, he hadquoted many Hadiths in support of that. I asked him why isthat it is never talked openly in the public by Jamaat.Qazi had said that the hints are all over the place. But JIdid not make it a big issue since the women who currentlyhave the voting may vote against JI in the elections ifsuch a thing is said openly. For this I was against. in myopinion, since all the main leaders of Jamaat believes thatwomen will not have voting rights after they come to power,they should openly say that. If you do not say now and thenyou remove the voting rights later when you come to power,that is going to build a resentment among the people. ButQazi was firmly of the opinion that JI should not say thatnow. Q:That brings us to the question of minorities. Will theyhave to pay Jizya tax? A:Yes. They have to pay the tax. As explained by Qazi, theidea of Jizya is not protection money. But it is a monetaryforce on the non-Muslim to convert to Islam. Once theJamaat comes to power, the minorities will be induced(forced) to become Muslims either by monetary orpsychological factors. JI is already equating the Indiawith Hindus so that the Hindus of Pakistan will be forcedto become Muslims. This was very successful strategy duringthe Babri Masjid riots. JI actively involved in destroyingthe Hindu temples in Punjab and Sindh. We ordered thedestruction of the Hindu family property too. But our mainaim was to destroy the Hindu temples. We wrote the JIpamphlets that destroying each pagan temple make a Muslimmove closer to heaven of Allah. We used the Hadiths in allthe pamphlets. Babar destroyed the Ram temple in Ayodhya.Because he was a true believer. The same way every Muslimshould take upon himself to destroy the Hindu temples inPakistan. Our idea was to encourage the Muslims of Indiaalso to destroy the Hindu temples in India. But this wasnot met with much success since the Hindu police in Indiastarted attacking the Muslims who were doing the Allah'sduty. Q: What kind of government that JI envisages for Pakistan? A: It will be the Sharia govt. Sharia will be made ourconstitution so that the eminent Muslim scholars who hadcompleted the schooling in Madrassas will be appointed asthe Judges in every court. Qazi wanted to make thepresidium on the same model as the Khalifa. Presently ourideas is that the entire top leadership of JI as well asall three military Generals will be part of the presidiumfor which the Qazi will be the Kalifa. We are keenlywatching the progress of Taliban and learning from it. Weare impressed with the Taliban on the women issue,minorities issue and law and order issue. Mullah Omar is agreat friend of Qazi. Omar had visited his house manytimes. In the tentative talks, we had decided to form unionof Pakistan and Afghanistan once the right conditions areset in Pakistan (i.e. the JI government in Pakistan). Ourmotto is Constant Jihad. The idea is to keep Pakistan in aconstant state of Jihad all the time. Qazi's vision is thatPakistan will be center of the new Islamic Empire thatstretches from Burma to Afghanistan and from Srilanka toTajikistan including Kashmir. Towards that end, Jamaat willuse all tactics from terrorism in the kafir-controlledareas to negotiations in the Muslim controlled areas. Already the Jamaat leaders of Bangladesh and Jamaat leadersof India had accepted the primacy of Pakistani leadershipin this regard. Q: Do they come to Pakistan? A: Yes. We had made arrangements once in Peshawar andanother time in Multan during the Zia time. But theunderstanding remains even now. Q: What about Srilanka and Burma? A: Both are Buddhist nations. For that matter evenBaluchistan and Afghanistan were Buddhist once while Sindhand Punjab were Hindu earlier. Buddhists are generallyweaker in matters of faith. Hence we hope they will becomeMuslim with a little pressure. But that will happen onlyafter Jamaat conquers first Pakistan and then India. Q: What are the plans for India? It looks like entire Indiapolicy of Jamaat revolves around Kashmir. A: Yes that is true. But that is for a very good reason.See Kashmir is like a keystone that sits on a top of thearch. It is true that the arch holds the entire weight ofthe keystone. But if you remove the keystone, then thewhole arch falls down. That is why it is called keystone.Kashmir is the keystone for India. Once you remove that,then India can no longer be secular and it will not be aunited country either. like the stones of the arch, all thebricks will fall down. Qazi impressed this idea upon Zia. Hence Zia started the Operation Topac. Operation Topac'sidea is not to get Kashmir for Pakistan as thought of byIndian analysts. Operation Topac is much more. The ultimateaim of Operation Topac is to make India a million pieces sothat it is easy for Pakistan to swallow India once piece ata time. That is why Pakistan was encouraging the militancymovements all over India. Once Kashmir is taken out, thesemilitancy movements will break India by asking the similarfreedom for Nagaland, Kerala, Mizoram, Meghalaya, Manipur,Assam, Jharkand, Tamil Nadu, West Bengal and Khalistan. ButBenazir destroyed our whole plan by giving away the detailsof the operation Topac to Indian govt. led by Rajiv Gandhi.That was a big set back for our vision. But yet we aremoving ahead. Q: I heard that she gave away only details about Khalistanmovement. A: That is true. In my opinion, that is why I think thedamage is limited. India thinks and deals with separatistmovements in different parts of India as if they aregenuine movements even now. In that way, I say, the damageis limited. Q: Do you think if the states if India became independentcountries, no such similar movement will start in Pakistanitself? A: No. Jiye Sindh movement and small separatist movementsin Baluchistan and Peshawar are contained. We are not goingto deal with the separatism in Pakistan as India treats theseparatists. It will be Taliban style. Actually we do notforesee any position for opposition in JI ruled Pakistan.Hence the BNP and Pakhtoonkwa leaders will be madeirrelevant. A: Coming back to the same point, If India to become manycountries how do you deal with the individual Hindu states.They may even become big enemies of Pakistan. Or they mayagain regroup to challenge Pakistan. A: Qazi and other people had already discussed thispossibility. In our opinion, such a thing is not possiblesince the language and cultural differences between statesin India are enormous. There is no language like Urdu tobind all Indians. English and not Hindi that is commonlanguage between all the states of India. Hence we haveplanned to start riots in each state against theneighborhood state people so that the states will always beat the state of war. For example there are lot ofKannadigas in TamilNadu and Telugu in Madras. We will startthe anti -telugu riots in Madras, which will keep theAndhrapradesh and TamilNadu fighting. If we keep a bomb inTelugu Cinema Theater in Madras and keep a bomb in TamilMovie Theater in Andhra, the war between Tamilnadu andAndhra will run for eternity. The similar things can bedone in Assam cultural center in Bengal and Hindi pracharsabha in Orissa. Given the differences between thenationalities in India, the options for Pakistan areendless. Qazi's vision is to make entire India a 100%Muslim Nation. A United India, where Hindus are majority isan impediment to that. Like Prophet Mohammad (PBUH) madeMuslims out of pagans of Arabia, Qazi also wants to makeMuslims out of the pagans of India. Q: This is a great vision since this was not even possiblefor the Muslim dynasties and Moguls who ruled India for thelast 700 years. A: True. That is because they had never really establishedthe Muslim Empire. Though the Kings were Muslims they hadentertained the Hindus in positions of power. When you makean unequivocal statement that only Muslims are voters anddeclare that India is Islamic republic, then automaticallythe people will become Muslims. Little bit of terror had tobe applied to the heart of Hindus and Christians. I willgive you a best example. The portions now constitutePakistan had 25% Hindu population before Independence.After independence lot of Hindus migrated to India. Yetafter the migration, Pakistani Hindu population was 15%. Doyou know what is the percentage now? It is less than 1%. How was this made possible? How did the Hindus converted toIslam in a short span of 20 years whereas for 700 yearsthey had never converted to Islam? That is purely becauseof the terror of the partition. That terror forced theHindus who remained in Pakistan to become Muslims. Pure andsimple. JI used similar techniques in Punjab and Sindh eachtime a riot breaks out in India, we had used that pretextto strike terror among the Hindus, Christians andAhmaddiahs. The similar terror will be at the heart of theevery non-Muslim both Hindu as well as Christian in comingyears in entire India. Qazi is a analytical genius whoknows every strategy that is used by Prophet Mohammad(PBUH) will be and should be used in India to achieve thetotal submission to Allah. Q: Do you envision a possibility that when the Kashmirbecomes part of Pakistan, there could be large-scale riotsin India against Indian Muslims? Hence unwittingly Kashmircould lead to more deaths of Indian Muslims and damageIslamic Ummah. A: Yes that is a possibility. But our ideology is based onQuran and Hadiths. Prophet Mohammad (PBUH) in numerousHadiths and Allah in Quran had said that any Muslim whoassociates with a polytheist in a polytheist. Muslimscannot be friendly with a non-Muslim. This includes theChristians, Jews and Hindus. Also Mohammad (PBUH) says thateven if the Muslim ruler is not good, the Muslims stay withthe ruler than to go out to a non-Muslim country. Hadithsand Quran are very explicit regarding this. All the Muslimswho did not migrate to Pakistan during Partition are inessence Hindus. They may think that they are Muslims. Butnot before Allah. They are as self-deluded as theAhmaddiahs who think they are Muslims when everyone knowsthat they are not Muslims. Hence the Muslims of India whohad decided to stay in India during partition are notMuslims and their progeny are not Muslim (since they didnot migrate to Muslim lands). Another thing that I noticedin my journeys in India is that the Hindu farmers generallyoffer their entire harvest to their gods at the end oftheir harvesting season. This makes the entire crop asharam for Muslims. Yet these so called Muslims of India areforced to eat this food which was already offered to someother God other than Allah thallah. This is explicitlyforbidden in Quran. And this is one of the serious problemsof living in non-Muslim countries. Prophet Mohammad (PBUH)knew such things; that is why he ordered Muslims not tolive in non-Muslim areas. Yet knowingly these so calledMuslims live in India. Again all the Muslims who migrate toother countries and US are non-Muslims. Only the Muslimswho intend to come back are Muslims not the ones who decideto stay in such countries. Hence we do not care if such Indian Muslims die in theriots. But due to strategy reasons we do have excellentrelations with these Muslims. All the Muslims who work forPakistan and for glory of Ummah are real Muslims. They areour front line troops in non-Muslim countries. Hence wehave to distribute the arms and ammunitions to these realMuslims in case of riots come to their door. Whereas the Kashmiri Muslims are pure Muslims who aretoiling under the yoke of Hindu rule. They are victimizedby the international conspiracy to keep them under theHindu rule. That issue is part of the incomplete partition.Whereas the Indian Muslims have accepted partition andstayed on in India knowingly. Q: Yet the popular uprising in Kashmir was missing in 1965as well as in 1948. A: That is true. That may be because of the clout of SheikAbdullah of Kashmir during 1948 war. Actually the Muslimpopulation in Jammu Kashmir was only marginally higher thanHindus. Muslims constituted 58% while the non-Muslimsconstituted the 42%. Hence the operation Topac aimed ateliminating the Kashmiri Pandits from the valley. Wethought all of them will go to India. Instead many went toJammu and only very little went to India. Hence we had toask Harkatul to start terrorising the Hindus in Jammu. Wealso expected large scale war against Muslims in Jammu aswell as in all the parts of India because of the killings.Indian govt suppressed these information. Another thingthat was not done is the complete removal of Buddhists andHindus from Jammu and Kashmir. We could do only in Valleyand not in jammu and Ladakh. Hence the population ofMuslims in Jammu and Kashmir is around 65% only accordingto Harkatul. Q: Tell us about your stay in Saudi Arabia. A: We embarked on a Umra as team of JI leaders. of course,Zia had arranged every convenience for us. We wereaccommodated in a Sheik's house. He is one of the richestBuilders in Saudi Arabia. He owns few gold shops in Qatartoo. Sheik was a personal friend of Zia Ul Haq. During thetime of Zia, we were not politically active. Since Zia didwhatever Qazi wanted, there was no need for political powereither. Hence we had lot of time. That is the main reasonwhy we stayed 3 full months in Sheik's palace. This sheikcomes from a Bedouin family of southwestern Arabia. He hadthe habit of drinking camel urine and camel milk early inthe morning. I asked him why does he do that? He repliedthat it is the family tradition as well as Islamic practicethat is supported by Prophet Mohammad (PBUH). I was astounded. But Qazi explained to me that it is true. Hetold me three or four Hadiths in which the camel urine andcamel milk drinking is suggested. So Qazi wanted to drinkthe camel urine and camel milk along with the Sheik. SinceI could not bring up myself to drink the camel urine, Idrank only fresh camel milk, which was thick and frothy.But Qazi drank the camel urine and camel milk the sameamount and same time as the sheik. Qazi astounded me inthis incident. I am amazed by the fact that Qazi was readyto go any length to mould his life in the teachings of theprophet. Q: Does he continue to do that even today? A: No. He bought a camel after coming to Pakistan. Threeyears later he had kidney stones problem. As per thedoctor's advice he had to stop drinking the urine while hecontinued the drinking camel milk. Doctor advised him tostop drinking the milk as well since the camel milk is richin calcium compared to the cow milk. I think he stoppeddrinking any milk or milk products. But he had said thatonce JI comes to power in Pakistan, he will popularize thecamel milk and camel urine drinking in Pakistan. But Idoubt he can do that. In my opinion, only camel milk can bepopularized. Q: That is quite news to me. How was your stay in Arabiaotherwise? A: First I have to tell you that Saudi Arabia, as a countryname, is wrong. It is Just Arabia. Only that Saudi dynastyrules over some parts of Arabia. You cannot put your namebefore a holyland as if you own that land. For Pakistan ifNawaz rules it, will it become Sheriff Pakistan andtomorrow Bhutto rules it and will it become BhuttoPakistan? Anyway, one thing we noticed is that the Arabians ownslaves. Though Allah says that the slaves should be treatedin a nice manner, he did not advocate the abolition ofslavery. If slavery is bad as considered in today's world,Allah certainly would have said that the slavery is wrong.Prophet Mohammad (PBUH) also said that the slaves should betreated in a good manner and the slaves should be releasedoften. But if there is no slavery how can anyone releaseslaves? Hence the reintroduction of slavery in Pakistan isone of the future plans of Jamaat. All the captured HinduIndians and Srilankans will be made slaves to work forPakistani Muslims. Every God abiding Pakistani Muslim willget slaves once we conquer India. All the slaves whoembrace Islam will be set free. Slavery is Islamic. Jamaatis the only political party, which does not voice anyopposition to the slavery of Harees (defeated) in Pakistan. We went around all over Arabia. We were surprised to knowthat there are some Hindus in Yemen. These ancient YemeniHindus are not Indians. In my opinion, these Hindus aretraders from India in the ancient times. I was alsosurprised to know that they have a Shiva temple in Yemen.Qazi was very unhappy over this. When he talked to Yemenleaders, he broached this subject. But the Yemeni leadersrefused Qazi's suggestion of forced conversion of thesepeople to Islam. I don't know why they refuse. I think itmay be due to the large population of Hindus from India whowork in Yemen and Arabia. He disliked the currentleadership of Arabia for this reason. In his opinion,Arabia should not allow any non-Muslim into holy lands ofArabia. Arabia should be 100% pure. Large number of Hindusin Arabia is corrupting the Arabians. Though they live ascontractors, they have the potential of corrupting theminds of the Arabians. One such thing is the presence ofArabians in Qatar Hindu temple. First the king allowed theHindus to build a temple and church in the holy lands thereby polluting the Holy Land. Second is that even a member ofthe Royal family visit that temple to inaugurate thattemple. To the horror of Qazi he had learnt that one of thepowerful member of Qatar royal family is a devotee of a godcalled Aayanppan. This news resolved Qazi to fight theforce of the devil thousand fold. Q: Such things happen in Pakistan today. I mean a friend ofmine goes to a Hindu temple. Another friend goes to churchmeetings. A: Yes. One of Qazi's relatives wanted to become a Hindu.He did not have a child for many years and it seems he hadprayed to a Hindu God and got the child. Hence he feltthankful to that god and wanted to become a Hindu. Qazi gotto know of this and called him and threatened him direconsequences. That relative did not become a Hindu. Butthat incident made Qazi read more about apostasy. Quran andHadith clearly say the punishment for abandonment of Islamis death. Since Sharia is not the law in Pakistan, and thecurrent Pakistani constitution grants right to change thereligion, it is legally correct to declare oneself as Hinduor Christian. But once JI takes over the government, itwill make Sharia as the constitution. Then Pakistan alsolegally execute any person who leaves Islam and joinsAhmaddiah, Christianity or Hinduism the same way Iran andTaliban treats its apostates. He also opined that thepresence of the Hindu temples in Pakistan is the root causeof the problem and hence we want to destroy all the Hindutemples and Churches in Pakistan. Q: This brings us into another area. Right now Internet isbecoming widespread. Even Saudi Arabia is connected withoutside world. Destroying the temples may be good but howwe can insulate the Pakistani and Muslim people against thecorrupting knowledge totally? A: JI had taken a principled stand on the matter of scienceand religion. Religion is far superior to science. Whateverman needs to know is in Quran and Hadiths. Knowing morewill create problems like the Atom bomb and Television.Quran and Hadiths are explicit in denouncing pictures. Yetthe lure of Satan in the form of photography and televisionis eating our lives. Music previously was confined only tothe vocal singing. Now science and technology made themusic widespread at a cheaper price. These are the lures ofSatan. We have to on guard against these harami things. Hence more science and technology is bad for thecivilization. I had completed civil engineering. Hence I amprivy to scientific knowledge. I can tell you howcorrupting that is. It even makes you question the gloriousQuran. There are many Hadiths, which say that the earth isflat. But any science will tell you the earth is a sphere.But you can use the same science like relativity theory toprove that the earth is flat. It is the same case withevolution. But the point being that the doubt is sown inthe minds of the people on the validity of Quran as theword of God. More and more we work hard in proving theQuran's scientific correctness, more and more people willget apprehensive of the truth of Quran. This is anabomination. This is why when we talk of education, we talkof religious education and not scientific education. It is true that science grew after Prophet's revolution inArabia. That was start of science. Now each and everyscience is filled with anti-god stuff. If you want tobecome a doctor, you have to read evolution. If you have toread any engineering you have to believe in the billions ofyears old universe theory which effectively says that thehuman beings came to world only in just one or two millionyears back. Q: But we still need the arms and knowledge of westernworld, which believes in science. And again you hadreferred to television as evil. If we abolish photographyhow can we have passports or identification cards? A: Yes. That is strategic. With the help of Allah, we willbe given oil for them to run their cars and we will havearms in that place. We will use their arms to destroy themin the course of time. As for as photos are concerned, theywill be banned as it is done in Afghanistan. If there is noneed for people to go out of Pakistan where is the need forthe passports? For those who have to travel to othercountries like the leaders of the revolution, they onlywill be given the passport with photos. For that, we willallow limited photography licensed only to govt. And thebiggest corruption in today's Pakistan is Indian satelliteTV and Indian cinemas and Indian DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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