Group Picture Is Repulsive!

October 2, 2004

Dear Madam,

I am a new member in this group and have been reading some of the write up. That

was a good comment same as " Healer heal thyself" before healing others. The

worship of GOD in the female form is very appealing to many. Most probably it is

the relationship of a mother to the children. It cements a bond of mother &

child relationship.

However, I am sad and shocked to see the picture of the form of shakti displayed

in the sit-naked obscene, in very bad taste. I know you will tell me that this

is the basic & raw form of shakti. It is repulsive. The form of Mother should be

devoid of all sex or degrading sexuality. I know that it is part of living but

if you look at your mother in this manner you are worthless and not worth

calling yourself her child.

Thank you.

Vengadesan

"N. Madam" <ashwini_puralasamy wrote:

October 2, 2004

Dear Vengadesan,

My pranaam to you for realizing instantly what many so-called self-

realized souls on this forum fail to comprehend of the Shakti, our

eternal Divine Mother. i even cringe at mothers exposing themselves

to their own children in bikinis, plunging necklines and mini-

skirts. To strip the Shakti of all modesty is unforgivable! But to

expose Her sitting in that position with Her private parts exposed

is beyond words.

Those who have visited the Devi in the Sahasrara thousands of times

over the years always mantain that She takes great care to protect

Her modesty - http://www.adishakti.org/index.htm

i wonder how many rebirths it will take to attain liberation for

those who admire this repulsive replica which has nothing to do with

Her form and presence in the Sahasrara.

Jai Shri Mataji,

jagbir

, vengadesan neiker

<svnaiker> wrote:

> Dear Madam,

>

> I am a new member in this group and have been reading some of the

> write up. That was a good comment same as " Healer heal thyself"

> before healing others. The worship of GOD in the female form is

> very appealing to many. Most probably it is the relationship of a

> mother to the children. It cements a bond of mother & child

> relationship.

>

> However, I am sad and shocked to see the picture of the form of

> shakti displayed in the sit-naked obscene, in very bad taste. I

> know you will tell me that this is the basic & raw form of shakti.

> It is repulsive. The form of Mother should be devoid of all sex or

> degrading sexuality. I know that it is part of living but if you

> look at your mother in this manner you are worthless and not worth

> calling yourself her child.

>

> Thank you.

> Vengadesan

October 2, 2004

Dear Vangadisan,

The naked body is never disgusting and sexuality is the most sacred of

all acts. I am appaled at your words calling her obscene. Without sexuality

there will never be children and attraction is a force that brings about

creation of new life in every species. Judgements of disgusting are not natural

but learned from the perverse beliefs of some religions and their fear of the

creative aspects of the feminine. Patriarcal religions foster these beliefs for

the purpose of control in a form of brainwashing that starts from early

childhood. If you experince desire of your mother allow them to come up without

action and release them. Your feelings of guilt are manifestations of childhood

repression. Guilt is the most perverse of mans creations and in complete

defience of compassion for self and creates prisons for the mind manifesting in

depression and many other diseases of modern humans as well as unnatural acts as

expressions of the sicknees of society. Suppression of feelings

create sickness of the mind.

Peace and Love to you

Guy

vengadesan neiker <svnaiker wrote:

October 2, 2004

However, I am sad and shocked to see the picture of the form of shakti displayed

in the sit-naked obscene, in very bad taste. I know you will tell me that this

is the basic & raw form of shakti. It is repulsive. The form of Mother should be

devoid of all sex or degrading sexuality. I know that it is part of living but

if you look at your mother in this manner you are worthless and not worth

calling yourself her child.

Thank you.

Vengadesan

-------Nonsense, a body comes from the mother and looks at her in just this way,

or closer, and then takes up residence at her breast. A trucker joke is that a

guy comes from a woman and then tries to get back inside her their whole life.

It's great if one is no sexual threat and one is non sexual, but for the rest,

sex is the ideal and sexuality is what women also want. They don't want to be

treated like priestesses. In fact, nuns enjoy very active cloistered sex lives

with their colleagues.

There's a fine line between good taste and oral sex. If you figure it out you're

probably more a feminist than those who merely are all talk, and therefore

closer to Shakta. Tantra is about taking desire as the path. If the upfront

display of the naked form is repulsive to you then I submit that you are no true

tantrika. Perhaps you belong over at the Veda-bhakti group.

October 2, 2004

Funny, I had a similar reaction to my personal icon of Shiva in the form of

Bhairava, naked and dancing with an erection..despite the fact that the icon was

painted through Divine inspiration, the person could not get past their own

dirty mind and see the Lord Shiva in His glory. The fact that you find the

nakedness of the Goddess disturbing and obscene says more about you than it does

about God, who created all things through the Yoni-Power and to whom they will

all ultimately return.

Lilith M.

--- vengadesan neiker <svnaiker wrote:

> Dear Madam,>

> However, I am sad and shocked to see the picture of

> the form of shakti displayed in the sit-naked

> obscene, in very bad taste. I know you will tell me

> that this is the basic & raw form of shakti. It is

> repulsive. The form of Mother should be devoid of

> all sex or degrading sexuality.

October 2, 2004

All things are not Yoni-born.

The Yoni-borns are the mortals.

:-)

, Lili Masamura <sephirah5>

wrote:

>

> Funny, I had a similar reaction to my personal icon of Shiva in the

form of Bhairava, naked and dancing with an erection..despite the fact

that the icon was

> painted through Divine inspiration, the person could not get past

their own dirty mind and see the Lord Shiva in His glory. The fact

that you find the

> nakedness of the Goddess disturbing and obscene says more about you

than it does about God, who created all things through the Yoni-Power

and to whom they will all ultimately return.

>

> Lilith M.

>

> --- vengadesan neiker <svnaiker> wrote:

>

> > Dear Madam,>

> > However, I am sad and shocked to see the picture of

> > the form of shakti displayed in the sit-naked

> > obscene, in very bad taste. I know you will tell me

> > that this is the basic & raw form of shakti. It is

> > repulsive. The form of Mother should be devoid of

> > all sex or degrading sexuality.

October 2, 2004

Dear Vengadesan and Jagbir:

If the yoginis of the outermost enclosure of Sri Yantra disturb you

so, I must warn you that there are eight more enclosures to go, and

things will get a lot more "repulsive" (by your definition) before

they get any better. Plan accordingly.

You both seem quite convinced that your particular point of view is

the only legitimate one, so I will not argue. For whatever it may be

worth, however (nothing to you, of course; perhaps something to

others), I would offer the words of Sri Amritananda Natha Saraswati,

who presides over the Sri Meru temple at Devipuram in Andhra Pradesh,

where these murthis are located:

**********

"The Sri Chakra is one of the most sacred and potent representations

for the entire spectrum of energies of the Mother Goddess in the

Hindu Culture - energies that allow us to experience ourselves in all

imaginable and unimaginable ways.

"This temple is constructed in the exact form of a pyramidal Sri

Chakra called Sri Meru. It is 54 square feet on ground, and rises

majestically to a height of 108 feet. Such a big Sri Chakra does not

exist anywhere else in the world as of today. The temple itself is

the body of the Mother Goddess. All Her attending deities are

surrounding Her life size, accessible to all for worship.

"Some of the Goddesses are totally nude inviting us to worship their

nudity. This is a temple of learning where you can learn about your

own nature and interact with the cosmic powers. Why are some

Goddesses depicted nude?

"Nudity is an attitude: 'I have nothing to hide, this is how God made

me. So what if I am an adult?' It also implies purity of Nature. It

reflects the deep aspiration to live in truth, to remove all masks;

expressing what we feel without hiding it or changing it in anyway.

It is a rebellion against social pressures to conform, indicating a

creative spirit which does not accept any authority except personal

experience. It is a symbol of unity between thought, word and deed.

Some people ask, 'How can I look at a nude female statue and not feel

lust? How can I associate religious fever with lust?' That is

precisely the message being conveyed here. Lust separates; it makes a

living person into an object. If you can look at a beautiful person,

and recognize the divine hand of Goddess that molded it, then you

have gotten beyond lust and made it into love and worship. Only by

converting lust into love, can we overcome its degrading tendencies

like neurotic anger and violence and make it pure love. This is the

basis of Tantra; the alchemy of changing base metals into pure gold."

**********

Perhaps these are (as you confidently assume) the words of a "so-

called self-realized soul" who "fails to comprehend the Shakti, our

eternal Divine Mother." Or perhaps they are the words of one who

knows of Whom and What he speaks. If you believe yourself to be a

worthy judge of this, then I bow to you. If not, then I commend you

for your honesty -- and for your openness to the possibility of valid

truths; even those generated from outside the confines of your

individual mind and chosen belief system.

Respectfully

DB

October 2, 2004

Oh? And what about the YONI-Verse???

Lilith M.

--- malyavan_tibet <malyavan_tibet wrote:

>

> All things are not Yoni-born.

> The Yoni-borns are the mortals.

October 2, 2004

>

> converting lust into love, can we overcome its degrading tendencies

> like neurotic anger and violence and make it pure love. This is the

> basis of Tantra; the alchemy of changing base metals into pure gold."

I like this statement very much. The first yoga school i attended

drives this point very much. The technique of sublimation of sexual

energy or OJAS into energy at the higher chakras.

The lower worlds has more raw power. The analogy of sage

kapila(incarnation of vishnu) sitting in the netherworld and

meditating and the 60000 demonic kings who gets burnt by his looks

when he was disturbed in his meditation. The 60000 represents the

various dark and lower chakra thoughts we all have. From

memories/vasanas stored from various incarnations(which includes the

various animals we all have been). Unless we face them and know the

technique of sublimating them, it is going to come to the surface.

October 2, 2004

Is that root from which universe(word) came?? :-))

Liberated beings does not take birth in Yoni's.

Moksha is the freedom from being born in Yoni. There are various kinds

of Yoni which are described in puranas.

, Lili Masamura <sephirah5>

wrote:

>

> Oh? And what about the YONI-Verse???

>

> Lilith M.

>

> --- malyavan_tibet <malyavan_tibet> wrote:

>

> >

> > All things are not Yoni-born.

> > The Yoni-borns are the mortals.

October 3, 2004

If the Devi had meant us to be naked, we would have been born that way,

right?

I am reminded of the Fundamentalist Hindus who made a hullaballoo over

the cover of a book about Ganesha, which portrayed him as a naked baby.

Pretty prurient, those naked babies, eh?

And I am frightened by the USA's John Ashcroft, who had a curtain raised

to obscure the nude statue of the Goddess of Justice in Washington D.C.,

rather than be filmed during interviews in front of a naked lady.

Nudity, in art and religious symbolism, represents a lack of artifice or

sham. Would you obscure Justice? Or Ma Kali, would you put clothes on

Eternity Herself?

Nature gave us bodies. We should be comfortable in them. There is

nothing profane or repulsive about the human body, whether presented

sexually or not. And most naked bodies are not explicitly sexual.

-- Len/ Kalipadma

On Sat, 2 Oct 2004 13:18:45 -0500 "Detective_Mongo_Phd"

<detective_mongo_phd writes:

>

> However, I am sad and shocked to see the picture of the form of

> shakti displayed in the sit-naked obscene, in very bad taste. I know

> you will tell me that this is the basic & raw form of shakti. It is

> repulsive. The form of Mother should be devoid of all sex or

> degrading sexuality. I know that it is part of living but if you

> look at your mother in this manner you are worthless and not worth

> calling yourself her child.

>

> Thank you.

> Vengadesan

>

> -------Nonsense, a body comes from the mother and looks at her in

> just this way, or closer, and then takes up residence at her breast.

> A trucker joke is that a guy comes from a woman and then tries to

> get back inside her their whole life. It's great if one is no

> sexual threat and one is non sexual, but for the rest, sex is the

> ideal and sexuality is what women also want. They don't want to be

> treated like priestesses. In fact, nuns enjoy very active cloistered

> sex lives with their colleagues.

>

> There's a fine line between good taste and oral sex. If you figure

> it out you're probably more a feminist than those who merely are all

> talk, and therefore closer to Shakta. Tantra is about taking desire

> as the path. If the upfront display of the naked form is repulsive

> to you then I submit that you are no true tantrika. Perhaps you

> belong over at the Veda-bhakti group.

>

______________

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October 3, 2004

I recall reading somewhere that the Devas were cursed to not be born from

Yonis. The only exception was that Lakshmi Mata gave birth to Kama-Deva

through her Yoni (appropriate, since he is the God of Desire).

-- Len/ Kalipadma

On Sat, 02 Oct 2004 20:48:35 -0000 "malyavan_tibet"

<malyavan_tibet writes:

>

> All things are not Yoni-born.

> The Yoni-borns are the mortals.

>

> :-)

> , Lili Masamura

> <sephirah5>

> wrote:

> >

> > Funny, I had a similar reaction to my personal icon of Shiva in

> the

> form of Bhairava, naked and dancing with an erection..despite the

> fact

> that the icon was

> > painted through Divine inspiration, the person could not get past

> their own dirty mind and see the Lord Shiva in His glory. The fact

> that you find the

> > nakedness of the Goddess disturbing and obscene says more about

> you

> than it does about God, who created all things through the

> Yoni-Power

> and to whom they will all ultimately return.

> >

______________

Get your name as your email address.

Includes spam protection, 1GB storage, no ads and more

Only $1.99/ month - visit http://www.mysite.com/name today!

October 3, 2004

Immodesty is as one does. But if one is in love with the Divine Chick, then

what is the wrong. Im sure the Divine Mother can be as alluring as She wishes.

Desiring Her form is also Kundalini's wish. She liberates but one comes to live

in love with Her. The Shakti Bijas are all Kundalini rising. Not desiring her

form is for Sanyasin only and even then, since Shri Shankara and before, many

Sanyasin secretely practice the Sri Yantra, which does have the deities in union

in it if it is a higest tantra. Besides, we're really talking about energies

here, and their dynamics, and not always about personal sexual relationships.

-

jagbir singh

Saturday, October 02, 2004 10:15 AM

Re: Group Picture Is Repulsive!

Dear Vengadesan,

My pranaam to you for realizing instantly what many so-called self-

realized souls on this forum fail to comprehend of the Shakti, our

eternal Divine Mother. i even cringe at mothers exposing themselves

to their own children in bikinis, plunging necklines and mini-

skirts. To strip the Shakti of all modesty is unforgivable! But to

expose Her sitting in that position with Her private parts exposed

is beyond words.

Those who have visited the Devi in the Sahasrara thousands of times

over the years always mantain that She takes great care to protect

Her modesty - http://www.adishakti.org/index.htm

i wonder how many rebirths it will take to attain liberation for

those who admire this repulsive replica which has nothing to do with

Her form and presence in the Sahasrara.

Jai Shri Mataji,

jagbir

, vengadesan neiker

<svnaiker> wrote:

> Dear Madam,

>

> I am a new member in this group and have been reading some of the

> write up. That was a good comment same as " Healer heal thyself"

> before healing others. The worship of GOD in the female form is

> very appealing to many. Most probably it is the relationship of a

> mother to the children. It cements a bond of mother & child

> relationship.

>

> However, I am sad and shocked to see the picture of the form of

> shakti displayed in the sit-naked obscene, in very bad taste. I

> know you will tell me that this is the basic & raw form of shakti.

> It is repulsive. The form of Mother should be devoid of all sex or

> degrading sexuality. I know that it is part of living but if you

> look at your mother in this manner you are worthless and not worth

> calling yourself her child.

>

> Thank you.

> Vengadesan

/

b..

c..

October 3, 2004

i shall be much obliged if yo guys can find a temple in India where nudity is

NOT depicted. I am not speaking of "modern" temples but ancient ones.

Devi Bhakta <devi_bhakta wrote: