Do we have to make Krsna Conciousness 'politically correct' before preaching today???

[krsna 3]

I mean the philosophy or the cultural traditions of the Vedic Tradition which seem to be at odds with 'modernity'?

[Nrsinghadev 0]

Haribol,

 

first ask yourself why it is that it is "at odds" with today's world. The answer to that holds the answer to your question.

[Guest guest]

There is no choice for the Vedics but to be politically correct, or they simply cannot survive in this crazy (materialistic) world.

[Yofu 0]

Forget poltical correctness, devotees have to become socially correct first.

 

That is:

 

1. Stop selling dishonest Hong Kong pictures.

 

2. Stop trying to be Indians by wearing Indian clothes in the west unless you are a sannayasi tec

 

3. Grihastas get jobs.

 

4. Support your kids.

 

5. Stop having multiple marriages and divorces.

 

6. Stop emotionally abusing our children in the name of devotion.

 

7. Eliminate the hippiness that often surrounds western devotees

 

8. Stop being conspiracy theory nuts...

 

 

please feel free to add more...

[Beggar 0]

1. Stop smoking ganja<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

2. Stop preaching trnadapi sunicena and being a road rager.

3. Stop drinking decaf because you think it has no caffeine in it, it does.

4. Stop selling stickers at American football games.

5. Stop going to 12 step programs, there is only surrender to Krsna.

6. Stop spending your time on forums and chant your prescribed number of rounds.

7. Stop completely at stop signs.

8. If you are a Western devotee stop listening to “devotee” rock music. Replace it with “devotee" Country Western music.

[gHari 0]

START from where you are, withdraw from the world's drama, and learn to love God.

 

STOP screaming in the aisles - most people have heard about God. Gently help them remember Him.

 

STOP being so damn crazy.

 

Let Krsna decide when and where and how to 'preach'.

[Guest guest]

Just as long as modernity doesn't mean that gurus can be active homosexuals go ahead and be politically correct as you want. No just kidding. I don't know about political correctness because I always thought that the Vedas were about presenting the truth despite all the opposition and all that.

 

-D.B. Cooper Jr.

[Guest guest]

 

Forget poltical correctness, devotees have to become socially correct first.

That is:

1. Stop selling dishonest Hong Kong pictures.

2. Stop trying to be Indians by wearing Indian clothes in the west unless you are a sannayasi tec

3. Grihastas get jobs.

4. Support your kids.

5. Stop having multiple marriages and divorces.

6. Stop emotionally abusing our children in the name of devotion.

7. Eliminate the hippiness that often surrounds western devotees

8. Stop being conspiracy theory nuts...

please feel free to add more...

Ha ha ha! This is funny. The hippiness is probably one of the only GOOD things that western devottees are still into.

 

Anyway yeah, i get what you're saying.

[Beggar 0]

....stop having superficial relationships with others due to false renunciation.

[krsna 3]

<CENTER>Political Correctness

by Philip Atkinson</CENTER><SUP>What Is Political Correctness? </SUP>

Political Correctness (PC) is the communal tyranny that erupted in the 1980s. It was a spontaneous declaration that particular ideas, expressions and behaviour, which were then legal, should be forbidden by law, and people who transgressed should be punished. (see Newspeak) It started with a few voices but grew in popularity until it became unwritten and written law within the community. With those who were publicly declared as being not politically correct becoming the object of persecution by the mob, if not prosecution by the state.

<SUP>The Odious Nature Of Political Correctness </SUP>

To attempt to point out the odious nature of Political Correctness is to restate the crucial importance of plain speaking, freedom of choice and freedom of speech; these are the community's safe-guards against the imposition of tyranny, indeed their absence is tyranny (see "On Liberty", Chapter II, by J.S. Mill). Which is why any such restrictions on expression such as those invoked by the laws of libel, slander and public decency, are grave matters to be decided by common law methodology; not by the dictates of the mob.

<SUP>Clear Inspiration For Political Correctness </SUP>

The declared rational of this tyranny is to prevent people being offended; to compel everyone to avoid using words or behaviour that may upset homosexuals, women, non-whites, the crippled, the mentally impaired, the fat or the ugly. This reveals not only its absurdity but its inspiration. The set of values that are detested are those held by the previous generation (those who fought the Second World War), which is why the terms niggers, coons, dagos, wogs, poofs, spastics and sheilas, have become heresy, for, in an act of infantile rebellion, their subject have become revered by the new generation. Political Correctness is merely the resentment of spoilt children directed against their parent's values.

 

<SUP>The Origins Of Political Correctness </SUP>

A community declines when the majority of its citizens become selfish, and under this influence it slowly dismantles all the restraints upon self-indulgence established by manners, customs, tradition and law (See the law of reverse civilisation). As each subsequent generation of selfish citizens inherits control of the community, it takes its opportunity to abandon more of the irksome restraints that genius and wisdom had installed. The proponents of this social demolition achieve their irrational purpose by publicly embracing absurdity through slogans while vilifying any who do not support their stance. The purpose of the slogan is to enshrine irrational fears, or fancies, as truth through the use of presumptuous words, so public pronouncement:

• Dissembles the real nature of the claim
• Identifies any dissenters as enemies of the truth
• Acts as an excuse for any crimes committed in its name

For example the slogan Australia is Multicultural is a claim that:

• Different cultures are compatible.
• People who contradict this claim are blinded by prejudice against other cultures.
• People who contradict this claim are trouble-making bigots, which makes them enemies of the community, if not humanity, and deserving persecution.

Which is an attack upon truth, clear thinking and plain speaking.

<SUP>From Bourgeois To Racist </SUP>

Naturally as the restraints shrink the rebellion grows ever more extreme in nature. When the author of Animal Farm wrote an article in 1946 about the pleasures of a rose garden, he was criticised for being bourgeois. George Orwell mentions this in his essay A Good Word For The Vicar Of Bray, published in the Tribune, 1946. The term bourgeois was then a popular slogan meaning having humdrum middle class ideas— The Oxford English Dictionary 3<SUP>rd</SUP> Edition, 1938 — which is just a blatant attack upon tradition.

<SUP>Outright Assault Upon Tradition </SUP>

Now, in the late 1990s, the results of being bourgeois (retaining traditional notions), is being labelled racist, sexist etc. and risk losing your job, your reputation, being jostled in the street, being subject to judicial penalty and death threats. And it is this very extremity of reaction that has won media attention and the name Political Correctness, though the reaction will become even more unpleasant with the next generation.

 

<SUP>Parental Values Always Attacked </SUP>

The inevitable scapegoat for people impatient of restraint must always be parents, because these are society's agents for teaching private restraint. So the cherished notions of the parents are always subject to attack by their maturing offspring. This resentment of tradition was observed in his own civilisation by Polybius (c. 200-118 BC), the Greek historian, who said:

"For every democracy which has enjoyed prosperity for a considerable period first develops through its nature an attitude of discontent towards the existing order,.."

<SUP>Tyranny Grows </SUP>

Once a community embraces tyranny the penalties can only grow in severity. This gradual increase is easily seen by the example of Toastmasters. As the members of the club became more concerned about the delights of socialising and less concerned about the disciplines of public speaking, they became more intolerant of citizens who were earnest about learning the art of rhetoric. Once those members who did their duty by truthfully pointing out the shortcomings in another member's performance were just labelled as negative or discouraging; later this became a risk of being socially ostracised. Now (since 1998) unpopularity can result in being permanently ejected from the club by a majority vote.

<SUP>Australian Experience Of PC Tyranny </SUP>

In my country the tyranny erupted with the persecution of public figures such as Arthur Tunstall for uttering truths that had become unpopular, either directly in a speech, or indirectly by telling jokes. The maiden speech of the Federal Member of Parliament for Ipswich contained so many disliked truths that the rabble escalated the ferocity of their attack and extended them to her supporters, introducing terror into Australian politics. Anyone who watched the TV coverage (1997/8) of Pauline Hanson's political campaign will have seen the nature of her opponents; a throng who looked and behaved more like barbarians than citizens of a civilised community. And any mob that chants "Burn the witch" (when she spoke outside an Ipswich hall after she had been refused entry) leaves no doubt as to their intent or character.

<SUP>Widespread Throughout The Community </SUP>

Revealing the extent of the mob's support, their sentiments (suitably refined) were enthusiastically echoed by the media and the administration. And in an unprecedented act of cooperation, all the political parties conspired to eject Ms Hanson from the federal parliament in the election of October 3rd 1998. This was revealed by the how-to-vote cards of the parties contesting the seat of Blaire, which all placed Ms Hanson last. This was a public admission by both the major parties that they would rather risk losing the election than allow this forthright woman to keep her seat in parliament.

<SUP>International Experience Of PC Tyranny </SUP>

And it is not just in Australia but in every western democratic country popular demands have been made for restrictions on expression. Bowing to the clamour of the electorate, politicians in these countries have enacted absurd laws. The Australian community wide declaration of irrational hatred displayed by the persecution of Pauline Hanson, paralleled the Canadian experience of Paul Fromm, director of the Canadian Association for Free Expression Inc., and the examples of the national soccer coach of England and a prominent public servant in Washington, USA confirm that the hysteria is everywhere.

<SUP>The Inevitable Result Of Political Correctness </SUP>

By using the excuse of not upsetting anyone, the politically correct are demanding that people behave like the fool who would please everyone; that everyone must become such a fool! All must accept the notions of the Politically Correct as truth, or else! This is the same mentality that inspired the Inquisition and forced Galileo to recant; the same mentality that inspired the Nazis and obtained the Holocaust. Once expression gets placed in a straitjacket of official truth, then the madness that occurs in all totalitarian states is obtained. Life, in private and public, becomes a meaningless charade where delusion thrives and terror rules.

<SUP>Examples Of Denying Freedom Of Speech </SUP>

Evidence of this effect is amply demonstrated by the Soviets, who embraced Political Correctness with the Communist Revolution. The lumbering, pompous, impoverished, humourless monster this Nation became is now History. And it should be remembered that in 1914 Tsarist Russia was considered by Edmund Cars, a French economist who then published a book about the subject, to be an economic giant set to overshadow Europe. The SBS television program "What Ever Happened To Russia", which was broadcast at 8.30 pm on 25th August 1994, detailed the terrible effect the Bolshevik's oppression had on their empire. And SBS further detailed the terrible crimes inflicted upon the Russians by their leader Stalin, in the series "Blood On The Snow" broadcast in March 1999.

<SUP>An Old Witness </SUP>

Helen, a member of Parramatta writers club in 1992, was a citizen of Kiev during the Red Terror, and described living with official truth and the constant threat of arrest. Knowing the content of the latest party newspaper was critical to avoiding internment, as public contradiction, either directly or indirectly, meant denouncement to the KGB. If you complained about being hungry when food shortages were not officially recognised, then you became an enemy of the state. If you failed to praise a Soviet hero, or praised an ex-hero, then again your fate was sealed. The need to be politically correct dominated all conversation and behaviour, as failure meant drastic penalty. Uncertainty and fear pervaded everything, nobody could be sure that an official request to visit Party headquarters meant imprisonment, torture, death, public reward or nothing important.

Living with such a terrible handicap naturally destroyed all spontaneity of thought or action, rendering the whole community mad. The awful effect this had upon Helen's sanity was made clear when she escaped to Australia. Here she encountered the free press, which had an unpleasant impact upon her. One day she read The Australian newspaper which happened to carry two separate articles about Patrick White, one praising, the other denigrating, this well known writer. Poor Helen found herself turning from one to the other, which was she to repeat as correct? She nearly had a nervous breakdown.

<SUP>Political Correctness Is Social Dementia </SUP>

Unless plain speaking is allowed, clear thinking is denied. There can be no good reason for denying freedom of expression, there is no case to rebut, only the empty slogans of people inspired by selfishness and unrestrained by morality. The proponents of this nonsense neither understand the implications of what they say, nor why they are saying it: they are insane.

<SUP>Social Decline Grows Worse With Each Generation </SUP>

Political Correctness is part of the social decline that generation by generation makes public behaviour less restrained and less rational.

[redhead 0]

PC people are eather fascists or commies aka red fasicism. the american governemnt is a fascist government and the europe is along the same lines. el duce and hitler would be proud of george bush and the democrats and republicans of todays america. when i speak my mind people ingnorently assume i am a white supremist or a radical of which i am neather especially since i am a extremly nationalist/leftist/socialist politically and racially half the same admixture as most people of middle eastern and southeast asian desent people. i have roots in punjab but i look as white and american as you can get.

[Guest guest]

NY City, Mid '70's:

Dayal Chandra and I attended an equipment auction to purchase things for the Radha Damodar Busses. The auctioneer was late and all the attendees waited, sitting on a staircase in the hall. A middle aged black gentleman sat next to me reading the newspaper, then turned to me and said: "You know the moon shot was a hoax. They never went there. It was all faked." I smiled and said, " You are probably right." And inside I thanked Srila Prabhupada for never stooping to political correctness.

[krsna 3]

Krsna is no so politically correct? Is He?

 

Isn't KRSNA the Absolute Truth past, present and future?

 

Who will want to mess with KRSNA in politics?

 

Presenting KRSNA means to give a spirit soul a personal loving relationship with KRSNA face-to-face, heart-to-heart and eye-to-eye.

[brajeshwara das 0]

Stop finding faults outside of ourselves and look to fix the ones on the inside.

[Guest guest]

Political correctness is the mayor disease of our times, Krshna is right and redneck as well......i don't mind different cultures and races, but these PC fascists want a particular religion to dominate us, these "friends of free expression" persuing their "inner spiritual struggle" presented as the socalled "religion of peace".

Or......?

[Guest guest]

 

 

8. Stop being conspiracy theory nuts...

 

 

I'd rather be a conspiracy theory nut then a brainwashed sheep. Indeed there is nothing wrong with thinking outside the box as Prabhupada encouraged us all to be independently minded. Failure to do so leaves us in grave danger to become conditioned and lose our own ability to discriminate.

[bhaktatraveler 0]

We as devotees are the quiescents of correctness.

 

 

 

Conversation 1/3/77 Mumbai

 

 

Prabhupada: So your wife came... [break] This is Indian attitude. They do not care for the modern, civilized way of life, wasting time reading some nonsense book or going to the bars, the cinema, talking unnecessarily. They do not like. Those who are old style, they do not.

 

Gopala Krishna: No, I know many women who are very good cooks, I have tasted...

 

Prabhupada: They have no time to waste time in that way. They must be inclined that “I must prepare something nice so that my husband, my children or my, all friends will be very pleased.” That is their policy. I wanted that all our girls, they should be expert. And in America they are doing that. They should learn the art of cooking and prepare very nice foodstuffs, daily change of menu. And the children should be so trained up that no more birth. And that is life. They can produce hundreds of children, it doesn’t matter, but must be responsible that “The children should be saved. This is the last birth, no more birth. I’ll train the child in such a way that next life he’s going to Krishna, back to home, back to Godhead.” That is parent’s duty. Otherwise they should not become parent. That is contraceptive: “I am not fit to train my children in that way, so I shall not produce cats and dogs.” This is life. Why shall I produce cats and dogs? And Bhaktivinoda Thakura was grihastha, he produced Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati. That is one... So in this way, if there is ideal institution, ideal mode of living, it is happy; everything is all right. That is grihastha. Produce Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati. My Guru Maharaja used to say that “If I can produce krishna-bhakta as children, then I’m prepared to marry and produce hundreds of children.” And if we cannot, then we shall not produce even one children. Just like Vasudeva and Devaki in their previous life. What was the name? Their determination is “If we can get a child like God, then we shall produce. Otherwise we go on, tapasya. And when Krishna came, “What do you want?” “I want You.” “Who is like Me? I shall appear. I shall appear.” Anyway, we have got such huge establishment. Utilize it very properly everywhere. Another thing, that in Vrindavana... You remember the corner land, parikrama, last time? That is available by acquirement.

Gopala Krishna: The corner land to the left? Left of Gurukula? Or...

 

Prabhupada: No Gurukula... When we go to the chuni,(?) in front of...

 

Gopala Krishna: Ha, ha, ha. In that direction.

 

Prabhupada: Yes. That is agricultural land.

 

Gopala Krishna: Right opposite...

 

Prabhupada: Yes.

 

Hari-sauri: Where that gate is.

 

Prabhupada: Yes.

 

Gopala Krishna: Right before the gate. That is... I was under the impression that belonged to some Christian man.

 

Prabhupada: No, no, no. That is first. After crossing the road, the corner.

 

Hari-sauri: Where the parikrama path is.

 

Gopala Krishna: That is available for...?

 

Prabhupada: Yes.

 

Gopala Krishna: Actually that would be good if we get that. It’s right next to our temple.

 

Prabhupada: So why not try for that? You can get it, I am sure.

 

Gopala Krishna: Okay. I’m going to Vrindavana in ten days.

 

Prabhupada: So if we can get that land, then we can divert our sewer in the land and utilize it for nice agricultural purposes. So instead of spending lakh of rupees for municipality, why not acquire that land?

 

Gopala Krishna: Acquire or buy? Acquire.

 

Prabhupada: Acquire means you have to pay, but government...

 

Gopala Krishna: Yes, but acquire usually takes a long time.

 

Prabhupada: Not long time. They’ll give us, because it is lying vacant.

Gopala Krishna: On the sewage problem in Vrindavana, we’ll have to make, do something quickly because even the Gurukula will not be able to open till we can...

 

Prabhupada: So you can do it immediately. But go on, purchase. It is lying vacant.

 

Gopala Krishna: Okay, that’s a very good idea. But we’ll still have to put a pipe underground coming out.

 

Prabhupada: That is not much, a few you, few yards only. And then introduce it and distribute that water, the whole land, and you will get good agricultural produce, very good. You can have very good business.

 

Hari-sauri: That can be used for agriculture?

 

Prabhupada: Oh, yes. Oh, yes. This water is very valuable for agricultural purpose. Nature has made in such a way. Aiye. All rejected water, you can utilize for agriculture.

 

Hari-sauri: I think in the West they have a law that says you can’t use human sewage.

 

Prabhupada: Kick out the West. We are doing here, in India. The municipality is doing that also in Vrindavana. Everywhere it is. In Calcutta there is called dhapara matha. Dhapara matha, formerly, anything produced in dhapara matha, that was not used for Deity. The superstition that “These vegetables are grown in filthy water, nasty...” But the vegetables were—cauliflower so big, so big. Everything, very luxuriantly, very tasteful and solid and big... Dhapara mathera (Bengali). They used to take. In Bengal, generally, the land is very fertile to produce vegetables. But this, the more the filthy things of the city were thrown there, and the cultivator used to grow very nice... That is utilization of this filthy water where there was sewer ditches formerly. In the village they diverted from the water in the field, and they got good crops. Generally they pass stool in the field. The cow’s, cow dung and man’s stool and everyone’s stool, they are wrapped gathered together in the rainy season. It became fertile. (Hindi)

 

Gopala Krishna: We will try for the land.

 

Prabhupada: Immediately. That is... That will be proper utilization. And in the court, unless they arrange for this dirty water out, why shall I pay tax? We shall stick to this position.

 

Gopala Krishna: We are sticking to it. The only harm to us is our Gurukula is going to get delayed now, the opening.

 

Prabhupada: But in the meantime you...

 

Gopala Krishna: Yes. And also we are running out of time because we can’t let water accumulate the way it is.

 

Prabhupada: So why you can’t? We have purchased that land. They have to...

 

Gopala Krishna: Yes, that is... We’ll try for that now.

 

Prabhupada: Yes. That means... We have purchased that land. By force you can drive out? We are trying for that. Go to the court: “We have regularly purchased that land. What can be done? The municipality is not doing anything.” We have to fight like that.

 

Gopala Krishna: Yes, we are fighting.

 

Prabhupada: Why you should be afraid?

 

Gopala Krishna: No. I mean the water... We’re having all the trouble with the man in the back.

 

Prabhupada: That I am speaking, that he’s trouble. Why he should be giving us trouble? We purchased it. Take land; take money. And we have to purchase the land for this purpose. We are doing other arrangement; that is our mercy. But even that land... The municipality is obliged. Otherwise we can throw the water on the street. That is municipal’s duty. Otherwise why shall I pay tax? We shall do everything, we shall pay tax, and we shall suffer? What is this?

 

Gopala Krishna: We’re not paying tax. We are fighting it in the court.

 

Prabhupada: So in this way we have to fight. We should not be afraid for these rascals. Why you should be afraid? If they take to gunda-ism, we shall engage fifty gundas. “Come on. Let us see.” We have to maintain that spirit. Anaye yei kare prabhu anaye yei sahe.(?) The Rabindranath Tagore’s one poetry: “One who does wrong and suffers wrong, he is wrong.” One should not do anything wrong; one should not suffer anything wrong. That is human. If somebody does harm to me, wrong to me, I cannot suffer it. I shall not do any harm to anyone. That’s all right. But if you want to give me suffering, I must fight you. Why shall I suffer it? That is kshatriya spirit. Yuddhe capy apalayanam. “If you are challenging, ‘All right, come on,’ I accept this challenge.” We have to do like that. Now, this baniya spirit... Our Bhagatji, he purchased that land, and he’s afraid of him. What is this? Baniya spirit. But you are kshatriya.

 

 

August 1, 1975, New Orleans

750801rc.no

Prabhupada: That is time for punishment. They should build up their character, samah, damah, fully controlled. When they like, they become grihasthas. Otherwise they are controlled. That is brahmana. For brahmana it is not compulsory to marry. Kshatriyas may marry more than one wife. They can take. So all girls must be married. That is... They must...They must have one husband, even the husband has got fifty wives. Then the problem of girls’ marriage will be solved. And as soon as one girl is pregnant, she should be separated.

Hridayananda: From the husband.

Prabhupada: At least for one and half years.

Upendra: At the moment of pregnancy? From the moment of pregnancy one and a half years?

Prabhupada: Yes. Pregnancy is understood at three months. From that month till further, sixteen months at least, she should not come to be near husband. That is eka-kadi (?). The child does not live. And they are not inclined to come unless a man induces. So the man, if he has got more than one wife, so man will not disturb her. And she will take rest for the next eighteen months. So after ten months she will give birth to the child, and for six months continually she will take care of the child. Feeding the child with breast milk, the child will be healthy. If the child can take mother’s milk for six months at least continually, he’ll become healthy for life.

Upendra: Where do they send that mother?

Prabhupada: Where they’ll take care.

Upendra: If the man sends the woman away, where does she...?

Prabhupada: Our aim is not to give help, but not... Generally she goes to the father’s house. So you can have separate building for that.

Nityananda: Are you saying that our men should have more than one wife?

Prabhupada: I have no objection.

Satsvarupa: That’s a difficult proposition.

Prabhupada: Why?

Satsvarupa: It’s not allowed in this country. It’s illegal. It’s against the law.

Devotee: It’s against the law.

Nityananda: No, it’s a matter of... No one knows who is married or unmarried, but if you have...

Prabhupada: That is not very difficult.

Satsvarupa: Well, the other difficulty, you brought this up several years ago, was that the men who take many wives have to be very select. Otherwise men will be attracted to join our movement for sex life, having different wives.

Prabhupada: No, no, unless our men are trained up, why you should allow to stay here and to wife. We want trained up men, not third-class picked-up. We want men who will follow the rules and regulations and fully trained up. Otherwise we don’t want. We don’t want ordinary karmis and... And if he agrees to be trained up, then we’ll take. Otherwise what is the use of bringing some useless men? He must agree to produce his own food, and work. Our rules and regulations, he must follow. Then it will be ideal community. Otherwise, if you bring from here and there some men and fill up, that is not good thing. This is a training institution, to become devotee.

Satsvarupa: Everything we do, we don’t hide it. We show the world what we’re doing. I don’t see how we could hide that one man had many different wives.

Prabhupada: If you don’t call wife, you can have. The law allows you to keep boyfriend, girlfriend. Then the... Instead of calling “husband,” call “friend.” That’s all. But, er, it is risky and the man must be responsible to keep... To keep more than one wife by trained-up man is not disallowed.

Brahmananda : But I think they thought that he could get it legally established, at least in the state of California.

Prabhupada: Well then go and marry there. If the state of California allows that, then they all can go to California.

Nityananda: The general public objects to that... It’s very...

Prabhupada: Public we don’t care. We... What is the public? We have got our own public here. So pub... What is the public? All rascals. They are killing cows and drinking and topless dance, bottomless dance. What is the value of this public? All rascals. I don’t give any importance to this class of public, only after sense gratification, that’s all. They have no ideals of life. They do not know what is God. What is the value of this public? Mudhas, they have been described, mudhas. You know the meaning of mudha?

 

 

 

CB-r