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Who is Greater? Shiva or Vishnu?

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(Where does it say , it is Rudra. )

 

Well refer to what you have cut out.

 

No one does copy/paste/alter/copy/paste better that you. Every citation of yours vary from the previous one.

 

 

(unlike advaitis who claim equality with Bhagavaan.)

 

Why you are so full of hatred?

 

 

No realized Advaiti has any individuality left. So there cannot be any equality with Bhagawan, since Bhagwan (Self) is the only true being. Equality can be betwwen two or more beings.

 

The question of equality does not arise in ONE WITHOUT A SECOND.

 

Those who are not capable of shedding their ego are advised to be worshipful. But you are very rude.

 

 

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(This moron's fingers typed the poison which He posted, so, the fingers are greater Diety than this MORON.)

 

 

I thought this was very apt, since it supports your logic very well.

 

 

 

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Please deisregard all rude posts. They are artificial ones.

 

 

avajananti mam mudha

manusim tanum asritam

param bhavam ajananto

mama bhuta-mahesvaram(Gita 9.11)

 

The ignorant ones, not knowing My supreme natures as the great Lord (mahesvara) of all beings, disregard Me when I assume human form.

 

 

 

Great citation. I have just added mahesvara by the side of great Lord.

 

 

I have two questions, if you do not mind.

 

 

1) Are there many mahesvaras?

 

2) What I could gather from your answer is that Atma is Brahman and Purusha is Narayana, Is my understanding correct?

 

3) If the above is correct, then which of them is primary as per the scriptures? and as per your understanding?

 

 

Thanks in advance and regards

 

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Great citation. I have just added mahesvara by the side of great Lord.

 

 

Maheshwara is a noun, describing Narayana or Krishna here.

 

 

I have two questions, if you do not mind.

 

1) Are there many mahesvaras?

 

 

See above.

 

 

2) What I could gather from your answer is that Atma is Brahman and Purusha is Narayana, Is my understanding correct?

 

 

Brahman and Pursuha are also identical as Atma. They are all different names or features of Narayana, who is eternally different from Jivas and matter. Jivas and matter are also eternal and different from each other.

 

 

3) If the above is correct, then which of them is primary as per the scriptures? and as per your understanding?

 

 

Narayana=Atma=Brahman=Pursuha=Bhagavaan=Purushottama

 

Matter, space, time, Jiva etc. are eternally dependent on Narayana.

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Oh Yes, moron, you are actually not worth discussing with.

 

See above. Find out the foolishness.

 

 

Sign of emotional dis-order. Please find a Psychiatrist and avoid discussion boards for your own good.

 

 

Why Vayu and Keshi are repeatedly separately mentioned and why suddenly sons of Va_taras'ana are mentioned is really inexplicable.

 

 

Why Sons of Va_taras'ana(munis) and Keshii are repeatedly separately mentioned ?

 

Why Rudra and Keshii are repeatedly separately mentioned ?

 

Any moron can ask such foolish questions. It takes time and knowledge of sanskrit to know the context properly.

 

Answer why these munis are said to be Vayu's steed, vayu's friend etc.

 

Anyway here is the answer to you.

 

There is something called AnukramaNIs for all Veda mantras which provides

 

(a) Rishi(s) who revealed those verses

(b) Devata or Being who is praised and worshipped

© Chanda or Metre for each verse.

 

(a)The rishis are JUti, VAtajUti, ViprajUti, VRSAnaka,

Karikrata, EtaSa, RSyaSRnga (VAtaraSanas) who are sons of vaátarashana(vaátarashanaaH).

 

vaátarashanaaH also means one who has air for a cloth, no clothing for them. It is these Rishis who are praising Vayu ie. Keshii.

 

(b)The Devata for Keshi or Vayu Sukta is Vayu.

 

©The Chanda is anus.t.up.

 

It should be clear to readers who is egoistic and a moron. here.

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You have come a long way DOWN from 'Vayu gringed days'.

 

 

 

“vaayúr asmaa úpaamanthat pináSTi smaa kunannamaá

keshií viSásya paátreNa yád rudréNaápibat sahá

 

Vayu squeezed, kneaded and crushed [a small portion] of the

poison for Shiva and drank the poison along with Shiva.”

 

 

 

Your inserting the “small portion”, where there is none, does not change anything. And your identifying Vayu of the first line with the Keshi of the second line is ill-motivated as the two different translations show.

 

 

 

10.136.7 Vayu hath churned for him: for him he poundeth things most hard to bend, When he with long loose locks hath drunk, with Rudra, water from the cup.

 

 

10.136.07 Va_yu churned for him, the inflexible (thunder) ground it when the radiant, along with Rudra, drank the water with his cup.

 

 

 

 

And the devata is not Vayu alone. But the whole truth is

 

r.s.i: va_taras'ana munigan.a, (1 ju_ti, 2 va_taju_ti, 3 vipraju_ti, 4 vr.s.a_n.aka, 5 karikrata, 6 etas'a, 7 r.s.yas'r.n:ga); devata_: kes'i_ (agni, su_rya, va_yu);

 

 

The verses provided only prove that Devas work for Shiva.

 

Notwithstanding your distorted translation, which only goes against you, the following is true, going by your excellent logic.

 

 

Your fingers type your posts for you, so your fingers are greater than you.

 

And so on with other organs that you may have.

 

 

 

"Sign of emotional dis-order. Please find a Psychiatrist and avoid discussion boards for your own good."

 

Yes, find one for yourself. Since your kind of hatred is unmatched.Hatred has only one end, on the bed of a Psychiatrist, or worse.

 

 

 

 

 

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Namaskar

 

 

Although not asked for, still you have clarified that “Maheshwara is a noun, describing Narayana or Krishna here.” (And obviously not Mahesvara of Kailasa).

 

 

So in reply to: 1) Are there many mahesvaras? obviously the answer would be “Yes” and you imply that there can be several Mahesvaras.

 

 

 

To my query, which of them (Atma and Purusha) is primary, you have clarified

 

Narayana=Atma=Brahman=Pursuha=Bhagavaan=Purushottama

 

 

 

Two further questions

 

a) Is Virat Purusha same as Narayana=Atma=Brahman=Pursuha=Bhagavaan=Purushottama? And can we modify the equation as

 

Lord Vishnu = Narayana = Virat Purusha=Atma = Brahman = Pursuha= Bhagavaan = Purushottama

 

 

b) If the above equation is true then which aspect precedes what?

 

 

 

OM

 

 

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So in reply to: 1) Are there many mahesvaras? obviously the answer would be “Yes” and you imply that there can be several Mahesvaras.

 

 

Just bcause some guy has a name Shiva, does he become Shiva in reality ? These names are given.

 

Similarly, Rudra Deva got the name Maheshvara as it was given to him.

 

 

Two further questions

 

a) Is Virat Purusha same as Narayana=Atma=Brahman=Pursuha=Bhagavaan=Purushottama? And can we modify the equation as

 

Lord Vishnu = Narayana = Virat Purusha=Atma = Brahman = Pursuha= Bhagavaan = Purushottama

 

 

Yes

 

 

b) If the above equation is true then which aspect precedes what?

 

 

There is no aspect here. It refers to the same BEING Narayana period.

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And the devata is not Vayu alone. But the whole truth is

 

r.s.i: va_taras'ana munigan.a, (1 ju_ti, 2 va_taju_ti, 3 vipraju_ti, 4 vr.s.a_n.aka, 5 karikrata, 6 etas'a, 7 r.s.yas'r.n:ga); devata_: kes'i_ (agni, su_rya, va_yu);

 

 

Where is agni or surya mentioned here ?

 

Agni is mentioned only to show that Vayu supports him. Hence the Deveta is Vayu alone and not these other Devatas as you hallucinate.

 

 

“vaayúr asmaa úpaamanthat pináSTi smaa kunannamaá

keshií viSásya paátreNa yád rudréNaápibat sahá

 

Vayu squeezed, kneaded and crushed [a small portion] of the

poison for Shiva and drank the poison along with Shiva.”

 

Your inserting the “small portion”, where there is none, does not change anything. And your identifying Vayu of the first line with the Keshi of the second line is ill-motivated as the two different translations show.

 

 

 

Why "ill motivated" Atanu ? Are you intoxicated with Baang or what ?

 

"Vaata" means Vayu.Read the verses Atanu and count how many times it is used in these mantras and use your intellect, just repeating nonsense and have never changed.

 

The mantras which praise Vayu, obviously shows superiority of Vayu over Rudra, by the word Saha.

 

The word SAHA shows that Rudra was simply secondary participant, while Vayu is the main subject of the mantras.

 

Besides Rudra gets a blue throat because of drinking the poison showing he was affected by the poison. There are sroies where Uma had to stop the poison from entering Rudra Deva's body for fear of Rudra getting affected by poison.

 

Eventhough Vayu drank the poison, He had no mark in His body unlike Rudra Deva. This again shows Rudra Deva's inferior position.

 

 

The verses provided only prove that Devas work for Shiva.

 

 

How ? Now this you call extrapolation with pre-conceived hallucinations from Shivites and Advaities.

 

 

Notwithstanding your distorted translation, which only goes against you, the following is true, going by your excellent logic.

 

Your fingers type your posts for you, so your fingers are greater than you.

 

And so on with other organs that you may have.

 

 

I do not answer BS logic from Advaita.

 

 

Yes, find one for yourself. Since your kind of hatred is unmatched.Hatred has only one end, on the bed of a Psychiatrist, or worse.

 

 

If you cannot forward logical refutation, please refrain from posting BS.

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and also remember, the word SAHA shows that Vayu, the main subject, drinks the major portion of poison, while Rudra Deva merely follows what Vayu does.

 

1. Note that Rudra merely drinks the crushed and kneaded poison given by Vayu to Rudra, while Vayu drinks the major portion from the poison vessel, Vayu taking the lead being the main participant.

 

2. Rudra gets a blue throat, while Vayu does not even have any sign of getting affected by poison.

 

Read the verse once again and may be something good will enter your head atleast once.

 

“vaayúr asmaa úpaamanthat pináSTi smaa kunannamaá

keshií viSásya paátreNa yád rudréNaápibat sahá

 

Vayu squeezed, kneaded and crushed [a small portion] of the

poison for Shiva and drank the poison along with Shiva.”

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(Why "ill motivated" Atanu ? Are you intoxicated with Baang or what ?)

 

 

What is this? Some mix up with other copy paste material? What is atanu and what is baang?

 

 

 

Rudra is Dyaus. The creator of Adityas, aswins, maruts, rudras, visvedevas, mahat, virat, etc. -- vasyu including.

 

He is Bhuthanath -- Lord of the great elements. He is Bhuthesvar.

 

Keno Upanishad states how Parvati imparted the knowledge of Brahman (manifesting in the place of Brahman) to Vayu, Agni, and Indra. And please do not try to demean Vedas and Hindu Religion by demeaning the father and the mother.

 

 

Your attempts are more dangerous that attempts of alien preachers. If you wish take me as friend and heed my request to be more contemplative than commbative.

 

 

Your motivated stories are too low to be commented upon.

 

The verses provided only prove that Devas work for Shiva.

 

 

And by your logic, your fingers and toes do most of your work, so pray to them.

 

 

And pray, pay heed to the following:

 

BG

 

Shrutivipratipannaa te yadaa sthaasyati nishchalaa;

Samaadhaavachalaa buddhistadaa yogam avaapsyasi.

 

(2.53) When thy intelligence, which is bewildered by the scriptures, shall stand unshaken and stable (samadhi), then shalt thou attain to insight (yoga).

 

 

Good Luck. Love. Please do not help alien preachers on public forums.

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(and also remember, the word SAHA shows that Vayu, the main subject, drinks the major portion of poison, while Rudra Deva merely follows what Vayu does)

 

 

Saha means with. So what is special?

 

 

Vayu kneaded, which the radiant (Kesins: agni, surya etc) drank with Rudra.

 

 

There is no need to separate out Vayu and Kesin. Otherwise simple sentence would be "Vayu kneaded and drank" and not "Vayu kneaded and Kesins drank with Rudra".

 

Vedas do not use extra words. Drop your preconceptions that have arisen from first reading Puranas and then going to Vedas.

 

 

 

 

Shrutivipratipannaa te yadaa sthaasyati nishchalaa;

Samaadhaavachalaa buddhistadaa yogam avaapsyasi.

 

(2.53) When thy intelligence, which is bewildered by the scriptures, shall stand unshaken and stable (samadhi), then shalt thou attain to insight (yoga).

 

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Meditate the form which is (shining) like crores (millions) of suns (kOTiravipram), Three eyed, wearing the cool gangA, in the hand with axe, deer, protection posture, the Great with only one leg, to the right and left shoulders of Lord shambhu brahmA, and vishNu present with their ideal arms surrounding Him, to Him, salutations with folded hands.

 

 

purANa of the deity :

Eka pAdar : one legged

 

 

********************This is the mUrti that shows that brahmA and vishNu appear from the Lord and finally merge in the Lord and oneness of God.****************

 

http://www.shaivam.org/siddhanta/maekap.html

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shankara nArAyaNar

 

shlokam:

The right part of the body, white in color, moon decorated crown, decorated by ash and rudrAksham, the left, black in color, with jeweled crown, shining in yellow clothes, the right hands are holding axe and protection posture, and the left, conch and mace, partially showing eye in the forehead, in the combined form of harihara, always (I) salute that shambhu.

 

 

purANa of the deity

sha.nkara nArAyaNar : the combined form of sha.nkara and nArAyaNa

 

vishNu is one of the shaktis (powers) of Lord Shiva. This mUrti indicates that concept. vishNu is in the left part of the Lord's body, which is the place of shakti. (1) (During the mOhini avatAr, mahAviShNu became the devi of Lord shiva.)

 

http://www.shaivam.org/siddhanta/mashan.html

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Hare Krishna,

 

Lord Shiva is so self-controlled and self-realized, that nothing can attract him or stop him from performing his tapasya and meditation on the Supreme Lord. Nobody can stop him apart from the Supreme Lord Himself, for He is the object of Lord Shiva's devotion. No wonder Mohini avatara was the only one who could disturb Lord Shiva - because She was after all the object of Lord Shiva's devotion, Lord Vishnu, the Supreme Personality of Godhead.

 

Hare Krishna.

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So is Lord Iyyappa is greater than both Lord Vishnu and Lord Shiva? Since he is combination of both the gods' powers.

 

Please don't fight over such mere fairy tales.

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Lord Iyappa is a form of Lord Shiva.

 

Lord Vishnu is the source of Lord Shiva.

 

No fairy tales - do you not accept Srimad Bhagavatam?

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What is this? Some mix up with other copy paste material? What is atanu and what is baang?

 

 

You are so intoxicated with Baang you do not know what you are typing.

 

 

Rudra is Dyaus. The creator of Adityas, aswins, maruts, rudras, visvedevas, mahat, virat, etc. -- vasyu including.

 

 

You advaitis are just confused. All the Devatas are different Jivas including Rudra, Umapati.

 

Remember the gradation Agnir Avamo Visnoh Paramas.

 

 

He is Bhuthanath -- Lord of the great elements. He is Bhuthesvar.

 

 

Do you want me to quote from Taittiriya Samhita

 

vi. 2. 3.

 

They said, 'Who shall shoot it?' [1] 'Rudra', they said, 'Rudra is cruel, let him shoot it.' He said, 'Let me choose a boon; let me be overlord of animals.' Therefore is Rudra overlord of animals.

 

The correspoding verses from Taittiriya Samhita are

 

váraM vrnA ahám evá pashUnAm ádhipatir asAnIti tásmAd rudráH pashUnAm ádhipatis.

 

If Rudra is Bhagavaan, I wonder why gets Varas from other Devatas.

 

 

Keno Upanishad states how Parvati imparted the knowledge of Brahman (manifesting in the place of Brahman) to Vayu, Agni, and Indra. And please do not try to demean Vedas and Hindu Religion by demeaning the father and the mother.

 

 

The Mukhyaprana Vayu of Keshii Sukta is "Sutra" mentioned in Upanishads, is the teacher of Rudra himslef. The Vayu you are mentioning in Keno Upanishad is Nasika Vayu.

 

 

Your motivated stories are too low to be commented upon.

 

 

In other words you do not know what you are talking about.

 

 

The verses provided only prove that Devas work for Shiva.

 

 

Just speculation. Nowhere it is said in Keshii Sukta that Devatas work for Rudra. Show me where it says so ?

 

 

And pray, pay heed to the following:

 

BG

 

Shrutivipratipannaa te yadaa sthaasyati nishchalaa;

Samaadhaavachalaa buddhistadaa yogam avaapsyasi.

 

(2.53) When thy intelligence, which is bewildered by the scriptures, shall stand unshaken and stable (samadhi), then shalt thou attain to insight (yoga).

 

Good Luck. Love. Please do not help alien preachers on public forums.

 

 

Falsehood must be exposed no matter it is alien or internal like advaita.

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Saha means with. So what is special?

 

 

The subject of the mantras is Vayu. The word SAHA points Rudra as simply a secondary participant, meaning Rudra was a secondary particpant with lesser importance as the subject of verses is Vayu.

 

 

Vayu kneaded, which the radiant (Kesins: agni, surya etc) drank with Rudra.

 

 

"Keshii" is a singular noun in first person. So it refers to only one person.

 

Secondly the Keshii here is referred in the first verse as support of Agni. So Keshii does not refer to Agni.

 

Nowhere Surya is mentioned. So it is mere speculation that it refers to Surya.

 

Third, Vayu is mentioned all over the mantras as Vaata and Vayu. Hence Vayu is only the real Devata.

 

 

There is no need to separate out Vayu and Kesin. Otherwise simple sentence would be "Vayu kneaded and drank" and not "Vayu kneaded and Kesins drank with Rudra".

 

 

As stated before it is Keshii(singular noun) and not Keshins as you suggest.

 

Second, even Agni is mentioned separately in Verse 1 of the mantra. So Keshii definitely not refers to Agni.

 

Third even if you wrongly assume Keshii as Surya etc. still that makes Rudra lower than these Devatas as

 

(a) Rudra gets a blue throat getting affected by poison

(b) Keshii does not get affected as there is no sign on his(their) bodies.

 

 

Vedas do not use extra words. Drop your preconceptions that have arisen from first reading Puranas and then going to Vedas.

 

 

One who does not understand Puranas does not understand Vedas properly. This is Veda Vyasas opinion as stated in Itihaasas and Puranas.

 

 

Shrutivipratipannaa te yadaa sthaasyati nishchalaa;

Samaadhaavachalaa buddhistadaa yogam avaapsyasi.

 

(2.53) When thy intelligence, which is bewildered by the scriptures, shall stand unshaken and stable (samadhi), then shalt thou attain to insight (yoga).

 

 

Applies to advaities and shivites very well.

 

Read this.

 

Persons of demonic nature do not know what to do and what not to do. They neither have purity nor good conduct nor truthfulness. (16.07)

 

They say that the world is unreal, without a substratum, without a God, and without an order. The world is caused by lust (or Kaama) alone and nothing else. (16.08)

 

That enemy has been slain by me, and I shall slay others also. I am the Lord. I am the enjoyer. I am successful, powerful, and happy; (16.14)

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(One who does not understand Puranas does not understand Vedas properly. This is Veda Vyasas opinion as stated in Itihaasas and Puranas.)

 

 

I agree. Describes you well.

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(One who does not understand Puranas does not understand Vedas properly. This is Veda Vyasas opinion as stated in Itihaasas and Puranas.)

 

Its the other way round actually.. one shud be pretty advanced in spirituality before stepping into the Puranas.. otherwise it wud be a complete set of wierd mythical tales for a starter and wudnt make sense at times.

 

Since Puranas communicate us in "three" different shades/hidden-languages, we shud be very careful and have to learn it from a realized soul with patience. To put it very vaguely.. the 3 ways of the Puranas are:-

 

1. Telling about things "as they are"

2. Telling about things "as seen by a certain seeker/rishi"

3. Telling about things "as a symbolic meaning in form of a cooked-up story, but which carry very deep and important inner meanings"

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Jai Ganesh

 

 

(One who does not understand Puranas does not understand Vedas properly. This is Veda Vyasas opinion as stated in Itihaasas and Puranas.)

 

Re

(I agree. Describes you well. )

 

 

How very true.

 

If only this people have conviction in what they say and accept what Veda Vyasa says then there want be this arguments which at times turns ugly

This very same people will tell you to ignore puranas if it does not fit in with their preconceived ideology.

The bhagvad puran has no mention of vayu drinking poison with Rudra yet our learned guest thinks he/she knows Vedas more then Vyasdev and concocts complete different version Of Kesin Sukta.

If only people accept what is quite clear in almost all the purans at least the ones that I have read that the lord is one but manifest in various forms I wold post few slokas, let us see if they accept what Vyasdev wrote.

 

SB 4.6.42: Lord Brahma said: My dear Lord Shiva, I know that you are the controller of the entire material manifestation, the combination father and mother of the cosmic manifestation, and the Supreme Brahman beyond the cosmic manifestation as well. I know you in that way.

(4.7/50-54 The lord said: The supreme cause of the universe, I am also Brahma (the creator) and Lord Shiva (the destroyer of the universe).

23. O lord, you are self-effulgent and supreme. You create this material world by your personal energy, and you assume the names Brahma, Visnu and Mahesvara when you act in creation, maintenance and annihilation.

 

 

Vishupuran say this 5.33-46 yo harih sa siva saksad yah sivah sa svayam harih ye tayor bhedam ati sthan narak aya bhave narah.

Whoever is lord hari, he himself is lord shiva indeed any human being mistake both the lords to be different,he/she surely goes to hell

 

yatha siva mayo vishnuh

Sivasya hrdyam Visnur Visnoz ca hrdayam Sivah(Skanda puran)

Just as Lord Vishnu is pervaded by Lord Shiva,

Similarly, in Shivas heart Vishnu resides and Vishnus heart is abode of Shiva.

 

I praise all the devotees of Sri Krishna and Shiva!

 

I detest all the so called devotees who though praise Krishna or Shiva but belittle the other propagating him to be inferior and small. Who go around distributing hatred.

 

Jai Shree Krishna

 

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(One who does not understand Puranas does not understand Vedas properly. This is Veda Vyasas opinion as stated in Itihaasas and Puranas.)

 

I agree. Describes you well.

 

 

Thank you. I will fllow Veda Vyasa than (a) fool(s) like you.

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**********The Mukhyaprana Vayu of Keshii Sukta is "Sutra" mentioned in Upanishads, is the teacher of Rudra himslef. The Vayu you are mentioning in Keno Upanishad is Nasika Vayu. **********************

 

 

Yes. And the Rudra you are talking about is your morbid imagination (which also is Rudra) and not the EKO Rudra.

 

 

 

One wonders how some beings hold fast to un-vedic concepts. We do not know where from this guest gets his translations whereby he sometimes kills off Rudra and sometimes reduces Rudra to a mere Jiva who is dependent on nature’s forces.

 

 

From Yajur Veda

 

Vikirida vilohita Namaste astu bhagavaha, Yaste sahasragam hetayo nyamasmanniva pantu tah ||

Namo astu nilagrivaya sahasrakshaya midhushe|

 

 

 

VEDAS PRAY TO RUDRA AS BHAGWAN who showers blessings.

 

 

It is truly an insult to Vedas to shout again and again that this Rudra is at the mercy of natural forces. And this pitiable guest thinks that he is Hindu. Just imagine, Bhagwan of Veda at the mercy of Vayu?

 

 

Some concepts (though originating from the pure consciousness itself) are delusions. We pity those beings that owing to the morbid love of egoistic mental concepts hold fast to such delusions and insult others. They are to be pitied and prayed for.

 

Rudra of Vedas is Benign-Shivo. He is EKO and HE is Visva Rupa. He saw birth of Brahma and is also all Devas.

 

Svet. Upanishad

 

3.2 Rudra is truly one; for the knowers of Brahman do not admit the existence of a second, He alone rules all the worlds by His powers. He dwells as the inner Self of every living being. After having created all the worlds, He, their Protector, takes them back into Himself at the end of time.

 

3.3 His eyes are everywhere, His faces everywhere, His arms everywhere, everywhere His feet. He it is who endows men with arms, birds with feet and wings and men likewise with feet. Having produced heaven and earth, He remains as their non—dual manifester.

 

3.4 He, the omniscient Rudra, the creator of the gods and the bestower of their powers, the support of the universe, He who, in the beginning, gave birth to Hiranyagarbha—may He endow us with clear intellect!

 

 

We do not understand the motivation of this Guest who clearly does not want to know what Shiva is. He is to be pitied and prayed for as below.

 

 

SVET. 3.4 He, the omniscient Rudra, the creator of the gods and the bestower of their powers, the support of the universe, He who, in the beginning, gave birth to Hiranyagarbha—may He endow us with clear intellect!

 

 

Shiva is not mere Jiva but is that indescribable BENIGN reality (Turiyatta Atma) on which everything subsists. He is Benign, one without a second and the world disappears in Him. He is like clarified butter in milk, present everywhere and in everyones heart. But He alone has apparently become the Jiva.

 

Manduyka Upanishad

 

XII

 

The Fourth (Turiya) is without parts and without relationship; It is the cessation of phenomena; It is shivo and non—dual. This AUM is verily Atman. He who knows this merges his self in Atman—yea, he who knows this.

 

 

The Self – Atma, which cannot be partitioned ever, brings forth the Purusha and not the other way around.

 

 

aitareya aranyaka

 

FOURTH ADHYAYA. FIRST KHANDA

 

OM aatmaa vaa idameka evaagra aasiinnaanyatki.nchana mishhat.h . sa Ikshata lokaannu sR^ijaa iti .. 1..

 

sa imaa.N llokaanasR^ijata . ambho mariichiirmaapo.ado.ambhaH pareNa diva.n dyauH pratishhThaa.antarikshaM mariichayaH ..

pR^ithivii maro yaa adhastaatta aapaH .. 2..

 

sa iikshateme nu lokaa lokapaalaannu sR^ijaa iti .. so.adbhya eva purushha.n samuddhR^ityaamuurchhayat.h .. 3..

 

 

Adoration to the Highest Self, Om!

 

1. In the beginning all this was Self (Atma), one only; there was nothing else blinking whatsoever.

 

He thought: 'Shall I send forth worlds?' He sent forth these worlds, Ambhas (water), Mariki (light), Mara (mortal), and Apah (water).

 

That Ambhas (water) is above the heaven, and it is heaven, the support. The Marikis (the lights) are the sky. The Mara (mortal) is the earth, and the waters under the earth are the Apah world. (2)

 

He thought: 'There are these worlds; shall I send forth guardians of the worlds?'He then formed the Purusha (the person), taking him forth from the water. (3)

 

 

Rig Veda clarifies as to who is the father of all --not Brahma but Rudra.

 

 

RV10.061.05 (Rudra), the benefactor of man, whose eager, virile energy was developed, drew it back when disseminated (for the generation of offfspring); again the irresistible (Rudra) concentrates (the energy) which was communicated to his maiden daughter.

 

 

RV 10.061.06 When the deed was done in mid-heaven in the proximity of the father working his will, and the daughter coming together, they let the seed fall slightly; it was poured upon the high place of sacrifice.

 

RV 10.061.07 When the father united with the daughter, then associating with the earth, he sprinkled it with the effusion; then the thoughtful gods begot Brahma; they fabricated the lord of the hearth (of sacrifice); the defender of sacred rites.

 

[Lord of the hearth of sacrifice: or va_stos.pati. Rudra. These r.cas show that Puranic stories are not what they seem. In some Puranas Rudra seems to be begot by Praja_pati; there is also a mix-up with the legend of Brahma's incestuous passion for his daughter. But one who reads all puranas together can only understand that EKO Rudro Maharshi is Sarva].

 

 

 

All these will remain confusing till it not realized that it is ONE BEING whom the whole Vedas hymn. It is EKO Rudra, who as Brahma, lusts after His own creation, then ashamed He becomes fierce (Manyu) and as Indra kills the father and makes Himself powerless; He alone rescues himself from Vritta; and from HIM proceeds the mind, the vak, the creation, the maintenance and the destruction. Sarva is Him. Eko is Him.

 

 

Shiva is that indescribable BENIGN reality (Turiyatta Atma) on which everything subsists. He is Benign, one without a second and the world disappears in Him. All will know him at the end of ego.

 

 

Svet. Up,

 

4.18 yadaa.atamastaanna divaa na raatriH

na sannachaasachchhiva eva kevalaH .

tadaxara.n tat.h saviturvareNyaM

praGYaa cha tasmaat.h prasR^itaa puraaNii .. 18

 

4.18. When the light has risen, there is no day, no night, neither existence nor non-existence; Siva (the blessed) alone is there. That is the eternal, the adorable light of Savitri, - and the ancient praGYaa proceeded thence.

 

6.7 tamiishvaraaNaaM paramaM maheshvara.n

ta.n devataanaaM parama.n cha daivatam.h .

patiM patiinaaM paramaM parastaad.h\-

vidaama devaM bhuvaneshamiiDyam.h .. 7..

 

 

6.7 WE WILL KNOW THIS MIGHTIEST ONE WHO IS FAR ABOVE ALL THE MIGHTY – THIS SUMMIT OF THE GODS AND THEIR GODHEAD, KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS, WHO TOWERETH HIGH ABOVE ALL SUMMIT AND GREATNESSES. LET US LEARN OF GOD FOR HE IS THIS UNIVERSES' MASTER AND ALL SHALL ADORE HIM.

 

 

 

 

 

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Hey...bloody idiots... you will never stop discussing "who's greater?shiva or vishnu?". Remember one thing, there is a spectrum in the sky, that spectrum is like the Sun but billion times more powerful than the Sun. That spectrum is only visible by ascetically, that spectrum is called the Supreme Power by us. Before the world was built, the Sun was created, and then by chance, when light from the sun has fallen on the Supreme, so the shadow of Supreme falls in the sky, and the places where the shadow is falling every time, God is established, first, three gods was created together, and are Shiva, Vishnu, Brahma and then Shakthi, Lakshmi, Saraswathi who become the wives of trimurtis (Shiva, Vishnu, Brahma), respectively. And after them, Prajapathis are created, it is they who shall develop the population in the world. Shiva, Vishnu and Brahma will be destroyed at the end of each Kalpa and they will be reborn at the beginning of each Kalpa. It is about the same for others as well, except the Supreme which is immortal, as he does not have birth, he has no death too. Shiva and Vishnu have the same power, Shiva worship Vishnu who worship Shiva has his time. That 's the truth, our ancestors, the early Hindus have understood, but over time, the descendants have forgotten, and they have separated themselves into two camps and brawl ... This is really stupid, this fight, which will put an end to this fight, the Supreme only i think ...

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