Jump to content
IndiaDivine.org
Sign in to follow this  
barney

Here we discuss Hinduism and its greatness but.......

Rate this topic

Recommended Posts

Indian Express Friday, January 07, 2005

 

Tsunami can’t wash this away: hatred for Dalits

 

 

In Ground Zero, Dalits thrown out of relief camps, cut out of food, water supplies, toilets, NGOs say they will start separate facilities

 

 

JANYALA SREENIVAS

 

 

Posted online: Friday, January 07, 2005 at 0058 hours IST

 

 

 

NAGAPATTINAM, JANUARY 6: There's something even an earthquake measuring 9 on the Richter scale and a tsunami that kills over 1 lakh people can’t crack: the walls between caste.

 

That’s why at Ground Zero in Nagapattinam, Murugeshan and his family of four have been living on the streets in Nambiarnagar. That’s why like 31 other families, they have been thrown out of relief camps. That’s why they are hounded out of schools they have sneaked into, they are pushed to the rear of food and water lines, given leftovers, not allowed to use toilets or even drink water provided by a UN agency. That’s why some NGOs are setting up separate facilities for them. Because they are all Dalits.

 

 

 

They are survivors from 63 damaged villages—30 of them flattened—all marooned in their own islands, facing the brunt of a majority of fishermen who are from the Meenavar community—listed in official records as Most Backward Class (MBC)—for whom Dalits are still untouchable.

 

The Indian Express toured the camps to find an old story of caste hatred being replayed in camp after camp:

 

• In the GVR Marriage Hall Relief Camp, Dalits cannot drink water from tanks put up by UNICEF. The Meenavars say they ‘‘pollute’’ the water.

 

• In the Nallukadai Street Relief Camp, a Meenavar Thalaivar, or leader, grabbed all cartons of glucose biscuits delivered by a Coimbatore NGO. The Dalits were told: these are not for you.

 

• At Puttur Relief Camp, the Meenavars have hoarded family relief kits, rice packets, new clothes and other relief material. When the Dalits asked for some, they paid a heavy price—they had to spend the night on the road.

 

• At the Neelayadatchi Temple Camp, Dalits are not allowed inside the temple, especially when rice and cash doles are being handed out.

 

• Dalits from three villages taking shelter at Ganapati cinema hall in Tharambagadi are thrown out every night because the Meenavar fisherwomen say they did not ‘‘feel safe’’ falling sleep with Dalits around.

 

• So 32 ostracised Dalit families took shelter in the GRM girls’ school in Thanjavur. But four days ago, even the school asked them to vacate saying it was due to re-open.

 

Those doing the discriminating brush all this aside. Says Chellayya, a Meenavar fisherman at a Tharambagadi camp: ‘‘These Dalits have been playing mischief, going back to the villages and looting houses. That’s why we don’t want them around here.’’

 

To which Dalit activist K Darpaya says: ‘‘What’s left in the houses for Dalits to take? And where will they keep the loot even if we assume they have taken something? In the relief camps? On the road side?’’

 

There’s an irony here. For, the district administration and relief agencies have to depend on the strong network of Meenavar fishermen to disburse aid and relief. But so rampant has the discrimination become that relief in-charge for Nagapattinam district Shantasheela Nayar, Secretary, Rural Development, is deputing District Adi Dravidar Welfare Officers to relief camps.

 

‘‘They will look into the problem and report back on what can be done to put an end to this. We certainly do not discriminate but if the fishermen themselves are doing it because of their local status, what can the government do?’’ says Nayar.

 

Talk to some of the victims and instead of bitterness and anger, there is grief and helplessness.

 

‘‘In Nagapattinam, three relief camps we went to denied us shelter saying they had no space. At the Nataraja Damayanti high school, the watchman refused to let us in,’’ says Murugeshan.

 

At first, the families did not understand why but as door after door slammed in their faces, it became clearer. They approached their local municipal councillor K Tilagar. ‘‘He assured us we would be given shelter soon but he disappeared,’’ says another survivor Anjamma.

 

In the neighbouring GVR camp, Dalit fishermen said they are being nudged out of relief and compensation queues. ‘‘We are inside the camp but kept in the far corner. Whenever officials and trucks come to give food, we are left out because nobody allows us to get near the trucks. Some men form a ring around us and prevent us from moving ahead in the queue,’’ says Saravanan, a Dalit survivor.

 

‘‘The Meenavars are more privileged as they get to sleep inside the rooms and are first to receive food and water. We have to sleep outside in the verandahs or in the open ground,’’ says Jivanana.

 

Kesavan, a Dalit of Nambiarnagar, says he was prevented from drinking water from a plastic tank put up in the hamlet on Monday. ‘‘We are forced to bring water in plastic cans from outside the village. The Collector’s office has put up the tank here and provides clean water but it is not for us,’’ he says.

 

V Vanitha, a Class X Dalit student, says adolescent girls are prevented from using toilet areas at Tharambagadi. ‘‘Small children have no problem but it is an ordeal for us. There are no toilets here and they prevent us from going to the area which serves as an open toilet,’’ she says.

 

Says activist Darpaya: ‘‘Dalits are not allowed to drink water from tanks put up by UNICEF. Even in relief camps, Meenavars don’t want to sit with Dalits and have food. Some of them manage to get rice but other relief items coming in like biscuit packets, milk powder and family household kits are denied to Dalits.’’

 

Says M Jayanthi, a coordinator of South Indian Fishworkers Society (SIFS): ‘‘Dalits are facing discrimination in all relief camps where they are present. But society does not want to raise the issue as it would complicate things further. Without making it public, we are opening separate facilities for Dalits exclusively,’’ she says.

 

Sevai, an NGO-based in Karaikal, Pondicherry, 20 kms from Nagapattinam, is the first organisation to address the issue.

 

Coordinator R Indrani says: ‘‘Since Dalits are not receiving sufficient food and water, we have started cooking for them in separate kitchens. They come from wherever they are taking shelter and we provide them whatever they want. We are also considering separate camps for them.’’

 

Several NGOs which noticed the problem raised the issue during their meeting with District Collector M Veerashanmugha Moni. ‘‘But no one is willing to take up the matter at the field level as this could complicate things. We don’t want friction between the two castes by trying to address it during this crisis,’’ says the team leader of NGO Accord, which is working among Dalits.

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Very good article barney. Goes to show how much hinduism has declined. These so called hindus that discriminate the dalits seem to be everywhere. I dont know how they can call themselves hindus when they are going against the very principles of hinduism and don't know what hinduism is about. I am sure most of the people that have hatred for the dalits have no knowledge of hinduism nor have they read the bhagvat gita, or else they wouldn't be acting this way.

This is also a big reason why some dalits are convertting to other religions and will continue to do so. So ultimately it is hindus(so called hindus i mean) that often force other hindus to convert....like i have said before so called hindus are the biggest threat to hinduism and unless we do something to educate these so called hindus, hindusim is going to loose out...sooner or later it is bound to happen.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have heard and seen race discrimination in all parts of the world but caste discrimination is only happening in India, the land that claims to be the oldest civilization and talks of Dharma. I'm an Indian but India is not the country of my origin but my forefathers. I hate to say this but never will I crave to visit India which discriminates its own race. I do not blame Hinduism for the stupid of of some selfish human being with qualities of animal. Educating this beings is a waste ot time as the are beyond redemption. For thousands of years Saints like Adhi Shankarara, Ramakrishna, Ramalingam and many others have thought to respect all living creatures and love them as you love yourself. Nothing could change these animals as it is their karma to take on such sins to suffer in their next birth. But I pray that the future generation of India would be different what what we experience now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

if the news is telling the truth, then it is sad.

it is adharma. hindus need to know dharma from gita and practiec it correclty.

 

still i believe majority hindus do not do cast discrimination now a days.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

"caste discrimination is only happening in India"

 

it happens all over the world.. where do you live? on mars? everywhere poors, workers are discriminated by rich, and leading classes

 

and castes have nothing to do with ancient varna system who has the opposite purpose: that the highest is the lowest's servant

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

I agree with the guest and madhav.

 

 

Luckily, the majority of Hindus I know dismiss caste discrimination. I don't live in India, but in our Chicago Indian-American community, inter-caste marriage is even the norm.

 

 

Also, it's ironic how people blame us and point fingers at us for caste discrimination when their own cultures are guilty of it themselves. The only difference is that they don't call it the "caste system."

 

Some very wealthy American families would never want to live next to families on welfare, and look down upon them just as some of these so-called "upper-caste" savages (savages because of the way how they treat other humans) look down upon dalits. People wouldn't want to hire a homeless person, or a person from the slums of Harlem. The list goes on..........

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

what we are talking about is discrimination the caste. You can call it varna but "JATI" is order of life among the Indians. Divided by different jatis, the one that claims to be of the higher cast would refuse to do anything with the lower caste. The lower caste would not be allowed to enter the houe of a high caste and if the need arise they could only enter through the back door and many other ristrictions and it is only happening i India and no where else. Sow me a country that divides the people by JATI. May be you are living in dream land that you are not aware of reality..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

again, that's happening every where in different ways and it has nothing to do with varna's system.. it is the opposite of it...

 

so do not mix vedic tradition with kali yuga corruption

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Kali yuga corruption was foretold and who is the cause for such? It's the same keepers of the verdic sastras. So denying the happening would not do you or oters any good. Admit it and say something like the gurdians of thw sastras would educate the fallen Hindus on the matter. Why do you want to be stuborn and deny the matter exist in India? I know there are true Hindus who do not discriminate but their numbers ae small compared to Hindus who have the qulities of animals instead of man. Qualities of man is suppose to be godliness but some do not possess such instead their is animaliness.

 

Possessiveness, Selfish, Anger, Retaliation, Roudyness, Scavanging, Thievery and Anarchy are all animaliness. As long as Hindus have the above qualities they cannot call themselves as Hindus and India has 3/4 of them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

barney,

 

what you are describing is also very rare and is not practiced by majority Hindus.

you are not born hindu,

and so have not grown in hindu culture.

please do not assume authority in hindu matters.

 

need is to awaken hindu, not defame hinduism or hindus.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

Casteist Hindu's are a disgrace and we seriously need to do something about these fools! They will destroy Hinduism quicker than any Christian or muslim or maxist groups.

Take any support away from any Hindu you know is a caseist and let him/her know you disagree with them and that they a wrong. The castesists need to be ostrascised and ignored so they loose power and support and have no choice but to change their ways.

 

I'm glad to say that in the west UK and USA that there are very few casteist Hindus and most castes get on.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

<< The castesists need to be ostrascised and ignored so they loose power and support and have no choice but to change their ways. >>

 

dharma gurus and real Hindus need to help them undersand hinduism as it is given in gita, and motivate them to live by it correctly.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

Possessiveness, Selfish, Anger, Retaliation, Roudyness, Scavanging, Thievery and Anarchy are all animaliness. As long as Hindus have the above qualities they cannot call themselves as Hindus and India has 3/4 of them. "

 

these are simply the features of kali yuga mankind..

 

and again, the original principle of varna-ashram and the sanatana dharma has nothing to do with the corruption

 

you are right that who knows shastras are meant to educate unconscious people... so please start to study them better

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

May be you too do not understand my view and who told you that I'm not born a Hindu? If a Hindu does not have authority over his religion than that religion is not Hinduism. For your information this is a discussion forum and every member has the right to put his view point here. I've never spoken against Hinduism and would not allow anyone to do so but what I'm refering to is the way most Hindus behave like what is happening in Chennai relief camps of the Tsunami Victims.

 

I've heard many stories of such before this and that is why I'm so disgusted with these animal behaviour of people who call themselves Hindus. You may not like to hear the real truth coz the truth is bitter but as Hindus we have to accept the truth instead of pretending that all is well among Hindus. Sorry, but what has to be said will be said.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I do not really know where you live on the earth, but I live in India and I know the reality over here. I will tell you that. Here in India, we have reservations for the so called dalits to the tune of 50% and the upper class had restricted their competition to the remaining 50%, or otherwise, they would compete for 100%. You need to appreciate the adjustment that is agreed. You said that dalits are asked to enter the house from the back door. If you are unaware of the fact that in majority of best hotels in the world, the staff enters the hotel from the back door and not allowed to sit before the customer. If you think that enterance by back door is only caste discrimination, then all the reputed hotels follow it and the majority are in the western countries who talk aboud discrimination.

 

Before you give any comment or a talk, you first of all analyse the same and talk as it might cause the misrepresentation of the facts.

 

Please take the note of it.

 

Bye,

Madhav Daitha.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Madhav,

 

As our first names match, our ideas also match. What you said to barney, about not to assume authority in Hindu matters is aptly correct. I also advice him to study and practice Hinduism so that he can understand it. If he needs some help, he can contact us and my mail id is daithamadhav@

 

Bye,

Madhav Daitha.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

I've heard many stories of such before this and that is why I'm so disgusted with these animal behaviour of people who call themselves Hindus. You may not like to hear the real truth coz the truth is bitter but as Hindus we have to accept the truth instead of pretending that all is well among Hindus. Sorry, but what has to be said will be said.

 

you´re right barneyji.in this summer vacations i decided to explore (south-/ern)india. and in one tempel there were many people beating a woman and i think they were going to sacrifice a goat. but I tell you it was so horrible and for a short period i didn´t have faith in hinduism.

 

and a month ago there was a excibition about hinduism ( here in zurich ) . and guess what I saw .... horrible think... It was not that hinduism that I know.

 

we must unite and clear the things:

 

hinduism is just like a diamond and people are trying to put mud on this diamond to hide its shine, but they don´t know that a diamond remains a diamond... (it´s actually in german /images/graemlins/smile.gif )

 

hare krishna

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

<< but as Hindus we have to accept the truth >>

 

barney, there we agree. and we have to act considering the truth also.

 

it would be nice if you begin posting with a hindu username. as i have said many times, we hindus need to do work intrenally, as well as externally. it is not a good idea to let the enemies know our problems because it does not help us. they are very much intersted to divide us and cause strife within so that we cannot win over them.

 

as an example, it does not help one to let the world know what problems one has with one's wife or parents. it is an internal matter. to the world the whole family wisely would say: "We are united. World, keep your nose out of our family matters."

 

hope you (and other hindus) understand.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

its one of the age old practices, to drive away the evil spirits that might have haunted the woman.

they even beat men like that.

So unless you know the intentions, you cannot comment.

 

and sometimes there are harsh punishments for not being faithful to one's partner.

 

its not that people enjoy beating a woman. this is not like gladiator type movies, where people are bloodthirsty.

 

and dont brand untouchabilty as hinduism. untouchabilty is prevelent in all parts of the world and all religions of the world. might is always right.

 

its just a question of haves and havenots.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

To ekanshanand

 

<< i decided to explore (south-/ern)india. and in one tempel there were many people beating a woman and i think they were going to sacrifice a goat. but I tell you it was so horrible and for a short period i didn´t have faith in hinduism. >>

 

You should do what Krishna advised all us to do - to be absolutely fearless and fight for righteosness. These practices need to be abondoned by the people, even if it means forcing them, because it is they who are playing their part in destroying Hinduism. Imagine the bad karma they will incur for doing such bad practices.

 

<< and a month ago there was a excibition about hinduism ( here in zurich ) . and guess what I saw .... horrible think... It was not that hinduism that I know. >>

 

Please tell us what you saw?...I'm sure most of us can handle it. I'm interested in knowing how these western nations are misrepresenting Hinduism. I know throughout the history of Hinduism there have been many good things, but there has also been some bad inncorrect practices that have largely been dropped over time. Though in remote parts of India you still have backward people who might carry them out.

 

 

To guest

 

<<its one of the age old practices, to drive away the evil spirits that might have haunted the woman.

they even beat men like that.

So unless you know the intentions, you cannot comment.>>

 

Please don't make me laugh! It's stupid practices like this which makes people not take Hinduism seriously and make it look exploitative. By the way beating a woman to get an eveil spirit out is actually an ISLAMIC practice! They beat a djinn out of a woman in order to get it out and some Hindu communities have adopted this from them and do the same.

 

It's not as age-old as you think and is not in the Vedas, whereas the Atharva Veda has mantras to drive evil spirits away but beating is not done in any way.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

beating a woman with neem leaves is in South india. We south indian tamils dont know the sanskritised vedas.

Then may be we are not hindus at all. thanks for letting us know the real roots... then may be sanskritised vedas are not the nativity of south india?

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

Did you use a brain to figure that out? Because if you did, you might want to ask God for another one because it seems to be malfunctioning. Your reasoning is completely incoherent.

 

"beating a woman with neem leaves is in South india. We south indian tamils dont know the sanskritised vedas.

Then may be we are not hindus at all. thanks for letting us know the real roots... then may be sanskritised vedas are not the nativity of south india?"

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

Nothing was said about neem leaves, so now I'm surprised you mentiones neem leaves. Why not mention it before, how are we to know if it is neem leaves or a stick? Stop trying to play smart. We were talking about beating a woman to get the evil spirit out and you bring in this thing about neem leaves!

 

<<We south indian tamils dont know the sanskritised vedas.

Then may be we are not hindus at all. thanks for letting us know the real roots...>>

 

It seems you have a chip on your shoulder. Some south Indians do know the sankritised vedas, but maybe your group does not. Shankaracharya and Ramanuja and Madhvacharya were from the South and they knew the Sanskritised Vedas. It's your problem whether or not you want to be seen as a Hindu. It's not a problem for North Indians, we would gladly accept you all as Hindus, but if you don't, then it's your choice.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...