Guest guest Report post Posted December 29, 2008  SrI: Dear ALL : FYI. V.Sadagopan - Vijayaraghavan Chakravarthy Oppiliappan Group Sunday, December 28, 2008 12:16 PM RE: Re: Cost of srardham Dear ShrimAn Kochhappa & other Esteemed members who have expressed their thoughts on the above subject: These are my humble views that somewhat differ from the views expressed so far. We all complain of the cost involved in performing Vaideeka ceremonies. We are also seeing a steady decline in anushtAnams and the aachaarams required by those who officiate in our religious ceremonies and take part in Braahmanaarthams etc., The Bruhaspathees (except a small percentage) also lack the knowledge and the Shraddha required for performing Vaideeka ceremonies correctly and (as far as possible flawlessly). Overall, the cost aspect is only a small problem associated with the performance of Vaideeka ceremonies and our focus should be to increase the quality of these activities as laid down in the Shaastraas. Also, the e-Bruhaspathy while serving a noble goal cannot replace the divine presence of a Brahmana (who practices anushTanams and aachhaarams along with the spiritual qualities of “ashta vidham pushpamâ€), that is so vital to perform vaideeka Karmas. In the USA the problem is much more acute as temple priests who are trained in aagamaas perform Vaideeka karyams. What can we do collectively to improve the situation? First: How we as “Lowkiikaas†have contributed to this problem: For people like Kochhappa, the question to be asked is: Am I contributing at least 3% of my income to Vaideeka Kaaryams and other charitable activities. Statistics show that we as Hindus completely lack the charitable spirit. We need to be generous and practice more wholeheartedly the spirit of giving. Otherwise our complaints have no meaning. We as Hindus need to increase the financial base for Vaideeka activities so that we attract talent and quality people to practice Vaideekam as a profession. We, who have given-up our village, our Vedic roots and the Brahmanical way of life (because of materialistic pursuits), should resist from complaining against the Vaadhyaars who apparently would also like to partake of the economic prosperity that we all enjoy - like cell phones, tv, cars etc - and money is the medium. Second: How can we rekindle the “lowkiikaa’s†interest in Vaideeka kaaryams?. I think the solution lies in every Sri Vaishnava Brahmana learning a minimum of Vaideeka Kaaryams along with their regular education. The matams should focus on opening summer schools (2 to 4 weeks duration) or classes (after school-hours) where children can learn simple things like performing a punyahavaachanam, Upaakarmam, Sandhya vandanam, Bhagavat aaradhanam, Agni sandhaanam, and important mantraas of upanayanam, Vivaaham and Shrarddham etc. This is the only way we can create shraddha and the high standards required to perform the Vaideeka karmas. The proposed e-bruhaspathy can certainly supplement this need but it cannot be a replacement. Finally, no organization including matams & temples can escape the need for money to offer quality services for the people that they intend to serve. We should whole-heartedly support them (by being lavish) but at the same time demanding high quality in their performance. In my humble opinion we should have a Vaideeka Association that will recognize exceptional “Bruhaspathiis†and encourage other Bruhaspathiis to constantly improve through continuing education. Vijayaraghavan Srinivasan Chakravarthy Buffalo/NYS. Vijayaraghavan Buffalo/NY Oppiliappan From: kochappaaDate: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 11:43:42 +0530Re: Fw: Re: Cost of srardham Sri: Namaskaram to Sri. Sadagopan swamin. At the outset kindly bear with the delay in my reply. My mail did not open for 3 days. I am extremely grateful for the kind steps your goodself and Sriman nvs swamy offered. I will certainly render whatever assistance that I could do. The e bruhaspathi would be a great boon to many. I earnestly hope many asthikas will come forward to lend a helping hand. Adiyen Kochappaa --- On Sun, 21/12/08, Dr.V.Sadagopan <yennappan (AT) computer (DOT) net> wrote: Dr.V.Sadagopan <yennappan (AT) computer (DOT) net>Fw: Re: Cost of srardham"Ponnappan" <Oppiliappan >, "Sgt" <saranagathi >, "SG" <Tiruvenkatam >, "DS" <desikasampradaya >, RamanujaandDesika , "Swami" , "IRS" , "RB" <Raamabhakthi >, Rajeev (AT) parakalamatham (DOT) orgCc: "av" <ahobilavalli >, "Srikanth Veeraraghavan" <hindusrikanth >Sunday, 21 December, 2008, 6:18 PM  Sri: Dear Sri Kocchappa Iyengar : Thanks for your mail and staying deeply interested . Yes , Many have responded and the exchanges are good . Time has now come to take action . The intent in taking action and creating ways to address the needs of sincere AasthikAs is to come up with a solution based on modern technology ( Skype , Multimedia , Text and Video ) so that many who long to perform SrAddhAs but do not have access to knowledgable Brahaspathys as well as limited by the steep costs requsted by some Bruhaspathys . We do not plan to reduce the earnings of Bruhaspathys but want to create a Bruhaspathy assisted performance of annual SraaddhAs and Maasa TarpaNams etc . The thinking on my mind is the creation of an ebruhaspathy approach , where the karthA is assisted online . The technical problems are addressable . Precursory instructions will be provided so that one approaches the performance in a prepared state . I come from a family of Bruhaspathys , whose strength was in the Knowledge of Veda Mantraas and PrayOgams and they earned very little .They went to extraordinary lengths for AasthikAs to recite the Mantrams precisely and follow the prayOgams without Mantra lObham . My grandfather was an expert in both the Yajur and Saama Veda prayOgams . They wer eindeed PurohitAs in the fullest sense of the term . There are a few uncompromising Bruhaspathys , who do n ot look upon their services as a business . SambhAvanai YathA Sakthi can be made . Those who have can give and the others can provide sambhAvanai within their means . Bottom line , Vaidhika KarmAs are carried out and mental peace is attained thru the performance of these prescribed pitru karmAs . It will take a little time to set this all up but can be done if Sri Lakshmi Nrisimhan blesses us to proceed . A Membership oriented organization has to be built for efficent cooperation and effective scheduling . It would be more than a full time activity for that "ebruhaspathy " , who can perhaps be assisted by similar minded people to ease the load on the assumption that there will be a good usage of such services to AasthikAs . Let me hear from you whether you like this proposal so that I can work further on this and streamline this process . It is a major effort and it is not worth pursuing unless there is significant interest . Oppiliappan Koil V.Sadagopan Co-Moderator , Vaideekam Groups - kochappa Iyengar Oppiliappan Saturday, December 20, 2008 2:27 AM Re: Re: Cost of srardham Adiyen is moved by the sincere response from a number of swamins on the cost of srardham and most have concurred that concern should be for reduction of cost so that people with little or moderate finance will not be driven to think of giving up the practice. However, I doubt whether most of the bruhaspathis will ever listen, as they have their own concerns. However, I prostrate to all those swamins who took the pains to spend time to ponder on the issue. Someday, solution might come. One swami had remarked that one should understand the meaning and do the srardham. It is true but who is going to explain the detailed meaning of mantras to karthas, as bruhaspathi swamins have also have to race against time. But I request that at least if any one explain, at least briefly, the significance of the following steps in srardham, it would be of solace that the financial strain is compensated. 1.After agnisanthanm by wife and owpasanam etc., placing (dropping ) the annam with ghee in the Agni, for pithu, pitha maha, pravitha mahan, mathu pithamahi and prapithamahi. 2. Placing annam on the floor before the leaf of nimantrana swamigal, after serving food to them but before their start partaking the food. 3. Placing the rice ball to crow 4. Pinda pradhanam with water and thil after the above. Of the above, which is very vital and really goes as food to the forefarthers, so that if some bruhaspathi rushes through and omits we can ask for? Adiyen, Kochappaa--- On Mon, 15/12/08, thirunarayanan swamy iyengar <nanu_04011955@ > wrote: thirunarayanan swamy iyengar <nanu_04011955@ >Re: Re: Cost of srardhamOppiliappanMonday, 15 December, 2008, 9:10 PM Respected swamy,I know one Sama vadhyar by name Sriman U.Ve.Devanatha Iyengar, he will help the person(s) who do not have sufficient money to pay to the vadhyaar. But he will get more sambhavanai whose status is high without fail.My periappa who was in Serangulam near Mannargudi. He will go to others house for srardham as "Swamin" take oil bath and food etc. But instead of sambhavanai, he will accept only " THULASI THALAM". Similarly, my mutual understanding when my periappa does srardham in his house, the swami will also take only THULASI THALAM as sambhavanai from my periappa.No one should demand money. We have to do all ceremonies by mutual understanding only.S.THIRUNARAYANAN of Karappangadu--- On Tue, 9/12/08, kidambi1950 <kidambi1950@ > wrote: kidambi1950 <kidambi1950@ > Re: Cost of srardhamOppiliappanTuesday, 9 December, 2008, 10:43 PM Oppiliappan, "kochappaa" <kochappaa@.. .> wrote:> i accept the views expressed by Sri. Kochappa. the brahaspathis has to consider the fianancial capacity of the karthas. moreover many of the brahapathis are not even bothered to perform the rites/rituals in full and many times, if the kartha is not having any knowledge of the mantras, they skip the mantras and complete the srartham in 30 minutes. so it is time for them to relaise and come forward to help the poor brahmins. ofcourse, i am capable of meeting the demands of the vadhyars but writing this letter over my willingness that the poor should not stop the srarthams due to financial bvurden k.r.narasimhan> Respected swamins,> I want to share a haunting thought of mine. I am a retired middle > class pensioner in Banglaore. For the past 3 or so years I find > things are becoming very costly for doing annual pitru srardhams. > The charges are like this: Rs.650 for Bruhaspathi + small coins > Rs.50, Rs.600 for 2 swmingals, Rs.700 for thaligai swami and the > provisions Rs. 600. Thus the total cost of a srardham is Rs.2600. I > have to do two per year and arrange for the srardham of my poor > sister who passed away. Many middle class bramins must be facing > this kind of music. Can any middle class person can afford such > costs? Whether any other people from other religion or even other > caste people would spend like this annually on remembering the > departed souls? Rs.500 if donated to an orphanate or oldage home > would feed atleast 25 mouths. Where is our sect heading towards. I > am sure that unless our sect wakes up and rationalise and regulate > these fleecing bruhaspathis, the whole custom of peforming such > rites would quickly vanish. It is time, our mutts start some > registered body where they should register these bruhaspahtis and > swamins and fix reasonable tariff also.> > adiyen > Kochappaa> Connect with friends all over the world. Get India Messenger. From Chandigarh to Chennai - find friends all over India. Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Invite them now. It’s the same Hotmail®. If by “same†you mean up to 70% faster. Get your account now. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted January 8, 2009 Sri: Srimathe Ramanujaya Nama: adiyen's 2 cents - I could be rewinding the same comments from many of you but slightly differently: 1. The " bruhaspathy " industry needs standardization of practices, and commonization of a " rate-card " system across the country and the globe. Institutionalization could help this. Regional, national, global institutions could be formed. Bruhaspathy's could register themselves with the institution to provide services. I will discuss the advantages of this institutionalization further in the posting. 2. Reaching people in remote locations. When orders start flowing into the institution in a mass, the institution can then methodically plan the logistics and deployment of Bruhaspathys to a local area depending on the number of assignments there. This would save tremendous amount of time. Today we see Bruhaspathys traveling from one end of town to another spending lot of time on travel. Optimizing travel could result in tremendous cost savings that could be passed on to the customer. 3. The institution can use financial planning and forecasting methods to determine demand-supply. At the same time, if one were to adopt the model of Aravind Eye Hospital and Shankara Netralaya, the institution could subsidize the cost of Shrardha for the lower income group, by requesting higher income group people to pay a little more. Payment can also be donation from people abroad in order to subsidize the cost of Shrardha for some low income group person. Adiyen has been a regular contributor to Shankara Netrayala who promtly send me the names of people to whom they performed cataract operations with my donation! 4. Institutionalization can help plan logistics better. If the demand pattern shows a number of vaideeka karyam demand in a particular rural area during a particular period - say a week or 2 weeks, a bruhaspathy could be sent there for that short period to stay and perform all karyams. 5. In addition, the institution could consider offering e-bruhaspathy services over web, webcam, videophone, or simply a phone after establishing its feasibility by considering the variables that are needed to perform vaideeka karyams. Adiyen Ramanuja Dasan, Sudarshan vaideekam , sounderrajan srinivasan <nssr1941 wrote: > > Respected Sir, >  >  I fully agree with the Views expressed by Shriman Dr.V.Sadagopan. >  >  In Singapore for instance the Association has to be informed for our needs and we are provided with all the facility to perform our Vaideeka ceremonys. There is a standard Charge( may be comparitively high) but it renders a Good and Quality Service. >  >    We should have a begining on these aspects and those who are not qualified for the job should be sidelined. >  Regards, >  N.S.Sounderrajan. > > > --- On Mon, 29/12/08, Dr.V.Sadagopan <yennappan wrote: > > Dr.V.Sadagopan <yennappan > [Vaideekam] Fw: Re: Cost of srardham > vaideekam > Monday, 29 December, 2008, 9:27 AM  > SrI: >  > Dear ALL : FYI. > V.Sadagopan > - > Vijayaraghavan Chakravarthy > Oppiliappan Group > Sunday, December 28, 2008 12:16 PM > RE: Re: Cost of srardham > > > > Dear ShrimAn Kochhappa & other Esteemed members who have expressed their thoughts on the above subject: >  > These are my humble views that somewhat differ from the views expressed so far. >  > We all complain of the cost involved in performing Vaideeka ceremonies. We are also seeing a steady decline in anushtAnams and the aachaarams required by those who officiate in our religious ceremonies and take part in Braahmanaarthams etc., The Bruhaspathees (except a small percentage) also lack the knowledge and the Shraddha required for performing Vaideeka ceremonies correctly and (as far as possible flawlessly). Overall, the cost aspect is only a small problem associated with the performance of Vaideeka ceremonies and our focus should be to increase the quality of these activities as laid down in the Shaastraas. Also, the e-Bruhaspathy while serving a noble goal cannot replace the divine presence of a Brahmana (who practices anushTanams and aachhaarams along with the spiritual qualities of “ashta vidham pushpamâ€), that is so vital to perform vaideeka Karmas. In the USA the problem is much more acute as temple priests who are trained in > aagamaas perform Vaideeka karyams. What can we do collectively to improve the situation? >  > First: How we as “Lowkiikaas†have contributed to this problem: For people like Kochhappa, the question to be asked is: Am I contributing at least 3% of my income to Vaideeka Kaaryams and other charitable activities. Statistics show that we as Hindus completely lack the charitable spirit. We need to be generous and practice more wholeheartedly the spirit of giving. Otherwise our complaints have no meaning. We as Hindus need to increase the financial base for Vaideeka activities so that we attract talent and quality people to practice Vaideekam as a profession. We, who have given-up our village, our Vedic roots and the Brahmanical way of life (because of materialistic pursuits), should resist from complaining against the Vaadhyaars who apparently would also like to partake of the economic prosperity that we all enjoy - like cell phones, tv, cars etc - and money is the medium. >  > Second: How can we rekindle the “lowkiikaa’s†interest in Vaideeka kaaryams?. I think the solution lies in every Sri Vaishnava Brahmana learning a minimum of Vaideeka Kaaryams along with their regular education. The matams should focus on opening summer schools (2 to 4 weeks duration) or classes (after school-hours) where children can learn simple things like performing a punyahavaachanam, Upaakarmam, Sandhya vandanam, Bhagavat aaradhanam, Agni sandhaanam, and important mantraas of upanayanam, Vivaaham and Shrarddham etc. This is the only way we can create shraddha and the high standards required to perform the Vaideeka karmas. The proposed e-bruhaspathy can certainly supplement this need but it cannot be a replacement. >  > Finally, no organization including matams & temples can escape the need for money to offer quality services for the people that they intend to serve. We should whole-heartedly support them (by being lavish) but at the same time demanding high quality in their performance. In my humble opinion we should have a Vaideeka Association that will recognize exceptional “Bruhaspathiis†and encourage other Bruhaspathiis to constantly improve through continuing education. > > Vijayaraghavan Srinivasan Chakravarthy >  Buffalo/NY > S. Vijayaraghavan Buffalo/NY > > > > > > Oppiliappan > kochappaa (AT) (DOT) co.in > Thu, 25 Dec 2008 11:43:42 +0530 > Re: Fw: Re: Cost of srardham > > > Sri: > Namaskaram to Sri. Sadagopan swamin. > At the outset kindly bear with the delay in my reply. My mail did not open for 3 days. > I am extremely grateful for the kind steps your goodself and Sriman nvs swamy offered. I will certainly render whatever assistance that I could do. The e bruhaspathi would be a great boon to many. I earnestly hope many asthikas will come forward to lend a helping hand. > Adiyen > Kochappaa > > > --- On Sun, 21/12/08, Dr.V.Sadagopan <yennappan (AT) computer (DOT) net> wrote: > > Dr.V.Sadagopan <yennappan (AT) computer (DOT) net> > Fw: Re: Cost of srardham > " Ponnappan " <Oppiliappan>, " Sgt " <saranagathi@ . com>, " SG " <Tiruvenkatam>, " DS " <desikasampradaya>, RamanujaandDesika@ . com, " Swami " <>, " IRS " <@ . com>, " RB " <Raamabhakthi>, Rajeev@parakalamath am.org > Cc: " av " <ahobilavalli>, " Srikanth Veeraraghavan " <hindusrikanth@ gmail.com> > Sunday, 21 December, 2008, 6:18 PM > > > > >  > Sri: >  > Dear Sri Kocchappa Iyengar : >  > Thanks for your mail and staying deeply interested . > Yes , Many have responded and the exchanges are good . >  > Time has now come to take action . >  > The intent in taking action and creating ways to address > the needs of sincere AasthikAs is to come up with a solution > based on modern technology ( Skype , Multimedia , Text > and Video ) so that many who long to perform SrAddhAs but > do not have access to knowledgable Brahaspathys as well as > limited by the steep costs requsted by some  Bruhaspathys . >  > We do not plan to reduce the earnings of Bruhaspathys but > want to create a Bruhaspathy assisted performance of > annual SraaddhAs and Maasa TarpaNams etc . The thinking > on my mind is the creation of an ebruhaspathy approach , where > the karthA is assisted online . The technical problems > are addressable . Precursory instructions will be provided > so that one approaches the performance in a prepared state .  >  > I come from a family of Bruhaspathys , whose strength was > in the Knowledge of Veda Mantraas and PrayOgams and > they earned very little .They went to extraordinary lengths > for AasthikAs to recite the Mantrams precisely and follow > the  prayOgams without Mantra lObham . My grandfather > was an expert in both the Yajur and Saama Veda prayOgams . > They wer eindeed PurohitAs in the fullest sense of the term . >  > There are a few uncompromising Bruhaspathys , who do n ot > look upon their services as a  business . SambhAvanai YathA > Sakthi can be made . Those who have can give and the others > can provide sambhAvanai within their means . Bottom line , > Vaidhika KarmAs are carried out and mental peace is attained > thru the performance of these prescribed pitru karmAs . >  > It will take a little  time to set this all  up but can be done if > Sri Lakshmi Nrisimhan blesses us to proceed . >  > A Membership oriented organization has to be built > for efficent cooperation and effective scheduling . > It would be more than a full time activity for > that " ebruhaspathy " , who can perhaps be assisted > by similar minded people to ease the load on the assumption > that there will be a good usage of such services to AasthikAs . >  > Let me hear from you whether you like this proposal > so that I can work further on this and streamline this > process . It is a major effort and it is not worth pursuing > unless there is significant interest . >  > Oppiliappan Koil V.Sadagopan > Co-Moderator , Vaideekam Groups       >  >  >  >  >  > - > kochappa Iyengar > Oppiliappan > Saturday, December 20, 2008 2:27 AM > Re: Re: Cost of srardham Adiyen is moved by the sincere response from a number of swamins on the cost of srardham and most have concurred that concern should be for reduction of cost so that people with little or moderate finance will not be driven to think of giving up the practice. However, I doubt whether most of the bruhaspathis will ever listen, as they have their own concerns. However,  I prostrate to all those swamins who took the pains to spend time to ponder on the issue. Someday, solution might come. > One swami had remarked that one should understand the meaning and do the srardham. It is true but who is going to explain the detailed meaning of mantras to karthas, as bruhaspathi swamins have also have to race against time. But I request that at least if any one explain, at least briefly, the significance of the following steps in srardham, it would be of solace that the financial strain is compensated. >  > 1.After agnisanthanm by wife and owpasanam etc., placing (dropping ) the annam with ghee in the Agni, for pithu, pitha maha, pravitha mahan, mathu pithamahi and prapithamahi. >  > 2. Placing annam on the floor before the leaf of nimantrana swamigal, after serving food to them but before their start partaking the food. >  > 3. Placing the rice ball to crow >  > 4. Pinda pradhanam with water and thil after the above. >  > Of the above, which is very vital and really goes as food to the forefarthers, so that if some bruhaspathi rushes through and omits we can ask for? > Adiyen, > Kochappaa > --- On Mon, 15/12/08, thirunarayanan swamy iyengar <nanu_04011955@ > wrote: > > thirunarayanan swamy iyengar <nanu_04011955@ > > Re: Re: Cost of srardham > Oppiliappan > Monday, 15 December, 2008, 9:10 PM > > Respected swamy, > > I know one Sama vadhyar by name Sriman U.Ve.Devanatha Iyengar, he will help the person(s) who do not have sufficient money to pay to the vadhyaar.  But he will get more sambhavanai whose status is high without fail. > > My periappa who was in Serangulam near Mannargudi. He will go to others house for srardham as " Swamin " take oil bath and food etc.  But instead of sambhavanai, he will accept only " THULASI THALAM " .  Similarly, my mutual understanding when my periappa > does srardham in his house, the swami will also take only THULASI THALAM as sambhavanai from my periappa. > > No one should demand money. We have to do all ceremonies by mutual understanding only. > > S.THIRUNARAYANAN of Karappangadu > > > --- On Tue, 9/12/08, kidambi1950 <kidambi1950@ > wrote: > > kidambi1950 <kidambi1950@ > > Re: Cost of srardham > Oppiliappan > Tuesday, 9 December, 2008, 10:43 PM Oppiliappan, " kochappaa " <kochappaa@ .> wrote: > > i accept the views expressed by Sri. Kochappa. the brahaspathis has to consider the fianancial capacity of the karthas. moreover many of the brahapathis are not even bothered to perform the rites/rituals in full and many times, if the kartha is not having any knowledge of the mantras, they skip the mantras and complete the srartham in 30 minutes. so it is time for them to relaise and come forward to help the poor brahmins. ofcourse, i am capable of meeting the demands of the vadhyars but writing this letter over my willingness that the poor should not stop the srarthams due to financial bvurden    > k.r.narasimhan > > Respected swamins, > > I want to share a haunting thought of mine. I am a retired middle > > class pensioner in Banglaore. For the past 3 or so years I find > > things are becoming very costly for doing annual pitru srardhams. > > The charges are like this: Rs.650 for Bruhaspathi + small coins > > Rs.50, Rs.600 for 2 swmingals, Rs.700 for thaligai swami and the > > provisions Rs. 600. Thus the total cost of a srardham is Rs.2600. I > > have to do two per year and arrange for the srardham of my poor > > sister who passed away. Many middle class bramins must be facing > > this kind of music. Can any middle class person can afford such > > costs? Whether any other people from other religion or even other > > caste people would spend like this annually on remembering the > > departed souls? Rs.500 if donated to an orphanate or oldage home > > would feed atleast 25 mouths. Where is our sect heading towards. I > > am sure that unless our sect wakes up and rationalise and regulate > > these fleecing bruhaspathis, the whole custom of peforming such > > rites would quickly vanish. It is time, our mutts start some > > registered body where they should register these bruhaspahtis and > > swamins and fix reasonable tariff also. > > > > adiyen > > Kochappaa > > > > > > Connect with friends all over the world. Get India Messenger. > > > > From Chandigarh to Chennai - find friends all over India. > > > Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Invite them now. > > > > > It’s the same Hotmail®. If by “same†you mean up to 70% faster. Get your account now. > > > > > > > > Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to http://messenger./invite/ > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted January 13, 2009 Sri: Srimathe Ramanujaya Nama: Please do not mis-understand the " rate-card " to be a limiting factor. The idea of the standardization of the rates is to set expectations with consumers, while at the same time, those who are highly appreciative of the Bruhaspathy can pay more than the suggested rates. you may consider this more as " suggested minimum rate. " I do acknowledge that " One needs rigorous training in vaidhikam and Vedam. " The idea of the minimum suggested rate is to ensure that Bruhaspathies earn well as well, while setting an expectation with customers. I have not suggested any " limiting " rates - this would be dependent on market factors - that includes the locality, and spending power of the consumer. I have not said anywhere in my posting that the rates should be increased. In fact, as the spending power of the consumer increases, the rates would be revised. The suggestion of institutionalization is merely to make the industry an organized one, and enhance the earning power of the Bhruhaspathy community. It improves their collective bargaining power as a service provider. AT the same time, institutionalization allows the ability to address consumer grievances and exceptions (like lower income group customers) in a more structured manner than treating them as ad-hoc. Your analogy with Doctor community is a good one - However, you have not considered that the Doctor community is itself institutionalizing under " hospitals " and other institutions. You may want to look at the medical practices in the US for example. Practically everywhere in the US, doctors practice under the umbrella of an institution - which then s to an insurance, and owns the costs of defending the doctor when there is a law suit. That is why the cost of medical treatment in the US is so high. India is slowly catching up with the US in this matter, and one day you will find individual doctors charging whatever they want to will vanish. On the otherhand, have you considered? If doctors, make a mistake, the patient may no live, and could become crippled for life. Therefore customers (Patients) have the right to sue a doctor for committing a mistake. If Bruhaspathy makes a mistake - perhaps cuts short a procedure in order to make time to go to another appointment, who do you go to? Today, individual Bruhaspathys do not have the " collective bargaining power " an institution can offer - and therefore have to charge at will. Many times there is disappointment with the customer over what a Bruhaspathy charges, and at the same time, disappointment with the Bruhaspathy over what the customer is willing to pay. When a relatively poorer customer cannot afford to pay more, the bruhaspathy is disappointed, and that leaves the well-intentioned-yet-incapable-to-pay customer even more disappointed! As the disappointment grows over years, people look for ways to avoid these expenses! Somebody in the list asked whether we Hindus as a community pay even 3% of our salary to charity or vaideeka karyams. It is a good question to ask the top 10% of the salaried class in India! Only they probably read and particiapte in these forums. Remaining 90% of the salaried class do not participate in these forums, nor own a computer. Even if they do own a computer, they do not have Internet. They are busy preparing their monthly expense account, keeping track of much they earned, and how much they paid for what. The idea of the institutionalization of this industry is: 1. Do not overcharge the customer. 2. yet, ensure Bruhaspathys earn well - achieved by implementing " cost-saving " features by studying the demand-supply dynamics in a region, and promoting remote bruhaspathy services for regions that are very remote, and perhaps very poor. 3. Improve the collective bargaining of the customer groups as well as Bruhaspathys Adiyen Ramanuja Dasan Sudarshan vaideekam , venkat chari <venkigopu wrote: > > SrI: > What a comparison? > When it comes in getting a medical treatment, no one says the doctors fee or charges are high. There is no such suggestion in limiting the lawyer or doctor's charges. When a medical professional has freedom to charge their fees for the services rendered, why is a Bruhaspati being asked to limit the sambhavana for their service? When there is a pay raise (D.A.) announced by Govt. Of India, our vendors like milkman increase the prices of commodity we buy. Do we say that price increase is too much and it should be restricted? Can we do anything about? > > Why not we respect our bruhaspati for what they do? Not everyone can become a priest. One needs rigorous training in vaidhikam and Vedam. > > dasan. > --- On Thu, 1/8/09, Sudarshan <sudarshan_ji wrote: > Sudarshan <sudarshan_ji > [Vaideekam] Fw: Re: Cost of srardham > vaideekam > Thursday, January 8, 2009, 12:33 PM > > > > > Sri: > > > > Srimathe Ramanujaya Nama: > > > > adiyen's 2 cents - I could be rewinding the same comments from many of > > you but slightly differently: > > > > 1. The " bruhaspathy " industry needs standardization of practices, and > > commonization of a " rate-card " system across the country and the > > globe. Institutionalizatio n could help this. Regional, national, > > global institutions could be formed. Bruhaspathy' s could register > > themselves with the institution to provide services. I will discuss > > the advantages of this institutionalizatio n further in the posting. > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted January 14, 2009 Sri: Srimathe Ramanujaya Nama: Adiyen would like to clarify more on my previous posting. Institutionalization means setting up a company. Bruhaspathys can sign-up to work for this company. The company would publish the standardized rates and pubicize/market Bruhaspathy's services through various means. Like every other company, this company would have financials, balance sheet, income statements, etc. Bruhaspathy's would be compensated for their services either as a monthly salary or a percentage of income from services performed. Adiyen's opinion is that a monthly salary model would benefit many Bruhaspathys as it takes care of months when sales is low. However, for the benefit of realizing its potential, the model must remain open and take Bruhaspathy's apprehensions,if any, with the operating model into account. The rates published by the company are no means a limiting factor as the rates could be reviewed and revised annually taking into account salaries paid to administrative staff, and other overheads like publicity and advertising. Customers can sign-up with the company for Bruhspathy services and payments would be made to the company prior to the event - through check or credit card. On top of this payment, well-intentioned customers may also pay the Bruhaspathy at their residences when the event is conducted. This is entirely up to them, and this would be an additional earning for Bruhaspathys. Depending on the number of customers that sign-up for services - the company may modify and offer various " package " rates to customers - for instance, a customer may sign-up for a package of 12 events in a year for a package rate and make payments for the package on a monthly basis. This way, the customers are allowed to financially plan for year long events - most of which are known at the beginning of the year itself. Services offered would also include, besides shrardhams, marriages, and other sanskaramams - basically all vaidheeka karyams. In addition, few regular features like pre-recorded Amavasya Sankalpams, (dial-in service) may be offered to regular customers for free. Lower income group members may submit an application for the company's consideration for lower rates based on " yathashakti. " The company could subsidize services for them based on its own financial position. Another advantages is that, since this would be run as a professionally run company, based on its financial health, the company may also take bridge loans as needed, for working capital. The company may extend loans to Bruhaspathys that for it, for personal needs, based on its financials. I would like to humbly submit this idea for the groups consideration and follow-up as I felt there are immense benefits to the community as well as to the Bruhaspathys. The intention is create a win-win situation for everyone concerned with this matter. However, the success of the idea depends on its implementation. Should members have more questions, adiyen will try my sincere best to answer, and modify the idea to suit various situations, and ally any apprehensions. Please treat this as an evolving idea than a completely conceptualized one. That means, other members who agree with the idea may post their approval or add features to it. Adiyen Ramanuja Dasan Sudarshan *** I very much appreciate the proposals of Sri Sudharsan, Also I wish add my opinions below: *** Again and again all are much worrying about lower income group. I wish to clarify a thing; as logic, if one is getting less income, then the time spending for his job will be equally less. So, he may have much time to spend on vaideeka things to learn and practice. By this he can reduce his own vaideeka expenses and as well as he could earn extra money. So, this is not good to talk about less income group. Actually less income group are not at all minding this. With my experience I can assure, that people who are not agreeing to spend money (though capaple) only shouting about the rates and hikes. Let it be. My ambition is : There will not be a group of people to do only bArhaspathyam (bruhaspathyship) in the future. It means, majority of us should know everything. It can be possible by performing the upanayana samkaram to all male children at the age of seven, and every child should (must) spend few minutes everyday to learn the vaideeka karmas bit by bit. People are often confusing with veda pArAyaNam and vaideekam, both are entirely different. The Ahobila mutt Oriental School in West Mambalam is very well training complete vedam (of their own) side by side from sixth to 12th. People can encourrage such activities and those boys in the future to utilize them, by which they can keep the vedam in memory. Now I am trying to teach interested people to manage as a bruhaspathy in the foregin places. I hope, it will increase the strength of people willing to do vaideeka karamas and can put in the links. My worries are; most of the members are willing to support other to perform as a bruhaspathy and nobody is willing to come forward as one. It is something like, saluting and donating the soldiers to protect the nation instead of becomming a soldier. regards, nvs Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
