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OmHari

Who is a Vaishnav?

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It should be very clear to all hindus and not just mayavadis :

 

To even think that Sri Ramacandra has a sattvic body

or that shyamsundara has a sattvic body is detrimental for any kind of success- in the way to achieve wealth or mukti.

 

Mayavadis who offend Bhagavan in such a way obviously never even come close to overcoming maya.Bhagavan says,"It My Maya and she works according to My will."

 

So there is no question of the offending mayavadi ever becoming a gyani/mahatma.

 

And here,some people are demanding why we criticize such '"great" mayavadis.If a mayavadi is not even a mahatma,there is no question of even giving him the respect that is reserved for the great Brahmgyanis of satyuga,dwapara yuga etc.

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It should be very clear to all hindus and not just mayavadis :

 

You are absolutely right. We have got to something about Mayavadis. Here you are, making hundreds of posts about how dumb they are and yet nothing has changed at all.

 

Since posting on discussion forums is clearly not working, perhaps we should get together and beat them into submission. And then we can have a grand Hare Krisna initiation cermeony for all the subdued Mayavadins and the world will be a great place again.

 

Let me know your thoughts on this.

 

Cheers

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out of your 700+ posts majority of them were on mayavadiz,I think you wasted your pricious time!

No the fact is your tone and language is not fit for a devotee-forget vaishnava as you are not close even to call yourself vaishnava,you better first filter yourself and your thoughts with a good filter then use a sand paper to make a soft approachable person,your ideas you cannot dump on others, no way man.

 

So there is no question of the offending mayavadi ever becoming a gyani/mahatma.

 

Any parents will feel shy to see his son posting like this,show this to your parents and tell me what they said,absolute 3rd class language you are using in spiritual forum,I kept mum since long time but you put fingures in my mouth and forced me to type this reply.

 

Like saying Jagadamba is like an ordinary woman of Mumbai

 

That's like saying Brahmadeva is a chandala.

 

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To even think that Sri Ramacandra has a sattvic body

or that shyamsundara has a sattvic body is detrimental for any kind of success- in the way to achieve wealth or mukti.

 

 

But think like this shri krishna had left his body as he was shot by a hunter so doesnt this mean a material body.

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out of your 700+ posts majority of them were on mayavadiz,I think you wasted your pricious time!.

 

Oh,now i think i do...I have indeed wasted time before...but when one of you raised a finger on the behaviour of the bhagavatas,it was important to establish some things...

 

 

No the fact is your tone and language is not fit for a devotee-forget vaishnava as you are not close even to call yourself vaishnava,you better first filter yourself and your thoughts with a good filter then use a sand paper to make a soft approachable person,your ideas you cannot dump on others, no way man..

 

i never called myself a pure devotee.I am talking about the bhagavatas-the Mahatmas.

anyway,i am sorry for the language.I believe rascal is not even a cuss word.Bhaktajan has already explained how.

 

 

Any parents will feel shy to see his son posting like this,show this to your parents and tell me what they said,absolute 3rd class language you are using in spiritual forum,I kept mum since long time but you put fingures in my mouth and forced me to type this reply.

 

My parents worship all gods.I don't even say anything to them.They have the deepest respect for Tukaram,Dyaneshwara,etc. but whenever i tell them,Follow what they SAID,they will still worship Ganeshji,Hanumanji,etc. etc.

 

BUT My parents will only get angry if someone even dares to say that Shankarji has a material body.

 

THAT's the difference.

 

 

 

Like saying Jagadamba is like an ordinary woman of Mumbai ..

 

This angers you,i suppose ??? Yes ?? It does.

 

Now,please tell me how can you still say that vaishnavas cannot critisize mayavadis???

 

 

know this,it is wrong to say that God has a material body.So all those mayavadis who say this are wrong.

Imagine you,who haven't even had a vision of the spiritual Durgadevi,are calling me 3rd class.

 

what should those mahatmas say-those mahatmas who have seen Durgadevi or Sri Krsna- to the mayavadis ????

 

Why can't you see it this way ??? Is it so difficult ???

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actually,it seems some of you don't even care about the Lord.

 

It's all about maintaining decorum in the 'spiritual forum'.

 

I can only imagine what people would have said when all the great mahatmas(pandavas-bhisma) slaughtered people(a 'immoral' act) on the battlefiled-that too on The lord's direction !!

 

No one has considered my point...some of you have derided me,called me things...that's fine..

 

but at the end of the day,if you people fail to see the most basic

 

thing...the fact on which 4 jagadgurus have established superexcellent

 

doctrines...the point that Sri krsna/Sri Ramcandra are

 

Spiritual.Sat.Chit.Ananda,then I'm sorry to say,it all amounts to nothing...

 

 

It's just plain insulting to even think something along those lines.I'd rather

 

be banned from this forum than have not tried to establish that the Lord

 

is Beyond maya and without even a slightest scent of even sattva

 

guna,what to speak of rajas and tamas.

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Comming to the topic , what has been said for Vishnu in vedas...

Purush evedam sarvam yadbhutam yachcha bhavyam .

Similarly the Vaishnav is he , who changes the cloudy sky of ignorace to the originality of Vishnu as blue .

Are we trying for it ?

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Real Vaishnavism - Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati

The word 'Vaishnavism' indicates the normal, eternal and natural condition, functions and devotional characteristics of all individual souls in relation to Vishnu, the Supreme, the All-pervading Soul. But such an unnatural, unpleasant and regrettable sense has been attributed to the word as to naturally make one understand by the word, Vaishnava (literally a pure and selfless worshipper of Vishnu), a human form with twelve peculiar signs (Tilaka) and dress on, worshipping many gods under the garb of a particular God and hating another human form who marks himself with different signs, puts on a different dress and worships a different God in a different way as is the case with the words 'Shaiva', 'Shakta', 'Ganapatya', 'Jaina', 'Buddhist', 'Mohammedan', 'Christian' etc.

This is the most unnatural, unpleasant and regrettable sense of the word, 'Vaishnava', which literally and naturally means one who worships Vishnu out of pure love expecting nothing from Him in return.

Vishnu, the Supreme, All-pervading Soul gives life and meaning to all that is. He is the highest unchallengeable Truth devoid of illusion everywhere and through eternity. He is Sat - ever-existing, Chit - all-knowing, Ananda - ever-blissful and fully free. He is in jivas and jivas are in Him, as are the rays in the glowing sun and the particles of water in the vast rolling ocean. As nothing but heat and light of the sun, and coldness, liquidity etc. of the sea is found in the constituents of the rays and the particles of water respectively, so nothing but Sat, Chit or free-will and Ananda is found in the jiva.

The ingredients and attributes of the whole must remain in the part in a smaller degree. So the part is identical with the whole when taken qualitatively and different, when taken quantitatively. This is the true and eternal relation between jiva and Vishnu. So He always prevails over jiva who is also ever subject to Him. As the service of the master is the fundamental function of the servant, so the service of Vishnu is natural and inherent in jiva and it is called Vaishnavata or Vaishnavism and every jiva is a Vaishnava. As a person possessing immense riches is called a miser if he does not display and make proper use of them, so jivas when they do not display Vaishnavata, are called falses though in reality they are so.

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ranjeet , im so scared to carry on any coversation with you . after a few posts you just start shouting and screaming without any logic and rational sense till you become the cause for closure of that particular thread !!

 

thats why i have stopped answering . morever such things have already been answered .

 

i was thinking how would you feel if people start calling your guru kripalu ji names ? keep your mouth shut for the fear of guru ninda at least !

 

please.......

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Real Vaishnavism - Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati

The word 'Vaishnavism' indicates the normal, eternal and natural condition, functions and devotional characteristics of all individual souls in relation to Vishnu, the Supreme, the All-pervading Soul. But such an unnatural, unpleasant and regrettable sense has been attributed to the word as to naturally make one understand by the word, Vaishnava (literally a pure and selfless worshipper of Vishnu), a human form with twelve peculiar signs (Tilaka) and dress on, worshipping many gods under the garb of a particular God and hating another human form who marks himself with different signs, puts on a different dress and worships a different God in a different way as is the case with the words 'Shaiva', 'Shakta', 'Ganapatya', 'Jaina', 'Buddhist', 'Mohammedan', 'Christian' etc.

This is the most unnatural, unpleasant and regrettable sense of the word, 'Vaishnava', which literally and naturally means one who worships Vishnu out of pure love expecting nothing from Him in return.

Vishnu, the Supreme, All-pervading Soul gives life and meaning to all that is. He is the highest unchallengeable Truth devoid of illusion everywhere and through eternity. He is Sat - ever-existing, Chit - all-knowing, Ananda - ever-blissful and fully free. He is in jivas and jivas are in Him, as are the rays in the glowing sun and the particles of water in the vast rolling ocean. As nothing but heat and light of the sun, and coldness, liquidity etc. of the sea is found in the constituents of the rays and the particles of water respectively, so nothing but Sat, Chit or free-will and Ananda is found in the jiva.

The ingredients and attributes of the whole must remain in the part in a smaller degree. So the part is identical with the whole when taken qualitatively and different, when taken quantitatively. This is the true and eternal relation between jiva and Vishnu. So He always prevails over jiva who is also ever subject to Him. As the service of the master is the fundamental function of the servant, so the service of Vishnu is natural and inherent in jiva and it is called Vaishnavata or Vaishnavism and every jiva is a Vaishnava. As a person possessing immense riches is called a miser if he does not display and make proper use of them, so jivas when they do not display Vaishnavata, are called falses though in reality they are so.

 

Thank you gentleman for citing beautiful quote .

It is right to say that as per Vedas the character of Vishnu shown resembles the noble one , means neither so ordinarily brave as Indra , nor so destructive as Rudra and of course most suited to be a Vaishnav for human beings , still ….neti ..neti.

Also aham brahmasmi or tattwamasi , make no proper sense as it is mere prayer. See…

Yagne syamaham twam twam va gha sya aham . Syuste satya ihashishah..rig 8/44/23

Only the Parabrahma or parmatma is to be prayed, which is one and not the else .It is not me not you and not the anybody . See….

Apra dyava prathavi antarikshim surya atma jagtaststhusashcha….rig 1/115/1

So it is not Vishnu , Indra , Rudra etc. etc.

For neti ..neti…we can discuss further.

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Only the Parabrahma or parmatma is to be prayed, which is one and not the else .It is not me not you and not the anybody . See

You mean to say parmatma is not vishnu

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Friends first let us shape our life towards becoming a true humanbeing then we should talk of higher goals.

Great you speak my mind.

How do i start.

For what the saints say that a human being should enquire about his existence.

So is that good for a start.

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Friends first let us shape our life towards becoming a true humanbeing then we should talk of higher goals.

 

How can you separate being a good human being from understanding the goal of human life when achieving or at least striving to achieve the goal of human life is what makes one a good human being.

 

No we should not wait to get a vision of our ultimate goal because without the proper vision we will not know what direction to strive towards.

 

The supreme goal of human life is to come to a point of pure love for God.

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Referencing post # 62 :

 

Lord Shankara states in the Ramayan : "He(My Lord Ramacandra) is the brahm in the vedas whom the gyanis address by neti neti."

 

Neti neti (Not this Not that) refers to the Purusha Who is beyond maya.Not this Not that means : Not the indriyas,Not the mind,Not the 5 elements,Not the ego,Not even maya.

 

In the end,we stumble upon the Purusha Who is beyond maya.So your explanation that Vishnu is not Brahm is not helpful,for Who is Purusha other than Sri Visnu ??

 

 

***

 

Referencing Sambya's post: Do you accept or not that Bhagavan has a Sat.chit.Ananda body ??

 

Yes or No.It's very simple question.So instead of skirting around the bush,we should just stay on point.

 

I think it is only fair that your questions should be answered.You raised the point that great Vaishnavas criticise mayavadis and according to you,they are absolutely wrong.

 

So Sambya,it is imperative that you understand the logic behind their behaviour.

 

Now that you have,please consider the Vaishnava stand point every time

 

before whining how the great acharyas have no decency or moral

 

etiquettes.

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Just see the bottom of page,there are not one but 5 threads exists on similar point which I said in my post.

ThreadThread StarterForumRepliesLast Postbefore Das i want to b Vaishnav and before Vaishnav i want to be Human -part 5 samilHare Krishna Discussions3904-29-2005 07:16 AMbefore Das i want to b Vaishnav and before Vaishnav i want to be Human -part 4 samilHare Krishna Discussions304-27-2005 04:02 PMbefore Das i want to b Vaishnav and before Vaishnav i want to be Human- part 3 samilHare Krishna Discussions304-27-2005 03:00 PMbefore Das i want to b Vaishnav and before Vaishnav i want to be Human- Part 2 samilHare Krishna Discussions304-27-2005 02:57 PMbefore Das i want to b Vaishnav and before Vaishnav i want to be Human - part 1

 

How can you separate being a good human being from understanding the goal of human life when achieving or at least striving to achieve the goal of human life is what makes one a good human being.

 

No we should not wait to get a vision of our ultimate goal because without the proper vision we will not know what direction to strive towards.

 

The supreme goal of human life is to come to a point of pure love for God.

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Just see the bottom of page,there are not one but 5 threads exists on similar point which I said in my post.

ThreadThread StarterForumRepliesLast Postbefore Das i want to b Vaishnav and before Vaishnav i want to be Human -part 5 samilHare Krishna Discussions3904-29-2005 07:16 AMbefore Das i want to b Vaishnav and before Vaishnav i want to be Human -part 4 samilHare Krishna Discussions304-27-2005 04:02 PMbefore Das i want to b Vaishnav and before Vaishnav i want to be Human- part 3 samilHare Krishna Discussions304-27-2005 03:00 PMbefore Das i want to b Vaishnav and before Vaishnav i want to be Human- Part 2 samilHare Krishna Discussions304-27-2005 02:57 PMbefore Das i want to b Vaishnav and before Vaishnav i want to be Human - part 1

 

Sorry I have no interest to look up the topic on past threads. If you have anything to say on it that would be fine.

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You are trying to built a house without basement and that technic I don't have.

 

^why can't you address the main issue ??? Why is it that when someone cannot answer,we all raise morality issues ????

Man must look at his past to correct his mistakes,you are very rigid by self be like a butter and have flexibility to give space for improvement.

 

Sorry I have no interest to look up the topic on past threads. If you have anything to say on it that would be fine.

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Referencing post # 62 :

Referencing Sambya's post: Do you accept or not that Bhagavan has a Sat.chit.Ananda body ??

 

Yes or No.It's very simple question.So instead of skirting around the bush,we should just stay on point.

 

 

yes , i accept . its simple really ..

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