Gender roles & spirituality

[Sirona 1]

I underwent a removal of my womb it was in an incurable state. I haven't had my period since then (apparently). I actually don't miss my womb and I am doing much better right now on the mere physical level. But spiritually, I'm feeling bizarre since then. I noticed how much emphasis is given on the "women are child bearers" 'doctrine', or "women are not like men" blah blah. In my special situation I've come to realize that the differences are really not that big. I am considering to shift away from the Vaishnava faith altogether. Can you give me good reasons not to?

[stonehearted 0]

The considerations you give aren't really spiritual; they're social. So you may be fine spiritually but feeling awkward socially. Don't sweat it. You're no different from what you were before the surgery.

 

The "Vaishnava faith" is concerned with the health of the soul. Srila Rupa Goswami tells us the what's called bhakti is engaging the senses in the service of Hrishikesha in a state of freedom from identifying with any and all material designations:

sarvopadhi vinirmuktam tat paratvena nirmalam

hrisihkena hrishikesha-sevanam bhaktir uchyate

 

Lord Chaitanya Mahaprabhu teaches us to conceive of ourselves as neither brahamana, kshatirya, vaishya, nor sudra; neither sannyasi, grihastha, vanaprastaha, nor brahmachari, but as servants of the servants of the lotus feet of Krishna, who is the ocean of bliss and who protects the gopis of Vrindavan.

 

At its very beginning, the Srimad-Bhagavatam rejects everything that will divert us from that vision. We should reject it, too. The problem is more likely with your association than with the teachings of the Bhagavatam. I suggest that you try to find some more advanced devotees to associate with, devotees who can help you cultivate devotion to Krishna, not some religion of this world that somewhat resembles vaishnavism.

[gHari 0]

Sirona,

 

You ask "Can you give me good reasons not to?"

 

Yes, an infinite number. Krsna is God. All other religions are impotent watered-down versions of Srila Prabhupada. Our sincerity will blossom under Prabhupada's love, while it will just wither amongst the insincerity of all other show-bottle exploiters of the world.

 

Social nonsense aside, if you really want God and perfection in your life, then there is no other way practically in this age. Krsna, Caitanya, Prabhupada are for everyone; the King, the cop, the deaf, the dumb, everyone, anyone, in any unique or average worldly situation can perfect their love for God and revel in their only one true possession, their eternal relationship with Sri Krsna.

 

That is rather to the point and not very diplomatic, but it is the truth of this world. We cannot compare Prabhupada in the same breath to any other phenomenon.

 

Your happiness will demonstrate the fallacy that "women are child bearers" and "women are not like men". It really has precious little to do with what's happening around you or what chariot you are riding in. It's simply about heart - cleansing the heart and developing all-consuming sincere desire to have Krsna. Living reality brings Reality to us; let the illusions fall away as they may.

 

Wishing you all success with Sri Krsna,

 

gHari

[Guest guest]

A few possibilities:

 

1) Check out any biographies of "The Bliss-Permeated Mother" aka Anandamayi Ma.

 

She was like so totally awesome. When she was very young kid, people thought she was so spaced out. But she actually was experiencing

Savikalpa samadhi. Really and truly experiencing that she is not the body.

 

There are alot of synonyms for this state of consciousness. Some are:

Brahman realization, Buddhanature, Parashakti. It happens when your

male and female energies are perfectly balanced.

 

We all have a male energy and a female energy, or ida and pingala.

When they are perfectly balanced then they merge into one current

in our spine called the sushumna.

 

That is when people are supposed to take sannyasa, as then they

do not have the feeling of being either male or female.

 

Anyway, back to Anandamayi Ma. She initiated herself [right on!]

and her husband [she was born in India in 1896, so it was

an arranged marriage] became her disciple [love that part!].

You go, girl!

 

2) If you want to learn how to attain this state yourself, you might want to

visit world wide web dot gurudeva dot org. That lineage teaches you how

you can attain Savikalpa samadhi yourself.

 

And it is not that hard. They feel that any nice person can attain it by the

end of this life, if you follow the yamas and niyamas [obstervances and

restraints].

 

I like about 90% of their teachings, then (like you) I freak out about the ten

percent that are social conventions. However, on their website they have

a link to info about their guru's guru, a sage called Yogaswami. This cool

dude totally says the opposite things to the 10% that I freak out about.

 

Also, Yogaswami was a contemporary of Anandamayi Ma. So I don't feel that

weird about the 10% I freak out about when Yogaswami, who is in the

mood of a bhajananandi and an avadhuta, pretty much says the complete

opposite of whatever social conventions the next guru was advocating.

 

Seems like there is always this balance in every religious tradition. In Gaudiya Vaisnavism there is a similarly wide range of how their enlightenment

manifests and how it is expressed by the individual meditation masters.

 

3) If that tradition seems not quite up your alley, then you could always try

a tradition where The Supreme Goddess is highlighted more than God. There

are branches of Gaudiya Vaisnavism that emphasize and celebrate the female aspect of the Divine.

 

There is an oral tradition of story-telling and songs that celebrate the feminine aspects of the Divine. It is pretty radical, basically they are saying that God is just a Goddess wannabee and everything that God can do,

Goddess can do better. That really She is the Supreme Boss but just lets

God pretend that He is. Love that!

 

You might to read "Women Who Run With The Wolves" by Clarissa Pinkola Estes, PhD if "God is A Goddess Wannabee!" sounds like a fun tradition 4 U.

Ditto "When God Was A Woman" by Merlin Stone to unbrainwash yourself

from Christianity.

 

4) Whichever tradition you try, basically there are 4 main branches if Hinduism: Shiva, Vaishnava, Shakti, and Smarta. So just shop around

until you find the right "fit" or match for you.

 

In India especially but in Hinduism in general, people often move from one branch to another over the course of a lifetime. You can read about this phenomenon and what Indian Hindus as well as ardha Hindus ["half Hindus" or western Hindus who have not undergone the full conversion process] think about this by reading things like the letters to the editor of the online magazine "Hinduism Today".

 

5) There are 14 currents in the sushumna [your spine] that lead to the door

of Brahma being opened [Crown Chakra aka Sahasrara Chakra]. Thus there are 14 different sampradayas dating back to antiquity in India that will each take you to enlightenment.

 

And once you get to the Crown Chakra, there are 14 [or 32, depending on

how you count and quantify it] different very subtle chakras above that.

So even if you are experiencing Samadhi you can go higher and higher with

it, more and more subtle and refined states of consciousness.

 

So Gaudiya Vaisnavism is one of the currents that can lead you to the door

of Brahman. And if it does not feel right, perhaps you could study other

teachings to see if they have more of the right fit and feel for you.

 

If you do come back to Gaudiya Vaisnavism, you will be certain that you

really prefer it. Sort of like dating: check out the different religions and see which one is the best match BEFORE you make a commitment.

 

Because if you compare and contrast first, then you will better be able to articulate why you chose it. And if you can do that first, then you can more diligently focus sincerely on its application, once you decide religion you really prefer [if any].

 

Appropos to this, there are also guidelines for Ethical Conversion on the website of world wide web dot gurudeva dot org. Happy Hunting!

[Guest guest]

Dear Sirona,

Do you believe Radha-Krishna is the Supreme Godhead? does your heart fill with transcendental bliss when you meditate on their loving pastimes? if so, why would you leave the most beautiful Vaishnava path. Do not let some misguided attitudes of devotees distract you away from the Object of Devotion; our eternal Beloveds, Sri Sri Radha-Krishna.

 

You can find OTHER Vaishnava groups besides ISKCON.. if you have problems with ISKCON, that is one thing, but Krsna Consciousness transcends ANY organization.. whatever you do, don't forsake Krsna because of earthly gender politics.