AncientMariner

Apparently the Buddha used some techniques to fool the materialists and even some Vaisnavas say that Prabhupada was fooling the Christians when he said Christ was an avatar so it does seem there are some examples of Vaisnavas being less than completely truthful. I guess the difference is they are ultimately doing those techniques to try and advance people spiritually whereas a phony guru is just lieing to gain admiration or an easy lifestyle but I agree with you there is no value in a guru that lies for their own personal sense gratification but I do not begrudge the Buddha for fooling the materialists. I personally dont think Prabhupada was lieing when he said Christ was an avatar but I have met devotees that think he was.

I have always held out hope that Tiger Woods would eventually revive the Hare Krishna Movement. There is something special about that kid that I can't put my finger on but I think he is just going to be a golfer and not get into religion and I can't blame him. If I was as good at golf as he is I would stick with golf to but he is one of those monumental figures like Muhammad Ali that has the ability to transcend his sport and have an effect on our culture in many different ways. Even if the Golden Age of Mahaprabhu doesn't manifest as predicted it seems that in order to find real peace humans need to turn to the Lord at least at some level so I don't think that will ever completely die out even as the Kali-yuga becomes darker and more ignorant.

Well said, it gets more and more interesting each day. Will be interesting to see how it turns out. I personally do not really care what happens anymore, have sort of become surrendered to the universe so to speak and now view it as an unfolding drama that I have very little influence on. I do respect the lions like Alex Jones etc. that are aggressively reporting on this stuff but I am a lamb by nature and just like to graze in my field and observe things an be left alone and hopefully try to steer clear of the predators. It is weird when you learn about this stuff though because it is almost like getting the script to the drama and it becomes predictable what the people in government are going to do. I guess we can all hope and pray that someday they come to their senses and become more Godly in their rulership over us. It certainly seems to me like we are going through some sort of historical paradigm shift with the combination of globalism and technology advancement we are officially entering "The Brave New World" so to speak. We have been there for awhile unofficially but now it seems we are going there officially.

I remember reading somewhere in Prabhupada's books and it mentioned the concept of acting duplicitously for Krishna. I don't know exactly what that means but I assume only a real high level devotee could actually do something like that with sincerity. It seems in the history of Iskcon there has been some duplicitous behavior but it has been mostly gurus pretending to be more advanced than they actually are rather than using seeming duplicitousness to fool the materialists or something like that for the betterment of Krishna Consciousness.

I guess the question is how long will Obama maintain that faith. Originally Obama was basically doing everything he could to drive the stock market down and his popularity was going down but now he is changing his tone and doing everything he can to drive the stock market up so they are sensitive to his popularity. They are walking a tightrope because they are trying to keep Americans in a state of double think where they carry out their agenda which is contrary to the best interests of American citizens but at the same time keep people following Obama. They are good at what they do and how they use the media so it could take a long time if ever before people start waking up to what is going on. Alex Jones thinks if his popularity ever drops below 50% or so they will stage some sort of major false flag event to try and rally people around Obama again. All the people that I read who have been right all along about this crisis say that the more the government intervenes in this crisis the harder the ultimate fall is going to be in the market. It would be alright for the government to do stimulus packages if it involved rebuilding infrastructure and was really meant to benefit the citizenry as a whole but basically all the bailouts and stimulus packages so far have been mostly corporate cronism and taxpayer boondoggles designed to ultimately hyperinflate the dollar and bring America to its knees so that then the globalists will come in and offer a solution if we play by their rules meaning basically giving up control to them even though essentially we have been under their control for awhile it seems. I heard an interesting theory tonight that the banks are going to use the bailout money to try and build up India and get India to be the nation that buys most of the Chinese goods. They have used and abused America and over inflated everything and now the deflation of all these bubbles could leave America just as a used up wasteland but when things get deflated massively then the same people will come in and buy everything up at the deflated prices and then try to create the same cycle over and over. Wash, rinse and repeat. Of course there are more grisly scenarios where they have just decided they don't need us anymore and they are just going to start wiping us out. I live very close to a military firing range. Have been here for years and this year the range has been more active than I have ever seen. It used to just be occasional National Guard training on weekends. For the last 4 or 5 months they have been doing all sorts of stuff all week long. In Decemeber and January they slowed down for a awhile but the last month especially it has been non-stop. I don't know if it means anything but it is weird.

No doubt it is a stupid system and people are starting to wake up to this but the politicians and bankers have benefitted from this stupid system so they are doing their best to keep the sheeple to keep their faith in the system so they can maintain their control. From what I have been reading it is going to take trillions more to bailout the banks. I read Meredith Whitney say it would require 5 more T.A.L.F.S which means the stock market is headed for disaster even though Bernanke and Obama are busy pumping the stock market now to suck out the last dollars from the baby boomers. As far as climate change goes, I don't buy it, I think it is mostly made up. The demigods are in control of the climate not humans in my estimation. It is arrogant and atheistic on the part of humans to think they are in control of the climate the way I look at it. First they called it global warming and that was debunked so now they call it climate change. I am all for using our resources more efficiently and reducing pollution etc. but I view the whole climate change rhetoric as control mechanism of the financial elite to try and charge all sorts of new-age taxes on the slaves while the elite continue to live however they want. As far as Obama goes you are probably right, this plan was set in motion a long time ago and Obama is merely playing his part as the confidence man (con-man) who will try to keep the baby boomers on the hook and in the dark while this controlled implosion continues on over the coming months, years. If the people knew what is really going on there would probably be a revolution but the American people have been fattened up by McDonalds etc. and dumbed down by television so the bankers, politicians, corporate interests have Americans eating out of their hands and keep them running around like mice in a maze while applying shock treatment.

Who knows for sure what is really going on. I have heard these New World Order conspiracy theories for years and always thought they were possible but didn't know for sure. When it really hit home for me was when they started doing those bank bailouts back in September and October. I read the book "The Creature from Jekyll Island" by G. Edward Griffin that was written a number of years ago and he described that the world would face a crisis almost exactly like the one that has played out. I have traded stocks for a number of years and always thought the whole thing was rigged somehow and now I am learning who the "man behind the curtain" is so to speak so it has been interesting learning all this stuff. Since this eye-opening experience I have been reading Alex Jones, Webster Tarpley, Bob Chapman and others etc. Alex Jones claims that he has just been reading the government documents over the years and that he is not especially smart its just that the government has basically spelled out their plans in these government documents. It is hard to know who to believe and not to believe because it is even possible that Alex Jones is a disinformation agent, you never can tell, but I am convinced there is more going on than meets the eye and most of what is shoveled out by the mainstream media is meant for mind control of the public in my opinion. The more I read the more I am thinking high levels of the military and government are up to things that are just unbelievable but it could be that I am just paranoid as well.

<TABLE class=storycontent cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0><TBODY><TR><TD colSpan=2>BBC News Israel row derails Obama nominee </TD></TR><TR><TD class=storybody><!-- S BO --><!-- S IIMA --><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=226 align=right border=0><TBODY><TR><TD> Mr Freeman has criticised the Israeli occupation </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><!-- E IIMA --><!-- S SF --> The Obama administration's candidate for a top US intelligence post has withdrawn, after his past criticism of Israel came under heavy fire. Charles Freeman had been named to head the National Intelligence Council, which produces security assessments. But his comments about Israel, as well as links to China and Saudi Arabia, had enraged dozens of US lawmakers. Mr Freeman said he did not think the council could work effectively "while its chair was under constant attack". <!-- E SF --> It is the latest embarrassment for President Barack Obama, who has seen a number of appointees withdraw or forced out. Some observers are interpreting it as a test case of the Obama administration's willingness to stand up to powerful pro-Israeli forces in US politics. 'Strong views' National Intelligence Director Dennis Blair - who originally selected Mr Freeman for the post - said he was accepting his resignation "with regret". <!-- S IBOX --><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=231 align=right border=0><TBODY><TR><TD width=5></TD><TD class=sibtbg>The tactics of the Israel Lobby plumb the depths of dishonour and indecency Charles Freeman </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><!-- E IBOX -->Only hours earlier he had been defending him as a "person of strong views, of an inventive mind and the analytical point of view", which Mr Blair said he preferred to "pre-cooked" judgements. Mr Freeman has served as a former ambassador to Saudi Arabia, a senior diplomat in China and an assistant secretary of defence. His background and past statements had caused dozens of members of Congress - mainly Republican - to question his appointment. Among their stated concerns were: Remarks attributed to Mr Freeman in 2007, in which he said: "The brutal oppression of the Palestinians by Israeli occupation shows no signs of ending," and "American identification with Israel has become total" His position on the international advisory board of a Chinese state-owned oil company His presidency of the Middle East Policy Council, a think-tank that received funding from Saudi Arabia. On Monday, all seven members of the Senate Intelligence Committee sent a letter to Mr Blair expressing consternation about his appointment. They joined a chorus of complaint from members of the House of Representatives. Several of them applauded his withdrawal, including Democratic Senator Charles Schumer. "Charles Freeman was the wrong guy for this position. His statements against Israel were way over the top and severely out of step with the administration," he said in a statement. 'Libellous distortions' In a message posted on the website of Foreign Policy magazine, Mr Freeman said he believed the "barrage of libellous distortions of my record would not cease upon my entry into office... "I do not believe the National Intelligence Council could function effectively while its chair was under constant attack by unscrupulous people with a passionate attachment to the views of a political faction in a foreign country". He said the incident showed "Americans cannot any longer conduct a serious public discussion or exercise independent judgment about matters of great importance". And he blamed the campaign against him on the "Israel Lobby", which he said used tactics which "plumb the depths of dishonour and indecency". The NIC releases influential annual national intelligence assessments, supposed to reflect the consensus of multiple different US intelligence agencies. But they are not always without controversy - such as a 2002 assessment which concluded that Iraq was continuing to produce weapons of mass destruction, and which helped the Bush administration justify the case for war. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

True, knowledge is so tricky and Krishna is also a great trickster so the only sane path to take is that of humble truth seeking and forgiveness is related to humility it seems. I was reading the other night a story in Srimad Bhagavatam where Lord Brahma displayed some sort of mystic power and Krishna tricked Lord Brahma with even a bigger mystic power so the moral of the story seemed to be that Krishna is always more powerful and more knowledgable so there is never any reason for us miniscule jivas to ever get puffed up by knowledge or any other mystic opulence.

I have read the derivatives are anywhere from 700 trillion to 1.5 quadrillion. So it appears there is virtually no limit to the amount of bailouts that would be needed to bring these institutions to functional level as they are basically black holes. All this brings up the question why are they doing all these bailouts instead of just declaring the banks bankrupt and wiping out the derivatives? They are using the crisis in an attempt to bring about a wholesale systematic change to America it appears. Like Rahm Emmanuel and Hillary Clinton say they hate to waste a good crisis. The course appears that they are going to eventually completely collapse the stock market and then all these international banking corporate interests will buy up America for pennies. I guess only time will tell. Amazing to see The US get to this point. The precision that this thing has been carried out with has made me believe that almost all of the major events going on in government and around the world are not accidents as they are normally portrayed as by the media. They must have such sophisticated technology that they have this stuff planned out well in advance even though I am sure they are forced to change game plans from time to time.

Stick to the real stuff that is going on if you want to prove the government has been taken over by people of demonic nature and is working towards a fascist world government. No need to go off into fantasy land. There is plenty of evidence in the real news like on Friday when Obama said the failing financial institutions will probably need another 750 billion beyond the 700 billion already approved. More and more bailouts for the wall street fat cats in order to keep the same people who ran the economy into the ground in power.

I guess only time will tell what his degree of insanity is. Insanity is basically part of the job. Clinton was a rapist and murderer, Bush was a traitor, murderer you name it. Alex Jones and Webster Tarpley both think Obama is far worse than Bush because he is more believable than Bush although Obama becomes less and less believable each passing day as I notice he is going back on basically everything he promised in his campaign. I think it is the whole military industrial complex funded by the international banking system that controls our currency that is insane and these Presidents are just puppets. From what I have been reading it is looking more and more like the military industrial complex is getting prepared to officially take down its big prize the United States of America. Alex Jones has been saying when the media builds up the leader to be a messiah like figure really bad things are on the way, as this has happened before in history. Of course it all basically started with 9-11 and Al-CIA-da. That set the foundation for a hyper evolution of the fascist police state in America. It is possibly on some level a life and death struggle for these elites because humanity has the potential to wake up to the age old games these people have been playing and if humanity does wake up the elite will be in big trouble. They are sensing humanity being on the verge of an awakening so they will kick the eugenics programs into high gear. They feel threatened at some level probably partially due to the internet opening up information to the masses. They want to get control of the internet if they can. Hopefully I am wrong, who knows for sure, maybe I am reading it all wrong.

The Bush Administration's " Bank Bailout" The government's bank rescue program under the Bush administration was estimated at a staggering 8.5 trillion dollars, an amount equivalent to 60% of the Total Gross Federal debt of 14.078 trillion (2010) (See Table 2 above). This amount does not include the "aid" to financial institutions proposed by the Obama administration, including an additional 750 billion dollars in Obama's February 2009 budget proposal. The size of these allocations of liquid assets endangers the very structures of the fiscal and monetary system. The total of Bush bank bailouts (8.5 trillion) can be broken down into funds granted by the Federal Reserve, the Treasury, the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation and the Federal Housing Authority. The handouts to the financial institutions financed out of Treasury are government expenditures, to be met either through tax revenues or through the emission of public debt instruments. The disbursements under TARP are categorized by the Bureau of the Budget as part of "a mandatory program" under an Act of the US Congress.. The Treasury's liability, which includes the controversial Troubled Assets Relief Program, was estimated in November 2008 at 1.1 trillion dollars. (See Table 2) Further Treasury allocations, which serve to heighten the burden of the public debt have been envisaged by the Obama administration Spiralling Public Debt Crisis Is the Treasury in a position to finance this mounting budget deficit officially tagged at 1.75 billion through the emission of Treasury bills and government bonds? The largest budget deficit in US history coupled with the lowest interest rates in US history: With the Fed's " near zero" percent discount rate, the markets for US dollar denominated government bonds and Treasury bills are in straightjacket. Moreover, the essential functions of savings (which is central to the functioning of a national economy) is in crisis. . Who wants to invest in US government debt? What is the demand for Treasury bills at exceedingly low interest rates? Table 3 Interest Rates in PercentTreasury securities Updated 2/25/2009 This week Month ago Year ago One-Year Treasury Constant Maturity 0.64 0.43 2.10 91-day T-bill auction avg disc rate 0.300 0.150 2.160 182-day T-bill auction avg disc rate 0.495 0.350 2.070 Two-Year Treasury Constant Maturity 0.95 0.77 2.04 Five-Year Treasury Constant Maturity 1.79 1.58 2.89 Ten-Year Treasury Constant Maturity 2.75 2.56 3.85 One-Year MTA 1.633 1.823 4.326 One-Year CMT (Monthly) 0.44 0.49 2.71 Source Bankrate.com The market for US dollar denominated debt instruments is potentially at a standstill, which means that the Treasury lacks the ability to finance its mammoth budget deficit through public debt operations, leading the entire budgetary process into a quandary. The question is whether China and Japan will continue to purchase US dollar denominated debt instruments. Washington is running a public relations campaign to lure Asian investors into buying T-bills and US government bonds. . With the markets for US dollar denominated debt (both domestically and internationally) in crisis, further pressure will be exerted on the Treasury to slash (civilian) public expenditure to the bone, exact user fees for public services and sell off public assets, including State infrastructure and institutions. In all likelihood, this crisis is leading us to the privatization of the State, where activities hitherto under government jurisdiction will be transferred into private hands. Who will be buying State assets at rock bottom prices? The financial elites, which are also the recipients of the bank bailout. Consolidation of the Banks A massive amount of liquidity has been injected into the financial system, from the bailouts but also from pension funds, individual savings, etc. The stated objective of the bank bailout programs is to alleviate the banks' burden of bad debts and non-performing loans. In actuality what is happening is that these massive amounts of money are being used by a handful of institutions to consolidate their position in global banking. The exposure of the banks, largely the result of derivative trade, is estimated in the tens of trillions of dollars, to the extent that the amounts and guarantees granted by the Treasury and the Fed will not resolve the crisis. Nor are they intended to resolve the crisis. The mainstream media suggests that the banks are being nationalized as a result of TARP, In fact, it is exactly the opposite: the State is being taken over by the banks, the State is being privatized. The establishment of a Worldwide unipolar financial system is part of the broader project of the Wall Street financial elites to establish the contours of a world government. In a bitter irony, the recipients of the bailout under TARP and Obama's proposed $750 billion aid to financial institutions are the creditors of the federal government. The Wall Street banks are the brokers and underwriters of the US public debt, although they hold only a portion of the debt, they transact and trade in US dollar denominated public debt instruments Worldwide. They act as creditors of the US State. They evaluate the creditworthiness of the US government, they rank the public debt through Moody's and Standard and Poor. They control the US Treasury, the Federal Reserve Board and the US Congress. They oversee and dictate fiscal and monetary policy, ensuring that the State acts in their interest. Since the Reagan era, Wall Street dominates most areas of economic and social policy. It sets the budgetary agenda, ensuring the curtailment of social expenditures. Wall Street preaches balanced budgets but the practice has been lobbying for the elimination of corporate taxes, the granting of handouts to corporations, tax write-offs in mergers and acquisitions etc, all of which lead to a spiralling public debt. Circular and Contradictory Relationship The Federal Reserve system is a privately owned central bank. While the Federal Reserve Board is a government body, the process of money creation is controlled by the 12 Federal Reserve Banks, which are privately owned. The shareholders of the Federal Reserve banks (with the New York Federal Reserve Bank playing a dominant role) are among America's most powerful financial institutions. While the Federal Reserve can create money "out of thin air", the multibillion outlays of the Treasury (including the TARP program) will require the emission of public debt in the form of Treasury Bills and government bonds. US financial institutions oversee the US public debt. They are involved in the sale of treasury bills and government bonds on financial markets in the US and around the World. But they also hold part of the public debt. In this regard, they are the creditors of the US government. Part of this increased public debt required to rescue the banks will be financed or brokered by the same financial institutions which are the object of the bank rescue plan. We are dealing with a pernicious circular relationship. When the banks pressured the Treasury to assist them in the form of a major bank rescue operation, it was understood from the outset that the banks would in turn assist the Treasury in financing the handouts of which they are the recipients. To finance the bank bailout, the Treasury needs to run a massive budget deficit, which in turn requires a staggering increase of the US public debt. Public opinion has been misled. The US government is in a sense financing its own indebtedness: the money granted to the banks is in part financed by borrowing from the banks. The banks lend money to the government and with the money they lend the government, the Treasury finances the bailout. In turn, the banks impose conditionalities on the management of the US public debt. They dictate how the money should be spent. They impose fiscal responsibility, they dictate massive cuts in social expenditures which result in the collapse and/or privatization of public services. They impose the privatization of urban infrastructure, roads, sewer and water systems, public recreational areas, everything is up for privatization. The recipient banks are the beneficiaries as well as the creditors. As creditors, they will oblige the government a) to slash expenditures b) to run up the public debt through the issuing of treasury bills and government bonds. This public debt crisis is all the more serious because the US federal government does not control monetary policy. All public debt operations go through the Federal reserve, which is in charge of monetary policy, acting on behalf of private financial interests. The government as such has no authority over money creation. This means that public debt operations essentially serve the interests of the banks. Continuity from Bush to Obama The Obama stimulus program constitutes a continuation of the Bush administration's bank bailout packages. The proposed policy solution to the crisis becomes the cause, ultimately resulting in further real economy bankruptcies and a corresponding collapse of the standard of living of Americans. Both the Bush and Obama bank bailouts are intended to come to the rescue of troubled financial institutions, to ensure the payment of "inter-bank" debt operations. In practice, large amounts of money transit through the banking system, from the banks to the hedge funds, to offshore banking havens and back to the banks. The government and the media tend to focus on the ambiguous notion of " inter-bank debts". The identity of the creditors is rarely mentioned. Multi-billion dollar transfers are conducted electronically from one financial entity to another. Where is the money going? Who is collecting these multibillion debts, which are in large part the consequence of financial manipulation and derivative trade? There are indications that the financial institutions are transferring billions of dollars into their affiliated hedge funds. From these hedge funds they can then channel money capital towards the acquisition of real assets. Through what circuitous financial mechanisms were these debts created? Where is the bailout money going? Who is cashing in on the multibillion dollar government bailout money? This process is contributing to an unprecedented concentration of private wealth. Concluding Remarks Financial manipulation is an integral part of the New World Order. It constitutes a powerful means to accumulate wealth. Under the present political arrangement, those responsible for monetary policy are quite deliberately serving the interests of the financiers, to the detriment of working people, leading to economic dislocation, unemployment and mass poverty. This article has focussed on how financial manipulation has served to shatter the structure of US public expenditure. More generally, this restructuring of global financial markets and institutions (alongside the pillage of national economies) has enabled the accumulation of vast amounts of private wealth – a large portion of which has been amassed as a result of strictly speculative transactions. This critical drain of billions of dollars of household savings and state tax revenues paralyses the functions of government spending and spurs the accumulation of a public debt, which can no longer be be financed through the emission of US dollar denominated debt. What we are dealing with is the fraudulent transfer and confiscation of lifelong savings and pension funds, the fraudulent appropriation of tax revenues to finance the bank bailouts, etc. To understand what has happened: follow the money trail of electronic transfers with a view to establishing where the money has gone. The monetary system, which is integrated into the State budgetary process has been destabilized. The fundamental relationship between the monetary system and the real economy is in crisis. The creation of money "out of thin air" threatens the value of the US dollar as an international currency. Similarly, the financing of a mammoth US budget deficit through dollar denominated debt instruments is impaired as a result of exceedingly low interest rates. Moreover, the process of household savings is undermined with interest rates close to zero. What we have dealt with in this article is one central aspect of an evolving process of global financial collapse. The international payments system is in crisis. The economic prospects are terrifying. Bankruptcies in the US, Canada, the European Union are occurring at an alarming rate. Country level exports have collapsed, leading to a contraction of international trade Reports from the Asian economies indicate a massive increase in unemployment. In China's Pearl River basin in Southern Guangdong province's industrial export processing economy, some 700,000 workers were laid off in January. (China Morning Post, Feb 6, 2009). In Japan, industrial output has collapsed by more than 20 percent since December. In the Philippines, a country of 90 million people, exports collapsed by more than 40 percent in December. Financial Disarmament There are no solutions under the prevailing global financial architecture. Meaningful policies cannot be achieved without radically reforming the workings of the international banking system. What is required is an overhaul of the monetary system including the functions and ownership of the central bank, the arrest and prosecution of those involved in financial fraud both in the financial system and in governmental agencies, the freeze of all accounts where fraudulent transfers have been deposited, the cancellation of debts resulting from fraudulent trade and/or market manipulation. People across the land, nationally and internationally, must mobilize. This struggle to democratise the financial and fiscal apparatus must be broad-based and democratic encompassing all sectors of society at all levels, in all countries. What is ultimately required is to disarm the financial establishment: -confiscate those assets which were obtained through fraud and financial manipulation. -restore the savings of households through reverse transfers -return the bailout money to the Treasury, freeze the activities of the hedge funds. . - freeze the gamut of speculative transactions including short-selling and derivative trade.

<TABLE style="TABLE-LAYOUT: fixed" cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=5 width="100%"><TBODY><TR><TD style="OVERFLOW: hidden" vAlign=top width="16%" rowSpan=2> </TD><TD vAlign=top width="85%" height="100%">America's Fiscal Collapse by Michel Chossudovsky Global Research, March 2, 2009 http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=12517 “We will rebuild, we will recover, and the United States of America will emerge stronger" ( President Barack Obama, State of the Union Address 24 Feb 2009) "Those of us who manage the public's dollars will be held to account—to spend wisely, reform bad habits, and do our business in the light of day—because only then can we restore the vital trust between a people and their government." President Barack Obama, A New Era of Responsibility, the 2010 Budget) "Strong economic medicine" with a "human face" “Promise amid peril.” The stated priorities of the Obama economic package are health, education, renewable energy, investment in infrastructure and transportation. "Quality education" is at the forefront. Obama has also promised to "make health care more affordable and accessible", for every American. At first sight, the budget proposal has all the appearances of an expansionary program, a demand oriented "Second New Deal" geared towards creating employment, rebuilding shattered social programs and reviving the real economy. Obama's promise is based on a mammoth austerity program. The entire fiscal structure is shattered, turned upside down. To reach these stated objectives, a significant hike in public spending on social programs (health, education, housing, social security) would be required as well as the implementation of a large scale public investment program. Major shifts in the composition of public expenditure would also be required: i.e. a move out of a war economy, requiring a movement out of military related spending in favour of civilian programs. In actuality, what we are dealing with is the most drastic curtailment in public spending in American history, leading to social havoc and the potential impoverishment of millions of people. The Obama promise largely serves the interests of Wall Street, the defence contractors and the oil conglomerates. In turn, the Bush-Obama bank "bailouts" are leading America into a spiralling public debt crisis. The economic and social dislocations are potentially devastating. Obama's budget submitted to Congress on February 26, 2009 envisages outlays for the 2010 fiscal year (commencing October 1st 2009) of $3.94 trillion, an increase of 32 percent. Total government revenues for the 2010 fiscal year, according to preliminary estimates by the Bureau of Budget, are of the order of $2.381 trillion. The predicted budget deficit (according to the president's speech) is of the order of $1.75 trillion, almost 12 percent of the U.S. Gross Domestic Product. War and Wall Street This is a "War Budget". The austerity measures hit all major federal spending programs with the exception of: 1. Defence and the Middle East War: 2. the Wall Street bank bailout, 3. Interest payments on a staggering public debt. The budget diverts tax revenues into financing the war. It legitimizes the fraudulent transfers of tax dollars to the financial elites under the "bank bailouts". The pattern of deficit spending is not expansionary. We are not dealing with a Keynesian style deficit, which stimulates investment and consumer demand, leading to an expansion of production and employment. The "bank bailouts" (involving several initiatives financed by tax dollars) constitute a component of government expenditure. Both the Bush and Obama bank bailouts are hand outs to major financial institutions. They do not not constitute a positive spending injection into the real economy. Quite the opposite. The bailouts contribute to financing the restructuring of the banking system leading to a massive concentration of wealth and centralization of banking power. A large part of the bailout money granted by the Us government will be transferred electronically to various affiliated accounts including the hedge funds. The largest banks in the US will also use this windfall cash to buy out their weaker competitors, thereby consolidating their position. The tendency, therefore, is towards a new wave of corporate buyouts, mergers and acquisitions in the financial services industry. In turn, the financial elites will use these large amounts of liquid assets (paper wealth), together with the hundreds of billions acquired through speculative trade, to buy out real economy corporations (airlines, the automobile industry, Telecoms, media, etc ), whose quoted value on the stock markets has tumbled. In essence, a budget deficit ( combined with massive cuts in social programs) is required to fund the handouts to the banks as well as finance defence spending and the military surge in the Middle East war. Obama's budget envisages: 1. defense spending of $534 billion for 2010, a supplemental 130 billion dollar appropriation for fiscal 2010 for the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq, and a supplemental $75.5 billion emergency war funding for the rest of the 2009 fiscal year. Defence spending and the Middle East war, with various supplemental budgets, is (officially) of the order of 739.5 billion. Some estimates place aggregate defence and military related spending at $ 1 trillion+. 2. A bank bailout of the order of $750 billion announced by Obama, which is added on to the 700 billion dollar bailout money already allocated by the outgoing Bush administration under the Troubled Assets Relief Program (TARP). The total of both programs is a staggering 1.45 trillion dollars to be financed by the Treasury. It should be understood that the actual amount of cash financial "aid" to the banks is significantly larger than $1.45 trillion. (See Table 2 below). 3. Net Interest on the outstanding public debt is estimated by the Bureau of the Budget) at $164 billion in 2010. The order of magnitude of these allocations is staggering. Under a "balanced budget" criterion --which has been a priority of government economic policy since the Reagan era--, almost all the revenues of the federal government amounting to $2.381 trillion would be used to finance the bank bailout (1.45 trillion), the war ($739 billion) and interest payments on the public debt ($164 billion). In other words, no money would be left over for other categories of public expenditure. TABLE 1 Budgetary allocations to Defence (FY 2009 and 2010), the Bank Bailout and Net Interests on the Public Debt (FY 2010) $ Billions Defence including Supplementary allocations; $534 billion (FY 2010), $130 billion supplemental (FY 2010), $75.5 billion emergency funding (FY2009) 739.5 *Bank bailout (TARP plus Obama) 1450.0 Net Interest 164.0 TOTAL 2353.5 Total Individual (Federal) Income Tax Revenues (FY 2010) 1061.0 Total Federal Government Revenue (FY 2010) 2381.0 Source: Bureau of the Budget and official statements. See A New Era of Responsibility: The 2010 Budget See also Office of Management and Budget * The officially announced bank bailouts to be financed from Treasury Funds. The timing of disbursements could take place over more than one fiscal years fiscal years. The actual value of bank bailout cash injections is substantially higher. The Budget Deficit These three categories of expenditure (Defence, Bank Bailout and Interest on the Public Debt) would virtually swallow up the entire 2010 federal government revenue of 2381.0. billion dollars Moreover, as a basis of comparison, all the revenue accruing from individual federal income taxes ($1.061 trillion), (FY 2010) namely all the money households across America pay in the form of federal taxes, will not suffice to finance the handouts to the banks, which officially are of the order of 1.45 trillion. This amount includes the $ 700 billion (granted during FY 2009) under the TARP program plus the proposed $ 750 billion granted by the Obama administration. While TARP and Obama's proposed bailout are to be disbursed over Fy 2009 and 2010, they nonetheless represent almost half of total government expenditure (half of Obama's $3.94 trillion budget for fiscal 2010), which is financed by regular sources of revenue ($2381 billion) plus a staggering $1.75 trillion budget deficit, which ultimately requires the issuing of Treasury Bills and government bonds. The feasibility of a large short-term expansion of the public debt at a time of crisis is yet another matter, particularly with interest rates at abysmally low levels. The budget deficit is of the order of 1.75 trillion. Obama acknowledges a 1.3 trillion-dollar budget deficit, inherited from the Bush administration. In actuality, the budget deficit is much larger . The official figures tend to underestimate the seriousness of the budgetary predicament. The $1.75 trillion dollar budget deficit figure is questionable because the various amounts disbursed under TARP and other related bank bailouts including Obama's announced $750 billion aid program to financial institutions are not acknowledged in the government's expenditure accounts. "The aid hasn’t been requested formally, but appears in a line item “for potential additional financial stabilization efforts,” according to the budget overview. The budget office calculated a $250 billion net cost to taxpayers this year, because it anticipates it would eventually recoup some, though not all, of the money expended to help financial companies. The funds would come on top of the $700 billion rescue package approved last October by Congress. The White House budgets no money for fiscal 2010 and beyond for such aid." (Bloomberg, February 27, 2010) Fiscal Collapse A major crisis of the federal fiscal structure is occurring. The multibillion dollar allocations to the War Budget and to the Wall Street Bank Bailout program backlash on all other categories of public expenditure. The Bush administration's $ 700 billion bailout under the Troubled Asset Relief Program (TARP) was approved by Congress in October. TARP is but the tip of the iceberg. A panoply of bailout allocations in addition to the $ 700 billion were decided upon prior to Obama assuming office. In November, the federal government's bank rescue program was estimated at a staggering 8.5 trillion dollars, an amount equivalent to more than 60% of the US public debt estimated at 14 trillion (2007). (See table 2 below) Meanwhile, under the Obama budget proposal, 634 billion dollars are allocated to a reserve fund to finance universal health care. At first sight, it appears to be a large amount. But it is to be spent over a ten year period, -- i.e. a modest annual commitment of 63.4 billion. Public spending will be slashed with a view to curtailing a spiralling budget deficit. Health and education programs will not only remain heavily underfunded, they will be slashed, revamped and privatized. The likely outcome is the outright privatization of public services and the sale of State assets including public infrastructure, urban services, highways, national parks, etc. Fiscal collapse leads to the privatization of the State. The fiscal crisis is further exacerbated by the compression of tax revenues resulting from decline of the real economy. Unemployed workers do not pay taxes nor do bankrupt firms. The process is cumulative. The solution to the fiscal crisis becomes the cause of further collapse. Structure of The Public Debt This large scale appropriation of liquid money assets under the bank bailouts by a handful of financial institutions serves to increase the public debt overnight. When the US Treasury allocates 700 billion dollars to the Troubled Assets Relief Program, this amount constitutes a budgetary outlay which inevitably must be financed from within the structure of government revenues and expenditures. Unless all other categories of public expenditure including health, education and social services are slashed, the various outlays under the bank bailout will require running a massive budget deficit which in turn will increase the US public debt. America is the most indebted country on earth. The US (federal government) public debt is currently of the order of $14 trillion. This does not include mounting public debts at the state and municipal levels. This US dollar denominated (federal) debt is composed of outstanding treasury bills and government bonds. The public debt, also called "the national debt" is the amount of money owed by the federal government to holders of U.S. debt instruments. US debt instruments are held by American residents as part of their savings portfolio, companies and financial institutions, US government agencies, foreign governments, individuals in foreign countries. but does not include intergovernmental debt obligations or debt held in the Social Security Trust Fund. Types of securities held by the public include, but are not limited to, Treasury Bills, Notes, Bonds, TIPS, United States Savings Bonds, and State and Local Government Series securities. The proposed solution becomes the cause of the crisis. The 700 billion bailout under the Troubled Asset Relief Program (TARP) combined with the proposed Obama $750 billion aid to financial services industry is but the tip of the iceberg. A panoply of bailout allocations in addition to the 700 billion have been decided upon. Table 2 </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

That sums it up nicely. I am now convinced these candidates are put into positions by the powers that be as traps. Bush was a trap for the conservatives disgusted with Clinton and Obama is a trap for the liberals and everyone disgusted with Bush. People are reacting on an emotional level due to allegiance to one particular side of the left/right paradigam which blinds them to what these people are really doing. Been there done that, I never will fall for that again.

As far as what to do for the economy that is hotly debated issue. I have read the best thing to do would be to put the insolvent banks through bankruptcy instead of the bailouts and wipe out the 1.4 quadrillion derivatives. A massive stimulus package would be alright if it was used to upgrade the infrastructure of America to support the population but the current stimulus package is basically just pork and social programs designed to destroy the middle class and get everyone dependent on government in order to make the population easier to control.

That is a good question. For me personally I have guns and ammo to defend my property and food if necessary, own my house, have no debt and have been stocking up on rice and beans. Will be able to hold out for a long time here. Hopefully more and more people will wake up to what is going on but most people I know are starting to suspect something is very wrong but are still brainwashed by the MSM and societal conditioning and are still holding out hope that the same crew of politicians who got us into this will pull us out of this. Hopefully the good people in the military will wake up and quit blindly following the orders they are given and will get on the side of the people instead of on the side of the globalist military industrial complex and their mind game psy-ops on the public.

It seems like Prabhupada is making a comeback in popularity amongst Krishna devotees. Just shows you, you can't keep a good man down.

Read the book The Creature from Jekyll Island if you really are interested. The stimulus packages and bank bailouts have just been mechanisms to allow the government to take over all areas of the economy so that the international bankers can deflate the bubbles they created. A controlled implosion\ demolition to institute the Orwellian Brave New World police state. They are probably gonna need another major false flag event to keep people on the hook. These fellas are good gotta give them that much.

Good point and well said. I read in Prabhupada's books somewhere where he said something to the effect the mayavadis want to become God but a devotee is in a much better position because a devotee can become even greater than God in that they can control God by love.

I thought I read somewhere in Vedas that your father is your first guru. It looks like you had a good father and he guided you well and taught you humility, you are fortunate indeed to have had such a father and such good guidance.

I don't attend weddings or funerals.

It has always seemed to me Iskcon would have had a better chance if it hadn't gotten into this mode where you are pressured to surrender to the latest and greatest living guru and people that want to take shelter of Prabhupada are ostrasized and told that they are bogus. I personally have never had any attraction to Iskcon for this very reason. The so called advanced living guru advocates basically make fun of people that have strong affection for Prabhupada and label them as sentimentalists. Pretty sad deal all the way around.

I have always thought that at least it would have been simpler method, there may still have been abuses in that system but at the end of the day Prabhupada would have been the center so the devotee would always feel the option of returning to Prabhuapda, wheras the beggars and Kulapavanas of the world seem to imply that anyone who wants to take shelter of Prabhuapda and not be pressured into surrendering to the latest living guru are all bogus etc.. I know for me personally I have never found any attraction to Iskcon when the predominating philosophy is you have to find the latest greatest living guru or you are basically going to burn in hell.

They get all the common schmucks to do all the heavy lifting building the infrastructure in society and get all these poor schmucks to go into debt buying boats, motorcycles etc. then they pull the rug out from under them when the bubble pops. This time things are different because the banks are in such a mess from derivatives that the system is completely blown out and they need to be put through bankruptcy but the government is trying to lay the blame and the burden on the taxpayers for the crimes and cronieism they themselves created and are responsible for. They are throwing the bailout money into the derivative black hole stringing the people along until the whole thing eventually breaks one way or another. Not sure how it is going to all end up. Should be interesting.