ethos

Man, the petty crap I've been subjected to here…

I've got better things to do.

Time to burn some bridges… JNdas, got to hell.

Man, the petty crap I've been subjected to here…

I've got better things to do.

Time to burn some bridges… JNdas, got to hell.

Just stop telling me what to say JNdas. Even if you have to ban me to do it. Hypocrite.

You warming up for a little delete activity?

You think I'm your puppet that you can intimidate me from half a world away? You have some big illusions.

I will do what I will and so will you. I look forward to your visit to Berkeley.

Just stop telling me what to say JNdas. Even if you have to ban me to do it. Hypocrite.

You warming up for a little delete activity?

You think I'm your puppet that you can intimidate me from half a world away? You have some big illusions.

I will do what I will and so will you. I look forward to your visit to Berkeley.

You're not thinking very deeply on this Theist.

You're bringing up a whole 'nother range of topics such as what are you trying to do and say that is better than those you conquer.

But that's just 'round and 'round. I'm not in the mood.

God was Bharata Maharaja's justification and rightly so. Only God can ultimately justify what we do. But are the conquering Indians or Americans ready to give the Muslims religion? I don't think so. Poor example.

You're not thinking very deeply on this Theist.

You're bringing up a whole 'nother range of topics such as what are you trying to do and say that is better than those you conquer.

But that's just 'round and 'round. I'm not in the mood.

God was Bharata Maharaja's justification and rightly so. Only God can ultimately justify what we do. But are the conquering Indians or Americans ready to give the Muslims religion? I don't think so. Poor example.

Theist, this question is not befitting you:

"So the brahmins were the instructers in society. What did they tell the ksatriyas about duty?"

…Or you are not who you seem.

Well, obviously the brahmanas were the leaders of society in practically every way. Not only did they counsel the ksatriyas, but they were teachers, scientists, astrologers, doctors, and so on. So as a whole they were very in tune with their society and finely tuned to the extent of their God realization. I'm sure they were qualified to train and advise the ksatrias on what was the best interest of society and God.

"We are not in a world as describe in Mahabharata. Where the warriors go outside the city limits and meet on a battlefield, kill each other until sundown, party together at night, and pick it up the next day."

But we are in a world where the politicians shamelessly send their citizens to slaughter over policies they don't personally answer for.

And don't miss this perspective: Hijackings and terrorist activity had been going on for a couple decades with little or nothing done about it. The lives of a few thousand victims was not enough to initiate and policy changes. But the terrorists made the god-aweful mistake of hitting the leaders directly. Now no expense can be spared for our protection. Now doesn't that reveal alot about motives?

And as I said, the terrorism goes on historically and presently in innumerable forms. Even a single rape or murder fits the definition of terrorism. So do institutional policies stripping away civil rights and freedoms.

"Pre-emptive strikes are all that will work."

If only Prabhupada was here to hear you say that.

The twisted logic is real:

You try to punish someone for something he hasn't done and become guilty of the same activity you are supposedly fighting against. This is not reason.

Don't get caught up in the media. This stuff has been going on for a long time by all nations, official or otherwise. Just ask the Jews or the Indians or the Blacks.

I answered you though I'm really not interested. I'm tired of talking about this violence crap. It's not constructive. There are much more interesting and enlightening things to think about.

Theist, this question is not befitting you:

"So the brahmins were the instructers in society. What did they tell the ksatriyas about duty?"

…Or you are not who you seem.

Well, obviously the brahmanas were the leaders of society in practically every way. Not only did they counsel the ksatriyas, but they were teachers, scientists, astrologers, doctors, and so on. So as a whole they were very in tune with their society and finely tuned to the extent of their God realization. I'm sure they were qualified to train and advise the ksatrias on what was the best interest of society and God.

"We are not in a world as describe in Mahabharata. Where the warriors go outside the city limits and meet on a battlefield, kill each other until sundown, party together at night, and pick it up the next day."

But we are in a world where the politicians shamelessly send their citizens to slaughter over policies they don't personally answer for.

And don't miss this perspective: Hijackings and terrorist activity had been going on for a couple decades with little or nothing done about it. The lives of a few thousand victims was not enough to initiate and policy changes. But the terrorists made the god-aweful mistake of hitting the leaders directly. Now no expense can be spared for our protection. Now doesn't that reveal alot about motives?

And as I said, the terrorism goes on historically and presently in innumerable forms. Even a single rape or murder fits the definition of terrorism. So do institutional policies stripping away civil rights and freedoms.

"Pre-emptive strikes are all that will work."

If only Prabhupada was here to hear you say that.

The twisted logic is real:

You try to punish someone for something he hasn't done and become guilty of the same activity you are supposedly fighting against. This is not reason.

Don't get caught up in the media. This stuff has been going on for a long time by all nations, official or otherwise. Just ask the Jews or the Indians or the Blacks.

I answered you though I'm really not interested. I'm tired of talking about this violence crap. It's not constructive. There are much more interesting and enlightening things to think about.

Guest, What? You say'in I'm in a good mood. What do you know anyway?

Just kidd'in. Peace.

Guest, What? You say'in I'm in a good mood. What do you know anyway?

Just kidd'in. Peace.

Madhav, Your reply to Theist confounded me as I read it. I think you were continuing your reply to me.

Well, it is not necessarily a requirement to know all the details in assessing a moral position or positions. So-called objective scientific processes no matter how objectively applied are useless for moral understanding. It is through God and religion that we know right and wrong. And we can know these things through study and practice.

Prabhupada said the whole world was implicated in sin. He called us all melechas. But he gave his love anyway. And Miracles resulted.

I agree with Stonehearted on this. We are not about any warfare or politics. Our program is peaceful revolution. Hare Krsna.

Please desist from this talk of retaliation and killing. It is not the mood of this board.

Madhav, Your reply to Theist confounded me as I read it. I think you were continuing your reply to me.

Well, it is not necessarily a requirement to know all the details in assessing a moral position or positions. So-called objective scientific processes no matter how objectively applied are useless for moral understanding. It is through God and religion that we know right and wrong. And we can know these things through study and practice.

Prabhupada said the whole world was implicated in sin. He called us all melechas. But he gave his love anyway. And Miracles resulted.

I agree with Stonehearted on this. We are not about any warfare or politics. Our program is peaceful revolution. Hare Krsna.

Please desist from this talk of retaliation and killing. It is not the mood of this board.

That will never work as violence begets violence. All this technology and hatred are simply pushing the world to the rashness of "I'll get you before you get me" …as Bushy Boy so loudly cried of Saddam.

Why just look at how we act on this board with all our knowledge and so-called cultural refinement. We simply want to fight. And that's the result of our aggression.

Let's take 9/11 or the many hijackings before that. Does anybody ask why or even care to ask why? What drives people to such desperate measures?

Well, what is an ambush? What underhanded tactics were perpetrated at Kuruksetra and why?

People use such measures when they can't accomplish what the want directly––as often with a stronger adversary.

But what is their mission, their motive? That is not generally known of todays groups. They are simply advertised as devils. The truth may be very different.

What if the IRS ruins someone's life deliberately–as they have done––and they react by murdering alot of their employees? I mean people can be pushed to the breaking point.

Now what are the circumstances? The motives? The pain? That story is rarely told. The people behind the scenes moving world events are nameless and faceless to you and me. Their agenda supercedes all else; religion, humanity or family. And it's all for their cheap gratification.

I would like to point out that all nations have their terrorists training camps. They are all guilty of espionage and covert activites and so on. They are just a little more discriminate in their applications. But then they can afford to be if all the cards are in their favor.

We are getting so off topic here (as usual).

That will never work as violence begets violence. All this technology and hatred are simply pushing the world to the rashness of "I'll get you before you get me" …as Bushy Boy so loudly cried of Saddam.

Why just look at how we act on this board with all our knowledge and so-called cultural refinement. We simply want to fight. And that's the result of our aggression.

Let's take 9/11 or the many hijackings before that. Does anybody ask why or even care to ask why? What drives people to such desperate measures?

Well, what is an ambush? What underhanded tactics were perpetrated at Kuruksetra and why?

People use such measures when they can't accomplish what the want directly––as often with a stronger adversary.

But what is their mission, their motive? That is not generally known of todays groups. They are simply advertised as devils. The truth may be very different.

What if the IRS ruins someone's life deliberately–as they have done––and they react by murdering alot of their employees? I mean people can be pushed to the breaking point.

Now what are the circumstances? The motives? The pain? That story is rarely told. The people behind the scenes moving world events are nameless and faceless to you and me. Their agenda supercedes all else; religion, humanity or family. And it's all for their cheap gratification.

I would like to point out that all nations have their terrorists training camps. They are all guilty of espionage and covert activites and so on. They are just a little more discriminate in their applications. But then they can afford to be if all the cards are in their favor.

We are getting so off topic here (as usual).

Madhav, I see no problem with your reasoning. I am half-way around the world and removed from these passions. I am ignorant about your daily threats.

I am at a loss to understand this: <>

I simply have 2 side comments:

I don't believe people have to choose to participate as you say here:

"Conflicts cannot be avoided here, especially in this kali yuga. Every one has to join in. One just has to pick which side one wants to be."

And I see this comment as describing capitalism in general:

"The barbarisns' straategy is to bleed us slowley to death and disintegration."

God help us all. Hare Krsna.

Madhav, I see no problem with your reasoning. I am half-way around the world and removed from these passions. I am ignorant about your daily threats.

I am at a loss to understand this: <>

I simply have 2 side comments:

I don't believe people have to choose to participate as you say here:

"Conflicts cannot be avoided here, especially in this kali yuga. Every one has to join in. One just has to pick which side one wants to be."

And I see this comment as describing capitalism in general:

"The barbarisns' straategy is to bleed us slowley to death and disintegration."

God help us all. Hare Krsna.

Madhav, Good philosophy. Points well taken. You had me laughing at your ksaytria–doorstep–enemy analogy. Wonderful!

I am not a Prabhu or a Gosvami. I am a jerk.

It's a shame that neighbors are such bitter enemies, sworn to fight to the end. It's ominous that Prabhupada pointed at that region as a cauldron for world destruction.

Your reasons are justified and I empathize with them.

Ksatriyas, however are justified in independent action only in defense of society––or for the obvious reasons. When initiated aggression is considered, ksatriyas are to be counciled by Brahmanas who are supposedly free of political temperment.

The process remains the same. There really is nothing to fight about if we can get it right. But that's not likely in these times. I know.

The Muslims are righteous as are the Hindus. Everyone is too busy being righteous to be spiritual.

Madhav, Good philosophy. Points well taken. You had me laughing at your ksaytria–doorstep–enemy analogy. Wonderful!

I am not a Prabhu or a Gosvami. I am a jerk.

It's a shame that neighbors are such bitter enemies, sworn to fight to the end. It's ominous that Prabhupada pointed at that region as a cauldron for world destruction.

Your reasons are justified and I empathize with them.

Ksatriyas, however are justified in independent action only in defense of society––or for the obvious reasons. When initiated aggression is considered, ksatriyas are to be counciled by Brahmanas who are supposedly free of political temperment.

The process remains the same. There really is nothing to fight about if we can get it right. But that's not likely in these times. I know.

The Muslims are righteous as are the Hindus. Everyone is too busy being righteous to be spiritual.

And then there was San Francisco smog and pet rocks.

Madhav, I don't know why you are so Muslim conscious. But we all have our pet peeves.

You asked the question above, "So then what is the solution?" And you posted the below reply on another thread that I think reveals more about you ideas of action.

"However, I would say that when the Islamists have imposed global war (jeehad) oer the world, the priority is different. Everyone has to fight this asura in any possible ways they can. There are many non violent ways to fight, and to fight violently is kshatriya dharma also."

I for one have no qualms about violence applied for reasons you suggest above. But I also don't see the urgency that justifies a dash for the ammo. I think Muslims have alot of problems understanding reality and they are creating some real messes in the world. But what I do admire about them is their seeming commitment to their practice. I think in some of those terms they can be inspiring to even us. But then again, their standards may be somewhat easy to follow as the Christians are.

We could pick alot of people out to attack in this world for their transgressions. The Chinese, Russians and Europeans––especially the Europeans––have just made genocide their history. And they also have displayed dogmatic interest and a lack of empathy to others. What some of these corporations and governments are systematically doing to the world all in the name of their cheap gratification is atrocious. Maybe we should target them who are more deserving of retribution.

I would say in response that Prabhupada laid out the plan. He created a house the whole world can live in. But we are so ineffective and foolish that we can't even maintain it, what to speak of expanding it.

But the process is there. Simply expound the truth with Sankirtana. Sounds simple. But it takes alot of surrender to do this and we are not manifesting what it takes to make it happen.

Our process is to follow in Prabhupada's footsteps. How did he do what he did? We all know the history. Think about it. He became qualified and told others.

The process is eternal and remains the same. If we can intelligently seek empathy from most of the world, the Muslims will be carried too. Till then, I think it's best to leave the Muslims alone.

Madhav, I don't know why you are so Muslim conscious. But we all have our pet peeves.

You asked the question above, "So then what is the solution?" And you posted the below reply on another thread that I think reveals more about you ideas of action.

"However, I would say that when the Islamists have imposed global war (jeehad) oer the world, the priority is different. Everyone has to fight this asura in any possible ways they can. There are many non violent ways to fight, and to fight violently is kshatriya dharma also."

I for one have no qualms about violence applied for reasons you suggest above. But I also don't see the urgency that justifies a dash for the ammo. I think Muslims have alot of problems understanding reality and they are creating some real messes in the world. But what I do admire about them is their seeming commitment to their practice. I think in some of those terms they can be inspiring to even us. But then again, their standards may be somewhat easy to follow as the Christians are.

We could pick alot of people out to attack in this world for their transgressions. The Chinese, Russians and Europeans––especially the Europeans––have just made genocide their history. And they also have displayed dogmatic interest and a lack of empathy to others. What some of these corporations and governments are systematically doing to the world all in the name of their cheap gratification is atrocious. Maybe we should target them who are more deserving of retribution.

I would say in response that Prabhupada laid out the plan. He created a house the whole world can live in. But we are so ineffective and foolish that we can't even maintain it, what to speak of expanding it.

But the process is there. Simply expound the truth with Sankirtana. Sounds simple. But it takes alot of surrender to do this and we are not manifesting what it takes to make it happen.

Our process is to follow in Prabhupada's footsteps. How did he do what he did? We all know the history. Think about it. He became qualified and told others.

The process is eternal and remains the same. If we can intelligently seek empathy from most of the world, the Muslims will be carried too. Till then, I think it's best to leave the Muslims alone.

Vaisnava das 108, Nice reply. You certainly have more patience than I.

Sushi, We're all fools. As Leyh pointed out, our fund of knowledge is vastly superior. Can you even remember how you used to think before KC? Maybe our Muslim friend will see the light through Vaisnava das. Hint.

Yeah Atma, I think this posting belongs here.

I agree with your points made.

Reading this, I am reminded of contradictory mellows in the Nectar of Devotion. But the lack of philosophical understanding and expressed doubt is mortifying.

I think ISKCON is perhaps more shadow and less substance of it's former self than I realized.

I think the author is disturbed. I too am disturbed by reading it.

PS: That's funny about the book.

Do you have a link Atma?

I laughed. I'm light.

So there humility was realized in being pumulted by the others?