Shakti-Fan

Heres a picture of a pandal program going on in the Vraja area beside one of the new style, posh, expensive buildings that have gone up in the area:

Our Kids in Vrindavan - There for What, Exactly? BY: A CONCERNED PARTY Feb 11, CANADA (SUN) I appreciated Bhaktidhana devi's piece, " Our Kids in India ", especially the following; "I ask you...when was the last time you went to school, or to work, or to the shopping mall, or even to your non devotee relatives and were greeted with the resounding cries of affection such as Radhe! Radhe!? Or when last did you step out into the street while a descendant of Krsna’s pet Surabi cow passed you by with a sidelong glance of affection? Or have you awakened recently to the sound of the cuckoo singing his fifth note for the pleasure of Radha and Krsna in their forest grove? Did you hear the thousands of arotik bells ringing this morning in the thousands of ancient temples within walking distance, to awaken the thousands of dieties being worshipped for hundreds and thousands of years? This is Sri Vrindavan Dham!" To create bhakti samskaras and facilitate one's entrance into deep bhajan is precisely why Mahaprabhu had Vrindavan excavated and "created", so to speak. It is not the fault of young people if they want to hang out, chill out and have fun. These are requirements of their age. However, if one's child is at that age (teens and twenties), why not set them up in a place like Goa or just keep them in the West and bring them with you to Vrindavan for short pilgrimages? Srila Rupa Goswami advises in the last 5 slokas of Sri Upadeshamrta what the Dham is for and in what manner one should reside there. Since most of the readers have the book, I will not elaborate beyond " tisthan vraje tad-anuragi-jananugami ". Reside in Vraja under the guidance of anuragi jana . If one is not putting themselves or their child under the close guidance of any anuragi Vaishnava in order to facilitate their entrance into deep sadhan-bhajan , then why set up residence in the Dham to begin with? You can come and go on short pilgrimages and carry on with regular family life elsewhere. Air-conditioned restaurants and fancy resorts that rival the West can be found elsewhere in India. I see no need to construct and maintain such atmospheres smack in the middle of a Dham that was created for serious sadhan-bhajan . A moderate level of austerity is conducive for bhakti as only persons serious enough about bhakti to withstand some hardships will be willing to take up permanent residence there. For those whom it is "too austere", they will stay for short periods, which is preferable. A resort type of atmosphere in the Dham attracts all sorts of personality types who come there to do what they cannot in their own neighborhoods - make "friends" with the opposite gender. The Vrindavan area is still very orthodox and local youths are not allowed "friends" of the opposite gender. For that they go to ISKCON. Where else in the area will they be approached by young girls and women trying to sell them books? Come on people! Know your environment before you carry on behaving like you do in Western Europe or North America. Knowing what I know about the state of Uttar Pradesh, there is no way I would allow my child, male or female, to approach a stranger out of the blue and start talking to them about anything - whether it's bhakti or not. Uttar Pradesh is second only to Bihar in crime statistics. Apparently Lila devi and her family knew the murderer for several years. May I ask what Western devotees are doing in the Dham making acquaintance with local people who are not " anuragi jana "? Shouldn't the only people we know for "several years" in the Dham be anuragi Vaishnavas? I think it's time that we as a society question exactly what we and our children are going to the Dham for and what type of sanga we are seeking once we are there. Hare Krishna!

Srila Narayana Maharaja: So Srila Sridhar Maharaja is not giving a concoction but rather something which is right out of sastra, " sastra has told us". This is quite clear, so I don't know why you are saying that Sridhar Maharaja is giving a unique opinion? Srila Prabhupada: Here is clear evidence that Srila Prabhupada also gives the sastric version as well as the Goloka viewpoint. Saying that we are all nitya-siddha but have forgotten is only one viewpoint that Srila Prabhupada has given. He has also told us, Obviously it is us, the conditioned souls who have forgotten our position.

Tridandiswami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja:

Here's two interesting semantical points from Bhakta Rod. First is that he defines everything that exists as the "entire creation". There appears to be a contradiction, i.e., how can the jivas be created by God if they exist eternally? And if the creation radiates from " Lord Krishna in His supreme abode of Goloka Vrndavana", then how are we to understand this? Does everything radiate from Lord Krishna like the rays of the Sun radiate from the Sun? What would be the transitional stage as what is created goes through the process of creation? Can you see now that the Brahmajyoti conception of the origin of the souls is just an attempt to put this process which is beyond time into finite words? It has it's place in the Krishna Conscious philosophy and should not be "swept under the rug", like a nuisance or eyesore that we cannot accommodate. Srila Prabhupada gave both points of view.

The Villagers and the Train By Bhakta Rod Once upon a time many years ago, the British began building trains that would travel far and wide throughout India. In one of the villagers where the train would come, there lived simple village folk who had no idea what a train looked like, so when the time had come to greet the train, the village elders decided sent a young boy to first sight the train and then let everyone know ‘what’ was coming to their village. On the evening of its expected arrival, the villagers patiently and inquisitively waited for the young boy to return back and tell them what the ‘train’ actually is. Eventually day turned to night and everyone in the Village became anxious and excited, knowing the train’s arrival was forthcoming. The fact was no one in the Village had any idea of what a train was. So the young boy was told to immediately report back to the Village elders as soon as he identifies the train. In the meantime everyone waited patiently in the dark for the boy to bring the news and satisfy everyone’s curiosity. The night sky was clear and there was a slight breeze in the air, the boy heard the usual sounds of animals although; even they were quite on this still moonless chilly night. Then to his surprise, out of the pitch-black darkness and the still of night he heard this unusual thunderous high-pitched sound that sounded like nothing he had ever heard before. The sound thundered through the night air, then silence, then thundering again. Being thrilled, he was convinced what the train was and excitedly ran back to the village elders and told them, “The train is a big thunderous sound, an immense sound and nothing else” Some of the elders were puzzled, but most accepted the news as final and accepted that a train is just a loud thunderous sound. Some however, were still not convinced saying, ‘’How can there be just a sound, what is the cause and source of that sound? Feeling more inquisitive a few decided to send another young boy down to investigate this horn like sound and if there was more to what a train really is. They told the second young boy to wait well into the darkness of night until he saw the source of the sound. In due course, after hearing the sound getting louder and louder, to his surprise, he finally saw in the distance what he thought was the source of the sound; it was an extremely bright shinning effulgent light. Being excited he rushed back to the elders proclaiming, ‘The trains thunderous sound originates from a ‘bright blinding light’ Many at the village where now convinced what a train was and most where satisfied however, still a few were not satisfied and thought ‘Wait a minute, where is that light coming from that makes the horn like sound? Is there more to a train than an impersonal sound or light? ‘ Still not satisfied, the remaining few village elders’ had come to the conclusion that the light also must have a source and were determined to find it, they therefore sent a third boy to investigate what the train really is. ‘Was it more than just a sound and bright light’? The discussed amongst themselves The third young boy went to investigate and waited patiently for as long as it would take to see the truth of what the train really is. As he waited, the sound grew louder and louder and the light was getting brighter and brighter - then to his surprise, both the thunderous sound and blinding light passed him by. To his astonishment, he discovered the source of both the sound and light, coming from the form of the train, like carriages that were filled with people like him, all engaging in all kinds of different personal activities? He excitedly ran back to the village yelling, ‘The train is a structure built by personalities who are engaged in all kinds of activity. This is the source of the sound and light that radiates through the night sky. In this way the Villagers eventually saw the train for what it really is beyond the sound and the light emanating from it. ‘Similarly beyond this material world and the impersonal Brahmajyoti is the wonderful eternal devotionally active abode of unlimited Lord Vishnu’s on the Vaikuntha planets. And ultimately Lord Krishna in His supreme abode of Goloka Vrndavana from whence the entire creation radiates. All glories to Srila Prabhupada, your fallen servant Bhakta Rod

Srila Narayana Maharaja: “Remember all the examples (of the twenty-four siksa-gurus) that were told by Dattatreya. Give up everything – all worldly desire for wife, children and everything else. Give your heart, mind and everything you possess to Guru and Krsna. Then everything will be alright.” (morning walk on <st1:date year="2006" day="17" month="6">June 17, 2006)</st1:date>

“Your Twenty-Four Gurus” [This class is a continuation of the discussion of Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura's book, Sri Bhagavata Arka Maricimala] Badger, California: June 18, 2005 Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja, Yesterday I explained the following two verses: tasmad gurum prapadyeta jijnasuh sreya uttamam sabde pare ca nisnatam brahmany upasamasrayam [“Therefore, any person who seriously desires real happiness must seek a bona fide spiritual master and take shelter of him by initiation. The qualification of the bona fide guru is that he has realized the conclusions of the scriptures by deliberation and is able to convince others of these conclusions. Such great personalities, who have taken shelter of the Supreme Godhead, leaving aside all material considerations, should be understood to be bona fide spiritual masters.” (Srimad-Bhagavatam 11.3.21)] tatra bhagavatan dharman siksed gurv-atma-daivatah amayayanuvrttya yais tusyed atmatma-do harih [“Accepting the bona fide spiritual master as one's life and soul and worshipable deity, the disciple should learn from him the process of pure devotional service. The Supreme Personality of Godhead, Hari, the soul of all souls, is inclined to give Himself to His pure devotees. Therefore, the disciple should learn from the spiritual master to serve the Lord without duplicity and in such a faithful and favorable way that the Supreme Lord, being satisfied, will offer Himself to the faithful disciple.” (Srimad-Bhagavatam 11.3.22)] The root and backbone of bhajana is guru-nistha (strong faith in guru). Without strong faith in the bona fide guru, and unconditional surrender to him, you cannot begin your bhakti. You will never be able to do so. There are two kinds of guru: diksa-guru and siksa-guru. If the diksa-guru has given all siksa (instructions) from beginning to end – teaching bhajana, the aim and object of life, and all other devotional topics – be satisfied. However, if the diksa-guru could somehow not complete this work, then a siksa-guru is needed. The siksa-guru should be of equal rank to Gurudeva, but this is very rare. At the time of Srila Bhaktivedanta Swami Maharaja there was no one equal to him in ISKCON. For his disciples, therefore, there were senior god-brothers. Lord Sri Krsna instructed Uddhava in the Eleventh Canto of Srimad-Bhagavatam. In this regard He cited a historical narration concerning the conversation between the great King Yadu and an avadhuta [*see endnote 1] named Dattatreya. The avadhuta was questioned by the king, who asked how he had attained such an advanced state of spiritual consciousness, and he replied to the king's enquiry: santi me guravo rajan bahavo buddhy-upasritah yato buddhim upadaya mukto 'tamiha tan srnu [“My dear King, with my intelligence I have taken shelter of many spiritual masters. Having gained transcendental understanding from them, I now wander about the Earth in a liberated condition. Please listen as I describe them to you.” (Srimad-Bhagavatam 11.7.32)] Dattatreya is said to be a saktyavesa-avatara (a living being empowered by the Lord to act for a specific purpose). He used to travel naked without any belongings. No one knew where he was going, and even he himself did not know. Sometimes he was laughing, and sometimes weeping bitterly and rolling on the earth. His movements made him appear as though he had been captured by a ghost. As mentioned, one day Yadu Maharaja met him and asked, “You appear extremely happy. I cannot understand your moods. Why are you weeping, laughing and rolling on the ground?” Yadu Maharaja is teaching us to approach a spiritual master with a submissive mood. tad viddhi pranipatena pariprasnena sevaya upadeksyanti te jnanam jnaninas tattva-darsinah [“Just try to learn the truth by approaching a spiritual master. Inquire from him submissively and render service unto him. The self-realized soul can impart knowledge unto you because he has seen the truth.” (Bhagavad-gita 4.34)] Go to a tattva-darsi (one who has seen the Absolute Truth). He knows everything, he is self-realized, and he can remove all your doubts. Offer him obeisances, surrender to him, serve and please him. Then pray to him, “If I am qualified to hear and understand, please answer my question.” Ask in this way, and not in a challenging mood. Yadu Maharaja did this; he asked, “You are very happy, but I cannot understand your mood. Please tell me why you are traveling, why you are happy and why you are laughing and weeping.” Dattatreya replied, “I have many gurus. I have received so many instructions from them, and I have followed those instructions. I have 24 siksa-gurus: Prthivi (the Earth), air, water, fire, the Moon, the Sun, the pigeon, the python, the ocean, the moth, the bumblebee, the elephant, the honey collector, the deer, the fish, the prostitute named Pingala, the hawk, the baby, the young unmarried girl, the arrow-maker, the snake, the spider and the wasp. Instructions are of three kinds: 1) hearing the teachings of those who are actually sadhus; that is, guru and maha-bhagavata Vaisnavas. 2) learning from their character. We should follow the manner in which they do bhajana, conduct their daily routine and behave towards others. 3) watching here and there, and thus learning by one’s own intelligence. Dattatreya was telling about what he concluded by seeing nature. By his intelligence he took something for his own bhajana, and we should also do that. You are very fortunate that you have either taken birth in a devotee family, or somehow Krsna has given you the intelligence to hear hari-katha. You will have to hear. What is the meaning of the word 'hear'? Once an avadhuta (not Dattatreya) came to the assembly of King Vikramaditya and challenged the king's council members. He had been carrying a human skull, and now he put it on the table and asked, “Who can tell whether this person was very intelligent or foolish during his lifetime?” No one could answer, so he said, “I have wasted my time here. Everyone here is foolish, because nobody can answer.” King Vikramaditya said, “One of my counselors, Kalidasa, is coming in a few moments. He may answer you. Please don't be angry.” Kalidasa soon came, and that man again asked the question. Kalidasa picked up a coconut leaf straw. He put it in one ear of the skull and it came out the other. He then said, “Oh, he was foolish. If the straw would have gone in one ear and then down towards the heart, that would have indicated intelligence. ” Don’t be foolish. Be intelligent. Dattatreya told the king what instruction he had received from each of his twenty-four gurus. From the Earth – Prthivi – he learned patience, tolerance, great determination and forgiveness. You can dig anywhere on the Earth, pass stool and urine anywhere on the Earth, or make houses and anything you like from the Earth; the Earth is always tolerant. Can you be so tolerant? As I told you yesterday, even if someone is beating you and doing nonsense to you, you should be tolerant and forgiving. This is the extraordinary quality of a pure Vaisnava. If one is doing any nonsense to a Vaisnava, the Vaisnava will forgive that person. I have seen this in my guru-parampara, and we should also be like this. Mountains – on the Earth there are many mountains. We should learn from those mountains how to work for the benefit of others. A mountain gives so many trees, herbs and water, but not for itself – for others. Your life should be for others. Also, mountains live alone, in lonely places, and their only association is that of sadhus. So many sadhus used to live in the Himalayas in India, and also at Govardhana, because those places are very silent and favorable for bhajana. Trees – we also learn from the trees. You should be as tolerant as a tree. What are the qualities of a tree? His bark, root, leaves, fruits, flowers, dry wood and everything else is for others. Even if there is no summer rain and the tree is going to become dry, still he does not say, “Oh, give me water.” In Caitanya-Caritamrta it is said that one should be like a tree. Air – what is the quality of air? The air lives for others. If there is no air, we cannot survive for even a moment. The air is always detached. It can take the bad fragrance from here and there – bad and good – and yet it is detached. We should be detached like the air. Don't be attached to anyone. Reserve your attachment for guru, but not a bogus guru. A bogus guru will say, “You should marry.” Nowadays this is going on. Do not have attachment to unqualified gurus. Be attached only to qualified gurus, to those who can take your heart and give it to Sri Sri Radha and Krsna. Sky – the sky is everywhere, even in our hearts and bodies. Empty space is called sky. The sky is everywhere, and yet it is always detached. You should be like that. Water – the qualities of water are purity, softness and refreshment. When you take a bath, your body feels pure and refreshed. Be like the water. Fire – fire can burn stool, and still it maintains a good fragrance. After death one’s body is put in fire, and yet that fire always remains pure. We should be like that – always pure. Try to be pure to do bhajana. Purity can come by performance of bhajana; otherwise it will not come. No one can be pure without doing bhajana. One cannot become pure by performance of yoga or the execution of austerities; it is only possible by remembering Lord Sri Krsna and His sweet pastimes. The Moon – we say that there is a first, second and third Moon, up to the full Moon; It seems there are fifteen moons, but this is not true. There are not many Moons; the Moon is one. If you go very high in space, you will see that the moon is always full. It is sometimes covered by another planet, sometimes by Rahu and at other times by Ketu. So it seems there are 15 moons, but it is not so. Similarly, there is only one God, although He has many manifestations. The Sun – the Sun has no birth and no death, but it seems that it has taken birth. The Sun illuminates everywhere, and it therefore seems that there are many various suns. But there is only one. Similarly, Paramatma (the Lord as Supersoul) is seen in various places, but He is one. Jivas (individual souls) are so many, but Paramatma is one. The python – don't become a python, but take instructions from him. The python remains in one place. By his fruitive karma, some animal comes nearby without any effort on his part, and he eats it. He will not go here and there in search for food. Similarly, you will always get what you deserve due to your previous karma – not more and not less than that. The python may be very hungry when nothing is there, and it may be that he can't get his food for some time, but still he will not go here and there. If any creature comes nearby, he will eat it and be satisfied. You should try to be like that. If anything is coming without much effort – and it is bound to come – accept that. As suffering comes without effort, good things also come in the same way. Your maintenance of life will come according to your previous karma. Thus, we should tolerate everything. The ocean – the ocean is always happy, and this is understood by his rolling tides. He is laughing, but at the same time he is very grave. You should be like that. If an ant bites you, don't be overwhelmed, repeatedly exclaiming, “OH, AN ANT HAS BITTEN ME! An ant has BITTEN ME!” The moth – in the rainy season in India, if there is light or fire anywhere, moths at once fly into it. You should be careful. Ladies should be careful regarding men, and men should be careful regarding ladies. Don’t go to the fire; always be careful. If you go, this means your intelligence is finished and you will die. The big black honeybee – a honeybee (madhukara) goes from flower to flower, but he only takes the essence. He does not collect more than he needs. If he collects extra, this will go to the honey collector. The honey collector is the one who comes to empty the honey from the honey combs, and he is the one who also takes that bee in his net. The bee teaches us to take just a little from each flower. This is the advice for a traveling mendicant. The bee also teaches us not to store extra in one place. Otherwise, our property or money will be taken away by thieves and rogues. You should not collect more than you need, because nothing can be taken by you at the time of your death. If you have a million dollars in India, so many dacoits will know and they will come to kill you. Be like a bee. Collect very little, like those doing madhukari (“madhukari” means collecting like the bee, or in other words begging alms [*See Endnote 2]. The elephant – I have heard that in India some female elephants are sent to the forest, where there is a large well covered with long grasses and tree branches. The female elephant lures the male elephant there; and the male, controlled by that lady, falls in the well. Then, after many days of fasting from even water, the male elephant becomes weak. At that time, the same lady elephant goes inside the well, places a chain around his leg and takes him out. The humans then take charge of that male elephant and train him, and he then becomes a trained elephant. So, men should be careful about ladies and ladies should be careful about men. They should be careful about each other. This is not a joke. If you are not careful, you may become like a dog with no sense at all. The deer – a hunter goes to the forest and keeps a net hidden somewhere. Then, by his playing very sweet music, so many deer become attracted. The net falls, and at once all the deer are caught.Don’t hear mundane talk. Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu once heard the sweet voice of a lady singing ‘Gita-govinda’ and ran towards her. Somehow His servant Govinda told Him, “O Prabhu, it is a lady singing.” Mahaprabhu then said, “If you had not saved Me, I would have gone to the ocean and drowned there.” The fish – in catching fish, the fisherman attaches a thread (with a worm on a hook at its end) to a stick, and then drops that thread in the river. Thus, by the greed of the fish's tongue, he is at once caught. Try to control your tongue. Don’t be attached to good tasting foods. Be like Srila Rupa Gosvami and Srila Raghunatha dasa Gosvami, who never cared even for salt, what to speak of other things. So many people want rich foods – but especially sannyasis shouldn't take such foodstuffs. Take only such things like simple boiled vegetables, otherwise material desires will come. Be very careful. This instruction is not only for males, but for females too. The small baby – a small baby lives naked. Sometimes he laughs and sometimes weeps, and only his mother takes care of him. He is like a paramahamsa, like Nityananda Prabhu. Sometimes, Nityananda Prabhu would take off his clothes and then go naked to the courtyard of Sacimaiya (the mother of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu), and Mahaprabhu would give him His chaddar. Nityananda Prabhu is an avadhuta (beyond social etiquette) and because of this, being married or not married was inconsequential. We cannot imitate the character of transcendental personalities like him. Don’t criticize what others are doing. A small boy is doing so many things, but after all, he is only a small boy. Similarly, all living entities are different, and it is not for us to criticize or find fault with what Lord Krsna has arranged for them. A boy may sometimes put his toe in his mouth, and sometimes take a toy. Be like a boy. Do not be worried about what others are doing. Be carefree and oil your own machine. An unmarried girl – there was a young lady who was not yet married. One day she was in her home and there was nothing to cook. There were a few vegetables, but no rice. Her mother and father were not at home. In the meantime, a gentleman from another village came to see if that girl would be a suitable bride for his son. Because her father was not at home, she told him, “Wait a little while.” There was no rice, so she went begging for rice. She was wearing many bangles and they were making some sound. She began thinking, “If this sound is heard by him, he will know I am very poor He will know that I am begging for rice when he hears the sound of the bangles,and he will not select me for his son.” She was very intelligent. She took off all the bangles but one, and there was no longer any sound. What do we learn here? Jana-sanga-tyaga advaita-tyaga. Be far away from those who do not accept God as a person.Jana-sanga means the association of anyone other than those engaged in krsna-bhakti. Advaita means mayavadis. Don't associate with mayavadis or non-devotees, even if they are your mother and father. You can serve by other means, but don’t speak harikatha with them. Even if you have to mix with your family members, do not create a disturbance by trying to speak harikatha to them, because they have no faith in your ideals. They always think you are their child. The unmarried girl took off most of her bangles so that her future father-in law would not see what she was doing. Similarly, do not disturb those who have no appreciation for what you are doing – like your parents or friends who are not interested in bhakti. The arrow-maker – There was an arrow-maker, a blacksmith. He was so absorbed in making arrows that when a marriage party playing drums, singing and dancing passed by, he was not aware of it. Someone told him, “A very beautiful marriage party has just passed by.” He replied, “When? I didn't see it.” Be absorbed like this. Don't see what is going on here and there. Be absorbed in Krsna and not in nonsense. Better to be absorbed in nama-sankirtana: “Hare Krsna Hare Krsna Krsna Krsna Hare Hare, Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare.” Then you will not hear anything else. The snake – a snake lives and travels alone, and he has no house. He lives in rat holes and is always very careful. Even if you are at a far distance from him, he will know by “eye vibration” that you are there. (He has no ears, so he notices everything only by his eyes.) Similarly, always be very careful and alert for maya. The spider – a spider produces thread from his own saliva and thus makes a web. After he has created his web, many flies or other insects become entangled in it, and he eats them. Then, when there is no further need for the web, he takes it inside himself. Similarly, God creates this world by Himself, through the agency of His maya, and later on everything enters in Him. He expands His personal potency from within Himself, displays the network of cosmic manifestation, utilizes it according to His purpose and eventually withdraws it completely within Himself. The wasp – Srimad-Bhagavatam (seventh canto) states that a grass-worm confined in a hole of a wall by a wasp always thinks of the wasp in fear and enmity. Later he becomes a wasp, simply because of such remembrance. Similarly, if the conditioned souls somehow or other think of Krsna, who is the form of eternity, knowledge and bliss (sac-cid-ananda-vigraha) they will become free from their sins. Whether thinking of Him as their worshipful Lord or an enemy, because of constantly thinking of Him they will attain their spiritual bodies.” [*See Endnote 3] Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura concludes this part of Sri Bhagavat-arkamarici-mala with the following quote from Srimad-Bhagavatam: samsara-sindhum ati-dustaram uttitirsor nanyah plavo bhagavatah purusottamasya lila-katha-rasa-nisevanam antarena pumso bhaved vividha-duhkha-davarditasya [For a person who is suffering in the fire of countless miseries and who desires to cross the insurmountable ocean of material existence, there is no suitable boat except that of cultivating devotion and transcendental taste for the narrations of the Supreme Personality of Godhead's pastimes.” (Srimad-Bhagavatam 12.4.40)] All the living entities here are suffering in many ways. To cross the unlimited, endless cycle of birth and death is very difficult. Those who want to cross it very easily should hear harikatha. There is no other way. We should hear all the sweet pastimes of Lord Sri Krsna and Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu, and the histories in Srimad-Bhagavatam such as those of Prahlada Maharaja and others like him. Today we have finished. Gaura Premanande! [The following endnotes are all quotes from the translations and purports of Srila Prabhupada Bhaktivedanta Swami Maharaja:] [*Endnote 1 – “The word avadhuta means ’most free.‘ A person is not under the rules and regulations of any injunction when he has attained the stage of avadhuta. In other words, he can act as he likes. This avadhuta stage is exactly like air, which does not care for any obstruction.” (Srimad-Bhagavatam 4.20.11 purport)] “…a great saintly person without material care…” (Srimad-Bhagavatam 5.5.29) “…one who has surpassed the rules and regulations of varnasrama-dharma is called avadhuta. Such a person has already surpassed the clutches of maya, and he lives completely separate and independent.” (Srimad-Bhagavatam 5.5.29 purport)] *Endnote 2 – “A madhukari is a saintly person or a mendicant who does not accept a full meal at one house but begs from door to door, taking a little food from each householder’s place. In this way he does not overeat or give householders unnecessary trouble.” (Caitanya Caritamrta, Madhya 20.81, purport) *Endnote 3 – “…in Bhagavad-gita (9.30), where the Lord says: api cet su-duracaro bhajate mam ananya-bhak sadhur eva sa mantavyah samyag vyavasito hi sah “Even if one commits the most abominable actions, if he engages in devotional service he is to be considered saintly because he is properly situated.” A devotee undoubtedly worships the Lord with rapt attention. Similarly, if an enemy (suduracarah) always thinks of Krsna, he also becomes a purified devotee. The example given here concerns the grass-worm that becomes beelike because of constantly thinking of the bee that forces it to enter a hole. By always thinking of the bee in fear, the grass-worm starts to become a bee. This is a practical example. Lord Krsna appears within this material world for two purposes-paritranaya sadhunam, vinasaya ca duskrtam: [bg. 4.8] to protect the devotees and annihilate the demons. The sadhus and devotees certainly think of the Lord always, but duskrtis, the demons like Kamsa and Sisupala, also think of Krsna in terms of killing Him. By thinking of Krsna, both the demons and devotees attain liberation from the clutches of material maya. (Srimad-Bhagavatam 7.1.28-29 purport)]

Are you suggesting that I copy my posts from this thread (the Narayana Maharaja ones) to Uddhava Gita discussion (UG only please) ?

The Sastric Viewpoint helps the conditioned soul understand certain aspects of reality. But since material time is really foreign to the soul the Goloka viewpoint from eternity settles what appears to be some contradictions from the Sastric Viewpoint. The same is true visa versa. There will always appear to contradictions when we try to "know" what is beyond time while we are (or think we are) within time. There will also "appear" to be contradictions when we try to understand the infinite Lord with our finite minds, even if we are hearing from a bonafide spiritual master. When we actually "realise" Krsna then our "knowing" will be completely different. The words may be the same but then we will actually have compassion for others and detachment from this world and what we say or write will have some potency and we will no longer be shouting out into the darkness.

The Goloka viewpoint does not answer the questions of Bhakta P.K. Vidyavan, only the sastric viewpoint would address such questions. You can not have your cake and eat it too.

Srila Narayana Maharaja: “Remember all the examples (of the twenty-four siksa-gurus) that were told by Dattatreya. Give up everything – all worldly desire for wife, children and everything else. Give your heart, mind and everything you possess to Guru and Krsna. Then everything will be alright.” (morning walk on <st1:date year="2006" day="17" month="6">June 17, 2006)</st1:date>

“Your Twenty-Four Gurus” [This class is a continuation of the discussion of Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura's book, Sri Bhagavata Arka Maricimala] Badger, California: June 18, 2005 Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja, Yesterday I explained the following two verses: tasmad gurum prapadyeta jijnasuh sreya uttamam sabde pare ca nisnatam brahmany upasamasrayam [“Therefore, any person who seriously desires real happiness must seek a bona fide spiritual master and take shelter of him by initiation. The qualification of the bona fide guru is that he has realized the conclusions of the scriptures by deliberation and is able to convince others of these conclusions. Such great personalities, who have taken shelter of the Supreme Godhead, leaving aside all material considerations, should be understood to be bona fide spiritual masters.” (Srimad-Bhagavatam 11.3.21)] tatra bhagavatan dharman siksed gurv-atma-daivatah amayayanuvrttya yais tusyed atmatma-do harih [“Accepting the bona fide spiritual master as one's life and soul and worshipable deity, the disciple should learn from him the process of pure devotional service. The Supreme Personality of Godhead, Hari, the soul of all souls, is inclined to give Himself to His pure devotees. Therefore, the disciple should learn from the spiritual master to serve the Lord without duplicity and in such a faithful and favorable way that the Supreme Lord, being satisfied, will offer Himself to the faithful disciple.” (Srimad-Bhagavatam 11.3.22)] The root and backbone of bhajana is guru-nistha (strong faith in guru). Without strong faith in the bona fide guru, and unconditional surrender to him, you cannot begin your bhakti. You will never be able to do so. There are two kinds of guru: diksa-guru and siksa-guru. If the diksa-guru has given all siksa (instructions) from beginning to end – teaching bhajana, the aim and object of life, and all other devotional topics – be satisfied. However, if the diksa-guru could somehow not complete this work, then a siksa-guru is needed. The siksa-guru should be of equal rank to Gurudeva, but this is very rare. At the time of Srila Bhaktivedanta Swami Maharaja there was no one equal to him in ISKCON. For his disciples, therefore, there were senior god-brothers. Lord Sri Krsna instructed Uddhava in the Eleventh Canto of Srimad-Bhagavatam. In this regard He cited a historical narration concerning the conversation between the great King Yadu and an avadhuta [*see endnote 1] named Dattatreya. The avadhuta was questioned by the king, who asked how he had attained such an advanced state of spiritual consciousness, and he replied to the king's enquiry: santi me guravo rajan bahavo buddhy-upasritah yato buddhim upadaya mukto 'tamiha tan srnu [“My dear King, with my intelligence I have taken shelter of many spiritual masters. Having gained transcendental understanding from them, I now wander about the Earth in a liberated condition. Please listen as I describe them to you.” (Srimad-Bhagavatam 11.7.32)] Dattatreya is said to be a saktyavesa-avatara (a living being empowered by the Lord to act for a specific purpose). He used to travel naked without any belongings. No one knew where he was going, and even he himself did not know. Sometimes he was laughing, and sometimes weeping bitterly and rolling on the earth. His movements made him appear as though he had been captured by a ghost. As mentioned, one day Yadu Maharaja met him and asked, “You appear extremely happy. I cannot understand your moods. Why are you weeping, laughing and rolling on the ground?” Yadu Maharaja is teaching us to approach a spiritual master with a submissive mood. tad viddhi pranipatena pariprasnena sevaya upadeksyanti te jnanam jnaninas tattva-darsinah [“Just try to learn the truth by approaching a spiritual master. Inquire from him submissively and render service unto him. The self-realized soul can impart knowledge unto you because he has seen the truth.” (Bhagavad-gita 4.34)] Go to a tattva-darsi (one who has seen the Absolute Truth). He knows everything, he is self-realized, and he can remove all your doubts. Offer him obeisances, surrender to him, serve and please him. Then pray to him, “If I am qualified to hear and understand, please answer my question.” Ask in this way, and not in a challenging mood. Yadu Maharaja did this; he asked, “You are very happy, but I cannot understand your mood. Please tell me why you are traveling, why you are happy and why you are laughing and weeping.” Dattatreya replied, “I have many gurus. I have received so many instructions from them, and I have followed those instructions. I have 24 siksa-gurus: Prthivi (the Earth), air, water, fire, the Moon, the Sun, the pigeon, the python, the ocean, the moth, the bumblebee, the elephant, the honey collector, the deer, the fish, the prostitute named Pingala, the hawk, the baby, the young unmarried girl, the arrow-maker, the snake, the spider and the wasp. Instructions are of three kinds: 1) hearing the teachings of those who are actually sadhus; that is, guru and maha-bhagavata Vaisnavas. 2) learning from their character. We should follow the manner in which they do bhajana, conduct their daily routine and behave towards others. 3) watching here and there, and thus learning by one’s own intelligence. Dattatreya was telling about what he concluded by seeing nature. By his intelligence he took something for his own bhajana, and we should also do that. You are very fortunate that you have either taken birth in a devotee family, or somehow Krsna has given you the intelligence to hear hari-katha. You will have to hear. What is the meaning of the word 'hear'? Once an avadhuta (not Dattatreya) came to the assembly of King Vikramaditya and challenged the king's council members. He had been carrying a human skull, and now he put it on the table and asked, “Who can tell whether this person was very intelligent or foolish during his lifetime?” No one could answer, so he said, “I have wasted my time here. Everyone here is foolish, because nobody can answer.” King Vikramaditya said, “One of my counselors, Kalidasa, is coming in a few moments. He may answer you. Please don't be angry.” Kalidasa soon came, and that man again asked the question. Kalidasa picked up a coconut leaf straw. He put it in one ear of the skull and it came out the other. He then said, “Oh, he was foolish. If the straw would have gone in one ear and then down towards the heart, that would have indicated intelligence. ” Don’t be foolish. Be intelligent. Dattatreya told the king what instruction he had received from each of his twenty-four gurus. From the Earth – Prthivi – he learned patience, tolerance, great determination and forgiveness. You can dig anywhere on the Earth, pass stool and urine anywhere on the Earth, or make houses and anything you like from the Earth; the Earth is always tolerant. Can you be so tolerant? As I told you yesterday, even if someone is beating you and doing nonsense to you, you should be tolerant and forgiving. This is the extraordinary quality of a pure Vaisnava. If one is doing any nonsense to a Vaisnava, the Vaisnava will forgive that person. I have seen this in my guru-parampara, and we should also be like this. Mountains – on the Earth there are many mountains. We should learn from those mountains how to work for the benefit of others. A mountain gives so many trees, herbs and water, but not for itself – for others. Your life should be for others. Also, mountains live alone, in lonely places, and their only association is that of sadhus. So many sadhus used to live in the Himalayas in India, and also at Govardhana, because those places are very silent and favorable for bhajana. Trees – we also learn from the trees. You should be as tolerant as a tree. What are the qualities of a tree? His bark, root, leaves, fruits, flowers, dry wood and everything else is for others. Even if there is no summer rain and the tree is going to become dry, still he does not say, “Oh, give me water.” In Caitanya-Caritamrta it is said that one should be like a tree. Air – what is the quality of air? The air lives for others. If there is no air, we cannot survive for even a moment. The air is always detached. It can take the bad fragrance from here and there – bad and good – and yet it is detached. We should be detached like the air. Don't be attached to anyone. Reserve your attachment for guru, but not a bogus guru. A bogus guru will say, “You should marry.” Nowadays this is going on. Do not have attachment to unqualified gurus. Be attached only to qualified gurus, to those who can take your heart and give it to Sri Sri Radha and Krsna. Sky – the sky is everywhere, even in our hearts and bodies. Empty space is called sky. The sky is everywhere, and yet it is always detached. You should be like that. Water – the qualities of water are purity, softness and refreshment. When you take a bath, your body feels pure and refreshed. Be like the water. Fire – fire can burn stool, and still it maintains a good fragrance. After death one’s body is put in fire, and yet that fire always remains pure. We should be like that – always pure. Try to be pure to do bhajana. Purity can come by performance of bhajana; otherwise it will not come. No one can be pure without doing bhajana. One cannot become pure by performance of yoga or the execution of austerities; it is only possible by remembering Lord Sri Krsna and His sweet pastimes. The Moon – we say that there is a first, second and third Moon, up to the full Moon; It seems there are fifteen moons, but this is not true. There are not many Moons; the Moon is one. If you go very high in space, you will see that the moon is always full. It is sometimes covered by another planet, sometimes by Rahu and at other times by Ketu. So it seems there are 15 moons, but it is not so. Similarly, there is only one God, although He has many manifestations. The Sun – the Sun has no birth and no death, but it seems that it has taken birth. The Sun illuminates everywhere, and it therefore seems that there are many various suns. But there is only one. Similarly, Paramatma (the Lord as Supersoul) is seen in various places, but He is one. Jivas (individual souls) are so many, but Paramatma is one. The python – don't become a python, but take instructions from him. The python remains in one place. By his fruitive karma, some animal comes nearby without any effort on his part, and he eats it. He will not go here and there in search for food. Similarly, you will always get what you deserve due to your previous karma – not more and not less than that. The python may be very hungry when nothing is there, and it may be that he can't get his food for some time, but still he will not go here and there. If any creature comes nearby, he will eat it and be satisfied. You should try to be like that. If anything is coming without much effort – and it is bound to come – accept that. As suffering comes without effort, good things also come in the same way. Your maintenance of life will come according to your previous karma. Thus, we should tolerate everything. The ocean – the ocean is always happy, and this is understood by his rolling tides. He is laughing, but at the same time he is very grave. You should be like that. If an ant bites you, don't be overwhelmed, repeatedly exclaiming, “OH, AN ANT HAS BITTEN ME! An ant has BITTEN ME!” The moth – in the rainy season in India, if there is light or fire anywhere, moths at once fly into it. You should be careful. Ladies should be careful regarding men, and men should be careful regarding ladies. Don’t go to the fire; always be careful. If you go, this means your intelligence is finished and you will die. The big black honeybee – a honeybee (madhukara) goes from flower to flower, but he only takes the essence. He does not collect more than he needs. If he collects extra, this will go to the honey collector. The honey collector is the one who comes to empty the honey from the honey combs, and he is the one who also takes that bee in his net. The bee teaches us to take just a little from each flower. This is the advice for a traveling mendicant. The bee also teaches us not to store extra in one place. Otherwise, our property or money will be taken away by thieves and rogues. You should not collect more than you need, because nothing can be taken by you at the time of your death. If you have a million dollars in India, so many dacoits will know and they will come to kill you. Be like a bee. Collect very little, like those doing madhukari (“madhukari” means collecting like the bee, or in other words begging alms [*See Endnote 2]. The elephant – I have heard that in India some female elephants are sent to the forest, where there is a large well covered with long grasses and tree branches. The female elephant lures the male elephant there; and the male, controlled by that lady, falls in the well. Then, after many days of fasting from even water, the male elephant becomes weak. At that time, the same lady elephant goes inside the well, places a chain around his leg and takes him out. The humans then take charge of that male elephant and train him, and he then becomes a trained elephant. So, men should be careful about ladies and ladies should be careful about men. They should be careful about each other. This is not a joke. If you are not careful, you may become like a dog with no sense at all. The deer – a hunter goes to the forest and keeps a net hidden somewhere. Then, by his playing very sweet music, so many deer become attracted. The net falls, and at once all the deer are caught.Don’t hear mundane talk. Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu once heard the sweet voice of a lady singing ‘Gita-govinda’ and ran towards her. Somehow His servant Govinda told Him, “O Prabhu, it is a lady singing.” Mahaprabhu then said, “If you had not saved Me, I would have gone to the ocean and drowned there.” The fish – in catching fish, the fisherman attaches a thread (with a worm on a hook at its end) to a stick, and then drops that thread in the river. Thus, by the greed of the fish's tongue, he is at once caught. Try to control your tongue. Don’t be attached to good tasting foods. Be like Srila Rupa Gosvami and Srila Raghunatha dasa Gosvami, who never cared even for salt, what to speak of other things. So many people want rich foods – but especially sannyasis shouldn't take such foodstuffs. Take only such things like simple boiled vegetables, otherwise material desires will come. Be very careful. This instruction is not only for males, but for females too. The small baby – a small baby lives naked. Sometimes he laughs and sometimes weeps, and only his mother takes care of him. He is like a paramahamsa, like Nityananda Prabhu. Sometimes, Nityananda Prabhu would take off his clothes and then go naked to the courtyard of Sacimaiya (the mother of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu), and Mahaprabhu would give him His chaddar. Nityananda Prabhu is an avadhuta (beyond social etiquette) and because of this, being married or not married was inconsequential. We cannot imitate the character of transcendental personalities like him. Don’t criticize what others are doing. A small boy is doing so many things, but after all, he is only a small boy. Similarly, all living entities are different, and it is not for us to criticize or find fault with what Lord Krsna has arranged for them. A boy may sometimes put his toe in his mouth, and sometimes take a toy. Be like a boy. Do not be worried about what others are doing. Be carefree and oil your own machine. An unmarried girl – there was a young lady who was not yet married. One day she was in her home and there was nothing to cook. There were a few vegetables, but no rice. Her mother and father were not at home. In the meantime, a gentleman from another village came to see if that girl would be a suitable bride for his son. Because her father was not at home, she told him, “Wait a little while.” There was no rice, so she went begging for rice. She was wearing many bangles and they were making some sound. She began thinking, “If this sound is heard by him, he will know I am very poor He will know that I am begging for rice when he hears the sound of the bangles,and he will not select me for his son.” She was very intelligent. She took off all the bangles but one, and there was no longer any sound. What do we learn here? Jana-sanga-tyaga advaita-tyaga. Be far away from those who do not accept God as a person.Jana-sanga means the association of anyone other than those engaged in krsna-bhakti. Advaita means mayavadis. Don't associate with mayavadis or non-devotees, even if they are your mother and father. You can serve by other means, but don’t speak harikatha with them. Even if you have to mix with your family members, do not create a disturbance by trying to speak harikatha to them, because they have no faith in your ideals. They always think you are their child. The unmarried girl took off most of her bangles so that her future father-in law would not see what she was doing. Similarly, do not disturb those who have no appreciation for what you are doing – like your parents or friends who are not interested in bhakti. The arrow-maker – There was an arrow-maker, a blacksmith. He was so absorbed in making arrows that when a marriage party playing drums, singing and dancing passed by, he was not aware of it. Someone told him, “A very beautiful marriage party has just passed by.” He replied, “When? I didn't see it.” Be absorbed like this. Don't see what is going on here and there. Be absorbed in Krsna and not in nonsense. Better to be absorbed in nama-sankirtana: “Hare Krsna Hare Krsna Krsna Krsna Hare Hare, Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare.” Then you will not hear anything else. The snake – a snake lives and travels alone, and he has no house. He lives in rat holes and is always very careful. Even if you are at a far distance from him, he will know by “eye vibration” that you are there. (He has no ears, so he notices everything only by his eyes.) Similarly, always be very careful and alert for maya. The spider – a spider produces thread from his own saliva and thus makes a web. After he has created his web, many flies or other insects become entangled in it, and he eats them. Then, when there is no further need for the web, he takes it inside himself. Similarly, God creates this world by Himself, through the agency of His maya, and later on everything enters in Him. He expands His personal potency from within Himself, displays the network of cosmic manifestation, utilizes it according to His purpose and eventually withdraws it completely within Himself. The wasp – Srimad-Bhagavatam (seventh canto) states that a grass-worm confined in a hole of a wall by a wasp always thinks of the wasp in fear and enmity. Later he becomes a wasp, simply because of such remembrance. Similarly, if the conditioned souls somehow or other think of Krsna, who is the form of eternity, knowledge and bliss (sac-cid-ananda-vigraha) they will become free from their sins. Whether thinking of Him as their worshipful Lord or an enemy, because of constantly thinking of Him they will attain their spiritual bodies.” [*See Endnote 3] Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura concludes this part of Sri Bhagavat-arkamarici-mala with the following quote from Srimad-Bhagavatam: samsara-sindhum ati-dustaram uttitirsor nanyah plavo bhagavatah purusottamasya lila-katha-rasa-nisevanam antarena pumso bhaved vividha-duhkha-davarditasya [For a person who is suffering in the fire of countless miseries and who desires to cross the insurmountable ocean of material existence, there is no suitable boat except that of cultivating devotion and transcendental taste for the narrations of the Supreme Personality of Godhead's pastimes.” (Srimad-Bhagavatam 12.4.40)] All the living entities here are suffering in many ways. To cross the unlimited, endless cycle of birth and death is very difficult. Those who want to cross it very easily should hear harikatha. There is no other way. We should hear all the sweet pastimes of Lord Sri Krsna and Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu, and the histories in Srimad-Bhagavatam such as those of Prahlada Maharaja and others like him. Today we have finished. Gaura Premanande! [The following endnotes are all quotes from the translations and purports of Srila Prabhupada Bhaktivedanta Swami Maharaja:] [*Endnote 1 – “The word avadhuta means ’most free.‘ A person is not under the rules and regulations of any injunction when he has attained the stage of avadhuta. In other words, he can act as he likes. This avadhuta stage is exactly like air, which does not care for any obstruction.” (Srimad-Bhagavatam 4.20.11 purport)] “…a great saintly person without material care…” (Srimad-Bhagavatam 5.5.29) “…one who has surpassed the rules and regulations of varnasrama-dharma is called avadhuta. Such a person has already surpassed the clutches of maya, and he lives completely separate and independent.” (Srimad-Bhagavatam 5.5.29 purport)] *Endnote 2 – “A madhukari is a saintly person or a mendicant who does not accept a full meal at one house but begs from door to door, taking a little food from each householder’s place. In this way he does not overeat or give householders unnecessary trouble.” (Caitanya Caritamrta, Madhya 20.81, purport) *Endnote 3 – “…in Bhagavad-gita (9.30), where the Lord says: api cet su-duracaro bhajate mam ananya-bhak sadhur eva sa mantavyah samyag vyavasito hi sah “Even if one commits the most abominable actions, if he engages in devotional service he is to be considered saintly because he is properly situated.” A devotee undoubtedly worships the Lord with rapt attention. Similarly, if an enemy (suduracarah) always thinks of Krsna, he also becomes a purified devotee. The example given here concerns the grass-worm that becomes beelike because of constantly thinking of the bee that forces it to enter a hole. By always thinking of the bee in fear, the grass-worm starts to become a bee. This is a practical example. Lord Krsna appears within this material world for two purposes-paritranaya sadhunam, vinasaya ca duskrtam: [bg. 4.8] to protect the devotees and annihilate the demons. The sadhus and devotees certainly think of the Lord always, but duskrtis, the demons like Kamsa and Sisupala, also think of Krsna in terms of killing Him. By thinking of Krsna, both the demons and devotees attain liberation from the clutches of material maya. (Srimad-Bhagavatam 7.1.28-29 purport)]

Don't Be Attached Badger, California: June 17, 2006 Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja Regarding our daily discussions on the Eleventh Canto of Srimad-Bhagavatam, Lord Sri Krsna is telling Uddhava about the discussion between Avadhuta Dattatreya and Maharaja Yadu. [*See Endnote 1] Dattatreya has been explaining his 24 natural siksa-gurus, and in that regard we have explained up to the pigeon. Those who want to perform bhajana should remember how the pigeon was absorbed in his engagement with his wife and children. What happened to him because of this? He could not see his death before him, and he himself thus fell into the trap of the hunter and lost his life. Always remember this. As for the hunter, he became very happy. He collected the he-pigeon's children and wife, along with the he-pigeon in his net, threw the net over his shoulder, went home and cooked them all. Remember this: Don't be attached; don't be attached. All living beings want happiness and they want to stop suffering, but still suffering comes. Suffering comes and does not leave us, so that we may taste it. We will have to suffer, wherever we live. Those who know what is happiness and suffering should not exert any effort for them. If happiness is there in one's destiny from previous lives, it will come automatically. tat-prayaso na kartavyo yata ayur-vyayah param na tatha vindate ksemam mukunda-caranambujam ["Endeavors merely for sense gratification or material happiness through economic development are not to be performed, for they result only in a loss of time and energy, with no actual profit. If one’s endeavors are directed toward Krsna consciousness, one can surely attain the spiritual platform of self-realization. There is no such benefit from engaging oneself in economic development." (Srimad-Bhagavatam 7.6.4)] You should not do anything for sense gratification. All kinds of happiness will come automatically, as it is destined. In this regard, Dattatreya has given an example of a python. The python lives only in one place. Even if he does not eat for so many days, he will not try to obtain food. If any animal automatically comes in front of him without any effort on his part, he will eat it and be satisfied. A sadhu should be like that – always engaging his senses in Krsna consciousness. samrddha-kamo hino va narayana-paro munih notsarpeta na susyeta saridbhir iva sagarah ["During the rainy season the swollen rivers rush into the ocean, and during the dry summer the rivers, now shallow, severely reduce their supply of water. Yet, the ocean does not swell up during the rainy season, nor does it dry up in the hot summer. In the same way, a saintly devotee who has accepted the Supreme Personality of Godhead as the goal of his life will sometimes receive by providence great material opulence, and sometimes he will find himself materially destitute. However, such a devotee of the Lord does not rejoice in a flourishing condition, nor is he morose when poverty-stricken." (Srimad-Bhagavatam 11.8.7)] drstva striyam deva-mayam tad-bhavair ajitendriyah pralobhitah pataty andhe tamasy agnau patanga-vat ["One who has failed to control his senses immediately feels attraction upon seeing a woman’s form, which is created by the illusory energy of the Supreme Lord. Indeed, when the woman speaks with enticing words, smiles coquettishly and moves her body sensuously, his mind is immediately captured. He thus falls blindly into the darkness of material existence, just as the moth maddened by the fire rushes blindly into its flames." (Srimad-Bhagavatam 11.8.7)] Sannyasis, brahmacaris and brahmacarinis should all be very careful. The moth sees the flame of a fire, and at once becomes attached. He goes circling and then jumps into it. What is the meaning? You must be careful. Be aware that ladies are daivi-maya (the bodies of ladies are manifestations of God's illusory energy). They are even more beautiful than gentlemen. And for women, men are maya. So always be very, very careful. There are two kinds of varna-asrama: smarta and daivi. Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura Prabhupada, Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura and Srila Bhaktivedanta Swami Maharaja tried to establish daivi varna-asrama dharma. If you are married, you should be satisfied with one husband or wife. You should not change or divorce your husband or wife for your entire life. This is varna-asrama. We should accept what is favorable for us and reject what is unfavorable. This will be helpful in our Krsna consciousness. Persons who are attached to gold and ornaments and other perishable things, and always want to relish them, are foolish. They should not do so. stokam stokam grased grasam deho varteta yavata grhan ahimsann atisthed vrttim madhukarim munih ["A saintly person should accept only enough food to keep his body and soul together. He should go from door to door accepting just a little bit of food from each family. Thus he should practice the occupation of the honeybee." (Srimad-Bhagavatam 11.8.9)] Renounced-order sannyasis should be like bumblebees. They should go to the householders' homes, after the householder has taken his lunch. They should not be a burden on any householders. They should take a little from each of so many houses – as bumblebees take just a little honey from each of many flowers. Sannyasis should be like that. They should not be a burden on anyone. Dattatreya said, "I have learned from the bumblebees that sannyasis should not collect for the evening or the next day. They should collect enough foodstuffs for taking one time, and they should be satisfied. If the bumblebees collect extra, the honey collector will come and take their beehive, place it in his cloth and squeeze it (squashing the bees inside) to get out the honey." Don't be like those bees. padapi yuvatim bhiksur na sprsed daravim api sprsan kariva badhyeta karinya anga-sangatah ["A saintly person should never touch a young girl. In fact, he should not even let his foot touch a wooden doll in the shape of a woman. By bodily contact with a woman he will surely be captured by illusion, just as the elephant is captured by the she-elephant due to his desire to touch her body." (Srimad-Bhagavatam 11.8.13)] Sannyasis and brahmacaris should be very careful – otherwise they will be like the he-elephant who is captured by a she-elephant. Ladies may come and attract a sannyasi, and thus he falls down. Due to his attachment he thinks, "What I have done is okay. I have left sannyasa – no harm. It is okay – we should be householders." If such a thing is okay, then why did Ramanujacarya, Madhvacarya, Nimbaditya and Visnusvami and their generations create hundreds of thousands of sannyasis? In our sampraydaya, Madhavendra Puripada, Isvara Puripada and Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu were sannyasis, and so many sannyasis are still coming in our sampradaya. Srila Prabhupada Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura made tridandi sannyasis, and they are still coming. Renunciation is very good, and it comes after some time. Try to conquer your senses – especially the tongue. The tongue has no backbone. It is not controlled; it can tell anything to anyone. We should try to control it. If your tongue is controlled, all other senses will be controlled. The fish cannot control his tongue. Fish are found in ponds, rivers and oceans. Fishermen go there and try to catch the fish by using a fishing rod and attaching some flesh as the bait. The fish at once jumps and takes the bait, and it is caught. Then, the fisherman takes the fish home and cooks it. We should try to control our tongue. Don't speak anything wrong. Vaco vegam – if the tongue is controlled, there will be no offense to Vaisnavas, to the holy names or to anyone in general. Dattatreya continued speaking to King Yadu, and now he told him about his siksa-guru named Pingala. In ancient times, in Videha-nagari where King Janaka used to live, there was a prostitute named Pingala. A sadhaka should always remember this history of Pingala. *[see endnote 1] asa hi paramam duhkham nairasyam paramam sukham yatha sanchidya kantasam sukham susvapa pingala ["Material desire is undoubtedly the cause of the greatest unhappiness, and freedom from such desire is the cause of the greatest happiness. Therefore, completely cutting off her desire to enjoy so-called lovers, Pingala very happily went to sleep." (Srimad-Bhagavatam 11.8.44)] After experiencing miseries and frustration in her profession, she gave up her worldly desires and began to think, "Lord Krsna is very dear to my heart, but I have not tried to please Him. Regarding these persons who will die one day – what happiness have they given to me? No happiness at all. They enjoyed my body, I became theirs, and I lost everything. Somehow, by the mercy of Krsna, I have now renounced them, and this renunciation will take me to Krsna." Pingala then closed the door of her house, lied down to sleep and slept very well. And afterwards she became a good devotee. We should always remember this history, and try to be very careful. The avadhuta named Dattatreya explained all this to King Yadu, and Lord Krsna repeated that explanation to Uddhava. Why did He tell this history? He did this to teach you that you must detach yourself from this world. Don't have any attachment to this world; give your whole heart to please Krsna. Life is short, but it can give the highest goal – even service to Srimati Radhika. We do not know when death will come, so we should give our entire effort and energy to Krsna consciousness. Gaura premanande. Tamopaha prabhu has kindly donated a mini-bus for the school children and teachers to travel here and there, to preach. I want this school to progress. So many children from all over the world should come here, and this should be an ideal school. It is ideal already. [*Endnote 1 – from Srimad-Bhagavatam 11.8.22-44. Spoken by the avadhuta (sage) Dattatreya: O son of kings, previously in the city of Videha there dwelled a prostitute named Pingala. Now please hear what I have learned from that lady. Once that prostitute, desiring to bring a lover into her house, stood outside in the doorway at night, showing her beautiful form. O best among men, this prostitute was very anxious to get money, and as she stood on the street at night she studied all the men who were passing by, thinking, "Oh, this one surely has money. I know he can pay the price, and I am sure he would enjoy my company very much." Thus she thought about all the men on the street. As the prostitute Pingala stood in the doorway, many men came and went, walking by her house. Her only means of sustenance was prostitution, and therefore she anxiously thought, "Maybe this one who is coming now is very rich...Oh, he is not stopping, but I am sure someone else will come. Surely this man who is coming now will want to pay me for my love, and he will probably give lots of money." Thus, with vain hope, she remained leaning against the doorway, unable to finish her business and go to sleep. Out of anxiety she would sometimes walk out toward the street, and sometimes she went back into her house. In this way, the midnight hour gradually arrived. As the night wore on, the prostitute, who intensely desired money, gradually became morose, and her face dried up. Thus being filled with anxiety for money and most disappointed, she began to feel a great detachment from her situation, and happiness arose in her mind. The prostitute felt disgusted with her material situation and thus became indifferent to it. Indeed, detachment acts like a sword, cutting to pieces the binding network of material hopes and desires. Now please hear from me the song sung by the prostitute in that situation. O King, just as a human being who is bereft of spiritual knowledge never desires to give up his false sense of proprietorship over many material things, similarly, a person who has not developed detachment never desires to give up the bondage of the material body. The prostitute Pingala said: "Just see how greatly illusioned I am! Because I cannot control my mind, just like a fool I desire lusty pleasure from an insignificant man. I am such a fool that I have given up the service of that person who, being eternally situated within my heart, is actually most dear to me. That most dear one is the Lord of the universe, who is the bestower of real love and happiness and the source of all prosperity. Although He is in my own heart, I have completely neglected Him. Instead I have ignorantly served insignificant men who can never satisfy my real desires and who have simply brought me unhappiness, fear, anxiety, lamentation and illusion. Oh, how I have uselessly tortured my own soul! I have sold my body to lusty, greedy men who are themselves objects of pity. Thus practicing the most abominable profession of a prostitute, I hoped to get money and sex pleasure. "This material body is like a house in which I, the soul, am living. The bones forming my spine, ribs, arms and legs are like the beams, crossbeams and pillars of the house, and the whole structure, which is full of stool and urine, is covered by skin, hair and nails. The nine doors leading into this body are constantly excreting foul substances. Besides me, what woman could be so foolish as to devote herself to this material body, thinking that she might find pleasure and love in this contraption? Certainly in this city of Videha I alone am completely foolish. I neglected the Supreme Personality of Godhead, who awards us everything, even our original spiritual form, and instead I desired to enjoy sense gratification with many men. The Supreme Personality of Godhead is absolutely the most dear one for all living beings because He is everyone's well-wisher and Lord. He is the Supreme Soul situated in everyone's heart. Therefore I will now pay the price of complete surrender, and thus purchasing the Lord I will enjoy with Him just like Laksmidevi. "Men provide sense gratification for women, but all these men, and even the demigods in heaven, have a beginning and an end. They are all temporary creations who will be dragged away by time. Therefore how much actual pleasure or happiness could any of them ever give to their wives? Although I most stubbornly hoped to enjoy the material world, somehow or other detachment has arisen in my heart, and it is making me very happy. Therefore the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Visnu, must be pleased with me. Without even knowing it, I must have performed some activity satisfying to Him. "A person who has developed detachment can give up the bondage of material society, friendship and love, and a person who undergoes great suffering gradually becomes, out of hopelessness, detached and indifferent to the material world. Thus, due to my great suffering, such detachment awoke in my heart; yet how could I have undergone such merciful suffering if I were actually unfortunate? Therefore, I am in fact fortunate and have received the mercy of the Lord. He must somehow or other be pleased with me. With devotion I accept the great benefit that the Lord has bestowed upon me. Having given up my sinful desires for ordinary sense gratification, I now take shelter of Him, the Supreme Personality of Godhead. "I am now completely satisfied, and I have full faith in the Lord's mercy. Therefore I will maintain myself with whatever comes of its own accord. I shall enjoy life with only the Lord, because He is the real source of love and happiness. The intelligence of the living entity is stolen away by activities of sense gratification, and thus he falls into the dark well of material existence. Within that well he is then seized by the deadly serpent of time. Who else but the Supreme Personality of Godhead could save the poor living entity from such a hopeless condition? "When the living entity sees that the entire universe has been seized by the serpent of time, he becomes sober and sane and at that time detaches himself from all material sense gratification. In that condition the living entity is qualified to be his own protector." The avadhuta said: Thus, her mind completely made up, Pingala cut off all her sinful desires to enjoy sex pleasure with lovers, and she became situated in perfect peace. Then she sat down on her bed. Material desire is undoubtedly the cause of the greatest unhappiness, and freedom from such desire is the cause of the greatest happiness. Therefore, completely cutting off her desire to enjoy so-called lovers, Pingala very happily went to sleep.

Vaisesika Prabhu “Krishna will personally show you. He will open the philosophy of Bhagavad-gita and you will get to step into it; you can live in it when you go out on sankirtana.” Vaisesika Prabhu distributes books Vaisesika: The basis of book distribution is hearing and chanting and there’s no substitute for that. People can come for a little while, may be interested and do the service, but the hearing and chanting in groups of devotees where there’s lots of discussion about the philosophy, that’s when devotees actually start to feel the inspiration to do it on their own. Prabhupada told us that we should, in order to inspire devotees to do service, create an atmosphere in which they feel their service is individual, voluntary, and spontaneous. Also, he said that we should create fresh challenges all the time. In realizing each individual’s service capacity and make it spontaneous and voluntary, the hearing and chanting is essential. Devotees need to sit together to hear from the Bhagavad-gita, the Srimad-Bhagavatam, and discuss them. Then there’s a natural inspiration to want to spread Krishna Consciousness because it’s based on pure faith. There’s no reason to distribute Bhagavad-gita or Srimad-Bhagavatam unless one has pure faith, because then you’ll think, “Well, I’ll go do something else, I can distribute anything. Everyone is selling something.” If one is hearing and chanting and actually learning something from that sound vibration, with the other devotees expressing their doubts, and hearing others take away those doubts, then they’ll actually feel strong. Then, when they meet people, they can infuse them with faith, and they’ll understand that the instrument of passing on that faith comes through the Bhagavad-gita and Srimad-Bhagavatam, and the purports of Srila Prabhupada become one’s life and soul. So this is the starting point. Anyone who wants to be successful in life has to get a taste for hearing and chanting about spiritual topics. Hearing Bhagavad-gita is non-different form hearing Krishna directly on the battlefield of Kuruksetra so it should be done as a daily function. Without that, maya will crush us, will easily crush us. We are no match at all and we have to be fortified every day with some spiritual program, to fortify us against maya. Then organizing for sankirtana… that is the most beneficial type of service because everyone can contribute something toward taking out the mercy. This is the essence of religion, to show kindness to all living beings. In that there is no limit to how much you can refine the service, how widely expansive your campaign can become. So if we form a sankirtana party and organize it, then that organization will become more and more refined, and more and more people will be able to use their skills, and it goes on to expand like that unlimitedly. This is Lord Caitanya’s program: to hear and chant together with the devotees, and then go out and spread the Holy Name, go door to door and meet people and give them the opportunity to also taste that pure faith and then go back home, back to Godhead. Without sankirtana (propagation of God’s glories) in one’s life everything is boring. With sankirtana, there is life. So everyone should do sankirtana. It’s the yuga-dharma (the recommended spiritual process for self-realization). It is the yajna (spiritual sacrifice for God’s pleasure). Without doing yajna one’s life is inauspicious, unproductive. By doing yajna, even little bit of yajna, sankirtana yajna, life becomes fully auspicious and at every moment one is blessed by the Goddess of Fortune, one has nothing to worry about, and everything will be taken care of by the Lord Himself. So sankirtana is the yuga-dharma. Jaya! Sastra Dana: Why should one want to engage in book distribution? Vaisesika: Well, there are several reasons. The reason that I started engaging in book distribution is that a devotee told me that it is a very important service, and that Prabhupada liked it. That was a good reason for me! On a personal side, book distribution means that when you go out and meet people on sankirtana you learn about everything that’s in the Bhagavad-gita. You read from Bhagavad-gita and then you go out on sankirtana and you learn everything about the modes of material nature, for example, and how they act. Krishna will show you this personally. He opens the philosophy of Bhagavad-gita and you get to step into it; you can live in it when you go out on sankirtana. There’s something very tangible about this service because when you distribute a book you have something that’s tangible in your hand. It has weight, it has color, it has size. When you hand it to someone and they take it home, that vibration that you’re handing them is the most important thing that’s going on in the universe. Everything else is business as usual, but when there’s an intervention between a devotee and someone who does not know about Krishna consciousness, it will change the course of the universe. There’s an intervention there. When someone comes into contact again with Krishna, eventually their karma will come to an end. It is the all-powerful order of The Lord to distribute this and if one follows it, he will be in line with Lord Caitanya and his life will become productive, spiritually and materially. Hare Krishna. http://www.dandavats.com/?p=5246#more-5246

I don't see the connection from , "we cannot stay in the 'inactive aspect of the brahmajyoti" to "and therefore we have obviously 'actively' existed before entering the impersonal Brahmajyoti...". Therefore it is obvious? Why would that be logically true? "Although I am one, I shall become many." This is the Vedic aphorism (Chandogya Upanisad 6.2.3) One angle of vision is the Lord being one then becoming many. Is this is only told to convince the conditioned souls? But still if he became many or expanded Himself through His multifarious energies then it part of the process would be the jivas coming out like pencil-rays of individual consciousness. From the angle of Goloka-Gokula we are eternal and have always been related to Krsna. Why campaign to deny so many quotes from Srila Prabhupada's books that seem to contradict each other from the external viewpoint?

Please carefully read post my post #165 and respond to my philosophical proposals therein. Just cutting and pasting won't really do. There are really more than two sides on this origin of the soul issue, there are in fact, at least several: 1) Sridhar Maharaja - origin and fall from the Brahmajyoti 2) GBC - OOP Paper - the jivas fell from Vaikuntha 3) Narayana Maharaja - The scriptures tell the Brahmajyoti viewpoint but it's seen differently from Goloka Vrndavana. 4) The "Dreaming from Goloka Theory" which intrepets the quote "no one falls from the spiritual world" to mean since the jivas are always there that there is in fact no fall. Maybe it could be called the "NO Fall Theory". You are only responding to the pure fall from the brahmajyoti idea.

That Srila Prabhupada rejected this idea is a false proposition as shown below: Srila Prabhupada is simply paraphrasing the commentaries of the previous acaryas where they are quoting the scriptures or sastra. Srila Narayana Maharaj: Are we like Srila Prabhupada, actually SITUATED IN Gololka Vrndavana consciousness? These are two different perspectives given by a pure devotee, different angles of vision. The "Dreaming from Goloka Theory" is a dualistic misconception that attempts to deny an entire and vital aspect of Srila Prabhupada's teachings while attempting to establish the Goloka viewpoint as the only viewpoint in Srila Prabhupada's books. Preaching means to give both and all angles of vision as Srila Prabhupada did. He was never attached to the result although he knew that many of the things he said would be misunderstood by his neophyte followers. He gave his preaching service, his best effort and peacefully knew that the results are up to Krsna. To take the other course is to remain attached and the result is politics, not preaching or Hari katha.

The above quote from Srila Prabhupada (from the Purport, Srimad-Bhagavatam 3.16.26) does not refer to the living entities dreaming from the position of Goloka. It is where Srila Prabhupada is alluding to the sastra or scriptures where they speak of what appears to be the tatastha origin of the soul. Srila Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja: Srila Prabhupada was seeing things from the viewpoint of Goloka where his consciousness was fully established. To only repeat his statements made when he was expressing that mood and ignore his other statements where he is giving the sastric version is a form of imitation. Srila Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja: Guruvani and Beggar were calling your theory "Sleeper-vada" a few months ago. Maybe we could call it the "Dreaming from Goloka Theory". The main problem with your "Dreaming from Goloka Theory" is that you are trying to "give more explanation." Be patient and trust that one day you, me and all of those who have received hari nama through a bona fide spiritual master and chant it regularly and incessently while trying to give up the ten offense will have the real vision of the transcendental world (divya drsti) bestowed upon them.

A Clearer Understanding Of Namabhasa Cessnock, Australia: Feb 25, 2002 Tridandiswami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja [sripad Asrama Maharaja:] In Brisbane you were discussing namabhasa (a glimpse of the light of the holy name before its full light is perfectly visible), but there is still some confusion amongst the devotees. By chanting namabhasa, will all prarabdha (sinful reactions from which one is suffering at the present) and aprarabdha-karma (potential suffering) go away? [srila Narayana Maharaja:] You should know that there are so many kinds of namabhasa. Not all types of namabhasa are the same; chaya-namabhasa (a semblance of the pure name obscured by ignorance and anarthas, like the sun, covered by clouds, which does not manifest its full brilliance) and pratibimba namabhasa are not the same. All sins will not go away by pratibimba namabhasa (a mayavadi may chant like this), but they will go away by chaya-namabhasa (endeavoring to chant for bhakti). [sripad Asrama Maharaja:] When Srila Swami Maharaja came, and the hippies were chanting Hare Krsna Hare Krsna, they were not mayavadis; they were ignorant and innocent. Can this type of chanting be said to be chaya-namabhasa? [srila Narayana Maharaja:] Yes [sripad Asrama Maharaja:] Will all sinful activities go away by that chanting? [srila Narayana Maharaja:] Yes, but when will they go? At once, or gradually? When a rope is burned by fire, its form is still there. Calling his son whose name was Narayana, Ajamila repeatedly chanted namabhasa: "Oh, Narayana come, Oh, Narayana come, Oh, Narayana come." He did this up until the last day of his life, and his sinful reactions were like burnt rope. Srila Visvanatha Cakravarti Thakura has explained that his first namabhasa was enough to burn his past sins, but he repeatedly did so and therefore his chanting was like a sadhana. Although he was not aware of the results of such chanting, all his offenses, sins: prarabdha reactions that have already fructified), aprarabdha (reactions not yet fructified), kuta (reactions lying dorment), and avidya (ignorance, the cause of sin) were gone. [sripad Asrama Maharaja:] With the first namabhasa? [srila Narayana Maharaja:] With the first, or by gradually doing so, all his sins, prarabdha, aprarabdha, and kuta were all gone. He never realized this until he saw that his death had been stopped, because at that time he heard the dialogue of the Visnudhutas and the Yamadhutas. Hearing very minutely from them the glories of chanting the holy name, he thought, "Oh, they have glorified Narayana and His kirtana. They are my Gurus." He wanted to touch their feet, but they disappeared before he could do so. At that time he realized, "I've chanted, and the fruit is that my death has been stopped. I should now chant the pure mantra." He then went to Haridvara and practiced, I don't know for how many months or years. At that time it was Satya-yuga, so it may have been thousands and thousands of years. In the course of time, he developed love for Paravyoma (Vaikuntha) Narayana, and he was totally purified. The Visnudhutas came again at that time. They checked to see if something was still lacking, but they saw that his work towards full purification had now been completed and they took him back with them to Vaikuntha. We see that the Visnudhutas also came to Dhruva at the time of his death, but he said to them, "Where is my mother?" He had some attachment, and that is why he was stopped from going to Vaikuntha, and instead went to Dhruva-loka, which is the Visnuloka here in this universe. He was not fully liberated like Ajamila. Ajamila went to Vaikuntha and Dhruva was stopped in this universe and went to Hariloka (also called Rama-priya Vaikuntha). Don't doubt this. madhuram adharam etan mangalam mangalanam sakala-nigama-valli sat-phalam cit-svarupam sakrd api parigitam sraddhaya helaya va bhrguvara! nara-matram tarayet krsnanama ["Krsna-nama is the sweetest of the sweet and the most auspicious of all that is auspicious. It is the flourishing creeper, the eternal, fully-ripened fruit of the Bhagavata, and the embodiment of knowledge, cit-sakti. O best of the Bhrgu dynasty, even if someone chants the holy name only once, with faith or indifference (hela), he is immediately delivered from this ocean of birth and death." (Hari-bhakti-vilasa 11.234)] Even one name is enough. Sakrd api parigitam, sraddhaya. If one chants with sraddha, honor and faith, and even if one chants helaya, without it, in other words, if he chants namabhasa, even that namabhasa will cross all sinful reactions. [syamarani dasi:] Gurudeva, you were talking about the people who were ignorantly or innocently chanting Hare Krsna when our Prabhupada came to America, and then you started talking about the 'burnt rope.' You didn't finish; what is their situation? [srila Narayana Maharaja:] In Srimad-Bhagavatam, first chapter, second sloka, it is written: dharmah projjhita-kaitavo 'tra paramo nirmatsaranam satam vedyam vastavam atra vastu sivadam tapa-trayonmulanam srimad-bhagavate maha-muni-krte kim va parair isvarah sadyo hrdy avarudhyate 'tra krtibhih susrusubhis tat-ksanat ["Completely rejecting all religious activities which are materially motivated, this Bhagavat Purana propounds the highest truth, which is understandable by those devotees who are fully pure in heart. The highest truth is reality distinguished from illusion for the welfare of all. Such truth uproots the threefold miseries. This beautiful Bhagavatam, compiled by the great sage Vyasadeva [in his maturity], is sufficient in itself for God realization. What is the need of any other scripture? As soon as one attentively and submissively hears the message of Bhagavatam, by this culture of knowledge the Supreme Lord is established within his heart." (SB 1.1.2)] Sadhyo hrdy avarudhyate 'tra kritibhih susrusubhis tat-ksanat. What is the meaning of tat-ksanat? [Devotee:] Immediately [srila Narayana Maharaja:] Immediately. What is the meaning here? One may be full of anarthas, but he now begins to hear the hari-katha in Srimad-Bhagavatam. Others are hearing with taste and sraddha, but they are not in Goloka Vrndavana. Why not? The word tat-ksanat is therefore used properly here. You have been in this world for unlimited time, and if you are now on the path to perfection, if you are now on the way, this is tat-ksanat. In comparison to unlimited time, if in a year, or two years, or two births, one becomes purified, that is tat-ksanat. Try to reconcile this. [brajanatha dasa:] The example is also given that when you take out the plug of a fan, it's still running, but it will stop very soon. [srila Narayana Maharaja:] Yes. If you will stop peddling on a cycle, it will continue to move for a short time. The driver of a train steps on the breaks, and the train continues to go for two miles, three miles, or four miles. Still, it has 'stopped,' and thus there is no harm in using the word tat-ksanat. [Radhanatha dasa:] Many hippies were chanting harinama. Some were chanting namabhasa and some were not chanting namabhasa. I have one doubt. The Yamadhutas - [srila Narayana Maharaja:] Don't doubt. This is your lack. Don't doubt. [Radhanatha dasa:] The Yamadhutas had never seen this before. [srila Narayana Maharaja:] The Yamadhutas can do wrong, but not the Visnudhutas. [Radhanatha dasa:] Up 'till the time the Yamadhutas came to take Ajamila, they had never heard of this situation before. So namabhasa must be very rare. [srila Narayana Maharaja:] No, it is not rare. Caitanya Mahaprabhu and Nityananda Prabhu came for this. Those who do not commit any offenses to Vaisnavas (the first of the ten namaparadhas) will do namabhasa. Somehow they are on the way, and very soon, in so many births, they will become pure. Don't doubt this; what has been written in sastras is correct. [Radhanatha dasa:] Namabhasa cannot destroy aparadhas? [srila Narayana Maharaja:] Yes, gradually. If one chants namabhasa continually, he will not commit aparadha. If you fall down on the earth, you can stand up by taking shelter of the same earth. Similarly, if you have done anything wrong or committed many offenses, if you chant again, with repentance. Gaura Premanande Come with strong, full belief, don't have any doubt, and always respect Vaisnavas.

See Below

In Gaudiya Vaisnavism the central teacher other than Caitanya Mahaprabhu, who wrote no books is Srila Rupa Goswamipada who by Mahaprabhu's inspiration wrote many books. One very important book of his is Bhakti Rasamrta Sindhu. The basis of Rupa Goswami's presentation is the science of rasa or transcedental relationships or mellows.(BTW, mellows is Prabhupada's translation). So almost every analysis of the Gaudiyas is ultimately based on rasa, especially the conception that one Visnu tattva is higher than another or is original. As Srila Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja says, " In tattva they are both one, but by rasa-vicara, consideration on the basis of rasa, They are not one." To me this is the "trade secret" of it all.(BTW that quote was about Baladeva and Krsna but can be applied to all Visnu tattva).

anyabhilasita-sunyam jnana-karmady-anavrtam anukulyena krsnanu- silanam bhaktir uttama [CC Madhya 19.167] Sripad Premaprayojana Prabhu: Gurudeva has ordered me to give just the outline of this verse composed by Srila Rupa Gosvami by the inspiration of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu. In his Bhakti Rasamrta Sindhu he is giving the most excellent definition of uttama-bhakti, transcendental bhakti. It is the continuous unbroken cultivation of all the endeavors of your body, mind, words, and internal spiritual sentiments, which are meant exclusively for the pleasure of Krsna, totally devoid of any desires other than the desire to serve Krsna, not covered or mixed with karma, jnana, dry renunciation, yoga, astrology, and all other kinds of philosophies which are not conducive to bhakti. Such endeavors should be like honey flowing from a jar. When we pour honey from a jar it does not come out in drops. It comes out in one think steam. When citta-vrtti, the tendency of the heart, along with the activities of the body, mind, and words, are flowing without any break in the service of Krsna, this is called uttama-bhakti. Syamarani didi: Sripad Premaprayojana Prabhu mentioned, this verse is written in Srila Rupa Gosvami's Bhakti Rasamrta Sindhu, but where did he first get it? He heard it from Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu Himself. Mahaprabhu had given him instructions for ten days at Prayaga. Uttama-bhakti is the uninterrupted flow of all activities performed with the body, mind, intelligence, all the activities of the senses, and the spiritualized sentiments towards Krsna. It is only for the purpose of pleasing Krsna, without knowledge aimed at impersonal liberation, and without being covered by the desire to enjoy the fruit of our activities. Karma must be there, activities must be there, but those activities should be under the influence of bhakti - not covering bhakti. In aropa-siddha bhakti, karma covers bhakti: "I like arts and crafts, I like to make pretty clothing. I worship the Deity so that I can be satisfied with the way in which I am designing clothing." This is not pure bhakti, because the devotee has some personal desire. He is superimposing the word bhakti on an activity that he wants to do for his own happiness. Srila Rupa Gosvami and Caitanya Mahaprabhu are saying, 'jnana karmadi anavrtam.' Avrtam means covered. Bhakti should be uncovered. It should be the controller of our karma and our jnana. Even jnana, the knowledge that Krsna is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, gradually has to be changed to some relationship with Krsna in one of the five rasas - like that of the residents of Vrndavana - in order to come to the highest platform of uttama-bhakti. Lord Brahma, the creator of the universe and the first spiritual master in our line, has stated that ultimately one has to give up jnana, the knowledge that Krsna is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, by hearing about His sweet pastimes from a pure devotee who has realized Krsna. Our Guru Maharaja, Srila Prabhupada, has said that there are three stages. The first is 'under-knowledge'; less than knowledge, and that is atheism and mayavadism. Then there is the 'knowledge' that Krsna is the Supreme Personality of Godhead. When I have that faith by the association of a self realized soul, then I gradually come to the stage 'above knowledge', the stage where I realize my relationship with Krsna as my friend, as my master, as my son, or my beloved. Anyabhilasita-sunyam jnana-karmady-anavrtam anukulyena krsnanu-silanam bhaktir uttama. Anusilanam means cultivation - of the physical, mental, intellectual, and sentimental activities - only for the pleasure of Krsna. Canura, and Mustika, the wrestlers in Mathura, were giving Krsna pleasure, because by their fighting they were giving Him a sense of heroism, and that made Him happy. But their activities were not bhakti. They wanted to kill Krsna. Bhakti depends on the motivation. In uttama-bhakti, not only does Krsna get pleasure, but the motivation is to give Krsna pleasure. The wrestlers gave Krsna pleasure, and mother Yasoda made Krsna cry, but she is the topmost uttama-bhakta. Why? Because her motive is, "I should punish Krsna so He won't be a thief and steal everyone's butter, and so that He'll grow up to have very good character." Srila Narayana Maharaja: Has anyone any question about this? Have you understood the meaning? Devotee: In krsna-lila, when the cowherd boys were in the forest fire and they asked Krsna, "O Krsna, Krsna save us, Balarama save us." was this just their lila? Is this going against uttama-bhakti? Srila Narayana Maharaja: No, they are beyond uttama-bhakti. You cannot imagine their position. They are beyond uttama-bhakti. They are manifestations of Krsna Himself, and they are eternal associates. They came to this world only to fulfill the desires of Krsna. They are playing like ordinary boys to teach us. They are above our consideration. The gopis, gopas, and all the associates of Goloka Vrndavana are above our consideration. They are like Krsna. Devotee: If a person is on the neophyte platform, and he is cultivating devotional service in practice and trying his best even though he is full of desires, is that considered in the class of uttama-bhakti? Or, does he have to be on the spontaneous level to be classified as an uttama-bhakta? Srila Narayana Maharaja: This question is wrong. Uttama-bhakti is not for general persons. It is beyond the calculation of kanistha-adhikaris. You are not even qualified to ask this question. Better to hear and serve gurudeva. By continually hearing, the proper questions will come. I request you to hear more and more, and first have an idea about bhakti - and then uttama-bhakti. In bhakti, whatever you do is done for Krsna. This is simple. This is bhakti, but not uttama-bhakti. When the two symptoms, anyabhilasita sunyam and anakulyena krsnanusilanam are present, it is pure bhakti; otherwise not. You should try with all your senses and all your activities to please gurudeva, but gurudeva should be bona fide. You should continually hear, as Pariksit Maharaja heard from Sukadeva Gosvami. In this age you should especially try to follow Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura in a practical way. You should read Jaiva Dharma from the beginning, from the first chapter, and especially the second part. Be like Brajanatha and Vijaya Kumara. Follow those who are really hearing everything from their gurudeva and are following. All questions are conclusively answered there in Jaiva Dharma. We should not follow our uncontrolled mind. We should try to follow Brajanatha and Vijaya Kumara - how they were hearing and how they were totally engaged. Transcendental realization was coming into their hearts. If you are not fully hearing from your gurudeva, and you are engaged in so many speculations, you cannot follow bhakti. You must hear first what the two disciples heard from their gurudeva.

Yes wherever there is Vraja Krsna, there is Laxmi, actually Maha Laxmi (Laksmi) or Srimati Radharani. Do you want to enjoy Srimati Radharani or do you want to serve Her?