atanu

Lord has made you do a good job. In one place, you have pointed out my example that Vishnu is one of the Adityas. It is true. It was not to demean. It was to contrast and highlight, the position of some friends who maintain that "Vedas Prove Vishnu is the Supreme"

Dear Raghuram ji No one can overcome you. You are the unassailable Rudra yourself. Name and forms are Maya; but the essence beneath is eternal. To me, the supreme lord is compassionate (mother and father) and auspicious (Shiva) first and foremost; and also surely all pervading (Vishnu). All pervading nature without auspiciousness will hold no meaning for me. And since, supreme Lord is one without a second, the question of supremacy does not arise. There is nothing to compare with. Also, the Lord cannot forsake the Tamasic manifests. When there is only one being, then where the question of Tamasic and Rajasic arises from? – surely from one Lord only. Shiva is known to have said to the mother “no one wants to take up the dirty and difficult jobs and unkempt forms, so have I assumed an unkempt form and I protect all – sundry and low and sinners and demons etc.” Raghuram ji, you cannot say that some part of Vedas is Svattik and owned by God and some other part is Tamasik and owned by none. All that there is, is Him only, rest is in your externalized mind. Shankhachuda was unassailable due to boon of Brahma. Only destruction of Shankhachuda’s wife’s chastity could weaken him. O, Narayana, the Purusha of the Vedas, you as Vishnu took upon you the sin of breaking chastity of Sankhachuda’s wife (Tulasi) to weaken Shankhachuda and thus protect Uma-Shankara, who were in fierce fight with Shankhachuda. Without your sacrifice Shankhachuda could not have been vanquished (From Sri Hari-bhakti-vilas). This is reflected in the the sloka given below. HYMN XL. Visvedevas. 5 With offerings I propitiate the branches of this swift-moving God, the bounteous Visnu. Hence Rudra gained his Rudra-strength: O Asvins, ye sought the house that hath celestial viands. Shiva reciprocates by providing unlimited service through Marudganas eternally as show below: HYMN LXXXVII. Maruts. 1. To Visnu, to the Mighty whom the Maruts follow let your hymns born in song go forth, Evayamarut; To the impetuous, strong band, adorned with bracelets, that rushes on in joy and ever roars for vigour. 8 Come in a friendly spirit, come to us, O Maruts, and hear his call who praises you, Evayamarut. Like car-borne men, one-minded with the mighty Visnu, keep enmity far from us with your deeds of wonder. O, MahaVishnu at your instance, Shiva consumed Halahal and lovingly you gave him the name Neelkantha. The love between you and Hara is divine. You are one. You are all pervasive Vishnu and you are auspicious Shiva. Shiva is Vishnu and Vishnu is Shiva; not like milk and curd, but like a single moment of time, which appears as night time to some part of the world and which appears as day time to the other part of the world. But, why for us mortals you uphold the Maya of discord and division? Hari-Hara pray unveil the Maya. Pray dilute our ego. From Upanishad 'When the light has risen, there is no day, no night, neither existence nor nonexistence; Shiva (the blessed One) alone is there.' (Svet. Up. IV. 18.) Suta Samhita Vrikshasyamula Sekena Shakhahpusyanti Vaiyatha Shive Rudre Japatpreteprita Yevasya Devatah By watering the tree at the base of the trunk all the parts of the tree including branches, leaves, fruits etc are strengthened. In the same way by worshipping Shiva all will be pleased and one will get both the earthly and heavenly benefits including liberation. Three Slokas from Shree Rudram Prostrations to the one who is the eldest and the youngest. Prostrations to the primordial cause and the subsequent effect. Prostrations to the eternal youth; who is also the infant. Prostrations to the one who is in the loins and in the roots. Prostrations to the one present in vice and virtue and all that is dynamic. oM namo bhagavate rudrAya vishhNave mR^ityurme pAhi | prANAnAM granthirasi rudro mA vishAntakaH | tenAnnenApyAyasva || 6|| namo rudraaya vishhNave mR^ityurme pAhi agnaavishhNuu sajoshhasemaa vardhantu vaaM giraH | dyumnairvaajebhiraagatam.h The last two slokas establish that Rudra himself is all pervading – Vishnave and agnaavishnuu Lest the above slokas be considered Tamasic, I reproduce below some from Rig Veda. Rig Veda 7.46.2 He through his lordship pervades in all things and beings on the earth, on heavenly beings through his high imperial power. Please Come willingly to our doors that gladly welcome You (O Rudra), and heal all sickness, in our families. Note: He through his lordship pervades in all things and beings on the earth, on heavenly beings through his high imperial power. Rig Veda 10.191.3 sa vishnu sa shiva sa rudra so'kshara sah Mandala 7 hymn 46 imA rudrAya sthiradhanvane giraH kSipreSave devAya svadhAvne aSALhAya sahamAnAya vedhase tigmAyudhAya bharatA shRNotu naH sa hi kSayeNa kSamyasya janmanaH sAmrAjyena divyasya cetati avannavantIrupa no durashcarAnamIvo rudra jAsu no bhava yA te didyudavasRSTA divas pari kSmayA carati pari sAvRNaktu naH sahasraM te svapivAta bheSajA mA nastokeSutana yeSu rIriSah mA no vadhI rudra mA parA dA mA te bhUma prasitau hILitasya A no bhaja barhiSi jIvashaMse yUyaM pAta ... Translation 1. To Rudra bring these songs, whose bow is firm and strong, the self-dependent God with swiftly-flying shafts, The Wise, the Conqueror whom none may overcome, armed with sharp-pointed weapons: may he hear our call. 2 He through his lordship of things on beings of the earth, on heavenly beings through his high imperial sway. Come willingly to our doors that gladly welcome thee, and heal all sickness, Rudra, in our families. 3 May thy bright arrow which, shot down by thee from heaven, flieth upon the earth, pass us uninjured by. Thou, very gracious God, bast thousand medicines: inflict no evil on our sons or progeny. 4 Slay us not, nor abandon us, O Rudra let not thy noose, when thou art angry, seize us. Give us trimmed grass and fame among the living. Preserve us evermore, ye Gods, with blessings. Note: The Wise, the Conqueror whom none may overcome Second mandala, hymn 33 A te pitar marutAM sumnametu mA naH sUryasya sandRSo yuyothAH abhi no vIro arvati kSameta pra jAyemahi rudra prajAbhiH tvAdattebhI rudra shantamebhiH shataM himA ashIya bheSajebhiH vyasmad dveSo vitaraM vyaMho vyamIvAshcAtayasvA viSUcIH shreSTho jAtasya rudra shriyAsi tavastamastavasAM vajrabAho parSi NaH pAramaMhasaH svasti vishvA abhItI rapaso yuyodhi mA tvA rudra cukrudhAmA namobhirmA duSTutI vRSabha mAsahUtI un no vIrAnarpaya bheSajebhirbhiSaktamaM tvA bhiSajAM shRNomi havImabhirhavate yo havirbhirava stomebhI rudraM diSIya RdUdaraH suhavo mA no asyai babhruH sushipro rIradhan manAyai un mA mamanda vRSabho marutvAn tvakSIyasA vayasA nAdhamAnam ghRNIva chAyAmarapA ashIyA vivAseyaM rudrasya sumnam kva sya te rudra mRLayAkurhasto yo asti bheSajo jalASaH apabhartA rapaso daivyasyAbhI nu mA vRSabha cakSamIthAH pra babhrave vRSabhAya shvitIce maho mahIM suSTutimIrayAmi namasyA kalmalIkinaM namobhirgRNImasi tveSaM rudrasya nAma sthirebhiraN^gaiH pururUpa ugro babhruH shukrebhiH pipishehiraNyaiH IshAnAdasya bhuvanasya bhUrerna vA u yoSad rudrAdasuryam arhan bibharSi sAyakAni dhanvArhan niSkaM yajataM vishvarUpam arhannidaM dayase vishvamabhvaM na vA ojIyo rudra tvadasti stuhi shrutaM gartasadaM yuvAnaM mRgaM na bhImamupahatnumugram mRlA jaritre rudra stavAno.anyaM te asman ni vapantu senAH kumArashcit pitaraM vandamAnaM prati nAnAma rudropayantam bhUrerdAtAraM satpatiM gRNISe stutastvaM bheSajA rAsyasme yA vo bheSajA marutaH shucIni yA shantamA vRSaNo yA mayobhu yAni manuravRNItA pitA nastA shaM ca yoshcarudrasya vashmi pari No hetI rudrasya vRjyAH pari tveSasya durmatirmahIgAt ava sthirA maghavadbhyastanuSva mIDhvastokAya tanayAya mRLa evA babhro vRSabha cekitAna yathA deva na hRNISe na haMsi havanashrun no rudreha bodhi bRhad v. v. s. Translation 1. FATHER of Maruts, let thy bliss approach us: exclude us not from looking on the sunlight. Gracious to our fleet courser be the Hero may we transplant us, Rudra, in our children. 2 With the most saving medicines which thou givest, Rudra, may I attain a hundred winters. Far from us banish enmity and hatred, and to all quarters maladies and trouble. 3 Chief of all born art thou in glory, Rudra, armed with the thunder, mightiest of the mighty. Transport us over trouble to well-being repel thou from us all assaults of mischief. 4 Let us not anger thee with worship, Rudra, ill praise, Strong God! or mingled invocation. Do thou with strengthening balms incite our heroes: I hear thee famed as best of all physicians. 5 May I with praise-songs win that Rudra's favour who is adored with gifts and invocations. Ne'er may the tawny God, fair-checked, and gracious, swift hearing, yield us to this evil purpose. 6 The Strong, begirt by Maruts, hath refreshed me, with most invigorating food, imploring. As he who finds a shade in fervent sunlight may I, uninjured, win the bliss of Rudra. 7 Where is that gracious hand of thine, O Rudra, the hand that giveth health and bringeth comfort, Remover of the woe that Gods have sent us? O Strong One, look thou on me with compassion. 8 To him the strong, great, tawny, fair-complexioned, I utter forth a mighty hymn of praises. We serve the brilliant God with adorations, we glorify, the splendid name of Rudra. 9 With firm limbs, multiform, the strong, the tawny adorns himself with bright gold decorations: The strength of Godhead ne'er departs from Rudra, him who is Sovran of this world, the mighty. 10 Worthy, thou carriest thy bow and arrows, worthy, thy many hued and honoured necklace. Worthy, thou cuttest here each fiend to pieces: a mightier than thou there is not, Rudra. 11 Praise him the chariot-borne, the young, the famous, fierce, slaying like a dread beast of the forest. O Rudra, praised, be gracious to the singer. let thy hosts spare us and smite down another. 12 I bend to thee as thou approachest, Rudra, even as a boy before the sire who greets him. I praise thee Bounteous Giver, Lord of heroes: give medicines to us as thou art lauded. 13 Of your pure medicines, O potent Mart its, those that are wholesomest and healthbestowing, Those which our father Manu hath selected, I crave from. Rudra for our gain and welfare. 14 May Rudra's missile turn aside and spare us, the great wrath of the impetuous One avoid us. Turn, Bounteous God, thy strong bow from our princes, and be thou gracious to our seed and offspring. 15 O tawny Bull, thus showing forth thy nature, as neither to be wroth, O God, nor slay us. Here, Rudra, listen to our invocation. Loud may we speak, with heroes, in assembly. HYMN XLIII. Rudra. 1 WHAT shall we sing to Rudra, strong, most bounteous, excellently wise, That shall be dearest to his heart? 2 That Aditi may grant the grace of Rudra to our folk, our kine, Our cattle and our progeny; 3 That Mitra and that Varuna, that Rudra may remember us, Yea, all the Gods with one accord. 4 To Rudra Lord of sacrifice, of hymns and balmy medicines, We pray for joy and health and strength. 5 He shines in splendour like the Sun, refulgent as bright gold is he, The good, the best among the Gods. 6 May he grant health into our steeds, wellbeing to our rams and ewes, To men, to women, and to kine. 7 O Soma, set thou upon us the glory of a hundred men, The great renown of mighty chiefs. 8 Let not malignities, nor those who trouble Soma, hinder us. Indu, give us a share of strength. 9 Soma! head, central point, love these; Soma! know these as serving thee, Children of thee Immortal, at the highest place of holy law. Note 1: Aditi, mother of Vishnu, is invoked to obtain Rudra’s grace. Note 2: Rudra is the Lord of sacrifice and hymns Rig Veda 6. 74. 3 Soma and Rudra, provide for our bodies all needful medicines. Loosen and withdraw from within us whatever sin we have committed, which still adheres within our persons. Note: Liberation from Karma and its effects is Shiva’s domain. Indra himself is called Shiva several times in Rig Veda (2:20:3, 6:45:17, 8:93:3). Agni, as also Indra, is not infrequently called Shiva, Shambhu or Rudra. Agni is proclaimed to be the ancient Shiva (RV, VIII.39.3). Agni became Shiva-friend (Good friend) of the Devas, the first of Angiras, the lord of Maruttas-Kavayas (RV, I.31.1). He is the Pashupa (RV, I.144.5; IV.6.4; X.142.2) or the lord of the Pashupas (X.142.2), i. e. Shiva. Around him, as the Pashupati or king of the animals, i.e. lion, are sitting all the animals (pashavas—RV, X.142.2). Vastospati is Shiva- the auspicious one below HYMN LV. Vastospati. 1. VASTOSPATI, who killest all disease and wearest every form, Be an auspicious Friend to us. 2. When, O bright Son of Sarama, thou showest, tawny-hued! thy teeth, They gleam like lances' points within thy mouth when thou wouldst bite; go thou to steep. 3. Sarama's Son, retrace thy way: bark at the robber and the thief. Maruts who are always in attendance to Vishnu stem from Rudra HYMN LVI. Maruts. 22 What time the men in fury rush together for running streams, for pastures, and for houses. Then, O ye Maruts, ye who spring from Rudra, be our protectors in the strife with foemen. Rig Veda Mandal VII Sukta 59 and Mantra 12 Maha Mrituyonjaya Mantra We Worship Tryambaka (Rudra), Who spreads Fragrance and Increases nourishment , May He release me, like the cucumber from its stem, from Mortal life, But not From Immorality. Rudra-Shiva, the old god of India, is the source of the songs of the Rig Veda. Of all who are born You are the greatest Of all the powers, you are the most compelling Lustre itself becomes pale and outshone by you O Rudra! Protect us from the hordes of sins that assault us Stand between us and them Repel them with the thunderbolt of your arm O Rudra! Lead us to the other bank Let us cross with ease. Rig Veda 10.125.8 He is Rudra because He makes sinners weep ... is called Shiva as He is the benefactor and the well-wisher of all. Pancha Rudra Pancha Rudra hymns (consists of 5 Suktas) are taken from different Ashtaka, Adyaya etc. These Mantras were discovered by various Rishies, the Devata is Rudra and appearing in various Chandas ( like Gayatri, Jagati, Trishtup etc) By watering the tree at the base of the trunk all the parts of the tree including branches, leaves, fruits etc are strengthened. In the same way by worshipping Siva (1) all his related Devas will be pleased and one will get both the earthly and heavenly benefits including liberation. (2) all the evil manifestations in the neighbourhood and in the village premises will be driven of, (3) all worries/ sorrows will be removed in the entire area. Meaning of some Mantras in this Sukta : 1. WHAT shall we sing to Rudra, strong, most bounteous, excellently wise, That shall be dearest to his heart? (1.43.1) 2. To Rudra Lord of sacrifice, of hymns and mild medicines, We pray for joy and health and strength. (1.43.4) 3. To the strong Rudra bring we these our songs of praise, to him the Lord of Heros with the braided hair, That it be well with all our cattle and our men, that in this village all he healthy and well-fed. (1.114.1) 4 Be gracious unto us, O Rudra, bring us joy: You, Lord of Heroes, with Your reverence only we are serving. Whatever health and strength our father Manu won by sacrifice, can we gain under your guidance? (1.114.2) 5. By worship of the Gods can we, O Bounteous One, O Rudra, gain with your grace, Ruler of valiant men. Come to our families, bringing them bliss to our heroes who are uninjured, bring us sacred gifts.(1.114.3) 6. Don't Harm us Rudra, in our seed and progeny, don't harm us in the living, nor in cows or war horses, don't Slay our heroes in the anger (of your anger). We are Bringing oblations to you always. (1.114.8) 7. Chief of all born with skill in your glory, Rudra, armed with the thunder, mightiest of the mighty. Transport us over trouble to well-being and keep away from you, all assaults of mis. chief from us.(2.33.3) 8. I bend to you as your approachest, Rudra, even as a boy before the Pitrus who greets him. I praise you as Bounteous Giver, Lord of heroes: give medicines to us as your skill is to be praised. (2.33.12) 9. O yellow Bull,your are showing your nature, as neither to be angry, O God, don't slay us. Here, Rudra, listen to our chanting. Let us Chant/Pray Loudly with heroes, in this assembly. (2.33.15) In sloka above Agni is Rudra 10. Provide, O Soma-Rudra, for our bodies all needful medicines to heal and cure us. Set free and draw away the sin committed which we have still inherent in our persons. (6.74.3) In sloka above Soma is Rudra 11. Armed with sharp shafts and weapons, kind and loving Soma-Rudra, be gracious to us. Release us from the cord of Varuna; keep us from sorrow, and keep us in your tender loving-kindness.(6.74.4) 12. He through his lordship pervades in all things and beings on the earth, on heavenly beings through his high imperial power. Please Come willingly to our doors that gladly welcome You (O Rudra), and heal all sickness, in our families. (7.46.2) The Manyu Sukta Manyu Sukta appears in 8th Ashtaka, 3rd Adyaya and 18th & 19th Varga of Rig Veda (In otherwords, 10th Mandala, 83rd&84th Sukta) comprises of 14 Mantras. The Rishi is Manyustapasa, Devata is Manyu and the Chandas are Trishtup and Jagati Manyu Sukta Homa - Accoring to the Rig Veda Prayoga Chandrika, the Manyu Sukta Homa is given a prominent place. Manyu is the synonym of Lord Shiva. It means 'anger'. Those belonging to the Rig Veda saka very commonly perform Manyu Sukta Homa. It is stated in the Rig Veda Prayoga Chandrika, that the devotees who are suffering from the afflictions caused by incurable diseases, or enemies, can get rid of these by performing the Manyu Sukta Homa. Significance of Mantras in Manyu Sukta : 1. Is Manyu Indra? yes, the God was Manyu. Manyu is Hota, Varuna and Jatavedas. All human lineage worship Manyu. Corresponding with the zeal (Bhakti), Manyu guard us. 2. Come here Manyu, mightier than the mighty; chase, our enemy with your enthusiasm for a friend. O, Destructive force of enemy, (Vrutra and of Dasyu), you bring to us all kinds of wealth and treasure. 3. I have departed, still without a portion, wise God! (Manyu) according to your will, the Mighty. I am small and weak man, was wroth(angry), O Manyu I am myself; come to me and give me vigour. 4. O Conquerer, twin-born with power, destructive bolt of thunder, the highest conquering might is yours. Be friendly to it, in your spirit. O Manyu, Much-invoked, in shock of mighty battle. 5 Unyielding bringing victory like Indra, O Manyu, You be here with our Emperor. To your dear name, O Conqueror, we sing praises: we know the spring from you come here. 6. For spoil, let Varuna and Manyu give us the wealth of both sides gathered and collected; And let our enemies with stricken spirits, overwhelmed with terror, creep away and defeated. The core of the Vedas The Holy Five Syllables namaH SivAya is the heart of vedas. It is the core of the very famous chapter of vedas that stands in the middle of the vedas - the shata rudrIyam or rudra sUktam. This great mantra of veda samhita while hailing the God as the Lord of everything of the worlds, salutes the God as namaH SivAya cha SivatarAya cha. From The Mahabharata, Anusasana Parva Section XIV The blessed Vishnu said: "I salute Mahadeva. Salutations to Thee. O Thou that art eternal origin of all things. The Rishis say that Thou art the Lord of the Vedas. The righteous say that Thou art Penance, Thou art Sattwa, Thou art Rajas, Thou art Tamas, and Thou art truth……. The puissant Sankara then, devoted to the good of the universe, looked at the goddess Uma and the lord of the celestials and myself also, and thus spoke unto me": "We know, O Krishna, that Thou, O slayer of foes, art filled with the greatest devotion towards us. Do what is for Thy good. My love and affection for Thee is very great. Do Thou ask for eight boons. I shall verily give them unto Thee. O Krishna, O best of all persons, tell me what they are, O chief of the Yadavas. Name what Thou wishest. However difficult of attainment they be, Thou shalt have them still". The blessed Krishna said: "Bowing my head with great joy unto that mass of energy and effulgence, I said these words unto that great Deity, with a heart filled with gladness, -firmness in virtue, the slaughter of foes in battle, the highest fame, the greatest might, devotion to Yoga, Thy adjacence, and hundreds upon hundreds of children- these are the boons I solicit of Thee". The following is from the Tulasi Ramayana, Uttara-Kanda, Doha 45: "Sankara Bhajan Bina Nara Bhagati Na Paavai Mori" Sri Rama said: "With joined palms I lay before you all another secret doctrine: without adoring Sankara (Lord Siva) man cannot attain devotion to Me." Story from SAra KAndam - Chapters Four & Ten RAma's worship of Siva Ananda RAmAyaNam gives at least 2 instances where RAma worships Siva. 1) Chapter Four describes SrI RAma's daily activities; it is said that RAma did agnihOtram and worshiped the sphatika lingam every day offering vilvam and flowers. 2) Chapter 10 talks about RAma's worship again: Before building the bridge(sEtu) on the ocean, RAma did pooja for Lord VignEswara (GaNapati); with NaLan's help, He established 9 stones for Navagrahams and prayed to Navagrahams. Sri RAma then wished to establish a Sivalingam and asked HanumAn to get a Sivalingam from Lord Siva from KAsi (Benares). HanumAn did not arrive with the lingam before the auspicious time; so, RAma made a lingam out of sand and performed Siva worship. Later, the lingam brought by HanumAn was also established close by. [The lingam established by Sri RAma is called RAmanAthalingam and the lingam established by HanumAn is called ViswanAtha lingam in RAmEswaram Linga Purana Once the god of creation brahma and the god of protection mahA vishNu entered in an argument on deciding who is greater. When those two great gods were fighting between themselves, Lord shiva who is formless and transcends everything appeared as a pillar of flame. God told brahma and vishNu that whoever finds the head or the foot of His flame form would be considered greater. brahmA took the form of swan ( ha.msam ) and set out to reach the top of the Fire. vishNu became a wild pig to see the foot of the Fire. Where are the limits for the infinite God? They could not succeed in spite of their heavy effort. They realized their mistake and the peerless greatness of Lord shiva. The God who can never be reached by ego appears as the form of love to those who surrender to Him. Lord shiva appeared in the form of shiva li.ngam (which is the shape of flame) for their benefit. They worshiped that oldest form of Him and got blessed. The God who came to bless them from the Flame, from the li.ngam is known as li.ngodbhava (2). This incident is depicted in shiva mahA purANam (1) and many other scriptures. As the God stood as pillar of flame, the natural adornment for the Lord is Holy Ash. (As ash would be found on the surface of the fire). As the God stood as the Luminat Flame that stood up the shiva sahasranAma hails God as Urdva retas and the shiva aShtottara as hiraNya retas. The hymn that starts nidhana pataye namaH, refers to many similarities of Flame and shivalinga. God is formless, attributeless and omnipresent. This state is called arUpa (formless). For the benefit of the pashus, He took the form of shiva li.ngam which is neither form nor formless but is a symbol. This symbol of Him is called arUparUpam (formless form). He took many forms out of His mercy to bless all, which are called rUpams. (2). Skanda Purana In the Shiva Rahasya Chapter in the Skanda Purana, there is a shloka of 40 verses where Vishnu praises Lord Shiva as the Ultimate truth and it ends as: Ithi Sthuthva shivam vishnu: pranamya cha muhurmuhu: Sometimes I wonder, whether Rama and Krishna, who some Vaishnavaites show as the Ishta Devata of Shiva are mentioned in Rig Veda? Some even show Shiva fighting Rama and Krishna and under go humiliating defeat. Vaishnavaites do it to degrade Shiva or to degrade Shaivaites? No doubt, some Shaivaites try to do the same. Let us remember the teaching of desecration of Daksha’s yagna that Hari will not protect the ones who degrade Shiva. And vice versa.

Dear Gokul, I thank you for your spelling mistake. Is not your goal also to realise oneness with your Atman that is Vishnu verily. Your innonence will take you to the goal faster than many of us. Atanu

True.

Dear Madhav, Lord is eternal and unchanging. Your simile that Shiva and Vishnu are as same and different as milk and yoghurt is good but goes against the nature of God. If God changes, then he is limited and has a beginning and end. To me a better simile is: they are like night and day, part of a same 24 hour day but appear opposite due to nature of time. Or like different states of water:liquid, vapour, and solid. You may disagree. But the truth is that we love the same Lord. Atanu

Dear Friends, Raghuraman has written extensive and logical reply to the main theme "Shiva is Vishnu and Vishnu is Shiva" in a different thread. He has cited many slokas. He has also asked for proof from me about Vedas claiming Shiva as Param Brahman. I will request him to read Rudram please. Moreover, in reply to my comment that the real hero of Rig Veda is Indra and not Rudra or Vishnu, he has stated that quality is important and not quantity. I accept it. I request Raghuraman to consider the following from Rig Veda. Rig Veda succintly claims “ekam satviprah bahudha vadanti” (The truth is One, sages call it by various names, 1.164.46). God is one eternal thing -- unchanging, without beginning and end. Will He change if I call Him by a name that suits my temperament. Dear Raghu you are a portion of Krishna truly and that part of you is not going to die ever. Will that part change, when in your next incarnation your name is Madhav? Ponder over it please. If you accept even a small part of what i say i will be happy. Atanu

Dear Barney, You seem to believe in non-dual Brahman. If that is so then, how all humans are created from Brahman. There has to be a principle of Purusha and Prakriti. But, Purusha and Prakriti, being descendent of Param Brahman will be brother and sister, and again it will be incest. Requirements of Physical union are at gross level. Even amoebas do not require sexual union for multiplying. So no incest.

All dear believers I have come to love the fight among the faithful adherents of different gods. No doubt what happens happens with His will. Salvation, for many will come through such intense devotional fight. Out of intense love for Vasudeva or Siva or Shakti or Ganapati or Skanda, some may not be able to sleep and may prepare arguments staying awake. There is intense feeling because each one loves god in his own way and god cannot but reward such devotion. I know this truth because I have seen light of the path. If a Vaishnavaite feels that Vishnu is the supreme God, Vishnu indeed is. Vishnu carries such a devotee lovingly to salvation and only after attaining salvation one will know the truth. The same applies to Saivaites. Devotion is required to gain attention of Vishnu. On salvation, the image that a vaishnavaite has of Maha Vishnu sitting on a throne and guiding the work of other gods will clear away to show one resplendent god which encompasses all Adityas and Rudras. My vaishnav friends will tell “Yes, the one resplendent being is Vishnu and none else”. True. But will it matter if someone else calls that being as Devi or Siva or Tao? What is there in a name, except the meaning associated with the sound? The image of Maha Vishnu sitting on a throne and guiding the work of other gods, if true, makes Vishnu very weak. Despite his lordship, the Christ appears to rule the world and Uma-Mahesvar appears to rule India. Even prophet Muhammad will beat both Siva and Vishnu. Do you want to say that Vishnu is so weak that he cannot resist the domination of Christ? Whatever we see: emergence of a leader; an event; a person; a concept – vidya or avidya; a vice; a virtue, all emanate from the Supreme Being -- Maha Vishnu only. However, some people call him Prophet Muhammad. And some people call it Tao. Repeated and vehement reference to Vedas will not help. Both Rudra and Vishnu appear as minor gods in Rig Veda. Indra is the chief. That is just for appearance. God himself has written Vedas, so will he write to glorify himself? Only men who have not seen god glorify themselves. God works silently without claiming any fame. Gita clarifies that only the Lord is the doer. Despite glorious tribute to several deities Rig Veda succintly claims “ekam satviprah bahudha vadanti” (The truth is One, sages call it by various names, 1.164.46). In Rig Veda, Vishnu who pervades everything is just an Aditya (out of 12 Adityas)– a reference to all pervading divine light. Rudra, on the other hand is not part of anything but is a class in himself and his quality is that he is undefeatable. Rig Veda does not clarify the role of Rudra further except that is the only undefeatable God. He is also father of Maruts who assist Indra to rule. Yajur Veda however begins to clarify that Rudra wields the divine light as Vishnu shastra and similarly he also wields Vayu and also Indra etc. In Shree Rudram, Rudra is shown as Indra and Aditya. Rudra is also called as Vishnu who pervades everything. Dear friends may please confirm the last sloka in the Rudram. In Upanishads the status of Brahman is given to Uma-Mahadeva who appears in the beginning and at the end. What remains after dissolution to start another cycle is param Brahman and no icon suits this knowledge better than the image of dancing Nataraja. These images are created by the Lord himself and so they last. But again, name and forms are not important but the underlying principle and meanings are. Narayana also appears as Purusha who is an integral part of Brahman. Sesha only gets to see the dissolution when Vishnu goes to yoga nidra. I will not mention Tantras, but even in Bhagavatam: Shiva consumes the poison. Who but the greatest bears the heaviest load? Who but the greatest sacrifices the most? To say that only the slokas dealing with Vishnu were written by svattwic people or the Lord himself while Shree Rudram or Svetaavatara Upanishad were written by tamasic mortal men will be wrong. The Gita clarifies that only the Lord is the doer. What I have attempted is to bring out the meanings and not to lower any image. The Vedas state Supreme god -- param Braham to be Naryana. But Vedas also state that Rudra is param Brahman. Understand the meaning friends. Param Brahman is the underlying non-dual truth. Sages who abide in God continuously: Trailanga Nath, Ramakrishna, Maharshi Ramana state so. I remember a sweet smiling Vasudeva as the supreme god – the param Brahman, the same as Shiva. The beauty of Vasudeva brings tears to my eyes, invoking the spirit of pure goodness. But for me, when I face a higher problem associated with a vice, I cannot help but remember the supreme yogi yet bhogi, immobile yet the rhythm itself, fierce yet calm, inauspicious yet supremely auspicious Shiva who invokes the meaning of an ever constant and ever present Lord, who controls everything – the vice and virtue both. Undoubtedly, for many people Vishnu evokes the same. Shiva tells his lovers: Apparent decay and destruction need not be feared. The seed dies to live as a plant; the passions and sensuous thoughts of man must die to live as a conscious entity in Eternity. Once this is recognized, all destruction is seen not merely as inevitable, but as beautiful, for it reveals the sacrificial aspect of life, unconscious in the lower kingdoms, to be consciously recognized and used by the human being. During the Vigil Night of Shiva, Mahashivaratri, we are brought to the moment of interval between destruction and regeneration; it symbolizes the night when we must contemplate on that which watches the growth out of the decay. We have to look behind and before (with Shiva in our heart), to see what evil needs eradicating from our heart, what growth of virtue we need to encourage. Such a dark night of the soul comes to all of us; it is a time when desolation lies before and behind us, and in the burning-ground of the heart there seems no life. No one escapes this dark night. Even the Christ suffered in the Garden of Gethsemane. To keep before us the memory of Shiva's dance will save us from despair and give us the courage to pass on. Friends, when any one of you has to face such a dark night of soul when all seems lost, you feel choked and death seems the only escape, then Shiva will appear to carry you along and He will caringly impart knowledge to you. Such nights are not welcome nights, if unaided by Shiva. The image of trinity is also given by the gods, to reveal to us the truth in stages. Please do not comment that the trinity is tamasic as someone has commented about Mahabharata. To claim that god only does this and not that is to limit God. Maha Vishnu will not like that since he has stated in Gita that everything is Him and He alone is the doer. Shiva tells the same thing to Devi in Devikalottara. I conclude that finally everyone will know that Shiva is Vishnu and Vishnu is Shiva. Sincere devotion to any God will take one to the One Resplendent Being. That only is important. My dear Vaishnav friends may now hurl many Vishnu ashtra at me (as Rudra does to destroy Tripura). However, I have requested Vasudeva to protect me and I know that he will. By the way Param Brahman is not Brahma as Mr. Gokul seems to believe. But Brahma is Param Brahman. Can you understand this?

All dear believers I have come to love the fight among the faithful adherents of different gods. No doubt what happens happens with His will. Salvation, for many will come through such intense devotional fight. Out of intense love for Vasudeva or Siva or Shakti or Ganapati or Skanda, some may not be able to sleep and may prepare arguments staying awake. There is intense feeling because each one loves god in his own way and god cannot but reward such devotion. I know this truth because I have seen light of the path. If a Vaishnavaite feels that Vishnu is the supreme God, Vishnu indeed is. Vishnu carries such a devotee lovingly to salvation and only after attaining salvation one will know the truth. The same applies to Saivaites. Devotion is required to gain attention of Vishnu. On salvation, the image that a vaishnavaite has of Maha Vishnu sitting on a throne and guiding the work of other gods will clear away to show one resplendent god which encompasses all Adityas and Rudras. My vaishnav friends will tell “Yes, the one resplendent being is Vishnu and none else”. True. But will it matter if someone else calls that being as Devi or Siva or Tao? What is there in a name, except the meaning associated with the sound? The image of Maha Vishnu sitting on a throne and guiding the work of other gods, if true, makes Vishnu very weak. Despite his lordship, the Christ appears to rule the world and Uma-Mahesvar appears to rule India. Even prophet Muhammad will beat both Siva and Vishnu. Do you want to say that Vishnu is so weak that he cannot resist the domination of Christ? Whatever we see: emergence of a leader; an event; a person; a concept – vidya or avidya; a vice; a virtue, all emanate from the Supreme Being -- Maha Vishnu only. However, some people call him Prophet Muhammad. And some people call it Tao. Repeated and vehement reference to Vedas will not help. Both Rudra and Vishnu appear as minor gods in Rig Veda. Indra is the chief. That is just for appearance. God himself has written Vedas, so will he write to glorify himself? Only men who have not seen god glorify themselves. God works silently without claiming any fame. Gita clarifies that only the Lord is the doer. Despite glorious tribute to several deities Rig Veda succintly claims “ekam satviprah bahudha vadanti” (The truth is One, sages call it by various names, 1.164.46). In Rig Veda, Vishnu who pervades everything is just an Aditya (out of 12 Adityas)– a reference to all pervading divine light. Rudra, on the other hand is not part of anything but is a class in himself and his quality is that he is undefeatable. Rig Veda does not clarify the role of Rudra further except that is the only undefeatable God. He is also father of Maruts who assist Indra to rule. Yajur Veda however begins to clarify that Rudra wields the divine light as Vishnu shastra and similarly he also wields Vayu and also Indra etc. In Shree Rudram, Rudra is shown as Indra and Aditya. Rudra is also called as Vishnu who pervades everything. Dear friends may please confirm the last sloka in the Rudram. In Upanishads the status of Brahman is given to Uma-Mahadeva who appears in the beginning and at the end. What remains after dissolution to start another cycle is param Brahman and no icon suits this knowledge better than the image of dancing Nataraja. These images are created by the Lord himself and so they last. But again, name and forms are not important but the underlying principle and meanings are. Narayana also appears as Purusha who is an integral part of Brahman. Sesha only gets to see the dissolution when Vishnu goes to yoga nidra. I will not mention Tantras, but even in Bhagavatam: Shiva consumes the poison. Who but the greatest bears the heaviest load? Who but the greatest sacrifices the most? To say that only the slokas dealing with Vishnu were written by svattwic people or the Lord himself while Shree Rudram or Svetaavatara Upanishad were written by tamasic mortal men will be wrong. The Gita clarifies that only the Lord is the doer. What I have attempted is to bring out the meanings and not to lower any image. The Vedas state Supreme god -- param Braham to be Naryana. But Vedas also state that Rudra is param Brahman. Understand the meaning friends. Param Brahman is the underlying non-dual truth. Sages who abide in God continuously: Trailanga Nath, Ramakrishna, Maharshi Ramana state so. I remember a sweet smiling Vasudeva as the supreme god – the param Brahman, the same as Shiva. The beauty of Vasudeva brings tears to my eyes, invoking the spirit of pure goodness. But for me, when I face a higher problem associated with a vice, I cannot help but remember the supreme yogi yet bhogi, immobile yet the rhythm itself, fierce yet calm, inauspicious yet supremely auspicious Shiva who invokes the meaning of an ever constant and ever present Lord, who controls everything – the vice and virtue both. Undoubtedly, for many people Vishnu evokes the same. Shiva tells his lovers: Apparent decay and destruction need not be feared. The seed dies to live as a plant; the passions and sensuous thoughts of man must die to live as a conscious entity in Eternity. Once this is recognized, all destruction is seen not merely as inevitable, but as beautiful, for it reveals the sacrificial aspect of life, unconscious in the lower kingdoms, to be consciously recognized and used by the human being. During the Vigil Night of Shiva, Mahashivaratri, we are brought to the moment of interval between destruction and regeneration; it symbolizes the night when we must contemplate on that which watches the growth out of the decay. We have to look behind and before (with Shiva in our heart), to see what evil needs eradicating from our heart, what growth of virtue we need to encourage. Such a dark night of the soul comes to all of us; it is a time when desolation lies before and behind us, and in the burning-ground of the heart there seems no life. No one escapes this dark night. Even the Christ suffered in the Garden of Gethsemane. To keep before us the memory of Shiva's dance will save us from despair and give us the courage to pass on. Friends, when any one of you has to face such a dark night of soul when all seems lost, you feel choked and death seems the only escape, then Shiva will appear to carry you along and He will caringly impart knowledge to you. Such nights are not welcome nights, if unaided by Shiva. The image of trinity is also given by the gods, to reveal to us the truth in stages. Please do not comment that the trinity is tamasic as someone has commented about Mahabharata. To claim that god only does this and not that is to limit God. Maha Vishnu will not like that since he has stated in Gita that everything is Him and He alone is the doer. Shiva tells the same thing to Devi in Devikalottara. I conclude that finally everyone will know that Shiva is Vishnu and Vishnu is Shiva. Sincere devotion to any God will take one to the One Resplendent Being. That only is important. My dear Vaishnav friends may now hurl many Vishnu ashtra at me (as Rudra does to destroy Tripura). However, I have requested Vasudeva to protect me and I know that he will. By the way Param Brahman is not Brahma as Mr. Gokul seems to believe. But Brahma is Param Brahman. Can you understand this?

All dear believers I have come to love the fight among the faithful adherents of different gods. No doubt what happens happens with His will. Salvation, for many will come through such intense devotional fight. Out of intense love for Vasudeva or Siva or Shakti or Ganapati or Skanda, some may not be able to sleep and may prepare arguments staying awake. There is intense feeling because each one loves god in his own way and god cannot but reward such devotion. I know this truth because I have seen light of the path. If a Vaishnavaite feels that Vishnu is the supreme God, Vishnu indeed is. Vishnu carries such a devotee lovingly to salvation and only after attaining salvation one will know the truth. The same applies to Saivaites. Devotion is required to gain attention of Vishnu. On salvation, the image that a vaishnavaite has of Maha Vishnu sitting on a throne and guiding the work of other gods will clear away to show one resplendent god which encompasses all Adityas and Rudras. My vaishnav friends will tell “Yes, the one resplendent being is Vishnu and none else”. True. But will it matter if someone else calls that being as Devi or Siva or Tao? What is there in a name, except the meaning associated with the sound? The image of Maha Vishnu sitting on a throne and guiding the work of other gods, if true, makes Vishnu very weak. Despite his lordship, the Christ appears to rule the world and Uma-Mahesvar appears to rule India. Even prophet Muhammad will beat both Siva and Vishnu. Do you want to say that Vishnu is so weak that he cannot resist the domination of Christ? Whatever we see: emergence of a leader; an event; a person; a concept – vidya or avidya; a vice; a virtue, all emanate from the Supreme Being -- Maha Vishnu only. However, some people call him Prophet Muhammad. And some people call it Tao. Repeated and vehement reference to Vedas will not help. Both Rudra and Vishnu appear as minor gods in Rig Veda. Indra is the chief. That is just for appearance. God himself has written Vedas, so will he write to glorify himself? Only men who have not seen god glorify themselves. God works silently without claiming any fame. Gita clarifies that only the Lord is the doer. Despite glorious tribute to several deities Rig Veda succintly claims “ekam satviprah bahudha vadanti” (The truth is One, sages call it by various names, 1.164.46). In Rig Veda, Vishnu who pervades everything is just an Aditya (out of 12 Adityas)– a reference to all pervading divine light. Rudra, on the other hand is not part of anything but is a class in himself and his quality is that he is undefeatable. Rig Veda does not clarify the role of Rudra further except that is the only undefeatable God. He is also father of Maruts who assist Indra to rule. Yajur Veda however begins to clarify that Rudra wields the divine light as Vishnu shastra and similarly he also wields Vayu and also Indra etc. In Shree Rudram, Rudra is shown as Indra and Aditya. Rudra is also called as Vishnu who pervades everything. Dear friends may please confirm the last sloka in the Rudram. In Upanishads the status of Brahman is given to Uma-Mahadeva who appears in the beginning and at the end. What remains after dissolution to start another cycle is param Brahman and no icon suits this knowledge better than the image of dancing Nataraja. These images are created by the Lord himself and so they last. But again, name and forms are not important but the underlying principle and meanings are. Narayana also appears as Purusha who is an integral part of Brahman. Sesha only gets to see the dissolution when Vishnu goes to yoga nidra. I will not mention Tantras, but even in Bhagavatam: Shiva consumes the poison. Who but the greatest bears the heaviest load? Who but the greatest sacrifices the most? To say that only the slokas dealing with Vishnu were written by svattwic people or the Lord himself while Shree Rudram or Svetaavatara Upanishad were written by tamasic mortal men will be wrong. The Gita clarifies that only the Lord is the doer. What I have attempted is to bring out the meanings and not to lower any image. The Vedas state Supreme god -- param Braham to be Naryana. But Vedas also state that Rudra is param Brahman. Understand the meaning friends. Param Brahman is the underlying non-dual truth. Sages who abide in God continuously: Trailanga Nath, Ramakrishna, Maharshi Ramana state so. I remember a sweet smiling Vasudeva as the supreme god – the param Brahman, the same as Shiva. The beauty of Vasudeva brings tears to my eyes, invoking the spirit of pure goodness. But for me, when I face a higher problem associated with a vice, I cannot help but remember the supreme yogi yet bhogi, immobile yet the rhythm itself, fierce yet calm, inauspicious yet supremely auspicious Shiva who invokes the meaning of an ever constant and ever present Lord, who controls everything – the vice and virtue both. Undoubtedly, for many people Vishnu evokes the same. Shiva tells his lovers: Apparent decay and destruction need not be feared. The seed dies to live as a plant; the passions and sensuous thoughts of man must die to live as a conscious entity in Eternity. Once this is recognized, all destruction is seen not merely as inevitable, but as beautiful, for it reveals the sacrificial aspect of life, unconscious in the lower kingdoms, to be consciously recognized and used by the human being. During the Vigil Night of Shiva, Mahashivaratri, we are brought to the moment of interval between destruction and regeneration; it symbolizes the night when we must contemplate on that which watches the growth out of the decay. We have to look behind and before (with Shiva in our heart), to see what evil needs eradicating from our heart, what growth of virtue we need to encourage. Such a dark night of the soul comes to all of us; it is a time when desolation lies before and behind us, and in the burning-ground of the heart there seems no life. No one escapes this dark night. Even the Christ suffered in the Garden of Gethsemane. To keep before us the memory of Shiva's dance will save us from despair and give us the courage to pass on. Friends, when any one of you has to face such a dark night of soul when all seems lost, you feel choked and death seems the only escape, then Shiva will appear to carry you along and He will caringly impart knowledge to you. Such nights are not welcome nights, if unaided by Shiva. The image of trinity is also given by the gods, to reveal to us the truth in stages. Please do not comment that the trinity is tamasic as someone has commented about Mahabharata. To claim that god only does this and not that is to limit God. Maha Vishnu will not like that since he has stated in Gita that everything is Him and He alone is the doer. Shiva tells the same thing to Devi in Devikalottara. I conclude that finally everyone will know that Shiva is Vishnu and Vishnu is Shiva. Sincere devotion to any God will take one to the One Resplendent Being. That only is important. My dear Vaishnav friends may now hurl many Vishnu ashtra at me (as Rudra does to destroy Tripura). However, I have requested Vasudeva to protect me and I know that he will. By the way Param Brahman is not Brahma as Mr. Gokul seems to believe. But Brahma is Param Brahman. Can you understand this?

All dear believers I have come to love the fight among the faithful adherents of different gods. No doubt what happens happens with His will. Salvation, for many will come through such intense devotional fight. Out of intense love for Vasudeva or Siva or Shakti or Ganapati or Skanda, some may not be able to sleep and may prepare arguments staying awake. There is intense feeling because each one loves god in his own way and god cannot but reward such devotion. I know this truth because I have seen light of the path. If a Vaishnavaite feels that Vishnu is the supreme God, Vishnu indeed is. Vishnu carries such a devotee lovingly to salvation and only after attaining salvation one will know the truth. The same applies to Saivaites. Devotion is required to gain attention of Vishnu. On salvation, the image that a vaishnavaite has of Maha Vishnu sitting on a throne and guiding the work of other gods will clear away to show one resplendent god which encompasses all Adityas and Rudras. My vaishnav friends will tell “Yes, the one resplendent being is Vishnu and none else”. True. But will it matter if someone else calls that being as Devi or Siva or Tao? What is there in a name, except the meaning associated with the sound? The image of Maha Vishnu sitting on a throne and guiding the work of other gods, if true, makes Vishnu very weak. Despite his lordship, the Christ appears to rule the world and Uma-Mahesvar appears to rule India. Even prophet Muhammad will beat both Siva and Vishnu. Do you want to say that Vishnu is so weak that he cannot resist the domination of Christ? Whatever we see: emergence of a leader; an event; a person; a concept – vidya or avidya; a vice; a virtue, all emanate from the Supreme Being -- Maha Vishnu only. However, some people call him Prophet Muhammad. And some people call it Tao. Repeated and vehement reference to Vedas will not help. Both Rudra and Vishnu appear as minor gods in Rig Veda. Indra is the chief. That is just for appearance. God himself has written Vedas, so will he write to glorify himself? Only men who have not seen god glorify themselves. God works silently without claiming any fame. Gita clarifies that only the Lord is the doer. Despite glorious tribute to several deities Rig Veda succintly claims “ekam satviprah bahudha vadanti” (The truth is One, sages call it by various names, 1.164.46). In Rig Veda, Vishnu who pervades everything is just an Aditya (out of 12 Adityas)– a reference to all pervading divine light. Rudra, on the other hand is not part of anything but is a class in himself and his quality is that he is undefeatable. Rig Veda does not clarify the role of Rudra further except that is the only undefeatable God. He is also father of Maruts who assist Indra to rule. Yajur Veda however begins to clarify that Rudra wields the divine light as Vishnu shastra and similarly he also wields Vayu and also Indra etc. In Shree Rudram, Rudra is shown as Indra and Aditya. Rudra is also called as Vishnu who pervades everything. Dear friends may please confirm the last sloka in the Rudram. In Upanishads the status of Brahman is given to Uma-Mahadeva who appears in the beginning and at the end. What remains after dissolution to start another cycle is param Brahman and no icon suits this knowledge better than the image of dancing Nataraja. These images are created by the Lord himself and so they last. But again, name and forms are not important but the underlying principle and meanings are. Narayana also appears as Purusha who is an integral part of Brahman. Sesha only gets to see the dissolution when Vishnu goes to yoga nidra. I will not mention Tantras, but even in Bhagavatam: Shiva consumes the poison. Who but the greatest bears the heaviest load? Who but the greatest sacrifices the most? To say that only the slokas dealing with Vishnu were written by svattwic people or the Lord himself while Shree Rudram or Svetaavatara Upanishad were written by tamasic mortal men will be wrong. The Gita clarifies that only the Lord is the doer. What I have attempted is to bring out the meanings and not to lower any image. The Vedas state Supreme god -- param Braham to be Naryana. But Vedas also state that Rudra is param Brahman. Understand the meaning friends. Param Brahman is the underlying non-dual truth. Sages who abide in God continuously: Trailanga Nath, Ramakrishna, Maharshi Ramana state so. I remember a sweet smiling Vasudeva as the supreme god – the param Brahman, the same as Shiva. The beauty of Vasudeva brings tears to my eyes, invoking the spirit of pure goodness. But for me, when I face a higher problem associated with a vice, I cannot help but remember the supreme yogi yet bhogi, immobile yet the rhythm itself, fierce yet calm, inauspicious yet supremely auspicious Shiva who invokes the meaning of an ever constant and ever present Lord, who controls everything – the vice and virtue both. Undoubtedly, for many people Vishnu evokes the same. Shiva tells his lovers: Apparent decay and destruction need not be feared. The seed dies to live as a plant; the passions and sensuous thoughts of man must die to live as a conscious entity in Eternity. Once this is recognized, all destruction is seen not merely as inevitable, but as beautiful, for it reveals the sacrificial aspect of life, unconscious in the lower kingdoms, to be consciously recognized and used by the human being. During the Vigil Night of Shiva, Mahashivaratri, we are brought to the moment of interval between destruction and regeneration; it symbolizes the night when we must contemplate on that which watches the growth out of the decay. We have to look behind and before (with Shiva in our heart), to see what evil needs eradicating from our heart, what growth of virtue we need to encourage. Such a dark night of the soul comes to all of us; it is a time when desolation lies before and behind us, and in the burning-ground of the heart there seems no life. No one escapes this dark night. Even the Christ suffered in the Garden of Gethsemane. To keep before us the memory of Shiva's dance will save us from despair and give us the courage to pass on. Friends, when any one of you has to face such a dark night of soul when all seems lost, you feel choked and death seems the only escape, then Shiva will appear to carry you along and He will caringly impart knowledge to you. Such nights are not welcome nights, if unaided by Shiva. The image of trinity is also given by the gods, to reveal to us the truth in stages. Please do not comment that the trinity is tamasic as someone has commented about Mahabharata. To claim that god only does this and not that is to limit God. Maha Vishnu will not like that since he has stated in Gita that everything is Him and He alone is the doer. Shiva tells the same thing to Devi in Devikalottara. I conclude that finally everyone will know that Shiva is Vishnu and Vishnu is Shiva. Sincere devotion to any God will take one to the One Resplendent Being. That only is important. My dear Vaishnav friends may now hurl many Vishnu ashtra at me (as Rudra does to destroy Tripura). However, I have requested Vasudeva to protect me and I know that he will. By the way Param Brahman is not Brahma as Mr. Gokul seems to believe. But Brahma is Param Brahman. Can you understand this?

Although it is a beautifully maintained site, I possibly registered to a wrong site. Though no offence is meant, but surely this site is full of ego -- not entirely conducive of good thoughts. From Mr. Krishna's writings it seems that he has seen Maha Vishnu ruling over other gods. We must understand that denigrating a god in whom others believe is denigratiing one's own deity. I am attaching a small note, i hope, for the benefit of all. Rarely does one speak of unity and oneness of all Gods. Often, articles appear parochial, claiming supremacy of one god over other. Thus, I was motivated to write this piece, highlighting a gift that India is capable of bestowing on the world. Modern physicists know that a set of proton-antiproton-pion particles can evolve out of void and again resolve into the void. Such creation, apparently out of nothing, goes on all the time. Physicists now know that what we call void is repository of all forms and unlimited energy. But physicists only have a hint but no definite knowledge that the void is also conscious and intelligent. God is this non-dual void equipped with infinite consciousness. No one will ever know the equations that govern the super intelligent void. A report written by me will not know me but I will know the report. This is advaita philosophy, known to India since Upanishads -- greatest contribution of India’s numerous sages. The concept of trinity: Brahma as creator, Vishnu as sustainer, and Mahesh as destroyer, is a concept of forms, like we perceive the essence of water as liquid, gas or ice under different conditions. Which of these is greater and which comes first are wrong questions. If Vishnu, gives birth to Brahma who in turn creates Rudra, then who again will create Vishnu? Surely Rudra. This is hinted in Shree Rudram: Prostrations to the one who is the eldest and the youngest. Prostrations to the primordial cause and the subsequent effect. Prostrations to the eternal youth; who is also the infant. Prostrations to the one who is in the loins and in the roots. Prostrations to the one present in vice and virtue and all that is dynamic. The truth is that the form of the creator Brahma-Saraswati cannot exist without the existence of the form of Uma-Mahadeva. These forms are interlinked and they pray to each other, fully aware that non-dual Brahman underlies each form. But we interpret the Puranic stories to claim dominance of one over another. In Bhagabhatam – a vaishnavite lore, Shiva is shown to have consumed the poison Halahala to save the world. Who but the master of the house bears the heaviest responsibility? There is another story in Valmiki’s Ramayana. Once, Brahma instigated a quarrel between Vishnu and Shiva. Brahma said to Rudra “Vishnu wielded himself as the arrow that you shot to demolish Tripura. So Vishnu is greater”. Shiva retorted that Vishnu was the mere instrument whereas he himself was the master of the instrument. This Brahma conveyed to Vishnu, who took up arms and challenged Rudra to a fight. At this challenge Rudra became sthanu – immobile. Valmiki at the conclusion of the story commented that there was no doubt as to who was the greatest. Do we know what Valmiki meant? Many vaishnavaites cite this example as a proof of overwhelming superiority of Vishnu over Shiva. But, would it have been prudent of Rudra to get engaged in a battle that caused untimely dissolution of the universe? Will I retaliate or will I retreat, if my brother or my child, during a fit of anger over a petty ego issue, challenges me to a mortal duel that will finish everything off? These great stories are repositories of great wisdom. In cases where dissolution of the Universe is required Shiva does his dance. And also, in cases where fury is required but will not cause untimely dissolution of the Universe, Rudra acts, as in the case of Daksha’s yagna that combined force of other gods could not protect. However, Shiva knows how great Vishnu or Brahma is. Each one of them knows the superiority of the other under specific circumstance. When Nara-Narayana (incarnation of Vishnu) prayed to Shiva, he appeared and said that it is he who should pray to Nara-Narayana. Similarly, in Skanda purana, Shiva tells Kartikeya that he meditates all the time on shalgram-shila – an icon of Vishnu. The truth is that the non-dual all pervading God knows which form to assign the leadership at a given time. The stories are symbolic: to stir initiate devotees to love towards chosen deity but they also veil greater wisdom. We, in our small sectarian view fight each other. India does not own the trinity rather the underlying non-dual truth beneath the trinity is the Universe. The principle of the trinity is universal and not merely Indian. India can impart this glorious knowledge to the world if we ourselves soar above our pettiness.