bhaktatraveler

Your rejection is sweet to my ears, that means sin is flowing out of the way for DVD to take birth, Just like Pritu Maharaja's apperance after bahukah, the embodyment of sin cleared the way.

 

Who can say if a cow is ever killed? I can. Want to know? Do you know? Do you read SB? Have fun on line. S-its and Giggles

 

CB-r

What about the killing a cow question? I asked you because you are so inteligent as to know all siddhanta and the meanings of everything I posted. And said I was all wrong. Surly you know if Srila Prabhupada has said such a thing. Please enlighten me. Anyone?

CB-r

Post where Srila Swami Maharaj says to eat meat in his centers, among his people.

Post where Prabhupada says DON'T eat meat in His DVD centers? I say He has said OK and give evidence. You say no and give nothing. That you reject, I am also doing with your question, that has no prof submited that shows contrary understanding from, what I posted.

CB-r

If you point at the sun a thousand times and say it is an orange, should I believe you? Enough is enough, enjoy your meat eating. Hari Bolo.

Yes you are right, enough from you. Thank you.

CB-r

Post where Srila Swami Maharaj says to eat meat in his centers, among his people.

If I show you a thousand times, you will reject as many times. And you do not study the texts provided. So?

CB-r

Post where Srila Swami Maharaj says to eat meat in his centers, among his people.

Your rejection is sweet to my ears, that means sin is flowing out of the way for DVD to take birth, Just like Pritu Maharaja's apperance after bahukah, the embodyment of sin cleared the way.

Who can say if a cow is ever killed? I can. Want to know? Do you know? Do you read SB? Have fun on line. S-its and Giggles

CB-r

Its really about complete and bogus garbage these idiots are spouting off. They give all kinds of quotes to justify their illusion that they are ksatriyas, but they are dogs, mleccas, diskrtinas. The same discussions they post, (which are not teachings, BTW. These discussions are with those who are trying to control the society, not rank and file devotees.). These discussions all have Srila Prabhupada disrespecting their precious VAD but they dont read that part, and Im not about to interfere with their incessant spamming on this issue. However, how many times do we have to read that we are not saudras, we are vaisnavas. Even in these idiotic proofs the post, Srila Prabhupadas is saying (Not sudra, Vaisnava). The attitude of harisaquri, satswarups et all, is thet they want sudras in their temples to control. They say the one stringing garlands is a sudra, but Srila Prabhupada tells them clearly that they are not.

 

As Far as threats go, this is what the VAD squad always do when they are defeated by sheer beginners in this science. They want to get their guns and hone their skills by some bogus jihad against those who dont accept their administration.

 

So, bhakti king, who are you king of? Since the regs are out the window, Il bet that you arent even king of your own house, let alone anyone else. You are just a wannabe who has no ksatriya qualifications whatsoever, because Arjuna does not want to harm even his grave enemies, and does so only by duty.

 

Srila Prabhupada never designated a disciple into a varna. The asramas were requested by the disciple. VAD was an ideal if the society was to properly function, but not a spiritual science, just a mundane arrangement to make a mundane system work.

 

Those who are possessed by this VAD squad nonsense are not to be3 heard from and cannot preach because they have not even come to the platform of aham brahmasmi. They are still full of "I am the body" consciousness. All the varnas and asramas are false identity designations.

 

Hare Krsna, ys, mahaksadasa

Thank you for the flowery words of discontent. I take it as petals from the sky.

It is just like when the brahmans churned King Vena's thighs and all the sinfull reactions took form. First the adversion will come out, then we will find those that are now hidden in plain sight. It is not you Mahaksha, that I'm looking for. Nor a Theist or Braj. This I know after your posts. But it is interesting to see who is emboding the sinfull reactions.

Hare Krsna, Caturbahu das Bhakti-raja

It was the opinion of Srila Swami Maharaj as well.

 

To be of some value? Srila Swami Maharaj said specifically that Srila Sridhar Maharaj was Om Vishnupada, his siksa guru, "so what to speak of

the benefit that others can have from his association."

 

He wanted to bring others to Srila Sridhar Maharaj:

"Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakur told me that Sridhar Maharaj is one of the finest preachers of Krishna consciousness in the world, so I wanted to take him everywhere. This was my earnest desire. But since he could not go around the world and preach, at least the people of the world should come to hear from him." Again: "So if one is actually serious to take instructions from a siksa guru, or instructing spiritual master, I can refer him to one who is the most competent of all my Godbrothers."Sridhar Maharaj is a pure devotee per Srila Swami Maharaj, your opinion doesn't matter:

"He was always my good advisor, and I took his advice very seriously because from the very beginning I knew that he was a pure devotee of Krishna. So, I wanted to associate with him. Krishna and Prabhupad, Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakur, liked him to prepare me. Our relationship is very intimate."

 

 

 

You try to minimize Guru here, why? Whether the Guru is in a thatched hut on the banks of the Ganga with one disciple or running a worldwide mission, if he is genuine it is Krishna Himself that is empowering him.

 

This is why I said to be careful not to cause offense to Guru Tatva, and why I posted the quote of Srila Swami Maharaj. Not to bring anyone to SCSMath but to eradicate the belief that there is one Guru of highest quality and all other manifestations of Guru are lesser. A true manifestation of Guru is a manifestation of Krishna, you really want to minimize Him?

 

I figured that you guys say to follow Srila Swami Maharaj's instructions 'black and white' but really you cherry pick, you add your emphasis for what is important to your agenda and minimize his words in other places. Was he insincere when speaking of Srila Sridhar Maharaj above? Is that what you are saying?

 

If Srila Swami Maharaj really intends for some disciples to eat meat I have absolutely no issue with that, but I don't think it is conclusive. One place it is mentioned and not specific to initiated disciples, the public was what was being discussed. If it really was his intention and as you say he spoke of it constantly for 4 years, surely you have more proof?

It is asked where to do it and Prabhupada said in our centers, amoung our people. It is just to plan. Post the conversations yourself and show the deviations or why do you speak like a fool? SB 8.2.30 is also used, post it and give a conclusion in context to DVD.

Is any of the adversion, with no other prof but your mouth, the quality of a devotee? I have been called many ill names and made much fun of, but you guys have nothing but mouths and no substance.

Put up these conversations, as I did and give a reasonable retort or be known as ludricus.

CB-r

Frankly if the guest above would have been paying attention he would have noticed the clear fact that while quoting from of Srila Prabhupada's statements it is their spin on those statement's which is being challenged and not the quotes themselves.

 

I do not for one split second regonize the bhakti-king or bhakta mark as representatives of Srila Prabhupada despite their quotes. I find them and those that think like them to be wolves entered into the iskcon camp and are spreading their diseased ideas of meat eatting now being allowed for some members of iskcon.

 

The same quotes are presented over and over ad nauseum and the same errors keep being championed as belonging to Srila Prabhupada and express his new ideas on meat eating. Most people recognize this straight away as full blown ignorance but no doubt people can be fooled and hurt by hearing these ideas from what I suspect to be the animal killing branch of the ritvik tree.

More diatribe, no vani. No reposting the conversations I used as a common ground and proving your speaking from a Guru and not just personal concoctions of old conclutions. Try to keep up with the changes, eh!

Hare Krsna, Caturbahu das Bhakti-raja

Caturbahu prabhu,

 

How many times does it have to be said that DVD isn't at dispute here? Sure, if it is practical to implement DVD in the modern age, then it must be implemented. What is being disputed is your insistence that the 4 regulative principles can somehow be broken. For a sincere aspirant on the path of Krishna consciousness, there can be no compromise in the 4 principles.

 

And as others have pointed out, a Vaisnava killing animals in the modern age for 'practice' is a new concept you're trying to introduce. In any case, please answer the question I already asked ... if practice is all you need, why do you eat the animal after you kill it?

Again and again just cheap talk. Take the conversations sited and show the discrepancy or you just look ludricus.

As for eating meat, what you kill, it is a warrior thing. If you still have to ask, you can't understand the answer is/has been given numerous times in the conversations and Prabhupada's books.

CB-r

Caturabhu prabhu,

 

Killing any living entity is unthinkable for a Vaisnava, regardless of which varna he or she is. Vaisnavas are all compassionate, therefore killing of animals for 'practice' is a nonsensical idea. Eating them afterward is hideous. If practice is all you need, why do you have to eat the dead animal?

 

You seem completely convinced that killing innocent animals & eating them is alright, so I will not attempt to dissuade you. But I must tell you that you've taken a very dangerous path, sure to lead you astray.

It is practically useless to reply to a post like this, but I take the easy bait.

So many times now I'm saying to you nay sayers that DVD it is not my concoction. These are the words of the Guru, A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Maharaja, Srila Prabhupada.

Please take the conversation and SB quotes and show me, through them, the error of my ways. Just so much talk is useless and un-vaisnava. If you have contention with my posts, then please by all means necessary re-read these conversations and tell me how I have it wrong.

Have you read Bhagavad-gita? Spoken on the field of the largest battle in the history of the planet. 64,000,000 or so dead in 18 days. Blood ran like rivers. And who is the central figure in that great book? A Vaisnava Ksatriya. Arjuna, Maharata, killer of 10,000 warriors at a time. Man do you have the wrong religion/spiritual life. We Vaisnavas are not check turners as a whole. Some will kill you. And enjoy the religious/spiritual opprotunity. The ksatriya delights in a religious fight, un-sought.

Hare Krsna, Caturbahu das Bhakti-raja

I'm just sayiong wear a clean kurta, basically. Srila Bhakti Siddhanta was prepared to have meat served to get people to listen to His message.

Well spoken Braj

CB-r

Sometimes its necessary to play devils advocate in order to get someone to reveal their actual position, which is what I have done several times anonymously a little earlier. The DVD Ksatriya deer hunter fallacy is just another Prabhupada-onlyite manifestion which is akin to Rtvikism in that it divorces B.V. Swami Prabhupada from his own guru-varga. Once you get below the surface you find that they have a very prejudiced, negative view of all of Prabhupada's godbrothers and their successors in the guru varga. Once I was at a big North American ISKCON temple for a festival. Some Poison Theory/Rtviks were across the street dressed in battle fatigues handing out flyers. I'm sure that they were also "Survivalists" and possesed firm arms. From there it's just a small leap to deer hunting.

'Deer hunter fallacy' are you a devotee of Krsna? Do you read SB with faith in the words? Have you a clue to the conversations in question? or the regulations/duties of Ksatriya varna? You again make outlandish accusations with no vani support to your claims of impropiorties to my posts. Like so many others you have a mouth, but no support from Guru to back it up.

Put up the relivent purports or conversations or any of Srila Prabhupada's vani on the subject of DVD that will point out I have posted out of context or stop drooling on line please.

Hare Krsna, Caturbahu das Bhakti-raja

QUOTE

When Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura saw that many babajis were now bogus, that they were with widow matajis and producing sons, he became very furious and said that we will again accept the same saffron cloth of others like Ramanujacarya, Madhvacarya, Mahaprabhu, and Isvara Puripada. He then preached everywhere in the world. At that time, those family persons who were of loose character and had no status in society honored these bogus babajis. That is why Srila Prabhupada Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura re-introduced the reddish cloth and sannyasa. Presently, those who are bogus persons, but were previously in the Gaudiya Matha, have become lusty and have thus been kicked out from the Gaudiya Matha. Now they have become babajis.”

QUOTE

 

This is very nice. But after BSST we so dozens of sannyasis fall down, often in unmentionable ways. So what did this change of clothes and titles solve? Now we not only have bogus babajis but we have numerous scandals involving Gaudiya Math and Iskcon sannyasis.

Now it is a DVD point This has to be checked by ksatriyas, that no cheating in the varnas and asrama goes on. Ksatriyas must step in and rearrange this deviant behavior out of the brahminical varna and into the gutter as it should be.

This is the social finction/duty of ksatriya, to check 4 varnas and 4 asramas.

Hare Krsna, Caturbahu das Bhakti-raja

Shakti-fan on Varnashram-dharma said that:

 

Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja said in

Vienna, Austria: September 19, 2002 :

"Most Radha Kunda babajis are doing just that, mixing illicitly with widows and having children with them; they are not doing any real bhajana.

"Do not fall down like them. You should follow your Gurudeva's orders; engage your energy in growing fruits and vegetables to offer to Thakurji or to a pure Vaisnava. You should also chant the holy name, Hare Krsna, Hare Krsna."

 

 

 

 

Reply

 

Only very few “sadhus” in Radha-kunda are in this category, they are usually the exception, by which even the traditional Gaudiya Vaishnavas are bewildered.

The matter of fact they are not babajis. They have never accepted babaji vesha (which is the stage of renunciation similar to sannyasi in other vaishnava sampradayas) from any traditional Gaudiya Vaishnava, and give themselves as "sadhus".

 

Here it is an excerpt from the life of the Gauranga Dasa (Babaji), disciple of Jagadisha Dasa Babaji:

 

Once Gauranga Dasa ji went to Radha-kunda. There he was invited by some "sadhu", whom he had not known before, to stay with him in Radha-kunda for some time. He accepted the invitation. But he had stayed with him only for one night when he discovered that that "sadhu" belonged to a pseudo-religious sect, in which woman and wine were parts of the sadhana. The next morning he left his company. But he found that his heart was empty. The subtle effect of the company of the unholy man had blocked his vision and he was not able to see Krishna-lila. He felt choked like a fish, who suddenly find that the water of the pond in which it lived, has dried up. Immediately he started for the parikrama (circumbulating) of Giri-raja Hill . It was the month of June, when the sun is hottest. He was walking the whole day in the scorching heat of the sun and praying to Giri-raja. In the evening he felt tired and lay down for rest on a step of the staircase of Uddhava-kunda. But he fell asleep. It was dangerous to sleep on the step, because, if he turned sides in sleep, he would fall into the kunda (pond). When he woke up he found that someone had lifted him and laid him at a safer place. He looked all round to see who that person could be. But to his surprise he found that no one was anywhere near that place.

Next day he went to his guru, Jagadisha Dasa Babaji in Vrindavan. No sooner had he laid himself prostrate before his feet than he shouted, “Like a fool you sleep wherever you like. You do not know where to sleep and where not to sleep.”

Gauranga Dasa understood that it was Baba, who had lifted him from the step of Uddhava-kund. This brought him the realization that Gurudeva followed the disciple like a shadow wherever he went and protected him. This realization brought tears in his eyes.

Gauranga Dasa then told Baba about the loss of vision he had suffered on account of his meeting with the so called sadhu in RAdha-kunda, and prayed for his blessings. Baba blessed him and his vision was restored.

 

 

PS

this post has been previously deleted, and there is only an explanation that the rumours that the babajis of Radha-kunda sleep with widows and drink wine has no support, hope nobody got offended.

Are you sure you have the right topic for this post Anadi?

CB-r

ok, you should be very careful not to cause offense to Guru Tatva. I think this is my cue to avoid your association. Hare Krishna Prabhu. I wish the best for you always.

Guru Tatva? What ever.

That I should not speak about Srila Prabhupada's godbrothers is a fact. Even He has used the terminology 'black snake' as discriptive of some, it is not for me to say. It has always been the followers of such Godbrothers actually that I have a bad time with. Like the agresive pitching of one guru over an other or the living Guru trap. Who is their guru that say like that? They are the ones that denegate Srila prabhupada as a senior Godbrother by dint of His amazing preaching success.

And I should remember it is not for me to comment on Prabhupada's favorite Godbrother especially, B R Sridhara Maharaja. Please forgive my mistake.

But his followers are another issue. So if you would like for me to behave, I say the same to you.

CB-r

It is my understanding he appologized to his godbrothers before leaving this plane. It was for you he gave this so your society wouldn't disintegrate as all your godbrothers sought out someone else as Guru. That is my understanding anyway. This isn't a topic I have spent any time studding so I frankly don't know. But anyone thinking the mercy of the Lord is limited should be careful.

You do not understand 'why' an aplogy was given do you? You actually have the idea Srila Prabhupada is some how less than His brothers, when actually, He is so much more.

I apologize to my childeren, even I made no mistake. but that does not make them more than the father. It is for their encouragement, nothing more. The mistakes were not on Prabhupada's part, He spread the chanting of the Maha mantra thtough out the world. No one else even moved untill Prabhupada left and vultures came out to make false claims of grandure in Prabhupada's absents.

The apology was Vaisnava edict.

CB-r

I have read the quotes and I am not refuting Srila Swami Maharaj but your interpretation. It surely is with my own interpretation but we are both allowed. I believe I have shown flexibility in my position and have adjusted accordingly, I just don't reach the same conclusions as you.

OK fine, then show the part you say I have wrong and post your understanding and we can have a nice exchange. If you want. I do not mind. We can use the same conversation snipit.....

I'm wondering when Prabhupada answers the question of where and who, He does give a very plain responce as 'ISKCON' and 'amoung our members'. In another DVD conversation Prabhupada is asked about 4 regs and says yes 'but'. That it is not in one place shouldn't be a problem. So I am mildly currious as to why you say it is unclear. Plus a very nice purport explanation by Srila Prabhupada.

There is much much more but for brevities sake I hesitate to flood this form with all the DVD vani. What is posted should've been enough.

CB-r

I disagree with your interpretation. I agree that a varna has some rights, in that varna according to vedic injunctions they are not bound to the same regulations, but as an initiated devotee, I don't agree the evidence is clear that different regs were laid out for devotees. A devotee is above the varnas and accepts the position in a varna as his service for the necessity of the mission. This is clearly stated.

 

Srila Swami Maharaj said in the varnashrama college that persons living there have to follow rules by their varna, but it is not clear at all to me he is talking about initiated disciples in the varnashrama college. I have the impression from my reading that the devotees would be the teachers (outside the varnas) and these colleges would be open to the public at large to prepare the greater society in the mode of goodness for spiritual life. Preliminary Help and that the ashramas come later, when they are ready to make a commitment and follow vows, like the bhakta programs in ISKCON now but on a much larger scale, maybe more general. So meat eating intoxication etc for uninitiated students would be allowed in some situations. But not for devotees. Though you may make a leap and say he meant that this was for the devotees, I believe there is not enough evidence to say that with certainty, and this definitely requires certainty. What is the harm in being careful here?

 

Maybe an in-depth look at what Srila Swami Maharaj's vision of the Varnashrama Colleges would be helpful.

What you 'think' is one thing, that is for you. But if you want to interpret from an outstanding Guru such as Srila Prabhupada then it is customary on the vaisnava forms to post evidence relative and in context to the topic then refute or give a different view after some study. Are you studying these converstions?

CB-r

It is the truth, spoken by Srila Swami Maharaj himself, that devotees aren't in the varnas. I am 100% correct here. No presumptuous statement, unless he isn't a devotee.

Yes, devotee is not to be concidered in varna the same as non devotee. There is a diference. But not the service/activity of the varna for either. Have you read? I posted a conversation snip-it with this exact item in it.

Hare Krsna, Caturbahu das Bhakti-raja

We must do like that for the management of the temple. How is killing and eating meat involved in the management of the temple?

 

Killing a snake in the garden, fine. Killing gophers eating the bhoga, fine. Wild boars fine, they are a danger to the devotees if on temple property. A thief, fine. Needing to know how to kill if necessary, fine. Learning to kill once is sufficient, that isn't needed on a continuous basis. But going out one day a month with your gun club buddys with a 30 30 to kill a deer I don't see as in any way being related to devotional life or service. For devotional life eating meat is not necessary at all. Because Srila Swami Maharaj is describing what a sudra does in one place doesn't mean he is describing the behavior of a devotee in another.

 

You take Srila Swami Maharaja's words and run with them, you mingle messages and make them seem to mean something that I'm convinced doesn't really exist. You are taking a dangerous road for no good reason. You can preach the DVD thing fine, I'm with you there Prabhu no problem, go ahead and break ISKCON down into varnas and take on service as necessary. But you are saying abandon the regulative principals for some initiated disciples and I don't buy it.

If you do not read or post from offered evidence what can I do for you? Just motoring along with your head out the window. Read what I have posted for you from Srila Prabhupada at least 20-30 times in all these threads. Then say a thing.

CB-r

How is it I never heard "bhakti raja" or any of this DVD nonsense. Is it because this was not divulged in Srila Prabhupadas books, and it is only from brainstorming sessions with his leaders?

 

These revisionists are nonsense. They make up philosophies as they go, initiate themselves, come up with words no one ever heard Srila Prabhupada speak of.

 

What is their motive? Certainly they dont propose to pass on Srila Prabhupada as he is, because he is clear on what it takes to be his disciple.

 

They flock together, cheer each other on, like the sentimental cultists they are. Even the rtviks would have none of their nonsense.

 

Okay, DVDers, what is your position on female vaisnavas? Your answer is what you are made of, BTW, nothing short of life and death.

 

mahaksadasa

My, answer to you is to stuff yourself. Your black. I've made up nothing. I have posted where Srila Prabhupada is definitely saying to do in ISKCON now. Not 'brainstorming' the way your rejecting makes you black in the heart and a danger to those that read your posts. You can not show congruent contextual vani examples to prove any points you make against DVD.

Go to the conversation and prove Prabhupada is just 'talking' Did you read the purport to SB 8.2.30? Is that brainstorming?

Hare Krsna, Catrubahu das Bhakti-raja

You're missing the point entirely, you aren't really a ksatriya.

Yes, we are not any of these varnas, but for management we must do like that. Do you read anything I post from Srila Prabhupada. Did you read 8.2.30 purport? No? Then how can you talk? I'm not saying different, it's you that's inferring differently......

CB-r

Sure, I don't know how many devotees really want to go shoot a deer. Nearly all want to go have sex though.

 

Personally I was a vegetarian for 10 years before I met the devotees, so meat eating was not an attachment of mine. I guess for some killing and eating meat are just as hard to give up as sex.

Your missing the point of ksatriya killing, it is part of what he does. Have you not read any of the Srimad Bhagavatam or Mahabharata? Read the story of Krsna and Arjuna killing any and all of the animals that fled the burning forest in Krsna book. No, the details are in Mahabharata. But it is the same story. Ksatriyas hunt once a month. Eating meat of not, is not the reason for hunting. It is the killing.

For sudra yes it is only about eating meat. You may not have a problem, but you should be kind to those that do and stay within regs only. It is to be accepted in DVD.

CB-r

Ah, but in marriage sex is to make devotees, not to condone sense enjoyment, it may be misused by some like myself as a release valve but it is illicit if we use it in that way. It is meant to be service, grhasta life is some high service as well. It isn't a license for mundane activities. And I can see no service in meat eating. I still disagree with you, I just saw your position misrepresented.

I agree with what you say about sex, good post on that. But meat is never said for sudra to have a redeaming servise. For Ksatriya once a month hunt is to learn to kill.

Anyone can disagree, we still have free will.

CB-r

Revisionism works this way. Of course you never heard it, because he never said it to you. Show me in his books where he says it is okay to eat meat. These nonsense folks come back with this "offer it to Kali" garbage, but they do not include that such worship of the demiogods is condemned by Krsna in BGAII.

 

Prabhupada is never good enough for the likes of such revisionists. They have to have their ksatriya club, a domination trip just like Black keiths hillybilly club, or JTs peaqcekrsnas where with a little LSD, kirtana is so much better.

 

So they get to go hunting, like they have special permission, which they dont. Because there is a story of the hunter, Mgrari, who was the very best at his art. Yet, by influence of Sri Narada Muni, who gave him initial instruction to improve his behavior (Dont trap your prey, kill it instantly), Mgrari was softened that he even became so gentile that insects were protected by him.

 

Nonsense revisionism, has no place in vaisnava teaching, which very strongly proposes that from Vyasadeva to the present acarya(s), there is no changes, nothing revised, etc.

 

Haribol, ys, mahaksadasa.

Your arrogant refusal to accept Srila Prabhupada is the real crime going on here. Your trash talk above has no bases in reality either. It is you that can find nothing in these DVD conversations to refute the conclusions presented and supported with a tremendous amount of vani.........this is one from the books SB 8.2.30

TRANSLATION

Thereafter, because of being pulled into the water and fighting for many long years, the elephant became diminished in his mental, physical and sensual strength. The crocodile, on the contrary, being an animal of the water, increased in enthusiasm, physical strength and sensual power.

PURPORT

In the fighting between the elephant and the crocodile, the difference was that although the elephant was extremely powerful, he was in a foreign place, in the water. During one thousand years of fighting, he could not get any food, and under the circumstances his bodily strength diminished, and because his bodily strength diminished, his mind also became weak and his senses less powerful. The crocodile, however, being an animal of the water, had no difficulties. He was getting food and was therefore getting mental strength and sensual encouragement. Thus while the elephant became reduced in strength, the crocodile became more and more powerful. Now, from this we may take the lesson that in our fight with maya we should not be in a position in which our strength, enthusiasm and senses will be unable to fight vigorously. Our Krishna consciousness movement has actually declared war against the illusory energy, in which all the living entities are rotting in a false understanding of civilization. The soldiers in this Krishna consciousness movement must always possess physical strength, enthusiasm and sensual power. To keep themselves fit, they must therefore place themselves in a normal condition of life. What constitutes a normal condition will not be the same for everyone, and therefore there are divisions of varnasrama—brahmana, kshatriya, vaisya, sudra, brahmacarya, grihastha, vanaprastha and sannyasa. Especially in this age, Kali-yuga, it is advised that no one take sannyasa.

SB. 5.1.24 purport

Sometimes we are criticized because although I am a sannyasi, I have taken part in the marriage ceremonies of my disciples. It must be explained, however, that since we have started a Krishna conscious society and since a human society must also have ideal marriages, to correctly establish an ideal society we must take part in marrying some of its members, although we have taken to the path of renunciation. This may be astonishing to persons who are not very interested in establishing daiva-varnasrama, the transcendental system of four social orders and four spiritual orders. Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura, however, wanted to reestablish daiva-varnasrama. In daiva-varnasrama there cannot be acknowledgement of social status according to birthright because in Bhagavad-gita it is said that the determining considerations are guna and karma, one’s qualities and work. It is this daiva-varnasrama that should be established all over the world to continue a perfect society for Krishna consciousness. This may be astonishing to foolish critics, but it is one of the functions of a Krishna conscious society.

Then like a true desenter to Prabhupada's vani you will say it is out of context or it doesn't say anything about this or that. It is just your adversion welling up in your heart, making it hard. DVD explanations are all through the books and I have not misreresented Srila Prabhupada, you are!

The applied definitions to all that is here in this purport, is in the DVD conversations. 3/12-14/74 and 2/15/77 especially.

Yes, no one hears, I've been saying for decades and you will not listen, then say 'I am Prabhupada's disciple' big puffed up chest. NOT. You would not get away with this on a form that had only Prabhupada men. You would be black balled as a heritic.

Give counter conclusion from the evidence in these DVD conversations or surrender or be black.

CB-r