Hi SubramanyamJi and Mark,

1)What are you trying to say is yet a very much valid
point.but don't you think till someone comes to you
and knocks your head you will never come to know what
you are doing is right or wrong.

Every person due to his instincts thinks what he is
doing is right,may be betraying
someone,killing,getting angry on someone,screwing
someone etc etc.

Amazing part of is that he thinks because what he is
doing is nothing to do with his problems in other part
of Life.for example a girl having an affair with a Guy
and enjoying those little moments in grief or
happiness,never thinks why her domestic life is
shattered.she takes both thing differently and in
futher life leads to her own disaster.

These is where astrology or guru in one's life help
him a lot,which tells him what is a true way of
living.astology can be Guru of someone who doesn't
have any.

2)Everyone wants to be a perfect as you said,Very much
true,because we are imperfect we are born and reborn
in order to achieve perfection and it is very much
time dependant,path and sincerity of a individual.A
individual needs to understand a living as a generic
term and see both faces of a coin.If you become too
selfish with yourself,than obviously you will end up
in grief.

3)You mentioned our instincts change with time,It may
be happening to you,But in general it is not so,people
think what they are doing is very much correct and
reason for grief is all karma and nothing else and he
goes on doing it repetedly and end up with nothing.
That's where astrology or spiritual Guruji show's
insight and tells what is correct and what is
wrong.For a time being things what we are doing brings
happiness,But same are responsible for aour long grief
and that's what most of people don't understand,they
want to leave in present they want,not what is correct
and result is too much grief afterwards.

Leaving in present should be a correct theme of one's
Life,but more into a correct way rather than a way
where life takes us and enjoy for a moment.

--- Mark Kincaid <m.kincaid@...> wrote:

> Dear Mark,
>
> So, how exactly do we go about strengthening our
> malefics?
> ........
>
>
> Dear Subrahmanyam:
>
> See below:
>
>
>
> From: subrahmanyam <konqueror3k@...>
> Reply-To: JoeTischResearchProject (AT) yahoogroups (DOT) com
> Date: Mon, 4 Apr 2005 14:21:10 -0700 (PDT)
> To: JoeTischResearchProject (AT) yahoogroups (DOT) com
> Subject: Re: [JoeTischResearchProject] Re:
> 2-Sbrahmanyam, re... My intro. >
> Mark K.
>
>
> Dear Mark,
>
> So, how exactly do we go about strengthening them?
> I will put forward my understanding based on your
> mails in the vedic-astro group.
> Please correct me.
>
> 1) Any particular "maleficness" or "beneficness" in
> our charts, tends to "show itself" as an instinct in
> ourselves.
>
> Well said. We can also say that the maleficness
> that's in our
> charts....also....
> stands for mistaken notions of bad habits, as well
> as inclinations, and
> thought patterns.
>
>
> 2) So, "maleficness" of a planet is actually the
> "maleficness" of our instinct in matters relating to
> that planet.
>
> Yes, yes! But don't forget these 'intincts' of
> ours.... in essence,
> represent those areas within us
> that we're meant to change and grow within.
>
> Instinct doesn't mean forever, it just means
> tendency, or quality or
> characteristic...
>
> The benefics on the other hand stand for the
> qualities, tendencies and
> characteristics that we have,
> that are balanced or in-tune with Nature.
>
>
>
> 3) By observing and learning which "instincts" of
> ours
> are actually the ones leading to trouble, we can get
> an insight into which "planets" are responsible for
> it.Ofcourse, astro principles will tell us the same.
>
> yes yes... However, Astrology principles don't
> tell us 'how' to change our
> malefics,...
>
> Traditionally Astrology says these are our benefics
> and these our
> malefics...
>
> But, I've realized there's an essential wisdom to
> gaining this better,
> Jyotish discrimination...
> regarding which of our 'instincts' are benefic and
> which one's malefic.
>
>
> 4) So, observing the malefic traits, and trying to
> control them is the obvious way out of trouble.
>
> Yes, this is one good insight. However, there's
> also the possibility of
> radically improving and even,
> changeing our so-called 'bad' instincts....into
> their better, or benefic
> counter-selves!
>
>
>
> Ok, now where does astrology fit in?
> Surely we dont need to know astrology to observe
> ourselves and "know" where the problem is.
>
> Astrology is really just that, another name for life
> itself.
>
> Whether someone understand their 'Astrology' or not,
> they're still living
> the realities, of having
> strengths and weaknesses, inside...
>
> The key to Life!
>
> is...that we learn how to transform ourselves into
> our more healthy, higher,
> or benefic Self!
>
> Astrology, just improves our ability to do this.
>
> It can be done without Astrology, but it's generally
> a lot harder....
>
> With Astrology, and the clarity of mind and the
> certaintly that comes when
> you realize that your insights and
> conclusions,...are verified by the
> realities of your chart...
>
> only goes to strengthen one's ability to change and
> improve.
>
>
>
> My understanding is that, our instincts do change
> over
> time, and gets reflected in the transits etc. So,
> knowing them "beforehand" gives us a "look ahead"
> into
> what we can expect, and be prepared.
> Is this correct?
>
> Our instincts can improve over time, but they don't
> improve miraculously by
> themselves...
>
> They improve because we want to improve them.
>
> They improve because we have the will to change, to
> improve, and create
> greater success.
>
> Someone once said: "Knowledge is the greatest
> purifier."
>
> I love this quote, because it's been my experience
> that as I've grown in the
> increasing knowledge
> and wisdom of Jyotish, it's had an amazing exprience
> on improving each and
> every aspect of my life!
>
>
> In my case, i have observed some trends that get me
> into trouble.Lack of patience is my enemy !
> However, i have a hard time trying to change my
> "instinct"s,
> ("instinct" is afterall "instinct").
>
> You're right, generally it's found to be fairly
> difficult to change our
> instincts, sometimes.
>
>
> I am conscious of my "shortcomings", but some where
> deep down, i dont want to change them !
>
> But, you said it perfectly, here!
>
> It is because, 'somewhere deep' inside, we don't
> want to change...
>
> However, it's actually that somewhere inside, we
> grew to believe that our
> present course, or actions, is the best thing we can
> do to pursue our
> desires.
>
> However, when we start to get a glimmer, as you said
> above regarding
> 'impatience'.... that...
>
> that very instinct might itself, be the real
> problem!
>
> Then, when you get that idea, then things will begin
> to change!
>
>
>
> I consider it as the beauty of "humanness", to have
> both sides, and not be "perfect".
> I dont know why this is the case !
>
> I think I know what you mean, but it's also our
> humanness to grow towards
> more and more...
>
> Perfection may be a concept that's too big to
> consider at this point, but I
> think most will agree,
> it's at least possible to improve and get better and
> better....
>
> That, after all, is the real essence of human life!,
> to grow,....to improve
> and to succeed....
>
> It's the challenge and the path, that attracts us,
> and that ....we're on....
>
> It's the lack of ability or wisdom as to exactly
> 'how' to do this, that's at
> the real heart of all our
> misries, and sufferings....
>
>
>
> Now, am i unhappy?
> I am at times. But ever since i have realised that
> gains/losses (happiness/sadness) are just a
> "feeling"
> of the mind, life has become much happier(in the
> conventional sense).
>
> And 'that' changeing attitude that you've
> encountered, which by the way is a
> very good Saturn insight! hehhe, is part of the
> reason why greater happiness
> is beginning to come to you!
>
>
>
>
> Please correct me and add more to this line of
> thought, if you wish.
>
> Wonderful converstation.... One of the best I've
> had in a long time.
>
> I love the Philosophy of Jyotish transformation...
>
> It's at the very heart of my and Nature's
> Jyotish/Astrology....
>
>
>
>
> Sincerely,
> Subra.
>
> Ciao
>
>
> Mark Kincaid
>
>
> ps ..... for those of you who have an interest to
> join our discussion and/or
> jyotish research project
> please go to:
>
>
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JoeTischResearchProject/
>
> to join.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --- Mark Kincaid <m.kincaid@...> wrote:
>
> > Dear Subrahmanyam:
> >
> > Learning how to improve ourselves through the
> > special perspectives of
> > Jyotish, is one of the
> > greatest things I've experienced in this life.
> >
> > First step is learning to 'feel' the realities of
> > our charts.
> >
> > Once you get to a point where you can say: "my
> > chart fits me"!, then,
> > we can really begin the process of Jyotish
> > transformation.
> >
> > See below:
> >
> >
> > > From: subrahmanyam <konqueror3k@...>
> > > Date: Mon, 4 Apr 2005 12:38:27 -0700 (PDT)
> > > To: Mark Kincaid <m.kincaid@...>
> > > Subject: Re: 2-Sbrahmanyam, re... My intro. >
> Mark
> > K.
> > >
> > > Hi Mark,
> > >
> > > My details:
> > >
> > > DOB: 24th June 1984 (too young?)
> > > TOB: 13:15 (not rectified.+/- 5min error,
> hospital
> > > record)
> > > time Zone: GMT+0530 (IST)
> > > no daylight savings etc.
> > > POB: Guntur, India
> > > 80E27 , 16N18
> > >
> > > Virgo rising. Asc: 25Vi00
> > >
> > > Some past trends:
> > >
> > > 1)Been outstanding in academics all through
> until
> > 2001
> > > 2)2001 aug- 2003 mid, very very lethargic, spent
> > time
> > > thinking, thinking abt life and existence of
> GOD,
> > > which has changed my outlook forever.
> > > 3)2003-2004.. lots of health issues.. some virus
> > or
> > > the other
> > > 4) Got job offer in july 2004.
> > >
> > > best time of my life: 98 jan to 2001 april.
> > > It was very good.
> > >
> > > General characteristics:
> > > -----------------------
> > > 1)I am usually at extremes. no middle ground.
> > > too passionate or too lethargic.
> >
> > ((Personally, I think this is due to your Mars &
> > Saturn, being together,...
> > in the same house/sign.))
> >
> >
> > > 2)Very unskilled in social relations (forming or
> > > maintaining)
> >
> > ((Interesting way in which you said this.
> >
> > The situation of Venus being so close to the Sun,
> in
> > your chart, I think,
> > expresses this 'confusion'....
> >
> > Venus is the planet of relationships and when
> Venus
> > is combust, it can
> > represent
> > such an experience...))
> >
> >
> > > 3)very close to family.
> >
> > This may be due to Jupiter being in Sagittarius in
> > your 4th house...
> > And, from there, Jupiter aspects Moon, which
> > represents mother...too...
> >
> > > 4)NEVER get what i wish for really.
> >
> > This is definitely Mars & Saturn, the two planets
> > that determine
> > fulfillments of desire.
> > being too close together....
> >
> > However, i get
> > > lucky a lot of times on things i dont give much
> > > importance to.
> >
> > 'Luckiness', is definitely a Jupiter quality!
> >
> >
> > > 5)Usually have something or the other on my mind
> > that
> > > bothers me.
> >
> > When you listen to the words we use, or the
> thoughts
> > we have, you can 'hear'
> > the
> > specific Planets being expressed!
> >
> > 'something or other, on my mind,...that bothers
> > me'...
> >
> > is so classic Moonish.
> >
> > Moon represents the mind, and Moon's in the 8th
> > house,
> > and Moon, there, is being fully aspecting 7 houses
> > away or by Mars &
> > Saturn...
> >
> > So, their confusion, or tension, directly aspects
> > your Moon, or mind....!
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > > I believe it is Mars+Saturn(R) in 2nd and Moon
> in
> > > Marana karaka sthana, with Saturn aspect which
> > explain
> > > a lot of features.
> >
> > Voila! you're right....
> >
> >
> > > I have been trying to read through Mark's mails
> on
> > > Vedic-Astro group and understand the effects of
> > the
> > > malefic planets and how to "read" their
> > maleficness
> > > and act accordingly(control them).
> > > Suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
> >
> > Once we identify the problem,.. then we can get a
> > glimmer,...into
> >
> > which planets we can strengthen, to improve those
> > areas of our lives...
> >
> > Strengthening or balancing Mars & Saturn, I think
> > would be a great area for
> > you to begin...
> >
> > >
> > > Sincerely,
> > > Subra.
> > >
> >
> > Sincerely,
> >
> >
> > Mark Kincaid
> >
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > __________________________________
> > > Do you Yahoo!?
> > > Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources
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> >
> >
>
>
>
>
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