MC....

Me thinks you lack knowledge what a sahajiya truly is.




[This message has been edited by jijaji (edited 06-08-2001).]

That is true.I have only a general definition, that is of one who takes devotional service in a cheap way.That is the group I belong to at present.

I also understand that there are particular groups with their own invented practices, that have been a disturbibg element in Indian society in various ways.

Perhaps jijaji would start a thread that explains one or more sahajiya groups in some detail.

MC

I agree that PD confusion should not be used to smear him....but....he has already taken diksa in the lineage he states on his website, is that not enough for him?
That is my point! He has his affiliation in this line, therefore why does he continue to window shop other Gaudiyas. If he was not initiated that would be another thing.
I await your reply
sevaka.

We are all individuals....thank GOD!





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PEACE NOW

Sevaka,

There are persons of many different natures in this world. So when you bring up my inability to decide what guru to follow, I wonder how much you have learnt about human nature in life.

It is not forbidden to have doubts, to question. After some time of doubting, and getting answers, I have reached a conclusion.

P D

Sevaka
We are all individuals....thank GOD!

MC..
sorry dude...sahajiya thread not bein started by this guy..(why beat a dead horse?)
But be my guest..your idea anyway! Your the one getting into it with Premananda saying Radharamana was sahajiya and all!
You start saying these things and then admit you know very little about the subject and then try to get me to start a thread on the subject.
Is this how you get your entertainment?




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PEACE NOW

[This message has been edited by jijaji (edited 06-08-2001).]

jijaji, But I admit to the lack of info.You claim to have it.My idea is for you, the one who professes to know to share the knowledge.For two years now at almost regular intervals you offer me this same post.Are you on a timer or what?

By the way I am not getting into it with PD as my above posts clearly state.

Maybe if you took off the shades your reading would improve.

MC

MC..

It's not brain science dude...Like I said(why beat a dead horse) some people just don't get it.


Premananda...

sorry dude I have to run....hope all is well

MC

bye bye...

You're mistaken. Maitreya never did say anyone was a sahajiya. He simply provided a quote from Sri Prabhupada on the subject. Perhaps you should take more time to read carefully before accusing others.

Premananda
No it is not forbidden to have doubts, I'm sure all of us do at some point and for that much I'm with you, but after making a choice, as you have done, and although I may have my reasons as to dispute your choice I will not dispute the fact that you have made one.
My query is that you are championing the cause of caran dasa babaji whom your guru no doubt rejects as his param guru does and along with all other Gaudiya groups, surely we are to respect the guru and take into account who he suggests we should take inspiration from and not leave it up to our imperfect minds?
By the way could you infrom me about Gadadhara Prana's preaching that Gaura Nagara Bhava is the highest zenith of spirituality, I know that he has writen a book on the topic.
sevaka

Oh yeah, for what its worth, I don't think its necessary to bring up people's personal choices in discussing a philosophical point. We've all been making thousands of spiritual mistakes in our countless previous lives. I hope no one will hold that against us to dismiss our philosophical discussions.

Philosophy is quite independent from us. We are followers of a philosophy. Whether it is right or wrong has nothing to do with us. Therefore in judging a philosophy, its pointless to bring up the case of a practitioner.

Besides, as Sri Prabhupada has said, even those who are chanting concoted mantras attain states of transcendental bliss. I'm chanting a bonafide mantra and haven't got there yet. So I sure won't be the first to criticize any babaji who is doing sincere sadhana.

Sevaka,

And of what benefit is that information for the readers, Sir?

I admit that I have been very indecisive about which line I am going to follow. So what? That is nobody else´s problem.

The only purpose of your posting is to make me look like an idiot, and I admit that I am.
You should perhaps think about your own character. You who sit there and judge me and want to make me look like a fool. I feel sorry for you if it gives you any pleasure.

By the way, who are you if I may ask? It is proper to present oneself at least when writing about something so personal.

P D



[This message has been edited by premananda (edited 06-08-2001).]

Dear Premananda,

I agree with you totally. Who you follow is your choice and is not pertinent to this discussion. I also agree that vaishnava saints are inspiring. May we all be blessed with honesty, integrity, humility and, above all, a serving attitude.

Your servant,
Audarya lila dasa

Thanks for understanding, Audarya Lila dasa ji. The main thing to understand, as always, is that Sri Sri Radha-Krishna have always been in the centre. Every human being questions his choices sometimes. I have been very doubtful at times. But now I see things a lot clearer. It might have to do with age, that one realizes that time is short in this world and one´s direction in spiritual life has to be clear.

P D

In checking the few recorded statements Srila Prabhupada made on this I found his complaint against this mantra is that it doesn't include the full pancha-tattva.He also said it was manufactured with rasabhasa, but choose not to elaborate.He saw no need but to follow what had been previously given.

TRANSLATION CC ADI 8.22

Whether he is offensive or inoffensive, anyone who even now chants sri-krsna-caitanya prabhu-nityänanda is immediately overwhelmed with ecstasy, and tears fill his eyes.

PURPORT

The präkrta-sahajiyäs who chant nitäi-gaura rädhe syäma have very little knowledge of the Bhägavata conclusion, and they hardly follow the Vaisñava rules and regulations, and yet because they chant bhaja nitäi-gaura, their chanting immediately evokes tears and other signs of ecstasy. Although they do not know the principles of Vaisñava philosophy and are not very much advanced in education, by these symptoms they attract many men to become their followers. Their ecstatic tears will of course help them in the long run, for as soon as they come in contact with a pure devotee their lives will become successful. Even in the beginning, however, because they are chanting the holy names of nitäi-gaura, their swift advancement on the path of love of Godhead is very prominently visible.
Ädi 8.22

[This message has been edited by Maitreya (edited 06-08-2001).]

To call Sri Radharamancharan das Babaji a sahajiya is rather drastic. ACBSP´s critique of the Bhaja Nitai Gaur chant only shows that he and his guru didn´t understand its meaning.

P D

Hare Krsna.
Thank you for your replies.
I mean no offence by what I posted. all I wished to point out is that you bring up these points of discusion that if you were faithful to your line you would not be persuing. A follower of Bhaktivinode has no business with Radharamanacaran dasa babaji or his followers. Not that we should just offend them for the sake of it but we have no business in their line or way of interpreting instructions.
This is what I meant. You are in the line of Bhaktivinode but you post all these things about other babajis who the Thakur would no doubt have rejected. Are we to enter into serious discussion with one who cannot make up his mind whose side he is on?
Trinad api sunicena may mean that we offer respects to others at a distance but that is where they should stay to us, we should not, in the name of unity, confuse ourselves in the forest of Gaudiya misunderstanding. We need Guru Nistha, that means that what our divine guardian says, we follow. Not that we think "oh I can look around and collect information but not be bewildered" We will end up not knowing which way to turn.
I am in the Bhaktivinode parivara following in the line of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta so you may not aggree with me on many points, but every group would say that we should stay within the group we find our faith in and not think that we can go it better alone.
Vaisnava dasa
sevaka

Sevaka,

Who are you? We can continue this discussion via e-mail instead. Or are you such a coward that you are afraid to tell me who you are?

P D

ok you can mail me at syamananda@hotmail.com.
Syamananda is not my name either by the way.
sevaka