NOI, Text 6: bad complexion

01-08-2007, 03:03 AM

I agree with Braja Sevaki's analysis. Whenever I read the verse, I always
visualize an acne-filled face, or psorisis (spelling?), or pockmarks.
Although I lived in South Africa for twenty years during the heydays of
apartheid, I never even thought of equating "bad complexion" with skin
color.

Your servant,
Visakha Priya dasi

>
> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> > Indeed, one should overlook a devotee's having a body born in a low
> > family, a body with a bad complexion, a deformed body, or a diseased or
> > infirm body.
> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> >
> >
> > I wonder how to render "bad complexion" in Dutch. Throughout Srila
> > Prabhupada's books "complexion" refers to "skin colour" (at least in the
> > word-for-word translations; "golden complexion", "having a complexion
> > resembling bluish rainclouds", etc.).
> >
> >
> > However, "skin colour" in combination with "bad" will very likely get us
> > into trouble with Dutch readers who are not unlikely to consider us as
> > racist if I render this as "bad skin colour" (even though the "good"
> > colour isn't mentioned).
> >
> >
> > I'm inclined to use "(outward) appearance". Would that cover the
> > meaning, you think, or should the meaning specifically pertain to the
> > skin (colour)?
>
> No, it's limiting the word's meaning to confine it simply to skin color.
> It's not only color that is referred to when speaking of complexion: AHD
> and Wesbsters both refer to complexion as pertaining to color, texture,
> and appearance. In that sense, it means scarring from skin diseases, acne,
> unsightly skin afflictions that might weep, etc. And, while I'm reluctant
> to speculate about what Prabhupada "might have been thinking," in this
> sense it's not a stretch (considering he was in the medical field) to
> consider that he may also have been including "white leprosy," which was
> not an uncommon sight for him -- it's not such a rare thing in India --
> where the pigment of the skin is damaged and so there are white patches --
> usually quite large -- over the surface of the skin.
> >
> > Otherwise, perhaps it's an idea to use "unhealthy" or something similar
> > for "bad"?
>
> It's a better idea to understand the full meaning of a word, then one can
> see it's context within a sentence.
>
> Your servant
> Braja Sevaki dd .

01-08-2007, 07:25 AM

This is the only place in Prabhupada's words where "bad complexion"
appears. I question whether he even said it. Is there any ms or ot for this
book? All the Skrt. says is "bodily faults."

At 12:30 PM 1/8/2007 +0100, Kesava Bharati Dasa Goswami (NE BBT, Govardhan)
wrote:

>Complexion doesn't refer only to skin color. In American English at least
>the words "bad complexion," for example is an idiomatic expressing meaning
>skin that is diseased with acne or disfigured by scars from acne, small pox,
>or someother irregularity.
>
>Hare Krsna
>
>ys, kbdg
>
> >
> > Please accept my humble obeisances.
> > All glories to Srila Prabhupada!
> >
> >
> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> > Indeed, one should overlook a devotee's having a body born in a low
> > family, a body with a bad complexion, a deformed body, or a diseased or
> > infirm body.
> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> >
> >
> > I wonder how to render "bad complexion" in Dutch. Throughout Srila
> > Prabhupada's books "complexion" refers to "skin colour" (at least in the
> > word-for-word translations; "golden complexion", "having a complexion
> > resembling bluish rainclouds", etc.).
> >
> >
> > However, "skin colour" in combination with "bad" will very likely get us
> > into trouble with Dutch readers who are not unlikely to consider us as
> > racist if I render this as "bad skin colour" (even though the "good"
> > colour isn't mentioned).
> >
> >
> > I'm inclined to use "(outward) appearance". Would that cover the meaning,
> > you think, or should the meaning specifically pertain to the skin
> > (colour)?
> >
> >
> > Otherwise, perhaps it's an idea to use "unhealthy" or something similar
> > for "bad"?
> >
> >
> >
> > OED
> >
> > 1. a. In the physiology and natural philosophy of the Middle Ages: The
> > combination of supposed qualities (cold or hot, and moist or dry) in a
> > certain proportion, determining the nature of a body, plant, etc.; the
> > combination of the four ‘humours’ of the body in a certain proportion, or
> > the bodily habit attributed to such combination; ‘temperament’. Obs. exc.
> > Hist.
> >
> > lb. Also used as equivalent to ‘humour’, or to ‘collection of humours’.
> > Obs.
> >
> > l2. a. Bodily habit or constitution (orig. supposed to be constituted
> > by the ‘humours’). Obs.
> >
> > lb. Physical constitution or nature (of members of the body). Obs.
> >
> > l3. Constitution or habit of mind, disposition, temperament; ‘nature’.
> > Obs. (exc. as fig. of 4).
> >
> > 4. a. The natural colour, texture, and appearance of the skin, esp. of
> > the face; orig. as showing the ‘temperament’ or bodily constitution. (Now,
> > without any such notion, the ordinary sense.)
> >
> > lb. Rarely, the colour of hair or beard. Obs.
> >
> > lc. Countenance, face. Obs. rare—1.
> >
> > 5. transf. Of other things: Colour, visible aspect, look, appearance.
> >
> > l6. A colouring preparation applied (by women) to ‘give a complexion’
> > to the face. Obs.
> >
> > 7. a. fig. (from senses 1.3). Quality, character, condition; in mod.
> > use often with some notion of ‘tinge, colour, aspect’ from senses 4.5.
> >
> > b. (fig. from 4 or 5.) Appearance, aspect.
> >
> > ------
> >
> >
> > Thank you very much!
> >
> > Hare Krishna. Your humble servant,
> > Rupa Sanatana Dasa
>
>
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>
>
>
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01-12-2007, 08:11 PM

I suggest "sickly complexion" or something like it if in the foreign
language "bad complexion" won't fly.

dd

At 03:03 AM 1/8/2007 -0500, Visakha Priya (dd) GRS (Vrindavan - IN) wrote:

>I agree with Braja Sevaki's analysis. Whenever I read the verse, I always
>visualize an acne-filled face, or psorisis (spelling?), or pockmarks.
>Although I lived in South Africa for twenty years during the heydays of
>apartheid, I never even thought of equating "bad complexion" with skin
>color.
>
>Your servant,
>Visakha Priya dasi
>
> >
> > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> > > Indeed, one should overlook a devotee's having a body born in a low
> > > family, a body with a bad complexion, a deformed body, or a diseased or
> > > infirm body.
> > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> > >
> > >
> > > I wonder how to render "bad complexion" in Dutch. Throughout Srila
> > > Prabhupada's books "complexion" refers to "skin colour" (at least in the
> > > word-for-word translations; "golden complexion", "having a complexion
> > > resembling bluish rainclouds", etc.).
> > >
> > >
> > > However, "skin colour" in combination with "bad" will very likely get us
> > > into trouble with Dutch readers who are not unlikely to consider us as
> > > racist if I render this as "bad skin colour" (even though the "good"
> > > colour isn't mentioned).
> > >
> > >
> > > I'm inclined to use "(outward) appearance". Would that cover the
> > > meaning, you think, or should the meaning specifically pertain to the
> > > skin (colour)?
> >
> > No, it's limiting the word's meaning to confine it simply to skin color.
> > It's not only color that is referred to when speaking of complexion: AHD
> > and Wesbsters both refer to complexion as pertaining to color, texture,
> > and appearance. In that sense, it means scarring from skin diseases, acne,
> > unsightly skin afflictions that might weep, etc. And, while I'm reluctant
> > to speculate about what Prabhupada "might have been thinking," in this
> > sense it's not a stretch (considering he was in the medical field) to
> > consider that he may also have been including "white leprosy," which was
> > not an uncommon sight for him -- it's not such a rare thing in India --
> > where the pigment of the skin is damaged and so there are white patches --
> > usually quite large -- over the surface of the skin.
> > >
> > > Otherwise, perhaps it's an idea to use "unhealthy" or something similar
> > > for "bad"?
> >
> > It's a better idea to understand the full meaning of a word, then one can
> > see it's context within a sentence.
> >
> > Your servant
> > Braja Sevaki dd .
>
>
>--
>No virus found in this incoming message.
>Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.16.7/618 - Release Date: 1/6/2007
>7:47 PM
>
>
>
>
>--
>No virus found in this incoming message.
>Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.16.7/618 - Release Date: 1/6/2007
>7:47 PM

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