Are you listening to tha katha of the link i sent?

ok .. U havn't answered my question but ill ans ures first
1. the vadtal vachanamrut as you quoted says "And schould know that I have installed Dharm-kool-the descendants of Dharmadev continuing with this tradition."
but where does he clearly say that santos should get diksha ONLY from the acharya? though it does say both in the shikshapatri and the satsangi jivan granth that one of the acharyas duty is to over look that things run smoothly within the sant mandal and the common devotees mandal - but it seems that the acharyas of this day and age have failed to do their duties.

2. the Shikshapatri says - those that do not folllow the shikshapatri (by word thought and deed) should be considered excommunicated - to me what that implies is that if the acharya does not follow his niyam dharma the he should then he shouldn't be considered an acharya - eg. in order to be called a medical doctor - the person has to have up- to -date knowlegde about curing people - and most importantly he has to put that knowledge in to practice thats the only time he becomes eligible to be a doctor. a doctor has to have qualities of a doctor to be called a doctor-0 same applys to the acharya - HE HAS TO BE BORN IN THE DHARMA KUL BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY HE HAS TO PRACTICE HIS NIYAMS THOROUGHLY IN ORDER TO BE GIVEN THAT PADVI- ( and this is primarily my own interpretation) - so i think Nishkulanand Swami was obviously absolutely correct - only that now many of the past acharyas and the present ones are not fit to have obtained their padvi - so as far as im considered there is no acharya!..... so what do we do now? leave satsang ? and our whole goal is to attain moksh and nowhere in the vachanamrut does it say that acharya gives moksha- moksha is only attained by pragat. and the acharyas right now don't have the qualities to substantiate that they are pragat.

this will be my last post - cos i gatta go do thaal and then study - the rest i will discuss tommorrow
JaiSwaminarayan

one last thing - you talk of islam - not that i have anything against them - but they are growing not primarily because people voluntarily join islam out of the blue - they are growing because our Hindus and people of other diff faith are marring into muslim families - and you have to respect the muslims for keeping their staunch belief - so that the person of the other faith mainly converts into islam - and it does not happen the other way around. and SOME muslims also have other propagenda that they're involved in which i'd rather not get into right now. You cannot compare that to BAPS. forget about other religions - BAPS is a Hindu panth- a bhakti maarg- compare it to other Hindu panths.

Jai Swaminarayan,<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:" /><o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
First of all which question have I not answered please restate as I clearly feel that I have answered every single one of your points. I Clearly stated that the Satsangi Jivan in the 4th Prakran clearly states that that Acharya should give Bhagvati Diskha to the new tyagi. I states this earlier. You need to read my post carefully.<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
The Acharyas today have not failed. Please could you name the acharyas that have failed and please state which way they have failed. <o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
If the Acharya does not follow his dharma then he is excommunicated. I’ve stated that before and I state it again for your sake. Even we all believe this much as Shriji Maharaj has stated so in the Satsangi Jivan and Desh Vibhaag lekh. <o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
You think there is no Acharya? Well why not? That’s a foolish thing to say as Shriji Maharaj Himself has stated that the Acharya, true Saint, Scriptures and His Murtis which have been installed by Him or invoked by the Dharmvanshi Acharya will remain till the moon and sun shine-‘Yaavat Surya chandra divakale’. <o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
So you are wrong once again. To state that you do not believe in the existence of the Acharyas is wrong. This even Gunatitanand swami states is wrong to do. Like I quoted from Swamis vato above. Also what faults do you find with Amdavad Acharya Kaushalendraprasad or Vadtal Acharya Rakeshprasadji Maharaj? They have not yet done one thing which is devoid of their Acharya dharmas. <o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
If you think Nishkulanand swami was correct then why not follow him? You also do not follow Nishkulanand Swamis words as stated earlier this means that you do not care for his word in the Nishkulanand Kavya. You just accept that BAPS saints are clearly shown in the Sikshapatri Bhashya and other scriptures as not following the ways of the Swaminarayan Tyagis rules. First of all you fail against the 4th Prakran of the Satsangi jivan, which states that the Acharya should give diksha to the one who requires to be a Sadhu. Their will never be a case where one has to leave the Satsang at all. Also the Vachnamrut is the Yog Shastra of the Sampraday. The Dharm shastras is the Satsangi Jivan. The Vachnamrut also does not state the four types of Mukts. You need to read the Purshottam Prakash. Maybe they don have it in BAPS because they do not agree with it. So I cant blame you. It clearly shows that the Acharyas give Moksh. This is the fourth way to get moksh. <o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
By the way I wasn’t comparing ISLAM and BAPS. Please do re read my post carefully. My point was not how great Islam is or how people follow it. My point was that just because so many people follow it does not mean that it is the right way. As you state that many are following BAPS so God must be with it. HAHA. If this was the case then the Swaminarayan Sampraday established by Bhagwan Swaminarayan (*note not BAPS) has over 5.5 million followers and is growing still. BAPS have a little more than 1.7 million. <o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
Another thing I wanted to add was that in Gunatitanand swamis Vato, swami in Vaat 171 states that “the avatars of God previously have never established a tradition of female enunciates and look today there are thousands of female renunciates and today and in the future will give moksh to many”. So where are these female renunciates in BAPS? <o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>

You fail to answer alot of my post. or provide no comments for the references fro mactual scriptures that i post. The other members who read such can see this too.

<o:p></o:p>

Chopai: Ek bahu bahu Parkare re, vale Jeev tarya ah vare re<o:p></o:p>
Bahu Hari kari Parmarth re, tarya jeev vavri samarthya re<o:p></o:p>
Varto vichaar karyo che vale re, avu avu ghanu kem chale re<o:p></o:p>
Mota mota karavya Mandir re, tema rakhya sant sudhir re<o:p></o:p>
Pan teh toh sant che joh tyagi re, vasi kem sakshe vitragi re<o:p></o:p>
Mamat vina Mandir kem rehshe re, vaat bandh eh kem bes she re<o:p></o:p>
Jeh tyagi che triya dhan tanare, deh suchthi nirashi ghanare<o:p></o:p>
Tene nahi jarvaay jagya re, nathi vaat eh banva lagya re<o:p></o:p>
Mate ena karu ek dhani re, toh rakhe khabar eni ghani re<o:p></o:p>
Pachi sarvar desh thi sambandhi re, tene teravi jaygha didhire<o:p></o:p>
Sthapya dat putra pote sthir re, avadhprasadne raghuvir re<o:p></o:p>
Tene ape karya acharyaj re, karva bahu jivna kaarajre<o:p></o:p>
Apya vechimandir ne desh re, jema koi ne na thay kalesh re<o:p></o:p>
Sadhu Satsangi na guru kidha re, desh uttar dakshin vechi didha re<o:p></o:p>
Kahe sau sahune desh rejo re, saro sahune updesh dejo re<o:p></o:p>
Tamne manshe pujshe jeh re, mota sukh ne pamshe the re<o:p></o:p>
Ann dhan apshe anbar re, pashu vahan ne vari ghar re<o:p></o:p>
Fal full dal jal deshere, te toh akhand dham ne leshe re<o:p></o:p>
Eh adi jeh apshe vastra re, eva ghar dhaari jeh gruhast re<o:p></o:p>
Vari padhravshe potane gher re, karshe seva vari sari pere re<o:p></o:p>
Vari karshe sanmaan enu re, mare karvu che kalyaan tenu reh<o:p></o:p>
Em acharya thi kalyaan re, thashe sahu jivnu sujaan re<o:p></o:p>
Mano moksh no chelo upaay re, eh upraant nathi kahy re<o:p></o:p>
Murti acharaj dharmpaal re, reshe kalyan te bahu kaar re<o:p></o:p>
Jeh jeh ene koi asharshe re, teh toh jaroor bhavjar tarshe re<o:p></o:p>
Karshe darshan gunn leshe re, vari pachya pramane koi deshe re<o:p></o:p>
Shraddha sahit seva kare soi re, vari raaji thashe ene joi re<o:p></o:p>
Eva jann jeh jeh jagh mahi re, teni karvi mare sahaay re<o:p></o:p>
Mari iccha che hamh evi re, param prapti sahu devi re<o:p></o:p>
Mate moksh nu motu dvaar re, ame ughadiyu che ahh vaar re<o:p></o:p>
Acharya thi bahu udharshe re, jano brahmnagar vaas karshe re<o:p></o:p>
Em shri mukhe kahyu Shrijire, jan sau satya mani lijiye re<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
Bhagwan this time round emancipated many souls.With his great powers he showed much of his divinity. God thought, how can what He has established exist for the maximum time? God decided that He has constructed big temples and got saints to reside therein. But these saints are renunciates how will they live with so much control. How can temples exist without the saints thinking them as their own? These saints cannot have money or women and even not attached to their own body. They should not and cannot control such places, so I shall establish those who can control all this. So God called His relatives from sarvar desh and gave them places to stay. He consecrated Ayodhyaprasad and Raghuvir as His sons. He then initiated them as Acharyas so that they could help those in seek of salvation. He divided the land and the mandirs unto them so no one would have problems. He made them the gurus of ALL sadhus and satsangis and divided the land into southern and northern divisions. He stated for them to live in their respective regions and preach the goodness of others to them. Whoever listens to the word of the Acharyas and performs their veneration will attain much happiness. Whoever donates them grain, money, animals, transport, fruit, flowers and water they will attain my eternal abode. Whichever householders gives all this and anything else such as clothes as well as calls them unto their home, venerates them, provides service to them and respects them, I, will give them moksh. In this way the Acharyas will give Moksh to the souls. You should all believe that this is the final way to attain liberation. There is no other way after this fourth way to attain moksh. I shall live in the Acharyas forever. Whoever takes refuge unto them will definitely cross this material world. Whoever has their darshan and takes their good attributes, talks good of them, serves them with love and gets happy unto seeing them shall I will look after them forever. I want all to attain such liberation of the first kind, such is my will. Hence this is a great big door for attaining moksh, which I have opened this time round. Many will be liberated through these Acharyas and live in my Akshardham. This is what Shriji Maharaj Himself stated. Hence all should believe such firmly.

Please read within the Nishklanand Kavya the Purshottam Prakaash Prakaar 39:<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:" /><o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
Dharmvasnhini gadiye beshe re, vari kavshe dharm updeshi re<o:p></o:p>
Mate ethi tarshe apaar re, nischay janjo eh nirdhar re<o:p></o:p>
Bahu kaar laghi kalyaan re, thashe nischay jano nirvana re<o:p></o:p>
Evi iccha che joh amari re, evu dhaam thi avya ame dhari reh<o:p></o:p>
Em bolya shri hari harakhi re, suni vaat lidhi che joh lakhi re.<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
The Dharmvanshis have sat on my throne and will give dharm to all. Hence many will get liberated from them so all should realise this. Many will attain Moksh from them for all time. This is our will and I have decided this all the way from Akshardham. This is what Shri Hari stated in great joy and hearing this I have written it here. – Nishkulanand Swami.

Please read within the Nishklanand Kavya the Purshottam Prakaash Prakaar 40:<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:" /><o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
Mate sau dharmkul manjo, sau karjo eni sev<o:p></o:p>
Anya jan jeva eh nahi, eh che janjo mota dev<o:p></o:p>
Ek Brahmin jano bhakt ati, vari kave amaru kul<o:p></o:p>
Ene sevta sau jann tamo, pamsho such atur<o:p></o:p>
Manvanchit vaat malshe, vari sevta ena charan<o:p></o:p>
Eh che amari agna, sarve kaalma such karan<o:p></o:p>
Mann karm vachane manjo, ema nathi sanshay laghaar<o:p></o:p>
Eh dvare mare anekno, aaj karvo che udhaar<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
Chopai: mate sau rejo ene vachane re, tyagi gruhi sahu ek mane re,<o:p></o:p>
Rejo Dharmvanshi gamte re, vartsho mah koye mann mate re<o:p></o:p>
Eh kahye tem sau karjo re, puchya vina toh pagh na bharjo re<o:p></o:p>
Haath jori ne rejo hajur re, kari daapan potani door re<o:p></o:p>
Vidhya gunn buddhi ne bare re, ene dabaava nahi koi pare re<o:p></o:p>
Tyagi raaghi neh kavi koi hoy re, toy ene manjo sahu koi re<o:p></o:p>
Vad vivaad kari vadane re, eshu bolsho ma koi danne re<o:p></o:p>
Eni vaat upar vaat ani re, kedi vadsho ma mukhe vaani re<o:p></o:p>
Ene horye hathaavi harvi re, potani sarsaai na karvi re<o:p></o:p>
Pote samji potane praveen re, ene samajsho ma gunn hee re<o:p></o:p>
Jem eh vaare tem varjo re, ena kaam kaaj ma bharjo re<o:p></o:p>
Eni manjo sahu agna re, vartsho ma koi vachan vina re<o:p></o:p>
Ene raaji raksho joh tame re, toh tam par raaji chiyye ame re<o:p></o:p>
Ene raaji rakshe jeh jann re, tene amne karya prasann re<o:p></o:p>
Kaah je amara thekane eh che re, teto praveen hoy the priche re<o:p></o:p>
Bija jann eh marm nah lahe re, bhora manushya ne bhorai rahe re<o:p></o:p>
Pan samajvi vaat sudhi re, ati mati na rakhvi undhi re<o:p></o:p>
Vachan dvare vasya ame ema re, tame fer jansho ma tema re<o:p></o:p>
Ame ema eh che amm maahi re, em samjo sahu bai bhai re<o:p></o:p>
Ethi ame argha na rahiye re, ema rahine darshan dahi re<o:p></o:p>
Jeh jeh jann ne thaay samaas re, teh toh ame kari rahya vaas re<o:p></o:p>
Sher patane sanmaan jare reh, the toh amari samarthi vare re<o:p></o:p>
Deshpardesh pujaay aapre, tetoh jano amaro prataap re<o:p></o:p>
Jya jaay tiya jaay jeet re, tetoh ame rahya rudi reet re<o:p></o:p>
Em samjo sahu sujaan re, amm vina nah hoy kalyaan re<o:p></o:p>
Dharmvanshi acharyaj mahi re, sada rahyo chu mari irchaay re<o:p></o:p>
Ati dharmvara joi jann re, rehva maani gayu maru mann re<o:p></o:p>
Mate ene puje hu pujano re, tetoh jarror jann mann jano re<o:p></o:p>
Enu jene karyu sanmaan re, tene maru karyu che nidaan re<o:p></o:p>
Em jaani lejo sahu jann re, em bolya shri Bhagwan re<o:p></o:p>
Suni jann magan thaya re, dhanya dhanya swami keva rahya re<o:p></o:p>
Pachi sau acharya sevya re, tetoh mota such ne leva re.<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
Hence all should have firm faith in the dharmkul and should all serve them. They are not like the other people; understand them to be great Devtas. They are Brahmins and that too of my family. By serving them you shall attain happiness too. By serving them and paying respect at their feet you will all attainyou’re your desires. This is our order, which should be followed for all time. Believe this by mind, action and speech there is no doubt in this at all. I want to from now give moksh to many. <o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
Hence all should live in their commands whether it is the Sadhu’s or householders. Do not live by following your mind always live as they would want <o:p></o:p>
you to live. Do as they ask and never even step forward without asking them. Always be humble with them and cast away any foolishness. All renunciates, householders and even the likes of singers should live according to them. Never <o:p></o:p>
fall into arguments with them. If you keep them happy then I will be happy upon you. Do not think yourselves greater or knowledgeable than them nor enter into <o:p></o:p>
debates with them or think them without any good attributes. Whoever keeps them happy means that they are keeping me happy. Do as they ask and always aid them in their work. Follow their orders and do not live without their agna. The yare in place of me, only those who are worthy shall understand this. Other people will not understand this and are misinformed and fall into false understanding. But one should understand this talk and not have a false sense of belief. I live in the Acharyas through my divine speech do not see any different. All males and females should understand that the Acharyas live in me and I live in them. I do not live far from them at all, I give my darshan through them. Whoever advances in Satsang shall understand that its because I live close to them. Wherever the Acharyas shall be respected they will understand it to be because of my greatness. They will be venerated here and in other foreign lands<o:p></o:p>
and that is too because of my supremacy. Wherever they go they will triumph as I live in them in a great way. All should understand this greatly. As without Me there is no liberation. I live in the Dharmvanshi Acharyas with my own will. I also live in those who follow Dharm greatly. Thus worshipping them I am too worshipped. All you people should realise such with firm minds. Whoever has respected the Acharyas in such a way has said to have done what I have stated for them to do. So all of you shall realise such. In that Shri Bhagwan spoke. All were happy to hear this and they thought how greatly God lives amongst us. Then all performed veneration of the Acharyas to attain the divine bliss of God.

i have so much more. Do you BAPS not follow this word of God? And of Nishkulanand swami? Why not?

NO ANSWER FROM BAPS?? Didnt think so. There are many more proofs of what you follow is against teh original teachings of Bhagwan swaminarayan. But you do not like to reply to them.

What do you BAPS followers have to say about the above from the Purshottam Prakash??

I agree with you. BAPS is part of hinduism and is doing a good job in spreading Hindu dharma around the world. That's the only thing that matters.

Instead of pulling pout old post why don’t you reply to the ones you BAPS followers have no answer phone? I’m not stating that what BAPS and their charity do is wrong but you do not do it in accordance to Swaminarayan Bhagwan and His nand Santos.
<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:" /><o:p></o:p>
Oh’ so now BAPS is part of the Hindu Dharma and not with Swaminarayan Sampraday? Its not about spreading Hindu Dharm. It’s about following it too. This is much more important. Now if the gurus themselves cannot follow it then how will the so-called devotees follow the Dharma as established by Bhagwan Swaminarayan! Follow the Agna and Upasna. The two wings of Sampraday.
<o:p></o:p>
Yeah go ahead, bury the post that you have no answer for.
<o:p></o:p>
It’s the same with you BAPS followers. You are like the blind following the blind. You go around in circles and not advance in the way Shriji Maharaj requires. Also ignore the majority of the 225 scriptures and cherry pick the ones that do not talk of Upasna and Agna of the Sampraday established by Swaminarayan Bhagwan Himself.
<o:p></o:p>
What responses do you have to Nishkulanand Swami and the many other scriptures, for example the one above? Come on Celina answer or do you wish to ignore it like BAPS has done since 1907 after it started?<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
It does matter, as you are not following the orders of Shriji Maharaj. It matters a lot. You are not HIS like Nishkulanand swami states in the Purshottam Prakash. Which He heard from Shriji Maharaj himself.<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
Please read within the Nishklanand Kavya the Purshottam Prakaash Prakaar 40:

Mate sau dharmkul manjo, sau karjo eni sev
Anya jan jeva eh nahi, eh che janjo mota dev
Ek Brahmin jano bhakt ati, vari kave amaru kul
Ene sevta sau jann tamo, pamsho such atur
Manvanchit vaat malshe, vari sevta ena charan
Eh che amari agna, sarve kaalma such karan
Mann karm vachane manjo, ema nathi sanshay laghaar
Eh dvare mare anekno, aaj karvo che udhaar

Chopai: mate sau rejo ene vachane re, tyagi gruhi sahu ek mane re,
Rejo Dharmvanshi gamte re, vartsho mah koye mann mate re
Eh kahye tem sau karjo re, puchya vina toh pagh na bharjo re
Haath jori ne rejo hajur re, kari daapan potani door re
Vidhya gunn buddhi ne bare re, ene dabaava nahi koi pare re
Tyagi raaghi neh kavi koi hoy re, toy ene manjo sahu koi re
Vad vivaad kari vadane re, eshu bolsho ma koi danne re
Eni vaat upar vaat ani re, kedi vadsho ma mukhe vaani re
Ene horye hathaavi harvi re, potani sarsaai na karvi re
Pote samji potane praveen re, ene samajsho ma gunn hee re
Jem eh vaare tem varjo re, ena kaam kaaj ma bharjo re
Eni manjo sahu agna re, vartsho ma koi vachan vina re
Ene raaji raksho joh tame re, toh tam par raaji chiyye ame re
Ene raaji rakshe jeh jann re, tene amne karya prasann re
Kaah je amara thekane eh che re, teto praveen hoy the priche re
Bija jann eh marm nah lahe re, bhora manushya ne bhorai rahe re
Pan samajvi vaat sudhi re, ati mati na rakhvi undhi re
Vachan dvare vasya ame ema re, tame fer jansho ma tema re
Ame ema eh che amm maahi re, em samjo sahu bai bhai re
Ethi ame argha na rahiye re, ema rahine darshan dahi re
Jeh jeh jann ne thaay samaas re, teh toh ame kari rahya vaas re
Sher patane sanmaan jare reh, the toh amari samarthi vare re
Deshpardesh pujaay aapre, tetoh jano amaro prataap re
Jya jaay tiya jaay jeet re, tetoh ame rahya rudi reet re
Em samjo sahu sujaan re, amm vina nah hoy kalyaan re
Dharmvanshi acharyaj mahi re, sada rahyo chu mari irchaay re
Ati dharmvara joi jann re, rehva maani gayu maru mann re
Mate ene puje hu pujano re, tetoh jarror jann mann jano re
Enu jene karyu sanmaan re, tene maru karyu che nidaan re
Em jaani lejo sahu jann re, em bolya shri Bhagwan re
Suni jann magan thaya re, dhanya dhanya swami keva rahya re
Pachi sau acharya sevya re, tetoh mota such ne leva re.

Hence all should have firm faith in the dharmkul and should all serve them. They are not like the other people; understand them to be great Devtas. They are Brahmins and that too of my family. By serving them you shall attain happiness too. By serving them and paying respect at their feet you will all attainyou’re your desires. This is our order, which should be followed for all time. Believe this by mind, action and speech there is no doubt in this at all. I want to from now give moksh to many.

Hence all should live in their commands whether it is the Sadhu’s or householders. Do not live by following your mind always live as they would want
you to live. Do as they ask and never even step forward without asking them. Always be humble with them and cast away any foolishness. All renunciates, householders and even the likes of singers should live according to them. Never
fall into arguments with them. If you keep them happy then I will be happy upon you. Do not think yourselves greater or knowledgeable than them nor enter into
debates with them or think them without any good attributes. Whoever keeps them happy means that they are keeping me happy. Do as they ask and always aid them in their work. Follow their orders and do not live without their agna. The yare in place of me, only those who are worthy shall understand this. Other people will not understand this and are misinformed and fall into false understanding. But one should understand this talk and not have a false sense of belief. I live in the Acharyas through my divine speech do not see any different. All males and females should understand that the Acharyas live in me and I live in them. I do not live far from them at all, I give my darshan through them. Whoever advances in Satsang shall understand that its because I live close to them. Wherever the Acharyas shall be respected they will understand it to be because of my greatness. They will be venerated here and in other foreign lands
and that is too because of my supremacy. Wherever they go they will triumph as I live in them in a great way. All should understand this greatly. As without Me there is no liberation. I live in the Dharmvanshi Acharyas with my own will. I also live in those who follow Dharm greatly. Thus worshipping them I am too worshipped. All you people should realise such with firm minds. Whoever has respected the Acharyas in such a way has said to have done what I have stated for them to do. So all of you shall realise such. In that Shri Bhagwan spoke. All were happy to hear this and they thought how greatly God lives amongst us. Then all performed veneration of the Acharyas to attain the divine bliss of God.<o:p></o:p>

Please read within the Nishklanand Kavya the Purshottam Prakaash Prakaar 39:

Dharmvasnhini gadiye beshe re, vari kavshe dharm updeshi re
Mate ethi tarshe apaar re, nischay janjo eh nirdhar re
Bahu kaar laghi kalyaan re, thashe nischay jano nirvana re
Evi iccha che joh amari re, evu dhaam thi avya ame dhari reh
Em bolya shri hari harakhi re, suni vaat lidhi che joh lakhi re.

The Dharmvanshis have sat on my throne and will give dharm to all. Hence many will get liberated from them so all should realise this. Many will attain Moksh from them for all time. This is our will and I have decided this all the way from Akshardham. This is what Shri Hari stated in great joy and hearing this I have written it here. – Nishkulanand Swami. <o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>

Please read within the Nishklanand Kavya the Purshottam Prakaash Prakaar 37:<o:p></o:p>

Chopai: Ek bahu bahu Parkare re, vale Jeev tarya ah vare re
Bahu Hari kari Parmarth re, tarya jeev vavri samarthya re
Varto vichaar karyo che vale re, avu avu ghanu kem chale re
Mota mota karavya Mandir re, tema rakhya sant sudhir re
Pan teh toh sant che joh tyagi re, vasi kem sakshe vitragi re
Mamat vina Mandir kem rehshe re, vaat bandh eh kem bes she re
Jeh tyagi che triya dhan tanare, deh suchthi nirashi ghanare
Tene nahi jarvaay jagya re, nathi vaat eh banva lagya re
Mate ena karu ek dhani re, toh rakhe khabar eni ghani re
Pachi sarvar desh thi sambandhi re, tene teravi jaygha didhire
Sthapya dat putra pote sthir re, avadhprasadne raghuvir re
Tene ape karya acharyaj re, karva bahu jivna kaarajre
Apya vechimandir ne desh re, jema koi ne na thay kalesh re
Sadhu Satsangi na guru kidha re, desh uttar dakshin vechi didha re
Kahe sau sahune desh rejo re, saro sahune updesh dejo re
Tamne manshe pujshe jeh re, mota sukh ne pamshe the re
Ann dhan apshe anbar re, pashu vahan ne vari ghar re
Fal full dal jal deshere, te toh akhand dham ne leshe re
Eh adi jeh apshe vastra re, eva ghar dhaari jeh gruhast re
Vari padhravshe potane gher re, karshe seva vari sari pere re
Vari karshe sanmaan enu re, mare karvu che kalyaan tenu reh
Em acharya thi kalyaan re, thashe sahu jivnu sujaan re
Mano moksh no chelo upaay re, eh upraant nathi kahy re
Murti acharaj dharmpaal re, reshe kalyan te bahu kaar re
Jeh jeh ene koi asharshe re, teh toh jaroor bhavjar tarshe re
Karshe darshan gunn leshe re, vari pachya pramane koi deshe re
Shraddha sahit seva kare soi re, vari raaji thashe ene joi re
Eva jann jeh jeh jagh mahi re, teni karvi mare sahaay re
Mari iccha che hamh evi re, param prapti sahu devi re
Mate moksh nu motu dvaar re, ame ughadiyu che ahh vaar re
Acharya thi bahu udharshe re, jano brahmnagar vaas karshe re
Em shri mukhe kahyu Shrijire, jan sau satya mani lijiye re

Bhagwan this time round emancipated many souls.With his great powers he showed much of his divinity. God thought, how can what He has established exist for the maximum time? God decided that He has constructed big temples and got saints to reside therein. But these saints are renunciates how will they live with so much control. How can temples exist without the saints thinking them as their own? These saints cannot have money or women and even not attached to their own body. They should not and cannot control such places, so I shall establish those who can control all this. So God called His relatives from sarvar desh and gave them places to stay. He consecrated Ayodhyaprasad and Raghuvir as His sons. He then initiated them as Acharyas so that they could help those in seek of salvation. He divided the land and the mandirs unto them so no one would have problems. He made them the gurus of ALL sadhus and satsangis and divided the land into southern and northern divisions. He stated for them to live in their respective regions and preach the goodness of others to them. Whoever listens to the word of the Acharyas and performs their veneration will attain much happiness. Whoever donates them grain, money, animals, transport, fruit, flowers and water they will attain my eternal abode. Whichever householders gives all this and anything else such as clothes as well as calls them unto their home, venerates them, provides service to them and respects them, I, will give them moksh. In this way the Acharyas will give Moksh to the souls. You should all believe that this is the final way to attain liberation. There is no other way after this fourth way to attain moksh. I shall live in the Acharyas forever. Whoever takes refuge unto them will definitely cross this material world. Whoever has their darshan and takes their good attributes, talks good of them, serves them with love and gets happy unto seeing them shall I will look after them forever. I want all to attain such liberation of the first kind, such is my will. Hence this is a great big door for attaining moksh, which I have opened this time round. Many will be liberated through these Acharyas and live in my Akshardham. This is what Shriji Maharaj Himself stated. Hence all should believe such firmly.

<o:p></o:p>

By the way the acharyas thus give Moksh. BAPS saints are not Swaminarayan saints. Hindu saints? mmm, yeah they may be.

The yare in place of me, only those who are worthy shall understand this. Other people will not understand this and are misinformed and fall into false understanding. But one should understand this talk and not have a false sense of belief.

Instead of pulling out old post why don’t you reply to the ones you BAPS followers have no answer for? I’m not stating that what BAPS and their charity do is wrong but you do not do it in accordance to Swaminarayan Bhagwan and His nand Santos.
<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:" /><o:p></o:p>
Oh’ so now BAPS is part of the Hindu Dharma and not with Swaminarayan Sampraday? Its not about spreading Hindu Dharm. It’s about following it too. This is much more important. Now if the gurus themselves cannot follow it then how will the so-called devotees follow the Dharma as established by Bhagwan Swaminarayan! Follow the Agna and Upasna. The two wings of Sampraday.
<o:p></o:p>
Yeah go ahead, bury the post that you have no answer for.
<o:p></o:p>
It’s the same with you BAPS followers. You are like the blind following the blind. You go around in circles and not advance in the way Shriji Maharaj requires. Also ignore the majority of the 225 scriptures and cherry pick the ones that do not talk of Upasna and Agna of the Sampraday established by Swaminarayan Bhagwan Himself.
<o:p></o:p>
What responses do you have to Nishkulanand Swami and the many other scriptures, for example the one above? Come on Celina answer or do you wish to ignore it like BAPS has done since 1907 after it started?<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
It does matter, as you are not following the orders of Shriji Maharaj. It matters a lot. You are not HIS like Nishkulanand swami states in the Purshottam Prakash. Which He heard from Shriji Maharaj himself.<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
Please read within the Nishklanand Kavya the Purshottam Prakaash Prakaar 40:

Mate sau dharmkul manjo, sau karjo eni sev
Anya jan jeva eh nahi, eh che janjo mota dev
Ek Brahmin jano bhakt ati, vari kave amaru kul
Ene sevta sau jann tamo, pamsho such atur
Manvanchit vaat malshe, vari sevta ena charan
Eh che amari agna, sarve kaalma such karan
Mann karm vachane manjo, ema nathi sanshay laghaar
Eh dvare mare anekno, aaj karvo che udhaar

Chopai: mate sau rejo ene vachane re, tyagi gruhi sahu ek mane re,
Rejo Dharmvanshi gamte re, vartsho mah koye mann mate re
Eh kahye tem sau karjo re, puchya vina toh pagh na bharjo re
Haath jori ne rejo hajur re, kari daapan potani door re
Vidhya gunn buddhi ne bare re, ene dabaava nahi koi pare re
Tyagi raaghi neh kavi koi hoy re, toy ene manjo sahu koi re
Vad vivaad kari vadane re, eshu bolsho ma koi danne re
Eni vaat upar vaat ani re, kedi vadsho ma mukhe vaani re
Ene horye hathaavi harvi re, potani sarsaai na karvi re
Pote samji potane praveen re, ene samajsho ma gunn hee re
Jem eh vaare tem varjo re, ena kaam kaaj ma bharjo re
Eni manjo sahu agna re, vartsho ma koi vachan vina re
Ene raaji raksho joh tame re, toh tam par raaji chiyye ame re
Ene raaji rakshe jeh jann re, tene amne karya prasann re
Kaah je amara thekane eh che re, teto praveen hoy the priche re
Bija jann eh marm nah lahe re, bhora manushya ne bhorai rahe re
Pan samajvi vaat sudhi re, ati mati na rakhvi undhi re
Vachan dvare vasya ame ema re, tame fer jansho ma tema re
Ame ema eh che amm maahi re, em samjo sahu bai bhai re
Ethi ame argha na rahiye re, ema rahine darshan dahi re
Jeh jeh jann ne thaay samaas re, teh toh ame kari rahya vaas re
Sher patane sanmaan jare reh, the toh amari samarthi vare re
Deshpardesh pujaay aapre, tetoh jano amaro prataap re
Jya jaay tiya jaay jeet re, tetoh ame rahya rudi reet re
Em samjo sahu sujaan re, amm vina nah hoy kalyaan re
Dharmvanshi acharyaj mahi re, sada rahyo chu mari irchaay re
Ati dharmvara joi jann re, rehva maani gayu maru mann re
Mate ene puje hu pujano re, tetoh jarror jann mann jano re
Enu jene karyu sanmaan re, tene maru karyu che nidaan re
Em jaani lejo sahu jann re, em bolya shri Bhagwan re
Suni jann magan thaya re, dhanya dhanya swami keva rahya re
Pachi sau acharya sevya re, tetoh mota such ne leva re.

Hence all should have firm faith in the dharmkul and should all serve them. They are not like the other people; understand them to be great Devtas. They are Brahmins and that too of my family. By serving them you shall attain happiness too. By serving them and paying respect at their feet you will all attainyou’re your desires. This is our order, which should be followed for all time. Believe this by mind, action and speech there is no doubt in this at all. I want to from now give moksh to many.

Hence all should live in their commands whether it is the Sadhu’s or householders. Do not live by following your mind always live as they would want
you to live. Do as they ask and never even step forward without asking them. Always be humble with them and cast away any foolishness. All renunciates, householders and even the likes of singers should live according to them. Never
fall into arguments with them. If you keep them happy then I will be happy upon you. Do not think yourselves greater or knowledgeable than them nor enter into
debates with them or think them without any good attributes. Whoever keeps them happy means that they are keeping me happy. Do as they ask and always aid them in their work. Follow their orders and do not live without their agna. The yare in place of me, only those who are worthy shall understand this. Other people will not understand this and are misinformed and fall into false understanding. But one should understand this talk and not have a false sense of belief. I live in the Acharyas through my divine speech do not see any different. All males and females should understand that the Acharyas live in me and I live in them. I do not live far from them at all, I give my darshan through them. Whoever advances in Satsang shall understand that its because I live close to them. Wherever the Acharyas shall be respected they will understand it to be because of my greatness. They will be venerated here and in other foreign lands
and that is too because of my supremacy. Wherever they go they will triumph as I live in them in a great way. All should understand this greatly. As without Me there is no liberation. I live in the Dharmvanshi Acharyas with my own will. I also live in those who follow Dharm greatly. Thus worshipping them I am too worshipped. All you people should realise such with firm minds. Whoever has respected the Acharyas in such a way has said to have done what I have stated for them to do. So all of you shall realise such. In that Shri Bhagwan spoke. All were happy to hear this and they thought how greatly God lives amongst us. Then all performed veneration of the Acharyas to attain the divine bliss of God.<o:p></o:p>

Please read within the Nishklanand Kavya the Purshottam Prakaash Prakaar 39:

Dharmvasnhini gadiye beshe re, vari kavshe dharm updeshi re
Mate ethi tarshe apaar re, nischay janjo eh nirdhar re
Bahu kaar laghi kalyaan re, thashe nischay jano nirvana re
Evi iccha che joh amari re, evu dhaam thi avya ame dhari reh
Em bolya shri hari harakhi re, suni vaat lidhi che joh lakhi re.

The Dharmvanshis have sat on my throne and will give dharm to all. Hence many will get liberated from them so all should realise this. Many will attain Moksh from them for all time. This is our will and I have decided this all the way from Akshardham. This is what Shri Hari stated in great joy and hearing this I have written it here. – Nishkulanand Swami. <o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>


Chopai: Ek bahu bahu Parkare re, vale Jeev tarya ah vare re
Bahu Hari kari Parmarth re, tarya jeev vavri samarthya re
Varto vichaar karyo che vale re, avu avu ghanu kem chale re
Mota mota karavya Mandir re, tema rakhya sant sudhir re
Pan teh toh sant che joh tyagi re, vasi kem sakshe vitragi re
Mamat vina Mandir kem rehshe re, vaat bandh eh kem bes she re
Jeh tyagi che triya dhan tanare, deh suchthi nirashi ghanare
Tene nahi jarvaay jagya re, nathi vaat eh banva lagya re
Mate ena karu ek dhani re, toh rakhe khabar eni ghani re
Pachi sarvar desh thi sambandhi re, tene teravi jaygha didhire
Sthapya dat putra pote sthir re, avadhprasadne raghuvir re
Tene ape karya acharyaj re, karva bahu jivna kaarajre
Apya vechimandir ne desh re, jema koi ne na thay kalesh re
Sadhu Satsangi na guru kidha re, desh uttar dakshin vechi didha re
Kahe sau sahune desh rejo re, saro sahune updesh dejo re
Tamne manshe pujshe jeh re, mota sukh ne pamshe the re
Ann dhan apshe anbar re, pashu vahan ne vari ghar re
Fal full dal jal deshere, te toh akhand dham ne leshe re
Eh adi jeh apshe vastra re, eva ghar dhaari jeh gruhast re
Vari padhravshe potane gher re, karshe seva vari sari pere re
Vari karshe sanmaan enu re, mare karvu che kalyaan tenu reh
Em acharya thi kalyaan re, thashe sahu jivnu sujaan re
Mano moksh no chelo upaay re, eh upraant nathi kahy re
Murti acharaj dharmpaal re, reshe kalyan te bahu kaar re
Jeh jeh ene koi asharshe re, teh toh jaroor bhavjar tarshe re
Karshe darshan gunn leshe re, vari pachya pramane koi deshe re
Shraddha sahit seva kare soi re, vari raaji thashe ene joi re
Eva jann jeh jeh jagh mahi re, teni karvi mare sahaay re
Mari iccha che hamh evi re, param prapti sahu devi re
Mate moksh nu motu dvaar re, ame ughadiyu che ahh vaar re
Acharya thi bahu udharshe re, jano brahmnagar vaas karshe re
Em shri mukhe kahyu Shrijire, jan sau satya mani lijiye re

Bhagwan this time round emancipated many souls.With his great powers he showed much of his divinity. God thought, how can what He has established exist for the maximum time? God decided that He has constructed big temples and got saints to reside therein. But these saints are renunciates how will they live with so much control. How can temples exist without the saints thinking them as their own? These saints cannot have money or women and even not attached to their own body. They should not and cannot control such places, so I shall establish those who can control all this. So God called His relatives from sarvar desh and gave them places to stay. He consecrated Ayodhyaprasad and Raghuvir as His sons. He then initiated them as Acharyas so that they could help those in seek of salvation. He divided the land and the mandirs unto them so no one would have problems. He made them the gurus of ALL sadhus and satsangis and divided the land into southern and northern divisions. He stated for them to live in their respective regions and preach the goodness of others to them. Whoever listens to the word of the Acharyas and performs their veneration will attain much happiness. Whoever donates them grain, money, animals, transport, fruit, flowers and water they will attain my eternal abode. Whichever householders gives all this and anything else such as clothes as well as calls them unto their home, venerates them, provides service to them and respects them, I, will give them moksh. In this way the Acharyas will give Moksh to the souls. You should all believe that this is the final way to attain liberation. There is no other way after this fourth way to attain moksh. I shall live in the Acharyas forever. Whoever takes refuge unto them will definitely cross this material world. Whoever has their darshan and takes their good attributes, talks good of them, serves them with love and gets happy unto seeing them shall I will look after them forever. I want all to attain such liberation of the first kind, such is my will. Hence this is a great big door for attaining moksh, which I have opened this time round. Many will be liberated through these Acharyas and live in my Akshardham. This is what Shriji Maharaj Himself stated. Hence all should believe such firmly.

biggin up daas ka daas, the man speaks the truth. Very informative posts.

Desh Vibhaag Lekh::

10. You two, who hold the Gadees, have been appointed spiritual preceptors: hence all Sadhus and Brahmcharis and Palas and all our followers shall always remain obedient to your commands and shall serve you. Should any person of a sect (belief) other than that of the two spiritual preceptors of the line of Dharmadev be pre-eminent for his knowledge of the Shastras or for his practice of Yoga or for ascetism or self renunciation, or for any other virtue, and if thereby the two ruling spiritual preceptors of the line of Dharmadev be lowered in estimation, nevertheless we command all sadhus and brahmcharis and Palas and all our followers, that in order to the salvation of their souls, they always and forever honour the two ruling spiritual preceptors of the line of Dharmadev, and obey them in thought word and deed. Should one, failing this seek refuge in another and honour him, his soul shall never have happiness in this world or in the world to come but shall suffer extreme pains.

Whats the matter BAPS followers? What do you have to say of all this? None of you guys seem to be replying anymore.... hmmm I wonder why...


Shri Swaminarayano Vijaytetram!!!!!!!!!
Jay Swamianarayan
Nar Narayan Dev Ni Jay
Laksminarayandev Ni Jay
Gopinathji Maharaj Ni Jay

I still wait from the BAPS followers for answers.